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square. welcome to all of you in the united states and around the world. fareed is on assignment but he'll be on later in the show. e i'm bianna golodryga. tuesday marks the take over of afghanistan. i talked to that nation's last ambassador to america about just how difficult the situation there has become. >> restrictions are becoming harder and harder, every day, every week and every month. >> then what do russians really think about putin's war on ukraine? do they think much about it at all? top the "new york times" columnist spent a month in russia seeking answers. he'll tell us what he learned. then fareed sat down with sing

p singapore's deputy prime minister to discuss its role in the world and how it sees the u.s.-china tensions. we'll bring you that interview. first, president biden hosted president kishda and yun. over the last year there has been a fall in relations with encouragement from the biden administration. so what came out of the summit and what does it mean for security as the asia pacific face as rising china and a provocative north korea? my guest is danny russell. he had a long career in the state department that culminated in the obama administration when he was the top official on east

asia affairs. today he's vice president at the asia society policy institute. you can't overstate the historic nature of this summit. let's talk about what came out of it. one, the expansion of military cooperation such as joint military exercises and new crisis hotline, realtime sharing of north korea missile warning and tighter economic cooperation. how significant is all of this in your view? >> president biden summed it up in his press conference with his usual directness by describing it as a big deal and i think that pretty much nails it. the details of the various agreements and the various processes are important. the agreement in principal among the three that they share in

effect of common security, that's important, too. but there are two other things that i think matter a lot. first of all, this is sort of the tip of the iceberg. beneath it all is a tremendous amount of interaction, interoperability, intercooperation among the governments of the three countries. each one is pretty powerful. i think the breakthrough has opened the door. that's the second part, by institutionalizing japan, korean cooperation in the contest of the u.s., both reliance and technology and independence, i

think it will create a framework which we know is datante, it can make it inevitable that happens in democracies. >> this is a chance that president biden has to do something his predecessors have not been able to do. president biden said this wasn't about china but clearly that played a pivotal role here in bringing these sides together, china and north korea. >> and russia. russia's invasion of ukraine has a very powerful ripple effect. russia, after all, is a neighbor of japan and korea as well. yes, these three things are important drivers of progress among the three democracies and i think create a geo political backdrop that help motivate both

the japanese and the korean leader. but as biden said, i believe him on this one, this progress may be driven in large part by the growing threat from north korea, by china's assertive behavior, by russian aggression, but it's not about them, it's about us. it's about shaping the kind of world that americans and koreans and japanese want to live in. it's not an anti-china coalition. >> we have seen an increase in joint military exercises recently between china and russia and north korea is advancing its nuclear program to continue testing there. are you concerned at all that this could be an additional provocation to either one of those countries. >> i see it the other way around, honestly, which is that china and certainly north korea

have made no bones about their strategy and their path. they're moving forward in an aggressive way and they're going to make common cause. sure they'll find an excuse and camp david statement, the declaration is an excuse that they'll point to but it's not going to change or even accelerate their efforts. what it will change, however, is their ability to actually move beyond tantrums and threats and take provocative or take violent action because it really raises deterrence to a new level. >> you mentioned the war in ukraine and both south korea and japan have not only offered more aid and assistance to ukraine but they've also beefed up their open security spending and defense spending and japan near live doubling it to 2%.

quote, ukraine today may be east asia tomorrow." is fear over taiwan backing the core motivator between these countries? >> i think it's a motivating factor and central to deterrence. if military leaders look with a hunger at taiwan and wonder whether maybe they can get away with using military force to subjugate the island, they're going to think harder knowing that japan and korea and the united states are so closely aligned politically as well as militarily. >> danny russell, thank you so much for your time and expertise today. we appreciate it. >> my pleasure. >> up next on "gps", the damage that two years of taliban rule have done to afghanistan,

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tuesday marked two years since kabul fell and the tall i b taliban seized power. the taliban have also reversed decades of progress on women's rights. they've banned girls from education beyond the sixth grade and women from most jobs and what the u.n. describes as women apartheid. joining me is the director of the afghanistan policy lab at

prin princeton. the taliban have issued 51 bans against women. women can't work, they can't go to school, they can't go to public park, they have closed nail salons, hair salons in the country. what are you hearing from afghan women who remain in the country today? is there any hope left? >> thank you for having me and thank you for bringing this very important top being in discussion in regards to the lives of afghan women right now in afghanistan and if they have any hope. frankly speaking with whoever we spoke, it's a very tough situation and especially looking to the outside world and expecting something may change or someone will come in their way to help them out. the hope is very limited. the younger generation, the women inside the country, those who have fought not only the last two years but even the last 20 years to resist, to move

forward and right now to stand against the gender and the hope is within the people and women of afghanistan. that's probably the only sparkle of hope. but anything else, if taliban may change, if the restriction may change, if they may become a different people, i think that hope does not exist. their restrictions are becoming harder and harder, every day and every week and every month. >> a few months ago you had predicted and warned really that the future for women could even get worse than they're seeing today. you talked about an incident when you lived under the taliban as a child where you were slapped and beaten for just eating an ice cream cone. >> mm-hmm. >> why do you think the eradication of women's rights is so integral in how the taliban rules their country? >> they have seen women because

in the 20 years ago, they progressed, they developed, moved forward, they became a political voice inside the country. they not only stood for their rights but they stood for the rights of afghans. and today they're very feel fearful of afghan women because of their ability and because of their strength. it's really a political fear. >> what do you make of the u.s. engaging in meetings with the taliban recently just a few weeks ago for the first time in two years, a big shift in u.s. policy avoiding doing that, given their treatment, specifically of women in the country. the u.s. side seemed to walk away a bit cautiously optimistic. do you think that the u.s. is right to engage with the taliban right now? it sounds like you don't, even though the talliban is presentig itself as a taliban 2.0. >> i think the 2.0 is how good

they've book to the international community and how brutal they have become to their own society. the question that people are asking what are the results for those engagements? do we have a framework, an outcome, a road map? do we have plan? do we have principles around those engagement? they have become more brutal towards women of afghanistan and the constant feedback we are receiving is we are hoping they're going to change and the next morning and the next morning and they will not change, they will change for the work. so if the international community, including the u.s., does not have a clear objective of that engagement, if there is not a clear coordination among the international community on how to engage, why do engage, what is the results and what is the outcome and where do we -- what is our goal, i think regardless of how many times

diplomatic delegations will meet with taliban, the results would be nothing for the people of afghanistan. >> it's notable that secretary of state antony blinken marking the decision withdrawing from afghanistan called it an incredibly difficult decision and also the right one saying the u.s. has issued nearly 34,000 special immigrant visas to families but we know there are thousands waiting still in limbo. thank you for your time and for joining us today. so much appreciate it. >> thank you for having me. >> up next, i speak to one the "new york times" reporter speaking to people in russia from moscow to siberia about the war in ukraine and putin's popularity. hear from him when we come back. ♪

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to gauge public sentiment in russia, especially about the war in ukraine. even though the results must be viewed with some skepticism. those polled on the war may not be honest. as penalties run from harsh time to jail time. gerald cohen spent a month traveling from russia to sieb y siberia to the ukraine border. he has new book out and he joins me now. roger, it's great to have you on. a fascinating piece indeed. and your extensive report comes a t at a time when russia has increasingly turned into a totalitarian state. many reporters left the country. i'm just curious, how were you able to spend that much time in russia and have access to such a

variety of russians highly you were there? >> the surprise is that russia gave me a visa. i did not expect that to happen. we've had many people applying for visas and not getting them. why russia chose to do that, i do not know. once i was there, able to meet people in moscow without the impression i was being followed. they knew i was there and i'm sure keeping an eye on me. in siberia, it was more intense scrutiny and they would make their presence felt. when i would visit cemeteries to see the graves of young soldiers killed in ukraine. in general, though, i had access to people and speak to them and encountered a wide spectrum of

opinion. >> it's so help for you to have had that access because a year and a half into this war, it's still difficult to gauge how russians feel about it. i mentioned those polls, even the independent polls, you have to take with a grain of salt. when you're an authoritarian state like russia has become, it's very hard for people to give honest assessments. were you able to leave the country with a clear sense of how russians felt overall in terms of what you call putin's forever war? >> i think so. certainly a lot more of a sense than when i went there. i'm pretty old school. i believe there's no substitute for boots on the ground, there's no substitute for looking somebody in the eye, for meeting people at their homes, at their work, forever, and i was able to do that. as i said the spectrum of the opinion is pretty wide. there's a solid core of support

of president putin, that's not surprising given the propaganda cascading over the air every night. at the same time i met people who denounce the war, who felt the declaration of war against ukraine was not normal in the words of one opponent of the war that i spoke to. he could not explain to himself why president putin had done this other than to rally the country yet again. he's done this through successive wars in chechnya and georgia and elsewhere, other than to rally the country to his side with a presidential election and election i think should be in quotes probably, coming up in march of next year. >> we'll talk about the election in a moment and i really was surprised to see people willing to give you their names and go to such great lengths to denounce the war at this time that really requires a lot of bravery. it is worth noting in terms of

how russians feel about this war, we mentioned the only independent pollsters left in the country and here's what they came out with just recently. as of june only 20% of russians closely follow the war in ukraine. that is the lowest percentage since the war began. clearly this benefits the kremlin in your view. >> president putin has gone to great lengths to make the war as invisible as possible. this is one of the most fascinating aspects of my journey. apart from the bill boards seeking recruits, apart from this there is really no sign of the war. the restaurants are full, the city is functioning, everything seems to work, people are sitting in cafes enjoying themselves. and what president putin has done -- that's why i went to siberia, he has tried to

concentrate recruitment in remote areas of russia. where i was is 3,500 miles from the front yet the war is much more present there than it is in moscow, in all those graves with freshly turned earth and the faces of dread that i saw at the airport of young soldiers beginning the journey toward ukraine with their tearful families around them. and what he is doing, president putin, is offering contracts of $2,500 or more a month to people whose salaries generally speaking are more in the $400, $500 a month range. so he's buying people to go fight and die. the 20% number you cited just reflects the fact that he has been able to keep the war at a distance. and there are just a lot of russians who feel they have to get on with their lives, try to

get by and are tired of it. the headline was the forever war. i think one of the things the west may have to come to terms with in the coming months is that this is going to be a very long conflict. the counteroffensive on the ukrainian side is not probably going to resolve anything in any decisive manner and we could have some form of frozen conflict such as president putin managed to contrive in georgia. the question remains on what -- whom such a frozen conflict would favor but i think it's soon anyway that barring a surprise that the west is going to have to start thinking about that question very deeply. >> roger cohen, it's so wonderful to have you on and your perspective, so important to have had you on the ground there getting all the reporting that you did. thank you for joining us. we appreciate it. >> thank you very much. >> up next on "gps" fareed will

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take a lap, rookie. real mature. that's for bianna for tackling the top of the show so well. i spent the week in singapore, the city state at the southern tip of malaysia. it may pocket size but it punches way above its weight. today singapore has a larger gdp than malaysia despite having 1/6 of its population and singapore's per capita gdp ranks 8th in the world. and it has one of the lowest birth rates in the world.

freedom house rates it as only 47 out of 100 or partly free on its freedom index and scandals have recently rocked the ruling pap party. i had the opportunity to talk with presumptive next prime minister, lawrence wong, the current deputy prime minister. if he gets the top job, he will be only the second person to leave the city state who doesn't have the sur name lee. his son is the current prime minister. thank you so much. it is a great pleasure and honor to be back in singapore, particularly on the year that mar marks lee kuan yew.

he in a sense forgot something that was even more impressive, which was the building of a nation out of a community of chinese, mylai and indian where we are seeing a return to a kind of tribalism, causing tensions in various places, in the west and the east. do you have feel that is a problem that singapore has to deal with or have you dealt with that problem well enough that you don't see those dangers or those tensions? >> it's a work in progress. i would say we have not arrived but we have come a long way. quite remarkable for such a short period of time. we started on this basis that to become a singaporean, you do not

have to give up your ethnic identity. but when you become a singaporean, you add to your traditions, your cultures. so we tried very hard to create a society where every ethnic group, no matter how small you are, will always have a place. we encourage them to -- every group to maintain, to retain their traditions, retain their cultures and celebrate those but at the same time we enlarge the common space woe have of singaporeans, we build that common sense of being singaporean together. and in the last 58 years, that sense of being singaporean has grown and strengthened. but it is a work in progress. >> now the party has had a remarkable record of success, electoral success. there are many people who feel that you have unfair advantages

but you have faced some pressures recently. there have been scandals, some of it surrounding description. what did you learn about the scandals? >> i would say not just recent incidents but i've learned to have a certain sense in government when things go right, when things go well for us, when people praise us and say we are number one, we are gold standard, don't let that go into our heads. but at the same time when there are challenges and there are setbacks and there are bound to the setbacks, there are bound to be mistakes. like in the last three shares when we went through covid, we had our fair share of setbacks.

then we learn from the setbacks, we learn from the challenges and in fact very often it's the mistakes and the failures, it's in the mistakes and the failure where we find greater motivation to learn and do better. that's the attitude i take. >> when you look at the world economy, singapore has always been able to navigate the world economy very well. what does -- when you look at it today, does it look like an attractive picture? >> we are very worried about the trends. we are worried about how the global multi-lateral trading system is coming under siege. there is a change in the global consensus around free trade. the logic of interdependence used to prevail. people say countries didn't have to be friends to do business with one another. we promoted interdependence.

people talked about the mcdonald's theory of peace. now interdependence has become a bad word. people worry about interdependence creating vulnerabilities and that interdependence will become weaponized. but i think they are at risk of shifting to the other extreme because with countries having fewer stakes in one another's success, i think that will be less inhibitions. so we really need to think hard about how we continue to strengthen our system of trade, investment, interdependence while addressing legitimate security concerns that countries may have. >> when we come back, i will have the deputy prime minister

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we are back now with more of my interview with singapore's p presumptive next leader. when you look politically, china has been much more aggressive, particularly with its neighbors, the policy towards australia, the so-called 14 demands where the chinese government essentially asked the australian government to stop doing certain things, including to have its think tanks and its newspapers not pruint anti-chinese things, the clark at the borders withndia, some of

the claims with vietnam and the philippines and the south china sea. what do you think explains that and do you think there has been a course correction there? >> the chinese talk about three phases in their journey. they want to stand up, get rich, get strong. i think they are in the get strong phase of your journey and when you're a strong country, you want to assert your interests, whether it's claims in the south china sea that you feel it's yours, whether it's interests you feel are infringed upon by another state. in the cause of doing so, i think they also understand there will be a reaction from other countries and again they will have to find a balance in going about this. >> do you think that they have looked at -- do you think they got more pushback than they

expected? >> they certainly got a strong pushback from the u.s. and so what america has done now is going to be the big issue in the world, this new relationship -- the new defining feature of u.s.-china relationship is no longer one of engagement but one of strategic competition because it's full spectrum but it's really extreme competition. and what we worry about is what can go wrong in this dynamic because one country does something, the other country can retaliate and you create a tit for tat dynamic that can result for huge costs for both america and china and a lot of trouble for the rest of us in the world. >> so the biggest flash point of course is taiwan. do you think things have gotten

more dangerous with regard to thai taiwan in the last few months? >> sure, they have. all sites claim to sustain the status quo but tensions are starting to rise. there are people who draw a parallel with ukraine and you've got media headlines saying ukraine today, taiwan tomorrow. i think these are very dangerous and alarming. but what we hope is that all parties will exercise restraint and maintain the status quo. it's important to continue engagement to continue plopcy. diplomacy does not operate in a

straight line fashion. it curves and bends. there are some issues that are irreconcilable. sometimes you have to set these issues aside and focus on common interests. >> do you think that xi jinping is determined to -- as part of his achievements of his accomplishments, to achieve a forcible reunification of taiwan in the next five, ten years? >> i don't think that's the basic expectation at all. not a forceable reunification. taiwan is to china a very important matter because it is to china -- it is about sovereignty. can you talk about economics or china, you can talk about trade, chips, intellectual property,

but one china, that's nonnegotiable because it's a matter of sovereignty. i'm sure it aemploys to many other are yous views. >> you have a security interest in the united states and do a massive amount of economic business with china. if you were told you had to chinese between the united states and china, what would you say? >> if it ever comes to that, it's not just us that will be affected, it's the hold world and we better buckle our seat belts if it were to come to that because, you know, this is not like in the cold war where you

have the soviet union and you had two systems, you can operate two systems. china's sheer size and scale today is much larger than the soviet union was and it's embedded deeply in the global economy today. if countries, not just singapore, countries everywhere have to say, look, i either choose a chinese system or a u.s. system to everything, not just for high tech, but for everything, i think it would be disastrous for all of us. >> so you're hoping you won't have to make that choice. >> i'm hoping for the good of the world that we don't have to make that choice. >> next on "gps", i bring you a review that you will not want to miss, artificial intelligence, i its s promise and peril when we come back. helps reststore gu, and rehardens enamel. i'm m a big advocate of recommending things that i know work.

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it seems that every day there's a new warning about artificial intelligence. the fears range from misinformation to mass extinction. but on the flip side, it promises to better diagnose our ailments, increase efficiency. >> i have 32 degrees of freedom and can detect sounds. >> so what should we make of this a.i. revolution? next sunday i'll delve into this topic with a new special, artificial intelligence, its promise and peril. we'll discuss both the scary and the exciting elements of a.i. starting with the former ceo of

google. we'll sit down with the man known as the godfather of a.i. who left a top tech job so he could talk freely about its threats. i talked to james cameron about how he harnesses a.i. in his movies and will look at a.i. in art. look at this piece "unsupervised" on display at the museum of modern art in new york city. the artist trained an a.i. model using data from more than 200 years worth of the museum's art collection, which included nearly 90,000 works of art from over 26,000 artists. the machine is always learning and imagining new artworks. if you watched for a hundred years, you would not see the same screen twice. i sat down with him and the museum's curator of sculpture to discuss this extraordinary work. here is a piece of that

conversation. >> tell us a little bit about how you trained it. >> it's a super computer behind this wall. so there's like literally two computers, one is literally preparing our next dream while the current one is showing us a new dream that we are witnessing. and these two machines is traund trained in a way that their decisions are interactive with a camera and microphone. a rainy day is a different day for us and also for a.i. it's a loud day or calm down, early morning, afternoon students are more calm and meditative. >> this data is being fed -- it's not a closed loop, it's not just a painting? >> no. and there's a dialogue between human and machine. >> a human says that's a good answer, that's a bad answer. why is it not sharing representational works? you have some great early

picasso, the blue period. how come -- it feels like it's all abstraction. >> it does sometimes get very photographic. so if you watch, you will see moments where it literally looks like a photographic landscape or an architectural drawing or a face may emerge. you'll notice different modes and rafik i think has carefully choreographed and composed them. but these different modes are special because with generative a.i., it's working very, very hard in concert with the machine learning model to create the shapes that you see. you might just get noise if you were to yourself say here's a

generative a.i., you might get stuff that doesn't make sense. that to me is what is mind blowing. >> i hope everyone have an understanding of what an.i. is. it's beyond art. it's for humanity. we never have something powerful that has the imagination and thinking capacity before. we want to be sure everyone has an equal access and knowledge so we have a safer journey with this technology. >> watch "artificial intelligence, promise and peril," next week. and thanks for being part of my program this week. i will see you next