tonight, elizabeth holmes, once a silicon valley icon, and the youngest self-made female billionaire, reporting to prison to begin her 11-year sentence. it was a stunning downfall for holmes. she was 19 years old when she dropped out of stanford to found the blood testing start-up theranos. eagerly she played the role of tech boss, magazine covers, a lot of awards. she made the point to look the part wearing black turtlenecks in a nod to steve jobs. it fell apart in 2014 when is the "wall street journal" revealed theranos was smoke and mirrors, found guilty of defrauding investors, and tonight she begins to pay the price. "ac 360" starts now.

and good evening. on "360" tonight, debt ceiling drama. closed door meeting going on with house republicans, which could determine if the bill makes to it the floor, and if speaker kevin mccarthy keeps his job. also tonight, an interview with the 11-year-old boy who called 911 for help and got shot by the police officer who responded. and succession is over, but tonight kindle is talking. actor jeremy strong joins me with a behind-the-scenes lo riv any. the criticism kevin mccarthy is facing from some members of his own party as he and president biden race to extend the debt ceiling. given how toxic the deal with some of the more extreme members, every step mccarthy takes to pass it could put his speakership in jeopardy. melanie zanona with the latest. what is it you're hearing from house republicans whereby this is headed? >> reporter: the house is on the verge of clearing at least one

procedural hurdle, because the house rules committee is expected to advance a rule which would allow the bill to come to the floor tomorrow, despite opposition from two conservatives on the panel. so that is a big sigh of relief for leadership. but they still have to actually pass the underlying bill on the house floor. and there has been opposition from both the far left and the far right. so leadership has been working behind the scenes to sell this deal, to whip this deal. house democrats have expected to huddle tomorrow with members of their party leadership, as well as white house officials. and house republicans are meeting right now behind closed doors. we're told kevin mccarthy as he entered the meeting got a standing ovation. people were cheering for him. he said "let's have some fun." but we are expecting him to have to make a very forceful pitch for this deal he worked out with president biden. but despite the opposition from his right flank, he is expressing confidence that they'll be able to get it over the finish line. >> so president biden calls this a compromise. progressives are concerned about some things. so are conservatives. can you explain the top lines that are in the bill?

>> anderson, first and foremost, this would hike the debt ceiling until the beginning of 2025, which means they won't have to deal with this until the next presidential election. it also imposes limits on future spending. and they would keep the levels roughly flat for nondefense discretionary spending. and then there are a number of other priorities that got into the bill. work requirements, a key sticking point in the negotiations. what they ultimately agreed to was to impose new work requirements, a new age for recipients of food stamps. but at the same time, they also expanded the exemptions for people for work requirements. the cbo estimate that that will expand the eligibility for those requirements. and then a couple other things they got in there is clawing back irs funding, clawing back unspent covid money. and they also are going to put an end to the pause on student loan repayments. a number of different things in there. but the top line, hiking the debt ceiling and limiting spending, anderson. >> and the threats to kevin mccarthy's speakership, how real are they?

there. >> have been a couple of conservatives that have threatened to use the motion to vac vacate. dan bishop said it absolutely should be on the table. congressman roy said they need to rethink their leadership structure. they're very upset with this decision making. if the majority of republicans oppose the bill on the house floor, that it would automatically trigger a motion to vacate, because that would violate an agreement that kevin mccarthy made in his quest to become speaker. but i will tell you that talking to a wide swath of members, there is not a wide appetite to remove mccarthy, at least not yet. and leadership is expecting that they are going to be able to get a majority of their conference on board, which is why kevin mccarthy says this bill is going to pass, and he is going to keep his job. anderson? >> all right. melanie, thanks very much. joining us right now south dakota republican congressman dusty johnson, who helped negotiate the deal. he chairs the republican main street caucus, which describes itself as a group of pragmatic conservatives dedicated to getting things done.

that's what it says on the website. congressman, we appreciate you joining us. you have just come from the gop caucus. what are your congressmen saying and do you think it will pass the house? >> i will tell you i've talked to dozens of members in the last couple days. they've read through the 99-pang bill. i think they're excited about $2 trillion worth of savings, and they're excited about unlocking american energy with permitting reform. of course you have loud voices opposed. but welcome to washington. we don't let anything be easy around here. >> one i assume you're talking about loud and colorful, congressman bat gates, that it would be a violation of the deal speaker mccarthy made to get the gavel in the first place and would like lie trigger in his words immediate motion to vacate. do you actually think that a majority get the majority? >> a majority of republicans will support this bill. other than the $2 trillion worth of savings that i mentioned and

the unlocking of american energy, it's also the largest ever clawback of funds from the executive branch. and the work requirements that melanie mentioned, which is a big part of growing this economy. you're going to have certainly some republicans vote no, but the majority are going to back the speaker, and they're going to back this, which is the best debt ceiling deal the republicans had ever cut. >> right now i think congressman dan bishop is the only one, the first one to explicitly say he is considering a push to oust congressman mccarthy as the speaker. i think chip roy hasn't gone that far, but said, as melanie said, they're going to need to relook at how our leadership structure is in place. do you expect any others to try to challenge mccarthy? >> frankly, most members of the house freedom caucus are trying to tamp down that kind of speculation. i think they understand that we've got a lot of things we still have to get done in this, the 118th congress. and having another 15-round leadership battle in the middle of it would not be helpful to

actually putting more conservative wins on the board. but i'd also say this. kevin mccarthy is not in any way scared of this conversation. admittedly, the media is talking about it a lot more than members of congress are. but when the media ask him about motion to vacate and internal political machinations, he is focused on one thing, avoiding default and cutting this $2 trillion worth of spending. we're going get it done tomorrow. >> the reaction to the deal seems mostly favorable. certainly to moderates from both parties as members of the house freedom caucus, the complaint it doesn't do enough cutting requirements to work assistance from government programs. is this true? president biden calls this a compromise. you're saying essentially the democrats gave this away. >> listen, i don't want to insult the other half of the negotiation. i mean, they were smart people. this was clearly an environment, though, anderson, where president biden made a major strategic miscalculation in refusing to negotiate for 97 days. it drifted us really close to

the deadline. i think it caused many americans to believe that he was being stubborn and intransigent. it really put his negotiators in a weaker position than if they just would have come to the table 100 days ago. as a result, i think republicans got a lot of concessions. frankly, i don't think you can argue. the republicans clearly got more concessions out of this debt ceiling deal than any other deal that's been done. >> congressman, i appreciate your time tonight. thank you. >> thank you. >> congressman johnson. presidential politics now. take a look at church in clive, iowa west of des moines. florida governor ron desantis, who recently said he would oppose the debt deal if he were still in congress, speaking there right now. his first official stop in the campaign. part of a three-state swing which also includes new hampshire, south carolina, and follows what was, as you might have seen, are rough and buggy debut on twitter last week. cnn's jeff zeleny is traveling with theed can, joins us now. so what was the governor talking about tonight? what was the message? >> anderson, we're finally see florida governor ron desantis, you can see speaking behind me

here, wrapping up his first campaign event in person. and voters have indeed been waiting for what he has to say. and one of those appointments he made tonight, i'll lower my voice as he is speaking here, he was really speaking out against the debt deal. he said he believes republicans negotiated too much. they gave up too much in terms of spending. he stopped well short of urging members of congress to vote against this deal, which of course could lead to a default. of course, he has the luxury of not being forced to cast a vote on this. but he did talk about spending. one thing he did not talk about tonight, at least so far in the first 30 or 35 minutes of his speech is anything about donald trump. for the last several days, he has been sharpening his criticism of the former president, saying he simply did not get the job done at the border. he did not get the job done in terms of bringing down the deficit. we have not heard anything about that so far tonight. he simply said leadership is not entertainment. perhaps a veiled reference to the former president. but anderson, the iowa republicans in the audience here

are hungering for an alternative to donald trump. of course, donald trump still has his supporters here. perhaps 30% or so of the republican base. as you can see behind me here, people are cheering. they're applauding his deeply conservative message. this is the first stop of a two-day swing here in iowa. he'll be going on to new hampshire, south carolina as well. the donald trump also coming to iowa two days from now to have a rebuttal if you will against ron desantis. >> overall, what's been the reaction. we're hearing a lot of applause there, reaction of people you've talked to. >> so far the reaction has been really strong. the republicans here who are attending here, of course that's not the full universe of republican caucusgoers who open the primary contest next year, they're looking for an alternative. for those who are looking for an alternative, they like what they've seen from governor desantis. so looking beyond the botched twitter roll-out, looking beyond some of the hiccups that have come, a lot of the republican

voters we've been speaking to tonight want to see if he is strong enough to con front and take on donald trump. they don't necessarily want to see a food fight, in the words of one woman i talked to here, one republican voter who said she simply believes the party must move on from trump. but the question is are there so many republican candidates getting into the race now, does that complicate their effort. but for now, at least, many republicans here like what they see from the florida governor, and he is just beginning to introduce himself as this race intensifies. >> appreciate it. thank you. coming up next, how russia is reacting to the drone strike in moscow and what ukraine is saying about it. also, my conversation with james comey about republican claims the bureau has been weaponized against conservatives. why he thinks the former president is an existential threat to the rule of law, in his words, and an even greater threat now than he was before. and later, "succession" may be over, but i'm not over it. kendell roy, actor jeremy strong joins us for a behind-the-scenes

look at the incredible finale. the remarkable end of this epic show.

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fog interest start of ukraine's expected counter-offensive. more on all of it from cnn's sam kiley. >> reporter: same war, different capital. moscow hit by a squadron of eight drones. >> translator: there was a deafening bang, as though a huge ball of lightning had struck somewhere near. >> reporter: the attack was immediately blamed on ukraine, which reels daily from russian air assaults. >> translator: this morning the kyiv regime carried out a terrorist attack on the moscow region, and i will stress, aimed at civilian targets. in total, eight airplane type drones were used. all of them were brought down." >> reporter: kyiv was coy about its role in this drastic escalation. >> of course, we enjoy watching and predicting an increase in attacks. but of course we have nothing directly to do with it. what is growing in russia is the comic payment it will pay more

highly for everything it does in ukraine. >> reporter: ukraine is threatening an offensive to drive russian troops out. part of its tactics have been increased efforts to destabilize moscow's forces. a cross-border raid by anti-putin dissidents was backed by ukraine last week. frequent attacks on russian occupied logistic hubs like mariupol and now a mysterious drone attack that russia has blamed on ukraine. >> translator: though i'm more worried not by this, but by efforts to provoke a russian response. that appears to be the aim. they are provoking us to do the same." >> reporter: but this is the first drone attack by anyone on moscow outside the kremlin. here kyiv attacked for the 17th time this month. putin's generals now know they face attacks on ukraine's front lines and at home.

>> and sam joins me now from eastern ukraine. what is the latest on when ukraine's long anticipated counter-offensive will start? >> well, anderson, just today there have been yet more border crossings and artillery shelling by ukraine into russian -- excuse me, into russian territory itself, being seen as yet another precursor to an offensive. and president zelenskyy himself has said that the logistics are there. the weapons are there, the men are there, and that he has decided on a date. when that date is, we still don't know. >> all right. sam kiley, thanks. this next item certainly russia related, a less ominous feel to it. the central figure is a whale, and the key question is whether or not it's involved in espionage. cnn's melissa bell reports. >> reporter: the alleged russian spy was first spotted off the

waters of norway in 2019. a beluga whale apparently seeking human attention it quickly received. nicknamed valdimir, a pun on whale, it appeared to be wearing a harness with mounts for a camera. experts believe it may have been trained by the russian military, which moscow denies. dolphins have long been used by russian and the u.s. navy, patrolling and detecting explosives beside humans. since his arrival in norway, he has been tracked by volunteers who want to protect him. >> we fear that if he did enough damage to a salmon farm, they may be forced into considering the option of euthanizing him, as we've seen with other sedations in norway. but by all means, this does not mean that we think the salmon

farmers have anything but goodwill towards valdimir. >> reporter: and he has been capturing scandinavian hearts. a whale that appear morse accustomed to humans than his own kind, and now much farther south than he should be. far from heading back to arctic waters where he might have found some of his own kind, he is headed south, all the way to the coast of sweden, according to the ngo one whale, where waters are too warm and too populated for a whale who may have been used to spy but is now being very carefully watched himself. >> melissa bell joins us now. are there other claims of russia training marine animals? >> there are, anderson. this is a practice that goes back to the cold war. and what we saw at the time when russia first annexed crimea back in 2014 is that they very quickly announced that the combat dolphin program that had been run by ukraine would be diverted toward the russian navy.

we've also seen now some images that show just after the invasion some fresh dolphin pens being placed outside that port at sebastopol, the most important russian port in the black sea. so the idea that that was also being done to the arctic north. it is a practice also with the u.s. navy. these are simply animals that are very good at finding things that are underwater on the seabed and helping in demining operations. what's been happening with this particular whale these last few weeks and months, anderson, is that he has been heading south much more quickly. nobody knows if that's because he is look fargo mate, or if because he is a well-trained animal that's used to humans is simply seeking out more human attention. and that could actually prove his downfall, anderson. >> i feel bad for him. melissa bell, thank you very much. just ahead, former fbi director james comey speaks out about attacks on the justice department, as well as which of the many legal threats facing the former president he believes is the strongest. and later, jeremy strong is

here for his first television interview since the finale of my favorite television show "succession," which wrapped on sunday.

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top house republicans including house speaker kevin mccarthy today threatened fbi director chris wray with contempt proceedings. it's the latest in an ongoing fight for documents related to the investigation to the business dealings of president biden's family. part of a wider attack on the justice department. the former president has called for congress to, quote, defund the doj and fbi. just last week, florida governor and presidential candidate ron desantis said that if he wins the white house, he would fire director wray, quote, on day one. it's a fight my next guest knows very well. james comey was fired by the former president. just before air i spoke with him about all this, plus his fiction "central park west," a crime novel. congratulations on the new book. >> thank you so much. >> did you know you were a writer? is that something you had been interested? >> i always loved to write. i wrote in high school as a journalist, college as a journalist. actually, the last piece of fiction i wrote before this, i remember the date actually. it was the night i was writing

in my room when a serial rapist and robber kicked in the front door of my parents home. i was a senior in high school. it was the last fiction piece i wrote before. this nonfiction kicked in the door did rally. >> given the career you have had in the fbi, when you see the former president, now the front-runner again for the republican nomination, how big a threat is that? >> a very serious threat to the rule of law, almost an existential threat if he were to become president again. he has tried to take a flame thrower to the fbi, to the department of justice to stop them investigating. >> you believe donald trump is an existential threat to the rule of law? >> i do, yes. were he to become president again, i don't think america has ever seen and is ready for what he would try and do to the system of justice. >> the justice department has sent a very strong message about what happened on january 6th with their prosecutions, their investigations and prosecutions of some of those responsible. when you hear the former president talking about

pardoning, you hearron ron desas talking about looking at pardons, what do you think? >> it's disgusting. it's an take on the rule of law. if anything in this country people should be able to agree on, we should send a message never again. you can't interview by force. you can protest, you can march, you can do what you want, but don't you dare. that's the message that has to be sent with those prosecutions. and the idea of undercutting that message makes no sense at all. >> many in the house in congress say that the fbi has been weaponized, that it's going after conservatives, that it's politicized. do you believe any of that is true? >> i don't believe any of it is true. i never would have expected it. all of us should become more familiar with the way a cult operates in the recent years. so it makes sense in the light of that phenomenon. but i never would have anticipated it years ago. >> so what happens if the republican party, which has a long, proud history, if many of its members are talking about, you know, prosecuting the

director of the fbi, defunding the fbi. some of them are talking about defunding the fbi. what does that say about the republican party? >> i don't know what the republican party is anymore. and i don't know what its future. i think the american people need to hand it, especially the presidential level, a series of losses until they figure out who they want to be. because they're not a party that is consistent with the values of the country. >> in terms of the potential charges, potential cases that the former president is facing, which do you think is the strongest, or has the greatest likelihood of actually moving forward and having an impact -- an actual effect on him, charges? >> based on what i can see from the outside, which i know is an imperfect view having been on the inside, the mar-a-lago case strikes me as the one that is the biggest threat to him. >> because it's so clear? because it's not getting inside his head? it's actual actions that are documented? >> yeah. it's a fairly narrow range of

conduct. it isn't thousands and thousands of people marching on the capitol, for example, or a chaotic series of maneuvers after an election. it's focused. and it should be easier -- not easy given the nature of donald trump. i'm not sure he even knows his own mental process at time, but easier for a prosecutor to prove his mind, his state of mind about that series of events. >> let's talk about the book. you -- talk about how you went about this. >> well, i was nudged by the editor of my second nonfiction book who said hey, you write narrative really well. you write stories really well. i kept saying look, these aren't stories. this is my life. but he said you can really write crime fiction. you ought to try it. >> i have just gotten a copy of it. i have not read it yet. it is about a female prosecutor prosecuting a mobster? >> yes, is it's about a prosecutor named nora carlson who is taking on a mobster, trying to put him away after he has been elusive for a long

time. and the case she is bringing collides with another case involving the murder of a former governor. and it leads to a series of twists and turns that are both interesting and kind of fun. >> you have you a family member who is a female prosecutor. >> yes. >> prosecuting ghislaine maxwell. >> yes. >> so is she is model -- your daughter. is she the model for this? >> yeah. i originally imagined it as a guy as the prosecutor. and literally while i was putting this together, she was prosecuting ghislaine maxwell, epstein's co-conspirator in the same prosecutor where i had prosecuted joe gambino. and the crossover made it obvious it's got to be a woman as the protagonist. so nora carlton is born. she is a lot of my daughter. she is a lot of all four of my girls who are tall, strong smart women. >> did you get permission from your daughter? >> i don't think i asked permission. but i showed her the draft, and

she had feedback, including things i screwed up, putting her office on the wrong floor. but it made it a labor of love in a lot of ways i hadn't expected. i didn't need to think about me. i was thinking might be kids while writing this story, and that made it special for me. >> and you have already written another book? >> yes. second book. the general counsel to the world's largest head fund for a few years before the fbi. i would like nora to go to that ve venue. introduce people to that world in the way this book introduces them to the criminal justice in manhattan. >> james comey, thank you so much. >> great to be with you as always. >> it's called "central park west." an 11-year-old shot in the chest after he called 911 to get help for his mom says he was convinced he was going to die. thankfully he is a survivor.r. he is talking to cnn's nick valencia ahead.

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the 11-year-old mississippi child shot in the chest by a police officer after he called 911 is speaking out about the ordeal. aderrien murry was shot in the chest ten days ago when the officer asked him and others in their home to come outside. he was hospitalized with a lacerated liver, broken ribs and

was put on a ventilator because of a collapsed lung. we learn today his family is taking legal action against the police and the city. cnn's nick valencia spoke to aid derrien today. here is his report. ♪ god will do what he said ♪ >> reporter: as he lay in his mother's arms bleeding out from a gunshot wound, 11-year-old aderrien murry was so convinced he was going to die, he began to pray to god and sing gospel songs. >> i'm going to die. take care of my whole family. tell my teacher i say i'm sorry for what i did. >> reporter: on may 20th, aderrien's mom told him to call 911 for help after the father of one of her other children showed up at their mississippi home at four income the morning. nakala murry opened the door to an officer who already had his gun drawn.

>> he said everybody come out with your hands up. then i came running inside the living room. and then -- then i remember i heard the big bang. i remember holding my chest. >> reporter: indianola police say the officer was sergeant greg capers. murry says he shot aderrien once in the chest, seriously injuring the boy. cnn has made repeated attempts to get comments from capers, but he has not responded. aderrien's mother says he developed a collapsed lung and suffered fractured ribs and a lacerated liver due to the gunshot wound. he spent days at the mississippi medical center in jackson, needing a ventilator to breathe. >> it came right there. right here. >> reporter: more than a week since the shooting, he is remarkably in good spirits, but says sometimes when he is alone with his thoughts for too long, he has nightmares.

>> some time i can see myself laying inside the coffin. all my thoughts at night. and sometimes i think people are watching me, but my main thought is me dead. >> i'm so overfilled with joy to have my child there. i don't to have time to be angry. i trust in the law, that they will make the right decision, you know. my main concern is my son right now. >> reporter: the murry family and their attorney carlos moore have filed a federal lawsuit against the city of indianola, its police chief, and several officers, including capers. they're seeking $5 million in damages. >> anyone who has ever been a victim of excessive force deserves to be compensated, it's aderrien murry.

he trusted the police. he called the police to come to the aid of his mother, and he turns around and gets shot by the cop he called to rescue them. >> if that officer was here, sitting right here across from you, what would you want to tell him, aderrien? >> why did you do it? how i could have lost -- lost my life. all because of you. i want you terminated for what you did to me. >> nick valencia joins me now from mississippi. what's the employment status of the officer tonight? >> sergeant greg capers remains on paid administrative leave. meanwhile, the mississippi bureau of investigation, they've taken the lead on this case, and there is body cam footage of this incident. they have that in their possession, but tell me that they're not going to release it until their investigation is complete. incidentally, earlier this evening, the indianola board aldermen convened a special meeting to talk about that body camera footage. it was held in executive

session. no action was taken. but i did talk to the mayer r earlier, and he told me he doesn't support the firing of sergeant greg capers because he says he doesn't have all the facts yet, which include watching the body cam footage for the first time. aderrien very clear what he wants. he wants the officer terminated. the shooting has forever changed his life. prior to the shooting, he wanted to be a police officer. he says, though, now he is scared of police. now he wants to be a doctor, though, because he credits them in part for helping save his life. anderson? >> nick valencia, appreciate it. coming up, for four seasons i've been obsessed with the hbo show "succession." and sunday was the finale to end all finales. actor jeremy strong joins me to take me behind the scenes of the last show and what he thinks happens to the three main characters now. mercedes-benz electric vehicles. including two years complimentary charging and pre-paid maintenance. the vehicles are all electric. the feeling is all mercedes.

the choice is all yours. but hurry, these dream days are only here until june 5th. america is on the brink of defaulting on its debt, and donald trump is telling republicans in congress: “you're going to have to do a default.” he's pushing an extreme agenda to slash the basics we depend on, hurting the middle class, seniors, and veterans. a default would crash our economy, delay social security checks, and put basic services at risk. with so much on the line,

now is their chance to finally stand up to trump's chaos. so tell republicans in congress: say no to trump. say no to default.

so my favorite tv show came to an end sunday. "succession" included a brilliant four-season run on

hbo, with its highest rated episode since the show's debut according to warner brothers discovery, which was also on cnn. if you're unfamiliar with "succession," it's an incredibly engrossing look at the battle between three siblings to succeed their larger than life father as the head of a conglomerate. it's a tragedy on an epic scale that feels so personal. it's also at times very funny. it's won a number of emmy awards, including for its acting, which includes my next guest, jeremy strong, who plays kendall roy. he joins us for his first television interview. there are many, many spoilers ahead about what happens in the finale. so are you glad it's over? because from everything i've read about you and heard you say, you are very deeply -- you embodied the character. you're intensely into your character. are you glad you're no longer kendall? >> yeah. look, i think it was -- it's been the role of a lifetime.

it's been an immeasurable gift to get to sort of, you know, run the gauntlet with this character. it was heavy. i feel a responsibility to serve the writing and embody what the writers are asking the character to go through. >> but that heaviness, i mean, it's incredibly heavy, until the last episode, i don't think i even saw kendall smile. >> yeah, yeah. we'll talk about the scene. >> but is it heavy then when the cameras aren't rolling and you're back home and you're going out to the grocery store? >> i think in the eight months when you're filming, you sort of go on airplane mode a bit in your life. and you take on the material. and it kind of takes over, or it hangs over you. >> right. >> the show is always -- it's shakespearean. it was also heavy is the head that wears the crown. and there is a sense of that heaviness, especially with this

character. >> the final seen where kendall is -- walks towards the water and his security guy who was his father's security guy is following him, when i was watching it, i thought you were going to run to the water and jump over and attempt to kill yourself. you didn't do that. but i read you as a character felt that way, and you actually did a take that way. >> yeah, i did. i did try and go in the water. one of the incredible things about working on something for seven years, since we started the pilot, and just having 40 hours, a canvas of 40 hours of storytelling is just your instincts for the thing become a part of you. and are very alive and, you know, your job is to give the

writing, you know, a heart and nerve and sinew and density and weight and all that stuff. and at a certain point, i think something -- if you're lucky,ing in kind of ineffable happens and you enter into it. and the character has just been put through so much. has been through so much hell, really, from the chappaquiddick incident to in a way almost the most heartbreaking thing to me is the revelation in this final episode of this moment when he was 9 years old at the candy kitchen. >> right. >> where his father says one day this will be yours, and this sort of curse of that, that sentence of that. so i felt that this is an extinction level event. >> for your character? >> i didn't feel he could come back from what happens to him. >> what do you think happens to each? because i thought about this a lot after the episode was over. where does kendall -- what happens to kendall later on in his life?

what is the rest of his life like? what is shiv's life like? roman's life? the way he was looking at that martini. >> scary. >> seems like alcohol is going to be -- >> yeah, i think so. i think there is a real vortex that he is going to get into. >> and shiv, that extraordinary nonhand hold. >> yeah. >> also like. it was incredible. >> no, it's terrible. she's sort of -- it's a great capitulation. and the patriarchy has it's for jesse armstrong. there but for the grace of him went all of us, this whole time. and his writing and the depth of it and his insight into human nature. i think he feels that people are kind of stuck in and doom to repeat themselves. >> you imagine shiv and tom in

some sterile, palatial penthouse with their unhappy child, unhappy mother and kendall. i heard jesse armstrong say in the aftershow that maybe kendall will start a company or something, but will never quite -- >> this will be the defining moment of his life and sort of the stain that marks his life, i think. yeah. in that moment, you know, one of the great joys of working on this show in particular and making movies is the sort of discoveries you make. and so the collaborative nature of the medium, we had a great deal of latitude and freedom to follow those instincts and impulses. >> in the scene. >> yeah. >> when you're shooting. >> yeah, yeah. >> i want to show the scene, you're in barbados, there's incredible, emotionally charged

family reunion has occurred and they have anointed you -- you are going to be the one to take over the company. i want to show this. >> drink up. >> this is going to be all right, right? like, we're all right? yeah? >> just [ bleep ] drink it. oh god. >> oh my god. >> oh. >> king's don't wear silly hats. kings wear crowns. don't. wear your crown, sir. >> no, no, no. >> wear your crown. >> no, no, no, no. >> then let me -- >> oh my god. >> mom. >> king. >> i mean, it was a beautiful scene. it was incredibly beautiful. i found it so touching and so -- you think going into it. there's this momentum going into the last few minutes of the show and -- >> yeah. >> it's heart breaking. >> yeah. i find it heart breaking. it's very sad. >> such a tragedy.

>> yeah. there's kind of unadulterated happiness they have with each other. and you see -- you can sort of glimpse an alternate thing for them. >> i just want to show the scene of the critical vote is taking place. and shiv walks out of the room and you need her vote in order to take over your dad's company. >> right. >> let's just watch. >> vote for me. just please vote for me. shiv. vote for me. >> no. >> yes. >> no. >> shiv, don't do this. you can't do this, shiv. >> absolutely not, man. absolutely not. >> no. >> why? >> no. why? >> just -- >> i love you. i really -- i love you but i cannot [ bleep ] stomach you. >> this is blaep bleep disgusting. it's disgusting. you're [ bleep ] heartless. it's [ bleep ] nuts. it doesn't make any sense.

i'm the eldest boy. i am the eldest boy. >> you're not. >> it mattered to him. he wanted this to go on. >> i'm the eldest boy. that -- that was written? >> yeah. >> that was -- that scene -- that box within a box in that box-like building. >> yeah. >> i mean, there's just so much going on in that. >> yeah. well, you know, this is a moment where there's a writer's strike, right? and so it feels important to say that none of this show -- this show doesn't exist without -- >> the writing is incredible. >> the writing is everything. it's everything. that's all scripted. every word. but it's really a show about the underneaths as i think shiv says to tom in this episode. it's about the underneaths of

these people, of their struggles, the underneaths of the country. and that's the profundity of it. and but i think this scene, it's brutal for me to watch. it's just, you know, it's that greek idea that character is fate. i think from the very beginning, this was going to happen. >> well, thank you for being here and for your performance for the last seven years. >> thank you so much. >> it's brought so much joy and thought and emotion into so many people's lives and mine in particular. so thank you. >> thank you, anderson. >> really appreciate it. quick programming note. tonight on "cnn primetime," pamela brown speaks to the former inmate current prison consultant about what life behind bars will be like for disgraced tycoon elizabeth holmes who began her 11 year sentence. her company was built that it

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>> off the coast of south carolina, chaotic end to a cruise over the memorial day weekend. rough seas pound carnival sunshine as it made its way from charleston from the bahamas. one telling cnn he blames carnival for sailing into those conditions, asking, quote, why would you sail into the storm with 80 miles per hour plus winds? who does that? what were they thinking? flooding in hallways and cabins and other damages. some passengers and crew members needed minimal assistance from medical staff. that's it for us. the news continues. "cnn primetime" with pamela brown starts now. thanks, anderson. good evening and thank you for joining me. there may be a deal but the nation can't breathe a sigh of relief just yet. the drama only intensifying tonight with america drawing closer and closer to potential default. this time, it's not between the two parties.

it's mostly become