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second graders and three adults. hats off to the show of kindness. the news continues, cnn prime time with donna, back starts now. >> thanks anderson good evening i am dana bash. today, two sisters were supposed to be in school learning in their second and fourth glazed crass rooms, but instead 11 year old daniela, and eight year old sophia are being remembered with makeshift tombstones. they were murdered this weekend at a shopping mall in another mass shooting. their mother is said to be in critical condition. their school principal described the girls as rays of sunshine, imploring parents who still have their children, hard your kids and tell them you love them. also today, a six year old boy left the icu and found out he is the only surviving member of his family. he was simply shopping with his parents, and now he is an orphan. according to a gofundme page, he lost his mom, his dad, and his little brother who was just three years old.

an army veteran who administered first aid at the scene described the horror he saw. >> the first girl i went to, and this is pretty graphic, she was in the fetal position like she was praying. i did not feel a pulse, pulled her head back to see if she was okay and there was nothing left to face or head, it was gone. >> these children are three of the eight people killed over the weekend in allen, texas, at an outlet mall. one year ago this month 19 students in the same state did go to school, but never came home in uvalde. in the first five months of this year there have been 204 mass shootings in the u.s., that is more shootings than days. at malls, schools, parks, grocery stores. none of these tragedies have significantly moved the gun debate in america. both sides are usually talking past each other, but tonight

let's talk to one another. joining me is cnn contributor jennifer mesilla, founding staffer at traced which focuses exclusively on gun violence. stephen catale ski i gun safety instructor and firearms reporter for reloaded. com, cnn senior crime and justice correspondent shimon prokupecz is, and chris van jelly former police in newtown, connecticut, one of the first to respond of the 2012 massacre at sandy hook elementary school. and so we are going to have a conversation right now about all of this, and starting with both of you, because you are on opposite sides of the gun issue, but i'm sure you can each agree that what we saw, this mass shooting, all of the mass shootings are unacceptable. >> yes, absolutely. i don't think there is anyone out there in the country that doesn't think that mass shootings are a horrific acts of evil that we need to figure out ways to reduce.

>> i think the frustration really comes when lawmakers say the same thing over, and over again. thoughts and prayers, but do not really offer any solid solutions. i think a lot of americans are starting to see through that. >> so, you, one is that you sit on opposite sides of the issue, you are an advocate for more gun control. you are a very staunch supporter of the second amendment, i think it's fair to say. how do we get to the point where you can have very different points of view on guns? and how many guns should be on the streets, who should own guns, who should have guns? and gets to the point where there is some kind of consensus so that what we are seeing does not occur over, and over again? >> i think there is broad consensus on the base level of the kind of person who should be able to have guns, we have laws that restrict gun ownership, legal gun ownership at least two people who have not been convicted of felonies, or involuntarily committed, adjudicated to be a threat to

themselves as others as mentally ill. the bigger question comes to how you prevent people from accessing guns who should not have them, and i think that is a much more difficult question, and of course there's also the question of broadbased and certain kinds of guns where you get even harder to through disagreements. >> yeah, i think all of america agrees that gun laws should be tighter. on a 1 to 1 basis people who are for gun rights, and people who are gun reform, i have experience in my life when you have a conversation and you break it down outside of the political noise, there is a lot of common ground to be had. i think that both sides are really dug in, i think that there is a lot of perceived block to progress happening in a certain political party, and

i think that is very frustrating. but 1 to 1, americans agree on a lot more than we disagree. >> well you are 1 to 1 here. >> yeah. >> yeah and i think there's a lot more agreement to disagreement over the kinds of people who should have guns, and perhaps, stricter enforcement of current laws is another area there's a lot of agreement, mental health facilities, or mental health assets for people struggling, people going through a mental crisis that could go down this path of mass shooting. i mean another area brought agreement you sought legislation last year to that end. i don't know that it has been structured well enough to focus on the issue, usually he's sort of throwing money at general mental health causes which can have an impact, but isn't necessarily specifically designed to prevent mass shootings in particular.

>> i want to talk about one pretty provocative notion out there, which is the question of what people actually see when these shootings happen? cnn and other news organizations are very careful about showing images that are out there, particularly when it comes to children. and that is something that is going to stay, probably, almost definitely. but there is social media that exists, and over the weekend you saw a lot of images that were out there that were really very, very graphic. and it has got us thinking here about the idea of going back to emmett till, and emmett till's mother intentionally wanting the photograph of kherson, very different time, very different issue, but the notion of using an image to try to change policy. and what happened there began

to change policy, it was a very long road, but they began to change. you both have, unfortunately, had access to very graphic, horrible images, particularly starting with you. you are one of the first people on the scene in sandy hook. >> yes. the images that i have our from eye witness accounts, it is me going into that building, that school that day and seeing all the people that were murdered by the shooter. and one of the things i can say is, after the fact, i don't want anybody to see what i saw. i think the only thing that could be gained from really seeing that is that they are now going to be subject to that vicarious trauma. nobody needs to see what we saw that day. if they don't believe that it happened, if they don't believe what we saw, then that's going to be their issue. but i think people already have their minds made up in terms of which side they are going to fall on, and to get to jennifer's point there, most americans did agree after sandy hook happened, president obama made it a priority to have gun

legislation. i really thought something was going to have a major shift. i mean, i no point in american history and i think there's a greater chance for something to pass. when you have parents going before the senate, and speaking their heart about the children that they lost, and there was broad based american support for, unfortunately did not pass. that doesn't mean it can't pass on these laws. in connecticut of course we have very strong low that passed after sandy hook. so i can have a different view of this. and i do think it's important for people to see some of these images, as long as you do in a very careful, and thoughtful way. this is something that i'm grappling with right now dealing with uvalde, and the aftermath, and having seen all the body camera footage that these officers were wearing, seeing the kids in the classroom, the amount of blood

that went through the hallway, and the classroom. the horrific injuries seeing kids with, basically, unrecognizable because of the injuries. i will leave it at that. there is a way to do this where it is not trauma, where it is not going to inflict any kind of damage, let's say psychological damage. but there comes a time where it is important for people to see what is going on, the most time, and time again this keeps happening. there's really no way to describe it, how horrific this is, and certainly how horrific the injuries were. i will tell you something, during the uvalde reporting when we came across the 9-1-1 calls at the little girls made from inside the classroom.

when i listen to those calls i said to myself, i will never play these calls. they are just too traumatic, they are too horrific. but as time went on, i felt it was important. and what changed my one with the parents. the parents came to me and said, no you should pay that. we need the world to hear, and you see what my little girl went through inside this classroom. so there are, you know, like the emmett till moment. there are parents who are willing to do this, because they feel that they can make a difference. >> and again after sandy hook, there was a lot of media, and other people who wanted to see those photos. and the parents stepped forward, the parents of the victims, specifically at one of the teachers that was killed, and said these are images of our loved ones and their last hours, and obviously there's also a distinction between who was a juvenile who is not. >> exactly. >> talk about nfl i rules in terms of releasing, you're not gonna release anything as of a juvenile. connecticut passed law that exams pictures of homicide victims from being released without consent of the family. so if there are families that would think that that image would change anybody's mind in terms of the gun debate, but i think that's an individual decision.

>> i think family consent is key. i have actually spoken with parents who've lost kids to gun violence, not in mastering but every day gun violence. i actually made a woman several years ago who go to gun reform rallies and hold up a photo of her daughter's autopsy, and i had to speak with her. and she said people have to see this. this is not to get trauma surgeons have been talking about for years, people need to see what goes on in my e. r., and then their mind would change about what there is to be done. because why are we talking about this? we are talking about this because over the weekend, probably all of us, we have our phones, you see an alert. there is another mass shooting. and we look at it, we are horrified, and we say oh, of course is another mass shooting. and so the question is, what -- when is it enough? how do you get to enough?

what are the mechanisms of society that gets to the point where we say enough? >> well, i think again nobody wants to see these happen, and everyone wants to stop them. the difference is what people believe will actually accomplish that, and there are very stark differences on that. even releasing photos, it should be up to the parents i agree on that point. i wonder if the presupposition there is that the opposition to the policies like ar-15 bans or universal background checks, or some other policies we are discussing it's based on a misconception about how bad killing children's. i don't think anyone has, -- thinks that is not a terrible thing, they just think that is not a solution that's going to get to the end. obviously that is the sort of disagreement. >> you are a law enforcement officer. you saw the most horrific of mass shootings and sandy hook, you've been a law enforcement for 30 years. what is the answer? >> i will tell you.

just bringing in the pictures, i used to go when i used to speak across the country about my experience that sandy hook to law enforcement conferences, and people had various political beliefs in the audience, and some people were staunch gun advocates and gun owners. some wanted to ban guns altogether, one of the photos that it did she was right up the state police's website in connecticut, which is the picture of the weapon that the shooter used sitting right in the middle of the floor on a first grade classroom. as one of the images that always sticks with me, because it is such a distorted image, you're in a first grade classroom, the last thing you should see is a weapon that has been used lying on the floor on the carpet. and so when i tell people, raise your hand we think this doesn't belong? everyone would raise their hand. next question is, how do we make that not happen again? that's where the debate starts. >> that's the thing, what has to finally happen, right? so for the families in uvalde, they had a small victory today

for them is that in this committee, and texas legislation, legislators, they voted out of committee to raise the age. clearly it's not gonna go anywhere, nobody think this is going to get passed in texas, but it's a small victory, and perhaps maybe that saw changes, the smaller victories, these families. it is so remarkable that they don't give up, they keep fighting jessica sandy hook families, and i have the uvalde families. but the cause of henri sort of feel like you are talking to law enforcement families, something at some point has to give, with this to texas shooter, there are so many reasons why he should not have had a gun, right? but that is a private sale, that is a whole other issue. it becomes so much, and it something just has to give. >> well listen, having the civilized conversations is a step, i hope. maybe it's a baby step, but it is a step. shimon prokupecz, chief of angeli, jen mascara, and

stephen gutowski, thanks so much to all of you for this conversation. and tonight, you new video of migrants lining up on the border of title 42, a pandemic era ban on many asylum seekers will be lifted this week. and it's not just a southern border issue, a big clashes brewing in the north over an influx of migrants. one county is now declaring a state of emergency to block new york city's mayor from passing asylum seekers to their backyard. >> we still get an answer, when and who's coming, and if they've invaded, and if they have criminal records. i employ the mayor to rethink this. >> that town supervisor is here next.

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- especially when it comes to your finances. - are you a certified financial planner™? - i'm a cfp® professional. - cfp® professionals are committed to acting in your best interest. that's why it's gotta be a cfp®. >> tonight in new york counties under a state of emergency in anticipation of hundreds of migrants arriving from new york city. mayor eric adams announced friday that the city would send willing migrants to neighboring communities, beginning with two hotels in suburban new york. up to 300 migrants could be moved there. mayor adams says it is necessary because they need a decompression strategy with title 42 expiring on thursday. that is a pandemic-era rule that allows the u.s. to swiftly return migrants to mexico, city officials say they can see up to 1000 new migrants arriving daily in the coming weeks. rockland county in new york declared an emergency in to fight the mayor's plan.

>> we will make every effort to ensure that this plan does not go for an rockland county. the mayor's engage in human trafficking of the worst kind. >> joining me now is teresa kenny, a supervisor for orange town, new york in rockland county. thank you so much for joining me this evening. i'm going to ask first about what we just heard from the county executive and day, saying that the mayor's human trafficking. that is a very loaded term, it is also a crime that involves coercion and beyond. is that exactly what he meant? do you agree with that? >> i can't speak for the county executive. what i can say is that he has grave concerns that in a county where we have approximately 70 homeless individuals now, that bringing out 340. and that's just for a start, they ultimately need us overwhelmed, and basically saying they're being dropped off, the basically left.

i will not ever attempt to speak to a day, he's very capable of speaking for himself. >> i should say, adams offices very explicit, saying they won't be dropped off, that they will provide food and shelter for the migrants. it will be paid for, and that when you talk about the numbers, it is a quarter of 1% of the migrants currently in new york city. what is your response? >> so as a supervisor of the town of orange town where the hotel is located, this is what i would say. this so-called plan, which none of us really know exactly what it is, was popped on us on friday afternoon. to this day, we can't be told how many are coming, when they are coming, whether they've been vetted, all questions which the red zips would likely just to know about. on top of it, the town of orangetown does have a local

law that difference what hotel is and its use, and housing, individuals performances not consistent with our town code. so i think had the mayor sincerely wanted to work with the counties and make disarrangement thing, in fairness to all of us, he should have reached out to us well before friday afternoon. we were told that there would be asylum seekers coming over the weekend, something changed it may be because of the state of emergency the county issued. in fact, the town did issue a violation to the owner that housing people for four months is not consistent, we have a hotel definition as transient for no more than 30 days. there's just a lot of issues, and i don't think it's fair that it was thrust upon us and left to try and figure it out without having serious conversations. >> let me ask you more of a philosophical question. we've seen instances, globally, where commuters have taken in refugees and asylum seekers in times of hardship, and sometimes in war.

some would argue that these migrants face really difficult challenges at home, and that they are just looking for a place to land while they are waiting to see if they can actually get asylum. what is wrong with giving them some help, and some safe haven in your town? especially if, as the mayor says, they will be paid for? >> so here's the thing, the mayor says they will be paid for for four months. what happens after four months? i am told they can get working paper sometimes for years, this hotel is in a small hamlet approximately three square feet miles with approximately 4600 residents. it is a suburban community, you wanna put upwards of 300 men there, and they are on a state highway? it's not fair to them either to put them in this hotel, to be completely honest with you. and again, i'm not disagreeing with you. my husband's an immigrant, my father was an immigrant, that's

not what this is about. but what did then they are not reach out and have a sincere conversation with either ed de, who will ultimately be responsible, or social services department if these individuals cannot find housing in need help and assistance? >> one final question, do you believe that your county will sue, will you take us to court and if so when? >> so, what i would say is they issued a state of emergency. if the hotel opts to violate it, they wouldn't have a civil remedy against the violation of the emergency order. i can tell you this, the town of orangetown, because if they were to do this it would violate what our local law, we are considering bringing in action. again, if it complies with our town code there's a thing we can do, but as it has been presented, it does not comply with our town code. >> teresa kenny thank you so much for joining me this evening. >> thanks, you have a good

night. >> and on this eve of a crucial meeting at the white house, a senator leading a coalition of republicans is laying down markers on raising the debt ceiling and keeping america from defaulting. >> we have told president biden, look, we will work with you but it's not going to be free. >> will the president, and bipartisan congressional leaders find any middle ground tomorrow? we are gonna talk about that next. ♪ partnering to unlock new ideas, to create new legacies, to transform a company, industry, economy, generation. because grit and vision working in lockstep puts you on the path to your full potential. old school grit. new world ideas. morgan stanley.

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a clean bill, raising the debt limit without conditions, but republicans are calling for major spending cuts. among them is utah senator mike lee, he is leading a group of 43 republicans in the senate vowing to oppose a debt ceiling increase unless they see reforms. >> we have told president biden, look, we will work with you but it's not going to be free. the president needs to be reminded of the fact that he has one voice in this, it's an important voice, it's a powerful voice, but he can't pass something through congress unless he works with congress. >> now he, just like many other republicans, maintains that default is not on the table. but the question is, how do they get there if no one is willing to compromise? let's talk about this with cnn business correspondent rahel solomon, republican strategist

jason osborne, and democratic strategist basil michaels. so let's talk politics first. you each understand the political realities that the republicans are dealing with, that the democrats are dealing with. i'll start with the republicans, they walk into this meeting tomorrow, particularly for kevin mccarthy. can he afford to give much? and then, can he afford not to when it comes to the economics of it? >> i think he walks in there with the big, stick right? he has the ability because the house passed by very slim margin. a very comprehensive package. the senate republicans are sticking with him, and so as long ago senate republicans stay with him, and i think he is able to go in there and say look, i have to go back to my conference with something. now i'm gonna start with everything, and then give me something in that. and so what that something is, in the end, i think is yet to be seen. but there are four pretty good choices, i think, in there. i think it's curtailing spending, which quite frankly, the president doesn't really have much of an option there, that's congressional. but it can go back and say look, i understand we are to pay the

debts from the past, but in the future we are hoping that we don't have to come back and ask for as much, because we are still gonna have this fight again in two years, three years, four years, and another ten years after that. i think in the end we probably delay for two weeks, maybe three, and then come back and everybody gets serious and says all right already this, and then he is able to go back and sell it to my confidence. but i think it's also going to require that the white house lean on some of the democrats so that is not a sort of a lift for him to get those additional votes to pass it out of the house. >> yeah, it is interesting because i agree with you on the delay tactic. but i do disagree on the leverage issue, as you talk about big stick, i define leverage here as what the democrats have going into this conversation, great jobs report. granted, the biden's numbers are not as high as many would like it to be, but the reality is that from, if you center the voter in this conversation, they view this conversation as an inherently republican issue.

it is republicans or keep pushing us into this place, and it is republicans who keep pushing the country to the brink. because the president himself has said look, i'm willing to entertain some cuts. so why are we still having this conversation? and considering the leadership of jeffries in uniting the conference, i do believe that most voters are going to look at this and say, it is republicans bringing us here over, and over, and over again. maybe mccarthy is the one that settles this, i am not sure he could do it nominally, but my guess is that he will probably end up having to work with mcconnell, and then biden would have to work with mcconnell more than anybody else to get this thing done. >> but the same time, mcconnell does not have the votes in the house. so you talk about the big stick and the leverage issue, mccarthy is speaking to a caucus that is sitting there saying, we were elected to produce the spending in government, among many other things. so if he is not able to show that there is going to be a

reduction in that spending, and honestly i think we talked about a little bit earlier, the white house using the analogy that if you have a loan payment on your car or a mortgage on your house, i think that's completely the wrong thing. because a republican voters going to look at and say wait a minute, who's gonna bail also when you have the money for pay for that? and secondly, and last point i think is that, the white house is asking us to buy a boat to go along with the car and the house that we can't afford. who's gonna pay for that? >> i'm glad you're bringing this down to real people terms, because all of these politics are important, and that is what's at play, and that's what's going to define this meeting tomorrow and beyond. but rahel, we have you here to represent real americans and how this affects them. >> well, i certainly will try. there are lots of implications as to what this can be, certainly for wall street in terms of the financial implications, right? within the financial markets, but there's also mainstream, and how that would impact real small businesses, which by the way, is a huge driver of

economic growth. goldman sachs put out a survey just a few days ago, interviewed, so it more than 1700 small business owners. and what i thought was really interesting is 65% of these small business owners but they surveyed said they would be negatively impact if congress did not bail, did not raise the debt ceiling. so you think about, for example, all the different small business contract with the federal government works. with everything florist to i.t. to food vendors, so many implications. now, what i also thought was interesting in this goldman survey was that 90%, believe it's important that the federal government raises or avoids default. but 81% said they also think it's important that the government enact spending cuts in conjunction with these talks, right. so, i thought that was really interesting, that the solution here may not be black or white, it may be somewhere in the middle. so, i talk to one of the senior advisers of small business for america's future, that's a national coalition of small business owners. and i asked, because i was curious, you know, i speak to economists every day, and i

certainly know how economists feel about the threat of a duffel here, but how do small business owners feel? how do real people feel? he said,, look, there's a lot of frustration for small business owners, who really want congressional leaders to act. because they've seen the impact this will have on the business, the economy, and for many of them, their employees. to be clear, he's referring there to a shutdown, which we have all experienced. but a collapse of this sort, a default of this sort will be much more severe, would impact much more people. so, that's the real threat here. and a lot of people are feeling. it >> really interesting, particularly the notion of spending cuts, the people do want spending cuts. and we all know what's going on here. the question is, is it going to be attached to the debt ceiling? is it gonna be separate? there is gonna be some solution, presumably, where both sides can claim victory. but as you respond to this, i just want to bring in new poll numbers that came out about president biden's approval number. it is now down, according to the washington post 36%. that is down from february. this is one poll, this is a

snapshot in time. but it does give you a sense of the maybe the leverage or not leverage that he has. >> i don't think anybody is looking at the poll numbers right now. i mean, honestly, if you are a professional and your work in the white house, or you're working in the speaker's office, senate leader's office, you're not looking at the poll numbers. i mean, you can say oh publicly at that, yeah, his numbers are low, and we have a lot of leverage here. the fact of the matter is he's the president for the next two years. these folks are also the majority leader, yeah, the republican leader and the speaker the house until two years. so, the leverage i think becomes give me something i can sell, because i need 218 votes. if you want me to walk back there with a clean debt limit bill, i'm not going to pass it, unless you're telling me that you're going to give me every single democrat on the bill, because you going to have an abandoned ship of republicans. i, mean there will be a small cadre that will just never let it happen, or will never, you know, go against the speaker and we'll let the debt limit

pass. but he needs something to go back to the caucus. and rightly so, the public is saying we need spending cuts. at the same time, you also have all this money going overseas. it's like a perfect storm. and so, how do you justify sending all this money overseas, but you're not cutting spending back here? >> last point. >> as i said, the president has already agreed to do this. he just wants a clean bill. and again, centering the voter in all this conversation, what is the average voter see? they see 90 democratic party, united behind a democratic leader hakeem jeffries, despite the presidents low poll numbers, and they've been low for quite some time. the reality is that he has negotiated partners within his party to be able to go out there and do work. i don't know if that exists on the republican side. and, that i think, is the challenge that american voters are looking at, that who is the real leader of the republican party that's going to be at this table and actually put an end to this thing? >> yeah, and i just want to note for the record, it's the republican at this table that

said president biden's poll numbers don't matter. just for the record. >> in the context -- of >> i know, i know. jason, basil, rahel, thank you so much, appreciate it. and tonight, a surprise victory for uvalde families nearly a year after the school massacre there. a gun control bill that many loved ones of victims are pushing for, clearing a key hurdle with the help of a couple of republican state law makers. that's ahead. you've evolved. you've changed. so have we. that's why new dove body wash now has 24-hour

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tonight, state lawmakers, including to republicans, advance he measure that would raise the age limit to buy semi automatic rifle. >> eight eyes, five days, and zero [inaudible] in the motion. >> you hear there the vote met with cheers from families who lost loved ones almost a year ago at robb elementary school in uvalde. today's vote was a culmination of months of work. it keeps the bills chances alive, but it moved out of the committee, yet it probably will face a very steep climb in the full texas legislator. i want to talk about that, the issue of guns and much much more, with former congressman will hurd, he's a republican who spent six years representing texas, including uvalde, and united states congress. thank you so much for joining me, i appreciate it. so, you have backed several gun

control measures over the years. you support universal background checks. when you are in congress, you called for raising the eligibility age for assault style weapons after uvalde. do the type of restrictions you backed, are they getting any more traction, particularly in the wake of more and more mass shootings? >> well, they're getting traction amongst the public, right. when you look at what the public believes, and to include responsible gun owners, they believe these things are straightforward and simple things that we need to do in order to protect our kids. the stat that doesn't get used enough in these debates is that half of our teenagers in the red states of america are afraid of being shot at their school. that's a crazy number, and that's unacceptable. and these, these families that have had to endure the worst tragedy that any family can deal with, right, the loss of a child, shouldn't have to be in

austin lobbying to get a bill passed, a couple of days in the year anniversary of the death of the children. this should have already been done. and as you, said my sources here in austin say this is going to be difficult to see final passage. but this movement is something small. and i think it hopefully reflects that change in peoples hearts. >> you are on the inside in congress, now you are on the outside looking in. as things have unfortunately gotten worse with regard to gun violence. what's the special sauce? what needs to change to go from the public support for changes in gun laws, which was true when you are in congress, just as it is now, to actually making that happen when it comes to legislation and policy? >> we need more elected officials not being afraid of the constituents and not being afraid of a couple of nasty tweets. the reality is, when you're

thoughtful, look, i had an a rating for the nra, the nra supported my reelection's. but i also listen to groups like moms demand action. and when you realize the support that's out there, and to be honest, who can look a mom in their eyes and say, you know, i didn't do everything within my power to prevent this from happening, from somebody else. so, what needs to change, we need more people standing up and voting in primaries. the fact that only 23% of the country votes in primaries. we need to make sure -- , like there is oftentimes better choices in those primaries. but we need more people to get involved and make sure that we're getting people in november that we like, and are going to be reflective of where the majority of the country's. >> let's turn to immigration, title 42, a covid era emergency immigration restriction will lift at the end of the day on thursday. you've been very critical of the biden industry shun.

but you know very well, immigration reform is a bipartisan problem, because it's so politically divisive. what would you do differently right now? >> so, right, now this is something that the administration can do. you do not need title 42 to prevent people from coming into the country. you have to stop treating everybody as an asylum seeker. and asylum is very narrow, you have to be part of protected class, you have to be persecuted for being part of that protected class. and the fact that everybody is being allowed in is what is seeing the surge, 6.5 million people come in this country illegally since president biden was in office. we also, right now, you don't need legislation to try to dismantle the human smuggling networks that are taking advantage of these people that are trying to flee a crummy situation, to come here to the united states. >> the administration says they

need more funding, more border agents, things of that nature, to do that. >> well, look, i think there are, this is not being taken as a priority within the broader intelligence community, about stopping human smuggling and stopping fentanyl from coming into our country. fentanyl, drug overdoses has killed twice as many people as gun violence last year. so, there are resources that can be focused on this effort. look, they could streamline legal immigration as well. you have to deal with this crisis on the border, but what's fascinating to me is the democrats, whenever they're in power, they don't bring things up they know could potentially get the handful of votes they need in a place like the senate to get past. so, those are two things you can do immediately that doesn't require, that doesn't require legislation. look, where are diplomacy in this area? where are we making sure we are aligning usaid and the

philanthropic community to make sure that we have long term plans in places like the northern triangle, which has historically given, or has been historically been the root cause of much of our illegal immigration, and now, because it's so bad, everybody is coming out, so, our diplomacy is not being engaged in this initiative to address those root causes in those other places. >> well, you know, in fairness, they are trying it, the vice president's entire platform, a major part of her platform, she has been down there trying to do that, but that's for another discussion. >> yeah, 6.5 million have still come in. so, going well. >> i have to ask you before i let you go. you will be back in new hampshire this month. just last week, you said, quote, nobody wants to see a repeat of 2020. i think there are a lot of republicans that want to see conservative policies enacted. but if we don't win elections, we can enact those, can't enact those conservative policies, i

think he said that up in new hampshire to our old friend paul stein hauser. do you think you are the best choice in 2024? are you going to run in 20 -- or you would run for president? >> i am honored to have served my country in many different ways, whether was the cia or congress. i'm not closing the door on being able to serve my country again. i'm sick and tired of losing. i think that if we want to keep this century the american century, we've got to make some big changes and have common sense problems too complicated issues. and i also believe something i've learned in my time in congress, were actually better together. and there's an opportunity to get the right republican that can appeal to an independent. >> are you that republican? >> i think somebody like me has an opportunity to beat a president who has, what did you say, a 36% approval rating? but again, the opportunity to serve my country, i've always look for ways to be able to do that. >> when are you going to decide? >> well, i think anybody who's thinking running for office,

there is a time horizon on that. >> it's ticking, quickly. it's ticking fast. >> oh, it's always taking. but like i said, the thing, my father, my 90-year-old father always told me don't be desperate, when you're desperate, you make bad decisions. so, i'm want to always evaluate what's the best way for me to help a country that is giving me so much. >> will hurd, former congressman from texas, sounds like maybe future presidential candidate. we'll see. come back and let us know when you decide. >> sure. >> okay. and up next, 21-year-old u.s. tennis star, she announces an indefinite break from the sport. joining a slew of other young athletes authorities doing the same. former professional tennis player pam shriver is here to talk about that, next.

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>> a 21-year-old tennis star took to social media to announce a break from the sport. amanda anisimova said she needs time to focus on her mental health. she played in tournaments against naomi osaka and coco gauff, and she wrote on instagram "i've been really struggling with my mental health and burnout since the

summer of 2022. it's become unbearable being in tennis tournaments. at this point, my priority is my mental well-being and taking a break for some time. i worked as hard as i could to push through it. i will miss being out there, and i appreciate all the continual support." let's bring in former professional tennis player pam shriver. thank you so much for joining me. you were about the same age as anna when you became a worldwide tennis star. you were in the finals for the u.s. open. when you saw and read this announcement, what did you think? >> well,, unfortunately we've seen it in tennis and other sports, young people who have a high profile public job in this day and age, it happens pretty frequently. amanda, i'm glad she's taking care of herself, recognizing that she cannot push through. really, the toughest injury for any athlete is when your mental health is not as healthy as you

need it to be. so, she follows in the footsteps of other high-profile players, like andrescu and osaka recently. but andre agassi wrote it about it in his book decades ago as well. marty fish on the men side. it's not just related women, it's on both sides. >> that's a really important point. it's not. and i'll bring in other sports, michael phelps, and the list goes on. i want to read a tweet from a former world number one tennis player, chris evert, you came up with her in the world of tennis. she said it seems like a glamorous life. it is not. for a teenager, it is not a normal life. every day, you are either a winner or loser. you are put on a pedestal or shamed on social media. the highs and lows provide no balance. there's a price. take your time, amanda. can you relate to that? >> very much so. first off, christie is one of the great spokespeople and represents women's tennis, the champion mentality, but also very compassionate.

so i'm glad past champions like crises are supporting amanda. and other athletes in other sports that struggle mental health. so, i can relate a lot. and when i look back and think about certain stages of my career, the language, coming forward about mental health was not there. i certainly recognize my struggle during my 19 years. >> and when you were playing the game, there was no social media. how much do you think social media amplifies this? and as you answer that -- i'm also thinking about people who are not worldwide athletes or even celebrities in general. but people who, an average person who deals with mental health struggles, for whom their social media feed might be the spotlight that shines on them and makes them, gives them challenges with regard to their mental health. >> absolutely. i mean, i come at this also as a parent of 3 teenagers, who have unfortunately spent their teenage years with social media

and had to make difficult decisions whether to stay on it or not. and i think all of us have to look at that. i think tennis players, most have social media platforms that they have to promote certain things. but boy, you need to know boundaries, how to keep yourself healthy around things like social media, and also say this era of young players, like anisimova, had to deal with a global pandemic, something that's never happened in tennis before. and try to play a global sport during the stressors of that, coupled with social media, it's been a tough time. >> yeah, that is definitely true. and back to tennis, do you believe that the league is doing enough to support mental health, particularly the mental health of young athletes? >> well, the wta tour, which is the governing body of women's tennis, they've actually had staff in mental health for 25 years, which came right after i retired. the staff has tripled in the last 5 years. so actually, the wta was ahead of the game. the usta also had a summit last

year's open on mental health, and that initiative is going for a because the sport realizes, and i hope tennis can lead the way, not only with mental health, but all the with stronger safeguarding, to keep our athletes in the workplace as safe as possible. the 2 things really go together. >> oh, that is so true. and again, when you were coming up and you recognized some of the challenges we're seeing and hearing from amanda and others, people didn't talk about mental health. and they're talking about it now. and that is a good thing. and we should also note it is may, and may is mental health awareness month. and it is important to continue to shine a light on this, so that people can continue to discuss it. because that's the only way that people can get better. appreciate it. >> well, and dana, thank you for bringing up on your show. >> okay, thank you, and thank you so much for watching. >>