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good evening, and take a look. this is the face tonight of alex murdaugh, convicted killer. his head shaven in a south carolina prison system intake facility on his way within the next several weeks to serving two consecutive life sentences, life without parole for murdering his wife maggie and son paul. this is also the face of a man whose family name was once synonymous with the law and county in south carolina where he lived and multiple generations of the murdaughs in the legal profession and criminal justice system there. at today's hearing in the courthouse where his grandfather's portrait once hung murdaugh was sentenced. he spoke briefly but judge clifton newman had the last word. >> i would never under any circumstances hurt my wife, maggie, and i would never under any circumstances hurt my son

paw-paw. >> it might not have been you. it might have been the monster you become when you take 15, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 opioid pills. maybe you become another person. >> well, tonight our exclusive interview with creighton water, lead prosecutor in the case who made it plain in his remarks exactly who alex murdaugh was to him. >> no one who thought they were close to this manu who he really was and, your honor, that's chilling and i've looked in his eyes and he liked to stare me down as he would walk by me during this trial and i could see the real alex murdaugh when he looked at me. >> mr. water, thanks for joining us. we just heard you say that you knew alex murdaugh was the killer as soon as you looked into his eyes. when you heard him today

continuing to declare his innocence i'm wondering what went through your mind. >> nothing more than the same. i think after he said that, i got up and said words to the effect of what more needs to be said? you know, the truth is not in this man and i think that was a big part of what the jury saw and certainly a part of i believe what led them to the right verdict that they reached. >> were you surprised by the speed of the jury's deliberations? >> well, i've always said that, you know, trial lawyers tend to be a little superstitious and i tried no the to think about that and people talk to you while you're waiting and i'll say this, though, we had put so much out there, it had been such a huge effort by the whole team and you saw the whole team in action, i probably was less nervous waiting for this verdict than i ever had and not because of overconfidence but i just felt like we had done all we could do but, yes, usually when

you get a verdict within a short period of time that's generally good for the state. but, you know, you never like to even consider that until you actually hear the word that you want to hear. >> this was obviously a complex trial. there was a lot of moving parts, a lot of evidence was circumstantial. one of the state's key focuses was the time line that night and when you got up and you went through all the things that would have had to occur to have not been alex murdaugh, i thought that was extraordinary. i want to play that for our viewers. >> so what you're telling this jury is that it's a random vigilante that just happened to know that paul and maggie were both at moselle on june 7th and knew they would be at the kennels alone on june the 7th and knew you would not be there but only between the times of 8:49 and 9:02 and show up without a weapon assuming they'll find weapons and ammunition there, that they commit this crime during that short time window and then they travel the same exact route you do around the same time to

alameda. that's what you're trying to tell this jury? >> you got a lot of factors in there, mr. waters. all of which i do not agree with, but some of which i do. >> it's interesting, you know, obviously that time line was very crucial evidence and, you know, it really tells a story. you know, we have to remember this guy was an experienced lawyer doing sometimes complex accident cases. he's a part-time assistant solicitor and there's 100 years of prosecution legacy in his family. and so as we started to look at that time line it really appeared that this was a man who was manufacturing an alibi and that these time periods were more compressed than seems reasonable. you know, i think it's kind of ironic that he was using his cell phone and this data to construct an alibi but in the end that kennel video i think really caught him but the chain of circumstance, even though the

burden is on the state, the chain of circumstances he was trying to get the jury to believe just defied any sort of logic that this could have occurred and i think it was compelling to the jury. >> do you have any sense of when he came up with this decision to kill his son and to kill his wife, because as you said, he was laying the groundwork for this from, you know, that day earlier that day at the very least. do you have any sense of how long he had planned this? >> you know, one of the things i described of him and this is why i think it was important for the jury to hear this is i think i've used roller coaster or hamster wheel he had been on for a decade and it's really as you look at it and look at it in its entirety it's really exhausting. and these pressures were building. they were coming to a culmination and he was running out of options. i think that the other thing that was very important to him

was this family legacy, i think that was more important to him than anything. aside from his own personal things that he would suffer if all this was exposed, when that exact moment was, i don't know but i do know that all these pressures, i called it a gathering storm, a perfect storm were arriving on june 7th and whether it was that day or whether he had been thinking about it for awhile, i don't think we'll ever know. there is only one person that can answer that. what i do know as those storms -- as that storm arrived, as he was running out of option, as he was faced with ruining not just himself but his family legacy as his son had become a liability that threatened to expose him, that's -- all those came to a head on june 7th and that's the day they died. >> you also pointed out just sort of the impunity that he -- maybe other members of his family, his kid, maybe paul, but the impunity that he felt he had, i mean, his

great-grandfather, his grandfather, his father had all been the prosecutors in this area in south carolina. i mean, it seemed like he figured he can do just about anything. >> well, absolutely. and that's what we -- i never knew him. i did work with his father years ago on a case. but, you know, we studied this more and more as the white collar stuff that we investigated over months and months of investigation and started to get a picture of this man in talking to the people that knew him or thought they knew him because the one thing that ultimately it revealed no matter how close -- the closest people in his life had no idea who he was, which i said was chilling. so as we started to discover that as we started to realize that, you know, that became very clear and very apparent that he had never faced accountability in his life and had always been able to escape that and that that was more important to him

than anything. that's why i was always convinced he would testify in this case, that he was assured he could talk his way out of it one more time. maybe not out of all the trouble but this and obviously the jury saw otherwise. >> you said even today in the court was i would never do anything to hurt maggie or paul, paw-paw, he said today. which obviously he was talking about the murder, but he -- i mean he hurt them repeatedly for -- i mean, he was stealing money, i mean, he was ruining their lives. he was a distant father because he was a drug addict who had been lying to everybody and was stealing from all these people. the idea that he hadn't already hurt them even without killing them is just another lie. >> yeah, and, again, i am not a psychologist and i'm not trying to diagnose anyone here but i think there's an element of narcissism there. i think that to some extent, you

know, he almost saw this as a necessary action so that they wouldn't have to suffer the consequences of any of this coming out, but i think he's very careful in how he says things. he's a lawyer and his cross-examination was very interesting in dealing with him. one of the things i wanted to do unlike a typical cross where you really try to control the conversation is to start with a constructive cross and get him talking because i felt like, you know, he believed he could look at that jury and really convince them but i felt if i got him talking he would eventually, you know, he'd eventually lie and they would get to see that in realtime. see that in action but i think they got frustrated by the things you're saying. if you listen to what he's saying it's very careful in how he words it. you know, he says he never hurt them. at one point he never, quote, intentionally hurt them and a lot of times people try to, you know, live with the things they've done by qualifying it or

say that wasn't the real me. he had a very well-known and common tell that whether it was on the videos of the law enforcement interview organization even on the stand that when he said things that are a lie he would shake his head forward. >> is that right? that's incredible. >> yeah. yeah, and so, you know, i pointed that out to the jury but i think the main thing was, you know, establishing with them that nobody who knew this manu who he was. he lies effortlessly and convincingly and looked in their eyes and lied to them about perhaps the most important fact of this whole case, you know, about when is the last time he saw his wife and his son alive, and only when he was backed into yet another corner did he come up with this latest version and obviously the jury saw through that and i think, you know, he got up there very, very confident that he was going to, you know, this is his community and he's always been able to do

this, that he was going to get them on his side. >> we're going to take a short break and have more of my conversation with creighton when we come back including his take on that exact moment on the stand. the woman who was at the center of vladimir putin's propaganda war. time for downy mcbride to go to work. ya'll gotta sniff this stuff! ♪ woop woop! ♪ whooo! smells great, downy! ♪ ugh, cul de sacs. downy unstopables. you gotta sniff it to believe it.

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more now with my conversation with creighton

waters. we talked about murdaugh being forced to admit he lied when he last saw his wife and son. that's where we pick things up. i want to play some of what he said on the stand on that crucial day when he suddenly admitted that he had been lying all along. >> the second that you're confronted with facts that you can't deny, you immediately come up with a new lie. isn't that correct? >> mr. waters, we have established i have lied many times. i told a lie about being down there, and i got myself wed to that. other than lying to them about going to the kennel, i was cooperative in every aspect of this investigation. >> do you think he lied to his attorneys? i mean, at what point in the trial did he decide, i got to take the stand and i got to

admit -- was it just because of the preponderance of evidence of all the people you brought forward who said, yeah, that was his voice at the kennel that night on the tape? >> i think so. obviously i'm not privy to what he says to his attorneys and don't want to be and i have a good working relationship with both jim and dick. you know, when he started talking about this, i pointed out that even his own lawyer, you know, as late as november of 2022, now they say whenever it was recorded but still, you know, it's being publicly repeated what had been -- what he had initially claimed. if you look at the statements to law enforcement, his lawyers are sitting, you know, at least his lawyer in the june 10th one sitting there where he tells this lie and, of course, i pointed out and he conceded his own brothers were hearing that for the first time on 9 stand. there is a reason why we continue to bring up family and friends who had other relevant evidence but have them identify the video because, you know, initially in this case you heard the testimony from one of the

friends of paul that and you heard it also on the august 11th interview with david owen, the friend said i thought i heard alex in the background when i was talking to paul about the dog. and, you know, that was easy for alex to deny because, again, witness, you can say, well, they don't remember and they equivocate and he was like, well, he's wrong. i would be surprised if that was happening and i don't think he liked that but he wasn't as concerned. when the kennel video came out, it became, you know, impossible. >> one of the things i thought was so effective that you pointed out was he said, okay, i lied then and it was because of paranoia because of the drugs i was taking. he had also testified on the stand that he was sober, i think, for some several hundred days and, you know, rightly proud of that and yet as you pointed out he continued to lie while sober all those hundreds of days. i mean, it was -- yeah, which i

just thought was very, very damning. the idea it was a drug-fueled paranoia that he did eventually wake up from and still continued to lie about it. >> well, if you recall in the cross again, i wanted to get him talking. i wanted to let him talk and there were pauses and he couldn't help himself and kept adding new things. a number of things he said, i decided to lie because i was paranoid because i had a pill in my pocket. he didn't even describe it as some sort of overwhelming paranoid but likened it to be being paranoid if a police car drives down the road behind you. he said he had a distrust of s.l.e.d. he said his law partners told him not to talk without an attorney. and there were a number of factors he identified and, you know, one of the last questions to him in my cross-examination was to play the video with daniel green and point out on the 911 call that he was lying about the time periods out of the gate and that was long

before those factors had existed, and, you know, pointed out that, you know, about the most important part of his testimony he had just lied to that jury, and, you know, i think, you know, a lot of times as a lawyer you get to look in the jurors' eyes and, you know, it's always a read and, you know, they can obviously speak for themselves if they decide to speak but i just think that they saw him lying in action and saw how easy he could do it and it's hard to get by the fact of lying about being at the murder scene with the victims just minutes before they died. >> i just want to quickly play that 911 call. >> i need the police immediately. my wife and son are hurt badly. >> are they breathing? >> no, ma'am. >> you said it's your wife and your son? >> my wife and my son. >> what is your name? >> my name is alex murdaugh.

>> you know, again to hear this stuff now and with now with the convictions and, you know, all that crying, you know, maybe he was crying because he was emotional, i don't know, but you just see it and hear it in a different light obviously. >> well, absolutely. and, again, many people commit terrible crimes and they're very upsetting. i think judge newman said that, maggie and paul will be visiting you forever. we had testimony early on that, you know, he appeared to be crying but saw no tears and, you know, i think in observing him on the stand you saw that. but, you know, as you look at what he said, as you watched his reactions there, it's always dangerous and to try to gauge the accuracy of someone's reaction to a situation like that because people respond

differently. but when you start to look at it in a totality, it just -- didn't add up and didn't make sense and there was something off about it and that was sort of the beginning as you tell the story, but that's part of it is that he's already lying out of the gate and he's already lying if you were to play later in the 911 call then daniel green he's already lying about the time period are we he tried to tell the jurors about factors that hadn't existed yet. >> the last video i'd like to play is some of the attorney general when he was interviewing a crime scene expert to counter what the defense's crime scene expert had said about the crime scene. i just want to play some of this. >> the defense's theory, you tell me what to do and you act this out and i'm going to tell you what to do based on the defense's theory of the case. >> the defense agreed with the assessment that paul stood there for a moment, bleeding down his

injured left arm, and he slowly walked toward the door. >> okay. and what is the shooter do? >> the shooter is coming in the d door. >> what does the shooter do? >> he shoots paulg in the back of the head after he passes him. >> okay and then shoots paul in the back of the head like this and where does the blood spatter go? >> the blood spatter, pellet defects and one i didn't know about that the expert collected was in the door frame at the top of the door. >> now, i understand this is a little different than the feed room door. that's the best we can do. so what did you find odd about the theory, first of all? >> i think the theory is preposterous in my opinion. >> i mean, obviously that was incredibly powerful just as somebody, you know, me watching it and for a lot of people. can you talk about the decision

to -- i mean, did you know far in advance you would have to do a demonstration like that, or was it because of what the defense witness had said that you needed to come up with something to point out the flaws in his argument? >> well, yeah, as trials go on, you constantly adapt and in south carolina they don't have to provide us -- the defense doesn't, any sort of report as to what their experts will say so, you know, that's what rebuttal case is for. we have to listen to what they say and then if we have contrary testimony presented. you know, dr. kenzie did a great job but one of the things i think we were able to point out with that is not only how ridiculous what they were saying was but also they were trying to convince this jury that they could say things in absolutes that the crime scene just doesn't tell you. so aside from how ridiculous

that assertion was, you know, again, they were also, you know, trying to establish definitive height of the shooter or that there had to be two shooters based on practical things like, well, it would be easy enough to empty out the clip in a blackout. and these experts, i think, went too far and i give the jury a lot of credit and i give the attorney and dr. kenzie a lot of credit but the jurors saw that for what it is. jurors have a great meter for bull and i think that they saw that from the defense experts who tried to convince them that they could say things that simply are beyond what is reasonable. >> his financial crimes are -- or the allegations of his crimes are shocking. the numbers of people, the amounts of money he stole from people. even small amounts of money from people who did not have a lot of money are just horrific. there are some people who raised

questions about how much of the financial evidence was allowed in, will that be something that they use to try to appeal on? how concerned are you about his chances for an appeal? >> well, you know, i started my career as an appellate lawyer and it's part of the process. you know, we filed a motion prior to the trial where we indicated our intent to use it and put it in great detail and just to alert the judge and the defense that we were going to do that. there was in camera hearings and the judge admitted it. this case is unique and as i described during the trial and a little bit today, there's this unbroken chain of circumstances that part of the factors of all the various pressures leading to that day to answer a very important question is, what, you know, about this man could lead him to do these impossible things. you know, motive is not an element but it's almost always, you know, something a jury wants to know is -- it doesn't even have to be motive, why, how

could this person do such a thing so ultimately, you know, i'm certainly not going to speak for the state supreme court. but our judge newman considered all of that and issued a very detailed and well thought out ruling and so we're confident that that will be upheld. you know, also we have those white collar crimes. yes, sir. >> no, i'm sorry. go ahead. >> well, we also have those white collar crimes remaining and to be clear, alex is still presumed innocent of those. they came in or testimony evidence about them came in in this trial because of that decision by judge newman as to their relevance, but he is entitled to a trial on those as well and presumed innocent until that happens and we plan to aggressively pursue those as well. >> creighton waters, it's really a pleasure to talk to you. i appreciate it. thank you. >> i enjoyed it. thank you. coming up, the latest on the stealing of ukrainian children by russia and an update on one

teenager's story. her name is anya and had been living in mar open mar open -- speak to karim khan who just met with president zelenskyy. oh booking.com, ♪ i'm going to somewhere, anywhere. ♪ ♪ a beach house, a treehouse, ♪ ♪ honestly i don't care ♪ find the perfect vacation rental for you

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the u.s. announced another major investment in ukraine's

war effort up to $400 million in military aid including more ammunition for artillery as well as the himars multiple rocket launch system. it comes the same day that president biden hosted germany chancellor olaf scholz at the white house, a show of unity with both expressing commitment to ukraine and the same day merrick garland made an unannounced trip and met with zelenskyy and other officials on the topic of russian war crimes. more on that in a moment with the chief prosecutor of the international criminal court investigating crimes. first though an update on a young girl now in russia, one of thousands of ukrainian children brought there by russian forces. we told you a bit about her earlier this week. her name is anya. she's 13 and from mariupol. we showed you video of how she was made to read scripted of words to a soldier during a moscow rally celebrating russia. tonight we have learned more about who she is. >> reporter: as soon as katarina saw the little girl on stage in

moscow, that she sheltered with in mariupol, she knew something was wrong. >> translator: i was scared to look. you can't use kids like that. >> thank you, uncle yuri for saving me. who is anya. her family members were too scared to speak on air. she is anya as she is known, a 13-year-old brought from her foster family's home to this rally celebrating the russian army. cnn has no way of knowing how willingly she went but anya's social media gives an insight into her bewilderment. "look at all the rows," she says, before being told where she will stand and what she will say. it was a year ago that anya's hometown of mariupol was pounded. devastating heavy artillery

forcing its population under ground to basements like this one. anya and her family shared this space for much of the three-month lifelong siege with katarina who is now in germany. she couldn't believe her eyes when she saw her on stage. >> translator: we were like a family. we saved ourself, saved our lives. >> reporter: in early april anya's mother olga left the basement and was killed by russian shelling. anya shared her grief for her mother online, i want to be with you, she writes. by the end of the siege anya and her siblings were separated. anya sent to a foster family in mariupol. so does the international criminal court believe that anya has been a victim of a war crime by being paraded in moscow? >> regarding anya, it's very troubling and the statute and,

in fact, the geneva conventions make it clear regarding how children must be treated by occupying powers. the law is present. too many think it's an optional extra. ♪ >> reporter: cnn has reached out to russian officials for comment on the children featured in putin's rally last week. moscow has not responded. but for all the tragedy of anya's short life so far, the propaganda event has brought her fresh troubles. daily and violent threats under her adolescent posts from ukrainians. anya, don't be shy. when we liberate mariupol again, you'll be hanging from a post downtown. just one example of the many threats that anya has received. >> translator: we need to stay human. she is a child who survived the war, famine, lost her mother.

she is small, even if she looks like an adult. she is a child. >> reporter: but children as symbols of the future play an important part in orwellian displays of loyal toy. the one carefree, the other is twisted. melissa bell, cnn, kyiv. >> we'll get perspective from the chief prosecutor of the international criminal court you saw in melissa's report, karim khan, more than 25 years experience as a criminal law and human rights attorney. mr. khan, you were in ukraine the last time we spoke together in lviv a year ago, can you talk about what you're doing on the ground there? what your focus is? >> well, as we said when we last

spoke, anderson, ukraine is a crime scene with a variety of locations from care homes on the front lines of ukraine that were occupied by the russian federation to power stations that were targeted to residential buildings that have been partly destroyed, trying to find out what took place, what crimes, if any, had been committed and who is responsible. >> we showed just some video there of you, i think you called it a care home, like an orphanage in southern ukraine near the front lines. what were you looking at there or what were you looking for? >> well, you've seen from many sources a number of allegations that children have been taken from ukraine and forcibly transferred to be deported into the russian federation and this was one of the homes concerned. it's a pitiful site, in fact. you see empty cot, children's shoes and clothing often donated

by well-wishers in cupboards and on shelves and on the walls you see paintings of children we see in our own homes in bedrooms around the world of children that are proud to display their art and then photographs of really christmas past sometime, children dressed up in nativity plays and that's in very sharp contrast, the joy, the environment to the silence of what is otherwise now an empty carcass of a building with the toys and the play things of children, but no children at all because the allegation is they've been taken into the russian federation away from their families and loved ones and the familiar environment that they had grown up in. >> so that's what you believe may have happened to the kids at the place you were today, they've actually been taken into

russia or somewhere? >> well, this is delegations that we're looking into. we've had it from multiple sources there may be a pattern of conduct that children from the areas occupied by russian federation forces have been taken into the territory of the russian federation, not given to neutral third countries, not given or sent to other parts of ukraine but taken into the russian federation, so we have been investigating this and i went to the front line yesterday, in fact, and went to one of these homes and i wanted to see it for myself. >> you also, i understand, met with president zelenskyy, also i believe attorney general merrick garland who made a surprise trip there. can you talk at all about what that was like, what the focus of the meeting was? >> yes, well, it's now public. i'm in lviv at the moment and president zelenskyy and the government of ukraine hosted a conference, a really historic

conference, in fact, in the middle of a war called entitle -- united for justice focusing on the rule of law as bullets are flying and bombs are landing wreaking tremendous havoc and attorney general garland was -- attended as well, and the united states is supporting ukraine in terms of the rule of law, and also i had the opportunity of meeting the attorney general for the first time and i'm looking forward to see whether or not we can also get some tangible assistance from the united states, because since december the law has changed that the united states can support the international criminal court in relation to the investigations we're conducting in ukraine so we can get to the truth and i want to see whether or not that promise of assistance can be rendered tangible as soon as possible. >> you've had an extraordinary career looking at war crimes,

crimes against humanity, international crimes. it's very rare, though, and you and i have talked about it in the past, it's very rare to have active investigations like this going on in the midst of a war, i mean, often it's years after a war has ended, decades even. >> absolutely and i think even today's conference was absolutely historic, because we had the london agreement in august 1945 that discussed the importance of trials that would come at the end of the second world war and gave rise to n nuremberg but here we are and yesterday i was on the front line and there were drones in the sky and shells landing in different parts of ukraine, and i think it is to the tremendous credit of the ukrainian authorities that they are talking about the rule of law and what we need to do as the international criminal court is to make sure that our own investigations are independent,

are credible and are based upon evidence that will stand the test of time and i think there's a lot of firsts in this conflict, anderson, for good and bad. >> karim khan, chief prosecutor of the international criminal court. thank you so much for being with us tonight. >> great pleasure, thank you. coming up an update on the second day of what had once been a must visit conference for all republican presidential contenders but that is now dominated by one name, one name only, jeff zeleny is at cpac a day ahead of the former president's speech and he joins us next.

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tomorrow the former president speaks at what once had been an important stop for all potential republican presidential candidates but this year several likely contenders are skipping the conservative political action conference known by its acronym cpac because it's become a major three-day rally for the maga party. jeff zeleny has more. >> reporter: it's long been a command performance for republicans harboring white house ambitions. >> it's great to be back. >> reporter: but at the conference outside washington the parade of potential presidential hopefuls is far shorter. former south carolina governor nikki haley. >> if you're tired of losing, put your trust in a new generation and if you want to win, not just as a party, but as

a country, then stand with me. >> reporter: and former secretary of state mike pompeo gently called for a new direction. >> we shouldn't look for larger than life personals but find power in the rooms like this one. >> reporter: but the long-running three-day gathering called cpac is seen as the trump show. >> these are my people. this is beautiful. >> reporter: the former president is set to appear saturday joining a sea of loyal supporters and members of his own family. >> your president, president donald trump will be here. >> reporter: who are rallying to return him to office. but other big name contenders who many republicans see as the party's future had other plans. last year, florida governor ron desantis took to the stage as a rising star. >> cpac. >> reporter: but as he inches closer to declaring a presidential bid he attended a gathering of donors in florida hosted by club for growth. an anti-tax group urging the party to move on from trump. several potential rivals headed to florida including former vice president mike pence, south

carolina senator tim scott, south dakota governor kristi noem and chris sununu but adoration for trump was on full display at cpac where evy phillips took a seat at a replica resolute desk. >> trump first and then desantis, let's do that in '28. >> reporter: colleen hoffman is from jacksonville, florida and wore a desantis hat even as she sported a trump sticker. she's torn but believes trump is the stronger choice for 2024. >> i love this hat because it's like let us alone. i love it but as of right now i'm going to vote for donald trump. >> reporter: at the early stage it's hardly a two-man contest. an ohio businessman jumped into the race and he made clear on the cpac stage. >> when we rally behind the cry to make america great again, we did not just hunger for a single man, we hungered for the unapologetic pursuit of

excellence. that is what it means to be an american. >> reporter: yet even as the republican field grows, the conversations at cpac and comparisons between candidates always came back to trump. >> i think governor desantis is wonderful. i think he's amazing. i just don't think it's time quite yet. if he could just give it four year, i think he'd be a great successor to trump. >> now, trump's grip on the broader republican party is very much an open question. this hold on cpac and the base is unmistakable but that is the dividing line inside the republican party. those who want to see him come back to office and those looking for a fresh start. that is part of his burden as he comes here tomorrow to make the case for a new candidacy. i'm told by his advisers he plans to also try and begin defining florida governor ron desantis who he believes is his top rival. anderson. >> jeff, appreciate it. thanks very much. daylight saving time begins next weekend. if a growing list of lawmakers

have their way it might be the last time we change our clocks. we'll explain why. he's also obsessed with daylight saving time. you go by lots of titles. veteran, dad, hair stylist. so adding a student title might feel daunting. national university is here to support all your titles.

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so next weekend for reasons i'm still not really clear of,

we spring forward and move the clocks ahead for an extra hour of sunlight in the evening. this week, though, a bipartisan group of senators have announced they've reintroduced a bill to make daylight savings time permanent. a year ago, the sunshine protection act passed the senate only to die in the house. our favorite and only senior data reporter harry enten is called mr. sunshine to his friends in weather camp joins us now. shine some light on this. why will we lose an hour of sleep next weekend? >> because we've instituted daylight saving time for now since essentially the late '60s. it's been uniform across the united states. you can opt out of that. they do that in northeast arizona. >> you can opt out of it? like individuals can or whole states? >> states. not individuals. you and i have to obey the laws of time in the state of new york. >> what is the purpose of this? >> the whole purpose of it -- here it is. they say, oh, it's for energy. we're going to save energy. it doesn't save any energy. by the way, i noticed before the

break you call it daylight savings time. there's no "s." it's saving. i just want to clarify. >> okay. you told me before. >> don't worry about it. i figured we could bring it up. look, we're shifting time. >> sitting here ten minutes. >> i thought it was 15. we're not exactly saving an hour, right? it's just we're going to -- >> i still don't understand why we're doing this. >> because it's the way things are. that's the reason why. >> that's not an answer. >> we brought it in with the idea we're going to save energy, right? but that isn't actually true. now we're sort of in a stasis whereby you have these groups that want standard time all year round. >> has this been done before? have we gotten rid of it before? >> we have gotten rid of it before. we got rid of it during world war ii. we got rid of it in the mid-1970s. >> how did that go in. >> it went disastrously, anderson. we moved back. polls showed that people hated the idea of daylight saving time year-round. >> why? what is so bad about it? >> i'll tell you what's so bad about it.

let's say you're a kid going to school in the midwest. >> wow. okay. >> let's say you're in michigan. let's say you're in grand rapids, michigan, all right. i'm going to paint a picture for you. here's the deal. the deal is that if you go to school in kent county, michigan, you go grand rapids, you know what time you'll have to go to school in january if you have daylight saving time all year round? you have to go to school in the dark because the sun will not rise until past 9:00 a.m. the senators who introduced this bill in florida and massachusetts, their kids would only have to go to school -- they probably wouldn't have to go to school in the dark because it would be 8:00 a.m. when the sun would rise. you have these people in florida and michigan pushing this on the rest of the country when the fact is they would be pushing people in michigan to go to school in the dark. they have hated it historiy, anderson. >> harry enten, i appreciate it. thank you. quick programming note. he's very passionate. joining us tuesday night at 9:00 p.m. eastern for a cnn town hall. this is really important, america addicted to fentanyl crisis.

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