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this is "gps", the global public square. welcome to all of you in the united states and around the world. i'm fareed zakaria coming to you from new york city. today on the program, world leaders made their annual journey to new york city this week. for the u.n. general assembly. among them iran's president ebrahim raisi. after his fiery speech, he sat down with me for an exclusive interview. i asked him about his country's nuclear program, its place in the middle east debately changed by the abraham accord and about women's rights in iran after the death of mahsa amini. and the protests that followed.

and all of these hundreds of millions maybe over a billion muslims wrong? and only the islamic republic of iran is right? then open trade has bun within of the great engines of progress in the world, lifting hundreds of millions of people out of poverty. is it now moving in reverse? and is america to blame? i'll talk to the head of the world trade organization ngozi okonjo-iweala who said the world needs a new vision for globalization. but first, here is my take. the biden administration has pursued a new and ambitious economic agenda premised on the notion that the prevailing orthodoxy of the last few decades specifically the imperative to embrace free markets and free trade was inadequate to the needs of the

american economy. that approach owe cording to the critics gave the cost of inequality, a hollowing out of manufacturing and over reliance on kufrpt countries like kline. by contrast, biden has.together the largest public investment in many decades to have a revival in manufacturing, targeting chip making industry and to transition the energy sector to renewables. initial data from the u.s. treasury department suggested these policies have succeeded. spending on the construction of manufacturing facilities has doubled since 2021. mostly for computers, electronics and electrical goods. nonresidential construction spending in general is up 15% since the pass anl of biden's big infrastructure bill and private sector spending is up by almost three times as much as public sector. in other words, the government's

policies and expenditures have been a catalyst for the private sector. other advanced economies are not s showing such large increases in construction. they are happening mostly in america. these are impressive results. but the real test of the massive federal expenditures will become clear in the long run. in the short-term, government spending and tax incentives create a boom and the private sector will naturally jump in eager not to miss out on the action. but does this create a sustainable set of companies and industries over time when government money runs out, as it inevitably will. this is where the uaw auto workers strike becomes a test of bidenomics. on the one hand, auto work hes clearly deserve raises. and companies are doing well and management has given itself hefty bonuses. but a key component of the biden

economic plan is to make the u.s. a leader in the electric automobile industry. to help make that happen, the federal government is showering the industry with benefits from a huge up to 7,500 credit. all of the supports make it possible for automakers to make on higher costs. already the big three spend for more than tesla. they pay them employees five times more than in texas and 25% than those in japan. but the real challenge is coming from china which is taking the ev market bry storm. nearly two-thirds of the world's evs are made in china. byd topped les this year to become the world's number one producer of evs. american carmakers are shielded

from chinese competition. donald trump imposed a 27.5% tariff that american consumers must pay if they want to buy cars from china. building on protectionist policies which have meant higher costs and fewer jobs in america. but in the long run, tariffs only keep american car companies in their high cost bubble shielded from the global market. chinese cars will soon dominate in large parts of the world, even into europe where tariffs are only 10% so far. as wall street general pointed out, the real story of american manufacturers is that it is only growing 0.2% per year since 2009. well below taiwan 4% annual growth but well behind the u.k., germany, south korea and france and italy. the auto sector has crashed.

down 32% from 2012 through last year. this probably includes pandemic rela related disruptions. the massive increase in infrastructure spending was long overdue. funding for research is now increasing in some areas, though it remains to low by historical standards. helping computer chips, a computer industry makes good sense. but the broader effort to revive manufacturing will be a challenge. countries like japan, germany and france have all made such efforts and yet over the last several decades, manufacturing is a percentage of gdp has declined as a steady rate in all of them. in the united states, it is down to 11% of gdp and about 8% of employment. two scholars gary huff bower and eugene young have studied 50 years of industrial policy and

concludes the most successful efforts by far were those that funded basic development and opened foreign marks to american goods. to implement trade barriers proved costly failures. as the biden administration implements its plans, it could do well to look at this history and make sure it does not condemn to repeat it. go to cnn.com/fareed for a link to my washington post column this week. and let's get started. ♪ last saturday, scattered protests broke out around iran. to commemorate the first anniversary of the deng of massa is a mini. a 22-year-old wrom who died in police custody. she had been detained for allegedly not wearing her head scarf properly. the protests in the immediate aftermath of amini's death

rocked iran. they were brutally suppressed and eventually died out. in more recent months, iran has restarted foot patrols to enforce the country's strict dress code for women. most importantly, perhaps, the head scarf requirement. when i sat down with iran's president, ebrahim raisi, i wanded to understand why his government remains so adamant about the need for women to cover their heads. >> so it was around a year ago there were demonstrations across iran that caused a great deal of internal strife. the government likes to say this is a small protest but if you're pa pardoning 22,000 and imprisoning many more. it suggests these were large. at the heart of it, is this issue of the hijab. about whether women should have their heads covered. and i grew up as a muslim in

india. i traveled all over the muslim world. hundreds of millions of muslims do not believe that this is something women should be told to do. there are dozens of islamic countries where the government are very pius and devoted and they don't believe, they believe women should have the choice and the right to wear whatever they want and not have a patriarchal system tell them what to do. are all of these hundreds millions, maybe over a billion muslims wrong and only the islamic republic of iran is right? >> translator: what occurred during the days that you spoke of earlier, that was the presence of a few. not the presence of the people. the people of iran did not support in any way those that

rioted in the streets of iran. the people's lack of support defeated their plans. there were some who were fooled. there were others who committed murder, conducted serious crimes. but what occurred last year was a war conducted in the media by the enemy. i don't want to name tv networks or news networks, but networks who are headquartered in the three european countries and in the united states of america who broadcast news 24 hours a day. they openly teach tactics of terror. so, they conduct instructional steps on how to build a cocktail

molotav. this is toward the islamic republic and that of certain european countries of iran. it is not the hijab that matters for them. it is not women's rights. it is not nuclear issues. it is not human rights. because they are are countries such as the regime -- is the zionist come you the united states to protest in that and come out of the any of the european countries in -- >> and the hijab matters to islamic women. i've been there. it does patter to them. they have believe it is a infringement on their rights. >> but the fundamental issue that today in the islamic republic, hijab is a law. and when an issue becomes part of the the law, then everyone must adhere to the laws. so it is the same the world

over. and now that with regard to adherence to the laws, in reality the americans and certain european countries are only seeking to cause a bipolar situation in our society. so, they conduct their work in this fashion, always. they thought iran is one of the societies in which they could create two different opposing polls in which women's and the gender issues become against -- set against hijab. but rest assured that through the use of these tools they will not succeed. the people of iran are people of faith, are spiritual people and they deeply understand that the united states of america and three european countries don't care about their rights, their hijab. but a life of respect for women has existed for hundreds and hundreds of years in iran. it is not a development that we

have observed in the past few decades. >> after our interview, iran's parliament approved a bill for a three year trial period that gets even stricter on enforcing the dress code including prison perms of up to 10 years for violations. a panel of experts appointed by the u.n. describe the bill as gender apartheid. the bill still needs to be ratified by iran's guardian counsel. next on gps, the world worry about iran's nuclear program increased again this month. i asked president raisi about it when we come back. taking photos that are analyzed by ai. so researchers can help life underwater flourish. ♪ choosing a treatment for your chronic migrainine - 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more - can be overwhelming. so, ask your doctor about botox®. botox® prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine

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two weeks and a nuclear weapon just a few months later. last week the iaea said iran has decided to bar several inspectors. tehran has now removed the technical term as d designated about one-third of the agency's most experienced inspectors who were working in iran. the iaea director condemned the act and said it severely affects the agency's ability to do its work. he asked iran to reconsider. here is more of my interview with president raisi. >> let me ask you about the issues that the iaea has raised about iran recently. would it be possible to get the iaea inspectors to the point where they have enough people there who could actually inspector is your intention to make it impossible for the iaea to function in iran?

>> translator: well, you see if our intention was for the iaea not to be able to conduct inspections, we would have said so clearly. but from the very beginning we were to collaborate with the iaea and they are fully away of this within the iaea that we have cooperated fully. and this cooperation takes place in two ways. in various ways. one via installation of cameras that record in real time the activities that take place. secondly, are the inspectors who come there and oversee the nuclear activities in iran. and in the time that has elapsed thus far, since the agreement, 15 different times the iaea has said and certified there are no

digressions into iran's nuclear activity and it is for civilian and peaceful purposes and we have announced time and time again that the use of nuclear weapons or mass destruction in general do not have a place? why. because we don't believe there it and nor do we have a need for it. but however what we believe given in particular the fatwah issued by the supreme leader and because these could lead to the death of many innocent lives then this is not allowed to develop or use these weapons. we have -- the islamic republic of iran have said we dot not wish for inspectors to be here. but what we have been said by the iaea is that we have certain considerations vis-a-vis

individuals from these three countries. their trust is under a shadow of doubt. >> and you have designated all american inspectors and that is fired all of the french and the german and the british ones. and the iaea said this will cripple its ability to do th-- e inspections. and i want to raise these because those are the very questions that these three countries ask that you refer to and the question is around two sites which were never declared by iran as nuclear sites. and yet the iaea believes that they have traced of uranium there. why would you not answer that question. were those sites part of a uranium enrichment facility and if so why were they never

declared? >> translator: all of the questions have been answered. whether there were questions that were in any given specific time frame or those that are generally post each time when we responded to these questions, we did so officially, in official meetings with iaea officials and they were clarified, any unanswers questions or ambiguities were clarified. so the misunderstanding that or lack of good will that exists, they're not founded in reality. their simply allegations. >> i have to say the iaea does say these are important questions that have not been answered related to the two sites. so those regard these as serious unanswered questions. but let me ask you one that is very simple. iran is the only country that does -- that has only a civilian program as you claim it is, that

enriched to the level you enrich, to 60% and higher. why are you enriching to these high numbers? does that raise people's suspicions? >> you see, this action of the islamic republic of iran against breaking commitments and the three european countries vis-a-vis the reached accord, in the beginning we're not seeking 60% levels of enrichment. they trampled upon their commitments according to multiple iaea certifications. what the islamic republic of iran did was in response to breaking a commitment of the signatories to the agreement and it was officially announced that the action that we intend to take is not intended to reach nuclear weapons of any type or a

military dimension of any type. but it is a response for the lack of commitment demonstrated by the europeans. and should they at any time return to a fulfillment of their commitments, rest assured and have no doubt that the islamic republic as it is done in the past will adhere to her commitments. next on gps, i asked president raisi about warming relations between some of iran's arab neighbors and israel. how does he feel about this trend? for strength and energy. woo hoo! ensure, complete balanced nutrition wiwith 27 vitamins and minera. and ensure complete with 30 grams of protein. ♪ ♪ it's because of tiktok that i h to go out and get a website.

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the great regional issue going on in the middle east right now is of course what has been started with the abraham accords. the normalization of relations between some gulf states and israel. an arab diplomat said that the iranians have managed to achieve the impossible.

which is they have brought israel and the arabs together. against them. isn't the abraham accords fundamentally a failure of iran's foreign policy because here you have israel and countries that would not even recognize it, would not even t talk to it, because they see as malevolent. >> translator: this was a job done by the americans to take the hands of the israelis and put that squarely in the hands of certain arab countries. this doesn't equal the acceptance of those nations, of those people. people in these countries in those persian gulf arab countries have a great deal of hate for the israeli actions and this was only obtained under american pressure. and the mind frame -- the frame

of thought of the americans was that they are somehow creating security for the zionist regime whereas the normalization of certain countries with israel did not buy security or bring about security for the zionist regime because both the zionist regime is facing internal strife and difficulties and it is hated outside, whether by countries that are of muslim faith or otherwise. across the world, today know that the zionist regime is the most hated for crimes against humanity, against human beings and the trampling upon of many agreements that it should have adhered to thus far. and it is hated for that. so this was the action undertaken by the americans. on one side, the americans did this on the other side they started to promote a phobia about iran. and an unfounded fear in the hearts of the neighboring

countries about iran. so that when they wish to establish contact with iran or have a -- an approach, our conduct economic activities with iran, they see these are fears created by the americans. so this normalization will see no success just like in previous cases. and this is not a solution tor the zionist regime after 7.5 decades, they must go back to the principle found in giving rights to the palestinian people that are owed. what is rightfully theres. the path must start from that point of origin instead of addressing the core issue they are trying to bring about in forced normalization which can not help the zionist regime either to put to anyone in the position where even the people of the nations that you touched

upon earlier, they see that establishment of normalization of relationship as a betrayal. so after 75 years the different avenues pursued by the united states of america have never responded, have never yielded the desired fruit. >> you say that israel is after 75 years has not solved its problems and it is in trouble. but when i look at israel, it seems to have become one of the richest countries in the region, it is now almost an industrial country by per capita gdp, it has built an extraordinary technology sector and despite the palestinian problem they have been able to normalize relations with arab countries and increasingly if seems possible they will normalize relations with saudi arabia and meanwhile iran is isolated, your gdp growth has been very poor over the last 30 years, a country that used to be one of the richest countries in the

region now looks backward in comparison. iran seems more isolated. is it worth the price you have paid to have taken all of these positions that you have taken? it feels like for the iranian people, they have paid a heavy price in terms of lack of development. >> translator: with the islamic revolution we gave a loud and clear announcement that we will not go under the hedge em onny of america and we wish to have relations all countries but they sought only hedge omeny. and let's look at it. in the situation brought by the americans in syria, was syria successful or america? certainly syria. in afghanistan, were the people of afghanistan successful or the united states of america? certain the people of afghanistan. in iraq, where the iraqi successful or the united states of america?

certain the iraqis. now where in the region has america been successful? you cannot see an example of her success anywhere in the region. the difference in the comparison between iran western countries and the americans, iran has been the one who have succeeded. now, america, it is important to keep in mind, that they wanted iran to become isolated. that did not occur. is the entire world comprised of three european countries and the united states of america. the world has almost 200 different independent countries. we have relations with a great many of them, most of them. is today's world scenario showing you that american power is precipitating that of iran? we believe that it is certainly that of the united states of america and iran's position is being strengthened by the day. >> mr. president, our time is up and i thank you for allowing the world to hear your views on a range of issues.

>> translator: i also thank you. next on "gps", there is growing global rhetoric against free trade as countries like the united states have turned inwards somewhat. i will talk to the head of the world trade organization ngozi okonjo-iweala about why this is so troubling. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. thanks to skyrizi, i'm on my way with clearer skin. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months and skyrizi is just 4 doses a year after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections

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think hairspray's stuck in one dimension? think again. flex any style... with hairspray that flexes with you. new tresemmé hairspray. for more than 75 years, open trade has governed the way the world does business. it started after world war ii as nationed pulled down trade barriers. since then it had led to massively reduced global poverty. but today, countries like the united states are closing the door on open trade and investing more at home. my next guest said this is a mistake. ngozi okonjo-iweala heads the world trade organization. in a recent foreign affairs essay, she called for

re-imagining globalization with a world economy that is more open and fair. pleasure to have you have on. >> thank you, fareed. >> so you've been -- you've held so many fascinating jobs. you're finance minister of nigeria and in that whole period for the decades and decades when you were developmentally economist, what would washington tell you when they were trying to tell you guys in the third world and the developing world to change your policies. >> well, we all agreed and we would hear even when i was at world bank as well, we preached the same. that open markets, open stable fair and transparent markets in a multi-lateral trading system that is predictable was the best thing for the world. that interdependence would be the way to go. not overdependence, but interdependence would bring peace and prosperity to the

world. and that developing countries should maintain these open markets. >> so while the united states has been preaching this for the last 50, 75 years, in the last few years it is the u.s. under trump that put tariffs on not just the europeans, but canadians and biden has put provisions in all of his bills. so the u.s. has in some ways turned its back on its own creation? >> well, i would not say completely. but i want to stress that the more we put across measures that do not allow others, especially developing countries to compete, the more we give the signal that the multi-lateral trading system is not an avenue that they could use to improve the living standards of their population, to fight poverty, and even to support sustainable development, all of which are the purposes

for the world trade organization. we want to make sure that developing countries see they have a fair chance to compete within this system. >> you make an interesting point in your foreign affairs piece that everybody thinks about the vulnerabilities of your supplies during the pandemic. but moving to a system that is just based on a few friendly suppliers is actually in some ways leaves you more vulnerable? >> i would like to stress that, fareed, i think that gib what we're seeing with climate change, the unpredictability of what is happening, concentrating production, either at home or with a few friends, may not build the resilience you want. let us deconcentrate those and diversify supply chains to countries. those who are not part of globalization in the first round, but who are ready to receive investment, and many of these are developing countries,

it is vietnam is good, indonesia, and it is bangladesh. >> and what you're saying what you -- what will really give you security is if there is a global supply chain with many different manufacturers, so if there is a typhoon in one place, you could go somewhere else. >> absolutely. we need to look at this. rare earths are minerals and we could look and say why else in the world could we have this supply chain. in africa, there is a golden tonight to develop the minerals there. create jobs for young people at the same time as you help manage the decarbonization of the world. it is a like a win-win. >> no thea loy lot of people will say free trade is well and good, but the chinese for example, manipulate the system. they have a massive state. it is subsidizes, there are hidden and split is subsidies and doesn't open its market to a

lot of western goods and western tech companies could barely operate in china. how could they be part of a system and it is still open and fair. >> there are countries that complain that china has hidden industrial subsidies. and we certainly need to be mindful of that. because we want a level playing field. china itself complains about agricultural subsidies in other countries. so they're complaints are on all sides and i think we need to remind ourselves of how the system was built. it is true that if we do not have a transparent system, where there is a trust, then you have a race to the bottom. because everyone will try to subsidize. and you know developing countries will lose most because they don't have the fiscal space to be able to join the subsidy race. so what we want is there are sub siddys that are good and why not. that could help the world.

but i think specific cities or specific requirements that make it problematic for other members to complete and issue and that is what you want to get away with. >> but it is fair to say that what happens in washington matters the most. and if the u.s. turns toward protectionism and industrial policy, i think everyone else will just follow suit, right? they'll copycat? >> that will happen. once one nation starts to subsidize, whether it is e.u. or china or others and that is why we're saying that a subsidy race to the bottom is not the right way to go. i do want to say that, you know, what we've been hearing from the u.s. at the wto is increasingly very supportive and we hope we could push in that direction. i think there is a realization that this system that we have, if we allow it to fragment and

become too protectionist, we might lose it and that is not what we want to do. we want to maintain the position that has served the world for so well for so long. >> ngozi, pleasure to have you on. >> thank you. next on "gps", something different. we'll tell you about a blockbuster movie in china. it's version of top gun. but it's all about america's bullying ways. okay everyone, our missiois to provide complete balanced nutrition for strength and energy. woo hoo!

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xi jinping chose to skip both of the g20 this month and the un general assembly this week. president biden had hoped to see xi at the earlier gathering in indiana tensions between the u.s. and china remain high. the u.s. insists it isn't trying to keep china down but clohina

doesn't seem convinced and a film released this year to much fanfare sends a message to chinese movie-goers that the country needs to stand up to american bullying. it is about the chinese air force and it is called "born to fly." i recently spoke about it to david rennie, beijing bureau chief nor the economist. >> david rennie, pleasure to have you on. >> glad to be here. >> so tell us the plot, briefly. >> so this is kind of a cross of top gun and the right stuff. it is about test pilots. but what was striking and to me quite worrying about this film is it is set in the present day and closely mapping real world events in the south china sea where you see american war shirps and war planes flying in innocent passage in international skies and international waters so just show the flag and that is legally allowed. but in the film that is twisted and it begins and ends with --

we don't get told the americans, but the pilots fly modern planes and they have american accents. and they're going right into chinese air space and flying solo over a chinese gas rig that they smash all of the windows and sailors are falling into the sea and when they say you're in chinese air space, these american accented pilots say -- >> we could come and go wherever we want. >> and so the middle of the film is this very austere test pilot in the chinese desert where they trying to design a must plane that could drive the arrogant phonin treeders out and it ends with the americans seeing being driven out of chinese air space by these kind of super modern chinese jets. >> so me one of the most interesting moments that you have talked about is the parents of the kid, of the young wanna

be pilot, tried to dissuade him on a path and that is seen as the old modernizing reform minded china and that is actually -- the kid delivers a stern rebuke to his parents, right? that is a metaphor for the old china of tao. >> absolutely. i've heard american generals say, maybe the chinese won't start a war because all of the one child families, lots of urban middle class parents will risk their own child in a war. and the movie tackles that from a head on. and your right, there is a crash and nearly dies and his parents turn up in the desert, he refused our offer to send you abroad to study and he's like, no, i'm going to -- my generation will give china its

confidence back and i'm going to stay here and but a unfamiliar allison and he sends them backing and they talk about main melody films and the -- and the main melody is the main political message that the party is what everyone is humming along to and you could see xi jinping in speech after speech particularly aimed at the young is they're soft, their pampered, they need to be willing to sacrifice and suffer like their sort of ancestors did at the beginning of communist china and that is added on for the push for technological self-reliance and push back the foreign americans trying to hold china down. so all of the themes come together. >> and how does it end? is it a -- it is a glorious victory against the, as you say, the american accents unspeaking named narratives. >> you hear these panics saying

their planes are really good and they're sent packing. a crumb of comfort, they shoot down an american drone, not an american fighter. so we don't see an american killed on screen. but it is definitely a chilly movie and i'm spoken to chinese who are shocked by the kind of the next level of normalized combat, like a historical movie where you're killing americans in korea in the 1950s. this is new, this is present day normalizing combat with america and if we see another of these films, then i think we should start to worry. >> david rennie, pleasure to you have on. always love your reporting and thank you for this. >> thank you. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week. i will see you next week.

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