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>> you would catch them. see their demeanor. hear their testimony. look at the surveillance evidence. and make your own determination. and so the fact we could watch this hearing and we have having this discussion talking about how the attorneys are argue, how the judge responded back. that was a win for the justice system and we need more integrity so people can have

trust in this trial as it plays out. >> that's a great point. you think about honing in on the why. why would these two people not want to be tried together? the comment from his lawyer was he was kind of the more intellectual of the two. pining about the electoral count act. he said sydney powell was more hands on. much more thought of as the master mind. she denies all of that. they don't want each other's stink on them. but if you are sydney powell, people know her from the defamation case. maybe if you are chestboro, you want a big ten foot pole. what about the other 17 including donald trump who has no intention of being tried this year on this case. how does he fare in this? >> i think donald trump is probably looking at his calendar right now because they

are not going to set trial for him in fulton county probably until march, april, or may. that's a big negative for him. at the time he will win the nomination, he is going to face a trial of his peers and there could be a verdict of guilty in september or october. so he is the big loser in this case. >> i think all 19 defendants are losers, you are seeing people minimize their own involvement. pointing the finger at others. i would be worried that somebody would cooperate and flip earlier than my client. so i would be a little nervous about someone cooperating in this trial after watching how it played out today. >> the early bird gets the worm. in this case, you think about thatment thank you both for all ofdown insight tonight. i want to bring in former trump white house associate counsel may melman into this. we are thinking about how all of this is unfolding. this is but one of the four indictments the former

president is facing but there are a number of codefendants here. there are codefendants in the mar-a-lago case as well. when you are looking at all of this, staking a step back, what is your take in terms of what this is going to mean knowing there is obviously an election 400 or so days away? >> yeah, so trump has said that the march 4th date that is the date settled for the dc jack smith case, so, he has called that election interference. and i think he is right in the sense that it is election interference in his favor in the primary. we have seen trump more than double his support. during this primary season because of these indictments. i think at the very beginning it was maybe understandable. you had alvin bragg's case first. i think people on the other side of the aisle were

skeptical of that. all of this playing out during the primary process seems to be helping president trump. does it move an independent voter toward trump? probably not. but trump is i think the near term winner actually with you know, with all of these cases piling on top of him. >> that is interesting to think about the thumb on the scale. we certainly see the money being raised. the government, the consistent talking point. they are really after you. i'm in the way taking the heat for you here. let's go down to mar-a-lago for a second. jack smith has a cooperating witness against a former president in that classified documents ca. it's an it worker and he could testify the efforts by trump

and the other codefendants in their attempt to delete security camera footage. that could be particularly damning for trump. are you surprised now that there is that cooperating witness? what would be your suggestion here? >> i am not surprised there was a lot of pressure on this person. because he had a potential perjury charge. he said one thing to the grand jury at first. then he flipped his story. you should really cooperate with us. and i guess if i'm advising trump, i would want to know

what was said to this person. at least within the superseding indictment doesn't make me all that concerned because it seems like he didn't have a direct link to trump as far as an obstruction of justice. so i think as clear as you can see it, trump's attorney said there is a subpoena. trump talked. then another person named defendant. that person talked to now this cooperating witness. so there's a lot of telephone. you don't know if he will know who is in trump's mind. so, we will see what it comes out of it. but this person is low level enough that it doesn't. it wouldn't give me immense heartburn i guess. >> there certainly has to follow the leader and follow that game. but then again, there are three

codefendants. perhaps testifying against one might induce other pressure in other ways. that is up to jack to prove his burden in this case. there is this point where donald trump was saying he was willing to go on the stand to defend himself at trial. we have heard trump say he would testify. that he would say i would do it but my lawyers say i can't. so in this instance, the idea of him testifying, would you suggest he do so in any of these cases? >> so lawyers are risk adverse. i would say no. trump, you never know what he is going to say. that amount of risk is something you don't need. especially in the mar-a-lago case. the facts are pretty bad. and you want to focus more on the law. what is the interaction and the required state of mind?

these questions where you don't want to push the facts and of course, trump will be out there with a whole bunch of facts. so, do i think trump is ultimately going to testify? no. i think these are just words. i guess my one caveat to that is usually defendants don't want to testify because they are presumed innocent until proven guilty. with trump, you are a little bit different. everyone already has their opinion of him. so maybe there is something to be gained about sort of proving your innocence in trump's case that wouldn't be there for a standard defendant. >> certainly it is always the prosecution's burden. but interesting to think about he has conceded the possession of the documents. the rest of course, he is contesting how will that play in the end of all of this. of course i tell you, if he does take the stand, the prosecution will have to have a bib around their neck to stop him salivating at every word he is saying in the other three cases as way. may, nice to talk to you. >> thanks laura.

look, the man hunt is heating up tonight in pennsylvania for that escaped murder. he has been on the run now for seven days. tonight. there are new clues. we'll tell you what the police have found next. unlike some others, it supports 7 brain health indicators, including mental alertness from one serving. to help keep me sharp. try new neuriva ultra. think bigger. attention... are you suffering from hearing loss? the fda has finally approved hearing aids to be sold over the counter. and now, rca, introduces their revolutionary otc hearing aids... starting as low as $99. delivered, free...right to your door. they're affordable, they're not the cost people associate with hearing aids or hearing devices.

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there are new developments as the search for murder danelo cavalcante is intensifying. he crab walked up the wall of the chester county prison and pushed his way through razor wire before running across the roof, scaling another fence and pushing his way through more razor wire before escaping. now the prison's warden is saying that the prison tower guard didn't see cavalcante escape calling it a failure on the human element side. unquote. this is the second escape from the prison just this year alone. now cavalcante has been on the

run since last thursday and last month, he had been convicted in the brutal 2021 murder of his ex-girlfriend in front of her two young children. i want to bring in cnn's brian todd, also former fbi director for the criminal investigative division. i'm glad you are both here tonight. we are seven days in, gentlemen. brian, cavalcante still has not been caught. but there have been some discovery of footprints? what's going on? >> reporter: right laura. we learned about that today. a new piece of information that discovery of footprints so critical that they have found those because this guy has left very few traces of himself. this is what the lieutenant colonel of the police had to say about the elements of the search. >> reporter: there have been footprints. and there have been other indicaters to us he has passed through a certain area.

we had a number of dog scent trails we have followed for quite some time. >> reporter: a couple of other new pieces of information. there was a sighting of cavalcante last night. some homeowners sighted him on the creek bed of their property. they called 911. by the time law enforcement got there, he had vanished. today, we learned, laura, at least for the moment, lieutenant colonel george bivens they don't have any indication he has a weapon on him but they are concerned he might procure one somehow because he has been seen near several homes and it is believed he has broken into at least one of them. >> it has been almost a week since his escape. why are they having such a hard time finding him? >> well, the search area has been shifting constantly. it shifted a little bit to the east today. it shifted back and forth and expanded today. you can also tell when you are out there.

this is extremely rural areas of eastern pennsylvania. a lot of farmhouses. a lot of rolling hills. hillsides, forests. i will show you another example of why this search is so complicated. we will pan to your left. my right. our photojournalist jake shire will take you down the railroad tracks. what we are told by law enforcement, you can see down there, the engines. those engines are attached to freight trains usually. these are areas that they are searching. they did tell us that they are searching these areas because they are very concerned about the possibility that cavalcante might jump on a freight train. if he does that, and is successful in doing that, he could obviously get a long way away from here fairly quickly and it wouldn't matter where he is going. at least it wouldn't matter to him. they are securing as many of these areas as they can. but that is part of the challenge. they can secure areas like where i am right now. but all up and down the

railroad tracks, that's just one aspect of the search. they also have to comb through forests. and fields. and things like that. it is very, very rural out here which is surprising to a lot of people because we are only about 10 miles west of wilmington, delaware. we are only about 30 miles west of philadelphia. you wouldn't think that it is so rural but it is vast, rural, and at night, it is pitch black and he can move around. that is when he has been moving around. >> you are looking at the same things we are talking about here. do they have enough people assigned to this? how has this man hunt evolved? >> typically it involves a lot of agencies and a lot of people. with drone technology, there is a lot to work with.

they do have him contained but he seems to be able to go freely. he is a two time killer and he is desperate. although it is rural, we hear there are houses in the area. we had the sightings and the home invasion. that family was very lucky. but job one is to keep his head down. >> think was convicted of killing his former girlfriend. he is a brazilian national. i can't get out of my head this video of him crab walking up the prison wall before escaping. i mean, it's a remarkable lapse and security and doesn't seem like the first time he has tried to go up that wall or this happened in this prison.

>> yeah. looked like spider man. the big lapse there is not so much he spiderred up the wall, it was that there was a blind spot up there. they had a prison escape earlier. and that same person, that person got on the roof. and was able to maneuver around as well. so this was a known sun nor ability. there should have been periodic checks. but within short intervals. once you do it once, you have to red team yourselves and fix it. >> thank you so much tonight. >> thank you. >> next, i will speak with two people who live less than two miles from the prison where cavalcante broke out. and they believe he has actually been on their property. they're next.

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a pennsylvania prison. my next guest just lives a few miles from the prison where he broke out. investigators have searched their property twice. nina and charlie limon join us now. the nation is captivated by this. one, the fact it happened at all. now, we are a week into this man hunt. it is a very scary notion that is happening. do you think that he has been on your property, nina? >> so we have had reason to believe that perhaps he has. we have a 65-acre farm. with 50 acres on the backside. so my husband and i live in the center of the woods that is about a mile-and-a-half from the prison. we saw some things and alerted police we have been working with.

and this morning. there is a tree house clubhouse that has been shut for some time. we had a gate shut for the safety of our five-year-old. we found it shoved open. that would take some brute force. we called one of the troopers and they did come up again and searched the property. but we have several nooks and crannies. we have three barns, hay loft. there are three houses on the property. so, we are a little, we are taking precautions. >> what did you see, charlie, that made you alert the police? besides the tree house? >> on the trail, the one kithara at the barn, we saw, what we think was a flashlight coming through. the officers took our video back. they claim it was some bugs. >> your son's school has been closed multiple days now.

it must be very unsettling to say the least to think if you believe on his property, that you have homes on your property, a tree house as well, maybe being tampered with. what are your concerns now? what are you being told by the school as to why it is being closed? >> i guess they are worry about the safety of the kids. kids at the bus stop, he comes through. i don't know. i guess it is best the schools do stay closed. they encourage everyone to lock their doors, windows, so forth. we have been trying to help the officers when they come up here. we grew up here our whole lives. we hunted, our kids played in the woods. i gave a lot of the officers suggestions like if i was on the loose, this is the way i would go. we have been trying to help

them out. i ran across a bunch of u.s. marshalls and i said where are you guys at? philadelphia. i said well i grew up here my whole life. i talk to them a while. this is where i would go if i were on the loose. they said you are very helpful. if you want to stay hidden, you will not go in that direction. >> and there are drainage pipes that are pretty, you could get in there pretty easily. there were a lot of drainage ponds. so the biggest reason for the school closures are because of the road closures. so, this whole area within, you know, half a mile to a mile radius has been blocked off. and there are staff, there are children. that can't get to school. they said if there were school buses in the area that had to

go through these roads and closures, they would have an escort which is very comforting. >> a police escort. >> yeah. i believe a police escort. they did release that at some point. and that was with what we were told. honestly, i would patrol still drive my child. i want to make sure i can see him going through the locked doors and right into my locked truck. we carry so we are protecting ourselves adequately on the farm here. and we are taking shifts every hour-and-a-half. we have several security cameras around the facility itself. we can get some angles and see what's going on and get the security cameras on our phone. we had monitors in our house. that sort of thing. >> are the police asking you for that footage? are your neighbors doing the same? is it a mutual understanding to

hand it over every time it comes in? >> yeah. so our neighbors are being very cooperative. everybody seems to be super cooperative. police and agents are being very friendly. being cooperative with us as well. there is a big group effort. one neighborhood broken into is walking distance. they actually have a chopper yesterday, and they had made a press release that they were going to be flying the chopper. i was sitting at my desk and i said what is that noise? sure enough, the chopper was flying around. and it was his mother's voice, and she was very distressed, crying. screaming over an intercom. and they flew around about an hour-and-a-half. almost two hours constantly playing her voice asking her a

plea of surrender. surrender to police. that was a little chilling. >> one of the families who are experiencing all of this. nina, charlie, thank you so much. i can't believe what you have had to go through. thank you so much. >> thank you. the doj says tonight, they are going to indict this man. hunter biden. what that means for the president's son and what it means for the president. that's next. baby, only on game nights. you know you are retired right? am i? ya! the queen sleep number c2 smart bed is now only $999. plus free home delivery when you add an adjustable base. shop now only at sleep number. hi, i'm jill and i've lost 56 pounds on golo. hi, i'm barry and i've lost 42 pounds. jill and i are a team. if she tells me to do something, i usually jump on board. golo was doable, it's realistic, and it's something we can do the rest of our lives.

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weiss intends to seek an indictment against president joe biden's son hunter. this related to a gun case. i want to talk about it right now with kara who has the latest this evening. >> we learned in a court filing this afternoon that special council david weiss says they are going to seek an indictment related to the gun case. because of the speedy trial act, they would need to make a decision on this case by september 29. they say they will do so before that date. this is part of this pretrial diversion deal he had reached last, back in july. and under that deal, he would have avoided prosecution on a gun possession charge possessing a gun while he was under the influence of a controlled substance. he has been very specific about

his cocaine addiction. he would be diverted if he met certain conditions. that deal fell apart. what we don't know is exactly what they will try to seek an indictment on if it will be that same felony or if it will be, which we know something they were looking at, falsifying the father or mother. that remains an open question at this point. but certainly in this case, looking like it is going to move forward with a felony charge against the president's son. >> that might surprise a lot of people. because if that deal imploded and we all remember what happened in that courtroom that it all went south so quickly and wondering what would happen next. then the special council appointment obviously, why is any part of that deal still on the table if it imploded? >> what's interesting is hunter biden's lawyers said they believe it was binding because it was signed by hunter biden and the justice department prosecutor. they say diversion agreements are usually between two parties

so it should stick. the special council says it lacks the signature of the head of probation in delaware. they said this deal was never executed and not binding. they signaled they will move forward with this. and biden's team saying they will push back on this. they think their deal is valid. so there will be further fighting in court over this gun case and where it might lead. >> obviously, there are questions now about getting every i dotted, every t crossed. but is there any reporting about there being another deal on the table at all? or are we past that? >> biden's lawyers have said repeatedly since the deal fell apart, and since weiss was appointed special council they do hope to resolve this case at some point. likely in a deal. the question here is we still have the tax investigation open. prosecutorred say they will move forward to bring the case

to trial. we don't know what charges they seek in that case. they said because they are appointing a special council, this will be a broader investigation. they will look at other areas. that was part of this investigation. but that is a big question now of whether the investigation will reopen. we know republicans have been pushing on this issue or if we are going to see two discreet charges in different jurisdictions and we could ultimately end up where we started with a plea deal down the road. >> thank you so much. interesting. very much so. well, leonard mac was wrongfully convicted of rape five decades ago. five decades ago. he spent years behind bars. and now, at the age of 72, he is being exonerated. i'll talk to him next.

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nearly five decades after he was wrongfully convicted of rape, a conviction has been turned over for 72-year-old leonard mack. a different man has been identified who has since confessed to the crime. joining me now is mr. leonard mack and susan freedman. thanks so much for being here in particular. you have been hoping to clear your name for nearly 50 years. and it finally happened and on your 72nd birthday, no less. you had to tell us, what does this all feel like in this moment? >> to be honest, it feels

unreal. >> tell me why. >> it feels unreal because it finally happened. and because it took so long. 48 years. and, the reason it feels real is because the reality is sitting in. yesterday, when the judge read her decision. and said that the conviction had been vacated, and i was exonerated, i just thank the lord that it was the day

finally came. and now the reality of it is setting in. >> mr. mack, you spent more than 70 years in prison for a crime. and i want to reiterate, you did not commit this crime. you did not commit this crime. and yet you have been fighting all this time to get your name cleared. as the reality sets in, thinking about what was lost. that time. what it did to you, to your family. you say that it really changed the entire trajectory of your entire life. >> yes it did. as a result of the conviction, of the charge, to be charged with that, and to have to go to prison for it knowing that i didn't do it, the animosity and

the hatred that i had back then, and being put in prison in maximum security prisons, knowing that i didn't do it, and i was determined in my mind that i was going to prove my innocence. and that i wasn't going to give up. even though i presented a motion, it got denied. but i never gave up.

i had that hope. that something was going to happen. it was going to show i didn't do it. though back then, they didn't have dna. but that's what kept me going was my faith and hope. >> susan, you took this case, actually, even though leonard had been out of prison for decades. to his point, this is the longest case to be overturned based on new dna evidence ever by the innocence project. i wonder what was it about this case that made you want to take this on? >> when he looked at this case, we saw it had all the hallmarks of a wrongful conviction. it had eyewitness misidentification. evidence that was presented and the other thing that really stood out about this case is the way that tunnel vision really drove the police and prosecutors decisions in this case. when you look at this case, you see that the ids were unreliable. despite that, police decided not to reopen this case. and see if there were any other leads. so, to us, it was really a compelling case of innocence. >> thinking about what you had

to endure, that feeling of what if it was faced with them to be something so horrible. not to have done it. i wonder how did you have even to this moment, how did you have the mental fortitude and strength to still believe and endure? >> nothing i didn't do it, just knowing i wasn't going to throw in the towel. i'm going to continue with this. i said i'm going to continue it until the day that i die. i'm not going to give up. i know that i didn't do this. i know that i didn't do it. >> thank you so much for joining us today. your story is so important. susan, mr. leonard mack, thank

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