to have another roll call vote. i am not sure how quickly it is going to happen, but another roll call vote, and i am curious if he is going to lose more votes or if jim jordan can get his people to vote for him, and i doubt it. i think that we will do this until kevin mccarthy says enough. >> manu raja is there at capitol hill, and what is going to happen here? >> yes, that is the anticipation, and the mccarthy allies says they have been expecting it to fall short of 218 on the first ballot, but how it ends is anyone's guess, but they believe it can still happen despite the stiff loss, and he has to cut the defections down, a win them back of how to get there, and it is not clear, because he is not negotiating, and you can see him talking to

scott desjardins, because he is not negotiating and they are having an amicable conversation, and he is not negotiating, and so maybe he has to change the posture, but jim jordan is about to speak, and the expectation is to signal the supporters to support kevin mccarthy, and he is a close ally of mccarthy, and they have developed a close tie over the years, and this is a key source of the alliance between jordan and mccarthy. will jordan say, come vote and tell his six supporters to vote for mccarthy potentially, yes. will that change the math, no. this is still some paperwork is being done, and once that vote is being officially closed, and they will move on to the second vote, and the clerk of the house is about to make an announcement, and we will have the second vote to take place, and the conservatives is going to announce a potentially second

nominee, and we will see if that is going to play out, but kevin mccarthy is certainly to fall short, and not expecting to step aside, but grind it out as long as possible. >> but jim jordan wouldn't have already known that the folks would have voted for him, manu, and wouldn't he have had discussions to say, vote for mccarthy. >> yes, potentially, anderson, but lauren boebert voted yes for jim jordan and maybe she was skeptical for mccarthy, and not explicitly voting for mccarthy, and she told me that last night she was not explicitly going to vote for mccarthy, and they were not going vote andy biggs, but somebody they aligned with ideologically, but jim jordan said he has no want to be a candidate, and if he did, he, too, would fall short of the 218

vote, and that is if mccarthy cannot get there to 218, who can? steve scalise would also fall short, and so the same group that mccarthy cut with the hard-line members would fall short of the member, and those who don't like those concessions said they would not support that with any other speaker candidate with all kinds of speaker problems here. >> and melissa, does the former president trump, does he have a role to play here? >> well, he is a major fact in that -- think of this, and some of the rations that donald trump weighed into, the ten house republicans that decided to vote for his impeachment, he made sure every one of them lost. i am wishing that jamie catco and peter meyer, and i would hope they were here in the rock rib moderates were here, instead, some of the more far

right characters won this election cycle, and that is chipping away at the majority, and charlie and i know that as well, and so, i think that he can flip some of the votes, but the margin is way too big to get kevin to where he needs to get. >> i don't know how you get 15 to change the vote after they have gone so public, and kevin has made as many accommodations as he can with these folks on the fringe, and they are not there. >> it is interesting to me to see the fighting spirit this morning after months and monthss a alyssa points out, now let's fight. but this is a microcosm of the problem of the republican party, and you have a small vociferous part of the base that is wagging the dog here. you know, a big move would be for the republican to say, you know what, i'm going to form a coalition in the congress,

because we have to govern, but to do that, you are courting reprisals among the base. i don't know if kevin mccarthy or anybody else is going to do that. >> in 2015 when kevin went down, and then ryan was not ready to ascend, i had the democrats approach me who were sent over by the leaders to say, well, if you can get some votes, we will help you to find the rest, and we started to have those conversations so i can see a coalition speaker, and it is not likely or probable, but if you can't get 218, you could get a coalition speaker. >> or get enough concessions to get rid of mccarthy so that enough of the far right comes with you. >> i wanted to focus on the dynamics of the modern day republican party which would make it difficult for anyone who had been the minority leader for this past 117th congress to emerge unscathed from this

experience and keep the coalition enough to become speaker in the 118th congress. so you either have to side with the people like marjorie taylor greene and upset the moderate members or you have to go with the moderates and upset people like marjorie taylor greene, and you can't have it both ways. >> well, mondaire, to the way they make concessions, you will lose the majority in 2024, and that is the message they sent in november, and so if i am a swing district and i'm a republican, i am thinking that these guys are putting me in jeopardy now, and the real leader has to sort of seize that and take advantage of it. >> and mccarthy at some point, he was betting on that, and the moderates putting the pressure on the hardliners, and if you are moderate, you are nervous about this, and not only

mccarthy losing but him winning, he is beholden to this hardline caucus. >> he is one of the hardliners who used to sneer at governing, because it is about governance, and they don't believe in it in some of it. >> and the republicans are fantastic for governing and campaigning setting aside 2022, but when you have to come to govern, and put together a coalition to have the far right increasingly asen dent party like marjorie taylor greene and jim jordan who is trying to broker some agreement, and this is not in good faith, and it is carefully choreograph and i don't know but i believe that jim jordan is playing both

sides, and i believe that jim jordan who is coming from the freedom caucus, and this is all in furtherance of the ultimate, you know, ballot that ultimately goes to it. >> if you are anti-government, you are not part of the governing coalition. >> i want to go to lauren fox. you have been watching kevin mccarthy on the floor talk to other members. what have you been seeing? >> well, if you are thiinking about the moment that kevin mccarthy is in right now not getting these votes on the first round of balloting, it is amazing to watch him on the floor. he seems very upbeat, and shaking hands with the people, new members as well as their children, and you are also seeing that he is huddling with the allies, and he is not trying to go across the isle to win the conservatives in this moment, because he knows that they are standing against him, and he is not trying to win them over with the side discussions at least not right now, and maybe this is coming because after the

conference and the meeting that was heated according to many source, there is no goodwill to try to win them over, but it is an amazing moment, because when i have seen the negotiations nap the past in the senate and the house, and when the votes are not, there you will typically see the leaders working across the aisle and trying to find the consensus, but you are not seeing that with kevin mccarthy right now. >> and we are back here in new york, and nina, this can go on? >> it can go on and on and on and this is a game of chicken at this point. you have hardline caucus that seems to be pretty united in their hatred, for lack of a better word of kevin mccarthy wanting to see him go down to defeat, and mccarthy who wants to be speaker. he has wanted this for a decade of his life, and he has worked so hard to get here. >> this has been his north star. >> this has been his dream, his north star and he has made

concessions to get there, and at this point, he has been defeated on this first round, and he said that he will go multiple, multiple round, and at some point do to moderates get sick of this spectacle, and another candidate who could emerge to get to 218. >> i am stunned by how roundly he went down, and i thought that it would be a closer vote, and if you are elise stefanic and others behind the scenes would have had a better count, and he lost 31 votes in the caucus meeting and why not some discussion to say, kevin can't get it, and who do we put up. and yes, the far right is holding the house hostage at this moment, but as far as kevin mccarthy is keeping himself in the race, he is keeping a c consensus candidate from coming

forward. >> and in the rules of the notice to vacate, and the rules of the speaker of the house, and being the speaker of the house, and somebody wants the job, and what a thankless job to be. >> and how do you pass a rules package, because if i am moderate, and i voted against him, i will then vote against the rules. >> and charlie, what if that is the price to get them to vote for the alternative candidate? >> that is how you get at coalition speakership with the democrats. >> seems unlikely. >> the next ballot is going to be unlikely, because if mccarthy votes more votes and 19 to 16, and go to third ballot and chip the number back down. >> that is what they are clearly hoping to have jordan up to no, ma'am -- to nominate him on the second round. >> i am going predict the

shortest speakership in history. >> and he is going to have the farm bill, and the moment he passes anything with democrats, they will vote to vacate. >> can you govern, and can you be a speaker if five people can get together and decide they want to challenge you? >> half the power of the speaker is the fear that the speaker inspires within other people that if they go up against what she wants to do there is going to be consequences. and nobody is going to be feeling consequences as long as five people can get together, and now there are 19 explicit no votes to kevin mccarthy going into this. so it is just untenable the idea that he would have any leverage and to say nothing of the fact that people don't respect him, and it is not just members of the freedom caucus. >> i want to add to what alyssa

said that there are real consequences for country, because if for instance the debt ceiling comes up, and the u.s. defaults on the full faith and credit, that is a catastrophic outcome for the country, and these are the kinds of things in play, and whoever is speaker has to decide if i work with the democrats on this, and then five-vote motion to vacate comes in, and then you have chaos, and it is a messy, messy situation. >> and you can see jim jordan and elise stefanic talking. there is a second vote in the works, and we will cover it all in the quick break. it's clinically shown to help manage blood sugar levels and contains high quality protein to help manage hunger and support muscle health. try boost® today. - "best thing i've ever done." that's what freddie told me. - it was the best thing i've ever done, and-

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the house will be in order. >> all right. listen in. >> the teller agree and the tallies are that the total number of votes cast are 434 in which the honorable hakeem jeffries of the state of new york has received 212. [ applause ] the honorable kevin mccarthy of the state of california has received 203.

[ applause ] the honorable andy biggs of the state of arizona has received is 10. the honorable jim jordan of the state of ohio has received 6. the honorable jim banks of the state of indiana has received one. the honorable lee zeldin of the state of new york has received one. the honorable byron donalds of the state of florida has received one. no persons having receive ad majority of the whole number of votes cast by surname, a speaker has not been elected.

following the procedure used by the house in 1923 and recorded in canon's precedent volume 6, 24, the clerk is prepared to have the reading clerk to call the roll anew. for what purpose does the gentleman from ohio seek recognition? >> i rise to nominate kevin mccarthy for speaker of the house. [ applause ] >> the gentleman is recognized. >> thank you, madam clerk. i think that we have three objectives this congress, three fundamental things that we have to get done in the 118th

congress. first, pass the bills that fix the problems. in two years' time, we have a border that is no longer a border. we have a military that cannot reach the military recruitment, and bad education policy, and record inflation, record debt, and government that has been weaponed against we, the people, against the very people that we represent. so we need to pass ledgedation to address all that, and i hope my democrat colleagues will join me. i really do, but i have my doubt, and if they don't, and if chuck schumer says no, we will not take up that legislation that we pass and joe biden will not pass that, sobeit. they will have to answer to the people in 2024. and second, we can never ever let a bill like the one that passed 12 days ago, $1.7 trillion spent, and we can not

ever, ever let that legislation pass again. [ applause ] we have to pass a budget that makes sense, that is good commonsense and then do the 12 appropriations bill that recognizes the people's money and not ours and send it to the senate, and then stand firm on that legislation, and again, if they won't take it up, and joe biden won't sign it, we can stand firm on a cr or something, and we can have that fight, but we are not going to have what took place a week and a half ago ever happen again. and then finally third, and this is important. we have to do the oversight through the investigations -- >> house in order. >> we have to do the oversight, and the investigations that need to be done, this idea that bureaucrats who never put their name on a ballot but i think

that run the country and insulted our constituent's first amendment liberties have to be held accountable. we need to do it. [ applause ] we need to do it in a way that is consistent with the constitution and we need to do it vigorously and aggressively and that is part of our duty as members of the body. to my friends on this side of the aisle, i would say this, the differences that we may have, and the differences between joyce and jordan or biggs and bacon, they pale in comparison to us and the left which is now unfortunately controls the other party, and we had better come together and fight for these key thing, these three things, and that is what the people want us to do, and i think that kevin mccarthy is the right guy to

lead us, and i really do, or i would not be up here leading this speech. i came in here with kevin 16 years ago and we have not always agreed, and i like his fight and tenacity and kevin told me in a book, the toughest questions are when you get knocked down, and can you come back? and yes, we need to rally around, and come together and deal with these three thing, because this is what the people sent us here to do. and my favorite scripture verse is paul saying to timothy, fight the good fight and stay the course and keep the faith, and i like the verse of action, and not wimpy words, but words that fit america, and this is what the american people want, they elected to us do, and we should all remember, remember that 12,000 people have ever had the

opportunity to do what we are doing, serve in this congress. it is a privilege. it is an opportunity. we owe it to them, the american people, the good people of this great country to step forward to come together, get a speaker elected so we can address these three thing, and i hope that you will vote kevin mccarthy, and that is why i am proud to nominate him for speaker of the house. [ applause ] >> for what purpose does the gentleman from california rise? >> madam clerk, i was witnessing history here. i was not sure who the gentleman from ohio was rising for, if not

to nominate himself. >> is the gentleman rising to place a nomination? >> yes, and i just want to take the same time that the gentleman from ohio took. take into consideration, the last time that the speaker went to a second body, the new oew y yankees had not gone to a world series. so, think of the chaos on the other side, madam clerk, we are going to stay here to get this done. and we are unified and we are all going to support hakeem jeffries for speaker. the lead vote getter in the last ballot. madam clerk as chair of the democratic caucus, i am directed by the vote of the caucus to

present for the speaker of the house of the 118th caucus from the state of new york hakeem jeffries, and we will once again be unified in our support for him. [ applause ] >> for what purpose does the gentleman from florida rise? >> to nominate a candidate for speaker of the house. >> the gentleman is recognized. >> well, sometimes we have to do jobs that we don't really want to do, and sometimes we have to do jobs that we are called to do and so my colleagues, i rise to nominate the most talented, hardest working member of the republican conference who just gave a speech with more vision than we have ever heard from the alternative. i am nominating jim jordan is humble perhaps today humbled to a fault, and maybe the right

person for the job of speaker of the house isn't someone who wants it so bad. maybe the right person for the job of speaker of the house isn't someone who has sold shares of themselves for more than a decade to get it. maybe jim jordan is the right person for speaker of the house because he is not beholden to the lobbyists and special interests who have corrupted this place and corrupted this nation under the leadership of both republicans and democrats. maybe jim jordan would be the right person for the speaker of the house when he would not fight us when we try to get a term limits on the floor, and maybe he would not fight us when we try to put a balanced budget on the floor, and maybe jim jordan is the right person, because he would put a plan to secure our border to the floor.

and as he said, there are certain bills that we need to pass to get to the floor, and the challenge is that the person who is voting for these bills have caused these problem, and mr. jordan says that we cannot accept the bills like the omnibus, and i agree, and if he were the leader of the republican team, we would not have that circumstance choking the country's economy and choking the prospect of life for our fellow american, and finally mr. jordan said that we must engage in rigorous oversight, and every one of the republicans knows that the person who can lead that oversight who works on it everyday, and has the skill and the talent and the will is jim jordan. i am nominating him and i am voting for him.

>> the reading clerk will call the roll. >> adams -- >> hold on. >> adams. jeffries. adderholt. mccarthy.

agu aguilar, jeffries. alford. >> kevin mccarthy. >> allen? >> mccarthy. >> allred? >> jeffries. >> moday. >> mccarthy. arms armstrong? mccarthy. arrington. mccarthy. aukenclaus. jeffries. bacon.

mccarthy. baird. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. bolderson. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. balance. >> hakeem jeffries. banks. >> mccarthy. >> barr. >> mccarthy. >> erdogan. >> jeffries. >> beatty. >> for the second time i proudly pass a historic vote for hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. pence. >> mccarthy. >> berra. >> jeffries. >> bergmann.

>> mccarthy. >> beyer. >> jeffries. >> bice. >> mccarthy. >> biggs. >> jordan. >> billerachus. >> mccarthy. >> bishop of georgia. >> jeffries. >> bishop of north carolina. >> jordan.

>> blumenauer. >> jeffries. >> blunt, rochester. >> jeffries. >> boebert. >> jordan. >> bonamicci? >> hakeem jeffries. >> bowman. >> jeffries. >> boyle of pennsylvania. >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. >> rakin. >> jordan.

brown. >> jeffries. >> brownlee. >> jeffries. >> buchanan. >> mccarthy. bu buck. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. lushon. >> mccarthy. >> budwinski. >> mccarthy. >> burgess. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. >> burleson. >> mccarthy. bush. >> hakeem jeffries.

>> jeffries. cal calvert. >> mccarthy. >> cammack. >> mccarthy. >> carrabeo. >> jeffries. >> carbajal. >> jeffries. >> for the first african-american speaker of the house, hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. >> carl. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. carson. >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. carter of georgia. >> kevin mccarthy. >> mccarthy.

cart oer of louisiana. >> carter of louisiana votes hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. carter of texas. >> mccarthy. cartwright. >> jeffries. kasar. >> jeffries. >> case. >> jeffries. >> jeffries. caston. >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. >> caster of florida. >> jeffries. castro of texas. >> jeffries. >> jeffries. chavez. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. mccormick. >> mccormack.

>> chu. >> jeffries. >> jeffries. cicilline. >> jeffries. >> jeffries. ci ciscomani. >> jeffries. >> clark of massachusetts. >> jeffries. >> clark of new york. >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. cleaver. >> jeffries. >> jeffries. kline. >> mccarthy. >> mccarthy. cl cloud? >> jordan. >> jordan. >> clyburn. so we are going to break in to note that once again congressman kevin mccarthy who can only afford to lose four house republican votes if he

wants to become the next speaker has lost five house republican votes, six house republican vote, and this time, all of the votes are going to congressman jordan as opposed to first ballot when all of them went to andy biggs, so we have six votes for congressman jordan right now, and what is significant and what we are all watching is if there is going to be more than 19 anti-mccarthy votes, and will the total of 19 go up or down, john king. >> and the question is what is next. this is plan b of the mccarthy opponents decided to rally around jim jordan. kevin mccarthy is not going to vote on the second vote of the congress, and so they have to figure out what are we going to do here. we are supposed to be the governing party of the house of representatives, and we cannot

come to a consensus of what to do who is going to lead us. and so this is about who can we call at leader for a month or two. and they are failing at the moment. >> can we talk about jim jordan, and two things, because it is a remarkable address on the floor. and dana, you have covered him on his time of the house, and it is a broadly inspiring speech, and i am not sure how the frame it, but i have not heard him talk that way necessarily, and certainly compared to the conviction on display with the conviction that kevin mccarthy does or doesn't routinely display around the issues, the contrast was strike, and then to have matt gaetz come up to say that he made the point on the house, and saying that mccarthy was selling shares of himself is a remarkable state. >> to expla in to what people

what just happened here. this is mccarthy's best shot if he wanted to convince people who wanted to vote for him and people on the second ballot to switch to mccarthy, this is the best case scenario for mccarthy. mccarthy and jim jordan as he said today, they do not see eye to eye. >> what an interesting thing for him to mention. >> and they used to hate each other, and they made a political alliance that is being tested right now. but, it may not be up to jim jordan at this point, and i think that if this vote goes much the same way as the last vote except for more people go to jim jordan's column, that is when we will see if there are some more come to jesus meetings with kevin mccarthy. >> and the opposition is making the point for all jim jordan so

far in the reporting of manu and that all 19 are planning to vote for jim jordan before they split the vote, and that is a message to kevin mccarthy and kevin mccarthy's allies, even if you have jim jordan out there to make a plea for somebody who he does not necessarily align with, that is not going to sway us, and that is going to leave them nowhere. >> it is not just public whipping votes, but privately, we will see what is going to work, because it has not happen happened so far that works. >> and they used to hate each other and kevin mccarthy brought him into the fold, and he wanted to be -- >> was it a smart move? >> well, maybe not a smart move, but you can see why kevin mccarthy did that is my point. as we are watching this and predicting what is going to happen next, and it is obviously

anybody's guess, and brian fitzpatrick who said who could be a viable alternative, he said it is not somebody inside of the house, but outside of the house of representatives. >> what is interesting about the speech that congressman jordan gave, it was officially a renominating speech for the second ballot for kevin mccarthy, but it was not an ardent explanation of why he loves kevin mccarthy and thinks that he should be speaker of the house, and it was as you noted, kasie, an inspiring agenda-filled description of what he wants to do as a leader of the house. i don't think that was lost on anyone. >> no, i am getting the text messages from the sources who are saying that they are digesting it on the house floor and talking amongst themselves

that it was remarkably good, and maybe i should think about that. >> and vote for jordan perhaps? >> i am not saying that people think that he is going to go to 218, and i think that people listened to the speech, and were surprised how good it was. >> there is another group here other than the freedom caucus, and this is all of the other people who have been voting for kevin mccarthy, and that is the moderates who are sitting here and realize that the party is being humiliated. they cannot vote for a speaker, and they cannot organize. to go back to what our colleague david axelrod up in new york so perfectly said, when is somebody going to go to kevin mccarthy saying is, "dude, they are just not that into you. and so there a point that some folks may not want kevin mccarthy. >> and yet, there is a point

that this has not happened in a century, and when it happened in 1923, the speaker ultimately was elected. >> that has gone to nine ballots, and that has not been lost on kevin mccarthy. and he said that the candidate who had the most votes became the speaker in the ninth round, and this is why they plan to grind it out going forward. the republicans who are part of the opposition group are all aligning themselves behind jim jordan behind the pleas to support kevin mccarthy, and eight republicans supporting congressman jordan and we expect that number to grow to 19. now, what is going to happen on the third ballot, and that is the third question, and as long as kevin mccarthy is in this race, and no viable alternative is going to emerge, and this is the reality on the house floor, and there are people who are not

going to run against kevin mccarthy including the leadership team including steve scalise, and this is not going to happen if he continues to be in this race, and he has not indicated that he is moving forward, and again, with rein the situation of unchartered waters the, and what is going to be happening here, and the fact is that the conservatives are not swayed, and bob good said, that there is nothing that kevin mccarthy can be swayed, and he is never going to become speaker with kevin mccarthy, and this is what he said. >> and it does appear that the 19 rebels are unifying behind instead of five candidates, they are all getting behind congressman jordan, but it does suggest that there was no plan b among the house leadership, and no plan, well, if kevin mccarthy does not win on the first or the

the second ballot, then steve scalise is going to fall in line, and that is up to him. >> that is what you heard, jake, from the mccarthy allies is that they never had a backup plan, and in fact, you have an awkward situation on the floor where you have jim jordan nominating jim jordan nominating kevin mccarthy who says that he does not want the job, and repeatedly said that he does not want the job, and he would not have the votes, and this is what the moderates have told me, and so who else is going to be getting this job? they are short 19 votes, but it is not necessarily that he would not get nothing, and in fact, it is true that the others may not have the vote either. and steve scalise is somebody they could rally around, and it is what manu raju and i and

others have been reporting on, and it is trick kishgs but the conservatives don't want mccarthy, but the conservatives have nowhere else to go. >> and dana bash, we are watching these 19 rebels fall in line behind congressman jordan, and i remember having a conservation with a democratic congressman 19 years ago in the midterm, and how the house republicans would likely win, and she said that she didn't think that kevin mccarthy was going to be speaker, and she thought that jim jordan had been, and she had heard the whispers from the colleagues that jim jordan would actually end up, and that was just gossip, but it was from a member of gossip, and we are certainly watching something interesting play out now. >> and the fact that he gave the speech, and they are now consolidating, and now, it is something as innocent as what

you were saying, abby, and hearing that jordan is making a point of being public in the support and trying to get the dissenters saying is no, no, no we won't be with you, mccarthy, and we are going to support jordan or there could be something else going on behind the scenes, and that this could be a very, very clever game of chess as opposed to what appears to be happening before us. i think it is unlikely, but why not? >> you mentioned gossip, and i have to say, jake, the floor of the house is not unlike a high school cafeteria or hallway, because it can run out of control, and what starts as rumor can become things that people don't expect, so it is important to pay attention to all of the moments, and to that jordan speech and the reaction

it to and how it is playing out, because the reality is that, yes, it is possible dana, that there are chess moves, but there is also a scenario that what is playing out is going to dictate the outcome, and we don't know how anything that is happening on the floor right now may ultimately influence who is going to become eventually the speak over the house. >> john king, you and i have been in this town for a long time, and what is your interpretation of the jim jordan speech? it sounded like a jim jordan nominating speech? >> it sounds like he likes his role of the chairman of the oversight committee, and as the speaker of the house, you have to oversee the herd, and he knows the chaos of the house, and do you really want that number one job because of the responsibilities of it or the bulldozer to go after hunter

biden and joe biden or cabinet members to indict them. it does conflict him, and does he want to be bulldozer in chief, and so they have to look in the mirror. jamie mentioned the more centrist republicans, and they don't want jim jordan to get to 218, and no. would he like to, yes. everybody on the floor is am bish shoushgs love that power. but then the consensus is that you are embarrassing the institution, and embarrassing our party, and making us look like clown, and when does kevin mccarthy have to say on the third or the fourth ballot, the math is not there, and the

longer, i hang on, i am embarrassing the institution, and embarrassing the party and embarrassing the process here. >> i think that we will look back at the second vote as the ego vote for jim jordan. the math is not going to g get there for kevin mccarthy, and this is the vote for jim jordan knowing that the math is not there yet for kevin mccarthy, and the move of these centrists has not happened yet to say to kevin mccarthy that we need to look elsewhere. >> can they then get jim jordan to go to kevin mccarthy, i am not going to win, and you are not either. so figure it out. >> and right now, the centrist and the more -- i don't know what we call them now, the

extremes, they are saying opposite. they are telling mccarthy, do not give up. >> when you are looking at mccarthy's leadership team, it is not centrist team, and you are looking will at people pretty much for the right, and you could argue to the right -- >> and now, let's listen in. >> jim jordan. >> mccarthy. just keeping an eye, okay, jordan voted for mccarthy. >> so, how long can mccarthy keep the hey, it's over, and i don't know what the answer is. i am not sure anyone does because any one of them i think could be that person to go to him and it may not be them who has their name put up in a nomination but how they decide that i think could determine how the rest of this --

>> well, the votes are still coming in. there is no end as of now in sight to this speaker's standoff. an open revolt against republican leader kevin mccarthy. stay with us to find out what happens next. we'll squeeze in a quick break. we'll be right back. uhhhh... here, i'll take that. [woo hoo!] ensure max protein, with 30 grams of protein, one gram of sugar and nutrients for immune health. if your moderate to severe crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms are stopping you in your tracks... choose stelara® from the start... and move toward relief after the first dose... with injections every two months. stelara® may increase your risk of infections, some serious, and cancer. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, sores, new skin growths, have had cancer, or if you need a vaccine. pres, a rare, potentially fatal brain condition, may be possible. some serious allergic reactions

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that doesn't change the bottom line, however, the house still doesn't have a speaker. it's not clear how or when this open warfare among house republicans may end. back with our team now as we continue to watch the counting of the votes and the roll call. alyssa, what do you see at play? >> so i suspect that the freedom caucus, the right flank blocking kevin mccarthy right now are running a 2015 playbook. i was at the time their comms director and what they were planning to do then, allow it to go to multiple ballots to show paul ryan didn't have the majority and that jim jordan couldn't be speaker before ultimately having, you know, the beleaguered tired folks unite around a consensus candidate. back then it was going to be mike pompeo. i'm curious if jordan is a straw man for the right right now and that they have someone else up their sleeves that they're going to put up to be speaker.

it's a long shot but there's a level of orchestration here that i actually think the freedom caucus deserves credit for that makes me think they have another play at hand. >> they have more than that of mccarthy. someone voting for mccarthy said as long as it takes, mccarthy. which isn't really a plan, right? it doesn't very strong. it sounds fairly thirsty and desperate at this point so we'll see what happens on the third ballot. >> this small band so far of 19 people seems to be much more organized than mccarthy. >> if that strategy was the plan back in 2015, had hillary clinton won, 5 is the end goal, not to get jordan across the line but have somebody else be speaker that's more to the liking of the right. >> there is a sense jordan couldn't get to 218.

that may be different. i imagine the speech he gave on the floor nominating kevin mccarthy shortly ago actually did more to flip more votes for them than kevin mccarthy. >> it was a slightly different tone than or sort of a broader -- >> sounded like a candidate, so perhaps the play is jim jordan but i wouldn't be surprised if it's basically teeing up anyone but kevin. >> can i say, we should note how ironic it is that two years after the january 6th insurrection jim jordan is a central player in this drama who was the guy who was speaking to the president on january 6th who was referred to the ethnics committee by the january 6th committee for his role, who was rejected for the january 6th committee because of his role and now he's described as a rock star. i accept that description, a rock star on the right, but, man, what a turn of events here.

this is exactly -- you know, in the election, voters, republican, democrat and independent came together and said we're done with election denial. we're unhappy with the insurrection and now here's a hero of that group of the insurrectionists who emerges as a central player. >> also a possible future chairman of the judiciary committee. >> yes. >> don't forget kevin mccarthy was also referred to the house ethnics committee on which i served until a few hours to me. it's not clear if you haven't been sworn in yet the members of the 117th continue to serve. we'll figure that out. i think what you described as something of a long shot might have been true a few weeks ago but i think it's clear they will not vote for kevin mccarthy and so the purpose now that they seem to have is establish their seriousness before them pivoting to another candidate. >> i feel like we'll be a standoff. who bends first? do the folks who are the only

kevin folks, do they say maybe we need to move elsewhere or do these 19, do they decide, okay, they've made their point? do they come back? i don't know right now. >> they're sort of the only kevin-ish folks. >> maybe kevin. >> right. >> goes from -- >> morally kevin. >> you kind of agree with alyssa this is kind of -- there's a strategy here. >> i think there is a strategy here. i think the idea that jim jordan and others who are ideologically aligned with him did not know how this would pan out defies common sense and, you know, it's not clear to me who the alternative will be. scalise is probably the best bet because i think so much of this is personal but the irony is that kevin mccarthy has done everything that these people have asked of him over the past two years, to the point of really diminishing himself in the eyes of not only his colleagues on both sides of the aisle especially moderates on th