-- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com we want to leave you where we began tonight, with the hard fact that five people with full lives ahead of them are instead being grieved over. kelly loving, ashley paugh, ray green vance, daniel aston, and derrick rump, they ended their life over the weekend in a place they thought of community, safety, and love. instead, it became a reminder of how precious those things are. a reminder now about their absence but also in the case of heroes, richard ferraro and james leave room for light and strength and grace. the news continues, so let's hand it over to kasie hunt and

"cnn tonight." kasie? >> john, thank you. we are going to stay with the memories of those five. police have identified the five people who were killed in the mass shooting at an lgbtq night club. daniel aston, raymond green vance, kelly loving, ashley paugh, and derrick rump. our deepest condolences to their loved ones. they have also named the two heroes being credited with taking down the gunmen. they are thomas james and richard ferraro, a u.s. army vet who says he went into combat mode as bullets were flying. john berman just spoke with him. watch. >> i saw the acu pattern flight vests. for me, there's a handle. i'm getting it. so, i ran across the room, grabbed the handle, hold him down, and then started to -- well, actually i think i went for his gun. his rifle threw in front of him. and the young man that tried to

jump in there with me, we both either pulled him down or whatever, but he ended up at his head right next to the ar. and then with the ar, i told him, push the ar, get the ar away from him. the kid pushed the ar. i don't know what his name was. and then i proceeded to take his other weapon, a pistol, and then just start hitting him wherever i could. i lost my kid's boyfriend. i troyed. i tried to help everybody in there. i still feel bad. people are -- five people didn't go home. and this guy, this guy -- i told him i'll kill you man, because he tried to kill my friend. one of the performers was walking by when the kid was getting tired of kicking. and she helped, kicked him with the high heels she had on. i'm not a hero. i'm just a guy that wanted to protect his kids and wife.

and i still didn't get to protect his boyfriend. >> what an incredible story. authorities did not release very many new details, but they did mention a tipline that's been set up by the fbi so the public can. suspects anderson lee ald rich is in custody but remains hospitalized. the 22-year-old is facing multiple murder and hate crime charges, but the d.a. of el paso county in colorado says the counts aren't finalized and are still under review. >> it's important that fe with have enough evidence to support biased motivated crimes, to charge them. it's important for this community. it's important for the prosecution effort. >> law enforcement says aldrich had an ar-style weapon and a hand begun on him at the scene of the crime. they've encountered this suspect before. last year after a bomb threat, police engaged with him in a

standoff. cnn has obtained new video of that incident. >> this is your boy. i've got the [ bleep ] [ bleep ] outside. they've got a beat on me. you see that out there. [ bleep ] feds got their [ bleep ] rifles out. if they breach i'm going to blow it to [ bleep ] holy hell. >> and there's what happened this weekend. we don't know if that was a hate crime or what the motive was, but it comes at a time when hate is on the rise. this has led the president of g.l.a.d. to say there is a -- politicians and extremists. there have been a record number of antilgbtq bills introduced this year in state houses nationwide. joining me now, cnn national security analyst, julia -- and hilary rosen and scott jennings. thank you all for joining me tonight. i want to start with julietta,

as we set the stage here. you heard the district attorney say that they are still collecting evidence to try and figure out whether this mass shooting can be charged, can be considered a hate crime. earlier today, he told cnn that there is already evidence pointing to that. let's take a look at that, and then we'll talk about it. >> the location is some evidence of the fact that these victims were in a specific location that is predominantly frequented by members of the lgbtq community. that is evidence that we can use towards that -- towards the decision of filing biased motivated crimes. but we're looking for other evidence as well as that. >> so, can you walk us through what the investigation might look like and tell whus what kis of evidence they will be looking for, especially to charge for a hate crime? >> yeah, so, first of all we don't know if he's speaking. we know he's not speaking now, but he may eventually.

whatever he says will be relevant. and of course whatever trail he left. there will be two pieces to this. one will be, did he say anything, do anything with other family members, with friends, that would then lead witnesses who can testify that he animus, had targeted the bar, had targeted the community. the other, of course, is online presence. what is online? what caused him to be radicalized. you know, just within a year, he's attacking his mother. this is the case we know about. he's focused on sort of a family issue. within a year, that becomes a mass killing, which we have to remind everyone could have been so much worse. i mean, you know, over a dozen people have bullet wounds. we're just lucky that they're alive. so, what radicalization happened? did it happen online? and who was he following? who was he communicating with? that will capture the picture. i was surprised -- i'll be honest with you. i was surprised they didn't charge today. these cases can -- you can start

with a hate crime. but i would suspect that they will likely do it in the next day or two, if they have evidence that this was targeted because of the kind of bar it was. and it's hard to believe it wasn't. it was a unique bar. not many lgbtq bars in the community. it wasn't like he randomly showed up at a bar and decided to shoot who was in it. >> right. no. of course. and you mentioned this earlier, but i'm curious how you think it will affect this. the fact that the suspect is refusing to speak to police. how does that play into this decision not to charge it, do you think? >> it may be that he might be willing to speak or that other members of his family will speak. remember the mother likely -- the mother did not file charges against him a year ago when he was violent towards her. she will not speak to the media or to law enforcement now. but there might be other family

members. but we would anticipate that he's not going to speak. he is -- he's going to get lawyers. and we can't imagine -- i can't imagine a narrative coming from him. so, then really what you're looking for is narratives about his hate towards the lgbtq community, either that he said to other people or that he's left online. >> so, hilary rosen, the reality here, whether or not this is deemed a bias motivated crime, it doesn't affect the sentencing in colorado. so, this man is going to face significant jail time no matter what happens. but how important is this distinction to the lgbtq plus community that it is recognized as a hate crime? as we know, from a law enforcement perspective, they're saying they don't have that. as we look at this, we understand that the people that were targeted here are members of a community. >> well, it's important, and it's particularly important in colorado and in colorado springs because colorado springs has actually been a ho t

with those children in uvalde and the shoppers in the supermarket in buffalo and the folks in the movie theater. we have to look at what these crimes, these mass shootings have in common. and the thing they have in common isn't hate. there's a lot of hate in the world and there are a lot of mentally ill people.

but what we have in common here in these mass shootings are high capacity magazines and guns. and, you know, the easy access to them. and i think until we actually face that, we're not going to stop this. we don't do mental health resources. but if we don't deal with the capacity to go in and shoot 40 people in the scope of ten minutes, we're never going to solve this problem. >> right. there's of course the motivation for whoever is committing the attack and also the means. and there are different ways to address those two things. scott, the reality is that the attack at club q happened on the eve of the transgender day of remembrance. while the motive is still under investigation, we do know that 2021 was the deadliest year on record for trans and non-binary people. and there are a lot of people pointing fingers at people on

the right, like that of congresswoman lauren boebert, that represents the western half of colorado. what do you say to that? >> well, number one, i would like to learn more about this guy's history. i don't know what his motivations are. i would prefer to wait for the police. number two, i would like to know more about what happened last year and why he wasn't held or charged in that incident. i mean, it strikes me that the quickest way to have kept him from getting a gun would be for him to have fallen under colorado's red flag law, which is not possible because hefts not adjudicated on the issue with his mother. that's the second thing. the third thing is i don't know of any republican politicians that are advocating violence. there are republican politicians that have strong policy differences with, you know, democrats on some of these issues. but that's a far cry from advocating violence. violence is wrong. i do not advocate violence -- >> but people like boebert are calling -- >> there's i dig --

>> people in the lgbtq community. she's using words like "rumors," right, which insinuating it could lead to violence. is that contributing to what we saw? let me let scott answer that. scott, can you answer my question? >> yeah, look, like i said, i don't know of any republican politicians who are out there calling on people to commit violence. and i think it's a pretty far jump. these issues have become hot button issues in america and certainly republican politicians have picked up on it. and some use heated rhetoric. but i'd still defy you to find a republican member of congress or anybody else who's out there saying, let's go commit violence against a particular community. i just don't think that's happening. and beyond that, we still don't know everything we need to know about this guy before those kinds of jumps are made. to me, i'm wait and see on this. but i would just say, violence

is wrong. rhetoric should be cooled down. but i think to ascribe violence to people, republican politicians that haven't called for that, is also not right. >> hilary, what's your response to that? >> i mean, i agree with scott. i don't think that, you know, republican congress people who target legislatively this community are encouraging violence. i just think that you create an atmosphere that makes people feel threatened by people who are different than them in a way that makes it uncomfortable for them. and if you take, combine that with a person who's mentally challenged, who has issues, who's sociopathic, there's a -- you are kind of lighting a match. and i think that that's the piece that people have to really think through. are we doing everything we can to bring people together instead of making people feel bad about

each other? that's the piece i think that the republicans don't quite take into consideration. i don't want to politicize this horrible murder, but i do think that this conversation is kind of an important one to have over time. clearly the access to guns is a particularly horrific tie between all of these mass shootings. >> julia, we've got about 15 seconds. quick last word. >> yes, i agree with hilary of course about the gun issue, the capacity to kill so quickly. but i just want to talk about radicalization very quickly. it doesn't have to be asked for by a politician. violence doesn't have to be asked for. i think what we have to ask ourselves, is the rhetoric one in which people will hear and feel that there's a permissive culture to attack, target, and then ultimately very small group to use violence against a class of people who have done no harm, who are just loving who they love? and so words like groom or even

if the person saying that doesn't actually think, oh, i want this person to kill someone, they know by now, scott -- you know by now that by using that term, that is an inciteful term. so, to be a responsible politician simply is -- if you know that that's likely how it's going to be interpreted, stop using it. you can have base about gay marriage and lgbtq issues. you can do that. but this name calling is the thing that becomes acceptance. in other words there's no shaming of this hate towards the lgbtq community, the jewish community, african american community. and it's a shame that i think that we can bring back to the dialogue now. >> all right. julia, thank you. hilary rosen, scott jennings. i really appreciate. it's a tough conversation. thank you for having it with us tonight. i really appreciate it. ahead, will the party of trump make a break from trump? are republicans closer than ever

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a number of republican presidential possibilities spent the weekend in las vegas. the republican jewish coalition's annual leadership meeting provided an opportunity for 2024 contenders to try and court the party's big money donors, many of whom have given in the past to the former president, donald trump. we heard this time around, though, lots of talk about moving forward. some were more willing than others to talk about or to name donald trump. >> trump was saying that we'd be winning so much we'd get tired of winning. well, i'm sick and tired of our party losing. the fact of the matter is, the reason we're losing is because

donald trump has put himself before everybody else. >> personality and celebrity just aren't going to get it done. >> we have to look in the mirror. the republican party has lost a popular vote in the last seven out of eight presidential elections. that's saying something. >> okay. i'm joined by cnn political analyst margaret thao -- and miles taylor. there was a lot to work with. i don't know how many you've covered. i've covered early events on the presidential calendar. you go out there, court big donors. they did seem to reflect a little bit of the change in tune that the gop has had after the midterm election. but it also sounds an awful lot like 2015, when everybody thought trump was going to lose. >> if there's a sure way to empower donald trump, it's to have a whole bunch of candidates dividing up the vote. the thing that's different this time is that in 2016, the sort

of line that donald trump could bring to the equation was, what have you got to lose? take a risk on a businessman. it'll be somebody different. we know what a donald trump presidency is like. so, there's that. but i think what you're starting to see is this split stylistically and brand-wise among the republicans who would like to seek the nomination. there are the candidates like ron desantis, who don't have to say donald trump's name and who are firmly in the forefront of this ridiculous early stage. there are the candidates who have branded themselves as critical trump and willing to speak outside the box. and then there's, like the mike pence lane, the mike pompeo lane, served close in the trump administration, helped legitimize him for years until the very end when they had no choice but to step away. then you have nikki haley, who i would say is seeking a page from

the nancy pelosi handbook. pelosi has opened the door to make it an age argument. >> sure. miles, you served in the administration. obviously there were a lot of people who when he did get elect td -- i remember talking to good republicans saying, look, good people have to stick around here because if they don't, this whole thing is going to go off the rails. by the end, you have january 6th, the complete collapse, hang mike pence. mike pence won't criticize -- what do you make of the way -- i don't see any of them, while they're saying, okay, the party needs something new, they're not going after the man himself, right? >> yeah, yeah. there's no other way to put it than cowardice. that same cowardice is what allowed trump to rise in the first place. your point about the adults in the room thesis, i was one of the biggest -- of the thesis that the adults in the room were keeping it in track. and i was completely abjectly wrong about that thesis? why? because it was very easy for

donald trump to systemically dismantle those guardrails. if donald trump became president again, i would be one of the first to say, we still need good people to go into government. exactly what margaret said about this being a replay. we have seen this movie before. what was striking to me when you played those clips, some of those same people were the same people saying the same things seven years ago, the nikki haleys, mike pompeo when he was a member of the house was saying the same things to me. now they're saying it less forcefully than they did then. rick perry called him a cancer on conservatism and then served in his cabinet. >> and there was lindsey graham, remember? >> the race, as early as it is, it very much favors donald trump the way it's constructed. >> paul? >> it's because it's a winner take all system in the republican party. and a plurality politician can do very well in this. that's what trump is. trump never -- >> he's like a 25%, 30%

politician. >> right. in his party, 40% -- >> in the republican nominating contest. >> and he can win a lot with that. he never got 50% in republican primaries until the 33rd state, which is new york, his home state. it didn't matter. i think people who are counting him out are wrong, i think he's formidable, and he wants as many opponents as possible. nobody could have been happier with the turnout at rjc than trump because it divides up the early vote. >> you're hearing from paul ryan to a lot of people in the room was that the reason it's time to move past trump for the party is a matter of winning because they can't win with him. and what i'm not hearing at this stage is the other argument, which is the reason for the party to move away from them is to redefine themselves around the rule of law or kind of old norms of what are acceptable guardrails in politics that, you know, you have to support institutions, that you can't tear everything down. that's not part of the argument. that may be for tactical reasons because these candidates feel

the base of the party isn't ready to hear that. it's an important moment to make that point, and i'm not hearing folks make that point. >> that's a good point. if you have national credibility like mike pompeo or nikki haley, why aren't they talking about held sink ki, the most shameful day a president has had on foreign soil. >> the material is aimless. >> he betrayed our agencies and endorsed putin. why aren't they saying that? >> some of these people that are going to be running against trump are the absolute worst people to be running against trump because, as you know, they were the people who were his right hand men. mike pence, mike pompeo. they're going to have a hard time creating this. >> you weren't saying that when you were working with me every day. stick around. trump's own former vice president has been distancing himself, as we've been talking about a little bit here, as he flirts with his own presidential bid. but mike pence is still carefully parsing his words about his former boss and now

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you may have seen one particular 2024 contender on television a lot lately. donald trump's former vice president mike pence was also out in las vegas. but he noticeably still talks

like this about the man who reportedly said he deserved to be hanged. >> i couldn't be more proud of the record of the trump/pence administration. >> so, marc short was the former vice president's chief of staff during that time. marc, thanks so much for being with us tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> you heard your former boss, the confidante of the former president. why isn't he more willing to be aggressive with con fronting someone who, per cassidy hutchinson testimony, mark meadows said that trump thinks pence deserves it, meaning pence deserves to be hanged. >> i'm not going to try to excuse anything that happened on january 6th. in fact i think january 6th was an important dividing line, and i think it was one in which the vice president tried to advise the president for weeks leading up to january 6th that he had no

such authority that the president was arguing he should use. i reject the premise of your question. i think even in the town hall that the former vice president did with cnn last week, he was clear in saying donald trump was an important part of the party but the party is looking for a different leader. but at the same time, proud of the record. he's not going to divorce himself from the record. he's very proud of the fact we have 240 new federal judges on our courts, judges that stand and affirm the value of life. we actually did secure the border. we did support israel. the administration did do a lot of theings in the record -- he' not going to distance himself from the record. if you look at the quote, he says, i'm incredibly proud of the trump/pence record. >> i take kwouyour point on the record. but when david muir pressed him about do we want trump to run,

he did not say no clearly. he said, we have better choices. he could be so much -- he knows so much. he was in the room. he could be talking about his experience in the capitol and using that in a way -- we were talking about the candidates on the stage are shying away from criticizing trump directly. why is pence shying away from it when he potentially had the most harrowing experience of all? >> he specifically said the president was wrong. if you've read the book -- >> i know he says it in the book, but i'm saying out in public. >> he said it multiple times out in public. he did it in the town hall just on cnn last week. i don't think he shied away from that. i think what many in the media want to do is discredit the record as well. and that's not something he's going to contribute to. he's incredibly proud of the record of the accomplishments during this four year. >> former presidents of the trump administration bill barr and rod rosenstein are out saying that the doj has a case

against former president trump. i want to show you what they have to say and we'll talk about it. >> i personally think they probably have the basis for legitimately indicting the president. >> i still believe they have a viable potential case. >> you have been called in before and worked on various legal arguments against the former president or been party to some of these cases. how does a trump indictment potentially impact the former vice president's plans and the plans of other potentially 2024 contenders. >> i don't know that it impacts the former vice president's plans at all. i think to the extent it impacts others, i think you have to ask them. i do think that it's an interesting development in naming a special counsel. i certainly think that both parties have abused special counsels over the last several decades. and i think the fact that this investigation has been going on for nearly two years just suggests that somehow now you're going to name a special counsel and say this is independent from what we've been doing i think doesn't really meet the smell test. >> do you think the special

counsel has credibility here? >> no. i don't. and i actually said i think that republicans have abused it before as well. and i think that you go back over the last several decades, going through the clinton and the ken starr investigation, all the way up until today, these special counsels typically don't have the same guardrails. and they abuse people's rights. and i think you have an unlimited usually budget and you have an unlimited scope of an investigation. and i think at this point, the department of justice has had nearly two years to investigate this. then they should be able to make a determination in whether there's evidence or not. >> do you think donald trump should face criminal liability for what occurred at the capitol on january 6th? >> i think donald trump disappointed the american people on that day. i think he let us all down. i think he let us down in the weeks leading up to january 6th. >> but you don't think he's a criminal? >> it's hard for me to say if you're listening to terrible advice that that would be a

criminal act. >> he was the president of the united states. >> you totally agree. as i say, i think he entirely disappointed the american people in his dereliction of his responsibilities. but i don't know what evidence the justice department has to say there's evidence to bring criminal charngs. >> what would you need to see? does the vice president -- >> i think he's answered that specifically. if you followed really terrible advice, that's a criminal activity. this is incredible separation believing the vice president said, if i had done something different, i would have violated my oath. and therefore i did not. to the extent the president should have criminal charges, i think that i don't know what evidence the department of justice has. if they haven't brought something in two years, i don't know where they're going to go with this. >> do the people who provided the advice, should they go to jail? >> i think some of the lawyers provided counsel that was against the law. basically advising to say here's

what the vice president should do. >> you talking about sidney powell and rudy giuliani? >> the whole group, including john eastman. they were given advice from a legal counsel perfective that was asking the vice president to break his oath to the constitution. >> thank you so much for coming in. ahead, we've got two before the next presidential election. up next, what happens for the nation's politics if twitter collapses? will donald trump's reinstatement even mat senator and what would the up and coming campaigns do without their favorite rapid response app? that's next.

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it's only been, if you can believe it, three weeks since the richest man in the world, elon musk, quote, unquote, took the helm at twitter. and since then, well, there's been at least the kitchen sink full of drama. the vast layoffs, employee exodus, accounts banned and unbanned, blue checks were given and then they were taken away. and just today, twitter's head of news u.s. partnerships announced he is leaving the company. while musk, well, this afternoon, he tweeted, quote, hope all judgey hall monitors stay on other platforms please, i'm begging you. so, that's where we are. twitter with no hall monitors. what will that mean for the social media giant and frankly for the rest of us? back with me now, margaret tau,

paul begala and miles taylor. i want to say first of all, twitter is not real life. it's important we recognize that and underscore it. it has become this echo chamber for the political media narrative and a place that campaigns spend a lot of time, certainly reporters. you could argue reporters spend too much time on twitter. but it has become a source of conversation. paul, let me put this to you because i feel like there actually are democrats who may be privately rooting for donald trump to start using the twitter account he received back yesterday. i'm wondering, do you think it matters? does it have an impact if donald trump starts tweeting again? >> i don't. it's the only social media i've ever been on. it's overpopulated with politicoes. seriously, hacks like me. >> i don't want to ask you how old you are. >> very first tweet i ever received, seconds after i joined the platform, i got twitter and

said hey, begala, why don't you drink rat poison and jump in a woodchiper. that shows i can't take a hint. mr. trump gets back on it, it undermines his investment in this right wing group he forms. i couldn't careless. i've been much less on twitter since mr. musk decided it needs a little more anger and vitriol and divisiveness, and it's been good for my blood pressure. >> miles, what do you think in terms of -- >> i take a little bit of a different perspective than paul and say i think if trump goes back on -- and it's been extraordinary that he hasn't. i've got the alert set up. i'm waiting for the moment. not that i want to. that was ptsd of four years of just waiting for every alert. >> i'm probably a bad reporter for not doing that. >> i don't think he's going to be able to resist. he can never resist a spectacle. he can reach a lot more people a lot more quickly. we have to wait for the sherpas

to say what he's saying on truth social because none of us want to be on truth social. we replaced the horse buggy with the car. we were fine. we were better for it. we replaced the bank teller by atm. if twitter goes down, it will give me and everybody else a little bit more reprieve from the craziness. >> it's true that everything has a shelf life. facebook is not what it was now what it was ten years ago and all that stuff. having said that, as we lose the ability to have any civil public discourse about anything, as political polarization and these kind of silos take root, social media is one of the only town squares. it's a messed up, twisted town square -- i'm afraid i'm going to use a bad word. but it's still -- >> it's very tempting to use one. i'm with you. i'm right there with you. >> so, town square. so, i do think, like, just a few

days ago there were all the sarcastic to twitter, if i knew that was going to be my last tweet, i would have said whatever. and now it's like, oh, my god, he let trump back on. everyone suggests it's not going to blow up and go away. we're in a period nobody knows what's going to happen. there are two things that are true. if twitter goes away, it empowers tiktok. we know what the powers are with tiktok. that's a real and not regulated concern. >> it's a national security disaster. >> which trump was right about. he was flagging that the chinese communists were driving this. and i don't know why he didn't act on it, but i think he was probably right. >> but i think -- so, separate from that concern is the inside twitter concern, which is security, data, privacy, everyone's dms. as long as twitter lasts and as long as everyone at this table is hanging on, some having set alerts, others having not, like, that is ripe for breaches right

now. i read a really interesting analysis about how elon musk did the same kind of crazy pressure testing at spacex and at tesla. the dicfference is there were notalnot millions of people all actively engaging in spacex and tesla. that was a contained place where scientists and engineers operate. this is a public gathering. when he public pressured tesla, millions of other people's lives and privacy gets drawn into it. >> billionaires doing politics. they think they can come in and do it and they are surprised by the system. quickly, the security concerns around twitter's -- it has not collapsed. but as margaret points out, there are vulnerabilities and problems. how worried are you about that? >> a great deal. some of the people who have left twitter are. so best internet security folks out there, people that are getting ready to leave that organization. i spent years looking at what

our foreign adversaries were doing on social networks. it works. they know it works. they know they can manipulate our population. you can guarantee right now that in moscow and beijing, they're looking at this trying to find points of leverage that they can exploit to try to undermine the american political system. that's a guarantee. >> very important story. margaret tau, always fun to have you on. really appreciate it. coming up, the world cup faces worlds of controversy, wearing this arm band could put some of the top soccer players in the game on the bench. are diversity and inclusion being blocked? the former world cup champion who made history on the field join us to discuss next.

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(burke) get a whole lot of something with farmers policy perks. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪ the holidays were awkward for romeo and juliet. but after saving big with amazon black friday... ...tragedy was avoided. ♪ shop legendary deals it is the most popular sporting event in the world. yet, what is happening on the field is getting some fans morale up than the game some selves. qatar as the host country for the world cup this year. and they say, quote, everybody is welcome. it is a great sentiment, dearie, except that homosexuality is illegal in the country. punishable by prison time. team usa, along with several other countries have planned to express their support for the

lgbtq+ community by wearing rainbow armbands on the field. but at the last-minute, viva banned this show of support. threatening anyone who wears the band with a yellow card. to have a great voice here to wearing. u.s. hall of fame goalkeeper, world cup champion, and two-time olympic gold medalist, round of scurry. she's one of the first openly gay women on the u.s. soccer team. thank you so much for joining us. but i will talk of the suffragist. winter one thing -- there was a drop in the game today, men's game. so what did you take away from the game? what's next for our team? >> but it's really unfortunate to save our planet time if you win your first time you go to the group into the around. so as a little bump out about. it we still in it, we're still in, we haven't done on friday. really tall order there. but we have a chance of getting through. so tell your family to stay in it, and keep with the team.

>> we have a very good friend who who -- asked us put our central's. so just in time for thanksgiving. let's turn to what's going on here. because, honestly, qatar's position on this and also fetus enforcement of it. what do you make of that? what should we think of, particularly, and whatever but fifa. which disorganization or plants country run the world and their decision to handle this way? >> we have said with eta is we picked the country, you pick the consequences. years ago, when fifa picture for the world cup, they picked the aryan rules and regulations, and lots, and the use of these laws are on the books that. so they chose this. now, unfortunately, they're hoping this would be a bit more lax about these types of things. but clearly not. i can picture both sides and a hotel room in doha, downtown somewhere. argument each other about this thing. and so people probably said,

you know, we have to show some solidarity. some understanding of this. so instead of this wonderful great idea of the one love armband, they decide to do the no discrimination are banned. which is black and white. a lot more muted. and so, it is unfortunate, but fifa rockslide mistakes. demolition things that go sideways. right with the tournament starts. that, unfortunately, rose to football. and they're doing it again. >> how would you feel. you've played in four world cup tournaments as someone who is experts of the game. would you feel complain the world cup there? >> i wouldn't. i would feel comfortable at all. we are talking about jail time. potentially, for being myself. being lamb. and it is very disheartening, it is very alarming. like i said, unfortunately, for makes these decisions that, a lot of, times put players and compromise positions. it is really unfortunate. the good news is, i will say, this topic is getting a lot of

press. it is getting a lot of coverage. it is getting a lot of conversation. that is actually backfiring in the face of fifa, and qatar. >> the boss said, and i think this quote will resident lot of people. there is a double standard. he said, quote, what we europeans are putting for the past thousand years we should be apologizing for the next 3000 years before we start giving moral lessons to people. i think he's trying to make a point about colonialism there. what is your response to that? >> my first response was, what? and then my second response was i think he is talking about colonization. and so, that is a little absurd, actually. to see that. because he had an opportunity to make a difference today. in the situation. had fallen on the side of allowing these players to make a stand. to use their platforms to bring more awareness and solidarity,

and support. to people all over the country. all over the world. he blew it. so now he wants to say this other statement. about, well, we should've done this. unfortunately, he had his moment. where he could've made a difference, he chose not to. >> what's really about? is it about money? >> it is about power, i think. i was one of the other. >> all right, thank you very much for being with us. we appreciate your time. >> we will be right back. go for a run. go for 10 runs! run a mararathon. instead, statart small. with nicorette. which cacan lead to something b. start ststopping with nicoret. i strip on public transit. i strip with the guys. i strip all byyself. breathe right strips openour nose for relief you can feel rht away, helping you take in air mo easily, day or night. introducing the new sleep number climate360 smart bed. the only smart bed in the world that actively cools, warms and

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thanks for watching, i'll be back tomorrow night, our coverage continues tonight houston camera. >> i listened, thanks so much. this is cnn tonight. timeouts in-camera. a new account tonight, from one of the heroes who stopped the gunman in the lgbtq nightclub shooting and colorado springs. by people were shot dead, at least 19 others injured. as their family and friends grief tonight, authorities praise to patrons who took down the shooter no doubt saving countless live