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i think in this instance, i would discourage americans from engaging in protests if, in fact, the former president is indicted. i understand the frustration. as i said this past weekend, if the president is, in fact, indicted by the manhattan d.a., that appears to me to be a politically motivated prosecution. >> former vice president mike pence breaking from his former boss. president trump called for protests if he is indicted. there former vice president pence saying maybe there are other ways to let voices be heard. let's discuss, gloria is here with us. start with you. what do you make from that response from pence? >> well, i think he is trying to thread the needle here in his mike pence way, without sort of

directly saying what the former president is charged with, what the case is about, and the low-hanging fruit is, of course; alvin bragg. you heard that at the republican retreat in florida this week as you were talking about. they're just saying this is politically motivated and that the charges are ridiculous. they never quite get to the point about whether donald trump conceivably could have done this or didn't do this. so, you know, mike pence, again, trying to be a little more delicate about it that, for example, ron desantis was when he took a sledge hammer to donald trump. so, i think it's just mike pence walking this line that we have seen him walk ever since january 6th. >> exactly. it comes with that context, right? he was there at the capitol during january 6th. >> nobody will listen to mike pence any way. who cares. the people who are going to march in protest, they would march in protest against pence himself. and did. >> they were chanting hang mike pence. >> i don't think you have a lot of sway with this crowd.

>> but listen, he's in the safe place, like gloria said. this indictment, this pending indictment, the safe place to be is to kind of condemn the district attorney, right? and i think you see a lot of republicans throughout on this one that may not be out there on the following one. this is a safe space to go out politically. this is a prosecution that has been passed on by cy vance and lots of other folks. it's safe to say if you're republican, this is a persecution not a prosecution, right? and so, that's where they're going. it's fine to do. >> i was going to say, trump has already laid the ground work for all of these cases to be politically motivated. he said that about fani willis. in atlanta. he said that about jack smith, the special counsel. and that's the documents case. so, trump is laying the ground work here. and in this case, they're following because it's easier, because this is controversial case to say the least. >> some will fall off, i think. >> you think? >> to be clear, some of these prosecutors, like alvin bragg, was elected.

someone like jack smith, who is a civil servant, right? he works at doj. >> right. >> so it's a totally different situation there. but if you look at big picture how republicans are responding, it's really fascinating because it wasn't long ago after the midterms where you had a lot of republicans saying they were ready to leave trump behind. now here they are coming out of the -- every corner defending him. >> but that's why democrats knees are knocking so loud all across the country because you're about to make a martyr out of somebody who had been a clown. that's the problem. you have a lot of people who are like, look, he's fading. i'm running for president. nobody is coming to his rallies. he will go away. now he is roaring back as a martyr. so a lot of people, joe manchin and others, are saying, guys, don't get too happy about this indictment. it could blow back up on you. >> republicans are in a position with trump where they can't live with him and can't live without him. they need the base. they want the base. >> listen, at some point -- >> they don't want trump. >> at some point trump is ascending right now. the former president on his way up. his numbers will go up. run polls, a big crowd in

it will be like the glory days of 2016. people will be there. now, how long does that stay? does that stay through the second indictment, the third indictment, the fourth indictment? that's the question. if they are, if they do come. >> everyone is trying to figure out the politics. it's important to point out, people are beating up on alvin. if you're the prosecutor, and lawmakers in your state came out with a law that says, we don't want politicians behaving in a bad way. we don't want them doing, lying, cheating and stealing and george santos running the whole state. and that law is on the books. and somebody violates that law, he's not supposed to care if it's good for democrats politically or bad or if it's good for republicans or bad. he's supposed to look at the law. it's weird that everybody wants this prosecutor to think about the politics not the law. >> the discretion piece of it. again, we talked about this before. if you're going to do this, if you're going to indictment the president, you better do something -- there better be a body lying next to the guy. right?

it better be something good you're going to convict him on. >> stormy daniels is not the first case that anyone would have -- >> i agree with that. >> so now, now, these other indictments come down, it will be white noise for a lot of america. >> look, the thing is there's no precedent for any of this. i mean, has there been any polling ever done on the potential indictment of a leading presidential candidate who is also a former president? i mean, you just -- we never had this before. >> by the way, the rest of the world you have president xi and putin meeting. lots of things going on in the world that are very serious, very scary that americans should be well, i mean it is a big deal. though >> it is a big. deal >> there are other important things going on. and cnn has been covering. that >> no, i get. at my point is, america is looking at this. around the world people are looking at this case, whether you're in great britain, our allies, our friends, people are saying this is what he's getting indicted. they're taking on the president over this? >> to be clear, he has not been

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advantage plan only from united healthcare. law enforcement agencies at high alert on all levels preparing for what could be the first ever indictment of a former president everyone's ready, when they get word, that he's gonna be coming here, if he comes here, if there's an indictment, they'll close streets, the move things around. and hopefully, get him in safely and get him out. that's the big concern, isn't it. and obviously, people shop to protest, make sure that that's done safely. but they're prepared, and every day, there are meetings to discuss this. and they're just waiting for the next steps to hear whether or not this is going to happen. >> obviously, before something

like january six, you mentioned, we saw a lot of chatter on the. seen >> nothing like that here. i think actually there's some surprise about it. but certainly, they're sort of saying, we're not seeing him. and when you look the protests there were calls for people to march today. but barely any people who showed up. so, so, far law enforcement is pretty satisfied. and i think they're happy to see this. but they're going to be prepared, no matter. what >> yeah, shimon prokupecz thank you so much. excellent. reporting thank you all for joining us. tonight cnn tonight with alisyn camerota starts right after the break. ♪ prizefighter... ...meets trailblazer. ♪ ♪ classic

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>> good evening, everyone. i'm alisyn camerota. welcome to cnn tonight. we are following breaking news about the classified documents found in mar-a-lago. sources tell cnn a federal judge believes donald trump may have used his own defense attorney to commit a crime. that means attorney-client privilege would not apply, and th