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>> good evening.

, tonight in the eyes of a federal giardia of his peers to donald trump, the once president of the united states, is a sexual abuser. six men and three women found him liable for sexually abusing writer e. jean carroll at a department store in the 1990s, and then defaming her about it last year on his social media site. the jury took just under three hours to reach their verdict and reward carroll approximately $5 million in damages. in a moment, we will be joined by jessica leads, testifying during the trial that a young donald trump groped her on a flight in the 70s. her lawyers neither put on defense, nor called him as a witness, leading the plaintiffs to play damaging portions of trump's testimony. they heard the access hollywood tape in which he says that stars can get away with women -- and heard them during the deposition, doubling down on that. >> historically, that's true with stars. >> it's true the stars that they can grab women by the --? -- >> if you look at the last million years that's been largely true. unfortunately or fortunately. >> and you consider yourself to

be the star? >> i think you can say that yes. >> jurors also heard the former president claim missing carroll was not his type, as if that would excuse sexual assault. this photo of her back in the 1990s for his ex-wife, marlon maples. >> is this the photo that you are referring to? >> i think so, yes. i don't even know who the woman's. i don't know. it's marla. >> you're saying marla is in this photo? >> yes, that's my wife. >> which one are you pointing to? >> here. -- >> the person you just pointed to is e. jean carroll. >> miss carroll did not speak to reporters today, but released a statement which reads in part, this victory is not just for me but for every woman that has suffered because she was not believed. as for the former president, he posted this on his social media

site, quoting now i'm absolutely no idea who this woman, is this verdict is a disgrace. a continuation of the greatest witch hunt of all-time. attorney joe patina underscored, the jurors stopped short of claiming that his client raped miss carroll, and plans to appeal. >> there are things that happened in this case that were beyond the judge overturning already once by the second circuit in carroll versus trump. we simply overturned it a second time. >> a lot to discuss. joining us now jessica -- in her first interview since the verdict. miss leads, thank you for joining us. what's your reaction upon hearing this verdict? >> i am very pleased for jean. i'm very pleased for the whole situation. i'm very pleased. >> you are brought up in former president trump's deposition which was played in front of the jury, and included some of the earlier comments that he made about you on the campaign trail.

for our viewers, i just want to play that. >> they made up a story. just like your client made it up. >> people willing to say, i was with donald trump in 1980. >> nothing changes. >> i was sitting with him on an airplane. >> and he went after me on the plane. yeah, i'm going to after them. believe me she would not be my first choice, that i can tell you. [applause] you don't know. that would not be my first choice. >> when you said in that video that miss leeds it would not be your first choice, you were referring to her physical looks, correct? >> just the overall, i look at, or i see her, i hear what she

says. whatever. i would not have any interest in her. >> i'm wondering, what was going through your mind when you heard what he said in the deposition? >> i knew that he was going to say something like that, but when i first made my story to the times, that's why i gave them the picture of what i look like. that was the time that i had met him. although the picture that i gave him, i had shorter hair. i knew that he would not be able to see past the fact that i, at that time, when this entire thing got started, i was like a 76-year-old woman. now i'm an 80 year old woman. he cannot imagine what i look like. all he sees is an 80 year old woman. he would not make a pass at it in a few-year-old woman if his life depended upon it. his entire image is of himself, that younger women are accessible to him. >> as we heard mr. trump denied

your allegations against him. and wondering what your experience was being cross-examined by his attorney, what it was like to be on the witness stand? why did you think about the jury, were they listening? >> it's one thing to be telling your story to friends, to family, even just two acquaintances, it was one thing to tell the story to the times and have it published. it's very disconcerting, and it's very difficult to be in a jury, be on a witness stand, and be making -- telling the story to a group of people, and to be questioned and basically badgered by the lawyer that trump had. the judge was very protective of me. he would not let this man carry on, go on for too long.

as he let them do with e. jean. she really endured two days of harassment. >> did you hear her testimony? >> did i hear her testimony? no, i did not sit in on her testimony. you're not allowed in. you're not allowed. >> the judge today advised jurors in this case not to reveal themselves publicly. i'm wondering, has there ever been a moment when you regretted coming forward? >> no. i have never regretted it. i've been absolutely amazed, and sustained by the support that i've received from friends, family, and strangers. it is really been quite awe inspiring. >> why did you decide to go ahead and testify in this trial?

>> she asked me about a year before this got started, and her lawyers felt that my story was important for the entire case. they stressed that to me. that's several times. >> in their mind it showed a pattern. >> correct. they zoned in on the interview that i did with you at one point, where i talked about this was his m. o.. they could show with me and with natasha from people magazine that this is the way that he treated women over the whole spectrum. at one point, i begged and pleaded the times people to

take this time to try and investigate the girls the trump dated in high school, and in college, because i'm sure that they have quite a few stories to tell. >> i'm not sure if you watched much of the deposition that he gave, and we played a small part of it. in it, he really doubled down on what he said on that access hollywood tape, which is counter to what he said immediately after the access hollywood tape, and they talked a lot about locker room talk, said it was not representative of who he really was. the idea that he said the stars have always been able to do this for millions of years, and not sure how many and a throw stars there were. but then he said that unfortunately, in fact, let's play this. he said, unfortunately or fortunately, i just want to play this again for our viewers. >> historically, that's true with stars.

>> it's true with stars that they can grab women? >> if you look over the last million years, i guess that has been largely true, not always, but largely true. unfortunately or fortunately. >> you consider yourself to be a star? >> i think you could say that, yes. >> beyond him being one of the worst people ever to give a deposition, were you surprised by the fortunately or fortunately -- unfortunately or fortunately? >> no, he truly believes it. he says exactly what he believes. he will sometimes come up with, okay, i hope you're not upset with me or whatever. the fact remains, he believes that from the bottom of his toes, that he has the right because he is something special.

of course, he is not. even president of the united states. >> jessica leeds, i appreciate your time thank you. >> thank you, it's good to see you. >> good to see, you we want to speak to george conway, who first aged -- george, can you walk us through how and when you met e. jean carroll? what exactly you advised her? >> it is serendipitous. what happened was the week before her story had come out in the new york magazine, in the book excerpt. over that weekend, that prompted me to write an op-ed from the washington post where i had pointed out that jean carroll's case was actually much stronger in terms of its corroboration then the case of juanita roderick and her allegations about being raped by bill clinton. the point that i made, which was flowing from the fact of the trump campaign itself brought out rodrick in 2016, attacking hillary clinton, and

if you believe the allegations of broderick, and you thought that she was courageous for coming forward, then you darn well better feel the same way about jean carroll, because she had to contemporaneous witnesses to whom she confided the sexual assault. and then of course, you have the incredible pattern evidence of dozens of women coming forward, alleging that donald trump had done exactly the same thing. if you hold that by the standards that we have been focused on in the last few years with all of the metoo reporting in new york or the new york times, and other outlets, the strongest things that you can have, that correlate, did confirm an event like this, because usually is just one person and another alone in a room, is that whether or not the victim told anybody at the time, and also we know that the men who engage in this grotesque conduct, do it repeatedly and over again

without shame. we saw that, and we saw that again with the tape that you just showed. it was almost sociopathic, basically saying, fortunately or unfortunately, women get raped. it is just crazy stuff. it shows you his attitude towards the women around him, and it shows you his basic inability. he was unable to defend himself because he would've been destroyed on cross-examination, if he showed up in trial. essentially there was no evidence. >> and back in 2016, after the access hollywood tape emerged, donald trump said, and i'm quoting, anybody who knows me knows that these words don't reflect who i am. i said, it i was wrong, and i apologize. and then obviously, listening in that deposition, that's what he really thinks in the deposition. those were words that somebody else grafted for him. >> absolutely. he's never truly, he's not capable of actual remorse, he doesn't have a conscience.

he's not capable of empathy. those words that he apologized, he felt bad, those don't last very long. in fact, by the time of the transition in late 2016 and early 2017, he actually told him, and this was in the new york times, he told the united states senator that he said he thought the access hollywood tape was made up in fabricated. that is the depth of his remorse for his egregious sexual misconduct. >> do you think that this verdict plays a role in how he does in the campaign for the nomination? do you think that it affects that? >> i think that like everything else involving donald trump, it cuts both ways. i think that to the people that support him, they will simply dismiss it as a conspiracy led by the litigation, whether it be me, you cnn, jean carroll,

jean carroll's lawyers. another attempt to get donald trump, and they never really ask themselves, wait a minute, how is it possible for any one person to get into this many scrapes and have that many people say the same thing about you, about his dishonesty, his lying, his sexual predication. they don't really ask themselves like, maybe there is something to this. where there's smoke there's fire. they can't do that. they can't bring themselves to do that because if they do that, then they have to admit that they have been essentially endorsing and enabling a monster. >> george cohen, thank you for your time tonight. later on the program, to republican women and longtime trump supporters make of this verdict. plus, legal and political panel joining us for reactions of the -- who today, in the aftermath of the verdict, said that she brought countless cases, her words, to then white house chief of staff mark meadows, where she thought the former presidents interactions with women were dangerous. also tonight, first on cnn,

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>> i think that the new york legal system is off the rails when it comes to donald trump. >> republican senator rob marco rubio echoed that notion, saying that the jury is a joke, and the whole case is a joke. both senators should be noted are also attorneys. joining us now, cnn political commentator, working for president obama, also senior lecturer and former federal judge nancy garner. jen jessica roth, who's now at korda law school, and jeff zeleny. it was a reaction to the verdict? >> i was not surprised. once it is clear that the testimony of the other three women, we are two women rather, had the access hollywood tape coming in, then there is a clear pattern. the judge allowed it in precisely because of that, there is a pattern. the pattern was walking up to women and touching them. and so her story was consistent with that. i was not really surprised. >> jessica, is there anything surprising you? they focused on the fact that the jury did not find him liable for rape, but for sexual

abuse. >> and picking up on what he said, i think the through line through this trial was about the pattern. the consistency about what he had done to those two other women coming forward with the account that jean carroll had gabe and what he had said in the access hollywood tape about how he would just attack women essentially, and grab their private parts. to the extent that that pattern was very important to the jury, and reaching the quick verdict that it did, it is not surprising that they essentially went for the category that most closely fit what he described doing in that tape, and what he did to those two are their women. >> and what he doubled down on in the deposition. that to me is stunning. >> it's assault and not sexual assault, and not necessarily rape. it is clear that the jury believed jean carroll in her account. the fact that they didn't check their box for rape does not in any way take away from the clearly credited her account to what happened, and accredited not only that it happened, but how it is our. the damages that were awarded here, $5 million, the vast majority, all but $300,000 were in compensatory damages which is in punitive which was striking here.

>> alyssa, first, of all do you think this makes a difference politically? >> i think it does. it certainly does if you make it to a general election. i don't know how you win female voters, it's one thing when there's allegations lingering overhead, it happened with democrats and republicans. this is a jury of his peers, finding that this did in fact take place. the flight that i would be waving for republicans to listen to is that this man cannot survive a general election with this now. it's one of the badges that he's wearing. i don't know in the primary. the latest polls have him seven points ahead of joe biden, head to head. he sees some of these responses, i'm very disappointed to see somebody like marco rubio trying to dismiss this. it's an important new york statute that allows victims to take up a case after the fact, who are not able to go after the statute of limitations has surpassed. i think it's something that will be a landmark case, and is important. >> you said earlier on cnn that in the trump white house, you noticed and flagged some of the behavior towards women that you found quote, dangerous. >> i want to be careful on how

much i say because it's not my story to tell. i can share my role in it which is that there were junior staffers that we were concerned with how much time they're spending one-on-one with the former president, female staffers. it was a pattern that several different people noticed. stephanie grisham, i had never work together in the white house, but she raised when she was pressed secretary. i did when i came in as comms director to then chief of staff. i said that this is problematic for these women to be alone with the president, to have an audience where he summons them. we are not his more senior staffers bringing him in. i don't know if it was ever addressed, i know what i feel about what was happening, and i thought that it was my duty to report it. i can't go further in making assumptions, but it is widely believed to do is problematic. >> and in reporting, was there any -- >> i was told by the chief of staff that he was aware of it, and that he would handle. it i don't believe anything ever happened. >> does this matter for people that -- >> i'm not sure but it certainly should. i think that certainly for

graham and rubio, to be undermining the jury, it's really despicable. anybody that's ever served on major, you are, card you do the best you can. the facts here, the pattern, the confession. donald trump said that he does this stuff. and so to have u.s. senators dismissing it, trying to undermine, and i think that was really, especially past a certain graveyard here. i think that they should really heed something. >> jeff zeleny, politically in terms of getting the actual nomination in the republican party, do you think that this plays a role? >> i think it's unclear. there's a sense of exhaustion among republican voters out there. we put republicans in a couple of different categories one of the always trumpers, they will not be bothered by this. there is a sense of a center lane, and it's a pretty significant essentially. there is an exhaustion factor, here searching for somebody else. that other somebody else has not yet arrived on the scene. there's no doubt that donald trump has a stronger position than he does at the start of the year.

just last, week a voter that voted for donald trump in 2020, looking for somebody else. she doesn't want any more drama. turned off by the -- she thinks she's too liberal and judges, but she doesn't want trump drama. for those voters in the middle, i think this does have a big effect. in the primary, it's unclear. but as alyssa was saying in the general, without question, this is a problem for republicans. again, nobody's been able to fill that exhaustion void that clearly exists. >> from a legal standpoint does he have to pay this? can he -- i'm not sure, he lives in florida, can he get away with not paying in? >> it's a verdict that can be enforced in florida. florida is part of the united states, at least up until now. no, he has to pay. there is no question about it. they will have to chase him, there's a question about that, and he's not known for paying his bills. of course you will have to pay. there will be an appeal here. there will be a judgment, and you can execute the judgment in florida, you can execute it

anywhere in the united states. there will be appeals, there's no question. the only victory that his lawyer has won in this case is delaying it. the case was relieved originally brought in 2020, and he has managed to delay it up until now. there will be a delay, but the verdict will stand. at least in my judgment, the verdict will stand. that can be executed anywhere. >> kevin mccarthy today, deflecting this question. it was about whether he would still support the former president. it seems like they're just going to try to ride this out until the next news cycle in move this along. >> i think that's very likely. i think elected republicans will see if they could just get away with not answering this. the problem our to underscores that one in three women will face sexual assault in their lifetime. you will lose female voters if you decide that you are hitching your wagon to somebody that has now been found guilty of it. the morality of it aside, just the tactical, trying to win a political election.

his main is a loser, no lack of talent on the gop side that we could put forward and could actually be somebody that we're proud of, and we're not constantly dodging people in the capital wanting to answer questions about his wrongdoing. i would hope that it would be a moment where somebody in the party can step up, i saw chairwoman of the rnc saying that she would not speak out about it, and other senators electing. i'm not holding my breath. >> do you think there's anything the former president could see publicly including at tomorrow's tannin hall that could -- i'm not sure, defuse the situation? >> unfortunately, every time he has a chance to defuse, he makes it worse. he doubles down, triples down, and i think that for a long time, trump, you see, how is he getting away with this? now he is no longer getting away with it. his whole thing was that i'm a winner, i can do what i, what nobody can touch me, this untouchable aura. he's getting touched a lot now, and there are more cases to come. i'm not sure what he can do. it would be very interesting if tomorrow, he chose to take a different tact. >> jeff, his rivals, at least for the ones out there, they

are not going after him. >> some. are we sir asia hudson, going after him. chris christie has been, others not been. there is still the sense that they want his voters. they believe that they need his voters. they haven't made a ball to have that confidence to make that leap. that's why he is in the driver seat here for the nomination. nobody is taking him on in a full frontal way. >> and it's not clear that anybody really knows how to. >> i mean, obviously didn't work in 2016, but chris christie, the former governor of new jersey is talking about it in the most fulsome way, going after him directly. the problem is that he's not part of those republicans. we just have to see how this plays. out i'm very skeptical of the polls right now, those head to head among the republicans. we have all seen past elections. it's not as relevant now but let's see what he says tomorrow, there is a exhaustion, like i said. we'll see if anybody fill that void. >> thanks everybody. we appreciated. just ahead, more on the

political jury decision against the former president, including a former congresswoman. we discuss the impact that this might have on the house. we'll be back. [bones cracking] ♪(tense music)♪ one aleve works all day so i can keep working my magic. just one aleve. 12 hours of uninterrupted arthritis pain relief. aleve. who do you take it for? you need to deliver new apps fast using the services you want in the clouds of your choice. with flexible multi-cloud services that enable digital innovation and enterprise control, vmware helps you innovate and grow.

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>> today's jury verdict against the former president, finding him liable for sexual abuse and defamation comes in the middle of the race for the presidency, obviously. as the former president is the current front runner for the nomination in the republican

party, he also lost the female vote from the 2020 general election by about 15 points. that's according to exit polls. joined now by two republican women to discuss the potential political fallout of today's decision. barbara comstock, former congresswoman from virginia, has been deeply critical of -- and alice do, it has been supporting this policy in the past. alice, as we mentioned, you've supported the president in the past. does this verdict change anything for you, either personally or politically? you think it'll impact the primary campaign? >> personally, it certainly does. this is yet another example of where he has shown complete disrespect to women. for many people, this is an example, and it demonstrates the fact that this access hollywood tape has been disturbing to many people. it's not just a bus banter. what he calls locker room talk was actually foreshadowing the dressing room action. this is quite disturbing for women that have distanced themselves from donald trump for quite some time. i was frustrated with trump echoing he first started the election integrity nonsense, widespread voter fraud leading women that have distanced themselves from donald trump for quite some time. i was frustrated with trump

echoing he first started the election integrity nonsense, widespread voter fraud leading up to the january 6th, as well as stepping in and trying to avoid the peaceful transfer of power. and the broader gop electorate is quite frustrated with him. they do have trump fatigue, and they are looking for somebody that has his policies, but doesn't have the personal grievances and political backlash and baggage that he has. the problem, anderson, as many people, know his base will believe everything that donald trump says. they will say that this is a witch hunt, they will say this verdict was disgraceful, and they will stand by him. they will be embolden him. i've spoken with other candidates vying for 2024, and they feel this will energize the space in a fractured field with many gop candidates, it's not going to be helpful for the gop nominee. >> allison, marco rubio, and graham both attacked new york juries, saying they were ridiculous. do you believe the jury? do you believe that donald trump is a sexual abuse or? >> i believe the verdict that

the fact that nobody is above the law, there is no statute of limitations on the truth. i believe what the accuser said did happen. the fact of the matter is that there are other women that have made similar claims. donald trump of course, as a he always, as it goes after the message instead of going after the -- >> do you think that disqualifies him from being the president of the united states? >> this is everybody's personal decision to make. for me, this is a deal breaker for myself. there are plenty of other candidates who, again, will support the policies that i support, that are people that aren't going to have the baggage that donald trump has. the difficulty is, right now, donald trump is looking at real clear politics, he's almost 30 points ahead of the next gop challenger, which is ron desantis. republicans need to rally behind somebody else, not just

the primary, but can win in the general election. >> congresswoman comstock do you believe that this would be a tipping point at all? >> you know, donald trump was vile, disgusting, in the tape was disqualifying. now he's doubled down on, it and i think that you can consider that eight years later, there are a lot of people that never saw that tape, who are now seeing it for the very first time, a young person who is 16 at the time who's now going to be 20 for next year. they're going to see this all over. you're going to see a lot of people who are going to see this, and they're also going to see republican men and women defending, it and being repulsed by our entire party, saying that this kind of thing is okay, saying that the insurrection is okay. saying that donald trump's authoritarian anti-democratic january 6th things are okay. we have repulsed an entire generation with this guy, that they are going to look at and

see this bloated orange guy sitting there saying, you know, it's okay for 1 million years, this is what guys have done to. women they're going to think, what is wrong with this party? it is disqualifying, and if republicans don't wake up and say, let's find somebody else, they are going to lose the general election, and rightfully so. i am proud of that age the had since in his stead after this. i hope that we can go to iowa and catch fire, get some people that realize he's a good and decent person that has been willing to stand up against donald trump. others are doing this also, and i appreciate mitt romney standing up, but people who are mocking the jury, just go home and talk to your wives and daughters. i know that lindsey graham doesn't have a wife or daughter to talk to about it, but if you are talking to any women, women in your district, they do not find this acceptable.

>> it's amazing to see marco rubio, you think back to going to donald trump's small hands, and yet on this, he chose to attack the jury system as an attorney himself. >> listen, i live in a swing, district the swing state. that's where the elections are decided. first of all, donald trump being president is just morally aberrant. this should be opposed on moral grounds. it's also politically stupid. you're not going to win pennsylvania suburbs, michigan suburbs, nevada, arizona, or georgia by supporting trump. if you haven't learned, it we haven't won since 16. a lot of trump voters have died off, but trump has been losing since 16. weijia, i don't know why they think this is going to work, it

hasn't worked. >> barbara comstock, we appreciated. alasdair, thank you so much. next, cnn exclusive, congressman george santos facing federal criminal charges. when it comes to your hair, ingredients matter. that's why herbal essences is packed with naturally derived plant ingredients you love, and none of the stuff you don't. our sulfate-free collections smell incredible... ♪ and leave your hair touchably soft and smooth. ♪ herbal essences this is how tosin lost 33 pounds on noom weight. i'm tosin. noom gave her a psychological approach to weight loss. noom has taught me how you think about food has such a... huge impact on your relationship with it. visit noom.com and start your trial today.

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republican congressman, admitted fabricator, serial liar, jewish impersonator, and a legit dog swindler, george santos. according to sources familiar with the matter, he's expected in court as early as tomorrow. we are joined now with more. what do we know about specific charges that he faces? >> anderson, we don't have word yet on exactly what the charges might be. right, now we do know that they are under seal, but george santos, this republican from new york representing long island and queens, he does face criminal charges being brought by federal prosecutors, and there are a lot of potential things that he could have, what they say is exposure on, but we do know a little bit about this investigation at the very least. we know that federal prosecutors out of the eastern district of new york, say long island, that they were investigating him. also people from the justice departments public integrity

section. anderson, that indicates that it is very likely that he could be facing some liability here related to campaign finance, and specifically what he was telling the federal government campaign finance disclosures. there've been lots of questions about the brokering of a major yacht sale between donors, some money that he had loaned to his campaign, $700,000 or so, that nobody really knew where he got that kind of wealth. there are a lot of questions around that, but we haven't seen those charges. yet we probably won't until he would appear in court, potentially tomorrow. >> and has the congressman or legal team made a statement? >> they have not. his attorney chuck lined to comment whenever they were reached by our reporting team that broke the story tonight, mark morales and evan perez. and then his spokesperson in congress, that's hard, there she is approached by reporters and asked repeatedly, do you have any congress -- do you have any comet for people that the congressman represents. she wouldn't even look at the cameras, let alone provide some sort of response. >> and obviously santos keeps

serving in congress at this point? >> he is allowed to continue serving in congress. there are house rules around what you can actually do as a member, but he's not disqualified. the constitution allows him to keep serving. there have been many people that have served in congress, continue to serve as they face charges, even federal charges, campaign finance related charges. george santos is a very different person than many of them. he's only been in congress for four or five months now. he's already announced that he's running for reelection, and he also has that very long list of apparent lies about his past that have so far even had members of his own party called for his resignation. he's been indignant so far. we will see what happens when he does appear in court to face these charges. >> we appreciated, thank. you joining us now is cnn senior legal analyst, elliott honig, the seventh district of new york. do you think this case will be something campaign finance related? >> anderson i see two possibilities, here based on what's publicly reported. it could be related to campaign finance, we know for example the george santos reported all

manner of expenditures of exactly $199. 99. that is significant because if you spend 200 are over, then you have to give a detailed account. if that is we're not in fact a bunch of 199. 99 expenditures, there could be fraud there. there is also legitimate questions, as kaitlan just, said about where did josh sánchez get his money? he's been asked that question many times. he has never given a straight answer. it could be that there is some charges relating to a fraud or ponzi scheme as well. >> it's not necessarily illegal to lie to voters. what if the lies are designed to get people to donate to the campaign? is that legal? >> no, you're right anderson. it's not a crime to lie to voters about your background, about your past, about what you will or won't do. i suppose at an extreme, there could be a fraud case if you tell a very specific disprove-able lie, in order to raise money. i think the allegations, here knowing the way the prosecutors

usually approach and charge these cases, they're going to be focused on either his statements to the federal election commission, which could be chargeable under perjury, or the way that he made his money, if by fraudulent means. >> what happens next? >> tomorrow george santos will appear in federal court in brooklyn. the eastern district of new york. the indictment will be unsealed, and so then we will know exactly what he is charged with. the judge will advise george santos of the charges against, him he will enter his plea, almost certainly not guilty. the judge will then set bail conditions, george santos will not be locked up pending trial. and then into the case prosecutors will have to turn over the discovery, all of the evidence to george santos. ultimately, anderson either george santos will plead guilty, or he's going to be going to trial to see what a jury says. >> how does the system back the house ethics investigation? obviously federal criminal charges are more serious. does any of this preclude him from serving in congress? >> technically, there's nothing about this that would preclude the house ethics investigation from proceeding. i think the prosecutors would

typically say that the house, stand, and this is more important, let us do what we have to do first. usually, congress would respect that. your second question, anderson, no. there is nothing stopping george santos from serving in congress while this plays out. the only way that congress can get rid of george santos is by voting to expel him. under the constitution the house can throw out its own members by a two thirds about. that is going to require some substantial republican support, in addition to democratic support to get to that two thirds number. , anderson it's worth noting, that is only happened five times in our history. three of them were confederates in the 18 hundreds, and it's only happened twice since then. >> elie honig, thank, you we appreciated. just ahead, why president biden said the situation at the southern u.s. border might become more chaotic. new numbers on just how many migrants might be waiting on the other side of the u.s. southern border, days before the pandemic era restriction used to expel them is set to expire. after the break.

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so they can do more of what matters. benefits. payroll. compliance. trinet. people matter. >> a source tells cnn that the federal government plans to make 155,000 migrants located in shelters and streets in mexican -- several thousand more than estimated earlier this week. this is just two days before covid era public health order

known as title 42 used to quickly expel migrants, set to expire. earlier today, president biden was asked of the administration's prepared for possible rushes of migrants to cross the border during his -- he cited talks today with republicans. >> it remains to be seen, it's going to be chaotic for a while. it's an example, as i raised in the meeting, when they said well, we're going to cut. what happens? if you cut it, are you going to cut people at the border? you're going to cut agents to the border? we need more at the border, not less. >> cnn's rosa flores joins us now from the southern border in el paso, texas. you are there with federal investigations waking up -- what this flyers say? >> those flyers were urging might -- and we have video of this, you can see that it was dark, anderson, i can tell you there

is a lot of confusion because these migrants were sleeping while this was happening. they were just giving them flyers, and then once the migrants realized what this was, then that is when the fear sunk in. a lot of these individuals i had talked to, grown men almost in tears saying that really, all of the reason why they are here in this country is to seek asylum. in their home countries of venezuela they work and they cannot offered food, water, or medicine. anderson? >> did people turn themselves in? >> they did turn themselves in, a lot of them. we actually have video of this, they walked a few blocks from here and according to a source, there were hundreds that turned themselves in this afternoon. cbp has not released official numbers just yet we've asked for them, but the understanding is that if you look around me, we've been on the show anderson. there's a lot more people out here, a clear indication that a lot of those individuals turn

themselves in. >> what happens when they turn themselves in? >> sorry i didn't know he said. >> what happens when they turn themselves in? >> a lot of them when they turn themselves in their very afraid. some of them were shaking, when men it comes to mind that it cannot get off my mind, literally is a man that was shaking. he was holding his phone, he said that his daughter had just called from venezuela, the she was hungry. he was terrified to turn himself in because there was a second round of law enforcement action. it is very different anderson, cause it was in daylight. officers were wearing flak jackets, they said police ice border patrol. it is intimidating for a lot of these migrants to see these officers now verbally asking these individuals to turn themselves into immigration

authorities. like i said a lot of these individuals right now are off the street, they're not here. i've been in communication with some of the ones we've been talking, to the communication has been cut. i haven't heard from them since they went into immigration processing. >> rosa flores, we appreciated, thank you. programming note, tonight on cnn prime time, donald trump's lawyer in the e. jean carroll trial will talk about the jury's decision, their next move, join us for that in the top of the hour. next, the return of democratic senator diane feinstein on capitol hill. eir lawn back fast and you need scotts turf builder rapid grass. it grows grass 2 times faster than just seed alone. giving you a stronger lawn. smell that freedom, eh? pick up a bag at lowe's today. feed your lawn. feed it. here's how tommy lost 30 lbs on noom weight. i'm tom. noom helped him use psychology to lose weight. the mindful aspect made me feel more conscious about what i was eating and why i was eating it. it's actually working. lose weight and make it last with noom weight.

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capitol hill, bringing democrats to the majority in the chamber in the case of the shingles that left her hospitalized at one point. qatar and san francisco. last votive brewery. with absence holding up judicial nominees. tonight, senate majority leader chuck schumer says feinstein is quote, ready to roll perceives and to work. earlier this year she announced she would not announce reelection in 2024. that is it, versus cnn news primetime dana bash starts right now. >> thanks anderson, good, evening i'm dana bash. another unprecedented day in u.s. history, the first former president to be criminally indicted is now also the first former president and current presidential candidate to be found liable for sexual abuse and defamation in a civil trial. also tonight, freshman congressman george santos, the republican who new york, infamous for his cascade of lies was charged by the justice in a federal probe. that news

broke right here on cnn to