>> off the coast of south carolina, chaotic end to a cruise over the memorial day weekend. rough seas pound carnival sunshine as it made its way from charleston from the bahamas. one telling cnn he blames carnival for sailing into those conditions, asking, quote, why would you sail into the storm with 80 miles per hour plus winds? who does that? what were they thinking? flooding in hallways and cabins and other damages. some passengers and crew members needed minimal assistance from medical staff. that's it for us. the news continues. "cnn primetime" with pamela brown starts now. thanks, anderson. good evening and thank you for joining me. there may be a deal but the nation can't breathe a sigh of relief just yet. the drama only intensifying tonight with america drawing closer and closer to potential default. this time, it's not between the two parties. it's mostly become republicans.

but the debt deal just pass a crucial test. >> not one republican should vote for this deal. it's a bad deal. >> how much confidence do you have in the speaker right now? >> none. zero. >> speaker lying about the way he's characterizing this bill? >> yes, he's lying. >> but members of the house freedom caucus like congressman roy and bishop are struggling to come up with a strategy that block the deal tonight. and there's also a divide over whether to try to oust mccarthy as speaker. now, as for the republican leader, he says he's not concerned about losing his post and can't seem to understand what all the fuss is about. >> i'm not sure what in the bill people are concerned about. it is the largest savings of 2.1 trillion we have ever had. >> now, a quick refresher of what is in this deal struck by president biden and the speaker over this memorial day weekend.

it would replenish our near empty treasury with borrowed cash by suspending the debt ceiling for two years. it also includes caps on federal spending, more work requirements for food stamps and cuts to irs funding among other things. t neither party got everything they wanted. something the senate republican noted on the floor earlier as all of this gop infighting plays out. >> divided government means negotiated deals. it means nobody gets everything they want. but in this case, it means the american people got a whole lot more progress towards fiscal sanity than washington democrats wanted to give them. speaker mccarthy and house republicans deserve our thanks. >> now that this bill has advanced, there could be a full house vote as soon as tomorrow. and a senate vote as soon as thursday. and of course, president biden would have to sign it before

monday's default deadline. we turn now to chief congressional correspondent manu raju with the very latest. manu? >> reporter: yeah. right now this bill clearing a key hurdle on its way to the house floor tomorrow. just moments ago, the house rules committee, which is really the first step in legislative process voted 7-6, barely clearing enough vote, getting majority votes to adopt a rule that essentially ensures this bill can be considered and be approved by a majority vote. now, that didn't -- this vote that came tonight did not come without some drama. in fact, two republican members on the committee have emerged as some of the most outspoken critics of this bill. chip roy, being one of them. ralph norman being another. chip roy even contending there was a secret deal that was cut between him and the speaker back in january for the speaker to become the speaker of the house that ensured that essentially all nine republicans on the house rules committee must agree

to any -- to rule before that bill is considered on the floor. well, that didn't happen just now. seven of the nine voted for it. even as mccarthy and his allies essentially reject the notion that there's some sort of secret deal. all underscoring the tension ahead of tomorrow's vote. there are a number of republicans on the far right who are concerned about this bill, argue it did not go far enough in cutting spending and say the speaker himself is not providing correct and fair representation of all that is in there. particular, they're concerns about the length of the debt limit suspension. it would not -- it would extend until january of 2025. some want to fight a much shorter time frame, try to extract concessions from the white house in an election year. but the speaker believes that this is the best approach and a lot of members agree with him. there is an expectation among the speaker and his closest allies that they will get a majority of the house republican conference behind it tomorrow.

and that is a key threshold because some members of that far right freedom caucus are warning if it gets underneath 150 votes, minority of house republicans support it tomorrow, then that could lead to a push to essentially oust mccarthy from the speakership. so that will all play out tomorrow. even as there is an expectation at this moment that the bill will pass with bipartisan support, democrats will be needed to shepherd this over the finish line. just moments ago, behind closed doors the speaker himself try to make a case to his members, he said to his members, if you think i failed you, i'm sorry. but if you think i failed, i think you're wrong. pam? >> all right. manu raju, you are busy this week. thanks so much. appreciate it. and just moments we'll speak with the republican who is against the bill. so be sure to stand by for that. but first, florida governor ron desantis kicking off his bid for the presidency in earnest tonight, saying republicans need to end what he calls a, quote, culture of losing.

>> it's time we impose our will on washington, d.c. [ cheers and applause ]. >> and you can't do any of this if you don't win. >> despite the glitchy twitter event, this looks like what a republican campaign usually does. his first official stop, a church right outside des moines, iowa. and he'll follow up that with a three-day swing through key early states including new hampshire and south carolina. a pro-desantis super pac is spending big money in iowa. but the latest cnn national numbers still have him polling half of what donald trump is. joining me here at the table, cnn eva mckend, ashley allison and former trump 2020 campaign spokeswoman sara matthews. so the speech tonight had a lot of the same dark themes, sara, that trump has always pushed, but at the same time, you know,

desantis is trying to draw contrast between himself and trump. >> yes. and i think one way that he is trying to do that is the electability argument. you know, him saying that there's culture of losing right now. that is a correct, fair point. i am a republican who is tired of losing. trump lost us the house in 2018. he lost us the presidency in 2020. and his hand-picked candidates in the 2022 midterms all lost. but i think you're going to have to differentiate yourself more than just an electability argument for trump voters to want to switch over to you. and it is going to be interesting to see how desantis will define himself. i think one place that he has done an effective way of doing that is with covid. he's tried to say, hey, look. trump didn't -- was for locking down the country. i opened up florida. and so he needs to do more of that by painting a starker contrast between him and trump, beyond just electability. >> and he also said tonight he's

going to impose his will on washington. and he blames what he says are the problems in the country on leftism, on woke ideology. what do you make of that, ashley? >> well, we're here in washington and the republican caucus can't potentially stay together to make sure we don't default on our debt. so i don't think it's the left that is really the problem. i think what desantis is actually doing is pretty interesting is he -- there's a long way to go in this republican primary. i think he just really wants to stay alive. i don't know if he's even thinks he can get number one in iowa, but he is like, iowans are used to kind of going against the status quo. in 2008 they picked barack obama. in 2020 they picked pete buttigieg on the democratic side. in 2016, they picked donald trump, who at that point was not part of the washington establishment. and so, i think he's thinking, let me see if i can get number two in iowa. then we move on to new hampshire and maybe somebody else wins in new hampshire. maybe a chris sununu if he gets

in the race. and that just keeps me viable and also counters that trump is the all mighty winner of the republican primary. and it's a viable strategy actually. >> yeah. it's a small pool of voters in iowa. so it makes a lot of sense if you're trying to capture momentum off the bat and shake up this narrative that trump is going to walk away with this primary right away to really invest in that state. i think part of, i guess, a veh secret weapon he has is the super pac. never back down. speaking to voters, registering voters, engaging with voters. so, he has that. the only thing that i think that maybe is a miscalculation from my conversations with democratic voters and independent voters, moderate democrats is he makes this argument that trump has a ceiling and that he has more appeal with this likes of the electorate, he can appeal to more independents than trump can. right now democrats, i think, pretty effectively messaged

internally that trump and desantis are equally as extreme. that is something that he is going to have to contend with. >> right. >> go ahead. >> it's been really interesting to see this because i feel like desantis hasn't really gone after trump as much as he really needs to to make an impression. if he comes in second in iowa, well, he's polling second nationally behind trump any way. is that really a victory? that's what everyone expects. i live in florida. i live in st. petersburg in the tampa bay area. and one thing that i know is that desantis does scare off middle of the road voters. and so everything that he's doing to try to appeal to the maga base is turning off, you know, swing voters, people who are a little more conservative or little less conservative. and i think that's the needle he's got to thread. how can he appeal to iowa voters and the maga crowd and still be positioned to come back to the center if he's lucky enough to actually win the nomination. >> yeah. when it comes to trump, it is a

tricky balance because he is popular in the party. i mean, he is the front-runner by a lot. so, how do you think desantis should handle that? we have seen him come out and start to attack trump more, but not the full-fledge as you note attacks you believe he should be doing right now. >> yeah. i think that he is going to have to take trump head on in order to make a case for why voters should support him instead. and that is something that he seems to be doing a little bit more now that he's actually declared candidate. but he is definitely going to have to ramp it up. i will say, too, on iowa, i think that that is going to be a place where desantis could really turn things around. he's had some early stumbles in his campaign, but the never back down, his super pac has already, i believe, they said they knocked 50,000 doors in iowa alone already. and that's kind of campaigning that i think could really turn things around. >> and there's -- i was readying today that there's political operative working for desantis who also helped ted cruz win in

iowa back in 2016. do you think the fact, e va, that trump has such a big lead means that iowa matters more than it historically has? >> well, it has known as ashley was saying historically to surprise people. so, it makes a lot of sense, the strategy, i think, one of the pastors that i met just a few weeks ago out there at the faith and freedom coalition, he happened to be one of the pastors praying with one of the 15 pastors praying with governor desantis before an event tonight. so that just gives you a sense of just how small it is, right? there's a chance that we're all going to meet the same folks as we spend the next few months out there. so, i understand why there's so much emphasis on that state. it's the first one. >> and he's obviously holding his event tonight in a church, 64% caucus goers in iowa are born again christians. clearly he's being strategic and targeting. >> he needs to make an

impression. he needs to do something to move the needle. and as odd a comparison it is, when barack obama won in iowa, it was a sign that he was a real contender, as a candidate for the democratic nomination. you know, desantis needs a moment like that. what we have seen is stumbles. what we have seen is people trying to say, no, he's good at retail politics. trust us. what he needs is a transformative moment. and if iowa can give that to him, obviously that would be a great achievement for him. i'm a little skeptical. >> all right. thank you all so much. stay with us, the good news is we're all coming back to continue our discussions. up next, we'll talk to one republican who says she is a no on the debt ceiling deal. and she was once the darling of silicon valley riding on private jets and gracing magazine covers. but tonight, elizabeth holmes is in federal prison starting her 11-year sentence. i'm going to speak live with the former federal inmate and prison consultant about what holmes'

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deal in its current form. congress woman victoria sparts of indiana. you left behind closed doors meeting with mccarthy. are you now going to vote for this deal? >> well, thank you for having me. you know, as someone who spent over decades in professional economy, i wanted to share numbers with you. the current deal we have is reduce by 1.5 trillion over ten years. we have short fall just this year, in addition to all of the debts, 1.5 trillion. so, we're not even getting to pre-covid numbers adjusted for inflation with our discretionary spending. we're not touching almost nothing. ton of fraud and abuse and don't have a conversation how we can resolve this fiscal insanity. i look at government, report audited financials 50% are not audited. almost 250 billion of money was

not -- we're not dealing with anything like that. so i'm very disappointed that we cannot have a serious conversation about the future of our country. you know, i always say one of the great artists michael anglo said the biggest danger for most of us not that we set our expectations too high and reach them, too low. the american people need to demand more from congress. >> to be clear, you are still a no on this current deal? >> i don't think it is actually material enough. -- >> so that's a no. >> no, i'm not. >> what is stopping republicans then from passing what you want without tying it to the debt ceiling? you know, you heard from mcconnell, senator mcconnell earlier today saying, look, it's a divided government. compromise is what you have to do. no party will be happy but at least republicans are getting

something, democrats are getting something too. why not wait and do it separately? >> unfortunately -- i wish we would not have to deal with this situation. it shouldn't be part of the debt ceiling. unfortunately we have completely broken budget process. over 90% of our spending is unauthorized by congress. we continue spending. unfortunately we do not have any mechanism to have a discussion, force politician to grow backbone to deal with very serious issues and abuses and fraud in the system. so i think this is the only time we actually can have a conversation. and otherwise everyone goes their own places, places politics with people's life and do nothing. it shouldn't be part of -- >> do you think then the country defaulting on its debt is the solution to your concerns? >> no, no. i think we could. you know, if we have to give more time, we could vote on this proposal and give some more time, but not the end of '25. we cannot punt again for another year in the house. i would be willing to give short

extensions to have a serious conversation where we can save money in our budget and maybe go through budgeting process and maybe for a change actually pass budget commit us to follow it and convince the otbranch to do that. i'm not willing to do that. >> time is of the essence. treasury secretary janet yellen says everything needs be paid june 5th. just getting close to the deadline badly damaged the economy in 2011. what cuts would be worth a repeat of taking this to the brink? again, 2011 is a great example of what could happen when you get too close. >> well, i agree with you. we had over months to have these conversations and no one wanted to deal with that. politicians like to put it to the deadline, then they can do whatever they want instead of have a serious conversation about it. we always have these fake dead license. if we want to expand our deadline for another month, i would be willing to do it even though it's strange to me that democrats control the house and senate last year. they didn't deal with it. and president didn't want to

deal with it until last second. and chuck schumer didn't pass the bill. house passed the bill. the process should work, house passed the bill, senate passed the bill and go to conference. that's how the conference should work. they never passed the bill. so i think this is neglect of their duty. as congress, you know. but i would be willing even to say, okay, for short period of time we shouldn't be defaulting on the debt. it's wrong. we'll give it extension but not until the end of '24 that no one will do nothing for another year and a half. >> yeah. and, of course, the reasoning that the negotiators say that is because they don't want this to be a big part in the upcoming presidential election. but i want to ask you if this deal passes without a republican majority, one of your colleagues says mccarthy should be ousted. do you agree? >> well, listen, you know, i think he did what he could. i don't think he put good faith in efforts and negotiating that. i probably disagree with some of the things he did.

i think he tried to work hard. we'll see how he continues to do. it is hard to be a leader. we have a disagreement. but ultimately i do not believe that people feel right now that he completely failed, even though he did fail on this deal. i truly believe we could have done much better. we must do much better. this is our duty to the american people to do much better. >> just to be clear, if he doesn't get a majority of republicans on his side, you do not believe that should lead to his ouster, correct? >> well, listen, if someone wants to make a case, i personally think, you know, he did what he could. and from what he stated. i disagree with that. i think he had good faith efforts and ultimately the jury is out on some other things. we'll see what he's going to do. i don't think from one thing i disagree i would think he would need to be taken out of his office. i think he's trying very hard. it's very difficult job, but if you want to lead, you have to be tough and be able to win difficult job. i do not consider it to be a win.

>> all right. congresswoman victoria spartz, thank you for your time this evening. >> thank you. up next, disgraced entrepreneur elizabeth holmes reporting to prison. what she faces in her next decade plus behind bars. we're going to discuss. ♪ [ music playing ] when we first arrived at st. jude, it was just claire and i. and side effects of that surgery meant that she had trelearn how to walk and how to speak. ♪

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from private jets to prison walls. disgraced entrepreneur elizabeth holmes today turning herself into to federal prison camp bryan in texas. it's a stunning turn for a former silicon valley darling. her company theranos was once valued around $9 billion after claiming it could accurately test for hundreds of health issues using just a few drops of blood. in november, holmes was convicted on multiple counts of defrauding investors and she is now set to spend the next 11 years of her life in that minimum security prison camp. alongside 600 other women offenders. so what exactly will it be like in there? my next guest has first-hand experience. holly coleman a former inmate turned para legal and advocate for women's prison reform. she helps run pink lady prison

consultants, which is led by people who used to be incarcerated. holly, thanks for coming on the show tonight. so for the rich and powerful who do face prison time, there is this belief, this perception that some are left off the hook to being sent to cushier prisons. what's the reality for elizabeth holmes? >> there's no club fed, camp cub cake. these are prisons. she is experiencing prison-like experiences. her first step in she was processed and that laid the ground by moving her right through the system. she's getting quite the dose of reality because covid has been very rampant still in federal bureau prisons. so she's been placed in quarantine with other women that have either self surrendered or have been transferred from other facilities. so she hasn't even made it yet to a cubicle where she would have three other inmates with

her. you have to remember a lot of these prisons are also on super fund sites. there's contaminated water. year over year as women come and go, there are no cleaning supplies that contain any bleach. and so, they have a pink solution that's sloshed around. it's filthy. it's dirty. it's run down. she's experiencing also coming in you've got people who are very upset with her because she refuses to take that responsibility of possibly endangered and had endangered friends, family members of either the officers and the inmates. so you've got that on top of her as well that it's not necessarily a great greeting for her. >> right. of course, she's not like another inmate. she was a high, profile national story. she is likely to be recognized. won't be the first well known inmate there. we know real housewives of salt

lake city star jennifer shah is serving her time there as well for her involvement in a telemarketing scheme. how do you think being a celebrity or well-known figure will affect her treatment there? >> again, it's that piece -- she's a unique individual. it's a little bit different from jen shah. because of that indifference and the way she has portrayed herself, elizabeth has, that it's going to be harder on her. the women aren't going to be friendly to her. the officers are certainly not going to be friendly to her. she is going to experience, you know, where they may get in her face more. may shine her lights coming in to do the standup checks or quiet checks at 12 midnight, 3:00 a.m., 5:00 a.m. she's got an 11-year sentence. with good time she still has over nine years if she doesn't take any programming classes and other things. that's nine years of this

reality. she is going to need to -- yeah. she needs to become very humble very quickly. >> it sounds like -- >> that is not -- >> she will be in a very humbling environment for quite some time. she is still appealing her conviction, we should note. her request to remain free on bail was denied earlier this month. one of the reasons that she put forward is that she's a mom to a 2-year-old and a newborn now just 3 months old. would there be accommodations made for her in that regard. those are young kids. >> no, no. they're very young kids. i served time with women who were pregnant and also had very young kids at home. it doesn't matter. that will not take into any consideration of lessening anything of her time. now, she needs to really try and keep relationships and that means by you get 300 minutes a month for phone calls. that's ten minutes a day. there's email. but that's not -- and there's video chats. >> what about visitation?

letting her kids visit her? >> visitation, again, with that covid right now, bryan is green, which means there are visitation. but there's a process for friends and family having to be cleared first. and then having them come in and seeing mom only from 8:00 a.m. until maybe 3:00 p.m. in the afternoon, it's going to take its toll. plus there's things on the backside for elizabeth, when she goes into visitation, there are things that she has to go through, such as perhaps search as well as perhaps even a strip search on the way back out. so, that's why a lot of women forego even having visitation. but, i know that she has these young children, so she's going to need to try her best to stay connected. >> all right. holly coleman, wow. thank you for coming on. appreciate it. >> thank you for having me. a dangerous turn in russia's invasion of ukraine. the war has come to vladimir putin's doorstep, both capitals on alert tonight after a series

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the ukrainian capital of kyiv is bracing for more drone strikes tonight after the kremlin blamed ukraine for a drone attack on moscow. the first to hit civilian areas in the russian capital. several residential buildings were damaged and two people were injured.

ukraine denies any direct involvement in this attack. but it's the latest sign that the war could be entering a new phase. president volodymyr zelenskyy has even said the timing of ukraine's counteroffensive has been set. cnn's jim sciutto is here to break down the very latest. a lot has been going on these last 24 hours, jim. bring us up to speed. >> so, biggest thing is that ukraine is proving its ability to strike in russian-controlled territory. russian-controlled territory inside ukraine, taken over since the invasion but also crucially inside russia. a across the border in ball ga rad, but in moscow. and on civilian targets there, it seems with drones now ukraine has not claimed responsibility, but they have not denied direct responsibility for this. but the key seems to be showing an ability to attack behind enemy lines even on the russian homeland and the crucial timing here is that in advance of this highly anticipated ukrainian

counteroffensive. showing an ability to attack there but also keeping russia on its toes, so to speak. they don't know where they might strike next, yeah. >> it seems as though it is. vladimir putin for his part has said this was terrorist ac activity. as you point out, ukrainian top officials are saying we did not have direct, keyword, involvement in what happened to moscow. what more do we know about how these drones were use and who could be behind them? >> so, we don't know specific drones were used. we know in the past ukraine has used old soviet-era drones. listen, this goes back to the '70s. not as capable of drones as we know today. to your point, they don't deny -- they're denying direct responsibility. they're not denying any responsibility here. that's key because listen, we talked a lot about the ukraine war. russia throughout the war has attacked ukrainian civilian sites in kyiv, horribly in the last 24 hours and going back,

you know, all across the country here. so for ukraine to attack a civilian target inside russia is a step and could create tension between ukraine and its nato backers and the u.s. for attacking civilian targets because it has given them the moral high ground not to attack civilian targets to this point. >> right. and of course, allies, including the u.s., have given ukraine tons of weapons. >> yeah. >> but there's always been that concern or precondition this should not be used. >> that could be the red line here. it's not clear that ukraine has used, in fact, there's no evidence that ukraine has used western-supplied weapons to strike russian territory. certainly civilian targets in moscow. that could create divisions between ukraine and its western backers if it were to use such weapons to do so given all the -- and purely understandable and just fiable anger that the u.s. and western allies have

expressed due to russia's attacks on civilian targets inside ukraine. >> yeah. but it's interesting, too, that the u.s.-supplied patriot missiles have really been helping save lives there in ukraine in the wake of those attacks. >> no question. they've been very successful. and we should not equate the two of these things because russia has been attacking -- first of all, russia attacked ukraine unprovoked and it's been attacking civilian targets for close to a year and a half since it invaded ukraine going back to february. >> can't lose sight of that for sure. jim sciutto, thank you so much. let's get more perspective now from former u.s. ambassador to nate toe, kurt volker the u.s. special ambassador to ukraine. thank you for coming on. russian president vladimir putin responded to the drone attacks. here is what he said. >> translator: kyiv chose the path of intimidation of russian citizens and attacks on residential buildings. it is a clear sign of terrorist activity. >> so, calling this terrorist

activity suggests how seriously he takes this and the kind of response he could take. do you think putin might use this moment as grounds for even more severe tactics? >> well, first off i think if putin could use more severe tactics he would already be doing it. his forces are doing very badly in ukraine. he's escalated the attacks on ukrainian cities already. if he could do more, he would. and i think his messaging here is really about trying to reassure the russian public who have got to be freaking out that there are actually attacks happening inside russia now. something they had not seen before. he's called this a special military operation. he has said that this is responding against nato, responding against nazis in ukraine. and now all of a sudden there's actually something happening inside russia. this is putting pressure on him and he's trying to control the narrative. >> what does that do in terms of

public sentiment in russia, the fact that russian civilians are now feeling the effects of this war on their own soil? >> well, the first thing is i think it's bringing home to them the idea that this is actually a war. putin has tried to portray this as a special military operation, far away, dealing with something inside ukraine and fully justified. and the fact that this is not what's happening is already evident to lots of people. russia lost so many people, so much equipment. the war has gone on so long. now that they see something inside russia, i think it adds to that confusion. but one thing i want to come back to what jim sciutto said, which he is making an assumption that ukraine was targeting civilian targets. we don't know that. we don't know what the targets were because all of the drones that were fired were shot down by russia. we don't know where they were going. it could have been military targets. we don't know. we also don't know where they were fired from or who did it. and so, i think we all have to

assume that ukraine would have facilitated this in some way, but there's a lot we don't know. so we shouldn't jump to assumptions. >> let's talk more about that. as jim emphasized, you know, ukraine is basically denying direct involvement, but how credible is that? clearly very careful word selection there. how credible sit especially even our previous reporting that u.s. intelligence picked up chatter of ukrainian officials blaming each other for the kremlin drone attack? >> yeah. well, first thing is that remember last week we saw these attacks inside russian territory in belgorod. these were all russians who are against vladimir putin and who gathered some military equipment, made an incursion just to prove a point that they could do so. they probably could not have done that without some kind of tacit ukrainian support, but at the same time, it wasn't ukrainians doing it. it wasn't ukraine conducting the attacks. as far as the drones go, we don't know where they're fired

from. i think that's significant because it's a long way from the ukrainian border to moscow with a lot of air defenses along the way. so for these drones to get there it indicates to me they probably weren't fired from ukraine but somewhere inside russia. even then, we don't know who did it. it could be ukrainian special forces. it could be these kind of russian partisans. it could be facilitated by ukraine in some way. there's just a lot that is unclear about all of this. >> kurt volker, thank you for offering your perspective tonight. up next, the right so-called war on woke picks a red state darling as its next target. why critics are going after chick-fil-a and how the chain is responding. was also the first time your profits left you speechless.

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tonight chick-fil-a facing fierce backlash after announcing its new vice president diversity, equity and inclusion dei. eric reynolds worked for more than 16 years at the fast food giant and been with its dei unit since 2020. chick-fil-a says the initiative will focus on promoting equal access to opportunities, valuing differences and creating a culture of belonging.

it's important to note that it does not mention the lgbtq plus community. chick-fil-a faced criticism in the past for giving financial support to organizations with anti-lgbtq views and yet this announcement still sparked outrage among some conservatives online. they can calling for a boycott over the company's, quote, anti-white, anti-christian woke agenda and saying chick-fil-a has gone woke. how many more times can i say woke right there? what is the sin here? what is the sin? >> okay. let's just baseline. dei is about >> it's about creating environments for their employees to feel safe and seen. it's also an opportunity for them and their consumers to get that same experience when they come and frequent their stores. in this case, to go buy some chicken wings and waffle fries. the people that are anti this

are anti anything that provides opportunities from a person like me, from everyone sitting, women, people of color, lgbtq, they don't want anybody to have a seat at the table. the reality is that they will not feel any difference from this policy or new position if they like chick-fil-a and go higher. they want someone to blame, they want a bogeyman, they want to say that this is woke. the funny thing is, this policy might actually help them because if they were to go into a store and spout some views that might not be as popular to some of the chick-fil-a customers, they could also feel inclusion and equity in that moment. it is frustrating because they are using a word when incorrectly, wokeism. but also, dei as a sin, as you said, when it's really just about what america is supposed to be. welcoming immigrants, welcoming people from all backgrounds to have an opportunity in this country. >> i'll also get to that point

about what you just made, using the word woke incorrectly. like i said, that is what they're trying -- the critics, are trying to hammer home. >> basically, what people are trying to do is demonize certain words. we saw rush limbaugh trying to demonize the word feminism. now some conservatives are trying to demonize the word woke. there's a certain fragility there. they cannot tolerate or the mention of inclusion without jumping on this issue, but i think that it does get to a very central difference between liberals and conservatives, which is this idea that systemic racism and systemic oppression holds back marginalized groups in this country. the fact that a company like chick-fil-a has considered friendly to conservatives, that is very religious, felt the need to hire somebody like this and promote them, they seem to be acknowledging that there is something out there that they need to work. they need to focus on if they need to make an effort to be inclusive for people, which i

think is a wonderful thing, and i think that some conservatives feel very threatened. >> i want to get your take on this, because chick-fil-a is considered a red state darling. how widespread is this criticism among conservatives against chick-fil-a? >> i think it's kind of just on line, a lot of twitter trolls making something out of nothing. if they're going to be upset the chick-fil-a has diversity, equity, and inclusion department, and dei statement on their website, i would encourage them to go and look up every single major corporations that they frequent daily. most major corporations have that kind of department and statement on their website. it does seem a little bit ridiculous to me that people are calling for the boycott of chick-fil-a, especially an organization that glorifies god and promotes christiane already, it donating to christian organizations. it feels like the wrong target for their, but at the same time,

selfishly, i love chick-fil-a. if this means shorter lines at chick-fil-a, i am all for it. >> i don't know if it will. i don't know how much this is actually good to hurt his bottom line. >> i know they're between getting the conservatives ban and lgbtq people, there might be plenty of room at chick-fil-a's if they don't get right on some of these issues. >> here's the bottom line. as you point, out just about every company has some diversity and inclusion part of it. do they just want every company wiped out that has that as part of its mission statement? >> feels like they didn't think through that. >> i think that's their point. they don't -- they want to invoke so much fury and anger that companies run away from it. look at what just happened with target, people coming in and protesting, having t-shirts on it with rainbows. i don't think that target made the correct decision of pulling the products that were on there,

but that is their hope. people will run scared. the reality is, most of these companies didn't actually have these policies before 2020, the murder of george floyd. there is a racial conversation in our country about what you are talking about earlier, systemic racism, and companies realizing that they need to look within to. try and get right. a lot of them have that on their website, it doesn't always mean that it comes out in all of their actual policies. but just to your point on the wokeism, they are using a language that candidates in the front running, some of those top candidates of the republican party are using. this wokeism, this -- they are trying to take your country, it's the others, as versus them. it is quite dangerous, it makes people feel like there is not enough space in our country for everybody to belong. unfortunately, it's a political ploy that some people are falling for. that is not what this dei work is about, it's not wood being woke is about. it's not actually what our country should be about. >> you make a good point that

they have had success with target, they've had success with bud light. i think that there might be a sense among conservative activists they can target another company to make them back down. they will gain a reputation for being able to focus on people and intimidate them. >> that is an important point. thank you so much, ashley sarah eric. up next on cnn tonight, a schoolteacher investigated for showing an animated disney movie in her classroom, and now there is a petition to remove the school board member who reported her. the teacher joint alison camerota, up next. what? my back feels better. before advil. new advil dual action back pain. fights back pain two ways for 8 hours of relief. lila: before i was diagnosed, there was nothing really to worry about. d then when i was diagnosed, there was just such a big weight put on my shoulders. every night, i felt like maybe i won't wake up tomorrow.

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>> we are watching capitol hill, where speaker mccarthy is set to speak as he faces criticism from federal republicans over the debt deal. i will hand off our coverage to alison camerota, hello, alison. >> i, pam, we will continue to watch that as well. good evening, everyone. i'm alison camerota, welcome to cnn tonight. whil