in straight sets in front of that global audience. those there and also 90 million people at home watching, making it the most-watched tennis match in history still to this day. the victory bolstered king's fight for equal pay in tennis, a cause she continued to fight for decades. a bipartisan push is under way to award king a congressional gold medal for her work in women's rights. reflecting back to her triumph, the tennis icon said, "more than a tennis match, it was a catalyst for social change and one of the most important days of my life. we've come a long way since 1973, but we're not done yet. let's keep going for it." powerful words from her. thank you so much for joining us. "cnn primetime with abby phillip" starts right new. >> thanks so much. an important moment for history and for all women. have a good night. good evening. i'm abby phillip. in a few moments i'll speak to chris wallace about some of the big developments from the campaign trail, including donald

trump taking heat on abortion. more bad news for ron desantis. and of course, questions about whether democrats are perhaps getting a little too cocky. first, as people fight over hoodies and bikinis on the senate floor, in just nine days the american government is scheduled to shut down. that means that agencies and parks will close. the men and women in uniform who serve this nation won't be paid. your flights, they may not take off on time. everything from cancer trials to food inspections will stop. and it could cost the economy billions of dollars. it's because house republicans right now are in full paralysis over infighting. just moments ago, speaker kevin mccarthy introduced a pretty vague measure that would extend the deadline another 30 days, caving to some of the demands by the hardliners in his caucus. but again, that's only a short-term bill. we will be right back here in a month. the hardliners, they want more promises on permanent spending

cuts and on border restrictions, among other things. one of those republicans joins me now. that's congressman tim burchett of tennessee. welcome, congressman, thanks for joining us. >> thank you for having me on. >> we have new reporting tonight that speaker mccarthy laid out for you and other members in a meeting tonight, a plan that would keep the government open for 30 days and would do that at levels of $1.47 trillion of spending. it also adds a commission to address the debt and border security in that package. my question to you is, are you on board with this plan? >> no, ma'am, i'm not currently. the package you described, i mean -- we take in around $5 trillion a year, conservative estimates say we're probably going to spend $7 trillion a year. we just passed $33 trillion in debt. and these commissions, they don't have any legislative

ability. if we give them that, are we violating the constitution by giving somebody authority over ourselves? we've had these bipartisan blue ribbon committees in the past, ma'am. elections have consequences. my folks back home are saying, quit spending this much money. and a continued resolution is just that. it's a 30-day fix. and how in the world do the 50 states manage? they pass a budget. i'm sure your family has a budget, my family has a church, a church or synagogue has a budget, every charity in the country has a budget except the united states government. we haven't passed a budget since the '70s. dodi arrington, god bless him from texas, chairman of the budget committee, i used to serve on it. i asked to come off of it because they didn't do anything. has now formulated a budget that we can balance our budget within ten years. if you do the math, within eight

years, if we continue down this path, the single-largest item in our budget will be interest. this is nonsustainable. this country will collapse. >> so i'm hearing you say you right now are a no on what speaker mccarthy is proposing that will come to a vote this week? >> yes, ma'am. >> would you support any continuing resolution, a short-term continuing resolution, no matter what is in it? >> well, never say never, ma'am. but the way you get somebody off of heroin is not giving them more heroin. the way you get this country off those so-called continued resolutions is quit passing niece dad gum continued resolutions. let's be adults. let's get in the room. let's figure out what's important. quit with the give-away programs. we give 114 unchecked billions to ukraine, yet the people in maui are suffering, the people in pennsylvania with the chemical spill. every time there's a national

catastrophe, we seem to be able to -- we'd be able to find the money for somebody overseas, yet our own people are suffering. look at the uaw up there. we gave the automakers huge amounts of money to develop these bail nonexistent electric vehicles. and yet by doing that, we deflated the economy. we inflated -- we caused inflation. now the auto workers can't survive on the amount of money that they're making. >> so how many others are there like you? that are a no right now in your conference? >> ma'am, there are seven locked in concrete. i would say there's probably four others that are pretty close. and there's a couple other wild cards out there. it only takes three. >> so when matt gaetz, your colleague, says that there are seven, he said that today, that there are seven who would vote no, no matter what, he's correct in that? does he speak for you? are you a part of the seven?

>> well, nobody speaks for me, ma'am. but yes, ma'am, if you were to count the seven, i am one of those. that is correct. >> and you're saying there are at least three more who are also unlikely to agree to this package? >> yes, ma'am. and there's -- excuse me, ma'am, there's a couple more that, due to whatever reason, don't want their name out. and i understand that. because you end up taking a lot of abuse and name-calling. and the reality, ma'am, we've known this date, september 30th. it comes around every year. yet what do we do the month of august? we went home, we worked from home, did constituent service back home. i probably work harder at home than i do here, but still, we spent the whole month of august at home. we come in. we said, we'll never do this, we're not going to be like the democrats. yet here we are. here's what will happen. we'll pass the continued resolution, come back in 30 days, pass another continued resolution, and then try to pass what's called an omnibus.

$33 trillion in debt. we pass huge packages, like nancy pelosi said, pass it so you know what's in it. read down till you find what's in your dict. then that's why we're $33 trillion in the hole. >> i hear what you're saying. congress did go away for six weeks and wait until the last second to deal with this issue. congressman, i am wondering about the votes. you're saying this is going to go the way all these other ththing s have gone, pass a continuing resolution. where are those votes going to come from? if kevin mccarthy has to reach across the aisle to get the votes to fund the government, would you try to move to vacate him from the speakership? >> i haven't really put much thought into that, ma'am. i'm more worried about the collapse of our country and our monetary system. but that is a viable option, very much a viable option. there's a lot of people talking about it. >> would you at this moment, if you're a no, there could very well be no deal on this proposal.

we're getting closer and closer to a government shutdown. are you willing to allow a government shutdown to get what you're demanding? >> ma'am, a government shutdown is the worst thing possible. it is the complete -- we've capitulated on our duties. which we have, which this congress has, which this government has done ever since i've been here five years. every year, the same thing, democrats or republicans. we've finally found enough people with backbone to say, enough is enough. we're not going to spend this much money, we're going to pass a budget -- >> so that's a yes on a government shutdown if -- >> fit happens, it happens. so it doesn't have to happen. leadership can come to us with a conservative budget. we can pass jody arrington's budget, which he's worked very hard to do. but because of egos and other things, you know, they'll pat him on the head and tell him he did a great job and give him his ten minutes in conference to explain it. but it just goes against the status quo. it's about staying in power, and

that's what both parties do, ma'am. the democrats, they spend all this money on these woke programs. and what do we do? we spend all this money on missile defense programs. and both parties own stock in it. it never ends, ma'am. eventually somebody's got to say, enough is enough, and we've got to say, let's -- they sent us here to washington to do a dad gum job, let's do it. let's balance this budget. the one thing we're required to do is to pass a budget. yet for 30 years, we have thrown that duty away. the american public knows it, and they're tired of it. >> on that, i think everyone agrees. it is congress' responsibility to get this stuff done. congressman tim burchett, some news there that you are one of, what you're saying, seven holdouts or no tonight on this new proposal from speaker mccarthy. thanks for joining us on all of that. >> thank you, ma'am. from chaos on the hill to a competition on the campaign

trail. a brand-new cnn poll shows support in new hampshire for governor ron desantis is tumbling as his rivals battle him for second place. joining me to discuss all of this is cnn anchor and host of cnn's "who's talking to chris wallace?" chris wallace himself. chris, thanks for being here tonight. it looks like in new hampshire, they are not all that into ron desantis. it's pretty remarkable. donald trump in this new poll is the cheer front-runner. he's at 39% support. but there is a four-way tie within the margin of error for second place between desantis, who's dropped 13 points, and is now at 10%, and then there's chris christie at 11, halley at 12. this is one of the first times we've seen a lot of movement. it's not the kind of movement ron desantis has been hoping for. >> no, i agree. that's the lead to this poll. desantis has dropped 13 points since july. more than half of his support is

gone. and especially among moderates. and you know, he was in a tear, he wasn't up there with trump, but he was in a tier ahead of those guys. now suddenly not only is he not second, i guess he's running fifth or sixth or something. ramaswamy is in the lead of the second tier. it's good news for trump. he doesn't have the majority support that you see him nationally and in a number of other states. but still, he's at 39%. and his closest contender, rama ramaswamy, is at 13%. i think he'd take that. i think it's bad news for chris christie. if there's one state where he's got to do well, it's in a more moderate republican state like new hampshire. he's down around 11%. >> doing a little better than ron desantis, though, i have to say. >> yeah, but if he finishes that low, with less than one-third of the support of trump, i don't know how he would continue. as you say, the lead, desantis

in real trouble, at least in new hampshire. >> yeah, his campaign would say they are focusing on iowa. but polls like this are really bad for momentum, which is important at this stage. chris, i want to turn to the other topic in washington which is what's going on on capitol hill in terms of potential impeachment. there was some interesting remarks from a staunch supporter of former president trump. and that's republican senator j.d. vance. he told ax i don't, "if we get too far ahead evidence, then yeah, i think the american people will penalize us." this is kind of saying out loud what is known, which is that there is not a ton of evidence yet. do you think that there's a risk here that the impeachment inquiry could backfire on republicans? >> yeah, there certainly is a risk. i mean, look at it this way. if i were to ask you, what was the clinton impeachment about? we'd say, monica lewinsky's blue dress.

what was the first trump impeachment about? a phone call with zelenskyy. when you say what this impeachment inquiry -- it's not an actual impeachment yet -- is about? hunter biden. what hunter biden was doing overseas. in other words, there isn't any, at least at this point, there there. this is they find it in the course of this inquiry, i think that's a problem for republicans. i also think that regardless of whether they find it with an impeachment inquiry, it's going to increase the pressure on speaker mccarthy to actually go for impeachment. >> it's a really important point, that it may very well be that all of this ends up being a coin toss in terms of how it flies with the american people. both in biden's favor or against biden. on that front, we are seeing these reports that the biden white house is advising all these anxious democrats to relax, to chill out. they're hoping and telling them

that the issue of abortion and just donald trump being in the race could be enough to propel biden to re-election. is that overconfidence in this kind of even steven electric from the that we have here between the two parties -- it almost seems like it perhaps could go either way. and that's wishful thing, that they just can rely on trump to win the day? >> well, first of all, it's exactly what you would expect the biden white house and the biden campaign to say. they're not going to say, it's time to panic. so obviously it's very much to their advantage to say, chill out. i have to say, and i've been around this town a long time as you know. i don't know that i've ever seen such a disconnect between the -- between what a party structure is saying and what the mood seems to be among voters. you keep hearing this sense of, well, trump's going to be a real hindrance for republicans,

abortion is a very strong issue now with the overturning of roe for democrats. but the fact is, when you ask the voters in poll after poll, the most recent poll, two-thirds of democrats say that they would prefer to see somebody else as the democratic nominee. >> yeah, i mean, i think the white house and the biden campaign's argument, twofold. one, the last midterm elections, voters were just as unhappy with the choices between the two parties. but it was abortion that made a huge difference for them. and even back in the last presidential, in 2020 between biden and trump, you could argue democrats didn't think biden would get out of the primary, and he did, as the nominee, after doing really poorly in the first two nominating contests. so there's that. but look, past is not always prologue. i think you and i know that, as people who watch politics. you can't always bank on what has happened in the past. one last thing, chris action

before i let you go. in the halls of the senate, old customs die hard. but all but three republican senators have now published a letter to the senate majority leader, chuck schumer, criticizing his decision there to relax the chamber's dress code. that move was seen, at least, in response to senator john fer man's preference for wear shorts and a hoodie, there he is, looking as comfortable as ever. you've covered capitol hill for a long time. i've been in those halls. i remember having to wear a jacket even when it's 100 degrees outside in d.c. what do you make about the squabble over the dress code on capitol hill? >> you're asking the wrong guy. as you know, seeing me in the halls, i wear a tie and jacket. >> always dressed to the nines. >> every day. maybe not saturdays. but almost all the time. look. maybe there's some bending.

i know that business casual has become the fashion or whatever. but really, in the united states senate, a hoodie and shorts? sneakers? you know. i'm not easily offended, and i mean, if they're going to go on this way, it's not the end of the republic. but gee, it does seem to me that saying that fetterman can dress like that, then you had susan collins, a very proper republican senator from maine, saying maybe she'll wear a bikini. i actually think that, you know, if it was a question of signing on the line about we need to have some kind of dress code that's a little better than the fetterman standard, i probably would have signed. >> i mean, look. to be fair, there have been some republicans who have dressed down in the senate, too. there's ted cruz. he sometimes likes to wear his workout clothes on the hill. former senator richard burr was

sometimes in a polo shirt and shorts and flip-flops. let's be honest. i mean, when it comes to decorum, i don't think the dress code is the problem over on capitol hill. this has been a pretty rowdy congress, if you ask me. is this just kind of making hay out of something that doesn't really matter all that must have? >> anby, you start with the tie, it's a slippery slope. i don't know where it goes from there. >> who knows what could happen if, god forbid you wear shorts, god forbid women wear sleeveless dresses. capitol hill, stay the same always. chris wallace, you stay the same too, thanks for joining us tonight. former trump aide cassidy hutchinson is accusing rudy giuliani of sexual assault. her former colleague, alyssa farrah griffin, joins me next. the usually calm mare irk garland getting into it with republicans on capitol hill in a fiery hearing today as he faces questions about the indictments of trump and hunter biden.

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bombshell testimony to the house january 6th committee. in a new book that is coming out next week, hutchinson claims that rudy giuliani groped her backstage at trump's january 6th rally on the ellipse that preceded the attack on the capitol. joining me to discuss this allegation is cnn political commentator alyssa farrah griffin. she's the former trump white house communications director and someone who knows cassidy personally. these allegations are very serious and very damning. she said giuliani put his hand under her skirt, or under her blazer, then her skirt, while they were backstage during trump's speech. she told you about this? >> well, i trust her implicitly. i remember about two years ago her alluding to something, and i don't want to misrepresent the words, either he was creepy or handsy with me. those of us working the west wing at that time knew that rudy giuliani was a wild card. he was unpredictable. being careful on how i say this,

there were concerns, i don't know if they were true that he would come to the white house inebriated. even up to the former president's level, there were concerns don't let him do television from the white house lawn, be cautious about what meetings he's in. fra frankly, the pattern of behavior makes sense to me, doesn't surprise me. it's horrifying, does not make it acceptable. big picture, this is such a historic horrifying bad moment for our country, this rally that's happening on the ellipse, the attempt to overthrow the election. in that moment, this is also happening. i don't think you can really fully process how significant that is. but i believe her implicitly. >> layers upon layers here. and just so people understand, this idea that rudy giuliani was inebriated has come up before. on the night of the lex, for example. that's been reported. have you ever witnessed giuliani doing inappropriate things? other women being concerned about being around him? yourself, perhaps?

>> my sense of giuliani was, i didn't witness so much probably the sexual harassment. it was just, there was a sense that he was not in control of himself. that he was somebody who was liable to say anything, to do anything. there was a sense among women in the white house that you didn't want to be around him. i think there may have been that sort of unspoken idea of, there's something off here, you don't want to be near him. by the way, the former president knew it. even though they've been friends for many years and there's these times that they're close -- he obviously called him when his white house counsel gave him counsel he did not want, he recognized that rudy giuliani was not the man he was 20, 30 years ago. he recognized and openly talked about the fact that he had really kind of -- had become debilitated from who he previously was. >> the giuliani spokesperson and political adviser gave the statement about the allegations, saying it's fair to ask cassidy hutchinson why she is just now coming out with these'ses from 2 1/2 years ago as part of the marketing campaign for her upcoming book release. this is a disgusting lie against

mayor rudy giuliani, a man whose distinguished career in public service includes taking down the mafia, cleaning up new york city, comforting the nation following september 11th. what's your response? >> but just, you know, to play devil's advocate, this is coming out when she's writing a book. >> so keep in mind the context of this. cassidy hutchinson stayed after january 6th for several months, kind of was trying to figure out where her footing was going to be, what she wanted to do next. horrified by the events that happened. it was only once kind of the legal ramifications caught up with donald trump that she felt empowered to tell what she had seen with regard to trying to overthrow the election, the president's actions, what was happening in the west wing. she's dealing with things so much bigger than herself. i don't want to speak for her, but i think this was probably almost something you put in the back of your mind because she's testifying in open congress against the former president of the united states. she's sitting down with the department of justice in the

fulton county district attorney. i would say this. that statement reads like it was written 25 years ago when rudy giuliani was a respected former mayor. this is a person who has diminished himself in every single day. has proven himself completely unfit to be advising anyone who's in office. i completely stand by what cassidy said. >> so much has changed for giuliani in that time. to your point about all the things cassidy is going through publicly and privately, she writes in her book, "trump continues to hurl insults in my direction. i learn how it feels to be on the other side. but i know enough not to react. that's what he wants me to do, he wants me to be defensive, he wants to know when he's hurt someone or gotten a rise out of them, he wants to project his hurt onto the source of it. trump doesn't care if you dispute him or call him liar, only silence bothers him. being ignored drives him mad." do you agree? >> spot-on. and i have seen so many people take the bait, get goaded into fights with him. the best thing somebody who's being attacked by hip is him is

ignore. he takes it especially hard when women, spot-on in her analysis. >> i think the attention is the greatest currency to donald trump, and i think she understands that pretty well. alyssa farrah griffin, thank you so much. breaking news, the biden administration will now offer work permits to nearly 500,000 migrants as pressure mounts from blue states. new york's governor kathy hochul just met with president biden here in new york city, and she joins me live next.

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breaking news tonight. as migrant crossings at the border surge again, the biden administration moments ago announcing it will offer work permits and temporary legal status to nearly 500,000 venezuelan migrants. this comes as president biden faced pressure from blue states, including the state of new york. let's discuss with new york's governor kathy hochul, who met with president biden just this week. when you met with president biden, was this one of the

things -- did you get a commitment from him in that meeting to do something like this? >> we have been talking to the president, the white house, the secretary of homeland security, for many months. in fact action well over a year. about our desire to have federal support for money, locations, but also work authorization. because you have people here who are in shelters, supported by the city. mayor adams is doing an extraordinary job. but they can't work. so top of my list has been temporary protective status for venezuelans. yes, we spoke about it yesterday. the president tipped me off and said, you've been heard. he understands and that the announcement would come today. >> why did it take so long? >> obviously there's a lot of competing interests. you have to be certain that you're not going to take -- support a policy that's going to draw more people. because places like new york really are at capacity. you know, we have large hearts. you want to be generous and supportive to people who are experiencing humanitarian crisis. but there is a limit to what we

can do. so the fear what probably be -- i don't want to speak for them -- but you have to ensure that we can also have controls at the borders and not welcome even more people to come who think they're going to come for the jobs. this is a good approach. i thank the president for having a limit for people who came before july 31st, so it's not an enticement for more to come after. i think that was an important considers. also, it really does have to slow down at the border because the volume will keep growing and growing. >> it only applies to venezuelans, almost 500,000 people. do you think this will have measurable effect on the problems new york specifically is facing? >> it certainly will. 41% of the people in our shelters today are from venezuela. they're literally from around the world. west africa, south and central america, they're coming from all over to let the word out that when you come to new york,

you're not going to have more hotel rooms. we don't have capacity. messaged properly that, we're at our limit. if you're going to leave your country, go somewhere else. the smarter thing is a ply for asylum before you leave your country, they'll you'll have a different experience when you arrive. we're just trying to deal with the crisis we have right now. we need the people out of shelters and into jobs. we have a shortage of workers. >> some have said that new york's right, its mandate for shelter, is a draw for people to come here. and they've called on it to either be paused or rescinded. would you support anything like that? >> yes, because the original premise behind the right to shelter was -- started for homeless men on the streets. people who were experiencing aids. then it was expanded to families. that is the right thing to do. but never was it envisioned that this would be an unlimited, universal right or obligation on the city to have to house literally the entire world. >> would you like to see it go away entirely?

>> no, no. >> on a temporary basis? >> this is one of the reasons we don't have an enormous homelessness problem. we have about 4,500 people on the streets of new york tonight, that is far too many. other states -- los angeles, san francisco, portland -- they have tens of thousands. 90,000 people. so we want to make sure that no families end up on the streets. we don't want anything to happen to our children. but we also have to let the world know that there have to be limits to this. there is a limit to what we can handle as a state, and it's financially going to start ensuring that there are cuts and services. the mayor has said this, the state of new york has already committed $1.7 billion this year alone. and we're just starting to -- planning for next year. it's a huge strain, but it's also an opportunity to take care of the people who have arrived from venezuela, because their conditions in their home country make us realize, they don't have anything to go back to. >> mayor adams did not meet with

president biden this week, while you did. he's been very vocal. he has a certain, as he says, he has a certain style. but it seems like that relationship has become strained. has that made it harder for new york to get what it needs to solve this problem? >> no, and i'm working closely with the mayor. he has his style, i have mine. i went to the white house, spent 2 1/2 hours there a couple of weeks ago. i was very persistent, that something has to change right now. so i'm not going to speak to that. we're allies in this together. the white house understands. they're not trying to hurt the mayor, they're not trying to hurt the city. this is an important first step for the mayor and i to be able to manage the scale of people that are in shelters, get them jobs. i've deployed state government as of an hour ago, 16 agencies sending volunteers, identifying individuals who could benefit, and let's get them into the jobs we have. >> real quick before we go, does this make you understand better

what border cities have been going through for years? >> of course we do. of course we do. we need a strong federal immigration policy. full stop. and that's why, instead of talking about shutting down the government, i'm calling on the nine republican members of congress from new york and the rest of our republican leadership in washington to do the right thing and meet with president biden and come up with a comprehensive immigration plan that deals with the border but also takes care of the people here. that's what we need. >> governor kathy hochul, thank you so much for joining us tonight on short notice on this breaking news. >> thank you. coming up next, attorney general merrick garland is probably still cooling off after a fiery hearing before the house judiciary committee during which house republicans grilled him on the indictments of donald trump and on hunter biden. >> i am not the president's lawyer. i will add, i am not congress' prosecutor. the justice department works for

the american people. >> you don't recollect whether you've talked with anybody at fbi headquarters about an investigation into the president's son? >> i don't believe that i did. >> aren't you, in fact, in contempt of congress when you refuse to answer? >> my colleague just said that you should be held in contempt of congress. and that is quite rich. because the guy who's leaving the hearing room right now, mr. jordan, is about 500 days into evading his subpoena. >> was the president telling the truth or was he lying when he said that president biden told you to indict him? >> no one has told me to indict, and in this case, a decision to indict was made by the special counsel. >> every lawyer who's ever practiced understands the implications of allowing statutes of limitations to expire. do you not know as you sit here whether it occurred or not? >> i left it to mr. weiss whether to bring charges or not. >> i'm not asking for the excuses, i'm asking whether you're aware of that fact, sir.

>> i'm going to say again, say again and again if necessary. i did not interfere with, did not investigate, did not -- >> see, those are statements -- >> joining me is congressman steve cohen, member of the house judiciary committee. congressman, quite the chaotic hearing today on capitol hill. were you satisfied with how the attorney general answered your questions and also those of your republican counterparts? >> i think general garland answered sufficiently and correctly and honestly. everything he has done has been to promote justice and the rule of law. they don't see that because they are supporting donald trump in everything he does. in this whole hearing, to try to help donald trump show some type of "how about-ism." oh, they did this to them, they're doing this to us, the justice department's been weaponized. if the justice department was weaponized, they would not have prosecuted michael cohen. of course, that was bill barr.

when trump should have been prosecuted. merrick garland didn't go after individual one, even though i asked him to on several occasions. it was obvious he was the person involved with michael cohen who went to jail. he didn't go after donald trump on an easy case. >> asked if there was any involvement in higher levels of the doj in the charging decisions as it relates to hunter biden, and the attorney general, he pretty flatly rejected allegations that this hunter biden investigation was tainted by politics. he said he didn't interfere with the probe in any way. but how can he know if there was no interference if he wasn't involved? >> well, he wasn't involved. that's the interference that would have taken place. i don't know that anybody underneath him -- there was no reason to suspect anybody else did. the suggestion was that he's the only person that would be above mr. weiss, and the only person

that could have interfered in that direction. >> why didn't garland appoint a special prosecutor, affidavit weiss, sooner? i think that's one of the other key questions here. if that was one of the key ways to sort of project to the public that this was an investigation that was going to be done without any sort of appearance of political pressure? >> i think mare irk garland is a man of such rectitude that he doesn't even conjure up the thoughts that have been expressed by republicans, that there could have been interference. he gave full authorities to conduct the investigation and go forward with the facts he found and how they needed to be made with law to make indictments as necessary. he allowed that to happen. >> don't you think it would have been helpful if attorney general garland were able to say why he decided on a special counsel?

his decision-making process? wouldn't that go a ways to alleviate concerns americans might have about how this investigation's being handled? >> not really. i think most of the concerns are simply, again, donald trump through jim jordan, matt gaetz, all those people on the judiciary committee, many of whom were involved in january 6th, asked for pardons, trying to do political things to raise issues in the public's minds which have no merits whatsoever. the impeachment of joe biden with no facts whatsoever is just anathema to our constitution. you're supposed to have the facts before you do anything in the way of an investigation. there's no scintilla of any evidence that there's -- that joe biden benefited from any of hunter biden's activities. >> republicans today also questioned the attorney general about hunter biden's former business partner, devon archer's

testimony to the oversight committee where archer said that hunter was selling, quote, the illusion of access to his father. would you say that selling the illusion of access by a family member of a vice president or a president is appropriate or ethical? >> i don't think it's appropriate, and i don't necessarily think it's ethical. but i don't think the way hunter biden thinks. there's nothing, even devon archer said that, and apparently it's true. he also said joe biden didn't do anything wrong, and he said it many times. because hunter biden tried to make the appearance that mr. big or whoever was involved or listening that doesn't mean that he got anything out of it or he did anything further in any of hunter biden's escapades. i think hunter biden is a whole different issue for the president of the united states. >> congressman steve cohen, busy week on capitol hill. thank you for joining us tonight.

>> you're very welcome. just in, donald trump just threw a curveball into the already contentious talks to avoid a government shutdown. what he's now demanding republicans do, next. babbling creek in the background.] [minimalalist piano enters, plas throughout.] (dadad) we got our subaru forester wilderness [heavy sound of water coming from waterfall.].] [heavy sound of water stops abruptly.] to discover all of the places that make us feel something more. [heavy sound of water from waterfall re-enters.] (vo) subaru is the national park foundation's largest corporate donor, helping expand access for all. ♪ (upbeat music) ♪ ( ♪ ) ( ♪ ) ( ) -awww. -awww. -awww. -nope. ( ♪ ) constant contact delivers the marketing tools your small business needs to keep up, excel,

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what's your take? >> it is. it's kind of hard to know what the requests are at this point. i mean, abby, the reality is that we're now at $33 trillion in debt. for members who want to say, enough is enough, we need to be addressing this, roughly 74% of our spending is on entitlements. that's not even on the table. what we're talking about is a small fraction of the deficit that we're talking about shutting the government down, now throwing in new objections to it as well. it seems that we're headed toward a shutdown at this point. >> you heard tim butch chet, he's one of seven, that's more than enough to stop this. he says there are three more considering noes. and when i asked him about whether he'd be willing to shut down the government, he basically said, whatever happens happens. >> i think practically, the reality is if a bill is not passed in the house and it weakens kevin's hands as far as negotiations, they're going to get left with a senate bill that has even more spending than what the house would be able to negotiate. their inability to pass something is going to lead to a

shutdown, the solution to which will be, pass a senate bill that has more spending. >> so is this brinksmanship for the sakes of brinksmanship? >> it appears so. i think there was a time when these fights were grounded in principle. it seems today much of these fights are grounded in performance artists who want more clicks and more interviews. it seems like it's harder to track exactly what they're fight. if the argument is spending, address what is the driver of our deficits, that is entitlement spending. no one's trying to do that. >> they are also being egged on by the former president on this particular fight. i do want to get to some of these political headlines. trump earlier this week really tried to walk back a lot of stuff on abortion but criticized republicans for going too far on a six-week abortion ban. the thing is though, marc, it does seem that he's responding to where polls say the american public is. so is he really all that wrong?

>> i mean, i think that the president deserves an enormous amount of credit for having appointed judges who overturned roe v. wade. i think the reality is it's not something he wants to talk about. i think it's something he's walked away from as far as that legacy. which unborn lives are you negotiating away as far as his future conversations? i think for much of the conversations it's also saying, the unborn children in california, illinois, new york somehow deserve less of a right to life than those in red states? i think the position is confusing. i think for those who are pro-life, it's pretty consistent. >> is it betrayal? he ran on a hard abortion message. >> he did. and i think that he deserves, as i said, he deserves credit for delivering on that. i do think he's walking away from the legacy. >> i've got to talk about this new cnn poll in new hampshire. the headline here is really a drop off the cliff for ron

desantis. but your former boss, mike pence, is at 2% in this poll. why? >> i probably have a different headline on this, abby. that is, i think the narrative has been that this is destined to be a trump versus biden re-election. basically you have more or less an incumbent president and a former president running as more or less an incumbent. you're saying 61% of the electorate is looking for an alternative. i think that -- >> no one else is getting more than 15% in this poll. >> fair enough, but it says there's room for a lot of growth for a lot of candidates in the field to say, there's 61% up for grabs. a lot of this does break away. i think you've seen candidates who spent a lot of money early who then run out of i think for somebody who dropped 129 points in the poll. it's a lot of spending. >> what is it above to get in the last single digits? he, after he won back rockland sami, he has. searched it seem like that didn't work. >> i don't, know i think that since that poll, since the last

debate i think you've seen the vacate call out from the left and the right for being a fraud. and i think, for the vice presidency, they seem to make an argument from where the party was going, or principles to draw that contrast. >> if he doesn't, dwell in new hampshire, what is the plan? what would he say in the race? >> i think that that's a long way, there's a lot to happen between now and then. and i, think of, early in the debate the american people get to see him and present his case as the true conservative. >> and we'll see another, debate in just a few dates, mark, thank you for joining us tonight. >> abby, thank you for having me. >> and coming up, tonight you, tonight the senate confirming a new chairman of the joint chief of staff as tommy tuberville continues his blockade. she runs and plays like a puppy again. his #2s are perfect! he's a brand new dog, all inin less than a year. when people switch their dog's food from kibble to the farmer's dog, they often say that it feels like magic. but there's no magic involved. (dog bark) it's simply fresh meat and vegetables, with all the nutrients dogs need— instead of dried pellets.

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tonight, the senate voting to

confirm general charles q brown to be the next chairman of the joint chief of staff. general brown previously served as the chief of the air force and takes over of retiring general mark milley. he is only the second black man to serve as chairman following general colin powell. now, as confirmation, on with more than 300 other military promotions was held up, by alabama republican senator, tommy tuberville, but the majority leader chuck schumer move to get brown's nomination approved. and that's it for me, and cnn prime time. cnn tonight with my friend laura coates starts right now. a lawyer. >> hey, so good to see you tonight. as always, great show abby and good evening everyone. i am laura coats. welcome to cnn tonight. there are bombshell, new accusations against ruby giuliani. cassidy hutchinson, the star witness you recall in last year's generous six committee

hearings claims that a brand-new book that rudy giuliani groped her backstage at the rally that preceded the insurrection at the capitol. we've got a lot more to come on that issue. plus, there are fireworks on the hill. the attorney general of the united states was in the hot seat on this very day. and, what can be called a quite combative house judiciary committee hearing. merrick garland pushing back on gop accusations after politicizing the doj. insisting he is not the president's lawyer. nor congress is prosecutor. so, was all of this a preview of what is to come next week when house republicans are going to launch their impeachment inquiry of president biden? plus, to colorado cops going on trial today in the death of this young man. 23 year old, elijah mcclain, who was just walking home from a convenience store with ice tea when he was confronted by police. three days later, he was dead. did no