i'm bill lockwood, current caretaker and owner. when covid hit, we had some challenges like a lot of businesses did. i heard about the payroll tax refund, it allowed us to keep the amount of people that we needed and the people that have been here taking care of us. see if your business may qualify. go to getrefunds.com. global sign of support for ukraine on the left london, on the right, brussels and in the center, the eiffel tower in paris. the cnn town hall, russia's invasion of ukraine one year later hosted by fareed zakaria starts now. this is a cnn town hall. russia's invasion of ukraine,

one year later. almost exactly a year ago missile attacks against the capital of ukraine, kyiv. to most this was a surprise attack and invasion. the ukrainians didn't see it coming, nor did the europeans. the one consistent voice cautioning that an invasion was likely, the u.s. intelligence community. another surprise for the world, the intense resolve about entertainer turned president volodymyr zelenskyy, unlike others in his position he didn't flee but only left the country a handful of times to plea for guns and ammunition. and for the last year he's faced off from across the border with vladimir putin who has ruled russia for more than two de decades. the key player who is not a participant in the war, the united states of america.

it is the country that has organized the sanctions against russia, it is the country that has been the single biggest provider of military and nonmilitary assistance and tonight on this special program, you'll hear from two top officials on america's national security team, first the biden administration's key player on countering russia's war in ukraine, the national security adviser, jake sullivan, who was with president biden in kyiv this week, also usaid administrator samantha power, the official responsible for making sure the u.s. is assisting the people of ukraine in the horrible humanitarian crisis created by russia's war. they will answer questions directly from americans and ukrainians in the war zone.

good evening, and welcome to a live cnn town hall event, i'm fareed zakaria. we are coming to you from three countries tonight, the united states, russia and ukraine. as russia's invasion turns one year old, our questioners have a lot on their minds and they're seeking answers about america's commitment to help ukraine defeat russia. this hour we will speak to a soldier on the front lines, a mother who is uneasy about america's resolve, and a child who is looking for protection from the united states of america and the people with the answers are joining me now, president biden's right-hand man on ukraine, national security adviser jake sullivan joins me here on the stage right now. [ applause ]

as does usaid administrator samantha power. [ applause ] jake sullivan, samantha power, so glad you're here with us. such an important night. the audience is getting ready to ask you questions, but before that, while they prepare, let's go to our reporters in the region. they've been covering this conflict for the last year in and out of ukraine. we've had teams there all the time. senior international correspondent fred pleitgen is in moscow. senior national security correspondent alex marquardt is in dnipro and clarissa ward is in kyiv. we'll hear from fred and alex later in the program, but now clarissa, i want to ask you something very simple to help us set the stage. what is the state of this war

right now? you've been covering it for -- ever since it began. >> reporter: that's right, fareed. and when we watched explosions one year ago lighting up the night sky, the expectation from intelligence services was that kyiv would fall in a matter of days. well, one year later kyiv is still standing. you can see the lights are still on behind me despite a ruthless concerted russian campaign to target civilian infrastructure, and the ukrainian military has been able to launch several very successful counteroffensives relying on a mixture of courage, obviously, but also creativity, savvy international support and cutting-edge technology that has been crucial in pushing back russian forces. but ukrainian authorities now, fareed, are saying that they want to take back all the territory they've lost. they want to return to 1991 borders and that is going to be very tricky because the

situation now is still grim, particularly in the eastern part of the country. it is a grinding war of attrition, looking more and more like a stalemate every day and that's why you're hearing ukrainian leaders coming out every day asking for that heavier weaponry they say that they need to finish this off. i spoke to one senior ukrainian official last night who said that they had pushed this home to president biden once again and that, quote, it is now in america's hands and they understand. >> thanks for that, clarissa. and stay safe out there. now we get to our special guests, national security adviser jake sullivan and usaid administrator samantha power. jake was one of just three aides who accompanied president biden on that surprise trip to kyiv, so i want to first ask you, jake, this was really an extraordinary trip. the president first time in history a u.s. president has entered a war zone that the united states did not control,

so -- i've taken that overnight train to kyiv and you're going through poland, and you're in a war zone for a large part of it, so i'm guessing u.s. planes could not enter that war zone. what was it like for you there? what were you guys thinking? there's a period there where the president was not protected the way the president normally is, right? >> well, first of all, fareed, thanks for having us tonight and i want to thank cnn for putting a spotlight on this war one year after it began, and it's just so important that we get the chance to talk about all of these issues. the trip actually began with a long plane flight from washington, a stopover in ramstein in germany and landed in poland and, in fact, the president had to take an hour-long car ride in an unmarked suv, not his normal limo we're all used to seeing with a very small motorcade, pull up to the train station and board this train late at night

in the dark for a ten-hour trip overnight to arrive in kyiv the following morning. and as you said, the united states didn't control the airspace, didn't control the ground, we were entering a country at war heading to a capital at war, a country that has been subject to routine and repeated bombardments by the russians and without any of the normal security capacity that would usually accompany a president so we were heading into the unknown because this was unprecedented. the president was up much of the night not so much worried about his safety as he was worried about making sure that he was going to maximize his time on the ground in kyiv, that he was going to have the kind of conversations face-to-face with president zelenskyy that would allow us to move forward in our support and most importantly that he could stand up and say to the world from right there in kyiv as you just heard clarissa say that a year ago people were bracing for the fall of kyiv and

a year later, kyiv stands. ukraine stands and america stands with kyiv and there is no more powerful way to send that message than have the american president do that. it was a mixture of deep anxiety but also a kind of building pride about serving a president and being part of a country that is trying to support ukraine in its hour of need. >> so let me ask you about the next thing that clarissa said, which ukrainian officials say they're trying to press on the biden administration, give us the tools, we will repel the russians completely. we'll kick them out of crimea and take back the donbas but you're not giving us that kind of offensive weaponry that we need to take it. what did president biden and you say when the ukrainians told you that? >> well, first, i want to make sure to protect the private conversations that president biden and president zelenskyy had, because they built a real relationship of trust, and they did have deep conversations about precisely what kinds of capacities and what kind of

training ukraine needs to be successful in this effort to take back the territory that russia is currently occupying. but let me just say this, fareed, this week alone on the day the president arrived, he brought with him aften announcet about more himars and about american tanks and vehicles and so much of america's high-technology capacity and today the united states announced a further $2 billion in security assistance to ukraine, all designed for a specific purpose, which is with our military looking hard at this set of problems, what can we do to give ukraine the tools it needs to win and we will keep working with them month by month to figure out if there are additional tools they need, and that was the message that president biden gave to president zelenskyy, that we're going to continue to look at what is necessary and make sure that we provide what is necessary that ukraine has what it needs to succeed on the battlefield so it is in the best

possible position to secure its sovereignty and territorial integrity. >> let's take a question from the audience. meet walter. he served in the u.s. army for 19 years, he has a question for administrator power. walter. >> thanks for the opportunity. what vital interest does the united states have in ukraine from a national security perspective? it seems avoiding nuclear war with russia is most important, however, the continued material support to ukraine raises the possibility that nuclear escalation might occur. our strategy seems to rely on the rationality of vladimir putin to not go nuclear. is this wise? >> thank you so much. well, you've heard president biden himself speak often to the importance of avoiding exactly that scenario. he's been very attentive to the risk of escalation and the strategy that has been pursued, has been very measured, but what

is at stake is values and interests so core to the united states, i mean, imagine just wanting your freedom and your independence. i mean, this country is predicated on exactly those two values. imagine the counter factual where we walk away or we didn't show up in the first place and what that would mean when a dictator who has shut down civil society, shut down independent media, shut down dissenting voices in his own country then can just turn his sights on a neighbor and with impunity take over that country. i mean, what would that mean for our allies in europe? what would that mean for our own security over time so i think, you know, americans understand bullies and the importance of standing up to bullies. at the same time, again, we're very alert to the risks given that russia is a nuclear armed power as you rightly say, but that, again, how we are in the

position that we are in now building a coalition of countries coming together, making sure this isn't just the united states and russia that this, in fact, is ukrainians on the front lines, ukrainians doing the fighting and a coll coalition of 50 countries rallying behind them and more than 140 countries at the u.n. signaling still a year into the war their support for ukraine's self-defense. >> jake, what about the issue of nuclear escalation? are you confident that vladimir putin is bluffing when he says he may escalate to other means, you know, he said that at various points in the past. >> well, what i can speak to is what we see, and we do not see any change in russia's nuclear posture and made no changes in our nuclear posture so we are constantly vigilant and also maintain regular channels to the russian government to be able to talk to them about the risk of this escalation and also communicate the severity of the

consequences of the use of nuclear weapons but from our perspective sitting here today we do not see movements in russia's nuclear forces that lead us to believe that something fundamentally has changed from how things have been over the course of the past year. >> let's bring in yigor, a soldier in the territorial defense forces working as a tactical medic on the front lines. for his safety we won't tell you his last name or exact location but he is on the front lines in the east of ukraine just a few miles from russia's troops. for someone living on the front lines day and night give us an idea what is life like out there? >> so, hello, everyone. of course, on the front line it is difficult. there are many factors, we speak about our direction, the direction of my unit, basically

we have fights every day and every night, you know, now it's night in ukraine and sometime ago it was enemy tank attack. our enemies try to break through front line zone. yesterday only in our direction the enemy had hundreds of soldiers and what should i say, we continue to hold our territories. >> does it feel to you like the russians are trying to break through? i mean, does it feel like there's a lot of new russian forces coming at you? >> yes, it's true. >> yegor, stay right there because if you can, we have to take a break. when we come back i'm going to ask yegor to pose a question to

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i am joined here in d.c. by national security adviser jake sullivan and usaid administrator samantha power. and joining us again from the front lines of the war is yegor, a territorial defense soldier in the ukrainian military. yegor, i know you have a question you want to ask jake sullivan. what would you like to know? >> yes, i have one specific question for mr. sullivan. is your government planning or considering launching the production of ammunition especially for ukraine? i mean 155 colored shell, 120 caliber mines and, of course, himars missiles. do you consider this plan and if your answer positive would you please tell me when are you going to realize this? thank you. >> well, first, yegor, i just want to say as you stand out on

the front lines tonight you're defending the freedom of your country but as president biden said in warsaw two nights ago you're defending freedom everywhere so i want to say thank you for your bravery, your courage and for the men and women who are fighting with you. we are grateful for all that you do, the sacrifices that you are making and we can't even begin to imagine the difficulties and the trials that you've gone through. what we can do is everything in our power to get you the equipment and the ammunition that you need, and you mentioned 155 millimeter artillery shells, 120 millimeter tank shells and other systems like the himars missiles that you also just discussed. one of the things that we are working hard at at president biden's direction is to increase the production of all of these types of ammunition. here in the united states, but also in nato countries, so that

the total supply of each of these different forms of ammunition grows month by month and we can continue to move to the front lines this ammunition and the quantities that is necessary for you to be able to mount a successful defense and take back territory that has been occupied by russia. this is not something we can do at the snap of a finger but it's something that we are putting immense effort and resources into, and secretary of defense lloyd austin every month gathers 50 countries together in europe in order to take stock of our progress and every two weeks president biden authorizes a new package of ammunition to send to ukraine and we are trying to ramp up the numbers of that as rapidly as we possibly can, because we recognize that it is so central to your success in the fight. so, we will continue to do all that we can do on this very specific issue that it's not

just about rhetoric or word, it's about actually delivering the goods and that's what we're trying to do. >> yegor, thank you so much for joining us. we pray that you and your compatriots return home safely to your families. you know, we have yegor up there because of starstink. i wantstarlink. the ukrainian army is able to communicate among itself. ukrainian society is able to communicate because of starlink, which is essentially the will of one private individual in the united states. is that how it should be? people there worry if elon musk loses interest that will turn the battlefield dark for them? they won't be able to communicate with one another.

should the u.s. government be playing a role in this rather than elon musk? >> well, first the fact that there is a company that has sent up enough satellites to create a resilient system for internet communication and telephone communication even in a war zone, even when russia is day by by day trying to take out ukrainian communications, that is a good thing and it should be praised. but, of course, there should be more options. there should be more availability of the internet, more competition and we'd like to see more companies enter the picture to be able to offer a range of choices. now, having the united states be the internet provider, the u.s. government in the united states or in ukraine or anywhere is, you know, not the way that we have designed the distribution and the availability of internet communication. we have relied upon the private sector for it but there are steps the u.s. government can take working with other governments to stimulate and support more of these types of companies being able to deliver

more internet to more people in ukraine but, yes, also here in the united states and elsewhere around the world. and, in fact, something that usaid does, i don't need to speak for samantha on this is look to expand internet access everywhere through ways in which we can break down the barriers to the provision of that internet access in ukraine and everywhere else, because there should be many different options available, but we also should give credit where credit is due and starlink has been a critical element in this -- in the defense of ukraine. >> if i could just add one thing, fareed, on the specifics of starlink, that was a public/private partnership between usaid in getting the terminals delivered in a timely way, i mean, within days, if not hours of when putin invaded, so, you know, it would be very hard for a ceo from far away to know where they should go, to have the connections on the ground with ukrainian officials,

because usaid and the u.s. government has been working with the ministry of digital transformation with the cybersecurity experts on the ground, i mean, one of the untold stories of this war is how secure ukrainian communications have been, notwithstanding russia's known proclivity for hacking and trying to use asymmetric means in order to destabilize countries. that's the product of years of partnership with the ukrainians and so often when you see a private sector actor and one as important as this one we can't discount that but it also stems from some hustle and some catalytic work by u.s. government actors, frankly, in order to get out of the way and bring the private sector together with the ukrainians who know what they need and when they need it. >> samantha power, let me ask you a question that really is fully in your bailiwick and something a lot of americans think about, a lot of republicans have been clamoring about, which is before the war, ukraine was regarded as by, you know, if you looked at various

indices, a very corrupt country. there was a lot of corruption in ukraine, transparency international, all those kind of measures. how can you be sure that these massive amounts of aid that the united states and europe is sending into ukraine are getting to the people they need to get to, that there isn't corruption, graft, siphoning off? what kind of assurances can you give? >> well, one thing just stepping back and recalling a year ago putin's speech where he described his motivation for invading ukraine, at the heart of it was his panic over the progress that ukraine was making to integrate itself to europe for starters, to become more democratic and to take on this corruption fight, because that endangered so many of his and his cronies ill-gotten gains, so actually what you've seen

particularly since 2014 is the strengthening of a whole series of anti-corruption institutions within ukraine. are they panaceas for decades, generations where corruption was a major issue? absolutely not. but you've seen usaid and other u.s. government actors throw their weight behind the support for independent media including actually once the war broke out a year ago getting flak jackets and sat phones to independent media but making sure they could survive a war and continue to report on what ukrainian authorities were doing in a critical way as a check and balance, civil society organizations, judges, we just launched a new initiative with the gao here in the united states to help ukraine build out its supreme audit institution and that is going to be incredibly important for reconstruction and all the resources that are flowing in. with regard to the very large investments that we make in providing monthly direct budget

support so that health workers can be paid and educators can be paid and people with disabilities can get support when ukrainian budget is under such strain and such pressure, that we do on basically a reimbursable basis. we don't provide resources unless we see the receipt for the expenditure and up to this point we don't have any evidence that u.s. assistance is being misused or misspent but, again, the key is not resting on anybody's good will or virtue, it's checks and balances. the rule of law, the integrity of officials and when something is spotted because there are going to be issues that that gets smothered, that the people get fired, that they get prosecuted and what's amazing about this last year is at the same time people like yegor has been fighting in the trenches, the fight against corruption has been continuing and continuing to pass laws on whistle-blower protection and e-procurement so

it's more visible to ukrainians and the rest of us and that has to continue alongside the military fight. >> i want to bring in arteme kulick, a native ukrainian. you have a question for the national security adviser. >> yeah, i do. i wanted to ask do you have a regret if the united states has started supplying weapons earlier, a lot of innocent lives would have been saved? >> so in 2021, the first year of the biden administration, the united states provided far more lethal assistance, weapons to ukraine than in any previous year in u.s. history. javelins and other critical anti-armor systems to help build the ukrainian defense. and we flowed that assistance as we were seeing the russian troop buildup in the spring of 2021 and we kept flowing it as we saw

the subsequent buildup that actually led to the invasion. now, at the end of the day, any time a country ends up in the kind of crisis that ukraine did when russia rolled in with its funnel-scale invasion, of course, we'd want to do more and faster and get as much as we possibly could into the hands of the ukrainians but i have to say, that our ability to flow assistance very rapidly in the lead-up to and in the early weeks of the war played a critical role in supporting the courage and bravery of the ukrainian people in defending the city of kyiv and ensuring that kyiv did not fall. and for that i thank the united states and our allies and all of the other countries supporting ukraine played not the vital role because the vital role was played by the ukrainian people but a critical role and one that we continue to play to this day with what we are supplying. >> but, jake, let me ask you about that. there does seem to be a pattern. the ukrainians ask for

something, the administration is ambivalent. time passes, there's a clamor around it that bills and then it starts leaning toward it and finally delivers -- that's what happened with himars and patriots, that's what happened with the abrams tank. fighter jets is now the issue. it feels like if you're going to do it three or four months later why not do it now given the speed is of the essence? what is going on that always leads to this pattern where you do eventually say, yes, but it's now four, six months later? >> so first, fareed, the way that our military and our intelligence community make recommendations to the president is they look at the needs of the ukrainian military during the phase of the war that they are confronting at that time. in the early weeks of the war, what the ukrainian military needed to defend kyiv was anti-armor systems basically missiles that could stop tanks

in their tracks so they couldn't roll over kyiv and anti-air systems like stinger missiles to shoot down the helicopters that were bringing in paratroopers to try to take over the city from the air. in the second phase of the war, ukraine really needed artillery in the east to stop the more traditional advances of the russian military. as we head into the spring, what ukraine really needs is armor. infantry fighting vehicles and, yes, tanks and we're providing those. the president was advised by his military abrams tanks, the american tank doesn't make sense for this fight. what they really needed were leopard tanks, german tanks that a bunch of countries in europe own but the germans said we won't provide our tanks unless you, the united states provide your tanks and president biden said, if me providing aobamas tanks even if it's not the most sensible military move will help unlock germany tanks to get to the front lines and also will

sustain alliance unity, i will do it. i tell that particular story as it relates to f-16s because these decisions are not just people sitting around and say, thumb's up, thumb's down. a wide variety of factors go into the decision to provide a particular system, to train up the ukrainians on it and then to get it into the fight so -- >> will he get fighter jets. >> when it comes to f-16s this, is important for the current phase of the war. this point is important for the current phase of the war, which is they're about to mount a significant counteroffensive. from our perspective, f-16s are not the key capability for that offensive. it is the stuff that we are moving rapidly to the front lines now. f-16s are not a question for the short-term fight. f-16s are a question for the long term defense of ukraine and that's a conversation that president biden and president zelenskyy had. >> we will be back in a moment to talk about a potentially disturbing escalation in this

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[ applause ] welcome back to washington, d.c. and a very special cnn town hall, "russia's invasion of ukraine one year later." i want to go live to kyiv, ukraine, and bring in larissa, a mother of three, she has a question for usaid administrator samantha power. welcome. what is your question? >> first i would thank to all american people for their unbelievable level of support since this war began. my father is 60 years old soldier now in ukraine in army fighting to protect and defend us. my children are unable to go to

school and all my friends and family, we are very grateful for your -- for all american people for your help. and we want to live normal lives in peace, but russia has brought war to us. i would like to know if americans see how similar they are to ukrainians and do americans understand that we share the same values and we are just like you, we love our families, we love our children. we want to progress and we want to see our children happy and safe? i would like you to know we do not have hate in our hearts and we do not want to take peace from anyone in this world, even though the world has come to us. please don't believe misinformation about us and can you tell me please how the normal american feels about us? thank you. >> thank you so much.

i mean first let me say that the reflection of how much commonality americans do feel with ukrainians is the flow of support that has been sustained over the course of this last year. it is the bipartisanship in a town that isn't famous for it anymore, but ukraine has been not only a galvanizing issue, but a uniting issue for our own country which has been very divided in recent years and that's as recent as the end of last year where an enormous new appropriation was given to usaid and to other parts of the u.s. government to be able to support schools, to be able to support keeping the lights on, rebuilding the pipes, providing generators, boilers as putin seeks to weaponize winter and i wish someday that you'd be able to travel to the united states and even when the war is over you'll probably see the remnants of the blue and yellow flag

flying in the most remote parts of this country. and so i think, you know, that commonality is there, that spirit of solidarity is there but the other thing you all have done is you have just awed us with your bravery and your resilience, so that is a separate dimension of this. that is something we have learned about ukraine over the course of this conflict that mothers, you know, using their sewing machines to pull household items together to make flak jackets and others pipes and mirrors to make perry scopes to provide to soldiers like yegor to see over the trenches. the way that all of society has come together and just refuses to be intimidated and bullied, it has inspired the world, it has inspired the american people and i think that's why you see that kind of solidarity is that we have gotten to know you and your hearts through the way you have come together and fought for freedom.

>> lesya, thank you. that was just a wonderful moment. let's go live to russia now. cnn's fred pleitgen is in moscow. fred, you've been in moscow for much of the conflict. tell us how do ordinary russians see all this, and how are they living their day-to-day lives? >> reporter: hi, fareed. i'd say a lot of russians see the war in ukraine very similar to the way that vladimir putin sees the war in ukraine, if you look at the approval ratings for vladimir putin, we always have to take them with a grain of salt, but according to an independent pollster there at around 80% at this point in time, and i would describe the support for the special military operation as the russians call it as not necessarily enthusiastic among most people and i think one of the things that administrator power said is correct. dissent is obviously very dangerous here in this country. nevertheless, there are things that vladimir putin is laying

out there in his reasoning for going to war that do resonate with a lot of russian people. there are a lot of people here in this country who believe that the east of ukraine is essentially russian territory. historically russian territory, there's a lot of people who believe that territory was infringed upon by the united states, by nato and that somehow this conflict now is one between russia and the west and specifically between russia and the united states, so right now there's no public pressure on vladimir putin to end this war and it certainly doesn't seem as though he's inclined to do so any time soon, fareed. >> fred, what is life like day-to-day for russians? do they feel the war in any sense? >> reporter: that's an extremely important question. i'm really glad you asked that, fareed, because i think a lot of people would be very surprised to see what life is like here in moscow. there's till a lot of western products on the shelves, card payments are possible, electronic payments are possible. if you wanted to you could block

out the fact that this country is at war. of course, then there are the symbols that the war is there. there's "z" symbol, "v" symbol, the symbols of russia's invasion of ukraine. as far as the economy is concerned it's been hurt by the sanctions but not crippled by the sanctions so certainly economic pressure is not something that will cause vladimir putin to change course. >> thank you, fred. fred pleitgen from moscow. let me ask you about that, jake sullivan. the imf projects that the russian economy is actually going to do better this year than the british economy or the german economy. there are reports on how countries like china and india and turkey and iran are supplying all kinds of goods to the russians that perhaps, you know, they would -- they thought they wouldn't be able to get when western companies left. does this mean that the sanctions are really not working? >> no, it doesn't.

first of all, the russian government has put an enormous amount of effort into trying to prop up the economy and they are spending down their sovereign wealth fund, basically the money they've got in their government bank in order to prop up the economy and to keep those numbers looking good on paper. but underneath that, there are signs of fundamental structural rot in the russian economy. their ability to access high technology which mostly comes from the west, their ability to access the brains of some of the smartest people in russia is becoming constrained by the fact that those people are flowing in droves in hundreds of thousands. their ability to keep replenishing their war machine with the components they need to build the missiles and bombs that they're raining down on ukraine has been hampered badly by these sanctions. and the thing about the sanctions, fareed s. that they have a compounding effect. they get worse over time. .by month. they hollow out the russian industrial base, the russian

technology base, and the fundamental foundation of russia's ability to hold on to a modern economy and to the future. so, are there more steps that we can take? absolutely. and tomorrow the g7 will announce a new and quite powerful round of sanctions including aimed at countries that are trying to backfill the products that are denied them from these sanctions. and so you will see as time goes on the continued erosion of the quality and capacity of the russian economy even as vladimir putin races to spend money in an effort to prop it up. >> let's now talk about china. we have another audience member who is here in d.c., joseph ogundi, project manager at a nonprofit and has the floor for a question with jake that gets right to the heart of the matter. >> yes, hey, jake, i was wondering, do you feel that u.s. sanctions will actually have an impact on drawing a closer

relationship with russia and china and pushing them together? >> well, i think it's a great question and we've all been watching the relationship between china and russia closely since early last february when president putin traveled to beijing for the olympics to meet with president xi. but what i would say is that the kind of cartoonish notion that these two countries have become unbreakable allies is belied by a few facts. first, china actually even today abstained on a u.n. security council or u.n. general assembly resolution. they didn't vote with russia. they have been very careful in how they posture themselves publicly in their comments. they have tried to pitch themselves as somehow not standing fully in russia's camp when it comes to the war in ukraine, and their top diplomat recently was in europe trying to sell the idea that china's not all in with russia.

but there are also disturbing signs about the ways in which china is supporting ukraine, is not standing up and speaking out about the terrible atrocities being committed in ukraine and, of course, they have not taken off the table the possibility of providing military assistance to ukraine although we haven't seen them do it yet. so it's something we watch very closely and president biden has a simple message to send when he talks to president xi. china should not be supporting the russian war effort because the russian war effort is all about trying to destroy and subjugate a neighbor in violation of every principle of human decency and every principle of international law and that is a message that not only the united states is carrying but countries around the world are carrying. as samantha said earlier, 141 countries today voted to condemn this war and to show that the vast majority of the world recognizes what is happening here and who is at fault and it is russia. >> but let me follow up on that

question and ask, is it a sign that the administration's relationship with china is so broken that the chinese don't feel they have anything to gain by being -- by trying to play some kind of even neutral role here and are in some ways pushed closer to russia? the administration maintains the trump tariffs, it has put sanctions on high tech to try to prevent technology transferred to china. from the chinese point of view, do they look at this and say, what do we have to gain? the relationship with the united states is terrible anyway. they are trying to contain us. >> i don't believe china's approach to russia is a referendum on its relationship with the united states any more than i believe it's a referendum on their relationship with europe. they bet big on building a better relationship with europe in the nations of europe. in fact, when we came into office, it was weeks after china and europe had agreed to a major

investment treaty that's now on the shelf. i don't think that the reason that china is making its decision is about any other country, us or the european union or otherwise but in their national interest and i think in the early weeks and months of this war they thought russia would roll over ukraine and this would end up being good for them. as they see the extent to which russia continues to show every single day that it is acting in monstrous ways that i think deep down many people, even in the chinese government, find difficult to deal with, they're just trying to get through. they're trying to find a way in a very awkward space to not oppose russia but to not fully support them either. that's a difficult place for them to be but i don't think that's about us. now, president biden has been absolutely clear, he has a very straightforward approach when it comes to china. we are in a competition with china and we are going to compete vigorously but we are

not looking for conflict and we will manage that responsibly. that's how he approached his meeting with president xi last fall in indonesia and how he will continue to approach this relationship going forward. >> samantha power, do you think that this is an inevitable alliance between two autocracy autocracies, president biden often talks about a world of democracies and a world of autocracies. is this what we're up against which is a sobering thought because the three largest nuclear powers in the world and you have two russia and china allied and in a sense their missiles pointed at the united states. >> well, what i see as usaid administrator traveling to developing countries is china making continuing to make a whole series of investments often causing those countries to incur an awful lot of debt but really caring a lot about its standing in the global self and

this gets to jake's point about the awkwardness of throwing its lot in with a naked aggressor committing war crimes as a matter of state policy, i mean, when you set out to deelectrify a country in the dead of winter, that is enshrining the intentional destruction of civilian infrastructure as a war aim. it's very unusual and to do so publicly and flamboyantly, that creates great awkwardness for the people's republic of china and with so much of the global self voting to condemn the world, seeing themselves at stake, you know, what would it mean to a developing economy if a neighbor, a larger neighbor in subhave haren africa can come across a border and take land and resources so i think that china's longer game, right, involves establishing legitimacy, shaping the international order in its own image, certainly diminishing the role of human rights but in

order to do so they're looking for votes in the u.n. and support and trade partners and markets for their goods and what russia is doing is bringing them into circumstances that i think fundamentally are not in their economic interests, not in their -- the interests of, again, expanding their standing which has been so fundamental to xi's approach to leadership from day one. >> stay with us. up next we are going to talk to someone in ukraine who has been living through this war and she is just 14 years old. when we come back. [ applause ] at adp, we understand business today looks nothing like it did yesterday. while e it's more unpredictab, its possibilities are endlese. frfrom paying your people from anywhere to supporting your talent everywhere, we use data driven insights to design hr solutions and services to help businesses of all size work smarter today.

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ukraine for an interview with president zelenskyy. she's an amazing young woman. hello. good to see you again. what would you like to ask? >> good evening. most children feel the safest around their close ones. can i as an average ukrainian teenager really on americans to make me feel that type of safety? >> samantha power. >> well, i think as you know firsthand, lera, safety, the feeling of safety comes from a lot of things, above all knowing that those around you are safe. it must be harrowing for you to know that your loved ones are likely to be called out to night on the front or are on the front. safety comes from being in your school and knowing that you're going to be able to continue to learn. the ability to know that you're going to have food on the table the next day or when you try to

logon to do your schoolwork that lil be electricity and what we are trying to do as a government is attack all of those issues that putin is trying to undermine and destroy at once and we're only able to do so because the ukrainian people are tackling all of these issues at once. the farmers are still out in the field planting sometimes using bomb detectors or metal detectors to make sure there's no unexploded ordnances. the teachers are teaching you and when they hear the air raid sirens bringing you and your classmates into the bunkers in order to ensure you have safety as you continue to learn so what i can promise you and i know jake would promise you and president biden would promise you if he was here, we have your backs and still not just here on the battle front but in trying to help you feel as much safety as you can when one man and his

wicked vision has tried to take that away and we all long for the day where you can walk freely with your classmates, not worry about having to scamper to a bomb shelter, not have to worry about your loved ones or yourselves when your neighbors and your friends and your family members are not off in some distant country where they became refugees but back home reunited with you and the president said we are with you till the end. we will stand with you. >> thank you, lera. >> thank you. we'll bring somebody else in from ukraine. cnn's alex marquardt is also in ukraine. he joins us from dnipro. alex, ukrainians are bracing for possible russian attacks today. as the sun rises on the day of the one-year anniversary of the war, where do they think these attacks will come, and what could they look like? what are they worried about? >> yeah, that's right, fareed.

the sun is due to come up in just about 90 minutes' time and you're absolutely right that this country is bracing for what they are calling potential provocative actions by the russians. they could come from land, sea or air from the north, from the east or from the south. there is a high likelihood, fareed, that we could see salvos of missiles fired all across this country as we have seen many times before. fired at critical infrastructure. heating, electricity, water, crippling those facilities in the middle of the winter which would have a devastating effect on the ukrainian population and could see russia step up their attacks where we are already seeing fierce fighting in the eastern city of bakhmut, in the southeastern town of vuhledar where i was with a unit earlier day that fully expected the russian, around kherson where the ukrainians have pushed back the russians several months ago. there could be random attacks in cities like dnipro, very far from the front lines.

we saw an attack in this city on an apartment building just last month, more than 40 people killed by a cruise missile. that kind of random attack, just striking fear and terror in the hearts of ukrainians so this country certainly girding itself for what could come on this anniversary. >> thank you. jake sullivan, most war, almost all wars end in some kind of a negotiation. the sort of world war ii war where one side completely annihilates the other is very, very rare in history. what will that -- what will those negotiations look like? the chinese have put out this -- i don't know what they're calling it -- peace plan just out, a 12-point document detailing its position calling for the end of hostilities and the resumption of peace talks. is there anything to this? what is your reaction? >> well, my first reaction to it is that it could stop at point one which is respect the

sovereignty of all nations. that's the first point in the 12-point plan. this war could end tomorrow if russia stopped attacking ukraine and withdrew its forces. ukraine wasn't attacking russia. nato wasn't attacking russia. the united states wasn't attacking russia. this was a war of choice by putin waged upon ukraine and it could end if he simply left ukraine. and that is the best way for this war to end. now, i cannot predict the future. what i can tell you is that the united states is not going to dictate to ukraine how this war ends, president biden tells president zelenskyy and our allies at every opportunity nothing about ukraine without ukraine. it is the ukrainians who will decide how they proceed towards the end to this war. our job is to put them in the best possible position on the battlefield so they are in the best possible position to be able to do diplomacy whenever they choose to do diplomacy and that is how we are going to proceed. but i think there's one more

important point as we approach this anniversary and as actually the anniversary has arrived in ukraine and that is russia has already lost this war. russia's aims in this war were to wipe ukraine off the map. to take the capital and to eliminate ukraine to absorb it into russia. they failed at doing that and they are in no position to be able to do that as we go forward and it is important for everyone to remember that the courage and bravery of the ukrainian people has already accomplished that objective and the support of the united states and our allies and partners have helped contribute to that. where this goes from here is something that will play out over the coming months. day by day we have to keep doing our job which is give the ukrainians the tools they need to defend themselves. >> sam, whatever happens at the end of this war, ukraine is going to need a massive amount of reconstruction and assistance. does the world have the capacity? does the united states have the capacity for the kind of thing, you know, people talk about a

marshal plan like there was after 1945 to help europe rebuild. is that the kind of scale we need to be thinking about? >> well, i think we associate the marshall plan with a moment just as we do with the end of world war ii with a moment, and it looks as though recovery and reconstruction in ukraine at least for the time being is going to happen differently. just this month earlier this month the world bank announced $50 million to invest in the repair and restoration of the transport networks, the transport infrastructure in ukraine and that's how usaid is proceeding as we try to catalyze the involvement of the european bank for reconstruction, development, the big financial institutions and to get the private sector to be interested in coming back to those parts of ukraine that are relatively peaceful, and even, you know, to continue to make investments elsewhere. we just struck a public/private partnership with bayer which is

building a new seed factory in ukraine which employ thousands of ukrainians. the more employed, the more revenue and the less assistance that will come from outside. i don't think it's necessarily going to be an on/off switch but something we want pore ukrainian refugees to be in a position to come home to have infrastructure that awaits them where they can live in buildings that have been repaired, but, of course, the damage that some estimates is that the damage so far has been $130 billion if you take land, homes, hospital, schools so this is going to be a mammoth undertaking. the other thing we do with an eye to those big ticket items which most of which will happen only when there is a negotiated peace, but we have to make sure that resources are going to be well spent. when you have those huge investments which go well beyond what is being provided right now that's when, of course, you want to make sure you have the safeguards in place so that all

outside investors and donors know that and can say to their citizens that this is money that will be well spent. i think president biden has spoken really eloquently powerfully to how much enthusiasm there will be when this war is officially over, you know, a number of actors are on the outside really wanting to be a part of the longer-term solution but getting the institutional frameworks right is something we can be working on right now in addition to the these stopgap recovery efforts. >> jake, let me ask you one final question. we talked all about the world, russia, ukraine. we haven't talked about what's going on in the united states. do you worry when you hear voices like governor desantis, senator hawley, senator vance questioning why the united states is doing this, asking why we should be spending this money wondering whether we should be taking a more neutral position? >> what i find so interesting about that perspective, we can't

operate in the world because we have to operate at home is it presents a fundamentally false choice that is not at all who america is. we can both invest at home and provide for the safety and well-being of the american people and we can lead in the world and that's what we have done at our best under democratic and republican presidents for decades. the united states is capable as a powerful self-assured nation we have the resources, talent, energies of our people to solve our own problems here and president biden has done more in two years to invest in this country to build jobs, to provide for the social safety net, to deal with the problems that people sit around their kitchen tables and think about while at the same time mobilizing a coalition of free nations to support the values that americans hold so dear. so what i would say to those senators is, yes, let's do these things at home, but are you saying that america is incapable

of also helping to serve a powerful force for good in the world? i don't think that the american people believe that. i think the american people think we are capable of doing both and at our best that is exactly what we have done and i believe that a lot of the moments i've seen in this last year in ukraine from those flags waving in small towns that samantha was talking about to the people in the u.s. government who are trying to support folks like yegor on the front lines, that has been america at its best and so i think that there's a pessimism in this argument that these senators are making. president biden has an optimistic view which is we can do it and we should do it and we are doing it and as a result, i believe that democracies in the world are getting stronger, not weaker as the president said and autocracies are getting weaker, not stronger and that's better for every single person in this country. >> jake sullivan and samantha power, pleasure to have you on

cnn. something special coming up on the war in ukraine from chief international correspondent clarissa ward. she returned to ukraine recently to meet with the people of ukraine and hear how they are faring one year into the war and focused on the central ukrainian city of dnipro. it was considered relatively safe until last month when it became the scene of one of the deadliest attacks since the war began. the will to win, ukraine at war, airs sunday at 8:00 p.m. eastern. [ sirens ] >> reporter: on january 14th, the 325th day of putin's war, dnipro was hell on earth. in all 46 people were killed including 6 children after a 2,000-pound russian missile as long as a city bus slammed into

this apartment building. so the blue wall that's your bathroom. >> yeah. >> reporter: 24-year-old nastia was at home in bed sleeping. when you look at it now, what do you feel? [ speaking non-english ] >> reporter: the missile sliced her one-bedroom apartment in half killing both of her parents in the kitchen while just inches away nastia clung on to life. >> i think for a lot of people it's hard to understand why russia would use this huge missile that's intended to take out an aircraft carrier in a

residential area. how do you try to understand why russia would do something like this. >> i don't understand. >> can you tell me a little about your mom and dad, what they were like as people. [ speaking non-english ] >> do you ever wonder why you were saved? it's this extraordinary image that we see of you surviving the unsurvivable. [ speaking non-english ]

>> take your time if you want to take a break. >> reporter: this is not the first grief nastya has experienced in this war. in september her boyfriend vladislav was killed while fighting on the front lines in kharkiv. you have experienced so much sadness and so much loss. in some ways your story is the

story of ukraine, of people who have given so much but who continue to survive. [ speaking non-english ] >> reporter: that courage and grit have come to define ukraine and the price has been painfully high. tens of thousands of lives have been destroyed. estimates suggest it will require close to a trillion dollars to rebuild the country when this is all over.

but today the end is still nowhere in sight. >> make sure to tune in sunday night at 8:00 p.m. eastern for clarissa a ward special report "the will to win: ukraine at war" only here on cnn. if you feel compelled to help out with humanitarian efforts in ukraine, we have a list of vetted organizations on our website. go to cnn.com/impact. and that concludes this cnn town hall. i want to thank our audience and questioners here in d.c. questioners in kyiv and the front lines. i want to thank jake sullivan and samantha power and all of you out there for witnessing and watching this evening. cnn tonight with alisyn camerota starts now. [ applause ]

good evening, everyone. i'm alisyn camerota. welcome to "cnn tonight" and thanks to fareed for that illuminating town hall and the look at where we are one year into russia's invasion into ukraine. we have a lot of stories to catch you up on starting with the disgraced attorney alex murdaugh making the risky move to take the stand in his own defense. he denied he killed his own wife and son but admitted lying to investigators about where he was minutes before they were shot. so did he help or hurt his own case? and how do defense attorneys decide when to put a suspect on the stand? plus, we have one of our signature voter panels for you tonight. i sit down with six parents from across the country to talk about the culture wars that are raging in our schools and why teaching black history has become so controversial. >> the reason why they don't

want to have this taught is because it makes people feel uncomfortable. >> the kids can handle it, i promise you. they're going to be all right. it's uncomfortable but we need to be having these hard conversations. >> look, you have one semester, you have one semester to learn about this huge history, one semester so you have to prioritize what's most important. >> then later in the program what would you pay to be all alone in total darkness for several days and nights? we'll tell you about the darkness retreat that green bay packers aaron rodgers just emerged from. but first to that dramatic day in the murdaugh trial let's bring in our panel. we have dan harris host of the ten percent happier podcast and author of "ten percent happier." we have joey jackson, lauren leader, co-founder and ceo of all in together and political commentator margaret hoover. also joining us remotely is richard gabriel. okay.

i was so surprised, joey, that he took the stand today. if you were representing alex murdaugh would you have put him on the stand? >> i think it's always a risky proposition to put the defendant on the stand. you talk about the analysis that goes into it. let's talk about it. the first thing is whenever you're doing a case, right, what you want to do is you want to make it about the reasonable doubt of the prosecution's case. you want to speak to every witness, you want to minimize their testimony through cross-examination and then if it doesn't go well you say maybe i'll put my client on. here's the kicker. whenever you put a defendant on the stand it's not about the case that you did as a defense attorney where you raised reasonable doubt, it becomes about your client. is your client credible? are they believable? are they relatable, are they human, right, and in essence do they carry the day, the problem here is that you have a person who has lied and lied and lied and lied. however. >> yes, because he admitted to that on the stand. >> so the question then becomes

he may be a liar. he may be a thief but is he a murderer? and that's what they're going at, right? last last point and that's this, in some respects you want him on the stand for the following reason. you have to attack motive. this is a loving husband and father. how dare you suggest he would kill his family. and there is no good reason that the prosecution is proving as to that second thing. time line, they have him dead to rights, the prosecution does, with the cell data, the car data. >> and the audio of him. >> the audio of him. >> which he admitted was him. >> so he has to backtrack and say i lied about that last and that is that it in terms of who else could have done it? is he around unsavory characters that could have caused his family harm and his son paul was getting a lot of public flack about the boating accident. could people upset about that have committed this? that's the calculus they made in putting him sdmron that's what he claimed because the flack

that his son was getting, maybe that was the motive. okay, did you guys all watch it today? how many thought that was credible that he did himself a favor. anybody think he did himself a favor? no, nobody? >> want to take this one? >> admittedly outside my area of expertise but from what i have learned, it seems to me he didn't help himself necessarily. you know, there are so many lies to joey's point that have mounted upon the previous lies. he could only help himself because the case was pretty strong against him. public opinion is against him. it didn't feel like the courtroom is against him. look, john grisham is in the courtroom watching this. there are videos at least on twitter of john in the courtroom. i don't know if that's true or not. must be true. so clearly this is a drama playing out why people are watching and why we are talking about it. i'm going with didn't help himself. >> to our expert, so, richard, you're the expert in jury

consultants. would you have put him on? do you think he did himself any favors today? >> well, as joey said it's always a risky calculus in terms of putting a defendant on and for another important reason which is kind of going to joey's point, do you want the case to be about the prosecution's failure to really prove their case or do you want it to be about your client? the more time he is on the stand the more the jury can scrutinize and really look at with a fine tooth comb everything he said whether it's consistent and so it's very difficult to kind of take a look, look, these trials are all about especially in a circumstantial case character is king. this jury is trying to create a portrait who is this man? is he a sociopath who would lie to do anything and is a murderer or is it just truly an aggrieved husband who has committed sins in his past but then also is --

couldn't possibly do it. he did show grief. he admitted about the lies. so he did all those things. the real issue is going to be at i think tomorrow in terms of cross-examination where the real analysis about how much he's going to hold up. >> for sure and how much whether he's hurt himself or helped himself. dan, i want to play for you the reason that he said he lied. so he explained he lied about the audio. he was actually there in the minutes before the murder. he lied -- he admitted that he lied to investigators repeatedly and here's why he said he did. >> i did lie to them. my addiction evolved over time. i would get in these situations or circumstances where i would get paranoid thinking and 2 could be anything that triggered it. it might be a look somebody gave me. it might be a reaction to something i did.

>> he says he had a long opioid addiction. what do you think about him saying that was the excuse. >> look, i don't want to say anything to defend this man unduly, set aside where you are on whether he committed the murders, he definitely admitted to ripping people off, innocent people off, his clients who he was sworn to protect. having said that i do resonate with his story of leading a double life where he's a prominent lawyer with an addiction on the side. i in my 30s was a news anchor on abc news and had a cocaine problem that led to me having a panic attack on the air and i think millions of americans can relate to substance abuse especially in the midst of an opioid epidemic so i think it's possible that that humanized him. >> agreed. in that way i thought that it was smart what he did there. >> i mean it's so painful to watch for all the reasons that dan said. this is clearly a guy with so much potential and completely destroyed every part of his life. destroyed everyone around him. destroyed the relationships with

everyone who trusted him and it's heartbreaking to watch and it's on national television and i think that's the other piece of this which is how do you ever walk away from this, whatever the jury decides the rest of his life this is what he carries forever because the entire country is watching live on national television and to margaret's point about twitter millions on twitter every second of their opinions about it, was he credible, was he not credible? the ultimate tragedy we took away today how devastating the opioid crisis it is and what it does to people. if any of that is true and that's another part of it it's just heartbreaking to watch. >> all right, everyone, stick around if you would. when we come back we'll have a panel that attacks the culture wars in our school and try to answer the question, what is woke? plates. plates. there's somehow no better way to travel this place, than on a plate. and when you add price drop p protection, expedia pays you back if your flight becomes cheapeper.

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this cough. [sfx: coughs] this'll help. vicks vaporub? vicks vaporub's ...medicated vapors go straight to the source of your cough... ...so you can relieve your cough to breathe easier. vicks vaporub. fast-acting cough relief. >> the panel is standing by right now to share their thoughts because the culture wars are raging in public schools around the country. governor ron desantis is proudly leading the charge on the war on woke as he calls it. this month he rejected a proposed ap course on african american studies leading to further debate about black history and cancel culture so we wanted to know how parents feel. we brought back some of our favorite voters from across the political spectrum including two

parents in florida to find out who should be making decisions about our kids' curriculum and why teaching black history is so fraught. but we to start with the definition. what does woke even mean? here now, our pulse of the people. >> for me it just means being conscious of the racial prejudice and discrimination that's within our society. and just being aware, you know, that there are a set of people who are oppressed and suffer from injustices. >> to me woke means that you were asleep and then all of a sudden you wake up to racial gender, social or general life issues and essentially virtue signal publicly how much these issues to you. >> i think it's the term that's been hijacked to be quite honest with you. it's a term that was and is meant to bring awareness to marginalized community and that was to really star