one in july of 2021, which is the audio recording that paula and the team have been reporting on for the last couple of weeks. the prosecutors cite the conversations that the former president is having with people in that room. there is -- right there it shows you that trump showed and described a plan of attack that trump said was prepared for him by the department of defense, and mark milley, who is, of course, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff. he showed a representative of his political action committee. the second one is he showed a representative of his political action committee, who did not have a security clearance, a classified map related to a military operation. those are the two instances that the can prosecutors cite in this document as, you know, the former president sharing information with people who are not cleared to have it. secondly, the obstruction of justice charges. according to prosecutors, the

former president suggested to his attorney that he falsely tell the fbi and the grand jury that they didn't have any documents, and they go through chapter and verse of his conversations with evan corcoran, who is identified here as attorney number one. they also say that the former president directed his valet, his assistant, his aide, walt nauta, to move boxes back and forth to conceal them from evan corcoran before corcoran did a search, and then was able to tell the justice department there were fewer documents than there really were at mar-a-lago. again, the justice department saying these are some of the things that the former president did to try to get his attorney to hide or destroy documents. he said that they -- they say he provided the fbi with just only some of the documents that had been demanded under a grand jury subpoena. and he's also caused a

certification to be submitted to the fbi saying they were producing all the documents, when, as you know, when the fbi did a search at mar-a-lago in august, they found hundreds of additional classified documents. again, this is a 49-page indictment of the former president and his aide, walt nauta, they are both charged. this is a case that will be heard in miami or in the southern district of florida. it is right now assigned to a judge that was appointed by the former president. this is, of course, something that will go down on tuesday when the former president is brought down to miami, is formally arrested and processed before entering a plea to these charges. >> right. for anyone listening, so obviously, two individuals, two incidents i should say where trump showed documents, two individuals that didn't have security clearances, including a room full of individuals working on the autobiography of his

former chief of staff, mark med dose. you can just go to google and look up mar-a-lago intruder and there are a number of individuals that have gotten in there. in terms of the documents, point three says the unauthorized disclosure of these documents could put at risk the national security of the united states, foreign relations, the safety of the u.s. military, human sources, the continued viability of sensitive intelligence methods, it includes u.s. nuclear programs, potential vulnerabilities of the u.s., and plans for retaliation in response to a foreign attack. it's just staggering. evan just mentioned walt nauta, who has been also indicted. what are the charges he's facing, and what is his alleged role in this? >> we've been following walt nauta for some time. he's one of the first people we asked about when we were curious about whether or not anyone would be charged in this case. he had been under a lot of pressure to cooperate to avoid

charges, specifically charges of making false statements to investigators during the course of this investigation. now, here yet he is facing false statement charges. but the president's attorneys argued if walt is not going to cooperate, they won't have any case against the former president. clearly that is not true. this case does not rest on the testimony of the cooperation of walt nauta. instead, it appears to be built on the testimony of dozens of people who have gone before the grand jury. almost every single one of them worked for former president trump. in addition to that, they have the audio recording that we reported last week. they have phone records, other evidence, including these incredible photographs showing the boxes just sitting in the ballroom for walt nauta moved them. they're sitting in a ballroom where they are having events for two months, some of the nation's most sensitive secrets. it is interesting. for so long, people were saying the case rested on walt nauta

where it does not. he's facing charges, so he has an incentive to cooperate. but we know that he's currently in bedminster, new jersey, with the former president. has a trump aligned lawyer, so it does not appear that he is -- i have to say, read thing indictment, there has been such incredible reporting here at cnn about this investigation. it confirms so many of the things we said, but it also shows that we had a sliver of the evidence that the special counsel has. this is a speaking indictment, laying out the extraordinary amount of information that they have collected, and i'm just hearing in my hear a couple more minutes we'll hear from jack smith. he'll probably take a few minutes to give brief remarks. it will be fascinating to see what he says. this is maybe halftime of his job there. >> incredible reporting,

including the information you broke today that is contained in this indictment, having to do with the transcript of the audiotape where donald trump is tell thing room full of mark meadows employees about this top secret document. evan, this document is full of firsthand information, text messages, transcripts, photographs, testimony, including testimony or things that were memorialized by trump's attorneys, which i suspect means they wrote it down at the time. trump saying would it be better if we just told them we don't have anything here, a lie about the fact that they had classified documents. this is firsthand information -- we're being told right now that jack smith and his team are coming out. so let's listen in. >> good afternoon. today, an indictment was

uns unsealed, charging donald j. trump of violations of our national security laws, as well as participating in a conspiracy to obstruct justice. this indictment was voted on by a grand jury of the citizens in the southern district of florida. i invite everyone to read it in full to understand the scope and the gravity of the crimes charged. the men and women of the united states intelligence community and our armed forces dedicate their lives to protecting our nation and its people. our laws that protect national defense information are critical to the safety and security of the united states and they must be enforced. violations of those laws put our country at risk. adherence to the rule of law is a bedrock principle of the department of justice. and our nation's commitment to the rule of law sets an example

for the world. we have one set of laws in this country, and they apply to everyone. applying those laws, collecting facts, that's what determines the outcome of an investigation. nothing more and nothing less. the prosecutors in my office are among the most talented and experienced in the department of justice. they have investigated this case to the highest ethical standards and will continue to do so as this case proceeds. it's very important for me to note that the defendants in this case must be presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law. to that end, my office will seek a speedy trial in this matter, consistent with the public interest and the rights of the accused. we very much look forward to presenting our case to a jury of

citizens in the southern district of florida. in conclusion, i would like to thank the dedicated publicer is vam -- public servants with the federal bureau of investigation with whom my office conducted this investigation and worked tirelessly every day upholding the rule of law in our country. i'm deeply proud to stand shoulder to shoulder with them. thank you very much. >> why did you decide to bring the case in florida? >> that was special counsel jack smith. we knew he wasn't going to take questions, even though one eager reporter attempted there, talking about the federal charges facing former president donald trump and one of his aides. the indictment released this afternoon, detailing 37 charges facing mr. trump, including the willful retention of national defense information and obstruction of justice. let's discuss with my panel. mark, let me start with you. i want you to translate for us,

when jack smith says that they are going to pursue a speedy trial pursuant to all the rights the accused has. how soon will this began? >> he is aware that the department of justice has a policy that they don't want to do anything to interfere with the election. we have over 500 days from the first election and two months from the first debate, then the primaries. he's aware of that. and the talking point is out there. trying to undermine the idea that add heerns -- he is trying to confirm to the people of the united states who are hearing him right now that they are going to do everything they can now. that does not mean that the judge or everyone else in this case will do everything they can to do this before any of those timelines. if, for example, donald trump secures the rnc nomination, and if he's able to become the

president of the united states yet again, and win over the democratic incumbent, now you can no longer pursue a case against a sitting president, based on doj guidelines. and so the speed and the timing will both be a friend and a foe of jack smith. >> and andy mccabe, as a former fbi official, is it unusual that the justice department decided to release the indictment today? and if so, why do you think they did? >> the normal order is the indictment is sealed until the defendant is presented at court -- >> which will be tuesday in miami. >> that's right, about the same time today. so that's how it normally happens. i'm surprised that they released it early here, simply because i think it would have been in their advantage to be able to say we followed the normal process with respect to this remarkable defendant in every possible instance. however, i think that doj

capitulated in some respect to the enormous pressure put on them by we in the media and political figures saying this is so volatile, the american people need to see the facts today. that's what they did. but this press conference, this was like a cover letter, right? there was no substance here. what jack smith wants us to do is read the indictment. he started his comments by saying exactly that. we have one set of laws protecting information for national security sake is important around read the indictment. >> dana bash, a lot of the republicans out there running for president against donald trump, with the exceptions of chris christie and asa hutchinson, a lot running to donald trump's defense. >> i just got a text from a veteran republican strategist, not affiliated with any of the presidential campaigns, saying if a candidate can't make an effective argument that this guy might be in jail, i don't know what they can do. >> they probably won't. i mean, many of the candidates -- even down to

former vice president mike pence who you were speaking to just a couple of days ago, not wanting to talk about it. really going out of his way today to discuss -- to not discuss the substance of this case. pence is not quite in the asa hutchinson camp, not quite in the -- maybe the chris saununu r chris christie camp, but he is taking the premise that trump violated his oath on january 6th and should not be president again. but he is reluctant, it seems, at this very moment. that could change in the future, but right now is reluctant to weigh in on this case. a lot of these candidates, a lot of republicans right now, probably understand what the poll numbers have showed us over a long period of time, which is at the very least, half of the republicans have been willing to give trump a pass on this case and many others. will that change based on this

indictment? we don't know. but a lot of republicans in the field right now are looking to see where the wind is blowing to determine where they go, and not enough time has passed. >> i would say beyond reluctant. we saw pence come out with his announcement and finally say these things. on the other hand, he also said he did not think charges should be pursued against trump. no one should be above the law, but don't do this. >> let's talk about the substance, if we can. we'll talk to former governor asa hutchinson in the show. he's calling for donald trump to drop out of the race. when you read the indictment, it's stunning. it's entirely credible, because it's based on contemporaneous notes, texts, and traps crypts. >> also important to note when you craft an indictment, you want to prove your case. probable cause to make the count. there's a lot in there.

also a lot not in there. you don't have to put it all in there. so what they put in there, text messages, trump's conferversati with lawyers, this is donald trump and the people around him. >> i want to talk about what we just heard from donald trump. we never heard his voice -- or heard from jack smith. we never heard his voice before. that was an economy of words, but they were very important words. he said donald trump put our country at risk. he's trying to break through to all americans, especially the 35% of americans who believe anything donald trump tells them. donald trump says this is casual, this is not a big deal. that was the special counsel saying donald trump put our country at risk, put the intelligence services and the men and women in the military at risk. then when he defended the work of the fbi, he is very aware, even though his job is to prove this case in court, he understands the political argument. donald trump has attacked the fbi for months and months, but

is forcefully doing so now. a member of the house republican party, andy banks, says this is time for an eye for an eye, and we have reached a war phase. january 6th is not too far in the rear-view mirror. you have people who put their hand on a bible or swore an oath to the constitution who are saying, donald trump is innocent until proven guilty. however, the words of elected officials, leadership officials, people in positions of authority are incredibly important always, but all the more so at this moment. you have these -- you have republican officials who, even before they saw this indictment, said these charges were baseless. the special counsel, his test is in a court of law. but he was trying right there to say at least please read the damn thing. >> an obvious note, but donald trump was elected in 2016 in no small part because he was taking

issue with hillary clinton's treatment of classified documents on her email server. "lock her up" was about her recklessness with classified information. >> you're making a great point. look at the photographs in that. lock her up because of the email server. >> right. >> hundreds of documents, maps, military information, nuclear information. >> show the one of all the documents spilled out that had the five allies of the united states, australia, new zealand, and others, uk, and these are documents that are only accessible, only allowable to be seen by people in the intelligence community in these five countries, and there is a photograph that, i'm sure our team will find of the documents spilled all over the storage room in a facility that is not secure. >> it's the opposite of secure.

that ballroom had hundreds of events during this period of time. >> is that it? >> there you go. >> that's the -- put it back, guys. okay. i don't know what's going on. the documents spilled all over the ground. andy, if you worked for the intelligence community of new zealand, australia, the uk, et cetera, and you saw that these are documents, our intelligence alliance, what would you think? >> it's one of the many ways this activity makes us less safe, because it discourages our allies, even our closest -- >> that's it right there, the photograph. >> that group, in that group, we enjoy unfettered information sharing from our very closest friends. this is the sort of thing that makes them think twice before they share their most sensitive information with us. >> andy, if i may, jake, the -- you've not had the greatest

history with donald trump, but you have an incredible history looking at indictments and being a part of major investigations. have you ever seen an indictment quite like this? >> this is extraordinary. i've worked on and around many mishandling cases, espionage act cases, i've never seen an indictment with this level of granularity, detail, the photographs, just to mention those photographs, to drive home this point of what you were just referring to, jake, that the unmitigated recklessness of how our most sensitive information was handled. it's off the charts. stratospheric. >> this is not the presidential -- this is not like george w. bush's home, guarded by secret service agents. this is a hotel. >> it's a public entity that has a long history of intruders, people with suspicious backgrounds, being taken into custody and investigated for the activities they engaged there. so it's absolutely a spy's

dream. >> it's foreign nationals, i just want to remind everyone, that storage room, even once they get some boxes in the storage room, you may all remember, there was no lock on the storage room. and if you read the indictment carefully, it talks about how oh, it was right next door to where they keep the glasses and the liquor, and there were all of these exits and entrances to it. just a former senior justice source just texted me, this is, to your point, the mother of all talking indictments. he's never seen this level of detail. >> this detail is an ongoing threat. this was used in this way or distributed in this way or perhaps disseminated. look at the human element that jack smith talked about, the people who are in idanger. this is really a part of a greater discussion to be having, and this indictment is not even

the report that is due to merrick garland. >> so let's throw it back to anderson in new york. >> the team here in new york, we have all just been poring over the 49 pages of this indictment. you've looked at a lot of indictments. discussions with trump attorney one, he said, i don't want anybody looking for my boxes. i really don't. i don't want you looking through my boxes, and he said, what happen it is we just don't respond at all and don't play ball with them, wouldn't be better if we just told them we don't have them here? later telling the same attorney, who was at that point removing some documents, bringing them to his hotel room. the attorney said, he made a funny motion like well, take them with you to your hotel room, and if there's anything in there, pluck it out. he didn't say those words. >> the level of detail here is remarkable. the job of any prosecutor in any scenario is to tell the story

and make it matter. when you look at the brief remarks we just heard from jack smith and the indictment, we manages to do just that. yes, there is an extraordinary amount of detail. quotes, nexts, documents, photos. but he tells a story that is very digestible. the president took these documents, he tried to hide them and he lied about it. that's it. anyone can understand that. and he made it matter. he said, this is not about pieces of paper and cardboard boxes but national security and the integrity of our criminal justice system. so he took a very prosecutorial approach -- >> he also ran through what the documents were about. information about weapons and defense capabilities, potential vulnerabilities of the united states, plans for possible retaliation, response to a foreign attack, and the unauthorized disclosure could put the national security of the united states at risk. >> in particular the vulnerabilities jumped out at me.

>> david? >> as someone who worked in the white house, this is stunning. we all had safes in our office to store documents much less sensitive than these. and to look at those documents, you had to be in the situation room, not wolf's, but the real one, oarr in a skiff. and for very good reason. my question, honestly, is this just a function of ego? because these documents are incredibly valuable. i mean, there are governments and actors all over the world who would like to get their hands on these documents. i guess we will find out. >> it will be interesting to see if there is any correlation between the documents. do they describe certain countries in particular? are those countries mr. trump might like to have business dealings with? why those documents? >> you'll hear probably a talking point that will emerge

in defense of the former president. we have an overclassification problem. and we do have an overclassification problem. these are not documents that are overclassified. these are things like nuclear secrets. i'll tell you, anderson, just for two years, i flew the kc-135, the air refuel we are a nuclear mission. we would go into practice our nuclear mission. we had to have top secret clearance to do that. we weren't allowed to take notes. we weren't even allowed to know where our supposed target was. and these documents, what you're seeing, particularly the nuclear ones and the ones that stand out to me, appears to be all of those secrets out there in the bathroom for somebody to go root through and find out. >> you know, i just look at this, and the context that david did and the context that andy mccabe did, as a former assistance deputy director of national intelligence, you work in a world of these documents. but it meant you had to get a top secret clearance, you had to

go through a polygraph exam, you had to work in a skiff of lead-lined walls. there were no cell phones allowed in the building or in the skiff in case somebody might have taken a picture or a document. when you get through what was the day-to-day routine life of living in the classified world, and then you change channels to mar-a-lago were they are certifying to the fbi and to the doj that there are no more documents on the same day they're loading them on a plane in boxes to fly them to bedminster, classified documents were going on the donald trump road show between different resorts, stored in a shower, a bathroom, a ballroom. >> and his attorneys are coming to look to certify where the documents were. >> when you look at the complete and utter lack of discipline, and in violation of security protocols, but also federal law that had become routine, it's just -- if you have gone through the proper handling of these

documents, as several of us at this table have, it's stunning. >> it's not just a lack of discipline, there's a lot of intent in this indictment. he's telling his -- >>sloppiness. >> he suggested that his attorney hide or destroy documents called for by the grand jury subpoena. when you look at this evidence that clearly they have, and we don't even have the full scope of it, but when you look at the detail of this, i'm thinking about the fact that the top two attorneys litigating this for several months since the search at mar-a-lago in august, have departed the legal scene. >> sbthe attorney you interview last night, who was talking about tuesday, 3:00, miami, he's gone. >> i asked last night, because this always happens with trump's legal teams. something happens to them, and they both resigned this morning. >> you were trying to pin them down on which attorneys were in

the courtroom. >> he said we'll see. what i'm told is they are searching for a florida-based attorney. that person hasn't even started yet. he's going to court on friday. jack smith talked about a speedy trial, but it's striking that the two attorneys who know this the best are no longer on the legal team to deal with this. >> just a few weeks before that, the one attorney, this was his portfolio and that team of lawyers also left. and we have talked about kind of the in fighting and meltdowns that are typical within the trump legal teams, which are revolving. >> one of the things that was pointed out in this indictment are past statements that the then candidate trump or even president trump said about classified documents. in said, in my administration, i'm going to enforce all laws concerning classified information. september 6, he said we can't have someone in the oval office who doesn't understand the

meaning of the word confidential or classified. >> i'm not surprised with the hypocrisy in those statements and his behavior. if you remember that one night when the photo of those documents sprawled out at mar-a-lago, it was like the first time we saw the documents outside of a safe area, he would lead us to believe that was it. that was all i had. it was an accident. and now we see photos of boxes upon boxes, with high national security risks, that he knew he had in that very moment just months ago. so to think in 2016 for him to say that, that is his character, his behavior. there is this feeling of him -- david, you said his ego. it is -- that is bigger than ego. i have a real question about what he was going to do with those documents and why he wanted to continue to hide them

after he knew that the search was going to happen. he tried to really bring in his lawyer and have him lie to the department of justice. the level of intent behind his behavior is not surprising, but it is quite disgusting and very scary that he is still the front-runner. >> as paula reed reported earlier, there is a transcript of the recording with the former president talking with a group of people, none of whom had proper classify kashicationclas documents he was holding. i want to bring in alice stewart, republican strategist. it's on page 50 of the indictment for those following at home. trump says, i have a big pile of papers. look, this was him. they presented me this, this was him talking about general mark milley. this was the defense department and him. let's see here. he's got a document, people are laughing. he says i just found it. except it's highly confidential.

he says secret, this is secret information. look, look at this. i mean, he literally says, this is secret information, look, look at this. he then goes on to say, as president, i could have declassified it. people in the room laugh. now i can't, but this is still a secret. alice, it's insane. >> it is. look, we're not talking about a love letter he's sending to a foreign leader. this specific reference you make was about invading another country. this is military information. he acknowledged it was top secret information, and it is sitting in a box at mar-a-lago. here's the thing. this is the very activity and action that he went after hillary clinton on. as you said, he talked in his 2015, 2016 campaign so much about locking her up. here is a quote from november of 2016 about hillary clinton. he said, her current scandals around controversies will

continue throughout her presidency and will make it look bad. it's going to virtually make it impossible for her to govern. well, the same standard applies right here. i think it's really important for people to understand now that we know what we are talking about, this is a different situation. but it still shocks me, anderson. i talked with republicans across the country. many are still standing by him. there's a cult of personality behind donald trump that will continue to stay with him. even the more information they have, they will continue to say, because they feel this is an unequal distribution of justice. as we heard jack smith say quite plainly, there is one rule of law in this country, and it applies equally to everyone. and donald trump is finding that out. >> yeah, the hypocrisy here, d the barack obama test. if barack obama, in ris retirement, had been recorded in l.a. at a hollywood party, say thing exact stuff about a secret

document, the republican's heads would explode. >> i think about so on january 6th, imagine if that was an tiffa or blm that did that, you know, the talk out of the republican side would be very different. if this was barack obama, i mean, they would have started impeachment proceedings, even though he wasn't president any more. hindsight impeachment proceedings, because they would be going crazy over this. and there is a lot of hypocrisy in politics, okay? no surprise to anybody. this is a whole new level of hypocrisy. when that infects national defense secrets -- by the way, these national defense secrets don't change. it's not like every week there is a new plan to -- whether it's war in iran or something like that being planned. they stay on the shelf. so these are evergreen plans, and i just look at that and go, man, the hypocrisy of it all, particularly when in 2016, the whole "lock her up" chant is about classified material.

>> to alice's point, though, we saw almost a padlovian reaction last night when this came out, including the speaker of the house, including ron desantis. >> the speaker of the house's statement was extraordinary. it was ss line as well, the president has done this to me. but this idonald trump's gift is to sell the sort of conspiracy narratives, and the narrative is, they're coming to get us, me and you, the deep state, the corrupt biden administration, and this is all -- now, the question does that stand up under the weight of all of this? i suspect in the short run, maybe yes. >> just to step back fora second, this is all completely unnecessary. all of this is -- had he just given the stuff back -- >> according to his own former

attorney general, who said if he had just turned the stuff -- this is what bill barr said -- >> and requested to look at it for his records. he had power to look at stuff. it's incredible, this is completely self-inflicted. >> also the fact that this is based off of notes from his attorney and an audio recording from him. he's always hated when anyone took notes in meetings. he was always suspicious when white house counsel and other officials did it. he didn't like it. his attorneys felt they needed to do it in great detail. that is what is at the center of this. >> let's go back to jake. >> so the indictment releases the details with other alleged crimes. the movement of boxes at mar-a-lago, including storage in a ballroom, in a bathroom, in a shower. i want to bring in cnn's kristen holmes, who is in new jersey near where trump and his allies

are gathered in bedminster. what do we know how secure or insecure these documents, these classified documents containing important national secrets were when stored at mar-a-lago? >> well, i reached out to a mar-a-lago member when we got these. we know it's not a house, sit a club that people have access to. but i wanted to know how much access. were these pictures familiar to them? this is what this member told me. they said they have never seen anything, including that white and gold ballroom on there locked. the direct quote is, once you are on the property, you can really go anywhere. i do. being a private club, they can't really stop you from going into the public spaces. one thing to note, you do have to be a member to go on the property, but you can also be the guest of a member. this has been a long-term issue for security around the former president. we know that while he was president, his advanced team, his body men, they had very

specific protocols in place for when members brought a "unsavety character as a guest." that is proximity to the president, not boxes in a room with an event. this source said they had taken guests to the ballroom on multiple occasions. never had an issue going in and out of there. it was never secured in any way. the other thing to note, since he has been president, since these documents were there, we know that the protocols have gone wayside. we had dinner with kanye west. none of that was vetted by any staff. all of those protocols were no longer in place, which gives you an idea of who could have been on this property. >> yeah. and we should note, i said this earlier, go to google and google mar-a-lago intruder, and you'll see at least two chinese nationals were caught on the property, one of them was

deported back to china. there is another allegation about somebody who appears to have been a conartist. those are just the three we know about. mr. trump, kristen, he's scheduled to have two campaign events tomorrow. one in georgia. do we know if they are going to go ahead as scheduled? >> i'm told that everything is going to be business as usual. this is what we heard after the manhattan indictment. they are going to continue the campaign, and trump has said time and time again, no matter what happens, he's not dropping out. we don't know what the long-term impact of this indictment is, but as of now, they are still going to attend to those campaign events. i will say, we are waiting to see if he is going to deliver any remarks directly on this. i'm told that is still in discussion. if that does hatppen, it will mirror what happened after that manhattan arraignment. but nothing is set in stone yet. they are still processing. this i will say, i talked to

sources all day long. it's been very, very equipment since this indictment was unsealed. >> all right, kristen holmes, thank you so much. more details from this bombshell indictment against donald trump. an attorney who recently represented him will be next. keep it here. we'll be right back. man, this aint messin', it's perfectin'! with marinated chicken and double cheese. sweet and savory... ...kinda like you and me, chuck. bye, peyton.n. try the refreshed favorites at subway today.

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we're back with our special coverage. the indictment shows mr. trump facing 31 charges. joining me trump's former attor in this case, tim palatori. thank you for being here. first, let me get your reaction to the indictment and to the statement made by special counsel jack smith. >> well, the indictment has a lot in it. a lot of stuff i wasn't aware of. >> what were you not aware of? >> a lot of the specific allegations about moving boxes before the search.

there are things in here that i think, you know, if they have backup for are problematic. >> like what? >> that whole discussion about, you know, talking to walt moving the boxes up to the residence and everything. you know, that's -- that is potentially problematic, especially if backed up by video. that being said, there are some parts of this like about the -- trying to convince evan to do certain things that are improperly included in here, and i think that those counts certainly would be subject to a proper motion to dismiss. honestly, the statement that he gave, which was very short -- >> jack smith? >> yeah. the one part that stuck out to me is where he talked about how his prosecutors kept to the highest ethical standards. to me, if you have a good, solid case, if everything in here is completely supported by the evidence, you don't need to play games, you don't need to do a

lot of the things that we saw the prosecutors do. i always say my biggest fear is a reasonable prosecutor, because they won't play those games and give me an opening. >> so the indictment says that the classified documents that mr. trump stored in these boxes included information regarding defense and weapons capabilities of the u.s. and foreign countries, the u.s. nuclear program, potential vulnerabilities of the u.s. and allies to military attack, and plans for possible retaliation in response to a foreign attack. he alleges, jack smith, that the unauthorized disclosure of these documents could put at risk the national security of the united states and human sources and the continued viability of sensitive intelligence collection methods. that is serious stuff. obviously, there's an overclassification problem in the united states government that we talked about on this show. i was wondering what is in these boxes, just the kim jong-un letters --

>> those weren't classified. >> but my point is, i didn't know what it was. this sounds serious. >> it does. one of the things i found interesting here is that they have -- in this 37 counts, they have separated out each of these separate documents as a separate count. so 31 counts for 31 separate individual documents. out of the, you know, couple hundred that they say had markings, so that indicates to me that they have kind of done, you know, some type of a triage to say okay, the vast majority of these, we're not going to charge, because they don't -- >> but these 31 are serious. >> it does seem that they are saying that these 31 at least, they think they can prove that these are national defense -- >> we're talking about hundreds if not thousands of documents, but only pin pointing 31. that's a good point. i want to get back to the indictment in a second. since you're a former attorney for mr. trump, two other former

attorneys for mr. trump abruptly resigned today. why? what was your reaction? >> look, it's surprising and yet at the same time unsurprising. it's a difficult situation to be in. i think that it was interesting to me that todd blanch is taking over. obviously, i have spoken before about my reasons for leaving. >> you testified to the grand jury. >> that was unrelated to my decision to leave. but -- >> but it was about the classified documents is my point. >> yes, i went in to testify about our efforts to do the other searches, to search the other properties, and the additional documents which we found, which i'm glad to read in this thing that there is nothing related to any of the searches i did, because obviously everything we did there was -- >> but there's stuff in here suggesting that mr. trump either misled his attorneys or asked

his attorneys -- suggested in some way for them to not be honest with the fbi. is that a reason why you no longer work for him? >> no. no, no. my reasoning as i stated the first time i came on here with paula reed, it was because of difficulties with specifically boris epstein. >> fair enough. but we have here in this indictment, it does seem like mr. trump, and they don't mention the lawyers, they call them lawyer one, two, three. but lawyer three, i think we know who she is, giving false statements to the government. did mr. trump ever ask you to say something that wasn't true? >> no. >> he never did that? >> no. >> some of the other things, there are two instances that the indictment goes into where mr. trump allegedly, according to the indictment, talked about some of these classified materials with individuals that clearly did not have classification. one of them we knew about

already because of the excellent reporting of cnn, paula reed and others, it was the mark meadows autobiographers -- that's a whole other conversation -- coming to the office and talking about an attack on iran. and the other is him talking about some other military related maneuver, top secret or classified, with somebody who worked for trump's super pac. you knew about these? >> no, the second one is new to me. the first one i knew about. the first one, i listened to the tape. i don't think -- when you listen to the actual tape, it's a little bit more -- a little bit more open to interpretation whether there is an actual document that he's talking about, or whether it's more bluster. there's certain segments oh of that conversation that i saw that were cut out. but, you know, that was a thing that -- i quite frankly was expecting that if they had that in here, they would have matched

it up with a document. >> yeah. >> but apparently, the lack of a match to a document, or mention of a document, indicates to me that they probably went through all the documents that they took, and showed them to witnesses, people were in that meeting. and they were not able to identify any. >> right. >> and there are documents that it could theoretically be. >> we're going by trump description, so it doesn't necessarily adhere to the paper. >> he said it's confidential, it's secret. >> but he acknowledges he can't share it with them, which is the point of the special counsel. he knew. he said see, as president, i could have declassified it. this is a quote in the transcript. now i can't. he knows that he doesn't have the power to do it with his mind as he stated in interviews with fox and others. >> he's stating that he can do it now that he's out of office.

again, whether there is an actual document or whether it's one of those, jake, i would love to show you, but i can't because it's classified. >> the other allegation in the indictment is there is a document there, and he's showing it to this guy who does not have classified status, classification status. >> that's what it says. >> that's shocking. >> if true, yeah. >> if true, that is a real problem for the former president. >> if it's true. again, indictments are, you know, these are allegations. you know, i can't speak specifically to some of those because i haven't seen what's behind those. behind those. i know that obviously i have a career of going into court and proving that some of these things turned out not to be true. so i always just -- because it is what i do, i have this experience, i always look at these things somewhat skeptically, but if the exchange that they're talking about with

walt as far as taking all of these boxes out, putting some back, if that's something that is backed up with evidence, that's certainly a problem. >> so let me show you this picture because this is a picture from the storage facility at mar-a-lago in which a bunch of documents are on the ground. i think walt nauta, the trump aide who has also been indicted alerted somebody as to this. these documents according to the indictment are supposed to only be accessible and releaseable, i think is is the word used in the indictment, releaseable to members of the five eyes countries, no he is are obviously an intelligence alliance between the united states, new zealand, australia, the uk and -- i mean, that's shocking. look at the storage of this. look at the storage of this. this is not exactly fort knox. what you had earlier in the day with kristen holmes, let's show the one in the control room with all the boxes on the stage in

mar-a-lago because it just seems like i had assumed that there was at least some -- look at that. i mean, that's a room where everybody who is in mar-a-lago has access to. >> sure. >> i had assumed that there was some effort to at least put them in a room and lock them away. that looks -- that's incredibly reckless. >> if they knew what was in the boxes. >> but there have been at least two chinese national intruders. >> sure. >> because another con woman who pretended she was a member of the rothschild family, people can google this if you want, it's all out there, who got access to mar-a-lago. those are the three we know b this is a country club in florida, i have no idea who had access to t that's not secure, right? >> that's absolutely right, that is not secure and that's actually one of the reasons why -- separate and apart from whether an indictment is appropriate -- one of the reasons why we were pushing to congress to say there needs to be an amendment to the presidential records act of setting up these nara controlled

facilities. how these documents -- and the indictment does gloss over this piece a little bit, it says that he caused them to be taken to florida, but doesn't really get into all the specifics, you know, which you and i talked about the other night. >> right. >> why did they go to mar-a-lago? why were they not sent to a nara facility? >> he doesn't have -- one of the reasons s as you know, that he doesn't have a presidential library and museum that's being built, unlike every other president. i'm not saying that as a criticism, it's just a fact. that's one of the reasons. >> right. and that -- that all goes into if these things become mandated as opposed to being more, you know, discretionary and -- >> absolutely the law should be clearer, there is no question about that and, look, i'm sure hillary clinton, joe biden and mike pence would all agree with you on that, too. here we are because there is a real difference between those three and this, which is, i mean, if you look at the comments made according to contemporaneous notes by trump's

attorneys, things that trump said to his attorneys about such as can't we just pretend -- i'm paraphrasing now -- here it is. what happens if we just don't respond at all to the subpoena? >> right. >> or don't play with them? wouldn't it be better if we just told them we don't have anything here? isn't it better if there are no documents? this is as memorialized by trump attorney 1. do you know who trump attorney 1 is? >> yes. >> who is that? >> that would be evan. >> if this is mr. corcoran and it says it's memorialized by him does that mean he recorded it or wrote it down? >> these are his notes. >> his notes. those are pretty shocking suggestions here. don't be honest with the fbi. >> so they -- here is part of the problem is a lot of those questions are really standard questions that any client will ask when they receive a subpoena. do we have to do this? are we required to do this? and so one of the reasons -- >> wouldn't it be better if we lied? >> well, that's question three essentially. wouldn't it be better if we just

told them we don't have anything here when he has hundreds of documents. >> that's not a great question but here is the thing -- >> wouldn't it be better if we lied to the government is not a great question. okay. >> here is the thing, you want clients to be free to ask these questions and as long as the answer to that question s no, we can't do that and a the client says okay -- >> presumably it was. >> yes, that's correct. >> okay. >> as long as the answer s no, we're not going to do that and the client says okay then it's not a problem, it's not a crime. one of the, i guess, most disturbing things in here to me is that they in my opinion improperly pierced the attorney/client privilege and then usee basis of charges. >> look, i was -- >> i do see a viable motion to dismiss. >> that part of it. >> that part of it, absolutely. >> i was surprised that he did do that as well. although the questions are as with so many things having to do with mr. trump shocking but not

surprising. last question for you because i know you have to go. this looks really bad for donald trump, right? i mean, you admit like you would acknowledge this indictment is based on transcripts, photographs, text messages, evidence, not just like, you know, some anonymous informant. >> right. >> evidence. i mean, this is -- you've seen a lot of indictments, this is a pretty strong indictment. >> it appears to be. it appears to be. a lot of it i am curious to see if the evidence fully backs it up, you know, again, this is an allegation. >> right. >> and so -- >> and he's innocent until proven guilty, absolutely. >> they do have to prove all these things. and also there are certain lyle hurdles that they're going to have to get over with regard to, you know, interpretations of presidential records act, things like that, that i'm sure will be properly briefed and argued before the court. >> first blush i'm sure if you're sitting there you're like, wow, this is bad. >> and, again, it kind of goes

back to if you really did have a solid case like this, then as a prosecutor why do you have to play games and potentially lose a case. i mean, a case like this can be dismissed base on prosecutorial misconduct. why would they even -- why would they even risk it? >> we will see about the prosecutorial misconduct allegation. look, i appreciate your coming here and talking to us about this. >> thank you. >> nice to get your insights. we have more of our breaking news coverage, former president donald trump indicted again, this is historic. the 2024 rivals of mr. trump reacting to the news as well as trump allies. we will also hear from a former attorney general and get his thoughts on how the justice department is handling this investigation. stay with us. wayfair's got just what you need... dog friendly and wallet friendly...

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welcome to "the lead" i'm jake tapper. we will start today with our law and justice league. the federal indictment of donald trump it's historic, it's shocking, i'm jake tapper in washington, d.c. the allegations outlined in the 37-count indictment include that mr. trump kept documents so sensitive they required special handling that he did not give them, he stored documents about u.s. defense, even u.s. nuclear programs improperly, illegally at mar-a-lago in public spaces such as a ballroom, even a bathroom shower. pretty shocking stuff, anderson. >> it certainly is. i'm anderson cooper in new york. just under an hour ago special counsel jack smith gave a brief

statement on the