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cnn primetime kaitlan collins starts right now. >> anderson, thank you so much. good evening, thank you for joining. about last night. 70 minutes i spent on stage in new hampshire with one former president donald trump. a major inflection point in the republican party search for its nominee. and potentially the starting line for america's next presidential race. it is important to remember that he is right now, the gop front runner. a race he is running as noted we'll be criminally indicted. found civilly liable. and under investigation for everything from his handling of classified documents, to his business empire. also notable, the republican reaction on capitol hill today. to somebody who could easily once again become their party's nominee. >> worried that the parting's leading presidential candidate. >> i don't intend to support him. the republican nomination. >> last, night providing a clear view of where trump

stands on key issues that america is grappling with right now. on the economy, trump casually suggested that the nation default. if president biden does not commit to spending cuts that republicans are demanding to raise the debt ceiling. that is extraordinary, and because of what trump said about the debt ceiling when he was in office but also because the treasury department and economists alike say the whole thing would cause an economic catastrophe and put the u.s. into a recession. >> i disagree. he didn't do it either when he was president. >> i don't agree. it won't be good for the american people to default. >> on democracy, trump refused to accept the results of the last election, which of course is notable given that he is under active investigation still for trying to overturn those results. and who refused to accept the results of the election that he's running for right now. >> i think that people saw last night when they would get with another term of donald trump as president. which is completely

untethered to the truth. >> speaking of active investigations, trump admitted he asked officials in georgia to find 11,000 votes after initially denying that he had asked for them. on his handling of classified documents he suggested that he knowingly took those documents from the white house when he left washington, and suggested it could be possible, he showed them to others. when it comes to january 6th, he suggested that he would pardon rioters who attacked the capitol and didn't rule out for those convicted of sedition conspiracy. >> i think that he should pardon people who engaged. >> anybody who crossed and to the end of the capital under the circumstances that i witnessed firsthand, it is hard for me to have a positive position towards them. >> on the jury decision, found by nine people that he is liable for sexual abuse and defamation, trump once again attacks the writer, e. jean carroll. tonight, her attorney say that if they sue him again, for defamation because of those comments. when it comes to the war in ukraine, trump refused

to say who he wants to win that war, and also refused to say that putin is a war criminal. two vital positions considering the fate of democracy there and how much u.s. aid, funding, and weapons is going into that war zone. >> where i differ with president trump's if we end this war and putin is still standing, he is unaccountable for the war crimes. >> putin is a war criminal. >> i think we've been very clear. about the atrocities in russia that putin has presented to this world. >> of course he's a war criminal. of course ukraine should win. >> on abortion, i asked the former president five times if

he would sign a national abortion ban if he is put into office. he refused to answer. when it comes to the border he also suggest his harsh policies supporting families might return if he returns to the oval office. and if they were not praising or criticizing the president with republicans who prefer silence today. >> do you agree? >> whatever he says or doesn't say, i am not going to weigh in on it. >> i don't want to talk about your town hall. that's anyone wants to talk about. >> maybe most telling was how trump spent most of those 70 minutes defending himself, he was hardly focused on the current event of the oval office. president biden. even as his advisers have urged him to look ahead instead of backwards. >> why should americans put you back in the white house? >> because we did fantastically. we got 12 million more votes than we did, as you know, in 2016. >> joining the table with me tonight, david axelrod, veteran political consultant and former adviser to obama. and -- for the new york times. -- republican strategist and former trump campaign advisor and cnn political commentator and former obama administration official, as well. thank you

for being here. let's star t with you and what you make of how republicans on capitol hill today were responding to that 70 minutes last night. >> i'm actually impressed that a number of them responded the way that they did. first off i thought you did a great job. i think that you did the best job anyone could expect out of anybody going out there against donald trump. to your point -- >> he said that behind your back. but to your point last night, it was trump being trump, as he has always been, and i am disappointed that we did not see something new. like just put everything that happened in 2020, the trial, there are ways to deflect it and put it into the rearview mirror but tell us what you are going to do next. i'm very impressed that we have republicans on the hill and we are willing to at least address the issue. there are some that just don't want to get involved in the noise. so i commend her for that. and let the noise die down and then come out and make a statement later. >> what did you think? >> first of all i just appreciate you being the matador against the bowl. anybody who had a conversation, it is a very hard thing to do. just in normal life let alone in front of millions of people. i also thought it was a re-run, it was a repeat. but i think that you also put it into a position where you revealed some things that people who do not watch him all the time were not aware of. he updated the weaponizing of nostalgia. before it was to make america great again from the 50s. that is very appealing to people who still, today, it is a rough

period. he's now moved up. no, make america great again from just two years ago. just two years ago it was great. it was perfect, everything was wonderful. if he stays there where he is praising his own past and putting the future and that is dangerous. so i think that now, democrats just have to look at it, we could start getting away. i think a lot of democrats have not left him for a few years. it is shocking how terrible this is but also he sees the virus mutating. >> what did you think? especially given obviously, one of the arguments he's been making lately is maybe he will just make the republican primary debates because he's so far ahead in the polls. but he didn't spend a lot of time last night talking about biden or his record. >> i was very struck by that. when he tried repeatedly to get under scan. you never let him, that was a briefing room version of you we saw over many years. i think that he was -- look, he went in there, and me and my colleagues have been hearing, he is going to start pivoting towards biden. that's where the energy is going to be. you, know if he's essentially running as an

incumbent donald trump. so there is not really a republican feel, he does not want to give out to his challengers. he can't stop defending himself or talking about himself so consequently, he spent almost no time talking about biden. it was very little. that would be a problem for him. and that is his problem for years. he wants to talk about himself in the past. and you know, i think that his folks still feel good about the contrast that he can show or they think he could show with

biden, in terms of doing a format like that, i think that they still think that he i s going to be able to try to appear dominant, or strong and he's going to try to draw a weakness, and contrast with biden. again, this primary is not over. we should not suggest that. but i think that is where they are going to be looking. what i also am struck by, he can't help himself on wanting to mix it up and wanting to be on stage. so, yes i understand

that he's been doing a lot of debate. i think there is a real chance he skips one or two. it's very hard for me to imagine him seeing a bunch of republicans onstage talking about him saying you know what? i am going to sit this one out. >> what is your sense of how republicans are responding to what you saw today, and also the fact that the white house to meet me was like, for more years than this? >> to your last point, a lot of americans do not share this view on what those years were like. those years were chaotic. they were exhausting. the more you see of trump as we saw him last night, the more it brings that back. i think that is strategically, smart of them to do. in terms of how the republicans reacted i think just as a reality check, they reacted the way that they did because as they have been four years, they are fearful of trump's base. which is the

dominant force in republican politics today. and he is in fact, i think a fairly substantial front runner in this race. there are a lot of republicans who share their views who wish it weren't so. but you've heard it in that room. people said it sounds like a trump rally. it sounded like a trump rally because cnn assembled a representative group of republicans in new hampshire. it has 50% in the polls and new hampshire. the governor of the state is at 11 in those same polls. he is in a dominant position. so what you saw were a lot of politicians who just didn't want to deal with it, and didn't want to

comment on it. some of them who tucked into -- i hate to be manu raju who must feel like he's carrying the plague or something, because every time people see him, this time the door shut. but they do not want to talk about it because we do not want to offend his base. one of the things opponents are going to have to decide is are they going to continue to play that game? i saw tim scott running into one of those doors. are you going to continue to let him behave originally, and have nothing to say about it? is that really a winning formula if you are running for president? >> i think that there is some element of what you are saying, and i recall back in 2015, the same thing what's going. when i was with dr. carson's campaign and everybody wanted to talk about what trump was doing, and they would ask every single one of the 18 of us that were on the ballot at the time, and they would ask people on the health, what do you think about trump? at the time the answer was there is no way this guy's going to win the primary. we cannot put up with this, let's talk about serious issues. i think to some extent, some of

these members now, you showed is simple clipping of some of the members that we talked about. i don't know how many overall, but i think that there is some element of, we've got serious business while we have to deal with right now. that is the last thing i want to be talking about. >> yeah, but the problem is it is the last thing that they want to be talking about in large measure because there is nothing to say. what i was really struck by today, two things. the volume of headlines you just showed, it was important for people to hear where he is on positions as opposed to just the small group of reporters who are on the plane with him, who are the occasional interview that he does, or what have you. number, one that was important. number two, the number of people who didn't want to say anything. or it would have been more vocal in recent months. who had been speaking out about trump but didn't today, and didn't last night, because i do think that is a strength in his primary. they see him heading in a certain direction. >> i think it is a wake up call. people have been very critical, how can you platform this, how can you do this, this

thing's happen. donald trump is back, and he is real. the fact that the mainstream media has not paid attention, or has tried to ignore, it does not mean that it is not true. i think people are aware that it is back, it is real. >> to this point that in 2015, 2016, people would not respond. they didn't think it was serious, and so on. the guy became president of the united states! so i think what we saw last night was that some of the -- look, i am not endorsing his behavior, and certainly i am not endorsing the lying, and all of that stuff. but clinically speaking, his performance skills are pretty substantial. and he knows his base, and he knows how to tickle the funny bone of his space, and he has made himself a martyr, incredibly, and now i am beginning to think, rather than -- that will slow his wagon down, his indictments are going to serve as proof that he is somehow being victimized by the deep state who are trying to stop him from winning. >> and on that front, one thing to notice is that these are either people who are republicans, or independents who are voting in the new hampshire republican primary. that is what they are called there. these people --

i've been 2 million trump rallies covering them, it was not that kind of crowd when you speak to how they were laughing when he was making fun of e. jean carroll. there were certainly people who felt uncomfortable with that. but on the front of what he said about e. jean carroll and her attorney saying maybe they will sue him again for defamation, he was just ordered to pay $5 million, also the documents seeming, unknowingly, do you think he could open himself up to more legal exposure? >> i do a double take in the newsroom when you asked him that question any i'm sure the way he did. that was a very specific moment of the town hall. the second half, we were both standing, his entire body language changed, and it is not a topic that he likes. it is a topic he is very worried about. and he walked himself into trouble. he said, you know, i took them, i'm allowed to. he has done slight variations of that before but not like that. and those noticeably, he would not rule out definitively that he did not show people classified material in his possession. and you know, not

that i could recall. it was a very legal iron sir. as you know, investigators have been asking multiple witnesses questions about whether he showed him. >> that really is not exactly it. he may have been told to say i don't recall, but not really is not like i don't recall. i would think that -- i think his political advisers who are focused on mailing this nomination were very happy with what happened last night, and his lawyers were appalled. >> many of them in the documents case had become witnesses himself. i'm not even sure how much briefing went on because of that. i agree with that. but i think it was a big area of trouble. i also think that he walked himself into problematic comments and he was enjoying it, mocking e. jean carroll, we will see what happens with that, but again going back to why it is important for people to hear where voters are, that evoked laughter. that evoked, you know, everyone was surprised the

access hollywood tape which was related to this tape in this case which he defended, because he defended the deposition in this case. people were surprised at the time. i remember republicans, maybe kelly, standing up at rallies and getting booed by republican voters because they were critical of him. this is still there, and it is a growing strain, and it is important for people to understand it. >> thank you so much. really turn to the border. right now agents are working to maintain order on the night that major policy allowing them to quickly expel migrants is set to expire. how bad the crossing could get in the days and weeks could come yes we were alive on both sides of the border, less than three hours to go until title 42 expires, after being in place for three years, next. >> we have done all we can to your best defense against erosion and cavities is strong enamel- nothing beats it. new pronamel active shield actively shields the enamel to defend against erosion and cavities. i think that this product is a

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was that trump era policy that allowed border patrol agents to quickly expel migrants from the u.s. on public health grounds. but after tonight, homeland security secretary alejandro mayorkas is saying the consequences forecasting are going to be even greater. >> if anyone arrives at our southern border after midnight tonight, they will be presumed ineligible for asylum and subject to steeper consequences for unlawful entry. i want to be very clear our borders are not open. >> that warning coming today as we have live coverage for you on both sides of the u.s. southern border tonight. david colbert, is -- we're gonna start with ed lavandera who's, live in elton paso. what are you seeing, not just on the mexico side but also the u.s. side? >> as you alluded to there, caitlin, there has been a steady stream of migrants coming across the u.s. southern border and the hours ahead of

title 42. here in el paso these are people who have been processed by border patrol agents and they have permits to stay here, to enter into united states. the question is, how will they be able to go, to be here in the united states? they'll be going through the asylum process. not everyone is granted at. but this is a very dramatically different scene we are seeing here outside of one of the shelters. just a few days ago. this area was packed with hundreds and hundreds of people. dhs officers came through warning them that if they do not have the proper paperwork that they would be expelled and rounded up from here. and that has really reduce the numbers you are seeing on the street. but up and down the u.s. southern border you are seeing cities bracing for what is coming here. but the head of the border patrol, the border patrol chief today is saying that he doesn't think that we're going to see these vast numbers of 15 to 18,000 people being apprehended per day, that was anticipated. right now the numbers are about 10, 000, which is still extraordinarily high, but the border patrol chief is saying that perhaps we're not gonna get to those peak numbers that they had been

anticipating. >> notable to hear from him that those expectations have changed. we'll see how they monitor. and, keep us monitored on that. david, you're on the other side. what are you seeing there on the ground? >> at the point we're starting to see numbers go down behind me and it's probably best to see it from above so let me show you from our drone. we can take you over across the rio grande, that's the marker between the u.s. and mexico, and as we then take you to look into mexico into the u.s. you are looking for mexico and you're looking at a group of families, mostly, families who have been divided by texas national guard and cvp and they've been putting in this grouping and they've been processing quickly your last pr few hours. if you look a little farther there's another group and that's mostly single man and they have been kept there as families been processed and what is not clear yet is all the families start processing the single man or they'll put them back on buses and bring

them back over to the mexico side. which we've seen in response. they've done that, where they have simply drove them across the border and release them here, and mexico of course is agreed to accommodate those expulsions. but once it about three hours from now title 42 is totally lifted of course title eight kicks in and that means those who are not qualifying for asylum will face serious repercussions. they could be barred from the u.s. for five years. >> for ideas before they can reapply. keep us it updated. the reality for many people despite what they've been told is the getting into the u.s. is likely to beautiful tougher, as david was noting noting, with the expiration of title 42. the biden ministration's increases of expedited removal, which, essentially means that people are deported before they get to see an immigration judge. overall deportation numbers have been climbing. they still lag behind the pace at both behind biden and trump barack

obama and trump. biden's rules make it harder to grand asylum. for example anyone who does it make an appointment at a port of entry first will be presumed ineligible. migrants will have to prove that they were denied asylum in countries they passed through before they got to the u.s. southern border. unlike the trump era policy, which carry no additional consequences for repeated crossing attempts, biden's rules include a five-year ban on reentry for anyone caught crossing the border, seeking to cross the border before they have done so. we're joined now by former acting secretary of homeland security under former president trump, chad wolf. chad, thank you so much for joining us tonight. and i disagree with how the biden ministration is handling this, but i think it raises the question of, if you are still running dhs, how you would specifically have been preparing for this. >> i have been preparing for over two years now, so when i hear phrases, like it's going

to be a chaotic, seen it doesn't need to be that way. there's a number of things that you can do from a policy standpoint to drive some deterrence and consequence into the system so that you don't have 200,000 folks trying to cross the border illegally. you've got to shift into ports of entry, into legal pathways, and so over the course of two years that just hasn't been occurring. we haven't impose those consequences on individuals, and we really haven't put the policies in place to help drivers individuals into those legal pathways. and so we know that the asylum systems being abused. the hr says this. we see other folks say this, but we actually haven't done anything about it. so there's a number of things that could be occurring today to drive this crisis and to really reduce it to something that's more orderly at the border and it's just not happening, unfortunately. >> we've seen this new asylum moves coming from the biden ministration. what we are talking about, they're essentially, the severely limit those who can claim asylum if they don't first seek

protection by country they pass through or by applying online. but we've heard from some legal experts saying they think they could face challenges. do you think will face challenges? >> well, it certainly could, and again the trump administration, we had a similar rule but not the same rule, a similar rule that was challenged in court. biden ministration at the beginning of their term decided not to defend that accord. had they, we would had two years of rules like this in effect that would, again, would help lessen this crisis. i think the difference with the biden administration's rules, the number of excess perceptions of loopholes. it doesn't apply to children, doesn't apply to families. if you can't access the cbp one app it exempts you from the rule. so there are so many loopholes that i have seen during my time as acting secretary. the more loopholes the more exceptions that you do to these types of rules, the more people take advantage of those rules. as you start to understand this, the cartels, and they'll start to coach people to take advantage of

those. so we'll see if the rule is successful. only time will tell. but i certainly have doubts about it, given what i have read about it in my experience. >> there have been some issues with some app. migrants have limited access to internet, and whatnot. i want to ask you about something the former boss, former president trump said to be last night. we were talking about his what his immigration process would look like if you were put back in office in 2024. he didn't rule out the idea of reinstating that zero tolerance immigration policy of separating planets to cross the border. do you believe that he should've ruled something like that out? >> i'm like president trump speak for himself, of course, but the idea of course was zero tolerance was holding people accountable for regular. we hear the biden ministration calling on those terms today, is, what is that deterrence and what is that consequence for individuals breaking the law? and that is what's not occurring, unfortunately, on the border today. that's why you continue to see so many repeat offenders. you see individuals who have been returned idle fully 42, only to come back two or three days later because there is no consequence. and so that's what we've got to get back into the

system. once in individual's charter understand, if you cross the border illegally, you're gonna be detained in you're gonna be removed back to your home country if you don't qualify for asylum. and as soon as folks understand that, i think that's when you continue to see the numbers drop and you see a lot more order come out of this chaos. >> but chad, it was an incredibly inhumane policy. it's separated children from their parents. isn't there a way to enforce the laws without separating kids from their parents? >> look, i think there's a number of ways to enforce the law. you've got to remember, over the last two years, under this administration, over 365,000 children have come across that border without parents. without supervision. without any guardians. these families have decided to separate themselves, before they're even cross this border, because of the policies of this administration. so we can talk about that, but i am ready to focus on, how do we secure the border, ho people accountable while still giving

those protections to those that truly need it and actually qualify, which is a very small percentage. i think that's the system we need to get to. we're not there yet. and i don't think cs getting there under this administration, with these policies over the last two years. >> some children are still separated from the parents today and unable to find. i'm chedworth, thank you for joining us tonight. as title 42 is set to expire. we will see how it handled at the border. also tonight, he could potentially face charges in georgia. so last night i pressed former president trump about that phone call at the heart of the election interference probe. >> if this call was banned, i question the election. i don't ask him to find. anything -- >> when we come back, the man on the other and that infamous

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>> having a normal call, nobody said og, he should've said that. if this call was banned, i question the election. you >> asked me to remind you. notes >> i didn't ask him to find anything. >> we heard the audience. you >> asked him to find you. votes >> all i want to do is this. i just want to find 11,780 votes. which is one more than we have. because we won the state. >> the video you just saw, it was former president trump last night denying, asking georges republican secretary of state, brad raffensperger, to find him votes before conceding that he didn't ask him to find him votes, and then you heard president trump in january of 2021, directly asking raffensperger to find him those votes. joining us now, brad raffensperger, georgia secretary of state. thank you for joining us tonight. what was your reaction when you heard those comments last night? >> well, president trump said i

didn't hang up on the phone call. you have to understand, i have been taught, and i believe in respecting peoples positional authority no matter what that level or office they hold. but he held the office of president of united states of america and that office tiller deserves respect. whenever you have a conversation with president united states of america. >> so that's why you didn't hang up, not because, what was it he was essentially suggesting was that if you and your attorneys, who were on the call, i should note, which was also recorded, actually felt something was wrong that you would have hung up in a moment. but you are saying you didn't because it was the president united states on the other line. >> i wouldn't hang up on a governor, senator, congressman, person, i just respect peoples positional authority. i think that's one of the things we have going on in america right now. we have lost respect in the offices the people hold. and i think that we should have

respectful conversations at all times. >> when he says that he was just calling into question the results of the election, claiming he wasn't asking you to find him anything, that's obviously not true. we have all heard the call. >> i gave him all the facts. he said at the karl there's 5000 dead people that were alleged to have voted. they sued us on 2315. i told him there was. two we found two more. he said that those under age voters, 66, 000, there were zero. there are thousands of felons, there are less than 74. 2400 on registered voters. there's actually zero. but caitlin, what is interesting, is that i didn't realize until just recently, that it was reported in the newspaper that he actually had paid berkeley

research group, spent over $600,000 for them to look into this, and he had that report the day before he called. and then just a few weeks ago he heard about he paid some patrick oh about $750, 000, and they also came back and said there was not sufficient enough fraud to overturn this race. so he had the facts. and then he called. >> there was a report from the washington post. he had those facts call, do you, you explained again to him the numbers, but do you believe he was strong arming you, using your office to get him votes that he did not learn from voters? >> i knew that we didn't have the votes. we know that we checked out everything. every single allegation. in fact he handpicked bobby christie, his attorney to come out to atlanta and specifically look at the fulton county counting of the absentee ballots that went on election night. and bobby christine is a acting u.s. attorney of the northern district did not find fraud there and then report that back to the president. and so every time that there's an allegation we did our checking so we could report back to the voters. we report, i report back to the voters. i want all the voters to understand that we won a fair, honest, election and that's my job, to make sure that they have confidence in

the results. >> what do you make of him saying that he would make that same call again to you today despite the fact that the dea there his heads charges could come this summer? >> we'll, if he did he'd get the same answer. in fact, now we have even more data points that just show that president trump did come up short. so what happened in georgia, and i think it may have happened in other states, but in georgia we know, 24,000 voters skipped the presidential race. they didn't vote for any of the three candidates for president, and yet they voted down ballot in other races. and that's why president trump came up short. in fact, what you saw is actually a republican congressman got 33,000 more votes collectively. 30,000 votes more than president trump. >> you've been clear that you follow the numbers, but you say i am a republican. you've noted before that you would've wanted republican to win that election. there's at her republicans to have someone who is right now the gop front runner, that is still denying

the results of the election, including in your state? >> i think that when people run for office they should be looking forward, because that's what we're gonna be looking spending our future time. that's really where people are looking at. what's gonna happen next week what's gonna happen next, year what your plans for the future. so when people run campaigns, it should be really looking towards the future, not just looking back. and talking about stolen election claims, which had been disproven. >> brad raffensperger, george is probably consecutively estate, your name was spoken many times last night. thank you for joining us tonight. >> thank you caitlin. >> tommy tuberville is under fire tonight for his remarks that his office is now trying to walk back. did he advocate for white nationalists in the military? we'll talk about those remarks next. if you don't stain your deck, it's like the previous owner is still hanging around. so today let's stain, with behr, the #1 rated stain. and make your deck, yours.

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his office are trying to do some cleanup tonight after he seemed to take up the case -- the cause of white nationalist, i should note, being able to serve in the military. -- tommy tuberville in an interview he did last week. >> democrats are attacking our military. so, we need to get out the white extremists, the white nationalists, the flu don't believe in our agenda, in joe biden's agenda. >> you mentioned the biden administration trying to being in the military -- do you believe they should allow white nationalists in the military? >> well, they call them that. i call them american. >> his office then tried to explain, that comment, and least a statement to aol dot com, saying tuberville's quote show that he was being skeptical of the notion that there are white nationalists in

the military, not that he believes they should be in the military. senator tuberville also spoke off camera to cnn earlier today saying quote, here is the problem, democrats portrayal maga republicans as white nationalists. that's not true. we have a lot of great people in the military that are my guess is. that's what i was talking about. davin david, jason, and van are back with me tonight. >> look, it was clear what he was saying. and it's hard to walk that back. michael jackson couldn't moonwalk that one back. there is a terrorist threat in our country. and it is violent and it is killing people. it is corrupting the minds of young people. it is massive. the fbi is terrified. and he is downplaying. it and it should not be in our military. and he knows that. now for him to ignore a terrorist threat in our country that is participating in our military, to try to score some kind of anti woke points, if that's what he was doing -- it wrong to do that.

but i'm not sure that is what he was doing. we've got to have a much serious and conversation -- this is not about wokeism. you can feel whatever you want to about that. this is a terrorist movement that is going in our country, shooting people down in the models, in synagogues, in churches. it should be talked about in those terms always. >> there are a lot of conservative service members. that's a separate thing here. what he was trying to say here was democrats painting them all as white nationalists. but there is a white nationalist problem in the military, and it's the military that says, that talks about those issues that they're having. >> look, as a -- i don't pretend know auburn speak. but i'm going to give coach tougher ville tuberville -- white nationalists or americans. i think he would freely admit that white nationalism is a problem and it's despicable just like many of us do. i question why we have to use the term maga republicans. can we just be republicans or

conservatives? but they do you think there is data out there that even the department of defense is investigated this issue, saying that there is a small -- very small problem, i think it's like 0.05% according to the d.o.t. zone data on this. regardless, it's problem. it's a problem that there is any white nationalism out there, just as there is anti-american behavior, just as there is in many other areas. but i don't think tuberville should bear the brunt of the criticism in saying that what he was referring to in this case was that white nationalists are americans. because i think if you read the purse first part of it, that's what they call them. and i think he could've used his words a lot better and maybe -- >> you are laughing. >> it's very kind words -- >> it's charitable. >> this would be more compelling if this was the first time that the coach had fumbled the ball. but he has a history of doing this around race. around race. >> his comments -- >> around race.

so, i just want to echo what has been said around this table. we have a problem with white extremism, violent extremism in this country. some of it was reflected on january 6th, and some of the participants in that, you talk to people in the military. you talk to people who work in the veterans community and there is a problem with radicalization among those groups. no, it's not about conservatism. >> at all -- >> people can have the views they have. and that's right and it's proper and we should defend that. but there is a problem. and it's dangerous. and the fbi director i spoke about this. the department of homeland security has spoken about this. this is a problem. and if you're a serious person in a high position in the united states government, you have a responsibility to be serious about this. >> yeah, first term u.s.

senator, he is in that serious position. it also comes as he's holding up military nominations. it's 196, i believe, something that even the republican leader in the senate, mitch mcconnell has criticized, he's holding them up because he doesn't like a pentagon policy where they would have service members be on leave where they would have travel if they are in a state where they can't get an abortion. he's holding it up because of that. and -- concerned about military recruitment. >> yeah. i saw schumer's statement on today saying, disavow the statement you made yesterday and released nominations. they're two completely different things. tuberville, whether i agree with him or not, is saying the u.s. government, should not be paying paid leave and travel expenses for somebody to get a procedure that, quite frankly, i thought the hyde amendment had taken care of, and that's not. allowed >> to jeopardize the security of the entire country there are other ways to exercise your views on those issues he's. holding hostage the ability of the president united states to be the

commander-in-chief over this issue, and it goes to his judgment. which i think was founding again lacking yesterday. >> i think that's a little, i mean -- look, i get it. >> these positions are important. it's the chief of staff of the army, nsa director, the commander of u.s. cyber command. >> serious stuff, man. >> -- yes, he's holding up nominations. but all these people have acting in front of their name. they are all sitting there in that position. it's not as dire as people are saying it is. and that's probably why tuberville is saying, you know what? you are going to have to play ball with me a little bit. >> i'm going to disagree with you, though. the leaders of the military, who -- i think this is a hindrance to them. so, i take their word for. it was pretty clear to me is that he's trying to put -- alabama has a very strict law relative to abortion. he is signifying, for his base, but he's doing it at the expense of

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>> we are now learning there are no talks tomorrow between president biden and congressional leaders to avert the nation's potential first ever default -- agreed to meet early next week instead and they basically argue there was not enough progress made at this point for them to meet again. what default would mean, though, would be dire consequences for millions of americans with ripple effects, not just here in the united states, but across the globe. the government would no longer be paid everyone, from social security recipients, to federal employees, to veterans. your 401(k) would take a direct hit. the u.s. credit rating would most likely be downgraded, which would send interest rates higher. but perhaps one of the biggest takeaways from last night's town hall, was former president trump's advice to his own party. before i play that i want you to listen to how president trump, when he was still in the oval office, felt about lawmakers using the debt

ceiling as a negotiating tactic. >> i said, i remember to senator schumer, and nancy pelosi, would anybody ever use that to negotiate with? they said absolutely not. that's a sacred element of our country. they can't use the debt ceiling to negotiate. >> it's a sacred element of our country. that's fast forward to now. >> i say to the republicans out -- there congressman, senators -- if they don't give you massive cuts, you are going to have to do a default. >> mister president, you think the u.s. should default if the white house does not agree to the spending cuts -- >> we might as well do it now, because you will do it later. >> you want said that using the debt ceiling is as a negotiating wedge just could not happen. you said that -- >> that's when i was president. >> so, now is it different now that you are out of office? >> because now i'm not president. >> -- president biden would be an

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>> thanks so much for joining us. the news continues right here on cnn. >>