interested in the fact that he is claiming to have retained secret information and is appearing to try to share that with a room full of people, none of whom had security clearances. this is a key piece of evidence in this ongoing investigation. >> reading your reporting this morning, it was a genuine jaw-drop moment for a minute because of how many things it rebut about what the president said publicly. what is your sense of how this will factor into things going forward or into the indictments that we haven't seen yet? >> when we were doing our reporting on the existence of this audio recording last week a source close to the legal team told me this audio recording, this is a problem. and the former president's legal team only learned about this a few months ago in march when a witness was asked about it before the grand jury. i also want to note that prosecutors subpoenaed the document that he refers to and they still don't have it. it's unclear, one, what this document was, if it was indeed a

real document, though it appears by this transcript he does clearly think that he is in possession of something that he is showing them something that supports his argument against milley. at this point it's not clear that the government even has that document in its possession. we don't have the indictment at this point. it's unclear when that will be unsealed, but it would not be surprise going this audio recording or quotes from it come up in the indictment. at this point we don't know. it's clearly a piece of evidence that the former president's legal team acknowledges is a problem for him. >> this is remarkable in every way. go on cnn.com and read through your report because you have all of these stunning quotes in there. thank you for this. stick us with. let's bring in katelyn polantz, live outside the courthouse in miami where trump will appear tuesday afternoon. you were one of the reporters who broke the story of that taped conversation. this development to that is extremely significant. >> reporter: it is. poppy and phil, we knew what

this was going to sound like because it had been described to us, but to see the words there on the screen, to hear paula read those words that former president donald trump uttered after he left the white house in this meeti where it's capturing the sound of him rustling through papers where there were multiple witnesses in the room and, you know, the big question here, as paula was saying, is this going to be part of the charge explicitly? if it is, that sets this recording up to be a key piece of evidence as this heads to trial. it would be something that the justice department would very likely play to the jury almost certainly if that is part of what is indicted here as a retention charge and once they have that retention charge, that is something we know that is going be charged in the case because donald trump's attorney last night jim trusty said it would be. we don't know exactly what paper

it will be around, what classified documents. but if it is about this document he is describing in this audiotape and that episode is part of this from july 20, 2021 at bedminster, they have to prove two things. that donald trump knew he had a classified record or national defense information piece of paper in his possession, and that he was willfully keeping it from the federal government outside of a protected classification area. not that he has the ability to declassify it, although it is sensational he says as president i could have declassified but now i can't. but look at this, highly confidential, this is secret information, it doesn't really get much more explicit than that. >> it really doesn't. stay right there. let's bring in our colleague and

bring kaitlan collins who was on that team last creek. evan perez and former federal prosecutor elliot williams is with us and cnn political analyst and senior political correspondent for the "new york times" maggie haberman. paula reid back with us. i want to read part of this tryptophan. quote, as president i could have declassified but now i can't. perhaps the most stunning line of all of this. kaitlan collins, to you for your thoughts given you were a key part of this team that broke the original reporting. do you expect that that would be a key part when this indictment is unsealed? everyone will be looking for was this tape a key part of it because this was again about iran, this was about a key national security issue. >> yeah. and it completely undercuts everything that trump and his legal team said publicly about the powers he had after leaving office or what he could do with

the documents. that is one of those damning lines of this transcript that we reported on. there is a reason this tape caused so much consternation in trump's legal team. they didn't learn about it all that long ago. it was in march when this recording was played during testimony from another trump aide where they heard it and then trump's legal team was alerted to the fact that prosecutors did have this audio in their hands. and having trump on tape admitting that he doesn't have the power to declassify it, which we know because we raid the presidential records act, but it completely undercuts the defenses that you have seen trump's legal team offer up publicly. that's why this is a central piece in this reporting, in the bigger context of last night when the former president being indict inside this and now going where kaitlan is on tuesday to that miami courthouse, this is going to be something that is a real problem for his legal team to try to defend in court and explain. and it's something that they are

pretty candid about behind the scenes when it comes to how crucial this tape is. >> elliot, as a lawyer, when you look through or listen to that transcript, there is, yes, him acknowledging that he can't unilaterally declassify things by magic or after the fact. he also seems to be holding and talking about a desk -- what stands out to you as most problematic for the former president's legal team? >> what helps the former president that it appears they have not found this document and it appears based on what we know about the charges thus far he was not charged with disclosing the contents of a document to another person. that itself would have been a federal offense. if he had access to something sensitive and showed it to somebody else if it could hurt the national defense. look, a challenge here is that classification and declassification doesn't matter as an element of the offense its he is charged with. they are merely what matters is they are government records and,

most importantly, there was a series of acts taken to object instruct the justice department's investigation. so it's a little bit of a red herring to go down the road of saying, you know, if he declassified it, therefore there would have not been crimes because once the documents were removed, mishandled, misappropriated, whatever word you want to use that's when the crimes were committed and false statements or even tampering with witnesses potentially. >> maggie haberman, your reporting leading up to the bombshell reporting from paula in terms of how the president's team may defend this? >> i don't think they quite know how to defend this, poppy, from what we have heard. they were as kaitlan said startled by the existence of this tape. this tape was something that they learned existed when this aide to trump testified. the prosecutors were already in possession of this tape. they didn't get it from the aide, although it appears the

aide had a copy when it was subpoenaed later but this is has been described to us by multiple sources since you broke this incredible piece of reporting many days ago as a really problematic piece of evidence for trump. now, i think they are going to stick that their line, he says things, he didn't mean it a certain way. i am sure they can come up with all kinds you have explanations for why he used the language he used but it's on tape. one of the things that is striking is this is someone donald trump who is incredibly paranoid about people taking notes of what he says and people taking notes of what he is doing and here he is with people because he also has a habit of showing off when he is in certain meetings and trying to, you know, sort of puff himself up. and that, you know, is what many people close to him said they thought he was doing in this tape. it's not as if he didn't know tapes -- or audio recordings were rolling. he knew what he was doing and went ahead and said this.

we don't know whether this will be part of a criminal complaint but there is every reason to assume it would be because it's been said to me by several people this is the most significant piece of evidence that they know that the government has. >> the idea of the evidence or the various pieces of evidence that could end up in this indictment, we haven't heard from the justice department. the former president announced the indictment. his legal team doesn't have the indictment as far as we snow. we don't either. but get at that point the there seems to be between tapes, between folks, between, obviously, the witnesses, there is a lot to work with for what they are putting together. >> yes, there is. there is a lot to work with. and one of the things that i think we are looking for this morning, if the justice department goes to a judge and gets to release this indictment, the criminal complaint against a former president, what we are expecting to see is, you know, what they call a speaking indictment. an indictment that tells a

narrative. that really gives a lot of the information that they believe proves why the former president, a former president should be found guilty of violating multiple, multiple criminal laws. and if they don't do that, if this criminal indictment, this criminal information that they put out doesn't have those details at the start, i think what it does is it helps give the former president certainly continue to have the field to be able to mold and drive the narrative about what this case is about. he is already doing that. he is already doing that. and the fact is that the justice department probably, you know, if they had done this the right way, they should have had a judge already sign off on releasing this last night so that the public see what it is behind these charges. now, here is the deal wabout ths tape. it is possible they may not mention it in the criminal

complaint, but i would bet that they -- at some point when this goes to trial that they will present this because it will be proof, even if the fact that the former president didn't declassify things, right, what they want to prove is that the former president knew these things were national defense information and one way you prove it is by saying these things are classified and the president, former president, knew that. you can bet this is going be a part of the criminal case. >> paula, you're a lawyer. it's most apparent, i think, to everyone this could die into the first charge, willful retention of defense information. what i'm interested is your perspective if you sthi this could play into the latter charges, obstruction and false statements and the timeline because this is a record interesting 2021. he is already out of office. so what should we consider around that until at least we see the unsealed indictment? >> it's a great question, poppy. look, when we broke this story

last week it really changed -- i know my personal understanding of this investigation. kaitlan, our competition, maggie and i have been reporting on this for long time. it wasn't clear that the former president was going to go charged and if he was charged what they could charge him with beyond obstruction. but once we got this recording it was so clear this was going to be a key piece of evidence. it was obvious because in here he is admitting in his own word, this is a recording, one of the most damning kinds of evidence that a prosecutor can have against someone, admitting he willingly, knowingly retained secret information. he seems a little confused about the classification of this alleged document, but that is incredibly damning. we don't know where this document is. so i am sure that pollutrosecut are working on that -- if they don't have the -- why they don't have it back. also the fact he is undercutting his own claim of his power to declassify so any point in this

investigation they have argued again to prosecutors they didn't have to return something because he declassified it. this completely undercuts that and could potentially go to obstruction. but it will be interesting to see, we don't know at this point how this reporcording will fact in. it's one of the most valuable piece of evidence. as we reported before, this changed our entire understanding of this investigation. the time, right, the place, and the kind of evidence. i mean, the time this goes all the way back to the summer of 2021. it's a clear byear before the s mar-a-lago. he is at bed minister. we didn't believe any classified documents had been found at bedminster. this takes it to another theater. lastly, the former president is someone who very careful not to email, not to text. that has been an obstacle in previous investigations. they didn't have the kind of evidence that he needed to tying

him to alleged crimes and here for probably one the first times they had to recording and it is so incredibly damning. we are waiting to see if and when the justice department unseals this indictment how this factors in. it will likely be a key piece of evidence. it's the strongest thing we know from our reporting that they have so far. >> thanks to your reporting. now the american public knows the president's own words. stick around. a lot more ahead. this historic indictment of former president trump. what we're hearing from trump's camp. cnn special l live coverage continues next. now ports can n know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right on time. (vo) robots can predict breakdowns and order their own replacement parts. (foreman) nice work. (v(vo) and retailers can get ahead of the fashion trend of the day with a new line tomorrow. with a verizon private 5g network, you can get more agility and security. giving you more control of your business. we call this enterprise intelligence. from the network america relies on. the subway series is getting an upgrade!

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which is ludicrous under the facts of this case, and i could explain it, and obstruction-based type charges and false statement charges which are actually again kind of a crazy stretch just from the facts as we know it. there is a lot to pick at eventually from the defense side. that appears to be the charges and it appears to be something that we will get off the ground on tuesday. >> is there a conspiracy charge in here? >> i believe so. i don't have it front of me right now. again, this is not biblically accurate. i am not looking at a charging document. i am looking at a summary sheet. there language that may be reflecting a single count instead of two, but i think there is a conspiracy account, too. >> that donald trump's turn. helpfully detailing the specifics of the top -- or the seven charges that are in the indictment which we still haven't seen and didn't believe he had either. he had a summary. now, trump faces several federal

charges tied to his potential mishandling of classified documents. the former president has denied all wrongdoing, claims the investigation is a politically motivated sham. let's bring our team back, including the one and only kaitlan collins. i was fascinated. we had to be up very early, so i can't say i was awake for that interview, but i read the transcript this morning and re-read it and re-read it. what was your takeaway about how this legal team is going to to-operate going forward now this this moment has come. >> i like the dramatic music paradigm. to be clear, that wasn't playing in the actual interview. >> the whole show has the music behind me the entire time. >> trump's attorney was his first interview since the news of the indictment broke and he confirmed it is seven counts. maggie was one of the first to report last night what what some of those charges are.

so that was helpful. thee haven't seen the indictment yet. they got a summary of what these charges look like and so that's what he was able to shed light on last night talking about this. obviously, he maintains that his client is innocent and is defending him there but we drilled that the details what tuesday is going to look like. he says there is not going to be where trump is arrested. he will, obviously, go to that courthouse in miami where kaitlan is. the one question that he left the door open on is what trump's legal team is going to look like on tuesday. jim trusty is one of several attorneys handling the documents case. he said you have to wait to see who shows up with the former president. and he was the one who informed trump he been indicted. he talked about a mix of a reaction of anger at being indicted and defiance that he was indicted once again. jim trusty said that they essentially received this summary of what these charges look like and of course informed their client. but as we know, they had been bracing for this to happen.

they had actually prerecorded a video that trump put out shortly after and it was trump himself as evan noted who announced this, not the justice department. >> just because i was stuck on -- and you clearly perked up when he couldn't give you a straight answer on who would be with the president. why? is that because they don't know? is that because it's a decision that will be made going forward? is there an issue? what struck ounce that? >> i think it's because the trajectory of this investigation has gotten very serious very quickly. initially they had been in this period where they didn't believe that he was going to be indicted here, there was no real legal trouble. i think the audio recording changed as well as several other factors into this. it will be done in florida now, not in washington, which is what we had been expecting-. everything there happen in florida. it won't be split between florida and washington. i think a florida attorney would be helpful. he has two attorneys who are barred in florida on his team.

but it did sound very much like they are going to potentially have some shifting around of who is going to be there with him. >> elliot williams, now the question of defense and how do you go into the courtroom and defend your client. what was notable -- so much was notable in kaitlan's interview of jim trusty, getting what the charges were, including that conspiracy charge, also notable the fact that it sounded from trusty and trump's former lawyer tim parlatore in us this morning that they are going to try to argue multiple kountz of prosectorial misconduct that they have not presented evidence of but you heard a lot more of that defense on tv than the defenses the president made about declassification. >> let's talk -- when we talk a defense that issing you could use at trial and you won't be able to make a prosecutorial offense at trial. it's a legal question, right?

he will file a motion saying the prosecutors -- it's witch hunt -- >> a motion to dismiss? >> yeah, the indictment. he is not going to win on that absent some revelation of major misconduct by prosecutors or whatever and even if it reached that point a judge could move a prosecutor off the case or something like that. now, if it were to get to trial, the defense is virtually all of these crimes involve an element of willfulness, the person intended to commitment crime. we were talking about saying he could declassify documents that suggests willful possession because he knew he had had them and retained them. an argument at trial would be, you know, there are a lot of documents, it's chaotic at the end of an administration, we didn't know where the boxes were, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, how could you possibly convict the defendant of it this crime? back to the -- >> he is holding a document in bedminster a year after he leaves office that he says -- i know it's classified.

>> i am telling you what a defense -- >> yeah, yeah, yeah. >> this is a prosecutor now. >> it is -- it is based on what is publicly available now, i hesitate to say damning evidence, but it is not good for this defendant. it really is not. that's the lemonade you have to make because at trial you really are in effect barred from making an argument about the prosecutors because you ywould have resolved that by the time you get there. >> the political reporter in me is watching what the current trump attorney was telling kaitlan last night and pitching to katlyn last night with the former trump attorney tim parlatore talking to us this morning about they are seeding the messaging ground now. and i understand that's not what prosecutors want to do, i think they understand that. why are they deciding to deep t -- keep the indictment sealed? what is their thought process to the extent we know it because of how closely held they have kept things about the fact that the president's got free run right

now to try to lay the groundwork messaging-wise? >> it's not just the political and the fact that the public sphere has been seeded to the former president who let's just say has a history of lying about everything, right? so big and small. things big and small the former president will just lie about. the problem for the justice department is there are real consequences to letting donald trump run with the, again, with an open field, and that includes, of the course, what we saw after the search in august. we saw someone go to an fbi field office, try to attack it. there were threats against fbi agents who carried out the search because their names were in court documents that the former president posted on his social media page, the names of those people, essentially encouraging people to go after those people. so that's the reason why it's dangerous to seed the ground to the former president.

now, the reason why, you know, the justice department is behaving this way is i think merrick garland and the former -- sorry, the special counsel believe that they should just speak through their court documents. they don't want to engage and litigate this stuff in the public sphere, in the media. and i get that. but they are making a nmistake. it's clear they are making a mistake and i think there are some conversations going on in the building today about, you know, how quickly can we get a judge to unseal this, are we going to wait until tuesday when the former president to miami for his appearance and does jack smith owe the public a public appearance where he speaks to the cameras. he doesn't have to take questions, but explains what his team has done over the past 18 months and why they have done this and what's the importance of this work. and i think, you know, if -- again, they don't have to engage in the politics of this, but that is important for the

institutions of this country to hear from people who are behind this not only from court documents for months and months to come. >> transparency. paula reid, let's end on you. this is your stunning reporting. what should people be left with this this morning? >> well, i agree with evan wholeheartedly. even a member of the former president's legal team told me that they were a little surprised that the justice department called them knowing this would come out on social media and had not already lined upper mission to unseal this indictment. if they want to speak through their indictments, that's fine. speak through your indictment and make it public. we know that the former president is not always truthful in his statements. he has an incentive to spin the narrative about what is happening in this criminal case his way. in the absence of nothing from the special counsel the country is relying on good accurate reporting. the entire team, we are trying to make sure that the american people understand the facts ever what is happening here and that's why this reporting both

the original scoop on the existence of this recording and now the transcript is so critical until the special counsel gets around to unsealing this indictment. >> that's right. and that could be today. it should be soon. right? that is for transparency reasons. they could wait until 3:00 on tuesday. thank very much, evan, elliot, kaitlan chltz appreciate it. once again, donald trump and america are in totally unprecedented territory. congressman daniel goldman served as lead counsel for the democrats in trump's first impeachment trial. he joins us in studio coming up next.

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. welcome back to special coverage. we have more on our breaking news this morning. cnn obtaining the transcript of that audio recording from 2021 of president trump acknowledging he had retained, quote, secret military information that he did not declassify. he was showing those alleged documents to people kwo did not have security clearance. that recording now in the hands of federal prosecutors. joining us now to discuss former prosecutor himself democratic congressman daniel goldman, served as lead counsel in trump's first impeachment trial. thanks for joining us. to start with, you heard paula's reporting, what's your takeaway in the context of things given

we haven't seen the actual indictment yet? >> it means a lot. every single thing donald trump ever said can be admitted at a trial. and so what you have here is him admitting in secret that he knows that the documents he had were not declassified and he knows that they are classified information. the difference between a criminal case and any civil case is you have to show that knowledge. that's what draws a distinction between donald trump's case and joe biden and mike pence where the question here is, is it knowingly and intentionally done to maintain possession of those documents and then to refuse to give them back? and so what he is essentially doing is neutering all of the public defenses that he made. the prosecutors will be able show his public defense and then show the recording and it will eviscerate all of the credibility of his defense. >> you are a prosecutor. can you help us understand why

the justice department would not have unsealed the indictment already, would not have gone to a judge and ask for it to be a able to be unsealed -- >> that's standard. >> you think until tuesday no one's gonna see it? >> yep. >> you do? >> mm-hmm. >> do you agree with what we just heard from our colleagues, paula, evan, et cetera, for the sake of the country, for transparency, we should hear from the special counsel before tuesday? maybe not taking questions, but explaining why this he did this -- >> take off your prosecutor hat, use your congressman/political knowledge. >> american citizen hat. >> well, you know. >> i understand why you all and we really want it. but the important thing to remember is the department of justice has done everything by the book with this case. and their whole rationale has been from the day merrick garland was nominated, where he said he was going to follow the facts and the law, to where we are today, which is they are doing things by book.

this is how investigations are done. we want to see the indictment. it's friday. that's going to be tuesday. in the grand scheme of things, it's not that long to wait. sure, i want see the indictment. we will see it tuesday. i don't know that there is a compelling reason why we need to hear from the special counsel or the attorney general before tuesday. that's what happened in the manhattan case. we had a delay, you recall, and didn't get the indictment until the day of and the district attorney made a comment that day. >> so in the many time, the president, even before the former president and his team, even before the indictment came down, have been reaching out to allies on capitol hill. you work across the aisle from them. you're on committees where they are on the other side, some of the leading voices in support of the president. you ask what's in the grand scheme of things. in this moment in time they are the ones that are out there making very clear while the justice department is staying silent that this is a dark day for the country, this is, you know, a weaponization of the justice department. you don't feel like the justice

department has any -- there is no necessity for them to counter that will facts? >> so, yes, they would love to. and there is no question that there is a complete imbalance in terms of messaging and public relations. but the nature of a prosecution is that the department of justice will only speak through indictments, through public information, through court information. they are not going to respond to all these allegations. i can respond because what they are saying is total garbage. it's gibberish. the notion that kevin mccarthy has said that this is an affront on the rule of law. you know what he says? he says because he was a former president and because he is a candidate for elected office. our country was founded on the rule of law, and that means that we are a government of laws, not men. and that there is no one above the law. that's what the rule of law means. the rule of law does not mean we can't charge a former president and we can't charge a candidate

for elected office. if that were the case ka, every member of congress could never be charged. >> this is all about actions after the presidency, too. i mean, just to put a fine point on it -- >> there is no question special counsel mueller who adhered to that memo in the department of justice very, very closely, played everything as much by the book to department of justice protocol, said and other republicans have acknowledged, senator mcconnell acknowledged there is nothing prohibiting donald trump from being indicted when he is not the president. you could make an argument you can be when the president. is a bastardization of the rule of law and we cannot allow that kind of rhetoric to stand. >> we wanted to ask you about president biden's classified document investigation. it goes on. there is a different special counsel, robert her. there are a lot of differences. but this is still ongoing and we have heard trump's team in the last 12 hours bring that up a

lot. >> they are going to bring up everything they can. what you are going to see, and this is the critical difference, you will see donald trump and all of his backers in congress both use the court of public opinion to try to frame this. unfortunately, i expect that we will see the official authority of congress being used to support donald trump, a private sut zen, criminal defense -- they are going to open investigations. >> special counsel, you think? >> of course. look what they did with the manhattan dirty air, a local district attorney, and opened an investigation that came to new york city for some sham crime in new york city when crime all around the country is in many cases worse. they will use their official power as a taxpayer funded defense team for donald trump. the problem that donald trump has and the problem with this recording is that be played out in a court of law. and there are very specific and different rules and all of his

political defenses, all of the congressional defenses will be irrelevant to what happens in court and what happens with his court case. >> congressman daniel goldman, you have some experience in these types of issues, transcripts, too, if i recall correctly from your past life. appreciate the time. >> thank you, guys. >> should note if they go after -- if they open investigations in jack smith, this is a prosecutor who has gone after republicans in office and after and democrats. >> there is no basis to think that anything was done other than by the book. >> thank you. appreciate it, congressman. donald trump's faithful supporters gathering outside mar-a-lago overnight. we will take you live there. and the 2024 candidates are sounding off on their opponents. keep in mind, technically their opponent's indictment. some taking automatic at doj. some at the president. how republicans are reacting coming up next.

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trump's faithful supporters gathering near mar-a-lago in florida proclaiming his

innocence. he is expected to return ahead of his arraignment in tuesday in miami. trump supporters think the charges will give him a political boost. randi kaye is live in palm beach. you saw this play out in real time? >> reporter: i did, poppy. we were here a short time after news broke of the indictment yesterday evening and there were quite a few protesters gathered here coming out to support the former president as you know, this is ground zero, where this case originated 15 boxes of documents removed from mar-a-lago more than 300 documents marked as classified document. so i spoke with his supporters last night. there are a few here this morning, very peaceful, very quiet, but they said they were going to come back today. last night they said they believe this is a witch hunt and one called it political garbage. another suggested it that perhaps some of these documents were planted here at mar-a-lago. listen to what one protester told me. >> i mean, they don't want him to run for president.

they have to go after him in some fashion, so that's what they are doing. no surprise to anybody. we already knew this was gonna happen. >> this is only firing him up more. the people who don't know president trump, the more they go after him, the harder he fights and he is not fighting for himself. he is fighting for the people. >> reporter: and there was a lot of horn honking as well while we were here during that time and many of them yelling out their window, lock him up. so certainly mixed feelings about the former president and this case. i should note as you mentioned, he is going to return here before heading to miami for his court date on tuesday, expected to be here on monday. i spoke with the palm beach county sheriff's department and palm beach police earlier this morning. they said they are likely going to be taking their marching orders from the secret service. of course, mar-a-lago sits on the intercoastal, also on corn boulevard on the ocean, so they have quite a few areas to protect. they said that they will be

looking into protecting the waterways here, southern boulevard as well as looking at mar-a-lago from the air and making sure that it is secure. poppy. >> randi kaye, thank you very much. how will trump's legal issues impact the race? what does it mean for the politics of it all. cnn senior political commentator scott jennings and republican strategist david urban. >> why are you starting to laugh? >> i'm trying to read, you're laughing. >> you act like we know. >> you have a lot of past precedent you can point to, to some degree. tell us what's going to happen over the course -- no, i think this is important. and i think you could listen to the voices that were spoken to last night and you know where that kind of chunk of the republican party, former president's base, ain't going anywhere. they are rock solid. my biggest question and i have been asking this all morning, probably boring poppy at this

point. >> never. >> but if you are in a republican campaign and he is leading by 30 points and this massive thing happens and the only thing you can do is not attack him on it for fear of losing support, how can you possibly win a primary? >> i don't think you can. right? i think that's the answer, right? think about this. 74 million people voted for president trump in 2020. the numbers he is polling someplace in the 30, 40s. assume there is 25, 26 million, 30 million americans still love and follow donald trump. and you are not going to be able to proi thosepry those folks fr. the president will double down on being indignant and saying yesterday and in previous -- after the alvin bragg indictment. there is not going to be any -- people will flock to him and feel that this is a political prosecution and, you know, i think scott and i talked about this before, the best thing doj could do -- i don't want to step

on his line, is what, scott? >> if i were hunter biden i would be nervous. the republican answer to these overnight has been how is it that donald trump's the only person -- you have hunter biden running around doing stuff, joe biden documents in the garage, hillary clinton bleecaching servers. the one die under federal investigation -- i was postulating outside. what if they did indict him, would take that off the table? >> to -- >> other things -- >> to be clear, all of those things had been investigated or parts -- >> what i'm saying, it's happening right now. but the republican mindset is if you're a republican or if you're donald trump you are held to one standard and if you are the other people -- >> that's the mindset. >> mindset is different than facts -- >> but they could be true at the s same, right? the mindset that -- held by a third of americans is true and correct. those could both exist to be

true. >> as a former strategist for former president trump, i found it interesting that jonathan turley said he can really, really run on had effectively and even run on pardoning himself. >> i don't think he would have to pardon himself. >> no, run on that. >> i do -- oh, running -- if you elect me -- >> yes, yes. >> i pardon myself? >> would you advise if you were in the camp. >> that's the campaign motto, pardon me, trump '24? no, i don't think that's a great strategy. i think the strategy is i did nothing wrong here. i think that the strategy these documents i declassified them. i have the authority to do so. >> we know from paula reid's reporting -- >> that's a strategy i would run on. if people are waiting to see donald trump in the box during a trial, that's not gonna happen. here's what's gonna happen. there will not be a trial in this case ever. i am just saying. it will happen in 2025 if it's gonna happen. donald trump is going to become president and there won't be a trial. that's what's gonna happen.

>> you raised your eyebrows? >> there is polling that indicates that a majority of americans take these cases seriously. even though republicans in the short term are rallying to trump. independents -- >> it's not like a one or two point majority. >> independents don't like this. if he is under these clouds and he never got a majority of the popular vote or the most popular votes twice. has anything happened since that to change that? highly unlikely if you are under four -- two, three, four indictments this enhances your chances of winning -- >> this is actually the point i wanted to get at. i have been trying to figure out how any republican opponent if they can't attack him on this could possibly win. the spin forward, which i think is relevant to somebody you are close to in terms of the senate minority leader and there is a reason republican leaders in the senate have not said a lot this point, the ability to deep the house, there is a general election, too. love the primaries. there is a general election.

this is -- if you are a republican looking around right now -- >> well, this cannot be viewed as a positive development. >> let me push back on you because look at the individual maps. in the smithenate. the battleground is in west virgi virginia, iowa, and montana. donald trump could get indicted 400 times and he will win those states by 30 plus points. >> you think brown is going to lose by -- >> no. >> okay, so -- >> if you are thinking about the senate map, running in red states and really no republicans on defense. >> can i take you guys really quickly to this sound because i've been talking about peter baker's great analysis in the "times" this morning pointing out this sound. this is trump in 2016. watch. >> in my administration i'm going to enforce all laws concerning the protection of

classified information. no one will be above the law. >> one of the first things we must do is to enforce all classification rules and to enforce all laws relating to the handling of classified information. >> we also need the best protection of classified information. hillary's private email scandal, which put our classified information in the reach of our enemies, disqualifies her from the presidency. totally. >> i bet he regrets that. >> then he actually acted on it. >> they signed a law making the penalties even stiffer over this. yeah. >> look, it's serious stuff. i said this last night, right? >> but the irony of it -- >> the phraseology espionage act and the same word as you're running for president, being charged with a violation of the espionage act hits different than obstruction. it viscerally feels differently

and i think americans will receive it differently. >> you do? >> it's a much more serious charge. but, again, i don't think it changes the outcome. i will quote joe biden, don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative and i think republicans will look at that and say we will take trump and let's say tim scott over joe biden and kamala harris any day. i think that's what you're going to see. >> david scott, thank you very much, so nice to have you. former president trump says that he was summoned to appear at a federal courthouse in miami on tuesday. next we are going to ask a former federal prosecutor at the u.s. attorney's office there what we should expect. there e were no surprises. well, my monthly payment did come o out lower than expected. financing my car with carvana was super smooth. [announcer] finance your next car with carvana today. (christina) with verizon business unlimited, i get 5g, truly unlimited data, and unlimited hotspot data. so, no matter what, i'm running this kitchen. (vo) make the switch. it's your business. it's your verizon.

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there -- is going to be brought there? no one knows better than richard gregory, a renowned former federal prosecutor there. thank you so much for taking the time. i want to start with -- i want to get into florida a little bit, but i want to start with what you've seen given your experience that's been reported about the indictment up to this point. what stands out to you? >> well, i think right now we haven't seen the actual indictment itself. so i think people are doing a little bit of speculation, but what i would tell you is that in the local rules if a case -- the events in a case take place in a particular county, in this case palm beach county, the case most likely would be tried in the palm beach courthouse. there are federal courthouses in key west, in miami, in fort lauderdale, in palm beach and in fort pearce. so this particular case would go to palm beach, i assume.

>> you are quoted in a really interesting new piece, the headline is "prosecuting politicians is hard here: why south florida is a tough place for the doj to try trump." your quote is prosecuting politicians is hard here. why is it to hard here? >> well, i think that miami is a very interesting city and it's one where we have a citizenry made up of people who came from a lot of different places. miami is full of cubans, new yorkers, hondurans, people from haiti. we have a great mixture and the trust in government is sometimes at issue. this is also the place where we tried falco in the 1990s and three jurors were convicted of being paid off.

so it's a very difficult place to -- to guess or try to speculate on how a jury is going to take a particular information. this case will be interesting because it isn't really as much a political case as it might be a case of national security, and i think if you give a miami jury a case that involves the national security, you have a lot of potential jurors who are coming from places where they are very concerned about national security. >> george, we have about a minute left. can you take us inside are prosecutors thinking about that? are they thinking about locations? are they thinking about makeup? are they thinking about the melting bottle emt of a particular place where they may bring a case? >> i would hope that the team that's going to be prosecuting this case is going to include a

member from the southern district of florida. i think that's a very important thing to do when you're trying a case. i know defense attorneys will tell you that if you are going to be tried in a particular case you want to have a local lawyer on your team so that he has some feel for who he's trying the case before, how they react to certain facts and certain evidence. i would certainly hope that the prosecution team in this case would include somebody from the southern district of florida just so that they would have that kind of input. it's very interesting, i mean, if you ask any other situation in life in the united states of america where you could get 12 u.s. citizens to sit together who don't know each other and agree to any fact beyond a reasonable doubt, i think you would find that very difficult. >> richard gregorie, thank you for the insight very much this morning. >> glad to be with you.

what a morning it is, what a night it was last night when this news broke, again, history being made. the first time ever any u.s. president has been faced with federal charges. >> i think it's also a recognition that this is a moment that isn't just a one day, 12 hour, one night. this is reality going forward. this is reality on the legal side, this is reality on the political side, this is reality for the country. >> and stunning to have this new reporting this hour from our colleague paula reid with the words of former president trump on tape about knowing how to declassify what is classified. it goes to the heart of a lot of this. we will have much more coverage throughout the day of all of this and then the president will appear in federal court on tuesday. >> tuesday. >> our special coverage of the federal indictment of donald trump continues right now. >> have a great weekend, folks. ♪