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that debuts here sunday at 9:00. thank you so much for joining us. "anderson" starts now. tonight on "360," breaking news. renewed focus by investigators on a 2020 oval office meeting where trump allies allegedly schemed with the former president about seizing voting machines and overturning the election. also tonight, where is prigozhin? the wagner mercenary leader supposedly exiled to belarus for leading a mutiny against the kremlin. has he returned to the motherland? and what will vladimir putin do to him there. and marjorie taylor greene, is she too much even for the conservative freedom caucus? reports she may have been voted out by her fellow republicans. we begin tonight with breaking news, what multiple sources are telling cnn about that turbulent december 18th 2020 oval office meeting involving the former president rudy giuliani, disgraced general michael flynn, lawyer sidney powell, and a former dot com ceo. our kaitlan collins is part of the reporting team which has the

exclusive. she joins me here. so what have you learned? >> this is essentially something that has been a continued interest of jack smith's, but appears to be a new one, he and his team are asking witnesses coming before his team or the grand jury about this meeting. and there were a lot of chaotic meetings in the trump white house. this one was described as probably the most chaotic, the most unhinged. and it happened about six weeks after trump lost the election. it was this oval office meeting where these advisers from outside the white house were essentially going off against the actual attorneys inside the white house about this plan for him to seize voting machines with the military, basically, to go back and recount the votes in the states, redo the votes in the states that he had lost. and jack smith is asking people about this, his team is. and they're asking witnesses months ago about it, but they've also been asking people recently about it, including rudy giuliani, who we learned went before his team for a voluntary sit-down last month. i'm told it was back-to-back two

days, about eight hours or so. he was asked about several topics. but he was also asked about this meeting. so it does signal that jack smith's team, we don't know which extent, is still interested in this meeting. >> and who is it that they're focusing on the participants in the meeting? rudy giuliani obviously. >> rudy giuliani is someone who was there. he was actually called in after the meeting was already under way. but sidney powell, the attorney that you saw out at the press conferences with rudy giuliani in the aftermath of that. also patrick burn, who is the former ceo for overstock.com, and mike flynn, the former national security adviser. they were the people who got into the oval office for this meeting. and then you saw the trump attorneys, the white house attorneys come in to talk about this. and it was essentially this insane meeting. people were yelling. people were screaming. >> there was testimony at the january 6 hearings about this meeting. >> yes. eric herschmann i think is the person who most colorfully described it and was talking about how nuts it was. i think what you heard from the attorneys who worked for white

house is they were so frustrated by this idea that they were pushing something that was one of the most desperate attempts that we saw in that whole saga to try to hold on to power, this idea of seizing voting machines, using the united states military so trump could go back and do the states that he lost. this is the idea that was being pushed to him. and he was obviously present for this, kind of watching it all play out. rudy giuliani testified at one point trump and the white house team went upstairs to the residence area. that sydney pull and that crew went into the roosevelt room. he stayed in the cabinet room by himself. and he is someone who has been asked about it, as have other witnesses we are told. >> and what are the advisers, any of the outside advisers commenting? >> they're not commenting. but also a lot of them are not talking to the special counsel's team, which as legal experts would say that's likely worrisome for them. we do know that sidney powell and mike flynn spoke to the january 6th congressional committee. mike flynn was pleading the fifth. sidney powell did talk. they had not spoken to jack

smith's team that we're aware of. that could target potential targets. >> i want to bring in potential analyst elie honig with us here. we mentioned just now the january 6th meeting. i want to play some of what white house officials said about that meeting when they were questioned by a january 6th committee. let's watch. >> i saw general flynn. i saw sidney powell sitting there. i was not happy to see the people in the oval office. >> explain what? >> well, again, i don't think they were providing -- well, first of all, the overstock person, i'd i didn't know who this guy was. actually, the first thing i did, i walked in, i looked at him, and i said "who you?" and he told me. i don't think any of these people were providing the president with good advice. the three of them were really sort of forcefully attacking me

verbally. and we were pushing back and asking one simple question. as a general matter. where is the evidence? >> if it had been me sitting in his chair, i would have fired all of them that night and had them escorted out of the building. >> i think it got to the point where the screaming was completely, completely out there. i mean, people walk in, it was late at night, it had been a long day, and what they were proposing i thought was nuts. >> i'm going to categorically describe it as you guys are not tough enough, or maybe i put it another way. you're a bunch of pussies, excuse the expression. i'm almost certain the word was used. >> i mean, it's just fascinating to kind of revisit crazytown. when we heard that the first

time, it seemed nuts. it seems even nuttier now hearing it all added together. >> it really does. and a couple of things that i could add to this reporting. first of all, this tells me that jack smith is taking the broad view, that he is not just focusing on the submission of the forged elector documents, that he is not just focused on the speech in the lips. he is looking at the big picture here. he is looking at the scheme and depending on the proof that can give you a predicate to bring eventual fraud or even conspiracy charges if you can connect those dots. the other thing is in order to know what happened in that room as a prosecutor, you have to get in the room. and we know that a lot of the people we just saw in that montage have spoken with doj, and it tells us doj's picked up on the work of the january 6th committee and now intends to use those folks as witnesses. >> kaitlan, if rudy giuliani spoke for two day, eight-hour-long days or so, that sounds like he is saying more than just i plead the fifth. or we don't know. >> we don't know. >> what he said there on tape seems pretty damning right

there. >> we should also note he was not required to go. that was a voluntary sit-down, we are told by one of his spoke spokespeople. so that is something he clearly thought was a good idea for him to go in. i don't think people voluntarily go in to plead the fifth. the assumption would be that he was asked about multiple topics we know, including this. we don't know the extent to what he said. we asked his attorney robert costello to comment on this. he declined, as did attorneys for sidney powell and mike flynn. i do think it raise as question because rudy giuliani was a witness to everything that happened in that meeting that was so chaotic. but i think also to elie's point, everyone is kind of playing the guessing game of what's going to happen with the culmination of this investigation, because it does appear that we're nearing the end of it. we don't know that. we don't know who could be charged ultimately, if anyone. a lot of the focus recently has been on this fake elector scheme. this would not be about that. this would be about the efforts of the sidney powell, the john eastmans, the patrick burns, the

mike flynns, into what they were doing, not just the fake elector scam. >> so it all wouldn't be of a piece? it wouldn't be one giant case? >> this is a huge decision the prosecutors have to make. first of all, who are we charging? second of all, are we going to charge everyone in one indictment? there is no limit. you can charge 30 people together or break it up in smaller chunks. and finally, what level of perspective are we going to take on this case as a whole? are we going to go for the nor discreet, tangible items, for example, they submitted the false forms, the false elector forms, or take a broad irglobalview view and charge this as a wide ranging conspiracy. the advantage of going broad is you get to put all the evidence in front of a jury and explain the whole thing. but the advantage of going specific is you keep it concise and to the point and more easily digestible. these are questions that prosecutors wrestle with in every case and ear. >> stay with us. i want to bring in carlos suarez. he is in miami with former president's aide in an alleged documents conspirator walt nauta

was arraigned today. he was the guy on video repeatedly moving boxes around at mar-a-lago. carlos, what happened in court today? >> anderson, so walt nauta, an aide to former president trump pleaded guilty to several accounts including several obstruction and concealment related charges. now his arraignment here in miami lasted just a few minutes, and nauta asked for a jury trial. anderson, the 40-year-old didn't say a single word as he left the federal courthouse. >> what do we know about his new attorney? because that was one of the issues. he hadn't had a florida-based attorney. >> yeah, that's exactly right. so he wasn't able to have this arraignment because he was having trouble finali finding a florida-based attorney. nauta did add a new lawyer to his defense team, sasha daddan, a former prosecutor who has handled cases in south florida. daddan was admitted to the bar in 2014.

and according to "the new york times," she has limited experience with the federal courts. the times reports that her name doesn't appear at all in pacer. that is the nationwide database of federal cases. but she has handled several local cases in fort pierce. that is where judge aileen cannon who is overseeing mr. trump's prosecution is based and where the former president's trial with nauta may eventually be held. daddan has been active in republican politics in recent years. election records here in florida show that she ran for the florida house in 2018, and she lost, anderson. >> all right, carlos suarez, appreciate it. thanks very much. elie, at what point, anybody who is facing a prosecution like this has to determine and as an alleged co-conspirator has to determine when their interests no longer align with their co-defendant. it doesn't seem like he has reached that point. >> it seems like this point their interests are aligned.

he could flip. there is no indication at this point he has or indication that he will, though people do flip late in the proceedings, as late as sometimes the eve of trial. the other thing, though, sometimes defendants join together and form what's called a joint defense agreement. it's actually quite common, which means we're going align ourselves. we're going to share our attorney-client privileges and sort of form a team. there is a separate question about whether they request to be tried together at the same time or simply, which is a really important strategic decision that ultimately the parties may argue about. prosecutors usually want to try everyone together. defendants want to be tried simply. that's going to be up to the judge, judge cannon. different judges rule different ways on that prosecutors, you want to tell the whole story. you want everyone there together. walt nauta may be afraid of sitting at the table with trump, but he may want to be with trump if they catch a sympathetic juror. >> it amazes me anyone facing legal prosecution would remain loyal to somebody that if they look at this with any, you know,

actual glasses, not rose-colored glasses, they would see that the person they're pledging allegiance to has no allegiance to them and would throw them under the bus in a second. >> we've seen how other attorneys have handled this. we're talking michael cohen, a very different situation. obviously he pleaded guilty and went to prison. he is someone trump once predicted he would never flip on him, and he in turn did. with walt nauta, i was talking to people who worked in the white house with walt nauta and asking about that very idea. i do think there is a sense of loyalty, and that walt nauta was a valet, which is someone who goes and fetches cokes and drinks and whatever for trump when he was in office. trump took him to mar-a-lago. he gave him this job. he has kept him very close by his side. he is with him almost any time he travels. he is also play paying his legal fees through this superpac which is also paying trump's legal fees. i think when i've talked to people and asked if they think he would flip, they essentially argue the opposite, which is

there is no reason for him to do so because he has this boss right now who is paying his legal fees and it's the former president of the united states. >> elie, we know prosecutors are pushing for a december trial. how likely is that? >> i think it's on the outer realm of what's doable. let's keep in mind, by the way, they lost a month trying to get walt nauta arraigned. it took three times. that's valuable time they lost. december is five months from now. a safe rule of thumb for a federal trial, you need to build in a year or so from indictment to trial. so it will be a mad rush to get it in five months. and keep in mind, there is classified documents here. so there is a law about special procedures you have to follow. and donald trump is going to have motions. he is going to challenge the search warrant that they did on mar-a-lago. he is going to try to get the attorney client communications thrown out. there is a lot that has to be litigated. i think they need everyone to be pushing the same direction. i'm not sure trump's team is going to be looking for a quick trial. >> thank you so much. kaitlan is going to be back anchoring the top of the next hour in her new program "the

source" launches next week. congratulations. stun development. s surrounding yevgeny prigozhin. he is not in belarus, according to that country's president. he is in russia, but he has not been seen in public in a week and a half. some insight next on what it all could mean to the kremlin and to the war in ukraine. also, there is later new word on when the secret service expects to wrap up its investigation of the cocaine discovered in the west wing and whether they may be able to identify who left it. tourist taking photos that are analyzed by ai. so researchers can help life underwaterer flourish. ♪

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ever since he gave up it was believed yevgeny prigozhin and perhaps his troops would decamp to belarus. the president of belarus, alexandr lukashenko said he arrived in the country, but there has been no sign of him since the 24th last month. today president lukashenko told us where he thinks prigozhin is and where he knows he is not. moscow has televised a raid on prigozhin's properties and have shown off items what they claim are items from his mansions, including gold bars and passports and wigs. matthew chance has mother. >> reporter: a rare meeting with the belarusian leader and an extraordinary revelation. >> translator: as far as i'm informed as of this morning, the wagner fighters are now stationed at their regular camps where they go for rotation to rest and recover from the front lines. in terms of yevgeny prigozhin, he is in st. petersburg, or maybe this morning he would travel to moscow or elsewhere.

but he is not on the territory of belarus now. >> reporter: it wasn't meant to be this way. lukashenko's deal to allow prigozhin into belarus was how the kremlin explained wagner's armed uprising last month had been brought to an early end. there was even talk of prigozhin arriving in belarus and of all charges against him being dropped. that now appears in doubt. so the offer you extended to wagner and to yevgeny prigozhin has not been taken up? they are not in your country? >> translator: not yet. this will depend on the decision made by the russian government and wagner pmc. if they deem it necessary to locate a certain number of wagner fighters in belarus forrest and preparation, then i will keep my promise. >> reporter: but the kremlin may have other plans.

russian state tv has for days been painting prigozhin as a traitor and a criminal. now broadcasting these new images of a raid on his st. petersburg property. the police seizing weapons, cash, and gold, even wigs for disguise and multiple passports under aliases. the kremlin told cnn they won't comment on where prigozhin is or whether new charges may be filed against him. but lukashenko raised the disturbing possibility that prigozhin being assassinated before insisting the kremlin would never do it. >> translator: what will happen to prigozhin next? well, in life, anything can happen. but if you think that putin is so malicious and vindictive that he will do him in tomorrow, no, this won't happen. >> reporter: but clearly, the fate of wagner and its leader is now in question. just last week, the satellite images appeared to show a military base in belarus being

prepared for a possible influx of fighters. lukashenko may now himself have got cold feet. is part of this you rethinking the wisdom of inviting a battle-hardened rebellious mercenary group into your country? are you concerned that that would have destabilized belarus? i mean, the russians thought it was safe to have them. but, you know, they were wrong. trars >> translator: this is not a situation where i was lending wagner a helping hand. this was reached in a process of negotiation. you know what was at stake. i made this decision at this time, and i would stick to it. but i don't think wagner would rise up and turn its guns against the belarusian state. >> reporter: but for belarus, wagner's absence may yet be a blessing in disguise. >> and matthew chance joins us

now from belarus. it's kind of extraordinary to see you talking with lukashenko and him being what appears to be quite candid on a whole range of topics. you wouldn't ordinarily expect to him him talking about. is it clear where lukashenko and prigozhin's relationship stands right now? >> you're right. he was very candid. and it is unusual to have this sort of press conference. but, yeah, he played down the friendship between him and prigozhin, which is surprising, because the kremlin said that friendship was the reason the two guys could do the deal in the first place. now lukashenko said that putin was much more friendly with prigozhin than he ever was. so really trying to put himself at some distance between himself and the wagner leader. >> matthew chance, appreciate it. thank you. to try to unravel some of what is going on, we're joined by jill dougherty, a global fellow at the wilson center and on the faculty of georgetown school of foreign service. also retired general mark hertling.

jill, i find that amazing. what does it tell you that prigozhin is allegedly in russia, and what could that mean for this deal that lukashenko alleged brokered? >> you know, lukashenko is an old soviet-style politician. so i don't really trust him as far as i can throw him. i think he is telling some of the truth, but there is probably a lot of the truth that's hidden behind the scenes. but i do think it is odd that apparently, prigozhin is able to fly to moscow, fly to st. petersburg, and his men are communicating in some fashion about, you know, reconstituting. and yes the thing that really tipped me off today was that video that the kremlin is showing on state tv, which is absolutely excoriating him as a criminal, corrupt, et cetera, with money and gold bars, et cetera. so what are they trying to do? what is the kremlin trying to

do? i think they're setting him up for possible prosecution as a, you know, taking money from the government, which putin already hinted at about ten days ago. but, they may also, as one russian observer, who pretty much knows a lot said, maybe they're just allowing him to kind of wrap up his affairs before the government begins to take them over. >> general hertling, what do you think is going on? >> it's bizarre, anderson. jill summed it up really well, but what we have to remember is this guy is the head of a global terrorist organization. it isn't just his actions inside of ukraine and the recent actions in russia that have caused some conundrums for mr. putin. i mean, he still has forces in africa and syria. he is considered an international terrorist by the united states. but the thing that i thought was fascinating was as jill just

mentioned, the besmirching of his background today on russian tv, with the pictures of his villa and the wigs and all the pictures of guns in his house and the pictures of people he had murdered. it's just phenomenal that he's gone from a very charismatic figure that's next to putin to being continually harassed and people breaking into his quarters, searching his apartment, and yet not saying anything about him. and i'll also follow with what jill said about lukashenko. he is as much as a liar as putin is. i had to laugh at when he said oh, mr. putin would never do anything like hurt prigozhin. he probably wouldn't because it would cause such a conundrum inside of russia, because prigozhin is admired by a very large percentage of russian citizens. he is a very charismatic figure. one other thing i'd lady, while we continue to look at prigozhin, one of the people that hasn't popped up was

prigozhin's deputy in eastern ukraine, and that's colonel general solvorikin. his family is concerned about him. no one is reporting on him. this whole mess is just a typical russian nesting doll of craziness. >> yeah, jill, with prigozhin being back in russia, i guess could potentially from the perspective of vladimir putin be a threat to his authority. but to your point, the kremlin is clearly allowing russian state television to be attacking prigozhin, mocking him, showing all these videos. i mean, that's all by design. >> right. and, you know, those videos, i was thinking they do something else. prigozhin's message to the russian people is hey, these generals who are screwing everything up in ukraine, they're corrupt. they led the president into this

war. you know, they're lining their pockets. and this kind of populist anti-elite message is actually very effective. so by doing this, and saying hey, look, prigozhin is just as corrupt, you know. look at his gold bars and his everything that he has, his mansion where he has all of this stuff, he is corrupt too. so they may be trying to dim that message a little bit. and then also, i think his -- let's say his empire is so hard to unravel right now. the government wants to take it over, as the general was mentioning. they've got a lot of work to do. and this cannot happen really fast. so there may be something to that, you know, let him kind of wrap it up, and remember. putin apparently thinks that prigozhin was not necessarily trying to bringing him down, he was trying to bring down the generals. so that could be another wrinkle. >> jill dougherty, general mark

hertling, appreciate it. thanks. um next, what another government official is saying about when the secret service expects to finish the investigation into the cocaine found at the white house, and whether they will name suspects found in that. details ahead. are subaruru is the twenty twenty-three best mainstream automotive brand, , according o consumer reports. and subaru has seven consumer rereports recommended models. solterra, forester, outback, crosstrek, ascent, impreza, and legacy. it's easy to love a brand you can trust. it's easy to love a subaru. julian's about to learn that free food is a personal eating trigger. no, it isn't. igh) yes, it is. and that's just a bit of psychology julian learned from noom weight. sign up now at noom.com.

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. tonight, we have new insight into when the secret service expects to conclude its investigations into the bag of cocaine found in the west wing of the white house and their efforts to identify a suspect. in a moment we'll talk with a former secret service agent, but first jeremy diamond at the white house. where does the investigation stand right now, jeremy? >> anderson, right now federal investigators are still going through security camera footage, visitor logs, and they're still waiting on the dna and

fingerprint analysis on that dimebag of cocaine that was found inside a cubby at the entrance to the west wing, right along west executive avenue. now based on all of that, a federal law enforcement official tells me that they expect this investigation to conclude some time early next week. and it will conclude, anderson, regardless of whether or not they find a suspect. and in part, that's because this same official cautioned me that it's possible they don't get to the bottom of this. look, they do have security cameras, of course, but it's not clear whether those cameras were pointed at those cubbies. and this official also talked about the number of people who go in and out of that entrance makes it that much more difficult to possibly get to the bottom of this. but they are still investigating at this hour, anderson, waiting for the lab results. >> and obviously none of the scenarios are great for the white house. either it was a staffer and they haven't ruled that out or someone fairly well connected part of a quasi vip tour groups or anybody that works in the white house. how confident are officials that it wasn't a staffer? >> i asked the white house

secretary that very question, and she simply wouldn't rule out the possibility that it could be a white house staffer, but of course the white house has been pointing out this is an entrance used by visitors, that there were tours happening at the same time. that seems to be the most likely scenario at this point. as you point out, this is not like an east wing tour or a garden tour where you can get tickets through your congressional office. you usually have to know someone who works at the white house or no someone who knows someone and be escorted by a white house official on the grounds. they're letting the secret service conduct the investigation. they answered some of the criticism they have faced, some of this pretty far-fetched, including from former president trump who made a series of kind of wild conspiracy theory allegations about this baggy of cocaine. the white house's response to that, they say they're sensing some frustration perhaps from republicans because of the policies successes of the biden administration. it might be a stretch, anderson, but it's what they're saying. >> appreciate it. new developments from

jonathan wakro, a cnn analyst. there are plenty of people watching who is coming and going. how hard is this investigation, do you think? >> well, it's complicated on a few different levels. one, you're conducting an investigation at the white house. so some of the security measures are more external. they're looking at the external threats that may impact the complex, not internal issues. right. it's not like a regular office building where you have cameras all over the place, because you don't want to record the business of the administration, especially in this location, as jeremy said. 80s tonight ground floor of the west wing, just routes of the situation room. so you have intelligence officials that are going in and out of there. so capturing video may not be something of evidentiary value for the secret service. >> i guess i didn't realize how many people might have had access to that location. i would assume this is a highly secure area. >> it's a secure area, but what i refer to, this is the crossroads of the white house. you have people who are coming

in that are military officials. you the secret service. you have white house staff members. you have senior administrative officials, cabinet members use that entrance to come in and out. on top of all of that, you also have this white house tour, this vip tour that was going on from friday to sunday, essentially those tours happen when the business of the west wing really concludes for the day or is off for the weekend. so there is a lot of people. >> we have the secret service. they said they expect to conclude this by early next week. and that regardless of whether or not a suspect is actually identified. does that make sense to you? >> it does make sense, and here is why. there is only so much you can do with this type of investigation, right. you can't boil the ocean. you have to either use the forensics, the fingerprint, the dna evidence that may or may not be on the bag. so that may point to a potential suspect, because this is a criminal matter. or you have to look at items of video evidence. and again, that's a little bit more complicated, because you're predominantly going to get the

view from outside the building. you're not going to get into this very specific area. there is only a few -- >> a camera on these cubbies? >> no. no. >> if somebody could bring in a dimebag of cocaine, does that raise questions about what else somebody else could bring into the white house? >> well, it raises questions, and i have some answers for that. so it's natural to associate a bag of drugs with a anthrax or ricin, right? that's commonality. but actually, the way that the secret service looks at it, there are two different domains. one is a criminal matter. one is actually a threat. and from a threat perspective, it's threat identification and management. the secret service does that very well, and they have processes in place to identify chemical, biological, and radiological elements that are brought to the white house. there are sensors all over the place, active and passive that are used as part of the protective program at the white house. i don't want the get into too much about how they do it. let's just say that they're there. from a criminal standpoint, the secret service is not screening

for drugs. now i think regardless of whether or not there is somebody that is identified or not, i think some of the protocols will change on how the physical screening of individuals takes place upon coming into the complex. again, this is a schedule 2 drug. it's illegal to have. this is a criminal matter. a crime was committed on the property. secret service has to address that, and they have to put protocols in place to make sure it doesn't happen again. >> all right. jonathan wackrow, thank you very much. what could cause the most conservative caucus in congress to expel one of its most prominent maga members. we'll discuss how marjorie taylor greene may have gone too far, even for the house freedom caucus. we'll be right back. with the lowestt transaction fees and keep more of what you make. start savingng today at godaddy.com (upbeat music) - [narrator] what if there was a hearing aid that could keep up with you? (notification dings) this is jabra enhance select. it's amart hearing solution that makes hearing aids more convenient and less expensive.

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we just learned today that before the house went on recess late last month, conservative house freedom caucus voted to remove one of its members, the first time this has ever happened. georgia member marjorie taylor greene is the one they voted on. she is officially out. a caucus member today told cnn, quote, as far as i know, that's the way it is. andy harris didn't list all the reasons. he did say the straw that broke the camel's back, his words, was a confrontation greene had with lauren boebert on the house floor. that's video of it happening right there. this would have been on june 21st, two days before the vote. greene called boebert, and forgive the colorful language, but these are her words, a

little bitch. green's spokesperson confirmed the account to cnn at the time. the subject was competing articles of impeachment against president biden. congressman harris, the freedom caucus member added today that this was, quote, not the way we expect our members to refer to their fellow, especially female members. today this was how greene responded. in congress, i serve northwest georgia first and serve no group in washington. my america first credentials guided by my christian faith are forged in steel, seared into my character and will never change. joined by cnn political director, david chalian and mia love. so david, is it clear to you where exactly marjorie taylor greene stands right now with the house freedom caucus, and whether there is more to this story? >> well, it doesn't seem 100% clear, even andy harris when he was talking about this today said he believes the vote means she is no longer in the freedom caucus, will not be attending freedom caucus meetings going

forward. but i think we'll wait for congress to get back to sort of get a final assessment of that. but clearly, there was this vote. and she was ousted here. and it seems, anderson, you know, there are lots of offenses that congress can withstand. but when you take on your own, that seems to really ruffle feathers almost more than anything else in congress. they do not like when members sort of go after members on the floor itself. and i think you're seeing that here. and it comes, of course, after marjorie taylor greene was already sort of playing political ftse with kevin mccarthy, going a little bit more establishment, if you will. and that was distancing her from the sort of freedom caucus agenda as well. >> congresswoman, does this make sense to you? of all the many offensive things marjorie taylor greene has said, does it make sense to you that the final straw may have her been calling lauren boebert a female dog on the house floor? >> i found her statement really

interesting, because before you join the house freedom caucus, i was asked at one point when i first became a member to join the house freedom caucus. people like myself and john ratcliffe refused to join because you are expected to vote as a bloc. they ask you that. they say hey, this is what we expect from you. and i didn't want any of the votes of my constituents to be tied to a group of people. so it's really interesting that she says, you know, i don't want -- she shouldn't have joined the house freedom caucus if that was the case. the interesting thing is i believe that this started when she didn't stand with the house freedom caucus. she stood with the president in making sure that kevin mccarthy became speak other telephone house. she was showing her phone to other members of congress, trying to get them to vote kevin mccarthy in as speaker of the house. >> you mean when she -- the former president trump? >> the former president, yes.

>> but did you ever think that that there would be repercussions for -- i don't know if this is repercussion for her bad behavior. is this such an egregious offense? >> oh, gosh, of all the egregious offenses i can think of. i mean, they play by their own rules. and she should know that if she doesn't play by their rules, then she is going to be out. i'm actually pretty surprised. this is the most conservative caucus in congress. and someone as far right as marjorie taylor greene to get kicked out? where does she go? who does she caucus with? where does she go from here? >> david, how much of an awkward fight does this put kevin mccarthy in? greene had obviously become a key ally of his. >> yes, he has utilized her time and again. you remember when he rolled out his midterm agenda. he had her positioned directly in the shot behind him to show that he had support from the right wing that is normally

causing him trouble. as mia was saying she was critical in trying to whip some votes on his behalf to become speaker. and on the debt ceiling fight sort of from a policy perspective, anderson, the most egregious thing she has done if you're a house freedom caucus member, which is opposed to the debt ceiling fight, she was helping speaker mccarthy there as well. so does he come out now and continue to sort of have this tension with the freedom caucus over marjorie taylor greene? i don't think kevin mccarthy is going to stake his standing with the conference overall on defending marjorie taylor greene at this moment. >> david jochalian, and mia lov thanks so much. up next, how mike pence is faring on the campaign trail in iowa. okay... i'll work on that. the queen sleep number 360 c2 smart bed isis now only $899. plus, free home delivery when you add an adjustable b ba. shop now only at sleep number. this is how tosin lost 33 pounds on noom weight. i'm tosin. noom gave her a psychological approach to weight loss. noom has taught me how you think about food has such a...

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the super pac supporting former vice president mike pence launched a new tv ad in iowa today, promising a return to the republicanism of ronald reagan. >> america doesn't stand with thugs and dictators. we confront them or, at least, we used to. >> mr. gorbachev, tear down this

wall. >> there can be no room in the leadership of the republican party for apologists for putin. there can only be room for champions of freedom. >> committed to america pac is responsible for the content of this advertising. >> kyung lah has been on the trail following the former vice president who has made a strong finish there in his bid for the nomination. >> the road to the white house starts in iowa. >> reporter: for former vice president mike pence, the early stretch of his race has been a jog through a two-mile july 4th parade in urbandale, eating the local sweets in rural northwest iowa. >> it's a serious issue, one that we need to deal with. >> reporter: hearing the personal politics of local republicans. >> it's wonderful.

it's the only way you have a chance to really know how they feel and answer questions at your level of the community. >> reporter: a ten-county sweep for candidate pence. just this week, as he aims to hit all 99 counties in iowa. >> what is it that you hope to achieve by visiting all these counties, by doing all of these parades? >> you know, i came to a conclusion over the last few years that i'm well-known, but we're not known well. we're going to be able to take our story, take our case, and take our whole record and the story of our family to the people of iowa and to great success. >> reporter: the midwest native plans to deliver it over prayer and pizza. pence's preferred spot for a slice? the pizza ranch, a chain with 71 locations across iowa. >> if you want to win the iowa caucus, it's a 50-person pizza ranch meeting because everybody that came here tonight, i guarantee the one thing they have in common, they're all going to caucus. >> reporter: the campaign chair

hatched the so-called pizza ranch strategy in 2008 as campaign manager for then presidential republican hopeful mike huckabee, who would come from behind and win the 2008 iowa caucuses. this room, believes pence's campaign, is how he too could win here. >> you're looking for people that are willing to come out on a cold night, spend an hour and a half listening to everybody else talk, and then vote for your person. and the way you build those relationships are in meetings of 50, not rallies of 5,000. >> reporter: in this pizza ranch meeting of 50 iowans, some wearing their allegiance to a different republican candidate, pence takes any and all questions from voters, including one who confronted him about his role in certifying the 2020 election results on january 6th. >> he won that election. >> let me speak to that. i want to tell you with all due res

respect, i said when i announced, president trump was wrong about my authority that day, and he's still wrong. i believe it with all my heart. >> reporter: that answer only slightly moved lou ann bertrand, who asked the question. >> i really do feel like he altered history. >> would you consider supporting mr. pence after listening to him today? >> i would consider it. but he has that one hiccup. >> reporter: but meeting pence did change amy klein's mind. >> well, i voted for mr. trump before, but i've been going to all of the people that come that want to run for president, and so far i like him the best. >> your opinion has changed after seeing him up close? >> yeah. [ applause ] >> reporter: the summer before the 2008 iowa caucuses, mike huckabee was polling in the very low single digits. of course he ended up winning

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oceangate, the company that owned the submersible that imploded on its way to the titanic wreckage says it has suspended its exploration and commercial operations. the decision comes as five men were killed when the titan sub suffered what was called a catastrophic implosion last month. since the tragedy, new details have emerged about warnings and safety concerns over the sub. oceangate charges each passenger $250,000 to ride on titan and explore the 111-year-old titanic shipwreck on the ocean floor. that's it for us. the news continues. "cnn primetime" with kaitlan collins starts right now.