giant blobs of seaweed. some of the strands are up to 60 miles long, stretching over a giant swath of ocean over 5,000 miles from the coast of africa to the gulf of mexico, globs turned up in florida and also in mexico and some have come ashore in barbados. look at that. here's the problem. when the stuff washes up, it rots and it smells and jimmy buffet will never ever write a song about it. turbulent times with air travel starts right now. 1943, 35018. four left. >> far left.

>>. >> delta 94, cancel takeoff times. tonight, close calls. >> it would have been catastrophic had a collision taken place. >> bird strikes. >> it's really hard to know how long we were going to survive trying to breathe in that. >> dangerous turbulence. >> this felt like a roller coaster. it is one of the days you count your blessings. >> unruly passengers. system meltdowns. >> we have been delayed three times. there are no more flights today that would get us there on time. >> america's aviation industry facing headwinds and life and death questions about the safety of passengers and the future of flying. cnn takes you into the air. on the runway and inside the tower to get the answers. "flight risk," a cnn prime time

special starts right now. good evening. i'm kate baldwin. the faa is holding a safety summit to figure out what's happening in america's skies and tonight we're getting answers with a visual in depth look at some of the biggest concerns. we have simulations and first-hand accounts. the cnn transportation correspondent takes up into the plane. and captain sully takes inside a flight simulator. first let's start with all of these near collisions. we're seeing far too many close calls on u.s. runways. the hard numbers, though, they can be confusing. over the last two decades, the number of what the faa calls runway incursions, it has been climbing.

but the really close calls have actually come down from a high in 2007. here's one reason. the fa a's data for these types of incursions this year, it only goes through january. yet, the rate that we're seeing this year is concerning. so to understand what we're talking about, let's examine what they mean by near miss. on one hand, there is the official aviation definition of near miss. but on the other, a near miss is already way too close for comfort for anyone. take what happened at new york's jfk airport in january. an american airline was getting ready to depart for london at the same time a delta 737 was getting ready to take off for the dominican republic. keep in mind, this is jfk. there are four runways. on average, this airport handles more than a thousand flights every day. so the american jet was on an active runway meaning takeoffs

and landings were happening. but over here the delta jet is gearing up for takeoff, already going more than 100 miles an hour. that is when the delta pilots hear this. >> [ bleep ]! delta, cancel takeoff plans. delta 1943, cancel takeoff plans. >> ejecting. >> now, pete is here with how these busy runways look. >> what's interesting is this is unprecedented. seven dramatic runway incursions back-to-back. we're talking about planes hundreds of feet apart, seconds away from disaster. the official term is called a runway incursion. but we just wanted to show folks how close planes can get, where the problems areas are and where the safe guards are to avoid an incident that could be a

disaster. airlines operate 45,000 commercial flights, taking off, landing and taxiing at some of the busiest airports in the world, delivering millions of passenger safely can be a delicate dance. one mistake can bring it all to a halt. >> runway incursions have been around since we've had more than one runway. >> former ntsb investigator recalls the disaster of 1977. two boeing 747s slammed into each other on the runway. more than 500 people died. >> runway incursions have been a tough nut for decades. >> bill and i met in flight school aviation adventures in virginia. here student pilots are taught about runway incursions almost immediately in their training. in the pilot seat of that trainer, bill and i are setting out on a demonstration of what goes into a runway incursion and

what keeps pilots from making mistakes that could be deadly. >> there are a lot of layers built in here, a lot of protections to prevent even when something does go wrong from it becoming catastrophic. >> five cameras are rolling to show some solutions are as simple as markings on taxi ways that lead to runways. the yellow hold short line reminds pilots not to enter a runway, a holy grail of paint matched by crucial phrases between pilots and air traffic control. >> move up to hold and wait for your time. >> hold short line. >> very good. and why is that so critical when it comes to runway incursions? >> well, first off, confirm it was heard. confirm you have the correct runway. those are the big ones right there. >> confirmation and communication are key. this executive airport lacks some of the technology that the faa is deploying in busier

airports nationwide. even new radar that can track planes and other vehicles on the ground. we are navigating to a landing at dulles international airport, one of the d.c. area's busiest with four runways. three of them are parallel to each other. even though we're landing in clear weather, bill dialed in a radio beacon to point us at the proper runway. i'm approaching the airport here, in the interest of time we edited out some of the turns from air traffic control to line us one with the runway. >> airport in sight. >> 262, 040 clip. >> i have been cleared for the approach. >> contact double star 34.42. >> over to tower. >> and now i've been cleared to land. >> let it come down. let it come down. there you go. nice. that's the picture. see, it is lower than you think. >> it really is, right? we're rolling.

that will be our first turnoff to the right. >> yank key 6 is the runway we use to exit the runway. telling where to get off the ground is just as important as the commands in the air. >> turn right at yankee 6 or yankee 7. contact ground. >> over to ground. >> bill points out to me how he's using an ipad app to track where we are on the airport grounds. >> how important is being aware of where you are in the airport, especially in a busy airport like dulles here. >> very important. we have airplanes coming in and out of the terminal there, both directions all the time. in an airport like this, there are multiple different runways aligned with one another. but i feel like it becomes even more precarious with an airport with crisscrossing runways. >> yeah, exactly. >> but things make the news like runway incursions and you have to be extra vigilant. >> the runway environment, especially in an environment

like this, you have to be extra vigilant. with what we've seen lately, i think everybody has their head on a swivel right now. >> we're taxiing to take off at dulles which crosses in front of the northbound runways we just use to land. air traffic control tells us to take off with the flight approaching those runways from the south. >> 262. flight runway heading on takeoff. >> clear for takeoff 30. >> here we go, runway 30 is on the pavement and 30 is is on our heading indicator. that's a double check. come up. >> 20 and rolling. you want to go quick for that guy that's going to the center. >> my normal flying is typically from a smaller country airport. it's not as busy, and there is no air traffic control tower. what's clear from this demonstration is that the nature of these incidents has not changed but they have put a new spotlight on safety. >> i think dealing with the problems, that's what we do in

aviation. we try to build that robust system. >> all right. come on back. then come down. pulls it right in. just hold it right there. that's perfect. got the hang of it on the second. >> pete will be back with us in a moment. now let's get the view from the air traffic control tower. omar is here with that for us. what did you learn? >> for starters, there is a whole lot more going on behind the scenes than you think. we went all the way to the university of north dakota, one of the best schools in the country for us. they brought us into their simulator to give us insight to what these air traffic controllers may have been seeing during some of the more recent significant incursions we have seen at u.s. airports. north dakota, home to one of the largest aviation schools in the country. >> you can place planes anywhere

you want. you can change the weather. >> and at the university of north dakota, the air traffic control can be simulated. >> really slow to really busy. you can have an aircraft coming in on final. you can have no aircraft. >> or for when things don't go as planned. in a january jtk incident, an american airlines flight crossed the runway in front of a delta flight. while the ntsb is investigating, we see it might have simply come down to communication. >> most likely the american aircraft was on ground control, so they're on a different position. as the controller that's controlling delta, i'm not actually talking to american traffic. >> i'm here. i'm on ground control. i've got american airlines. meanwhile, you are in your own world talking to delta. >> yes. i am going to do something with my delta aircraft first. >> the actual radio traffic sundayed a little different.

>> [ bleep ]! >> cancel takeoff plans. delta 1943, cancel takeoff plans. >> rejecting. >> air traffic uses radar, communication with pilots and relying on what they can see from the tower, at least when they can see. >> okay. now i'm stressed. >> the controller is not able to see the actual runway environment. >> fog and visibility were the conditions in austin, texas in february. a fedex plane was approaching to land as a southwest plane was supposed to have taken off from the same runway. with the weather, it would have been hard to visually confirm. >> by now southwest should be off the green and i should be able to see them on the radar. >> southwest, abort. fedex is on the go. >> at the last minute, fedex pulled up, an action led by the pilots. the two planes came within just

100 feet of each other. they are the types of scenarios the school trains for in the simulator. >> i think what's most important is i can learn from any kind of mistakes that happen in the real world or our simulation. >> a learning opportunity is the biggest thing. >> what would you say the weight of the job is? >> you hold people's lives in your hands. if i do something wrong or if i give the wrong command and they crash and something happens, that's the weight that you have to carry. >> omar, thank you so much for that. so just today, the ntsb issued a preliminary report about an incident involving two airliners that came within 14 seconds of colliding. i'm joined by three men who know what it's like to navigate the busiest runways in this country. ambassador of the famous miracle on the hudson and of course with

us is captain sydney clark from u.s. airways. thank you for being here. ambassador, first to you, what is going on with these close calls? just what do you think? >> in every system that's complex, we will have ups and downs in outcomes. i'm reminded that even though we made aviation ultra safe in the united states, we have not had a fatal airline crash in the united states in over 14 years. that does not mean just because we haven't had a crash, we are not doing everything as we should. there are still improvements to be made. and we are way passed the time when we can define safety solely as the absence of accidents. we have to do more than that and look more closely at incidents. these are concerning incidents that indicate to me in important ways that we're not doing everything we should be doing as

well as we should be doing it. >> i get the infeeling you don' get nervous about much, but are you nervous about the trend we're seeing with these incursions? >> no, not yet. we're coming out of covid. when we cut back on flying so much and pilots took time off and came back to work, it takes a while to get back up to speed. some air traffic controllers have retired. some facilities are understaffed, over worked and playing catchup. and in a system like that, then there are chances for opportunities like this, to have loss of separation. >> captain clark, i want to play for you what transportation secretary pete buttigieg said about all of this. listen to all of this. >> it would be one thing if we found a certain piece of technology in the cockpit or a certain control tower where there are a lot of issues.

instead what we're finding is pilots, ground crews and controllers alike seem to be experiencing this uptick. some have described it as a type of rust. >> you see the secretary speaking to pete and saying just that. captain, in your view, where is the rust coming from? >> i really don't view it as rust. you know, the gentleman and ladies in the cockpit today are professionals. i think the technology has to catch up. that's my point, that in speaking with the neighbor, i was reminded that his dog can't cross the invisible fence. his dog knows where the boundary is. so we have the technology. in all my years of flying, there was always this nagging what can we do to stop this? and first you ask before you

cross a runway. even though you may have been given the clearance. it is a free call. make that free call. i just want to verify. am i clear to cross runway so and so. yes, we gave you that clearance. okay, fine. and then the crm portion of it, the cockpit resource management, did you hear what i heard? that level has to be there. and i think it's there. that's part of the professionalism. in europe, there are some things they do as far as controlling aircraft crossing the runway that we could learn from. i'm not concerned. i think that the technology will catch up very quickly because people see the need. >> there is definitely a spotlight on it now, that's for sure. >> and a lot of that has to do with social media.

everyone has an iphone. everyone has an instagram, so everyone is trying to get ahead of it. everybody is looking, i won't say for that moment of fame, but they're looking for something. everyone is looking for something to be relevant. >> i'm really interested in the impact of the pandemic on this. the ambassador mentioned the pandemic. do you think this is still -- how much of this is fallout from the pandemic, pete? >> i think some of it is fallout from the pandemic because there has been a brain drain at the airlines, that the airlines incentivize folks very experienced and close to retirement but not quite as retirement yet to leave the airline because they were trying to downsize. now the industry is also bringing so many new people all at once, not only the regional airlines but matriculating up to the main line carriers that there is a problem here. a lot of new people and a lot of old guards leaving the industry all at once. so there is definitely sort of

the complacency element that sully talked about and that others talked about. but there is also this element that the airlines are really pushing the industry a bit too hard. there is maybe this sort of element that the airlines are just really trying to clamber to catch up and they're struggling and being caught flat footed. >> when you put it altogether, are we pushing the system as it exists today passed its capacity? >> i think we're getting very close to it. when it is close, then you have opportunities for these kind of incidents. you know, the brain drain we're talking about, it's what i call a loss of institutional knowledge. people with 30, 40 years of flying knowledge and know all the history of our safety systems and how we've gotten where we are, know what's important and why, they're leaving. and, so, it's the -- we have to do a better job of passing on

this task of institutional knowledge to the next generation of pilots so they have the same knowledge of the safety history and why what we do is important and why it is important we do it right on every single flight every single day. >> what's clear is there's not -- it doesn't feel like a quick fix. there is no silver bullet. it will take a lot of people working very hard to make sure it remains safe to standby. there is also, then, the idea of turbulence and what that means. the turbulence scare. free falls in the sky, sheer panic after steep and sudden drops. is climate change making turbulence worse? >> plus, a passenger injured on the flight that dropped 1,000 feet mid-air. that's when we return. what does it mean to be ever better? its your customers getting what they ordered when they expect it. discover how ryder ecommerce makes your customemer's experiee

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don't change or stop asthma medicines without talking to your doctor. ask your doctor about dupixent. humpty dumpty does it with a great fall. wonderful pistachios. get crackin' there is turbulence which we have all experienced one time or another. one then there is the sheer panic of your plane suddenly dropping with no warning. back in december, a united boeing was leaving maui, heading to san francisco. the plane was just over a minute into the flight northwest of the island and still climbing when suddenly the jet plunged. it dropped about the height of the empire state building. now, the pilots did regain control, but not until they were

less than 800 feet above the ocean. for perspective, that height is not much more of the towers of the golden gate bridge. in other words, the plane was likely seconds from the water, something passengers were all too aware of. >> at that point it was just -- it was frantic. it wasn't really enough anybody could conjure together as far as words. i hate to call them screams, but just gasps, i guess at least, of, you know, feeling like something is definitely wrong. >> and something definitely was wrong. now bill weir joins me for more on this. we're not talking about some little bumps from some bad weather. >> exactly. it is one thing to see thunder heads in the distance and bump into them. it is another thing when the skies are clear and turn objects into projectiles or lift you out

of your seat violently. >> what does climate change have to do with this? >> it has a lot to do with the jet stream. when i was a boy, it was pretty consistent to hold the warm air north and south. now we're seeing wobbles or cold snaps to texas. you feel that at 35,000 feet. >> i mean, we see the videos of the really bad versions of this, but how common is it? >> less than 150, about 10 a year. but you got to imagine it could be much more without stern seat belt warnings going in. it's going up. they studied the north atlantic. over the last 40 years, severe stuff is up 50%. >> so it is happening more and more often. knowing all of this, what does the future look like? >> it applies to all walks of life. climate change means we need to buckle up, more specifically than ever. ten-minute bumpy rides could turn into 30-minute really bumpy

rides by the turn of the century. >> thank you. good to see you. now this. >> this plane is literally going up and down in the air. there is food everywhere. i'm not sure if we're going to make it. just wanted to let you know i love you. i'm praying. pray for us. pray for this to stop. >> can you imagine? i mean, that video was taken earlier this month. it is from rolanda schmidt who recorded it for her family minutes after her plane dropped hundreds of feet in the air. the flight was going from texas to germany where it hit that clear air turbulence we just told you about. this happened over tennessee. it was so severe that the flight was diverted to virginia and seven passengers were taken to the hospital. she was one of the passengers injured and she is here with us now. thank you.

i can only imagine what it's like to see that video again. you sustained a concussion among other injuries. can you take me to the moment on the plane? what you felt and what you experienced. >> i felt shocked, scariness. at the moment of taking the third bite of my salad, just out of nowhere, the plane began to drop like nonstop. and i could hear screaming. and then as quick as it dropped, it also went back up at the same type of speed, very fast. and at that puncture, the top of my hair where my braid is hit where the container is to the

front of the chair the passenger next to me grabbed under my arm like an interlocked kind of situation to ensure that i would not move anymore because i'm pretty tiny even with things in front of me. and i have no words other than shock. like i was utterly shocked. i heard a lot of screaming. but what i did at the moment was pray. and i was internally praying and just saying lord, you know, please let this not be the day that i meet my son in heaven. and my phone, my laptop, all of that, had already flown out of the way, so there was no one to, you know, say anything to at the moment. but it stabilized for a little bit, and then people started, you know, lifting up our belongings and they were like, you know, is this your phone? so i got the phone back and i thought, let me tell my husband good-bye really quick. i told him i love you. i believe i'm going to die.

at that time we thought it was over a little bit. we were unstable. but after that it was silence more about 40 minutes on the flight. nobody said anything. the pilot didn't say anything. the pilot was just sitting there. >> how do you feel about flying now? >> i'm scared. i asked the lord to give me faith and strength to get to my daughter because i wanted to see her. >> that's why you were on the plane, to go see her play v volleyball in germany. i thought i did not want to fly nine hours and another hour. i asked please put me on any other airline and they did get me there. by the time i got there, i did see her game. and we were on a walking thing. and i felt like my hip was disconnected from the socket.

i told my daughter, i'm sorry. i got to get to the doctor in texas. they flew me back early. i had an mri. and i just found out before coming here they thought it was cracked but what it is i have a torn muscle. severely torn. and they said it will take three weeks to three months to correct with, you know, lots of physical therapy, with some other things. i have a contusion here and then a concussion and other things. so just the thought of flying, it makes me nervous. i know that i have to fly with some of the things that i do in life. but after that, it felt like i went through a tornado, and that's not something i want to experience again. >> something no one wants to experience. so much to be thankful for after that. but your fear is completely understandable. rolanda, thank you. nice to meet you. thank you so much. >> nice to meet you, too. thank you for having me. bird strikes recently forced

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we all became familiar with bird strikes, with ambassador sully and the miracle on the hudson more than a decade ago, and they're still reeking havoc in the air. a flight from cuba recently made an emergency landing. we go inside a simulation. >> reporter: a passenger jet takes off, climbing rapidly over 200 miles an hour. >> birds. >> reporter: then calamity. birds slam into the nose, wings and engine. that happened to captain sully leaving new york in 2009. >> we lost thrust on both engines very quickly, almost simultaneously. >> reporter: the effect was

immediate ly catastrophic. >> yes. >> reporter: right before his miraculous landing on the hudson river. he noted he had been flying at that point for 42 years. and all that time in any air flight, i had never experienced the failure of one engine. we trained for it, but i never had it happen to myself. >> reporter: the first flier hit a bird on this flight in 1905. so odd he wrote it in his diary. yet now the number of bird strikes in the u.s. annually is roughly 10,000 and climbing. it happened weeks ago on this flight from cuba to florida, filling the cabin with smoke and also forcing an emergency landing. other incidents have left a wake of damage claims and terrified flyers. >> and we know as the number of flight operations increases that the potential for a bird strike has increased. >> reporter: and the planes are

quieter and they're faster. >> yes. so it means that birds can't hear the airplanes coming as easily? >> reporter: combine that with air turbulence with climate scientists say is also growing, toss in the increasing but still unusually high number of passenger clashes and -- >> we're being warned these most recent incidents. they are canaries in the coal mine. >> thanks to tom coleman for that. i have to say, we're talking about bird strikes, i was amazed to hear how many bird strikes there are, how often it happens. if this happens more and more, what does that mean for air travel? >> well, bird strikes on airplanes are fairly rare, but they do happen. but most of the time, they don't even do any damage. >> really? >> what happened in our case in 2009 was very different. that's because we encountered a

large flock of large birds, canada geese. you know, they have five or six feet wingspans, weigh 10 or 12 pounds and two of them went into the core of the engines, damaging them irreparably. what happened to us was an outlier. >> is there anything pilots can do other than the miracle that you pulled off when it comes to if they encounter more and more from here on out? >> not much. we could be vigilant, but it is difficult to see birds far enough away to fly them when you are flying a jet aircraft that's flying 318 feet per second. you might be able to see them a mile away, but that's not very long. what's more effective is the airport environment, how well it's managed and if they can make the airport environment something that's not conducive to having birds there. you know, no water, no -- >> marsh land. >> no marsh lands, no food

sources. and some airports use things that would discourage them, loud noises, that kind of a thing. you know, having predatory birds out there to scare them away. but there is not much else you can do. we get general warnings but nothing specific enough to avoid birds in a realtime basis. >> ambassador, thank you. >> good to be with you. >> thank you. >> what can be done to get some of this under control? the head of the ntsb joins us in a moment. ♪ at morgan stanley, we see the world with the wonder of new eyes, ♪ helping you discover tapped possibilities

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so after a series of close call involving commercial flights this year, aviation leaders met at a summit in virginia. among those leaders, the chair of the national transportation safety board who warned these recent incidents must serve as a wakeup call for every single one of us before something more catastrophic occurs. the ntsb chair joins us now. thank you for being here. i noticed just today the faa

said that it's moving ahead with a recommendation that you have been pushing for, which is to make block boxes on board, specifically the cockpit voice recorder record much longer before resetting to this point. from two hours as it is today to something like 25 yhours. how is this going to help with everything you have been discussing? >> a great example are the six runway incursions that we're investigating, all the cvrs were overridden. >> and that means what? >> that means we have none of the data from the two hours that it recorded, and that is helpful for our investigations, but it is also helpful for the airline operators to improve safety. >> it sounds crazy that that isn't available to this point, but this is just now happening. it really does. >> that's right. >> i have also heard, and this kind of blew my mind, you said there is another recommendation

that the ntsb has been pushing for for 23 years. technology warning pilots -- technology will warn pilots of an impending collision, which sounds pretty important. what's stopping him? >> the federal aviation administration has not moved forward on that. they have stated, though, as a result of the summit that they're going to evaluate new technologies and technologies to prevent runway incursions, but that's one that's been out for 23 years. and we have others that have been out for a number of years, including -- >> is it politics? is it funding? a combination of all? >> it's will to get it done. and sometimes cost. we often hear cost is a prohibiting factor. but i often say the cost of a life is priceless. >> absolutely. so you have been investigating

some of the first runway incursions that we have been talking about for several weeks now. when you look at it all, are you seeing a broader trend at play? >> there is certainly an uptick on the hunrunway incursions. we're already investigating six. >> is -- is there a through line? is there -- everyone wants to know that there is -- it would -- it would feel good to know that there is one thing that can be fixed that would make it stop. >> well, i think a great example is what happened at jfk. the technology had notified the controller there was about to be a collision on the runway. and they told the delta crew to abort. so that saved it. but at some of the other a airports, that technology doesn't exist. that technology is at only 35 airports right now. >> wow. the acting faa administrator, he was asked about all of these

incidents. and the way he put it is he said that the faa absolutely has a grasp on the situation. jennifer, do you think they have a handle on this? what do you think about that? >> i think that -- that this has served as a wakeup call for the faa. but i want to see us move beyond just staring at the data and talking to each other. we need action. and the ntsb has essentially given the faa a road map to move forward with safety change. >> one thing that i think, some of the things that are discussed seem long term. is there a quick fix? >> there is not a quick fix, but many of the nearly 300 recommendations we have issued could be implemented today. could have been implemented years ago when we issued them, preventing collisions and preventing some of the incidents that we're seeing now. >> wow. chair of the ntsb. thank you for soming in.

>> thank you so much. >> there is another layer to all this. airlines have to deal with unruly passengers now. that's next. ♪ hey, heading on a family trip? nah, sorry son prices are crazy, we're gonna have to skip it this year. (son deflatiting fully to the ground.) awh, well use priceline they have package deals no one else has. five pools? (son reinflating slowly.) water slide? (son reinflates fully.) we can do it! (fully inflated - squeaks as arms wave.) ♪ go to your happy price ♪ ♪ priceline. ♪ ♪ ready to feel what it's like? when you can du more with less asthma. it's possible with dupixent. dupixent is not for sudden breathing problems. it's an add-on treatment for specificypes of moderate-to-severe asthma. and can help improve lung function for better breathing in as little as two weeks.

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violent incidents in the sky remain another huge challenge. passengers assaulting crew members, public intoxication and other acts of aggression. it is a trend that spiked during the pandemic with covid mask mandates. since then the faa says the rate of unruly passenger incidents has dropped more than 80%, thanks in part to hefty fines and criminal referrals. but the levels are still higher than pre-pandemic years. just last week, punches were thrown on a southwest flight in dallas while the plane was still on the ground. days earlier, a united flight went through this. >> well, tell them to shoot me down because they will have to shoot me down today. remember that. where are they diverting us? wherever there is, it is going to be a blood bath.

>> authorities say that man not only tried to open the plane's emergency door, he also tried to stab a flight attendant with a broken metal spoon. stuff like this has people on edge. so much so that an american airlines flight out of fear a woman was trying to breach the cockpit. but she says she was just trying to aggressively get a drink. some perspective from people who live through it every day. sara nelson and ted dy andrews who has more than 40 years experience in the airline industry. thank you for coming in. you testified before congress about what has happened to you. you said that you lost count when it comes to how often you have been harassed or threatened on -- while on the job. and there is one particular encounter that you shared with the committee. what happened on that flight? >> well, a gentleman that was

very upset during the flight about the mask, it was during the mask mandate, and he was refusing to wear the mask and he kept railing racial things at me. every word was the n word. n word this. i don't have to listen to you, n word. we talked to him and talked to him. we tried to calm him down some. and then eventually he calmed down and put his mask on and there was no further incident. so that ended pretty well. >> how do moments like that impact how you do the job? >> well, every incident that we have takes away from what our primary position is. and we're safety professionals first. we don't just serve drinks and pass out pretzels. we're safety professionals, and we're onboard to make sure we're the first primary defense onboard the aircraft. any time there is an incident

like this, it takes away from us being able to man the aircraft and just be attentive to what's going on in case there is an emergency that actually takes place. >> sara, something that you have said has stuck with me which is when flight attendants put their uniforms on, they don't know if it will be a signal for leadership or a target for a violent attack. why does it feel like people -- like people are getting nuttier in the skies these days? >> well, i think conditions have changed. pre-pandemic all the airlines went down to minimum staffing and they used the mergers to bring the seats closer together to cut capacity. every single flight is full. add on top of that the stress ors of the pandemic. and what we see on the airplanes is usually the typical spirit of what's happening on the ground in the rest of our society and pol politics. that's what we're experiencing. when you ask how does that make you feel? his experience fairs out in the

survey we conducted of flight attendants across the industry at the time who had experienced 80% incidents like teddy experienced in the entire months. and 61% of those incidents also had racial, gender or homophobic slurs included in them. that eats away at home. it makes it harder to do their jobs. when passengers hear a strange sound onboard, they look to us for leadership. it is hard to not know what you are going to get. >> how do you make it stop? >> well, we thank the faa for working with doj to to get the investigations over to doj and prosecute and put people in jail. crew member self-defense training should not be a voluntary program. that should be a part of our program. and we need to have a passenger banned list. if people are acting out on the plane, we need to share that with the rest of the industry. it could also be a transparent

program to make sure no one's civil liberties are hurt in the process. >> my grandmother taught me a valuable lesson. that's all of us are response able. while you cannot control what happens to you, you are able to respond or control your response. so i think when passengers are onboard the aircraft, we just want them to just be respectful. pack your kindness when you pack your suitcase. pack your self- -- your fmutual respect for one another. >> we bring people together. >> very closely. >> very closely, yes. but we truly are, especially when you are in a tube flying through the sky. you really are in it together. >> sara, thank you. it is good to see you. thank you so much. thank you. that's it for us tonight. i will be back tomorrow at 11:00

a.m. eastastern. hope to see you tonight. "cnn tononight" with laura coat starts after the break. ♪ get $1500 purchase allowance on a 2023 cadillac xt5 and xt6. ♪ visit your local cadillac dealer today. (boy) i think this is going to work... (vo) small businesses like this learning center... (smb) there's only one way to find out. (vo) ...help communities thrive. that's why wells fargo has donated ov $420 million dollars to diversemall business owners. (smb) back to alpha, plant. (vo) when a bank does what it says... (smb) lights on guys. (vo) ...small businesses can reach new heights. doing gets it done. wells fargo, the bank of doing.

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