the belgian shot putter filling in for an injured dream mate. and not exactly demonstrating expert form, but she was all smiles after finishing well behind the other competitors. and she spoke with don riddell about the unique experience. >> in my head, it looks a bit but it could be worse as well. so, i'm just happy that i have memory of a great moment like that. >> what a team player there. team would have been disqualified if she did not step up. >> hurdles are terrifying when you know what you're doing. good for her. thank you, andy scholes. thank you for joining me. i'm christine romans. "cnn this morning" starts right

now. ♪ all right. good morning, everyone. we're so glad you're with us. really significant developments overnight, perhaps after you went to bed. happy to have phil by my side. good morning. >> good morning. >> how are you doing? >> you know those moments when you see a transcript of something, i really like to listen to the actual tape. >> then cnn obtains the tape. >> and the tape is just as bad, if not worse, than the transcript was. and you think, oh, wow. this is huge news. >> then a former president is at the center of it. that's what we're going to get started with this morning. five things to know for this tuesday, june 27th. first on cnn what we were just talking about, that audio tape central to the prosecution's case of donald trump, trump's mishandling of classified documents you'll hear from the former president in his own words telling people, quote, this is secret information. look at this. >> and just hours from now, we may get a glimpse of how trump's political rivals leveraged that new audio against him, if they do at all. he and florida governor ron desantis set to collide in new

hampshire on the campaign trail. russia says it is dropping all charges against the wagner group, the rebel army prepared to march on moscow this weekend. questions remain where their leader is. all eyes on the supreme court this morning. we're standing by for rulings on several consequence shall cases including affirmative action and student loan forgiveness. cases of malaria have been contracted here in the united states. scie scientists warn the climate crisis is a key role. "cnn this morning" starts right now. ♪ well, good morning, everyone. welcome. there's a lot of news today. we want to begin with the biggest. it's a first on cnn. former president donald trump heard on audio talking about holding secret documents that he did not declassify. cnn has obtained that recording from a 2021 meeting at the former president's bedminster

golf club. he indicates he was holding a secret pentagon document containing plans to attack iran. listen. >> these are bad, sick people. >> that was your coup, you know. against you. >> started right at -- >> milli talking about -- no. they were trying to do that before you even were sworn in. that's right. trying to overthrow your -- >> milli. i'll show you an example. he said that i wanted to attack iran. isn't it amazing i have a big pile of papers. this just came up. yeah. this was him. they presented me this -- this is off the record, but they presented me this. this was him. this was the defense department and him. >> wow. >> we looked at this. this was him. this wasn't done by me. this was him. all sorts of stuff. pages long.

let's see here -- >> yep. >> isn't that amazing? this totally wins my case, you know. except it is highly confidential, secret -- secret information. look at this. >> hillary would print that out all the time, you know. private email. >> send it to anthony wiener, pervert. by the way, isn't that incredible. >> yeah. >> we were talking about it. and he's -- he wanted to attack iran. >> you did. >> this was done by the military, given to me. i think we can probably -- >> we'll have to see. we'll have to try -- >> declassify it. as president i could declassify it. now i can't. >> now we have a problem. >> isn't that interesting.

so cool. and you probably almost didn't believe me, but now you believe me. >> no, i believed you. >> incredible. >> there he is, in his own words. that audio is crucial evidence in federal prosecutor's case against trump over his alleged mishandling of classified information after he left the white house. federal prosecutors charged him with putting national security secrets at risk. here is what he wre on truth soal. jack smith working in conjunction with the doj and fbi, illegally leaked transcript of me an exoneration rather than what they would have you believe, closed quote. let's bring with our senior crime correspondent katelyn polantz. because of your reporting you and your colleagues, we knew what your reporting. to hear it was a different thing. legally is it damning?

>> reporter: well, phil and poppy, that's exactly what we're looking at here. right? we had the transcript of this. we knew what the words were that donald trump had spoken because the justice department confirmed them in that indictment. it was words on a page. but this brings it to life. not just for us to hear now, but it is the sort of thing, the sort of piece of evidence that prosecutors will be playing in a courtroom to tell the story of this case. and particularly from what we can see in the indictment, they're going to want to be using this to show how cavalier donald trump, documents were he's refused of -- he's showing them to people. disseminating them to people and also showing that he has knowledge that these documents are secret. at least this one in particular that he's acknowledging that it was classified and getting that feedback on that audio recording from the others in the room. yes, every time he's saying look. and they're responding to him.

yeah, we see it. we agree with you. that's the sort of thing that we would very much expect to be used at a trial if not once but multiple times during witness questioning. >> one of the big questions we all had to some degree special prosecutor has as well, these documents that the president is referring to in this tape, do we know where they are now will there be further searches? what's the stat us? >> there's no indication there would be further searches. it's charged in this case that we already have. there is a big question about what happened to this document? we know it's a real document. that was part of the reporting when we first broke this story that this type of document did exist during trump's presidency. he would have been privy to it. he would have been able to have it and take it with him. and after the justice department got this audio tape, they subpoenaed donald trump and his lawyers for this specific document or any copies of it he had. now if that indicates whether they couldn't find it, or they already had it in their

possession and just wanted to make sure there was nothing else out there, we don't exactly know. it is something that could come out in trial that the prosecutors might have. donald trump's team would not able to produce the exact document. and trump has clearly been leaning into that even since he was indicted. and this particular document, this episode is part of the case against him. here is what he has said previously about what he was waving around in this audio recording that he so clearly showing this particular document to these others. >> there was no document. that was a massive amount of papers and everything else talking about iran and other things. and it may have been held up or may not, but that was not a document. i didn't have a document per se. there was nothing to declassify. these were newspaper stories, magazine stories and articles. >> reporter: now, will that work in court? that's going to be a question for the jury to decide. but this is the sort of thing where prosecutors are going to

be able to play that audio tape and then we know that they have called witnesses, at least one of the people that was in the room witnessed this, to the grand jury and very likely would call those people into the trial itself to testify what they remember exactly seeing trump holding up during this episode. >> on top of all of this, someone who is alleged in the indictment to have moved a bunch of boxes is walt nada, trump's right hand and aide, arraigned today on charges he helped hide classified documents that the doj wanted back. what's going to happen today in court with this? >> reporter: well, we're expecting that to be a pretty short hearing today with walt nada, donald trump's valet, his body man, a man who still works and travelled with him as a political aide. waltt to coback into the federal courthouse behind me in downtown miami this morning to formally enter his pleading of not guilty. he didn't do it two weeks ago when we were here before for trump's arraignment, but he's coming back in to do it.

he is now very much expected to have a lawyer from florida helping with his case in addition to his typical lawyer helping him through this. but one thing about nauta, he is not charged in the retention. he is charged in concealing documents and making false statements as a part of a coverup to this retention case against donald trump. >> kaitlan poll lants, thank you for the reporting on all that. let's bring in adam ken sinker and elie honig. elie, to you, i want you to listen to trump's former lawyer, jim schultz. let's play the first sound bite. okay. we don't have it. apologize for that. >> i know what he said. it's okay. he said this is very damaging to donald trump. this is very helpful for doj's case. >> he said both on the espionage act and the obstruction front which is notable. >> i agree with jim on this. on the espionage act front, just to be clear, the charge is not

espionage, per se, it's willful retention. donald trump had sensitive, confidential information relating to military plans. he knows that's what this is and he's sharing the information some how or other with outsiders with no security clearance. then you get to the obstruction angle, let's remember when this happens, july of 2021, at this point national archives several months before come to trump's team and said, hey, we have some concerns you have some documents that you shouldn't have. we need them back. yet at this point he's already in the process of hiding those documents from the archives and eventually from doj. >> adam, i think one of the questions that i've had throughout is that this tracks the tape, the possibility that this was actually happening, i constantly hear repetition of the wire saying you're taking notes on a criminal conspiracy. what the president -- >> i concur. >> season 3. but the idea of him saying these

are just news articles. you don't have proof and we don't necessarily know they have the document at this point. however, if you look over the course of how he operated with classified information in the white house, after the white house, there's a through line here to some degree. >> the through line is he -- i don't think he's out there -- i would love to show people classified information. but if that classified information makes him look good. i remember -- i don't remember the details. there was something about some accusation or reality that he had revealed something classified to the russian foreign minister at one point. if you remember he tweeted a photo about maybe it was something in syria that was classified at the time. >> it was in iran. >> it was an iran issue, that's it. all those little thing. what is obvious, to him -- okay. everybody has an ego. everybody. sorry. most people with an ego try to put national security, particularly when you're sworn in to defend that, you try to put national security above your ego. it's the opposite in this case.

ky tell you what's going on in the room listening to all the commotion because i have seen it, i met with president trump. everybody is sitting there smiling. right? because he's talking. it's so amazing when he's talking. he's trying to impress them. what i thought was interesting, it was mentioned last night, the lady on there goes, wow. when he shows the document. somebody that has seen classified information, the very first time i was presented with something that was top secret, it kind of takes your breath away. it's pretty big deal, right? it's kind of cool. >> sure. >> it's interesting to hear the dynamics and people are just feeding his ego and he's using this another way to be fed. >> i thought it was interesting, kaitlyn did an interesting interview with mark esper who expressed concern about he said, we were generally concerned about the handling of classified material within the white house writ large. interesting to get behind the scenes and know top people were worried then let alone after the president left. >> one of the things i get concerned about, yes, what trump can reveal and all that, up

until donald trump, there was also this feeling republican and democrat, that we don't reveal classified information. this is about as holy as you can get in a secular government. now you have half of the country talking about -- everybody is talking about overclassification. this isn't a big deal, stuff like that. that's a concern to me what the damage is long-term to classified. >> overclassification is a concern, but this does not fall into that. this is a military plan about invading iraq put together by the national defense op rat us of this country. iran. excuse me. it doesn't get any more serious than that. this isn't some marginal document that was maybe classified. this ought to be. >> we don't have a lot of time left before the break. do you think not having the document, this is purely a 50/50 type deal. >> no. short answer you would rather have it as a prosecutor. if not, you can use this tape to show knowledge and intent. >> guys ta with us.

we have a lot more to come on this and many other issues going forward in the next couple hours, including vladimir putin set to speak to security forces at the kremlin just moments from now after armed rebels marched towards moscow this weekend. >> coming just after russia says charges are being dropped against the wagner group. we have the developing details straight ahead. we handcraft every stearns & foster® using the finest materials, like indulgent memory foam, and ultra-conforming innersprings, for a beautiful mattress, and indescribable comfort. for a limited time, save $400 on select stearns & foster mattresses.

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♪ breaking just moments ago, the kremlin says vladimir putin will be giving a speech at any moment now to law enforcement units who helped defend russia from the armed mercenary rebellion over the weekend. the russian government announced it's dropping all charges against the wagner mercenary group for that attempted revolt. the russian defense ministry says they're preparing to hand over heavy military equipment directly to russian troops. we don't know this morning where their leader is. we have not seen prigozhin since saturday when he abruptly ended his march on moscow and struck a deal to go in exile in belarus. what do you expect putin to say? >> reporter: hi there, poppy. first of all i think he'll thank those units that were part of that but perhaps also say that certainly seemed to be issues for the russians defending that territory and stopping that convoy from prigozhin and those wagner units. some of the things we saw unfold on that saturday was those units

marching straight towards moscow with very little to impede them on the way there. in the end, it took an agreement apparently with alexander lukashenko and prigozhin to get them to turn back. we heard from lukashenko earlier today. he said it was painful for him to see what was unfolding because it could have been russians against russians fighting each other. that's why he said he had to step in with the blessing of vladimir putin to talk to yevgeniy prigozhin. certainly there are a lot of things up in the air. one of the things we can see in russia is that they themselves are sort of trying to come to terms with the chaos and sift through the chaos. you heard vladimir putin say some of these wagner fighters could go to belarus if they want and sign contracts with the russian military if they want or they could go home. prigozhin last night from his point we haven't seen him yet but he seemed to be talking a big game and audio messages saying he could march to moscow and people were supporting his

units. that might be one of the reasons why poppy, late last night vladimir putin had that very short speech where he said, look, we would have put down that uprising any way, but we were only trying to prevent bloodshed. still seems as though while all this is over for now, there still appears to be a lot of chaos, poppy. >> interesting what putin is saying echos what prigozhin says about why he turned around to prevent bloodshed. do we know where prigozhin is? >> reporter: yeah, we don't. that's -- it's plain and simple. we know he's set to go to or set to go to belarus. we're not sure whether or not he's arrived there yet. he put out a very long audio message last night once again he justify what had he did. he said a lot of people were on his side. a lot of problems in russia that need to be addressed. that's why he felt that so many people were on his side. as of right now we don't know if he's arrived in belarus yet, poppy. >> thank you, fred. our panel is back with us. adam kinzinger, joining the

table, bobby gauche and kim dozer. i want to start with you, kim. through yesterday we have been following this together and trying to piece together what exactly happened here. when you listened to president putin last night, and his explanation for why perhaps it took so long to seem like they were taking any action at all for how things ended and what it means going forward for prigozhin, what's your take away? >> damage control. he's trying to send a message -- >> this isn't a grand plan. >> this is all chaos in motion. the arrogance of two men playing out. what prigozhin never understood is all of those months railing against the russian military and by default against putin because he backed these people to guide his military, putin was getting angrier and angrier, and the moment prigozhin helped win bakhmut and withdrew his forces a clock was ticking. and that is when the ministry of defense put in this plan that

said basically we're taking this wagner jewel away from you. we're tired of your antics. we're putting you under our control. not just in ukraine but everywhere. and they underestimated what his response would be. especially once they alledgedly hit some of his guys in the field. that caused this counteroffensive where he rushed for moscow. and you have to wonder, look, there's going to be a purge to figure out were people looking the other way to allow him to march forward? or was it simply confusion. wagner forces look like other russian forces. and also, the russian military is very top down. people don't do something unless they're ordered to do something. and if they haven't been ordered to attack one of their own, they could have been frozen in inaction which explains partly how far he got. now, both of them sort of realize, prigozhin was out over his skis and had a decision to make. he didn't really want power. he wanted his company back.

and now you've got clean-up time. >> bobby, this is -- we can't forget the biggest threat to putin's regime power in 23 years, in power. now he has to go. he really seems to want to be seen what he did last night and what he's going to do any moment now. but you have said this is akin to an emperor without clothes. can he unite, reunite his people? >> well, he still has absolute power, but he has been exposed -- >> does he have their hearts? >> that's the question. does he have the full loyalty of his closest circle of people? nobody was closer to him than prigozhin. this is a guy who used to cook for him. and rose through the ranks because of his closeness to putin. the guy closest to him sent his troops against moscow. that's, as you say, that's the strongest challenge he has faced in 23 years in power. you can't square the circle.

he will speak to his law enforcement and he's going to thank them from protecting the russian state. but how does he explain to them why he's letting those people off the hook. he's saying the wagner forces, all the forgiven. you can go back to the battlefield. prigozhin, everything is okay. you go off to belarus and there will be no consequences. you can't square those two things. yes, he controls all the levers of messaging, but underneath that, underneath all that propaganda, russians are beginning to ask some pretty tough questions about how much they can trust their leader and how strong he is. if he's not strong, he ain't nothing because that entire edifice is based on a projection of strength. he hasn't looked weak until this past weekend. that's a problem. >> can i ask you, your column, you wrote about the geopolitical impact particularly the middle east given the scale of wagner, people aren't paying close attention to. africa, the middle east, syria,

libya. the effect this has on wagner's operations, which are critical to russia's ability to project influence across the globe to some degree, certainly in very critical areas. does this have a significant impact? does that undercut putin as well? >> well, putin always used wagner as a kind of extension of russian foreign policy. deniability. a certain amount of this in mally employed wagner. moscow has pnty to do. can putin trust anybody at wagner anymore. that entire organization was built from the ground up by prigozhin. all its leadership all over the world were hired, hand picked by prigozhin. now all of them face a test of loyalty. and if sort of russian history anything goes by, when a unit of military rises up against the

state, the state is never going to trust anybody in that entire organization. so, as kim just said, the p word is important here. there's going to be a purge. there has to be a purge. there will be a purge within wagner and within the russian state. it's only a question of timing and how to avoid the embarrassment that might cause. >> i think we can't underestimate the impact this will have on global affairs. if you think about where russia has been engaged, gray zone conflict or hybrid warfare, this is part of what wagner is. so, look, crimea, putin sends in troops, they don't have in insignia, they're not ours. wink, nod. is that going to trigger a war? wagner is everywhere, libya, syria, africa, more than likely venezuela, cuba, other areas. this is going to have such a massive impact. and this is the moment -- and i would implore if i was still in congress, i would implore the administration to use this

moment not to sit back and say, oh, we don't want to provoke anything but push back against russia in other areas. you may not want to take on russia and ukraine. push back harder on russia in libya. push back harder them in syria. and push back against them -- not going to be u.s. military necessarily but there's other ways to do it, against their interest in africa. >> can you explain what those other ways look like? >> yeah. some of it can be essence a private military company not necessarily owned by the united states, but by companies that are out there maybe doing mining in africa, for instance. there's a lot of ways to in essence push back or, you know, maybe in some cases direct conflict. look what happened in syria, for instance, 300 to 400 wagner soldiers killed by u.s. military that was because they attacked them. but there's ways to get this done. it's time to push back against russia. if you're not going do it directly in ukraine, there's a lot of areas we can do it. >> you want the u.s. in the business of funding proxy wars

via mercenary groups. >> wagner is a terrorist organization. >> whatever the vehicle or mechanism? >> officer u.s. military training to replace wagner military training. that's just one way of saying, hey, we'll come in and give you some aid and assistance. >> yep. >> i think you're exactly right. there's an enormous opportunity here. all those countries, mostly military juntas that employed wagner, part of the reason why they implore wagner is to be on the good side of putin as well. they want russian support and russian money, russian expertise, russian market access. they're now wondering, wait a minute, did we pick the wrong side here? do we stay with our wagner employees? or -- do we risk upsetting putin by doing that? they have been caught in a bind. this is an opportunity for the biden administration to step in here. there have been efforts for some time now, biden administration through the egyptians, through the uae trying to put pressure on some of these african states

to cut wagner loose. this is a chance. and i think if the biden administration push hard enough this moment, it will make -- get some traction. >> all right, guys. stay with us. we have a lot more to get to. check out clarissa's reporting on wagner. it's extraordinary. they've been doing it for years. new reports multiple secret service agents testified before the grand jury. the latest on that investigation next. plus -- >> what we've done in our politics is create a situation where we're electing idiots. >> well, saying exactly what she thinks. that is former congresswoman liz cheney weighing in on the current state of politics and whether she'll run as an independent to take on donald trump.

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♪ welcome back. this morning, we heard that audio central to the prosecution's case on donald trump's alleged mishandling of classified documents. but jack smith, special counsel, is investigating the former president for his alleged role in the january 6th insurrection.

new report by nbc news says five or six secret service agents testified before the january 6th grand jury. want to bring in elie honig and adam kinzinger. it's easy to forget there's another piece of what the special counsel is working on related to january 6th. several different elements that people have been trying to pin down. what's your read of things based on who is testifying? >> nobody has access to the president's movements like secret service. so they could have really valuable information, important to know, there is precedent for this back in ken starr's investigation after white water, he wanted to talk to bill clinton's secret service agents. it was resisted in court and there was a ruling that came out saying, no, this is fair game. there is no secret service slash presidential privilege here. >> one thing we don't know that nbc points out is the proximity of these about six or so secret service agents to the president on that day. but the big question is, cassidy hutchinson famously testified before your committee, the january 6th committee, that she heard secondhand that trump

wanted secret service agents to drive him to the capitol. she also recounted an episode she heard about secondhand that the president in the beast tried to grab the car's steering wheel and reached for the classicals of the driver, right. trump denied all that. but this is what you would assume they're looking to corroborate? >> yeah. because if he -- if he's sitting there -- the law expert would know better, sitting there saying we want to go down to the capitol. that shows intent. it shows desire. it wasn't a one-off, said it on stage and i'm really going back to the white house. he was angry. he wanted to go. i think this is a pretty big deal. as a guy that spent a lot of time working on the january 6th stuff, i personally think this is as important as the classify document case is, accountability for this is even more important even if it's not the president but second tier folks. we can't have failed insurrections in this country. we can't do it. >> great point. we're all so focussed on

mar-a-lago. january 6th is a bigger deal. doj has not done anything about january 6th aboveground level as of yet. >> perfect. was it a perfect point? >> it was a 9.5 out of 10. >> he was a congressman. we don't have to build him up. he had staff doing that. >> very good. >> no one is perfect here, gentlemen. sorry to break it do you. adam, elie, thank you. stay close. happening right now, russian president vladimir putin is addressing his troops after that weekend rebellion. but our next guest says putin is caught in his own trap with disengaged citizens. stay tuned.

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coordinated matter. indeed you moved your loyalty. you shed responsibility for the fate of the motherland and its future. that's what putin just said. there's little doubt that as the wagner group marched towards moscow, they met hardly any resistance. >> when they arrived, nobody shot at them. you can see them on the street. yellow cups of coffee, street sweepers active and social media stars to some degree. according to our next guest, after spending years of cultivg public apathy, putin found people iifferent. this was the most rele aspect of the whole day. nobody seemed to find that a brutal new war lord arrived to replace the existing regime. not the security forces, not the public. ann applebalm joins us. i love this piece because throughout the course of the last 72 to 90 hours i've been

waiting for our colleagues on the ground or social media to see a level of panic or concern or fear or uprising to some degree amongst the russian people. you never saw it. i kept wondering why until i read your story. your column. it started to click a little bit. what were you thinking through as you wrote this? >> i was thinking about the way in which putin propaganda and public communications works. for decades now, two decades, since he originally came to power, putin has mastered the art of sending conflicting messages. you know, one message one day. a confusing event happens and he'll offer multiple explanations. different tv channels will make different kinds of speculations. when the malaysian plane crashed over eastern ukraine in 2014, they had literally dozens of explanations. one of the effects of this kind of fire hose of falsehoods, as it's been called, is that people don't really believe in anything. people don't believe the news. they don't belief the rumors.

they have no idea what's true and what's not true. and that, of course, leads to apathy. if you don't know what's true, there's nothing you can do about it. and we really saw that in action on saturday when the wagner group arrived in town, were taking over. they walked into the southern military district. they, you know, bought coffee at what used to be the mcdonald's across the street and nobody stopped them. people didn't seem to mind. on the contrary they were cheering and clapping when they left. this is because, you know, one war lord what's the difference. if putin doesn't have cad rays of enthusiastic supporters. we saw that on saturday. >> and here is an example of russian state media trying to spin it. >> translator: i'm sincerely grateful to our president for his exceptional strength and wisdom. all these screams someone is being replaced or removed. i can assure you, no one is

getting replaced. the president does not respond to ultimatums. >> look, you wrote in your piece i agree was just really helped us get a lens into what is happening right now. the side effect of apathy was on display, no one cares about anything, that means they don't care about their supreme leader, his ideology or his war. speak more to that. >> yeah. well, you will hear now, they're now realizing what happened and will now try to make up for it and putin is making these pompous speeches and the television will say, yes, yes, we all support him. but we did suddenly have a vision into the true russia on saturday. you know, one of the extraordinary things about russia is that you can't really dopolling. i have a friend who does it there. any polls reflect only 10% of the 10% who will talk to an opinion pollster. but even without that, it's pretty clear that faded support

for the war means very little. people don't want to sign up for it and they don't and they don't want to fight in it and they don't. and they don't create enthusiastic rallies around it and don't celebrate the dead and don't have funerals the way the ukrainians do. you can see there's no emotional attachment to this war. that is actually a problem for putin. he has to keep prosecuting and increasingly costly, costly in materials of money and lives, terrible military conflict and people aren't that excited about it. >> real quick before we let you go, president putin has been speaking to his military officials, in his remarks just now, he applauded them for the process of stopping a civil war. that type of language, i think we have all been watching his words very closely, listening to everything he said, read the tea leaves is a fool's errand, to some degree, his framing potential for a civil war stopped by whatever deal that was made, what do you make of that?

>> so he was the first person to use the term civil war. he used it on saturday morning when he talked about 1917 and so on. and you know, my guess is that he's now trying to retrospectively act as if some great deed was done by the army, by the military and the security services where as we know, what happened was the opposite. nobody stopped them. actually the wagner group shot down a few russian helicopters and airplane, which is ordinary. and now he needs to somehow give, you know, retrospective glory to the army that actually didn't do anything. this is part of that propaganda game i was talking about. >> thank you. your reporting since saturday on this has been extraordinary. really appreciate you coming on. turning back to the united states, there's been a lot of talk about how is this economy, et cetera. but a lot of experts are focussed on commercial real estate taking a hit or seeing jobs or employers to rethink

office space. what this could mean for the broader economy. that's next. ♪ the first time your sales reached 100k with godaddy

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>> after decades of booming growth, the commercial real estate industry has run into a brick wall. building values are plummeting, offices remain empty and now rising interest rates could pressure the industry even further. vanessa yurkevich is here with more. >> reporter: there's statuesque, vast and staggering, and they're empty. skyscrapers and office buildings once stacked high with businesses are experiencing high vacancy rates in the u.s. nearly 19%. 5.5% higher than before the pandemic. >> i think it's a very unique moment, nothing like any disruptive marketplace that i've experienced over the past 40 years. >> reporter: the pandemic emptied offices around the country. today the number of people returning to in-person work is

less than 50% in ten major metro areas, forcing companies to rethink physical office space. half of the biggest global companies say they'll need less real estate in the next three years. leaving landlords with loans to pay in a bind. >> no tenant, you're not making money. what do you do? >> there's no recouping lost income for down time. >> reporter: steven dorell runs the leasing at sl green, new york city's largest commercial landlord, with more than 30 million square feet of space to rent, the collapsing demand for office space means their tenant vacancy rate shot up from 3% pre-pandemic to 10% today. that calls for some creativity. >> you can build a set in here. you can have a fight scene in here. >> sl green is working with back lot, a company that connects landlords at 332 buildings across new york and new jersey, with film and tv companies. this episode of "law & order" was filmed in this vacant office in mid town manhattan.

the watcher on netflix and these east side offices. >> i think people are starting to look wholistically at how they can support a revenue stream. >> reporter: this year sl green says it will earn $3 million from film and tv shoots. >> it's really helped mitigate the loss of income during the down time periods. >> reporter: empty office buildings could be turned into residential, a big need. this project in washington, d.c., once an office building, is being turned into apartments. but that's not an easy, quick fix process. less than 1% of apartments nationwide are converted from commercial properties. and across the river in arlington, virginia, the city is trying to get ahead of its empty office space problem. 22%. >> i'm sitting right today in northeastern's d.c. campus. last year, university was not allowed to take up space in an

office building. >> reporter: thanks to new city zoning laws, that's now possible. along with seven new types of commercial businesses, like animal boarding, hydroponic farms and -- pickle ball. it's already happening in south jersey. this 22,000 square foot pickle ball facility was a vacant burlington coat factory in a strip mall. regional mall vacancy is at a record high. were there a lot of options like this on the market? >> yeah. i think we had more opportunity than we thought there would be in the market. >> reporter: pickle ball is the fastest growing sport in america. so does that mean that the sport needs to find places to play quickly? >> the greatest threat to the growth of pickle ball is the lack of facility. >> and obviously pickle ball is a great way to draw people into commercial spaces. this is also happening in connecticut. the largest indoor building with

open in an old saks fifth avenue. we spoke to landlords what they feel like will bring businesses and people back into the office, parks. so, things like outdoor space, better food options, better things to do on your free moments at work. it's a tough time for commercial real estate. all the banks are saying something different. these are the lenders, right? >> what are they saying? >> so you have someone like bank of america saying that this is going to be the worst situation since the financial crisis. you have morgan stanley saying that this is going to be manageable. you have other banks saying that this is something we need to wait and see. recession could obviously make this worse. no one is really on the same page right now about what this is going to look like. but at least what we're seeing in major cities, for example, like a san francisco, this is a ripple effect. you have the offices leaving. you have the retail leaving and fewer people in those cities, living in those cities. >> always nine when those consensus amongst the experts.

that was a great piece. thank you so much. >> i'm here for the pickle ball. the tape that is key evidence in former president trump's federal indictment. cnn was the first news organization to obtain it. hear trump in his own words speaking act classified documents ahead. later today, walt nauta, set to be arraigned. our analysts are here to break it all down coming up next. from prom dresseses to workouts and new adventures you hope the more you give the less they'll miss. but even if your teen wase vaccinated against meningitis in the past they may be missing vaccination for meningitis b. although uncmon, up to 1 in survivors of meningitis will have long term consuences. now as you're thinking about all the vaccines your teen might need

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