evening everyone, i am alison camerota, welcome to cnn tonight. we continue with our breaking, you cnn exclusively obtaining the audio recording of donald trump discussing highly classified documents at his golf club with people who did not have security clearances. you are about to hear trump in his own words explain that he no longer had the power to declassify documents, and you will hear him shuffling through papers. this conversation is a critical piece of evidence, special counsel jack smith's indictment of donald trump over his mishandling of classified documents information. we have cnn's top legal

political and intelligence and lists here tonight. but let's start with cnn senior legal affairs correspondent paula reid and former federal prosecutor laura coats, ladies, great to see you. all, i will begin with you. let's get straight to that exclusive audio tape. what do we hear donald trump saying? >> all right, so remember this back in the summer of 2021 as new jersey golf club. and in the room alone with him are to have states who he knows are recording everything he says. because during that time he was in the habit of having his staff report him anytime he talked to journalists, members of the media, or anyone working on a book. the other people in the room or two people working on an audio biography of former white house chief of staff mark meadows. at the time it appears the former president's quite agitated about comments made by general mark milley regarding trump's feelings and his desire to attack iran. i am gonna let him take it from here, you can hear him in his own words and what he had to say about that. >> he's a bad sick people.

>> that was your coup, you know? against you. >> it started right -- >> when really is talking about, oh, we are gonna try to do a coup. no, they were trying to do that before you even were sworn in. >> that's right, trying to overthrow your -- >> with milley she -- i've got to show you an example. he said that i wanted to attack iran. it's needed to mazie to have a big thing up here that says, wow, look. this was him. they present this, this is off the record, but they presented me this. this was him. this was the defense department and to him. we looked at some, this was him, this wasn't done by me, this was him. all sorts of stuff, pages long. let's see here. >> yeah, i just found, that is not amazing? just totally wins my case, you know?

except it is highly confidential. this is secret information. look at this. -- >> hillary would print that out all the time. she said that to anthony weiner. the pervert. by the way, isn't that incredible? >> yeah. >> i was just saying because we were talking about him. and you know, he said, he wanted to attack iran and, -- >> it was -- >> this was somebody military and given to me. i think we can probably use it. >> we will have to see. yeah, we will try to figure out a way. >> see, as president declassified, it no i can't. you know, but this is -- >> now we have a problem. >> isn't that interesting? it's so cool. i mean, here and -- you probably almost didn't believe me, but now you believe me. >> no i believe you. >> it's incredible, right? it brings some --

please? >> really remarkable there, the casual nature of that conversation where he is clearly claiming to be discussing some of the nation's most sensitive secrets. now in a statement tonight the former president spokesman said that this in part clarifies that the former president did nothing wrong. >> okay, laura, i want to get your take on that. you hear the former president say, quote, these are the papers, he calls them, quote, highly confidential secret information. so here is a question for you, that special counsel jack smith need to prove that they really were what trump was claiming they were? ? >> well special counsel and the team is probably salivating a little bit of the fact that this audiotape, when you look at the written transcript is so much more rich in these it gives you the full context, it shows maybe the motivation in part, the idea of wanting to show off and somehow in his mind prove it seems from a statement that he didn't believe me at first and i bet you do. it is probably part of a

greater to actual contests -- reasons why he wanted to retain and ultimately revealed certain documents, but it does fatally undermined the claims that he has made in the past, including at a fox town hall and other times, talking about the idea of he's these weren't actually paperwork assigned are associated with the department of defense. these were newspapers or magazines clippings. that negates that very wholeheartedly. of course if you are the special counsel you are well aware of this audio and you know as everyone in that room with whom he was speaking, the voices that you heard, the people who actually had the tapes, they are now all witnesses to this. and can be called in front of a grand jury if they haven't already been, i listen. where they can actually testify about what specifically he was in fact holding. it gives greater color to the overarching claims. but remember, the bulk of these claims in this indictment relate to the conspiracy, the idea of obstruction as well. and so now this paints a clear picture. but the conduct that is indicted happens primarily

according to the indictment in south florida. >> okay, so paula, where those are the voices that we hear? >> just so we know, trump's staffers, liz harrington, one of his spokespeople, and also margo martin. margo martin is a longtime aide and that is significant because when she went into the grand jury, they play this recording for her. and that was actually how trump's lawyers back in march of this year found of those recordings stood idle. prior to that they were unaware of this key piece of evidence. also emphasized that there are multiple poll versions of this recording because of these doctors that were not the -- were also rolling on this meeting so they had notes. now it is unclear exactly how the special counsel obtained the reporting that was played in the grand jury. but it is notable, march, march, that is one trump's lawyers learned. they learned about this incriminating piece of evidence. >> so, laura, as you know, donald trump has claimed the could to classify documents whatever he wanted. on the safe, we hear him admitting that he had not declassified those. and cannot declassify those now

that he is out of office. is that a problem? >> yes, and the plot also thickens on that very notion. this idea that he was able to declassify -- legally ridiculous. remember, this complaint, this actual criminal indictment deals with he willful retention of documents that should have been returned as well. the presidential records act as not playing the most -- classified material or defense related information as is defined in the espionage act is center stage here. so the knowledge that he does not have the power to declassify what is in front of him, a nature of the conversations surrounding general milley and of course the documents and the substance of it. it also gives further credence to the claims that these were documents that were falling under the category of defense related information. which remember means things that would be close to the best of the united states. that would be something that

our allies would not want to have out or those who wish to do us harm would love to have. so think about all of that context of the evergreen nature of the material. we are not creating new defense plans and war plans every day. and they are mostly things that have already been decided. of course they will be renewed in some form or fashion. these are very sensitive materials. and so he is fatally undermining his own defense. i will be curious to see what his lawyers ultimately articulate in the court of law. this will be the motion practice, alison. we are all looking for it. the pre trial motions, what comes in, what is excluded. and why? >> okay, thank you very much for explaining all of that to us, laura and paula. let's bring in former u.s. attorney harry lippman. we also cnn senior legal analyst elie honig and john miller, our chief law enforcement intelligence analyst. gentlemen, great to have you here. elie, your thoughts as you hear donald trump's onwards there? >> there are tapes and then there are tapes. that is a really damaging and devastating tape. because what it does is allows the prosecutors to put the jury

in the room. to hear what donald trump says. to hear him use these documents to make a point to try to persuade someone. to hear him paging through to talk about classified top secret and even you his eighth one point who is, let's just say, obsequious. says that's the problem. that she is struggling a little bit but even this aid who was telling trump everything he wants to see as to, oh, this is a bit of a problem. and as laura just said it undermines the core component of his defense. which is that a declassified. here he is saying, i could have, but i didn't, but i can't now. i don't even know what the defenses. maybe this is a very smart team, so we have been kicking this around. how do you define this. >> how do you do, it harry? >> but offense, there's never been a defense. but it is a lot to really significant aspects. one, just as lauren and how he says, it was the light -- of course he has a 12 different versions. but we have known all along, or at least remember a couple of months, this tape was to battle in the united states decision to seek a search warrant. there were people who was a

little bit on the fence. this is the thing that actually persuaded them. and if you listen tua to know why. he is asserting true or not a conversation from the chair of the joint chiefs of staff about how we are going to attack iran. that is radioactive. you can't even imagine sort of a higher level. so it was at that point that they had to go in. another point though, it seems as if and this is what they indictment says, he is floating with dissemination. dissemination would be a whole another crime under the espionage act. a whole another level we are talking, you know, the rosen -- >> does not mean he actually lost to hand over something. it appears that he is showing something? >> the short answer is no. but they have got to know it is. and that is why i suspect they haven't charged him. it is in there mainly for atmosphere to say that this is the kind of guy, this is what he would do. he is so indifferent to the national interest. this is the highest national interest. so paragraph six here is really put in there for sort of

atmosphere rather than charging dissemination. we will see if they have the goods to charge that double wide. >> okay, draw, they've laid off the legal case. let's talk about national security implications of this. how dangerous is it? >> so it is extraordinarily dangerous. and it crosses over into the legal and also because it is pure to the charge. which is 18 usc 70 93. which is defense information. doesn't matter if it is classified, they made that law in 1917. there was no such thing as ossified. but it's defense information that could be -- to the security of the united states. when you have a hostile foreign power, let's take iran, which apparently is the subject of this document we understand. and you have a contingency plan. if we had to attack iran, there was a situation that came up we had to put that into -- disseminating that information, not protecting that information could actually undermine the

entire attack plan. this goes back to world war ii, loose lips, sink ships. so i think it is a stunning example based on the charge that they have chosen. >> so there is this moment in it and we will play it again. i think we have it. where the listener, one of the people react to what they are seeing. okay? so listen to this. oh, basically they say, wow -- >> is that a big deal? >> one of the questions will be, or they react will document, what istanbul jean? in an odd way it doesn't matter. because this indictment that we have before, is that we live with before us now, charges thumps of docked with. whatever this document is is not one of them. so don't necessarily need to prove there was a document there in order to carry or charges. as harry said, it largely is atmospheric but a really important piece of atmosphere. because this is the one time we really see, one of few times in the indictment or don trump is actually doing something. so i think you'll see happening is people trying to piece

together the kilos. okay, he's clearly showing them something. >> you know because you have prosecuted these cases. when they get into court they are gonna play the tape and the jury is gonna be following along with the transcript. and then they ramp on those witnesses, they are gonna play it again, and they are gonna say, when this was happening, what happened in the room. he held up a piece of paper, what did you see? i saw a red cover and the word secret on it. did he feel about that first page? did you see a document behind it? did it also say secret? they will unfurl layer by layer what they saw and what they were exposed to. did they discuss giving it to you, yes they did, they said well maybe we can declassify. so i am and, all of that is gonna come out. transcript was damning. tape brings it to life. human witnesses bring it home. >> but even though -- >> i'm sorry, that main person who could reboot, it donald trump, he won't testify? so all of these things will be effectively on repeated. >> standby, guys we have many more questions for you because we have much more, cnn's

exclusive audio tape of donald trump talking about secret classified documents. also, still to come, an update from the ground in moscow. i will speak to a top ambassador about whether putin can hold on to power

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katelyn polantz who is in miami. where trump aide walt nauta is expected to appear in court tomorrow. okay, so caitlin, tell us how will special counsel jack smith's team use this audiotape? >> well alison we know that it is something that he wants to use and it is something that he has described in the indictment and he is quoting it in the indictment document and that is all very much expected to come to life at the trial whenever that trial happens. right now we don't have a final date on it for the justice department wants this trial to happen in december. and when they do bring it to life there is still gonna be questions around exactly how it becomes part of the story that prosecutors tell in the courtroom to the jury. is one of these documents that trump is speaking about on the tape about iran's plan to potentially attack iran is that one of the 31 documents that he is charged with retaining in this case? we don't know.

it is not clear either whether that will be something that is explained it to trial. what a coach possibly could be because we know just from the indictment alone that this is the type of document that passengers can use not just to explain the chargers to explain intent of donald trump allegedly had in wanting to keep these things. and the attitude he had towards these documents after he left the presidency. >> but caitlin, just so i am clear, that document, whatever it was that he was showing their, or do we know that status of that right now? where it is and what is a return to the national archives? >> yeah, alison, that is a huge question. and it is going to be a question that we are watching a lot of four as we move through this case toward trial in all the discussions before trial. because what we did know happen was after the justice department got a hold of this audio and made it known to donald trump's team that they had this audio recording in this case in the final months before they brought the

indictment against him. we knew that they had subpoenaed these types of documents, either this document specifically that might have been in trump's possession still, or any copies of it that would remain. and his lawyers were unable to find the exact document that was responsive. and so it is possible that the justice department found in that search of mar-a-lago last august and we just don't know that's part of the story yet. but it is also possible that maybe it was a copy of something. or maybe it was just a document that is lost in the third. that is really going to be a big question to watch for whatever we head towards this trial. >> okay, we will talk more about, that thank you very much. caitlin, let's bring back harry lippman and elie honig and john miller. what about, that what are they don't have that document? >> yeah, i think as a prosecutor you do have to -- show the jury. here is what he is talking about. but even if they don't have, it this recording is still completely relevant and i think admissible and i think really important because it shows

exactly what donald trump's intent was and it shows why donald trump kept these documents and what he actually did with them so you want the document but even if you don't have it as a prosecutor is still valuable. >> eric? >> there is a couple of uses of the document in addition and you can try very hard to go for the home run but i think smith is smart enough not to do that. but what a minimum here's what you can do with that document. first, it totally puts the lie to his various defenses about how he classified everything when he left, he realizes he doesn't have that power. second, it is one of what? a dozen shifting explanations by trump of his reasons. that in and of itself, you know, two days ago he tells bret baier the exact opposite. oh, there wasn't any document there. you play those serie a and you have got a liar on your hands and the jury knows it. and by the way, if it is admissible? it is admissible. every statement of trump as long as it is relevant out of support under the rules of

evidence will be admissible. and as i suggested, he won't be rebutting them. so those two things, at a minimum and that is a lot already. >> let's play that bret baier more meant, because that is how donald trump tried to explain whether there was, what that document was that he was showing off. let's listen to that. >> there was no document, that was a massive amount of papers and everything else. talking about iran and other things. and it may have been held up or may not, but that was not a document. i didn't have a document per se. there was nothing to declassify. these were newspaper stories, magazine stories, and articles. >> so he claims he wasn't holding up a document? >> so that is where the transcript doesn't help us. it's where the tape is suggestive. it's where the witness is going to win the day or lose today on the witness stand. which is did he hold up a document? what did it look like? did you get to see the document? could you read it? but i suspect if they put it in the case that way they are

going to do that? and then they will put on an expert witness from the director of the office of, you know, office of erector national intelligence. what is your classified -- and the president classifier declassified? yes he can. can a former president? now he can't. is donald trump's statement here showing that he has a clear understanding of the rules as giannis tandem as an expert? if he does. i mean, they will build around this. >> and he says in the tape that it is secret, it says confidential, i mean unless -- that difference, reasonable inference is that he is reading off the documents that you can hear him shoveling about. >> but as we have already established, whoever was in this room does sound obsequious as you said. these were his longtime staffers. when you put on the witness stand, harry, isn't it possible that they say, yeah, you know, they back up his story? >> but, way i think the most repulsive moment of the whole tape is where they are falling with him at the very thought --

ha. the short answer is yes, and i think if you are a prosecutor you use it conservatively. as you say, go for the home run, but it really doesn't matter in terms of it's going to his ferocity and flowing out the water on his defenses, kind of whatever they say. but i agree, i wouldn't put them in thinking they're gonna make the case against their old boss. >> john, as we, know donald trump was indicted in florida because of the boxes that we see at mar-a-lago, that they were mishandled. this happened in bedminster in new jersey. so is that a different case? it's that all part of the same case? how does that work? >> i think it will stay part of the same case. the reason i think that is you can see that the prosecutor here, jack smith has gone to great lengths as he has developed this case do not argue about the judge who was controversial. not argue about presenting it in palm beach. he is going to great lengths to not play it too cute.

but to go with the cards he is dealt. so i doubt they would bring a charge in bedminster just to get the advantage of a different jury. >> i agree with that, there was a theory going around for a while that maybe the doj has the second set of charges that will drop in jersey based on this. that is not how doj plays, and they are playing is right. as john says, they are placed right now. >> gentlemen, thank you very much for all of the help. was tonight installment trump's future depends on winning the upcoming presidential election. we talk about what that means for the campaign next.

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tonight, we got a reporting obtained by cnn, a former president trump at his golf club in new jersey, talking freely about what he calls highly classified secret documents. about a possible attack on iran. >> these are bad sick people. >> that was your coup, you know? against you. >> it started right at -- >> really is talking about, oh, you are going to try to, no, they were trying to do that before you even were sworn in. that's right? trying to overthrow your -- >> with nearly, let's see the, i've got to show you an example. he said that i wanted to attack iran? >> all right, let's talk about what this means for the 2024 race. presidential one of course. we have lee carter, cnn legal analyst joey jackson, and our senior political analyst john avlon, great to have you will hear. , legal reaction when you heard this statement? >> under the state was one of those moments, is not what he said it matters as much as what

people are going to hear. and my big reaction here is i am not sure it is going to move the republican primary voters all that much. and again and it's a democrats are going to be outraged in many ways. they are gonna hear that this is the proof that we have been looking for. this is the fell in, he is a felon at this moment. i think republicans have an opposite reaction. if you think, about 18% of republicans were more likely to consider donald trump post indictment. they hear this kind of thing and then there is a double standard that applies to donald trump. when you look at polling around what they say about hunter biden, versus donald trump, you think that donald trump, that's all politically motivated. they need -- hear you hear him offering up what he says -- i really don't think most voters thought that the classified documents weren't there. i think the question is, are they secret that will be

damaging? and that is how a lot of republican voters are looking at it. that's not how i'm looking at, i'm saying, but i think a lot of the problems are saying,, looking at these documents. he knew the secrets anyways. i'm not cuts and -- >> people around 90 classification. john, your consternation? >> yeah i am not buying that. for several different reasons. we have seen a poll just a few weeks ago showing that his support at softened in the wake of just to the news of the indictment. let alone this audio evidence. over a quarter of republicans said that they would not -- that he should drop out of the race on the basis of the indictment alone. and, you know, while he is leading the pack by a lot you saw some upward when anthem by other candidates, i'll be in the single digits. here you have got the audiotape that has been reported before. the deals with national security, right, this is the kind of stuff that can get people killed in the falls in the wrong hands. and if you look line that up with the lies that he has told consistently, that is the wrong word for donald trump. the difference lies he has told about this including to the

brett bears -- you can slice eludes to gather and say, look, he is lying. he is lying about holding on to national security secrets. now, the hard-core supporters may not affect him. but to anyone with an essence of being fair minded undefended minded that is got to be damning. >> joey, this is interesting because as the defense attorney you would lean into what police saying in terms of appealing to people for who still have a shred of doubt? >> yes, sir charles or about campaigns. same thing. and what you want to do is you want to mess edge. and part of that messaging has to be trust. and a lot of cases, right, from a defense perspective or predicated upon whether or not people trust the government. can you trust what people are telling you? what they're representing to you? the information they are providing to you? what the motivated for forgetting and gathering that information? what makes this different though is it is in his words. there is an indication that it is secret. there is an indication that he said many times that i could have declassified this as president, i am not president anymore. he is owning the issue of

knowledge. he is sharing it with other people across the table. why do i raise that? because when you are arguing as a defense attorney, don't trust the government, don't trust what they are telling you, fabrications lies, et cetera. now we have your own first, sir, and their own voice cut against the notion that it is just don't trust the government, they're evil, they're out to get everyone, i am innocent. >> let me ask you this. donald trump lost to joe biden by more than 7 million votes. does all of this, the audiotape, all of these indictments, does that help him pick up some of those 7 million? i mean, how is he going to get more votes. >> this time around, with all of this? >> >> i think this really impacts the general election. and that is the bottom line. when you look at the impact on polls, it has a huge impact on independent voters and it has a huge impact on democratic voters. there is going to be more energized, more likely to vote against donald trump than they would before. and in fact, many independents who are considering him are less likely to know as low result of it. but i do think this actually is,

you, know in many ways there is a opposite day thing that applies to donald trump. and with republican voters in the primary, this seems to have given trump energy and really adds fuel to the fire about the narrative. this to tears of justice that he talks about, the witch, and things seem so unfair. you hear a lot of contrast. i am sure about hunter biden's text messages versus the treatment of -- sure you already hear that on that works for sure. we'll have other, will his opponents in the republican primary season see this somehow? >> they should, i mean, i think in terms of this, they make a great point. republicans have to gross by this point. you know, not just from the self interest point with candidates, but with this candidate not only he is under indictment for serious crimes. but he is a general election loser. because he is even more kryptonite among independents than he was before. independent society when general elections. so you have to start standing up and speaking out. they can do it by saying, look, he lied, and this is about national security. >> thank you very much, next we

are in moscow where vladimir putin finally broke his silence, what is details mean for his grip on power?

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>> what we know where vladimir putin is. he is safely ensconced inside the kremlin. but yeah, he, right for the first time since this rebellion came to an end, so we are talking about a good three days, fluttery putin appeared on state television addressing the nation and he was, i, mean that was an angry president that we were watching on the television just a few hours ago. it's ugly absolutely slamming what he called the traders who carried out or who led this military uprising. mutiny by the wagner mercenaries against him. he said that they played into the hands of russia's enemies by putting russian against russian, spilling russian blood. and he restated him offer that he had been made before to the wagner fighters that took part, saying they could either now sign military contracts with the russian army, or they could leave the country altogether and go to the neighboring country of belarus.

he also, the putin, trying to get back some of the authority that is certainly lost over the past couple of days. by saying that it was only because of him that there was more bloodshed. because he had over the authorities, he said, to make sure that there was as little bloodshed as possible. but again, this is a weekend russian president, and a very angry one indeed. >> matthew, you have spent a lot of time reporting in moscow. does it feel different tonight in the city? after everything that happened this weekend? >> i think it does. look, first of all there is a lot of relief in the city that the wagner forces didn't entered. because that would lead to a confrontation and nobody wanted you to see that happen. but there is also a lot of anxiety now as well about what this means. you know, what will vladimir putin do in order to shore up his authority? which has definitely been weakened. and all the facts that when

mutiny has taken place against vladimir putin mean that others may follow in the future as well? because what has been lost here in russia and here in moscow is this aura of invincibility around vladimir putin. he was always seen as a symbol of stability, it's where he drew his power from. russians saw him as, you know, a consistent figure would bring stability and hand stability to the country. that is not necessarily the case anymore. and that is very concerning to people across the country. >> matthew chance, thank you very much for all of your reporting from moscow for us. great to see you. let's bring in the former u.s. ambassador to ukraine now, william taylor. mister ambassador, thank you very much for being here. so many analysts, as you just even heard matthew chance say, that this whole strange opposite has weakened him. but he did manage to wall a rebellion and dispatched prigozhin to belarus perhaps. so is he significantly weakened? >> i think he is.

i think he is weekend. he linked and prigozhin linked. they were both on a collision course. prigozhin of course barreling at the end for from the south towards moscow. putin lasting that morning, saturday morning, the trader of stabbing in the back and gonna arrest them and crush them and what do you do? he called it all off. he said no, actually we are not going to arrest, so i don't see how that helps him at all. if he would lose him from the area, from the lead of great leaders, cleo was as matthew said, he was saying the source of, stability are making good decisions, and he has made some really bad decisions coming

into this whole conflict. >> as you know, putin has no -- enemies poisoned or jailed, so what is going to happen to prigozhin now? >> prigozhin must be very worried, why he wouldn't agree to go to belarus, and belarus -- and, not known to be a heavyweight, and clearly beholden to putin. and, people across putin, people who are accused of much less crimes than prigozhin have ended up dead. falling out of windows, poison as you indicate, so if i were a putin, or prigozhin, i would spend as little time as possible in belarus. >> erin burnett just spoke to

former prime minister of russia -- and, he said, he thought putin looked pathetic, quote, and nervous, quote it in his speech. so what is your assessment of how putin appeared? >> he looked angry. he was not under control, -- me -- he has been disrespected, challenged, not just by someone, but one of his own creations. putin made prigozhin. there is no doubt. matt who -- thought was loyal turns out not to be so loyal. turns out he was on the way up to confront putin, and -- ministry of defense. >> so, ambassador, how does ukraine capitalize on this? how do they capitalize on the fact that it seems the wagner

group may not be fighting us ruthlessly there. >> you are exactly right this is a time for ukrainians for a couple reasons. matt 25 to 50 thousands of the best trips on the russian side, ukrainians have been upset that -- the wagner folks who are fighting better, more competently, than any ministry of defense forces. so russians don't have, those they are not on the line, there may not be back in ukraine, they may not be available to act in reserve. they may be disbanded. so there is that. and, the equine ian moreau would not be higher. they are just watching the -- over the weekend, with amazement, and amusement. and, knowing the disarray in the kremlin, --

mid to their counteroffensive, which as you have been reporting, they have been preparing, and starting the conduct of this government for weeks, and months. so they are ready. now that the russians are -- in disarray, and -- has to worry about domestic issues. >> former, bassett great to see, you thank you very much for all that contacts tonight. >> thank you, alison. >> okay, more on what this means for the frontline next.

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putin managing to survive a failed uprising by wagner boss if donny prigozhin. but could this power struggle still lead to -- front lines of the war with ukraine. that is the question for cnn military analyst cedric leighton. >> almost, and i think the answer to this is yes, the reason i say it is, yes it is because what the ukrainians have been able to do, they started out in the village of -- and moved in this general direction. so, they were able to capture several villages in this, area including the village of -- and, and other village in this area, of -- this one is important, because, it was actually a village that was controlled by the russians, has been controlled by the russians or their surrogates since 2014. this marks the first time that ukraine has actually been able to capture a village that was controlled by the russians since the beginning of this effort back in 2014. so, this marks a very different

aspect of the war and means that the ukrainians do have the capacity to take over, not only areas that have recently been captured by the russians, but also areas that were captured by the russians all the way to 2014. that's both trouble for the russians, because one of the things they thought they could do, is not only controlled, hysteria but really all of ukraine. the fact that they can't do, that is evidence by the fact also, that they have a really weak defense effort inside russia. and, the fact that they have a weak defense inside russia was evidence of what happened during -- when prigozhin's forces in the wagner group were able to go all the way from rostov-on-don, all the way to a point right about here, about 125 miles south of moscow. the fact they were able to do this shows a lot of weakness within the russian military structure, and could spell trouble for the russians because they are not able to respond to these types of threats, especially with the

threats have weapons from the west backed up against that. and, what they are able to do with those weapons on the ukrainian, side it will then determine whether or not the ukrainians can actually take over these areas of their territory. i listen? >> carl, thank you so much. tomorrow on cnn this morning, bank of america's ceo is going to join live to talk new recession fears, and what is ahead for the u.s. economy. that all starts at 6 am eastern. thank you so much for watching tonight, our coverage continues. ♪ ♪ huh, huh, so did ththeir dog roger. ♪ ♪ gain s scent beads keep even the stinkiest stuff smelling fresh.

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>> good even