we end the story with a bittersweet moment over the weekend. taylor swift gives her hat to a grateful fan in nashville while performing her song "22." the fan's name is eleanor. n march. hat's hoff for the show of kindness. thanks, anderson. good evening. i'm dana bash. today, two sisters were supposed to be in school, learning in

their second and fourtella and 8-year-old sophia are being remembered with makeshift tombstones. they were murdered this weekend at a shopping mall in another mass shooting. their mother is said to be in critical condition. their school principal described the girls ass of sunshine imploring parents who still have their children, quote, hug your kids and tell them you love them. also today, a 6-year-old boy left the icu and found out he is the only surviving member of his n orphan. according to a gofundme page, he lost his mom, his dad, and his little brother, who was just 3 years old. an army veteran who administered first aid at the scene described the horror he saw. >> the first girl i went to, and this is pretty graphic, but shlf

she's okay and there was nothing left of her face or head. it was gone. >> these children are three of the eight people killed over the weekend in allen, texas, at an students in the same state did go to school but never came home in uvalde. in the first five months of this year, there have been 204 mass shootings in the u.s. that's more shootings than days. at malls, schools, parks, grocery stores. none of these tragedies have significantly moved the gun debate in america. both sides are usually talking past each other, but tonight, let's talk to one another. joining me is cnn contributor jennifer musea, founder staffing at trace, which focuses on gun violence. steven gutoutsky, reload.com.

cnn crime and justice correspondent shimon prokupecz, and chris, a former police chief in newtown, connecticut, one of the first to respond to the ementary school. we're going to have a conver this. starting with both of you because you are on opposite sides of the gun issue. but i'm sure you can each agree that what we saw, this mass shooting, all of the mass shootings, are unacceptable. >> yeah, absolutely. i mean, i don't think there's anyone out there in the country who doesn't think that mass shootings are horrific acts of evil we need to figure out ways to reduce. >> i think the frustration really comes with lawmakers say the same thing over and over

again, thoughts and prayers, but don't really offer any solid solutions. i think a lot of americans are starting to see through that. >> so when i said you sit on opposite sides of the issue, you are an advocate for more gun control. you ar of the second amendment. i think that's fair to say. how do we get to the point where you cat points of view on guns and how many guns should be on the streets, who should own guns, who should havwhere there's som kind of consensus so that what we're seeing does not occur over and over again? >> well, i think there is broad consensus on the base level of the kind of person who should be able to have guns. there's, you know, we have lawo legal gun ownership, at least, to people who haven't been convicted of felonies or involuntarily committed, adjudicated to be a threat to themselves or others as mentally ill.

the bigger question comes to how you prevent people from accessing guns who shouldn't have them. and i think that is a much more difficult question. and of course, there's also the question of broad based bans on certain kinds of guns for everyone, where you get even harder disagreements i think. >> i think we all agree, like a lot of america agrees, that gun laws should be tighter. on a one to one basis, people who are for gun rights and people who are for gun reform, i have experienced in my life when you have a conversation and you break it down, outside of the political noise, there's a lot of common ground to be had. i think that both sides are really dug in. i think that there's a lot of perceived block to progress happening in a certain political party. and i think that's very frustrating. but one to one, americans agree on a lot more than we disagree. >> you're one to one here. >> yeah, i think there is a lot more agreement than disagreement in terms of the kind of people

who should havguns and perhaps stricter enforcement of current laws is another area there's a lot of agreement. mental health facilities or mental health assets for people struggling, people going through a mental crisis that could go down this path of a mass shooting. another area of broad agreement, you saw legislation last year to that end. i don't know that has been structured well enough to focus on the issue. usually you're just sort of throwing money at general mental health causes, which can have an impact, but isn't necessarily specifically designed to prevent mass shootings in particular. >> i want to talk about one pretty provocative notion out there, which is the question of what people actually see when these shootings happen. cnn and other news organizations are very careful about showing images that are out there, particularly when it comes to

children. and that is something that is going to stay, probably, almost definitely. but there's social media that exists, and over the weekend, you saw a lot of images that were out there that were really very, very graphic. and it got us thinking here about the idea of going back to emmett till. and emmett till's mother intentionally wanting the photograph of her son very different time, very different issue, but the notion of using an image to try to change policy. and what happened there began to change policy. it was a very long road, but it began to change it. you both have unfortunately had access to very graphic, horrible images, particularly starting with you, you were one of the first people on the scene at sandy hook.

>> yeah, so you know, the images i have are from eyewitness accounts. me going into that building, that school that day, and seeing all the people that were murdered by the shooter. and you know, one of the things i can say is, after the fact, i don't want anybody to see what i saw. i think the only thing that could be gained by really seeing that is that they are now going to be subject to that vicarious trauma. nobody needs to see what we saw that day. if they don't believe that it happened, if they don't believe what we saw, that's going to be their issue. but i think people already have their minds made up in terms of which side they're going to fall on. and to get to jennifer's point there, most americans did agree. after sandy hook happened, president obama made it a priority to have gun legislation. i really thought something was going to have a major shift. i mean, at no point in american history did i think there was a greater chance for something to pass, when you have parents

going before the senate and speaking their heart about the children that they lost, and there was broadbased american support for it, but unfortunately, it didn't pass. that doesn't mean it can't pass, some of these laws. in connecticut, we have very strong laws that passed after sandy hook. >> i kind of have a different view of this than you. i do think it's important for people to see some of these images. as long as you do it in a very careful and thoughtful way. this is something that i'm grappling with right now, dealing with uvalde and sort of the aftermath and having seen all of the body camera footage that these officers were wearing, seeing the kids in the classroom, the amount of blood that went through the hallway and the classroom, the horrific injuries, seeing kids with basically unrecognizable because of the injuries. and i'll leave it at that. you know, there is a way to do this where it's not trauma, where it's not going to inflict

any kind of damage, let's say, psychological damage, but there comes a time where it's important for people to see what's going on, because time and time again, this keeps happening. and there's really no way to describe it. how horrific this is, and certainly how horrific the injuries are. i'll tell you something during the uvalde reporting when we came across the 911 calls that the little girls made from inside the classroom, when i listen to those calls, i said to myself, i will never play these calls. they're too traumatic, too horrific, but as time went on, i thought it was important. what changed my mind was the parents. the parents came to me and said no, you should play that. we need the world to hear and to see what my little girl went through inside this classroom. so there are, you know, like the emmett till moment, there are parents who are willing to do this. because they feel that they can make a difference.

>> and again, after sandy hook, there was a lot of media and other people who wanted to see those photos, and the parents the victims specifically of one of the teachers that was killed, and said these are images of our loved ones in their last hours. and obviously, there's also a distinction between who was a juvenile and who is not. when we talk about foi rules in terms of releasing, you're not going to release anything of a juvenile. connecticut passed a lot that exempts pictures of homicide victims from being released without consent of the family. if there are families that think that image would change anyone's mind, i thing that's a individual decision. >> i think family consent is key. i have spoken to parents who

key. i have spoken to parents who have lost kids in gun violence. i met a woman several years ago who would go to gun reform rallies and hold up a photo of her daughter's autopsy. i had to speak with her, and she said people have to see this. this is something that trauma surgeons have been talking about for years. people need to see what goes on in my e.r. and then their mind would change about what there is to be done. >> because why are we talking about this? because over the weekend, probably all of us, we have our phones. you see an alert. there's another mass shooting. and we look at it. we're horrified. and we say, oh, of course there's another mass shooting. and so the question is, what -- when is it enough? how do you get to enough? what are the mechanisms of

society that gets to the point where we say enough? >> well, i mean, i think again, nobody wants to see these happen, and everyone wants to stop them. the difference is what people believe will actually accomplish that. there are very stark differences on that. even the releasing photos should be up to the parents, i agree on that point. but i wonder if the presupposition there is that the opposition to the policies like ar-15 bans or universal background checks or some of the other policies we were discussing is based on sort of a misconception about how bad killing children is. and i don't think that anyone has -- thinks that it's not a terrible thing. they just think that that's not a solution that's going to get to the end. i mean, obviously, that's the sort of the core disagreement. >> you're a law enforcement officer. you saw the most horrific of mass shootings in sandy hook. you have been in law enforcement

for 30 years. what is the answer? >> i will tell you, just bringing in the pictures. i used to go and used to speak across the country about my experiences at sandy hook to law enforcement conferences, and people had various political beliefs in the audience, and some people were staunch gun advocates and gun owners. some wanted to ban guns altogether. one of the photos i did show was straight off the state police's website in connecticut, which was the picture of the weapon the shooter used sitting right in the middle of the floor on a first grade classroom. and that's one of the images that always sticks with me because it's such a discordant image. you're in a first grade classroom. the last thing that you should see is a weapon that's been used lying on the floor on the carpet. and so when i tell people raise your hand if you think this doesn't belong, everybody will raise their hand. next question is, how do we make that not happen again? and that's where the debate

starts. >> that's the thing, what has to finally happen. for the families in uvalde, small victory today for them is that in the committee, in the texas legislature, they voted out of committee to raise the age. clearly, it's not going to go anywhere. no one thinks this is going to get passed in texas, but it's a small victory, and perhaps maybe that's how something changes. these smaller victories, these families, it's so remarkable that they don't give up. they keep fighting. just like the sandy hook families, and nonow you have the uvalde families. there comes a point in talking to law enforcement and families, something at some point has to give. you know, this, the texas shooter, there's so many reasons why he shouldn't have had a gun. but that's a private sale. that's a whole other issue. but it's sort of, it just becomes, you know, so much. and something has to give at some point. >> listen, having these civilized conversations is a step, i hope.

maybe it's a baby step, but it is a step. shimon, chief, and jen and steven, thank you so much, all of you, for this conversation. and tonight, new video of migrants lining up on the border as title 42, a pandemic era ban on many asylum seekers, will be lifted this week. and it's not just a southern border issue. a big clash is brewing in the north over an influx of migrants. one county is now declaring a state of emergency to block new york city's mayor from busing asylum seekers to their backyard. >> we still can't get an answer when and who is coming and if they have been vetted. i implore the mayor to rethink this. >> that town supervisor is here next.

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you've evolved. you've changed. so have we. that's why new dove body wash now has 24-hour renewing micro moisture for continuous care. new dove body wash. change is beautiful. tonight a new york county is under a state of emergency in anticipation of hundreds of migrants arriving from new york city. mayor eric adams announced friday that the city would send willing migrants to neighboring communities, beginning with two hotels in suburban new york, up to 300 migrants could be moved there. mayor adams says it's necessary because they need a decompression strategy with title 42 expiring on thursday. that's a pandemic era rule that allows the u.s. to swiftly return migrants to mexico. city officials say they could

see up to 1,000 new migrants arriving daily in the coming weeks. rockland county in new york declared an emergency to fight the mayor's plan. >> we will make every effort to insure that this plan does not go forward in rockland county. the mayor is engaged in human trafficking of the worst kind. >> joining me now is theresa kenny, the supervisor for orange town, new york, in rockland county. thank you for joining me this evening. i want to ask first about what we just heard from the county executive, ed day, saying that the mayor is human trafficking. that's a very loaded term. it's also a crime that involves coercion and beyond. is that exactly what he meant? do you agree with that? >> i can't speak for the county executive. what i can say is that he has grave concerns that in a county where we have approximately 70 homeless individuals now, that

bringing up 340, and that's for a start, may ultimately lead us overwhelmed and basically he's saying they're being dropped off and basically left, but i will not ever attempt to speak for ed day. he's very capable of speaking for himself. >> i should say, adams' office is very explicit, saying they won't just be dropped off. they will provide food and shelter for the mifwrnts. it will be paid for, and when you talk about the numbers, it's a quarter of 1% of the migrants currently in new york city. what's your response? >> okay, so as the supervisor of the town of orange town, where the hotel is located, this is what i would say. this so-called plan, which none of us really knows exactly what it is, was popped on us on friday afternoon. to this day, we can't be told how many are coming, when they're coming, whether they have been vetted. all questions which the residents rightfully would like just to know about.

on top of it, the town of orange town does have a local law that defines what a hotel is and its use. and housing individuals for four months is not consistent with our town code. so i think had the mayor sincerely wanted to work with the counties and make this a regional thing, in fairness to all of us, he should have reached out to us well before friday afternoon. we were told that there would be asylum seekers coming over the weekend. something changed. it may be because of the state of emergency the county issues. in fact, the town did issue a notice of violation to the owner that housing people for four months is not consistent. we have a hotel definition. there's a lot of issues and i don't think it's fair it was thrust upon us and left to try to figure it out without having serious conversations. >> let me ask you more of a philosophical question. we have seen instances,

globally, where communities have taken in refugees and asylum seekers in times of hardship and sometimes in war. some would argue that these migrants face really difficult challenges at home and that they're just looking for a place to land while they're waiting to see if they can actually get asylum. what's wrong with giving them some help and some safe haven in your town, especially if, as the mayor says, they'll be paid for? >> right. so here's the thing. the mayor has said they'd be paid for for four months. what happened after four months? i'm told they can't get working papers sometimes for years. this hotel is in a small hamlet, approximately three square feet miles with approximately 4600 residents. it's a suburban community. you're going to put upwards of 300 men there and they're on a

state highway. it's not fair to them either to put them in this hotel. to be completely honest with you. and again, i'm not disagreeing with you. my husband is an immigrant. my father was an immigrant. that's not what this is about. but why did the mayor not reach out and have a sincere conversation with either ed day, who will ultimately be responsible or social services department, if these individuals cannot find housing and need help, assistance. >> one final question. do you believe that your county will sue? will you take this to court, and if so, when? >> so what i would say is they issued a state of emergency. if the hotel opts to violate it, they would then have a civil remedy against them for violation of the emergency order. i can tell you this, the town of orange town, because if they were to do this, it would violate what our local law, we're considering bringing an action. again, if it complies with our

town code, there's nothing we can do. as it's not comply with our town code. >> thank you so much for joining me this evening. >> thanks, dana. you have a good night. on this eve of a crucial meeting at the white house, a senator leading a coalition of republicans is laying down markers on raising the debt ceiling and keeping america from defaulting. >> we have told president biden, look, we'll work with you. but it's not going to be free. >> will the president and bipartisan congressional leaders find any middle ground tomorrow? we're going to talk about that next.

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the treasury secretary is warning of economic catastrophe as the nation speeds closer to default and neither side is budging ahead of crucial talks at the white house tomorrow. president biden has insisted on a clean bill, raising the debt limit without conditions, but republicans are calling for major spending cuts. among them is utah senator mike lee. he is leading a group of 43 republicans in the senate vowing to oppose a debt ceiling increase unless they see reforms. >> we have told president biden, look, we'll work with you. but it's not going to be free. the president needs to be reminded of the fact that he has one voice in this. it's an important voice, a powerful voice, but he can't pass something through congress unless he works with congress.

>> now, he just like many other republicans, maintains that default is not on the table. but the question is, how do they get there if no one is willing to compromise? let's talk about this with cnn business correspondent rahel solomon. republican strategist jason osborne, and democratic strategist basil smikle. let's talk politics first. you each understand the political realities that the republicans are dealing with, that the democrats are dealing with. let's start with the republicans. they walk into this meeting tomorrow, particularly for kevin mccarthy, can he afford to give much and then can he afford not to when it comes to the economics of it? >> i think he walks in there with the big stick, right? he has the ability because the house passed by a very slim margin a very comprehensive package. the senate republicans are sticking with him, and so as long as those senate republicans stay with him, i think he's able to go in there and say look, i

have to go back to my conference with something. now, i'm going to start with everything, and then give me something in that. so what that something is in the end, i think is yet to be seen, but there are four pretty good choices i think in there. i think it's the curtailing spending, which quite frankly, the preddoesn't have much of an option there. that's congressional. if he can go back and say look, i understand we have to pay the debts from the past, but in the future we're hoping we don't have to come back and ask for as much because we're still going to have this fight again in two years, three years, four years, and another ten years after that. i think in the end we probably delay for two weeks, maybe three, and come back and everybody gets serious and says i'll give you this. but i think he's also going to require that the white house lean on some of the democrats so it's not as hard of a lift for him to get those additional votes to pass it out of the house. >> yeah, it's interesting because i agree with you on the delay tactic. but i do disagree on the

leverage issue as you talk about big stick. i define leverage here as what the democrats have going into this conversation. great jobs report, granted biden's numbers aren't as high as many would like it to be, but the reality is from, if you center the voter in this conversation, they view this conversation as an inherently republican issue. that it's republicans that keep pushing us to this place, it's republicans that keep pushing the country to the brink. it's because the president himself has said, i'm willing to entertain some cuts. so why are we still having this conversation? and considering the leadership of hakeem jeffries in uniting the conference, i do believe that most voters are going to look at this and say it is republicans bringing us here over and over and over again. and maybe mccarthy is the one that settles this. i'm not sure. he could do it nominally, but my guess is he'll probably have to

work with -- biden would have to irk with with mcconnell more than anyone else. >> at the same time, mcconnell doesn't have the votes in the house. when you talk about the big stick and the leverage aspect, mccarthy is speaking to a caucus sitting there saying we were elected to reduce the spending in government, among many other things. if he's not able to show that there's going to be a reduction in that spending, and honestly, i think we talked about this a little earlier, the white house today using the analogy of if you have a loan payment on your car or a mortgage on your house, i think that's a completely the wrong thing because a republican voter is going to look and say who is going to bail us out when we don't have the money to pay. and secondly, the last point i think is that the white house is asking us to buy a boat to go along with the car and the house that we can't afford. so who's going to pay for that? >> i'm glad you're bringing this down to real people terms, because all of these politics are important, and that's what's at play, and that's going to define this meeting tomorrow and

beyond. but rahel, we have you here to represent real americans and how this affects them. >> i certainly will try. there are lots of implications in terms of what this could mean, certainly for wall street in terms of the financial implications. within the financial markets, but then there's also main street and how that would impact real small businesses, which by the way, is a huge driver of economic growth. goldman sachs put out a survey a few days ago, interviewed more than 1700 small business owners. 65% of these small business owners that they surveyed said they would be negatively impacted if congress did not raise the debt ceiling. you think about for example all of the different small business contractors that the federal government works with, everything from florists to i.t. to food vendors, so many implications. what i also thought was interesting in this survey was that 90% believe it's important that the federal government raises or avoids default, but 81% say they also think it's important the government enact

spending cuts in conjunction with these talks. so i thought that was really interesting that the solution here may not be black or white. it may be somewhere in the middle. so i talked to one of the senior advisers of small business for america's future, a national coalition of small business owners and i askd because i was curious, i speak to economists every day and know how economists feel about the threat of a default here, but how do small business owners feel? how do real people feel? he said look, there's a lot of frustration for small business owners who really want congressional leaders to act. because they have seen them pact this will have on their business, their economy, and for many of them their employees. he's referring there to a shutdown, which we have all experienced, but a collapse of this sort, a default of this sort would be much more severe, would impact much more people, so that's the real threat, and a lot of people are feeling it. >> really interesting, particularly the notion of spending cuts. we all know what's going on here. the question is, is if going to be attached to the debt ceiling,

separate? there's going to be some solution where both sides can claim victory, but as you respond to this, i just want to bring in new poll numbers that came out about president biden's approval number. it's now down according to "the washington post" 36%. that is down from february. this is one poll, this is a snapshot in time. but it does give you a sense of maybe the leverage or not leverage that he has. >> i don't think anybody is looking at the poll numbers right now. honestly, if you're a professional and you're working in the white house or you're working in the speaker's office or senate leader's office, you're not looking at the poll numbers. you can say publicly, yeah, his numbers are low and we have a lot of leverage here, but the fact of the matter, he's the president for the next two years. he's folks are also the majority leader, the republican leader and the speaker of the house, until two years. so the leverage i think becomes give me something i can sell

because i need 218 votes. if you want me to walk back there with a clean debt limit bill, i'm not going to pass it unless you're telling me you're going to give me every single democrat on the bill because you're going to have an abandoned ship of republicans. there will be a small cadre that will never let it happen or never go against the speaker and let the debt limit pass, but he needs something to go back to the caucus, and rightly so. the public is saying we need spending cuts. at the same time, you also have all these money going overseas. it's like a perfect storm. and so how do you justify sending all this money overseas. >> the president has already agreed to do this. he just wants a clean bill. and again, centering the voter in all of this conversation, what does the average voter see? they see united democratic party, united behind their democratic leader in hakeem jeffries. despite the president's low poll numbers and they have been low

for quite some time, the reality is that he has negotiating partners within his party to do the work. i don't know that that exists on the republican side. that i think is a challenge that american voters are looking at. who is the real leader of the republican party that's going to be at this table and actually put an end to this thing? >> and i just want to note for the record that it's the republican at this table who said president biden's poll numbers don't matter. just for the record. >> in the context of this. >> i know. jason, basil, rahel, thank you so much. and tonight, a surprise victory for uvalde families nearly a year after the school massacre there. a gun control bill that many loved ones of victims were pushing for clearing a key hurdle with the help of a couple of republican state lawmakers. that's ahead. oh. we'll just put books here. and that looks fine. that's b bad. there we go. ooo! that's no good. i can just cover it. yeah. can you do that thehe whole day? that works. - not a big deal. - i can't stop, i can't stop. i don't have it, i don't have it.

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a surprise move in texas tonight. state lawmakers including two republicans advanced a measure to raise the age limit to buy semiautomatic rifles. >> you hear it there, the vote met with cheers from families who lost loved ones almost a year ago at robb elementary school in uvalde. today's vote was the culmination of months of work. it keeps the bill's chances alive, but it moved out of the

committee, yet it probably will face a very steep climb in the full texas legislature. i want to talk about that, the issue of guns, and much, much more with former congressman will hurd, a republican who spent six years representing texas including uvalde in the united states congress. thank you for joining me. i appreciate it. you have backed several gun control measuresover the years. you supported universal background checks when you were in congress. you called for raising the eligibility age for assault style weapons after uvalde. do the type of restrictions you have backed, are they getting any more traction, particularly in the wake of more and more mass shootings? >> well, they're getting traction amongst the public. right? when you look at what the public believes, and to include responsible gun owners, they believe these things are straightforward and simple and things we need to do in order to protect our kids. the stat that doesn't get used

enough in these debates is that half of our teenagers in the united states of america are afraid of being shot at their school. that's a crazy number, and that's unacceptable. and these families that have had to endure the worst tragedy that any family can deal with, the loss of a child, shouldn't have to be in austin lobbying to get a bill passed a couple days from the year anniversary of the death of their children. this should have already been done. and as you said, my sources here in austin say this is going to be a difficult to see final passage, but this movement is something small, and i think it hopefully reflects that change in people's hearts. >> you were on the inside in congress. now you're on the outside looking in. as things have unfortunately gotten worse with regard to gun violence. what's the special sauce? what needs to change to go from

the public support for changes in gun laws, which was true when you were in congress, just as it is now, to actually making that happen when it comes to legislation and policy? >> we need more elected officials not being afraid of their constituents and not being afraid of a couple nasty tweets. the reality is, when you're thoughtful, look, i had an a-rating from the nra, the nra supported my re-elections. but i also listened to groups like moms demand action. when you realize the support that's out there and to be honest, who can look a mom in their eye and say, you know, i didn't do everything within my power to prevent this from happening for somebody else. what needs to change, we need more people standing up and voting in primaries. the fact that only 23% of the country votes in primaries, we need to make sure, like, there's

often times better choices in those primaries but we need more people to get involved and make sure that we're getting people in november that we like and are going to be reflective of where the majority of the country is. >> let's turn to immigration. title 42, covid era emergency immigration restriction, will lift at the end of the day on thursday. you have been very critical of the biden administration. but you know very well, immigration reform is a bipartisan problem, because it's so politically divisive. what would you do differently right now? >> so right now, this is something that the administration can do. you do not need title 42 to prevent people from coming into the country. you have to stop treating everybody as an asylum seeker. and asylum is very narrow. you have to be part of a protected class, you have to be persecuted for being part of that protected class. the fact that everybody is being allowed in is what is seeing

this surge. 6.5 million people have come in this country illegally since president biden was in office. we also right now, you do not lead legislation to try to dismantle the human smuggling networks that are taking advantage of these people that are trying to flee a crummy situation to come here to the united states. >> the administration says they need more funding, more border agents, things of that nature to do that. >> well, look, i think this is not being taken as a priority within the broader intelligence community about stopping human smuggling, about stopping fentanyl from coming into our country. fentanyl drug overdoses has killed twice as many people as gun violence last year. so there are resources that can be focused on this effort. look, they could streamline legal immigration as well. you have to deal with this crisis on the border, but what's fascinating to me is democrats

whenever they're in power they don't bring things up they know could potentially get the handful of votes they need in a place like the senate to get passed. so those are two things you could do immediately that doesn't require legislation. look, where is our diplomacy in this area? where are we making sure we're aligning usaid and the philanthropic community to make sure we have longterm plans in places like the northern triangle which has historically given or has historically been the root cause of much of our legal immigration now because it's so bad, everybody is coming over. so our diplomacy is not being engaged in this initiative to address those root causes in those other places. >> in fairness, they are trying. it's the vice president's entire platform, her major part of her platform. she has been down there trying to do that, but that's for another discussion. >> 6.5 million have still come in. >> i have to ask you before i

let you go, you will be back in new hampshire this month, just last week, you said, quote, nobody wants to see a repeat of 2020. i think there are a lot of republicans that want to see conservative policies enacted, but if we don't win elections, we can enact those -- we can't enact those conservative policies. i think you said that insteinha. do you think you're the best choice in 2024? are you going to run for president? >> i am honored to have served my country in many different ways whether it was in the cia, in congress. i'm not closing the door on being able to serve my country again. i'm sick and tired of losing. i think that if we want to keep this century the american century, we have to make some big changes and have commonsense problems to complicated issues and i also believe something i have learned in my time in congress, we're actually better together. there's an opportunity to get the right republican that can appeal to independents and

democrats. >> are you that republican? >> i think someone like me has the opportunity to beat a president who has, what did you say, a 36% approval rating. but again, the opportunity to serve my country, i have always looked for ways to be able to do that. >> when are you going to decide? >> well, i think anybody who is thinking about running for office, there is a time horizon on that. >> it's ticking. quickly. it's ticking fast. >> it's always ticking. yeah. but like i said, the thing, my father, my 90-year-old father always told me, don't be desperate. when you're desperate, you made bad decisions. i'm going to evaluate the best way for me to help a country that has given me so much. >> will hurd, former congressman from texas, sounds like maybe future presidential candidate. we'll see. come back and let us know when you decide. >> sure. >> okay. up next, 21-year-old u.s.

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took to social media to announce a break from the sport. amanda m. a small of said she needs time to focus on her mental health. she played in tournaments against naomi osaka and coco gauff, and she wrote an instagram i've been really struggling with my mental health and burnout since the summer of 2022. it's become an unbearable being in tennis tournaments. at this point, my priority is my mental well-being and taking a break for some time. i worked as hard as i could to push through it. i will miss being out there. and i appreciate all the continual support. let's bring in former professional tennis player pam shriver. thank you so much for joining me. you are about the same age as anna when you became a worldwide tennis star. you are in the finals for the u.s. open. when you saw and read this

announcement, what did you think? >> well,, unfortunate lee we've seen it in tennis and other sports, young people who have a high profile job in this day and age, it happens pretty frequently. amanda, i'm glad she's taking care of herself, recognizing that she cannot push through. really, the toughest injury for any athlete is when your mental health is not as healthy as you need it to be. so, she follows in the footsteps of other high-profile players, like and rescue and osaka recently. but andre agassi wrote it about it in his book recently as well. marty fish on the men side. it's not just related women, it's on both sides. >> that's a really important point. it's not. and i'll bring in other sports, michael phelps, and the list goes on. i want to read a tweet from a former world number one tennis player, chris everett, came up with her in the world of tennis. she said it seems like a

glamorous life. it is not. for teenager, it is not a normal life. every day, you are either a winner or loser. you put on a pedestal ashamed on social media. the highs and lows provide no balance. there's a price. take your time, amanda. can you relate to that? >> very much so. first off, christie is one of the great spokespeople and represents women's tennis, the champion and mentality, but also very compassionate. some lad past champions like crises are supporting amanda. and -- other athletes and other sports that struggle mental health. so, i can relate a lot. and when i look back and think about certain stages of my career, the language, coming forward about mental health was not there. i certainly recognize my struggle during my 19 years. >> and when you are playing the game, there is no social media. how much do you think social media amplifies this? and did you answer that -- i'm also think about people who are not worldwide athletes or even celebrities in general.

but people who, an average person who deals with mental health struggles, for whom their social media feed might be the spotlight that shines on them and makes them, gives them challenges with regard to their mental health. >> absolutely. i mean, i come at this also as a parent of 3 teenagers, have unfortunately spent their teenage years with social media and had to make difficult decisions whether to stay on it or not. and i think all of us have to look at that. i think tennis players, most have social media platforms that they have to promote certain things. but boy, you really need to know boundaries, how to keep yourself healthy around things like social media, and also say this era of young players, like anisimova, had to deal with a global pandemic, something that's never happened in tennis before. and try to play a global sport during the stressors of that, coupled with social media, it's been a tough time. >> yeah, that is definitely true. and back to tennis, do you

believe that the league is doing enough to support mental health, particularly the mental health of young athletes? >> well, the wta tour, which is the governing body of women's tennis, they've actually had staff in mental health for 25 years, which came right after i retired. the staff has tripled in the last 5 years. so actually, the wta was ahead of the game. the usta also had a summit last year's open on mental health, and that initiative is going for a because the sport realizes, and i hope tennis can lead the way, not only with mental health, but all the with stronger safeguarding, to keep our athletes in the workplace as safe as possible. the 2 things really go together. >> oh, that is so true. and again, when you were coming up and you recognized some of the challenges we're seeing and hearing from amanda and others, people didn't talk about mental health. and they're talking about it now. and that is a good thing. and we should also note it is may, and may's mental health awareness month.

and it is important to continue to shine a light on this, so that people can continue to discuss it. because that's the only way that people can get better. appreciate it. >> well, and dana, thank you for bringing up on your show. >> thank you. and thank you so much for watching. cnn tonight continues after a break. >> i'l