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orchestrated reality show. yeah. it is, you know, rehearsed. it was like we did the thing with the press and went right inside, took the coat off, sat down, did the interview. it was all in that same moment. >> orchestrated reality show. that's what she's saying about what's happening. good morning, everyone. so glad you're here. we're talking about obviously that was meghan markle and her and prince harry talking about race, the royalty family, her comparisons to diana. what did we learn? it's in the new netflix series. we learned buckingham palace responding live in london this morning. >> the first major development, the case of the four murdered university of idaho students investigators are now looking for a car spotted near the home where they were killed. could provide more information. we know investigators are

zeroing in on two possible motives centered around extremist behavior in the power grid attack in north carolina. >> and new cnn reporting on the team hired by trump's attorneys and found two more documents marked as classified inside a storage unit in florida that has raised new questions about where else the former president might be keeping documents. mick mulvaney weighs in next. but first, the possible clue in the murder of four university of idaho students. police in moscow say they're looking for a 2011 to 2013 white hyundai elantra and whomever was inside it the night the students were killed. they don't have a license plate number but say it was spotted near the home where the victims were stabbed to death. it is the first major development in the investigation since the november 13th murders. >> this is a very active case.

we're doing a lot of work. granted, not a lot of it that can be seen in public but behind the scenes there's a lot of people working on the case and we're going to continue. >> authorities are also now removing the students' belongings from the home. they say those items are no longer needed for the investigation. >> we're going to be getting that -- those items back to the families. it's time for us to get those things back that really mean something to those families and hopefully to help with some of their healing. >> the items will be moved to a secure location until families can collect them. meanwhile, the house is still considered a crime scene. power has been restored to some grateful residents in moore county north carolina this morning after two attacks on the power substations over the weekend. thousands of people spent days in the dark in what officials say they believe was a targeted gun attack. multiple sources telling cnn

investigators are zeroing in on two possible motives centered around extremist behavior. whitney wild is live in north carolina. what can you tell us about what they believe the motive could be? >> reporter: they haven't said but they're looking at two threads. the first is calls on the internet among domestic violent extremists encouraging attacks on critical infrastructure. and the second thread here involves reviewing a series of disruptions to lgbtq events around the country. what we know is that at 7:00 p.m., just as the power went out here there was a drag show scheduled in moore county. law enforcement looking very closely at the correlation of the timing there. that there was this drag show supposed to take place at 7:00 p.m., that the power was cut shortly after that. the attack happening somewhere close to that 7:00 p.m. time frame when the power shut off.

that's what law enforcement is looking into. although they haven't been able to definitively connect those two events. law enforcement here is working around the clock. the fbi has been on scene all week at this location where i am in north carolina, where one of the substations was attacked on saturday. law enforcement also appealing to the public. the fbi putting out a poster hoping someone will remember something, that someone will come forward. law enforcement trying to encourage that. now state officials, local officials have upped the reward leading to information for the arrest of whoever did this. that reward now $75,000. >> we'll watch to see what the developments are. whitney wild, thank you. this morning president biden is renewing his call for an assault weapons ban despite the slim chance of one passing in congress now. he spoke at a two-hour vigil, and called a ban on military weapons common sense and promised his work was far from

done. >> we've seen you turn pain into purpose. together, we made some important progress. the most significant gun law passed in 30 years but still not enough. still not enough. [ applause ] >> mj lee joins us this morning from the white house. good morning to you. in the past few weeks we've heard him, the president, the white house talking about this more. is there a belief they think something could happen in the near term in this congress in the lame duck? >> reporter: i think last night was a great reminder when we hear president biden giving a speech calling for legislative action he's not necessarily doing it because he thinks it's a good chance this could happen. president biden and white house officials know well how difficult it would be for congress to get through an assault weapons ban. they couldn't do it the last two years when democrats controlled congress. they know it's going to be nearly impossible when they

don't control both chambers come next congress but the president has been clear he's going to continue talking about this issue and calling for an assault weapons ban because the bill he signed into law earlier this year he sees as not being enough. >> another thing atop the government's mind avoiding a government shutdown, what are you hearing? >> reporter: december 16th, that is the date that you want to circle on your calendar. that is when government funding runs out and one of several things needs to happen in order for the government to not shutdown, congress needs to pass a spending bill, that's what normal congress, government behavior would be, or it can pass a short term resolution or longer term cr for about a year, for example. the white house wants congress to pass a spending bill. saying even as of yesterday there is plenty of time to get it done. maybe not a lot of time but they can get it done. a short term stop gap measure

might be necessary to buy congress a little bit more time. but one thing i can tell you the white house does not want is the one-year cr saying that would have disastrous consequences for key areas of funding. and any talk of a government shutdown, at least in the building behind me they are not even contemplating that, that is how unacceptable it is to white house officials. and there's a lot of lobbying going on by white house officials and that's only going to ramp up as we get closer to the deadline of friday. >> mj lee live for us at the white house as the sun is coming up. thank you for that. let's talk about the new twist in the trump mar-a-lago classified documents saga. two documents with classified markings were found in a florida storage unit. a team hired by the former president's lawyers found them during a search. those documents were handed over to the fbi. a source says no other documents with classified markings were found. so for more on this we're joined now by the former acting white

house chief of staff in the trump administration, mick mulvaney. thank you for joining us. i have a lot to get through with you this morning. appreciate you joining us. more classified documents, was it irresponsible for the former president to have classified information sitting in a florida storage unit. >> yes, and no. thank you for having me. it shouldn't be there in the first place, that's not the right place for classified documents. but it's the most recent in a string of mishandling of documents. no question about that. i put it aside to incompetence by staff than something under handed stealing documents and selling them overseas. i don't think anybody is seriously offering that right now. but at least the stuff was found by the trump team and turned over, it's the proper way to handle it. it doesn't excuse things but at least that part of the process seems to be working well.

add it to a long litany of ways the move out of washington d.c. by the trump administration was mishandled by the trump team. >> should he face consequences for failing to turn over documents when the national archives asked him the first time or holding classified documents now that he is not president? he was president, he did, the documents are there, most citizens cannot claim ignorance of the law, why should he be different? >> he shouldn't be different. he shouldn't be treated any different. everyone should be treated and the penalty should be commensurate with the type of documents. we heard a rumor early on these were nuclear codes clearly that's not the case. we need to make sure the penalty is commensurate with theac actual offense. you and i both know it's the cover up and not the crime that gets people in trouble. it's not the necessarily taking of documents but perhaps the certifying to the court or fbi that all the documents had been

returned. that could be more problematic going forward. i think this is going through the proper procedures, investigated by the fbi in the right fashion and things seem to be moving in the direction they would with any other citizen. >> let's talk about the fallout from the midterms. republicans lost a crucial senate seat in georgia, i'm sure you're aware of that. a total of 14 candidates hand picked by trump lost their elections. was trump the problem? was he a problem for republicans in the midterms? >> he was a problem in a couple different places. i think more than anything in picking those candidates, trump picked and selected and was a proxy for some really, really bad candidates, people who had not run for office. it's not easy to run for senate, governor, congress. but that being said he wasn't helpful in the general elections. he was able to get herschel walker across the line relatively easily in a primary in georgia because donald trump still has tremendous sway amongst republican primary voters but he wasn't able to get

herschel walker across the line with the general electorate in georgia which sends the message that donald trump is still weak with swing voters in swing states, lost georgia in 2020, and now the senate lost another senate race in 2022 at the same time that state republicans not recruited by donald trump are doing well. it does expose a weakness that donald trump has in swing states that he's going to need to address if he's going to be taken seriously in 2024. >> you make a distinction between primary voters and general election voters and swing voters. that's a problem for the gop if you have a candidate that's not viable. is he the right person to be at the top of the ticket going forward for the gop nationwide? >> i think there's a growing group of republicans, myself included -- there's always been a group of republicans who can't stand donald trump so the fact they don't like him now or think he's the best candidate in 2024

doesn't change anything, doesn't move the needle. but there's a growing group of republicans that supported donald trump in '16 and 2020, like myself, worked with him in the administration, who think he's our weakest candidate in 2024, he's the one most likely to lose, because if he runs in 2024 as the republican nominee, that election becomes a referendum on donald trump. either vote for donald trump or against donald trump. he lost that election under that sort of structure in 2020 and has shown no ability to change that dynamic going into 2024. i believe if he is the republican nominee he stands just as much losing two years from now as he did two years ago. >> do you think he will be? >> the smart money is he will be the republican nominee. because while he can be beaten in a one on one race he's going to pull about 35, 40% of the primary voters regardless. if he runs against one person he loses with 35%. runs against five, wins 35.

and most republican states are winner take all, you can win the domination without winning a majority of the republican primary vote. i think the smart money is he is the nominee. >> do you think he should be the nominee? >> no, as i mentioned before, i think he's the weakest can't. we have a strong bench of republicans who i think could win in '24. i think donald trump could lose. >> if he is, will you support him? >> no, i'm going to support other folks in the primary. no question about that. there are a lot of republicans who are tired of explaining to people why they supported donald trump. we were okay with it when the policies were good. we're tired of supporting why he had dinner with a white supremacist. the baggage is getting heavier and heavier. >> i'm glad you mentioned all that. he called to terminate the constitution, you believe, i assume, that should disqualify

him? >> disqualify is a strong word and it was a long tweet. but it's stupid. it's the thing an undisciplined candidate says and it's why we're looking for a better option. we're tired of defending that activity. >> let's talk about it, former president spent the last few weeks associating with people on the fringing including posing for photos with a qanon conspiracy theorist who believes trump is demantling the deep state of sex traffickers plus his dinner with holocaust denier kanye west and nick fuentes. is this who the leader should be hanging out with? the leader of the republican party right now? >> no. there's ways to explain it away, if you wanted to or if it was a one-off kind of occasion. my guest he didn't know who nick

fuentes was the white supremacist. i understand the fund-raiser at mar-a-lago was a fund-raiser to combat human trafficking. that's a defensible thing. it's another side to the story if this was a one-off type of thing. it could be explained on bad staff work, if it was a one-off type of thing. but it seems to happen with president trump more and more. he's a candidate for president right now shouldn't be making these kinds of mistakes. all it does is divide his base, doesn't add anybody to his voting base. there's nobody in the country that said i wasn't supporting donald trump but since he had dinner with a white supremacist i'm on his team now. it's slowly eroding his base. >> you said it's bad for his base but also bad for the republican party because then the republican party -- >> it's bad for everybody. it's bad for the country to have any famous politician to say i

think we should throw out the constitution. >> of course but it puts the -- with all due respect, it puts the republican party in a bad position because you may have, as you well admit, someone who is running for president on the republican side who has done all of these things and who is sympathizing with anti-semites and such. it does put the republican party in a very tenuous and odd position. >> sure does. >> what does the party do? >> you can't kick him out obviously. and it weighed on the party in the midterms. talk to members of congress in florida who said how wonderful it was to have ron desantis at the top of the ticket. he brought votes for republicans in other office. then you talk to republicans nationwide who say what a drag it was to have donald trump at the top of their ticket and their voting base eroded because of that. he's become a weight on the party nationwide. come back to the same theme, republicans are looking for other people and looking for other people for the right reasons. >> thank you for your time this

morning, i appreciate it. london this morning, wow. thank you, sir. >> thanks, don. this morning more than 1,000 members of "the new york times" union are strike. the guild saying this in part, we are ready to work for as long as it took, but -- to reach a fair deal but management walked away from the table. we know what we're worth. this after more than a year and a half of stalled contract negotiations with their management. let's bring in sarah fisher. i was reading through their demands here. they're asking for what they deem to be fair wages, health care fund, no company cuts to their retirement benefits, remote work policy, this is probably one of the big stickers and a performance rating system with safeguards against bias they uncovered. there's a lot here unresolved. where does this go? >> they are going to reach a

point where they reach a contract but it's going to take a few more months. it's been a year and a half, as you mentioned. i think both sides are not ready yet to back down. i think they've been making progress on the wage increases one of the big sticking points they didn't want their salary increases pegged to the lowest band, they wanted it to their performance, the union one on that. i think in order to get a contract signed before the two year mark, there's still a few more things they're going to have to work out like the remote work policies. >> can you talk about -- i think we think of "the new york times" and largely think of reporters whose names you see in by lines it's more than that. >> yes. full disclosure i worked at "the new york times," i was in that union. it's people on the business side, people not in management, people in sales, marketing, et cetera, and also people in the "newsroom," reporters and also aren't managers.

within this particular union there's 1,400 people, which is huge, poppy. of those 1,400 about 80% work in the "newsroom." about 1,150 said they're going to participate in the walkout today. that means about 300 are not going to be participating. >> in essence it'll be basically the world seeing what it's like without that journalism that comes from all of those employees for 24 hours. >> it is. their editor said we're going to put out our paper today. but it's going to be a lot harder to do. >> yeah. sarah fisher, thanks very much. ahead, a look at prince harry and meghan, this documentary that's been released overnight. we'll tell you what reporters live in london outside of buckingham palace are seeing not just in the documentary but the reaction coming from the royal family.

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in this family sometimes, you know, you're part of the problem rather than part of the solution. and there is a huge level of unconscious bias. the thing with unconscious bias is it's actually no one's fault. but once it's pointed out or identified within yourself you need to make it right. >> prince harry and megan, the duke and duchess of sussex opening up about being part of the royal family this is part of their netflix documentary series that dropped overnight. netflix reportedly paid in the tens of millions of dollars for this. bianca is standing by outside of buckingham palace but first go to maux foster in london. what do you think? we've seen about half of the episodes. everyone wanted to know would there be shocking revelations? are there? >> reporter: it's interesting insight into their thoughts and process. we've only had the first three

of six. so yet to see the probably more controversial part which is the runup to them leaving their royal rolls. it has unruffled some feathers here i have to say because at the beginning of the series it said the royal family declined to comment in this series. my sources are telling me no one was approached for comment in the royal family nor in the palaces. i'm not expecting any major comment from buckingham palace today or next week officially. here are the highlights from what we've seen so far. it's been billed as the first-hand account of the relationship between harry and meghan. the first three episodes dropped in the early hours of this

morning and returned to familiar themes. >> that press pack of royal correspondents is extended pr arm of the royal family. >> reporter: harry comparing meghan's experience to that of his mother, diana's. he feared she would be driven away by the media harassment. >> as far as the family was concerned everything she was put there they were put through as well so it's a rite of passage. but my wife had to go through that so why should your girlfriend be treated differently? why should you get special trea treatment? why should you be protected? i said the difference is the race element. >> reporter: ultimately harry said he had to leave the uk to protect his family. >> i understand there will be people who disagree with what i've done and how i've done it but i knew i had to do everything i could to protect my

family, especially after what happened to my mum. >> that's your grandma diana. >> i didn't want history to repeat itself. >> reporter: we heard from meghan's mother for the first time. >> i remember when i first met him, too. he was just like 6'1", handsome man with red hair. really great manners. >> reporter: harry says when he introduced meghan to his family, they didn't think the relationship would last. >> the actress thing was the biggest problem, funny enough. there's a big idea of what that looks like from the uk standpoint. hollywood and there's this easy for them to typecast that. >> reporter: the couple say they felt unprotected by the palace against a barrage of media attacks. the palace is yet to comment. they are quite a divisive couple if you're a meghan fan or harry fan, there's a huge amount

you'll find fascinating. if you're not, perhaps you're not even watching it. >> max foster thank you very much. that's the most i've seen of it because it dropped when we were coming into work. >> we have to get some sleep sometime. >> we had to sleep, too. don, read it. >> that's all right. >> you need me to step in? >> bianca joins us from buckingham palace and here in new york is -- >> trish godard, and aaron vanderhoof. >> good morning, appreciate you for joining us. can we go to buckingham palace, because bianca is at buckingham palace. thank you so much. i want to pick up on something quickly that max said, there's a discrepancy about the palace being asked to comment and then saying well, we're not going to comment. can you clarify for us? >> reporter: i'm afraid i can't.

because nobody has better royal sources than max foster he's in the documentary as well himself saying something in praise of meghan in the middle of episode 2. but it highlights how this can begin to be divisive as it gets dissected and we get a response from the palace if we do. as max eluded to you get a sense watching it that it's building up to a crescendo. the first three episodes out their love story, which is touching in part, and the early stages of the engagement and meghan's early reception here in the united kingdom. the second half is why they had to leave, why they felt it wasn't safe for the family and couldn't live in these circumstances any longer. what struck me is the intimacy. scenes meghan markle is in her bat bathrobe, in a tur bin, recording herself and how she's feeling. they talk about their first date, their first kiss, sharing

a tent together. it's an insight we never had into figures in the royal family before. it also works on numerous levels, clearly the family level, the impact this will have on the relationship between prince harry and his brother, meghan and the rest of the royal family and the situation for their children but also on a roil and national level because there's references to britain's history of slavery and what that plays in the discourse and also that brexit was going on, suggesting that may have added to the discourse around her race and the resentment of somebody in her background marrying into the royal family. it's a look at this and their life, some people may have said we've seen enough there's been so much about this and it's oversaturated. i wonder how differently it's viewed in the united states versus how it's viewed -- >> in the uk.

>> in the uk by british media. the two different approaches we've seen to how candidly they speak. >> i think that the uk is going to find it more difficult because this is very hollywood. it's very produced and what have you. british documentaries tend to be a lot more raw. but i actually liked it. i actually don't see anything wrong. i don't see -- you know, yesterday i was asked do you think the royal family will be nervous about this? i think the british media will be more nervous. >> why? >> more critical. >> more critical, more nervous. i thought that because of the buildup. the build up and in that first episode you see a mention of that almost straight out of compton, which is one of the first headlines that one of the newspapers came out with and that newspaper has been re relentlessly attacking. and as we know there's a lawsuit against that newspaper from several high profile people,

including harry. >> it exposes them is that what you're saying? >> yeah. i think it exposes them, leaks them back to the days of diana, days of tabloids like the daily mirror when they were phone tapping, i have to say they refuted that but there's still a lawsuit there. so i think the british media will see it more of an attack than the royal family would. >> let's listen to more of this. this is meghan talking about sort of -- it's not comfortable to do this but why they felt they had to do this. here she is. >> i'm not going to say it's comfortable, but when people say you haven't gotten any sense of who you are for so long. it's nice to be able to have the opportunity to let people have more of a glimpse into what's happened and who we are. >> what do you think? >> well, i think watching -- having watched all three episodes now, i think you see

what really was motivating meghan to do this in her conversations about the markle family. you realize you have heard five of meghan's anonymous friends talk about their relationship, you heard meghan's lawyers talk about her relationship with her dad but you never heard her talk about it. you can tell there's a sense she started to resent how much they were telling her to deal with her own family and not about optics and not about the fact she had a difficult childhood growing up, her parents divorced when she was young and i think there's a lot of trauma around that for her and this is her taking the opportunity to clear it up. the first three episodes, i don't know what's going to happen next but the first three episodes are about meghan markle's relationship with her family and the way the media interfered with that and harry's relationship with his family. >> i don't know any other way to ask it than to ask it. you and i -- >> yeah. >> you can say the most

supportive things about harry and meghan and they take the one thing they go this struck me differently and make a headline out of that. it has happened to me before. so one can be supportive of meghan's story, especially as a black woman, what she faced there. but also analyze and and actually criticize how it is happening. the approach. this new thing they're doing. as we said earlier the kardach-ification of the family. i it's their right to do it. >> their fan base, are young people. young people are cool with it. they like the talking. it's cool for young guys to talk about their relationship and that they met something on instagram. and, you know, they went to africa. it's cool for young men to talk about that.

so i think it's going to endear them to the younger audience. that's what they're looking at. >> is that a lesson for william and kate and the king? >> no. >> they're saying they want to modernize the modern family. is this the way to do it? >> no. there's a modernization in a middle class way which is william and katherine, the establishment way. and then there's who harry has always been. we saw that in the first episode. always been the rebel. harry was loved for being a rebel. he's just continuing that. it does feel a little bit uncomfortable now and again but i'm sure a lot of young people would say yeah, that's cool. >> that's a really important point. it's a different generation. >> different generation. >> they're trying to appeal to. >> i got to -- sorry. i guilty to to see them the other night. >> you did at the ripple awards. >> just watching people flock to them. i like them. >> you didn't flock? >> no, no, i'm not going to run over. >> he was at their table he

didn't have to flock. >> what? >> yes. i didn't have to run. but i liked watching people -- i'm more of an observer. i liked watching how people reacted to them. >> how did they? >> it was very much in the same vain as they did with his mother. >> diana. >> i remember covering diana, this was years ago, in the '90s. when she walked into this fashion thing, i think it was the museum of natural history into this event and everyone was like, oh, it was young people. i remember this one woman who was covering it for us, for our style thing, and our photographer stumbled and only got her foot as she was walking in, had to adjust. she said how do i start the story? >> she said one small step for something and one giant leap for the fashion industry. i just remember they had to fix the thing. i remember watching the assent of diana and this is in that

vein. >> which rankled the royal family, though, because she got so much more attention than the royal family. >> here's the thing now with charles. we saw a different charles since the queen died. far more socialable, touchy feely. they're catching up. but these guys for youngsters are way ahead. >> interesting. now there's a conversation about the royals. >> we're too old. >> thank you. bianca, thank you. thank you trisha. do you get paid through paypal or other third party apps? the irs has news for you. what you need to know. rachel solomon is here -- rahel. sorry. >> major health news for a legend celine deon, what she's

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welcome back to "cnn this morning." coming up we have a lot of news for you. starting with a significant easing of the covid controls of the chinese government saying that people no longer need to show a negative test or health code to travel between different parts of the country. that's a major change as we saw the protests happening last week. a cnn exclusive also this morning the biden administration is considering giving ukraine weapons banned in 100 countries we'll see if they ultimately do. also is elon musk on the verge of losing the title of the world's richest person? we'll tell you. if you have a small business or a side hustle and get paid through venmo, which i'm sure elon musk does not. maybe paypal or catch app. the irs wants to know you will have to report any payment of 6 -- $600 or more.

what if you're paying someone like you're splitting the cost of a trip with someone, paying a friend back, does that become taxable income? >> not necessarily. this is a big deal and will impact a lot of people. if you provide a service, have a side hustle, a side gig and you receive more than $600 of payments over a year or one payment of $600 you are going to get a tax form. the threshold used to be $10,000. so this will impact more people. to be fair we were all supposed to report all of our income to begin with. but now the irs knows if you make money on the third party platforms. it's venmo, paypal, venmo, if you sell a couch for $600, you're probably going to get a 1099k for this. i talked to a tax adviser

yesterday night to understand how this will work. he said this is probably the biggest deal many taxpayers who self-prepare their returns could look at this and say i have income and not realize they have expenses. unfortunately the people this hurts is the people this bill has been designed to help. the takeaway for people at home, if you get a 1099 form this year and most probably will if you had any extra income but don't b panic and think about do you have any expenses to write off against that? >> this is incredibly significant because of who it will impact. i guess that's the question here, what are the implications with the criticism we've seen over it targeting certain groups of people? >> i think the reality is this will impact small business owners, plumbers, if you have a service business. if you have a hair stylist, a type of business you are getting paid viapaypal, venmo you are

going to get a tax form you haven't before. the bar was 20,000 now it's 600. >> will you get one for all of them or are they all different? >> each third party platform is now required to report this. so if you sell something on e bay and if you sell something on amazon you're likely going to get a 1099 from ebay and amazon and both. >> thank you rahel. >> you enjoy my name. >> of course i know your name it's in the prompter. it's early. you know. a bungled coup attempt and a fall from power. how peru's president went from addressing congress to handcuffs in a matter of hours. a major story impacting elections to tell you about. >> that's right, don. a supreme court case before the justices that could really change the way elections are run, and some say even imperil

democracy. how the justices seem to be leans after yesterday's arguments. [bells] ♪ hey tristan! ♪

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for $69.99 a month for 12 months. plus ask how to get up to a $750 prepaid card with qualifying internet. so this morning the supreme court grappling with an historic case over whether to allow state legislators to draw congressional maps and set federal voting rules without any oversight from state courts. after three hours of debate, the justices seemed divided in three different directions. jessica, good morning to you. what are some of the sticking points in the justices' decisions? >> reporter: good morning, don. the court really did seem to be leaning toward accepting some iteration of this independent state legislate why are theory. if accepted, it would give broad

power to state lawmakers to control elections. because of that, critics are warning that even if this court approves a narrow version of that power, it could lead to a lot more court fights and even great are restrictions on voting access. who controls u.s. elections? that's the central question before the supreme court in a case that revolves around an obscure legal theory that says the state legislature should have final say around procedures and redistricting, not state courts. >> the blast radius from their theory would force a confusion two-track system with one set of rules for federal elections and another for state ones. >> reporter: north carolina republicans who lead the state legislature are challenging a ruling from their state supreme court striking down a redistricting map they drew. they're relying on the independent state legislature theory, the idea that state legislatures should have unchecked power to control election procedures and that state courts and state constitutions have no role in

checking that power. it's a concept that was first raised by chief justice william rehnquist in the bush v. gore decision and while four conservatives have previously expressed interest in the issue, justice brett kavanaugh seemed to push back on it. >> the position seems to be further than bush v. gore where he seemed to acknowledge that state courts would have a role interpreting state law. >> reporter: some trump supporters seized on the theory in 2020 to argue lawmakers in battleground states had the right to overrule the will of voters. it likely would not extend to the issue of electors but some are warning it could be a slippery slope if the court finds in favor of the republicans here. >> it would make election-related decisions effectively unreviewable by state court judge, cutting

neutral arbiters out of the process and allow extreme disenfranchisement of voters. >> the hours' long debate centered around what the founders meant when they quote the constitution and said the time, manner and holding of elections are for the legislature to determine. >> i think what might strike a person is this is a proposal that gets rid of the normal checks and balances. legislators, we all know, have their own self-interest. they want to get reelected. so there are countless tuimes when they have incentives to suv press votes. >> and justice kagan wasn't the only skieptic here. on the conservative side they all pushed back on the reading.

this court might try to find some middle ground if they embrace this very broad and perhaps active theory. >> very active court session this time around. >> let's discuss more with our cnn legal analysts. he filed an amicus brief arguing against this independent state legislature theory. i listened to the oral arguments yesterday. it was completely riveting three hours, double the time it was supposed to be. joan, what i'm struck by is this is anathema to many big name conservative lawyers but it seems like the most conservative justices on this court see some sort of path for it. >> definitely. it was interesting, poppy. you say how riveting it was, and in the courtroom itself it was even more so with the tension emanating from the bench and the room just filled, every seat. this is something that justices

thomas, gorsism and alito have been looking for. they've been laying groundwork since 20 as jessica mentioned, some of the lawyers from former donald trump's campaign pushing it back in 2020. those justices at the far right of this bench raising questions about state courts essentially going rogue, in their mind, and second guessing what the legislatures are doing. so it would be radical and i know that justice kagan touched on that in some of her other comments, too. >> she certainly did. and she laid out a lot of actually, ben, what you laid out in your amicus brief in this case. the reality is you've got 30 state legislatures in america now controlled by republicans, 17 by democrats. can you explain for people as kagan did in the simplest turns

what this would up end if adopted in any form. >> state legislatures, the most representative part of our government would basically have unchecked powers. they would not be subject to gubernatorial vetoes, not to popular referendums. it would give them the ability not only to perpetuate themselves in power but to form all the rules under federal elections not subject to review. while there may have been some state courts that went rogue, there is a middle ground that the justices were all prodding at that would allow some review of what state legislatures did by state courts as long as the state courts didn't go too crazy. >> well, you just said legislature -- state legislatures are the most representative, right? so what do you say to people who say, well, then why shouldn't they have this unchecked power? >> because the system of our government for 233 years has

always been based on checks and balances. >> right. >> and this would take away that basic protection. >> and because of that point, joan, conservative legal luminary, like ben, is conservative former judge michael ludig, to called it, was so passionate, was co-counsel on this case and said this is the whole ball game. is it really that big? >> yes. i would say if they rule to the extreme that was presented by north carolina legislature position yesterday, yes, it would be the whole ball game because it could -- and i do have to say not only could it affect election practices and redistricting, if it were then extended to the electors clause of the constitution, which is related in some way. it's distinct now but it could go further because it was the

elector's clause at issue in the case of bush v. gore, this could actually affect the certification of elections and, again, at its most extreme it could -- it could up end federal elections all the way up to the presidency. >> wow. ben, very quickly. you worked on bush v. gore. how shocked are you that we're at this moment with this court at this moment in this country when so many people are questioning elections and trying to overturn them? >> bush versus gore and the election of 2000 was a very, very extraordinarily tight election, but both sides recognized that there would be one winner. and so the situation we find ourselves in now with the questioning of elections is really harmful. and in a way the supreme court now has a huge burden on it in deciding this case as to whether there will be sufficient faith in the reliability of our

elections or not. >> incredibly important decision ahead for the justices. ben, joan, thanks so much. "cnn this morning" continues right now. ♪ we'll stay forever this way ♪ >> that voice. >> oh, that voice, beautiful voice, beautiful everything, beautiful dress, beautiful woman. >> terrible news. >> it's december 8th, by the way. the reason that we opened up with that showing you celine dion because celine dion is making a heart breaking announcement of a rare medical condition. we're going to have more on that in just a moment. these are the five big things that cnn is following this morning. a chilling new warning from