and good evening from st. john's newfoundland. with a sad and somber evening here. this is where five explorers and would-be explorers were set off on friday, out into the open ocean, traveling so 460 miles from here towards the wreck of the artemis titanic. then, on sunday morning, they were sealed inside the submersible titan, and lowered into the ocean into their descend into

the seabed some 13,000 feet below, about two miles. less than two hours later, communication as you know, was lost with the submersible. and we just learned it was about that time that a senior navy official tells cnn, that a navy network of underwater sensors picked up sound consistent they said, with an implosion. but it was determined to be quote, not definitive, unquote. and this afternoon, we learned the worst we >> this morning, an rov, a remote operated vehicle from the vessel horizon our tech, discovered the tail cone of the titan submersible, approximately 1600 feet from the battle of the titanic, on the sea floor. the rov subsequently found additional debris, in consultation with experts from within the unified command, the debris is

consistent with the catastrophic loss of the pressure chamber. i >> and with that, the rear admiral's said, caused the titan to implode. the remote operated vehicle, which located the tight title, had -- arms and a camera. nose cone in that larger debris field that he talked, about that with some 1600 feet away from the battle of the titanic. and then there was a second, smaller debris field, where they found the afd of the hall, the pressure haul. when asked whether the vessel had perhaps struck wreckage from the titanic, or had been damage somehow in the ocean floor, the rear admiral said the area around that large debris field was smooth. when asked about the precise timing of the catastrophic implosion, as they are calling, he said it

was too early to tell. now, aboard the vessel, to deep sea pioneers. paul-henri nargeolet, a veteran of dozens of guys in the titanic, he was 77, why they regard as an expert in the titanic. also stockton rush, 61, the founder of ocean rush. also lost aboard, 58-year-old pilot in aerial adventurer hamish harding, and british pakistani billionaire shahzada dawood who is 48 years, old and his 19-year-old son suleman. now there is no good news in what happened at all. but perhaps some comfort for the loved ones and those now lost, that according to former longtime navy physician dr. aileen marty, who we will speak of shortly, the implosion that took their lives would have happened many times faster than the human brain could have even detected it, let alone experienced fear. in just a moment, we will talk to the titanic director james cameron, who himself has made 33 dives to the titanic. he joins us. but first, cnn's miguel marquez with more about what we now know. miguel, you really have been covering this from the beginning, it is the worst possible findings. >> there was so much hope. there was slivers of it, but people really clung to it here in st. john's and across this

community. and around the world, it was amazing to see how this story struck such a nerve. but sadly, i think most people that i was talking to didn't believe that there could be that miracle, and we're afraid that it could be a catastrophic event like this. and today, it was confirmed. >> and the newest information that we just got from the defense official was that, some sort of sonar equipment did hear some sort of a sound, that could be the implosion around the time they began listening a soon as they learned that there was a problem. >> well presumably, this technology picks it up automatically. it is meant to be a defense system. it is very unclear what exactly that defense system is. but it is amazing that they picked up. so one hour 45 into the nine hour drive or so, they were very deep by that time. they, the defense department picks up this. >> they were closer to the titanic than they were to the service. much closer >> so it implodes at this point it. burst into pieces essentially, and the way the

coast guard described it today, it showered down basically where they were headed, to the titanic itself. we narrowly missing the titanic, the hall the of the titanic. >> the rear admiral talked a loved about this a little bit already -- there are nine ships onsite, they were starting us and those, weigh medical personnel as well. but, they are gonna continue for now with the rov under the, water searching the degree. feel >> it sounds like very much they want to map the debris field, they want to understand where all the pieces. are they have made they, may try to bring some pieces up, i think as we know, this was a controversial sub. that it was, some called it experimental. it had gone down to the titanic many times, successfully. but they want to know what went wrong, and what it was that caused that catastrophic failure in this. it is amazing to think, in 1912, the titanic sank. and now in 2023, you have more peoples lives being claimed right at the site of

the titanic. we really like to understand that. we also like to recover remains if possible. but given the implosion, given the nature of this event, that may be impossible. >> yet it, is very unlikely we. have talked experts, we will talk to mark doctor -- later on, they said it was unlikely that there will be any bodies or even bones at this point. we will learn more about that obviously in the days ahead. but obviously, the families we would like to recover what they can, and take their loved ones home. miguel, thank you so much, appreciate it. we have been focusing on this now for several days. and joining us right now is james cameron, diver, explorer director of the abyss. a deep sea for lauren, and most famously of course titanic as well, as many as well as many other great films. james, i appreciate you joining us. at some whose devoted your life to expiration as you have, under the sea, i wonder what is going through your mind tonight? >> well thanks anderson. i mean obviously, we are all kind of heart sick from the outcome of this. and i've been living with it for a few days now, at some of my other colleagues in the

deep summer gents community. i was not on a ship myself when the event happened on sunday. the first i heard of it was monday morning, immediately got on my network of. because it's a very small community in the deep submerges group. and, i found out some information within about a half an hour, that they had lost comms, and they had lost tracking simultaneously. the only scenario that i could come up with, in my mind that could have countered that, was an implosion, a shockwave event so powerful that it actually took out a secondary system that has its own pressure vessel, and its own battery power supply, which is the trans monitor that the ship uses to track where the shot sub-is. so i was thinking implosion that, and that was monday morning. i got on the horn again with some other people, tracked down some intel that was probably of a military origin, although it could have been research. because there are hydrophones

all over the atlantic. and got confirmation that there was some kind of loud noise consistent with an implosion event. that seems to me enough confirmation that i let all of my inner circle of people know, that we had lost our comrades. and i, encouraged everyone to raise a glass in their honor on monday. then i watched over the ensuing days, this whole sort of everybody running around with their hair on fire search. knowing full well that it was futile. hoping against hope that i was, wrong but knowing in my bones that i wasn't. and so, it certainly wasn't a surprise today. and i just feel terrible for the families that had to go through all of these false hopes, that kept getting dangled as it played out. i >> you, i just want to, you said it was on monday that you learned of these listening devices underwater had picked up the sound of an implosion?

or what was believed to be an implosion? >> that's yeah, that's as it came to me, that's hearsay. mobile. they were credible sources, so i took that as a factor, that i multiplied in with the other factors. and, i couldn't think of any other scenario in which a sub would be lost, where it lost comms and navigation at the same time, and stayed out of touch and did not surface. i was also told, and i don't have confirmation on this, that they had, they were on the set, they were a couple hundred meters above the sea floor, and they dropped their weights. now, the only way for the ship to know that they had dropped their dissent waits, which would be an emergency abort, is if they had called that in. if they had -- so i believe now, that they had some warning, that they heard some acoustic signature of the hall beginning to de laminate. and investigation will hopefully eventually begin to

show what did happen. because we all need to know, as we go forward, the deep submerge in this community needs to know exactly what happened. when >> you've made dozens of, just extraordinary deepwater expeditions, including hoarding 30 to the titanic itself. you've also gone far deeper than the 13,000 feet where the titanic is. you've gone deeper than just about anybody into the ocean. i forgot the name of the place you want, but the challenger deep, which is extraordinary. you went in your own design. yeah, you add in your own designed craft, that's the submersible, that was experimental and didn't go through the sort of standard safety protocols. but the differences, you are not taking passengers on board. would you ever have taken factors on board a submersible that had not gone through the standard maritime safety protocol? >> no, not at all. i mean, my sub that went to the challenger deep, dove safely three safety -- we made multiple dives in that sub, that sub was a signal -- and it was only contemplated

that myself that the engineer -- could only be the only pilots of that sub. and we work on it for seven years, we knew every detail of it in intimately. i was involved in every phase of the testing, and so i assess the risks, understood and very well. in those arrest that i was going to take. i would never have taken it upon myself to ask someone to take that type of risk. and if i were designing a multi seat vehicle right intended to be the, pilot we would go through all of the rigorous test particles, and review protocols that you have let say abs, which is the american bureau of shipping, or d and the, or german lloyds. which are the major bureaus that class a sub, they called classing, but it's basically certification. and i think it was, unconscionable that this group did not go through that rigorous process .

>> what, this was an experimental design, there's no question about it. it was a carbon composite. you can tell us more about what that actually means. i mean, it's the kind of stuff used in spacecraft. but is it design for deep underwater? pressure and what is the, what is the danger of that kind of material in this kind of? environment >> it's completely inappropriate for a vessel that sees external pressure. you know carbon fiber composites are used very successfully for internal pressure. that's a scuba tank and you can take all of we get -- all steel or aluminum for that type of pressure. bottle with if you get -- like ceramic, or similar. you can do computer modeling with a high degree of accuracy and confidence. the second you

start doing carbon composite, or any kind of composite material. they're introducing to materials that are in contact with each other. the filament itself, and then the approximate tricks that it sits within. at that point, you have degradation failure. so, we always understood that this was the wrong material for submersibles. because with each pressure cycle, you can have progressive damage. so, it's quite insidious. you may have a number of successful dives, which is what happened here, and then have it fail later. if i were diving in a sub that was fully certified, i wouldn't think about it. even in my own sub, which had a steel hull, i knew that if i dove several two or three times, it was probably good to go, you could cycle steel hundreds of times. if not thousands of times. that's not the case with the composite.

it's quite insidious. that mold them into a sense of confidence and led to this tragedy. these are known things, known within the engineering community. >> we also wanna point, out oceangate former director of marine operations, he wrote this engineering report in 2018, i think it was he focused criticisms on the country's decision to rely on acoustic decisions on the homemade under pressure, as opposed to a scared of the hole. according to him the company claimed no equipment to perform that kind of skin on five inch thick carbon fiber hole. i know it's difficult to say without reading the report, i'm wondering what you make of that, it seems like this company was making a big deal about the sensors they had that could send some problem at the hole. if they can sense there was a problem that would have time to go back up, clearly, they

didn't. >> it's a bit like saying, we have a bit of a poor design for the engine at our jet indoor rocketship, we have a sensor that will tell us if it's on fire. to me, that's cold comfort. i think if you're building a hole where you need to have sensors to tell you that it's failing, in the process of failing, you have no business designing subs or being in that sub. they touted it, i believe, as a good thing. as a safety protocol. i consider it a bad thing. it sheds alight directly on the fundamental flaw they're of their design. you have to remember, the dna of this design concept goes back further, it goes back to the quest to go to the challenger deep, that i was involved in. there was another sub design that was competing with hours at the time. it was based on a wound filament composite cylinder, with two titanium in caps. i told those guys, point blank, you're gonna get killed and nothing. they ultimately

never drove it. i literally told the guy who bought the serb, when its own, or steve faucet, the famous billionaire, died in a plane crash and the sub wasn't purchased by another guy to operate it. i told him, you're gonna die down there. if you drive that thing. i felt very strongly about it. i had nothing to do with oceangate, i never tried to warn stockton rush of the same thing, i thought maybe they've solved it. i was pretty opinionated about it, at the time. they had a similar idea of acoustic centers, they call it, delimitation water starts to force the layers of the fibers apart. theoretically, you can hear it. i believe they heard it with yours, not through the sensor system. in the last moments of their lives. that's quite a horrifying prospect. >> james cameron, if you could just a with, us we're gonna take a quick break. i'd like to continue the conversation if you get. later, we'll have more on titans development, especially the selling of it as

james was just saying. a safe way to experience the deep. we'll be right back. back now (vo) when someone is diagnosed with cancer, they need support. subaru and our retailers are there to help... by providing blankets for comfort and warmth and encouraging messages of hope to help support nearly three hundred thousand patients facing cancer nationwide. we call it “the subaru love promise.” and we're proud to be the largest automotive donor to the leukemia and lymphoma society. subaru. more than a car company.

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questions surrounding. it namely, this issue to build it out of carbon composite, and not certified safety as other such vessels are. back now a deep sea exploring titanic director, james cameron. i mean, it's extraordinary to me that this debris field is just 1600 feet away from the bow of the titanic. obviously, people think about the battle of the titanic, they think of your film, titanic. with that iconic seen on the bow. i heard you earlier talk about these two captains. kind of a similar irony that you see, i'm wondering if you can talk about that. >> i think there is a great, almost surreal irony here, which is titanic sank because the captain took it full steam into an ice field at night animalistic i, with very poor visibility. after he had been repeatedly warned by telegram, by mark -- by radio, during the day, that

that's what was ahead of him. so, i think we're also seeing a parallel here with unheeded warnings about a sum that was not certified, where the entire deep submerges community actually, or not the entire community, but a large number of them got together to write a letter to oceangate, the company, and say, we believe that this could lead to catastrophe. it was lessard criticism of the engineering, then of the process. but it contemplated the fact that the engineering probably would not pass muster from certification bureau. so, they're trying to head this whole thing off. it was our worst nightmare. i, mean all of us in the deep some urgent community, people like myself, the pilot subs, designs of. implosion is obviously the specter that looms over us all the time. because of that, that's the thing that you engineer for the most. years in advance. that should never be

the problem. i've never believed that, if i was going to have a serious problem annissa, that it would be implosion. maybe entanglement in a fishing, that maybe a fire from electronics. hard to rules though things out. implosion, absolutely not. especially with modern, finite element analysis, and computer aided design. >> what should be, what did we learn from this? obviously, deepwater exploration, i mean, there's a pretty great, i love it's great, but a very good safety record with people who have done the certification. people have really studied this. do about having this is an impact on the continued exploration? >> i do. look, i'm not worried about exploration, explorers will go. about worried about innovation, people will innovate. i'm worried that has a negative impact on, let's say, citizen explorers, tourists.

these are serious people of serious curiosity, willing to put serious money down to go to these interesting places. i don't want to discourage that. i think that it's almost now the lesson, the takeaway is, make sure if you're gonna go into a vehicle, whether it's an aircraft or surface craft or submersible, that it's been through certifying agencies. it's been signed off. every day, we trust our lives to engineering. we step into an elevator. we make an assumption that somebody, somewhere has done the math properly. it's all been certified properly. we should take the same precautions when we get into a submersible. even if it's at a resort, we're only going down 300 feet. or 1000 feet. i'm a partner in a submersible company called triton, i'll say that up front. triton, not tighten. triton has a perfect operational safety record across 20 vehicles and 10,000 hours of people diving to depths up to 1000 meters. it can be done. but it requires rigor, i think all of us in the

community know that our worst fears have happened, and we know why it happened. i think largely, it puts us now on even more alert to be disciplined and to really think about the ethics of it. there's a lot of countries where subs are diving all over the world. you're not gonna have regulation everywhere that solves this problem. it's more that we have to just except a standard of practice that we don't encourage operators to work without proper abs or german lloyds or whatever it is certification. >> the coast guard rear adm. today was talking about the unforgiving environment at those deaths. can you just talk about that feeling of being down there? yeah, i can't

believe how deep you have gone into the ocean. three times deeper than the titanic, as you said. what does that feeling of being down there? >> well, i always say. you have to take a backhoe with you to go deeper than i went. anywhere on this planet. that is a feeling of remoteness, i knew, when i made that dive, there was no hope of rescue. literally, no vehicle in the world, no matter if you could fly it in, no matter if i could survive long enough on my life support system. there was no rescue. i had to self rescue if i had a problem. we thought about that for the seven years that we spent building the sub. i designed a lot of the safety systems myself. knowing i was going to be in that sub. terms of how to drop the weights, if i was incapacitated, the weights would drop themselves,

after a certain period of time. many, many communications, beacons, for what i got back to the surface, if i had drifted off someplace. i have been picked up by satellite, they would've reported my position. i had radio. visual beacons. it would not have required an aircraft search, they family pretty quickly. so, you think all that stuff through. the feeling in the moment, it's almost a sacred space. it's a place where there's nobody else there, just you, human yourself. and a sense of deep time, you're looking at something that no one's ever seen. it's been that way for hundreds, of millions, if not billions of years. a titanic, it's different. you feel the presence of the tragedy. i think that's the, lurid as what people want to go and experience it for themselves. to feel, and remember history i think people go to battlefields to gettysburg, normally beach and all those things to remember history and to take it in and make it part of their lives. i don't think that's, you know, i don't think anything wrong with that. some people don't like, they say to grave site, that sort of thing. i think it's important for us to remember. here's a case, starkly today, where the collective we didn't remember

the lesson of titanic, the guys on oceangate didn't. the arrogance and the hubris that sent the ship to its due, the exact same thing that sent those people and that's up to their faith. i just think it's heartbreaking, i think it's heartbreaking that it was so preventable. >> james cameron, i'm sorry we're talking under these circumstances, i appreciate the level of detail in expertise that you bring to the conversation. so, thank you very much. >> well, thank you, anderson, it's been a pleasure. >> all, right which you will. still ahead, tonight. we're gonna look in the effort to recover the wreckage, and i'll speak with a retired navy physician about would likely happen at those -- aboard the submersible during the implosion. we were just

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implosion. we were just speaking with director james cameron about the dangers associated with visiting the titanic wreckage, specifically, the dangers of the carbon fiber composite used to make the titan submersible. one of the challenges now trying to retrieve the wreckage of it, joining me now, robert -- foundered senior salvage master at northwest maritime consultants robert, appreciate you being with us. if they choose to bring up some of the material to try and understand what happened, what kind of resources would be needed to salvage the remaining parts of that vessel? >> well, there's a number of vehicles and vessels that are available. some are on site.

some of the factors that caused the problem, the surface conditions, the worst weather they've had in 40 years in the north sea. in the stability of the platform for operations is critical, in order to be successful in finite location of removal. the things they wish to bring up, for investigation. we have the equipment, the other factor is, of course, the cost to do it. very expensive process. >> and these rovs that they have the one that was able to locate the two debris fields, it does have arms that can be moved. i, mean with dylan arms literally pick up debris pieces? or would bring down cables to try and wrap around them? how would that work? >> it could be used to pick up small pieces. the major portion of the hole is going to be quite heavy, and that rov will not be able to lift, it nor will the umbilical attached to, it has a strength, it's not designed to lift tons of material. it could take down other lifting utensils that could be attached and remotely

inflated or filled with new materials they use a number of techniques. one was to pump down diesel fuel. from the surface, to a blender. which causes the item to rise, in a very slow and fixed rate. unlike a bag that would be dangerous, because it would never make it to surface. the bag would exceed its capacity by the surface, the outsider. the pressure on it causing the bag to expand beyond its capacity. so, there are number of methods in our military methods, and equipment that would make it possible. again, it's all about the cost to move forward to get that done. >> right, i mean, maybe this is a dumb question, who would pay for that if, i mean, i'm not sure who would want to. perhaps the company would want to. i don't know what their resources are. is there some sort of, i, mean organization like the faa with the airplanes that

investigates the sort of things? >> with the faa, that's a real good example to talk about, when an aircraft goes down, as we, know we have the ablation aircraft which is still missing. very large amount of money spent trying to locate that. a number of private companies and agencies that have a vested interest in finding out exactly what happened. a lot of the public fly. we recover aircraft in the water, i've been involved in many of those right down to circuit, when possible. in recovery. on those particular project, it's more there's only five people, not a mode of transportation that really accepted or a large amount of people used. and someone's gonna have to probably fund this operation. once again, it is extremely expensive. >> yeah, robert mester, bifacial your expertise, thank you so much. >> okay. >> joining me now to discuss with me have happened to those on board, florida international university professor it retired

navy physician, dr. aileen marty. dr., marty sorted to -- the circumstances. coast guard officials say the submersible shuttered a catastrophic implosion. you talk about with that actually means? obviously, you know, in the last couple of days, when people thought the running out of oxygen, the idea of what that would mean for those on board. an implosion is very, very quick. >> yeah, that's the one good thing about this horrific tragedy. is that when you get an implosion like that, it happens in a fraction of a millisecond. i mean, it's incredibly quick. it takes more than that, it takes about point 25 more than that for the human brain to even realize it's happening. so, these people would have the entire thing would've collapsed before the individuals inside would even realize that there is a problem. they may have heard a little something ahead of time, they've got a little bit of extra nitrogen in their brain. they probably didn't know anything, and then the thing

exploded, so. >> that extraordinary. it happens that quickly. i heard you say, i forgot the figure about how fast something implodes. the miles per hour that it includes. >> that's right. about 1500 miles per hour. that's the rate. that's just incredible, when you talk about something -- >> something to talk about something a small is that. >> yes. >> little, 1500 elsewhere. >> yes. >> that's what you're saying it so fast that the human brain can't even respond that quickly. feeling of fear or pain, i mean, it would be instantaneous. >> would not happen. these people they died. and that's horrible. they died in a way that they didn't even realize that they were about to die. so, ultimately, among the many ways in which we can pass, that's

painless. >> there was a question to the navy -- to the coast guard rear adm. today about the recovery of bodies. i don't want to get into too many details. there would not be bodies, they would not be bones even, is that correct? >> that's correct. there will be virtually nothing, these people bodies were completely collapsed in just a little minute fragments. there's very unlikely to find anything there of human tissue. i mean, if you were to search for dna, you might possibly find it. we're talking about an ocean, we're talking about a large debris field. so, you're not gonna find much in the way of human remains.

>> dr. aileen marty, i appreciate being with us. i'm glad to know it was quick. it's awful, no matter what. i appreciate the detail. thank you. >> giordano someone who knows firsthand what it's like to be inside that submersible, collin taylor was on the titan with his son last summer. colin, appreciate you joining us. you were actually able to do on the tight, and you are on the titanic. what was a lightning inside? >> it's a truly remarkable experience. i took my sundown last summer. july of last year. it was something will never forget. it really was. >> right, and was a claustrophobic. beyond the extraordinary experience of trying to look out the window and seeing the titanic. >> yeah, i mean, it is a little frightening to get into that submersible. and to know that you're going down two and a half miles. i, mean you have the liberal and figured of weight of the ocean on you. >> do you feel pressure? >> the vessel is maintained at

one, atmospheres no real pressure inside. but there is a sense of pressure i would say. just being that deep in the ocean. >> is it cold down there? >> it is cold other. the ambient temperatures is close to freezing down there. the titanium domes another, and a pick up that cool very quickly. there's some condensation from the breathing and everything else that goes right, it's on the domes. you feel the cold. >> when you are thinking about doing it, did you know anything about the safety protocols? >> so i did a lot of diligence upfront. on the risks, friend of mine is, or, was an engineer with a clear. asking about it. he told me that he buddhist people, in the offer is. and who i. then started talkative her solace though involved. aware of some of the things that come up already. >> i mean, such a bizarre feeling for you now. >> oh my, gosh i'm heartbroken.

about what happened here. i feel like i'm so deeply saddened for the people on board and their families. >> father and son on board, just get imagine. >> i just, i just keeps reverberating through my brain. yeah, it's horrible. your bolted in. and i think you know. at surface level, there's a beacon on board. myself on serve to be working, a spam gps ignores. as you go down, as you start to sending through the water column, there is no gps. radio communication becomes impossible. there are a couple of systems, one of them is the sonar based system. it's sending off pings, this is ship is sending off pings, and that's picked up by the mothership. and then there is a text-based communication, very

low bandwidth. very slow. you type in a shorthand, there's constant communication back and forth. the mothership is trying to guide you and tell you what you are on the way. back it strangling your position, try to figure how close you are. is there so no on board. >> the sonar on, rain to 1500 meters we are back for two and having meters, hit the bottom. our pilot, who i think is incredibly skilled, had been studying the currents in the wind and everything at the surface. we were very lucky, we flipped the sonar on. there was the bow of the titanic, 50 meters away. so, we 50 meters away. so, we inched up up to it. out of the gloom with the lights of the submersible on. there's the bow of the titanic. it blows your mind. that's incredible. >> how long did you spend on the titanic?

>> at that point, our pilot gave the control the ph. ph nargeolet who you've been referring, to a remarkable, man, took control of. it really toured us around the barrel of the titanic. >> was he talking about what happened? i >> mean, we spent all week with him. we got to know him very well. he, you know, for five hours, we got all of his knowledge about the titanic. >> it was incredible. we did try and make a run for the stern. which is about 600 meters, away we couldn't find it. and then we went for the surface, another 2 and a half from our ride up. >> i'm glad you're okay on, that i'm sure you talk to us tonight. >> my pleasure. under the circumstances, collin taylor, thank you. up next, the oceangate expeditions made of adventure and safety before, it launch. we'll be right back. it

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>> it was being promoted on part of being safe. randi kaye tonight has more. >> with this, i think we christened tighten. >> >> in april 2018, employees of oceangate, including its ceo and cofounder, stockton rush,

christened the brand-new titan submersible that just developed. the project was four years in the making. >> this will be one of the great moments of submersibles in this technology is what we need to explore the ocean depths. we're gonna go to 4000 meters after our testing in the bahamas, assuming all things panned out as we expect. and we validate our engineering. that will open up 50% of the planet. >> oceangate used social media channels, and its website, to drum of excitement about the titan. it's website describes the titan as a state-of-the-art vessel. used to explore the wreck of the titanic through its titanic expeditions. in one oceangate youtube video, rush tease the submersible as a once in a lifetime experience. >> you'll see things that no one's ever seen before. there is just a ton of things to look, at all kinds of things happen.

it all comes together to make a truly unique experience that you just have to experience to believe. >> this is not a thrill ride for tourists. it's much more. it is an eight-day, one-of-a-kind experience. >> in this youtube video, the company promoted its titanic experience. >> oceangate expeditions offers you the once in a lifetime opportunity to be especially trained crew member, safely diving to the titanic wreckage site. >> the promos include rave reviews from those who have been on board the titan. >> no other trip like this. fewer people have been to tighten it up into space. >> we saw things that maybe humanized never seen before. >> beyond the experience itself, the company repeatedly promoted its safety. >> it's very well engineered, very safe. >> videos also included field tests showing the titan at work. >> i would, here this is really focused on one thing. that's the pressure vessel. making sure that that component, which is clearly the most critical component of the sub, is safe and capable of handling depths down to 4000 meters, repeatedly. with people on board. >> employees also offer testimonials.

>> one of the best part of being in the submersible is you get to bring other people with you, just seeing the excitement they get from going underwater. it's pretty awesome. >> i found several shipwrecks, about 30 shipwrecks, nobody's ever found before. i would love to visit a manned sub. >> after all the excitement, plenty of successful missions, and all the hope it would forever change ocean exploration. >> excitement, thrills, and adventure on the high seas . >> randi kaye, cnn. >> during my interview early with james cameron, he called the titans carbon composite design, quote, completely inappropriate for a vessel that sees external pressure. he said that, quote, you may have a number of successful dives, and then have it fail later. the carbon composite construction was one of the experimental methods the maker of the titan used for the vessel that could fit five people, yet still be

underway. it concern among the time, including dj -- a former oceangate some quieter worked on the development of tighten, he joins me now. dj appreciate being with us sorry for what you must be going through. how does what we believe happened this catastrophic implosion, how does it align with any of the concerns you head? >> well, it seems to be in direct line with the engineering concerns that everybody knew. it's not a surprising thing.. this is kind of material science in realtime. it had not been tried before. pretty much everybody involved understood the risks. >> >> your concern, was it about of carbon fiber being used for the whole? what exactly, in your, view made that unsuitable? >> well, carbon fiber, you know, high -- strength fibers, work really well under tension. and it's just kind of logic that they don't work so well under tencel strength, or compression. unofficially, i was very excited about the program. it was my owner in my pleasure to

work with stockton rush and the crew. you know , all of this is really beyond my pay grade. made sense to me that that particular engineering choice may lead to some trouble down the road. >> did you or anybody else in the company raised concerns about the integrity of carbon fiber? i'm wondering, if so, was there a reaction? >> well, so, when you're developing something like this, there are's a lot of people who have the engineering prowess to

speak into various aspects of a build like this. and material scientists, material experts, subject matter experts, would raise concerns. and then there would be steps by oceangate to mitigate those concerns. and really, whatever you start a project like this, and you make some initial choices, it's one thing builds on another. so, there's a definite reason to pick carbon fiber. but, yeah, it may not be the right material. >> b. j. virnig, appreciate your time tonight. joining me now by someone who's been with us this week, and new hamish harden in stockton rush. well -- was involved into mission, attempting to reach the titanic. i'm sorry for the loss

of your friend, hamish harding in stockton rush. can you talk about how your feeling, what went through your mind when the u.s. coast guard today finally announced the catastrophic implosion? >> yeah, it was obviously devastating and heartbreaking when we finally heard the verdict. we were very optimistic in trying to stay positive. hoping for a little miracle for the submersible subject come up to the surface. it became increasingly clear, time was up. obviously, with the u.s. coast guard giving the final verdict, that was it. heartbreaking, devastating. the world has lost five great men, i'm afraid. two of which i knew. >> the fact that this vehicle had gone down to the titanic on a number of occasions had brought people down without filling in the past. i'm wondering, how you account for that? why a failure now? >> i'm not an engineer. there have been discussions in the science community that the material, there could be some

questions around it. it clearly was working, today a number of times. during the 2021 season, in 2022 seasons, there were a number of dives that took place, not all of them were successful. some of them got aborted, perhaps out of cautiousness or safety reasons, et cetera. the big question was always going to be around, does this composite material, cannot withstand these enormous pressures? it is a new way of building submersibles, compared to the old, solid titanium. like the -- that the russians have been using for a long time. also been used in previous missions. also the ones that i signed up for in 2012. before i ended up signing up with ocean gate in 2019. so, but it was a new technology, obviously not certified. but, yeah. sadly, proved not to be solid. >> the coast guard suggested today, the implosion likely occurred when the submersible first went missing, about an

hour and 45 minutes or so into the voyage. as we mentioned, a u.s. navy official told us they discovered an acoustic anomaly, quote, consistent with an implosion, or explosion, in the general facility of where the titan submersible was operating when communications were lost. and quote. they also said those noises were likely supporter of natural life or sound, given off by other ships. those noises that we had been told about over the past several

days, the banging that had been sound that had been reported. do you think those were now unrelated? i mean, if if the implosion occurred right away, clearly, those towns were unrelated. >> yeah, absolutely. i mean, the u.s. coast guard would know better than i do. they've got the sonar down there on the board. if they've heard that kind of big sound from the implosion, on the sunday, on the very day that went down, obviously, nobody there had disseminated that. nobody knew about it. if that is now in retrospect the case, yeah, that would seem quite likely. if you think about it, if the material was going to give in, on the way down, and it couldn't withstand the pressures, obviously, as you went down to one hour and 45 minutes, which probably would be around 2500 meters or so. well, that's got to be the point where it gave up. yeah, the u.s. coast guard has decent information, we haven't had them until now. i think the investigation will really show, eventually, what really happened. >> obviously, this is personal for. you lost to friends in

this tragedy. what you want people to know about them? >> hamish was a person who is larger than life. absolutely super amazing person, top guy. great businessmen. very successful in the aviation space. also, a very, very accomplish adventurer. three guinness world records to his name. he traveled to the south pole with buzz aldrin and a friend of mine from england. he'd done some amazing things. in the adventure space. always looking for the next adventure. just a guy who enjoyed life, enjoyed pushing the limits. it's a really great loss to the world. in terms of stockton, obviously, he was trying his very best to build these new things. can explore as well. it's just sad to see all five of them, quite frankly, disappear just like this. by her to go out to their families.

>> do you think this is going to impact deepwater exploration in the future? >> i think i remember when the titanic sank, obviously, that was a massive world event, the world media was on this thing. and the sinking of the titanic lead to new regulations related to how many rescue boats you had on it, on the titanic, they were not enough rescue boats for everybody. that got changed through the global legislation, safety measures got put in place, et cetera. so, that titanic event, more than 100 years ago, changed regulations. it is quite possible that with the titan imploding like this and with the partial lack, or maybe a gap in the regulatory space, if you do dives i