as you know, but governor gavin newsom. there is still a sea left vacant by the death of dianne feinstein. she does become only the third of black woman to serve as a u.s. senator. i have to tell you, abby, my daughter who is nine, always joked with me and says, mommy, you always say historic. is there seems to happen every single day, but that might be sue in some context, but today, it was a historic occasion given the fact of who was wearing are in. >> yeah, yeah, some people are wishing for unprecedented times. no more unprecedented times, but this picture on your screen is historic, and also a no, the ties between these two women, the funds of butler, key former aide to kamala harris and her presidential campaign, kamala harris, the first black woman vice president. it's a major moment. >> it is, and it does not mean that there will be other conversations surrounding who will ultimately be the

permanent level of that seat left vacant by the late senator diane feinstein. we'll see what happens next. abby, always a pleasure. thanks to everyone for watching, our coverage does continue. >> right now, for viewers who might be joining us, we're talking about a day unlike any in washington since 1910, the last time that has members tried to throw out their speaker then. >> 113 years later, for the very first time, members tried to throw at their speaker but this time, this time, anderson and caitlin, they succeeded. >> yeah, jake and edison, kevin mccarthy only serving for 269 days, his speakership undone by eight republicans led by congressman matt gaetz of florida, using that rule to force him out that mccarthy himself agreed to, of course, as a condition to get the job as house speaker, now a vote in the election is expected next week, a week for now from tomorrow night. the jockeying at the position

is already underway tonight. cnn's melanie zanona is covering it all at the capitol. nani, what is the latest now that we heard from kevin mccarthy saying that he would not try to run for speaker. again who is not going to try to enter the case? >> kaitlan, that is the question of the moment right now. we have heard from a number of republicans who say there are a number of names floating around. that includes steve scalise. he is the number two republican, the house majority leader. he is seen as the likely next in line, the era power apparent -- said he is getting a good amount of support already. so, just to give you a sense of how quickly things are moving here. but i will tell, you there are some other names in the mix as well. until there are some other members who are encouraging jim jordan to run. he is a conservative. he is a cofounder of the freedom caucus. but he has also become a kevin mccarthy ally. he is chairman of the judiciary committee. he is someone who is also seen

as a potential contender here. now, it's unclear if he would run. he was asked by our manu raju earlier if -- up to the conference. so, clearly, believing leaving it open. it's unclear whether he would -- challenge to steve scalise. we are hearing some other names as well. kevin hern, chairman of the republican steady committee -- but at this point, kaitlan, it looks like steve scalise is making moves to become the next speaker. they have until next week. there is going to be a candidate for mom tuesday for any speaker candidates to try to make their pitch.

then they will move to try to elect a speaker on wednesday. so, again, things are moving quickly. but as of right now, the house is paralyzed, and they cannot conduct any other business until they lacked a new speaker. >> right. they are moving quickly. but not necessarily that quickly, if they are going to wait over a week before they actually hold that election. given there such a time crunch with time to actually find the government, when this temporary bill that they just passed this runs out, is there a sense of why they are waiting this period of time to pick a new speaker? >> listen, they are in such a period of uncertainty. they didn't want to start ramming an election down the republicans outs again. they wanted to give them time, especially now that kevin mccarthy has stepped aside. it is a really a whole new ball

game, unlike in january, where he was in the race for round after round. no one else who is willing to step up to the plate. but someone like steve scalise, for example, has long been waiting in the wings. he never wanted to challenge that mccarthy outright, but now that he is out of the picture, he is clearly making his moves. but i will tell, you back to your earlier point, about government funding, there was a concern raised by a lot of republican members today, about if they were to go forward, with the motion to vacate, and potentially hours kevin mccarthy as speaker, which they did, that it was going to delay their appropriations process, the same appropriations process, we should point out that matt gaetz had been fighting for. so, now all of that is delayed. they were supposed to be marking up bills this week and next week, trying to move towards that november 17th deadline. that is going to be a lot harder. i can tell you, whoever is going to be the next speaker is immediately going to have to deal with that next challenge. and the question becomes, what do they do? they have to pass a short term stopgap bill to keep the government open and avoid a shutdown? the very thing kevin mccarthy was punished. for so, there's a lot of questions tonight here in the capital, kaitlan. >> yeah, not exactly an appealing job here melanie. i'm joined now by congressman tim burchett, of tennessee, one of the eight republicans who voted against speaker mccarthy we spoke to last night. congressman, i want to get your -- saying essentially that the

eight of you who voted to oust him are not real conservatives. what is your response to that? >> i would say he is better, and i will take it at that. my concern all along has been that we took six weeks off, as you know, in august, in september. we take in a five trillion dollars a year. we spend seven trillion. we pass continue continued resolution after continuing resolution. the reason we -- require, really, by law to do a couple of things. pass a budget. and the 12 appropriations bills. yet, they do a continuation, continued resolution to hide a lot of things, in my opinion. they -- their bodies, their lobbyist buddies, in the powerful stay in power. they all say, oh, this is a terrible thing. then they say, we are going to pass this continuing resolution so we won't have to pass another. >> so, when he says, you are not looking to be productive, you think he is wrong? >> he's absolutely wrong. i want to budget. -- jodey arrington out of texas is an excellent chairman of the budget committee. i was on the budget committee. i asked her -- never done any budgets and now jody arrington -- they gave him a little complimentary -- ascend him on his. way but we are required to pass a budget. every state in this great union

passes a budget and i -- i would say you are a family pass a budget, mind as. your church, your synagogue, your place of business. we have a budget. but this place back here does not have a budget. >> -- you had quite what it sounds like a testy phone call with the speaker after you and i spoke last night. you said you were praying about the decision. you say you basically was mocking you for saying you were being thoughtful about it. >> -- what i said. and i thought, i will listen to what he said and -- change my mind. and when those opening salvo i guess, was that, i said, i think the word going to be my answer. honestly, because i don't -- mocking god to me, it crosses the line. i thought it showed his character. but that is over. he is out, and we are looking ahead to a new speaker. >> and of course, that election is now not going to happen for over another week. are you happy that lawmakers are -- >> no --

that's another reason i was angry at the speaker before. because we left town when we should have been working. we took a long weekend until tuesday. i realized there was a jewish holiday, which i think we ought to honor. and yet, we could have come back. we could have worked up to that point. and we chose not to. again, we passed a continued resolution for 45 days. here it is, day 42. and we have not addressed it up to this point. we come in late. we leave early. the rest of america is not. i can guarantee you, they are working. >> that's going to be the challenge for the next house speaker. we are hearing names like people like steve scalise, jim jordan, kevin hern. do you like any of? those -- have you heard from them? >> i have not, but i have been on the media trail pretty hot and heavy. i think elise stefanik could be one, you can figure, maybe. maybe mark green out of tennessee. there's a lot of people that we have a very deep -- i don't think that's going to be the problem. i think once we elect this person -- i think we can probably do it

in the first round. i think, also, people will rally around them and we will see just like when you put in a new quarterback in and -- and the -- >> we have seen that in alabama a lot this season. and -- >> alabama -- tennessee boy -- y'all play football in alabama? >> we will get back to that in a moment. but when it comes to what the rules for the next house speaker actually look like, will you insist on keeping that one vote motion to vacate for whoever is actually the -- >> i have thought about that a lot. but i have -- that doubt in my mind. i don't know if it's important. i think it served its purpose. and honestly i don't know if it serves the purpose it once did. but it was on the books for years, i think, since maybe the twenties, until speaker pelosi had taken it out. >> it sounds like you are okay with it staying. >> i wouldn't mind. i voted for those rules. i thought it was a wise decision. and i think it serves as well. i think it holds them

accountable to the -- and i don't have a problem with accountability, which is something this town lacks a lot of. >> congressman tim burchett, thank you for coming over here to join us tonight. jake, of course, a lot of questions about what that is going to look like going forward. ell, a fist bump there. >> even though he is a tennessee guy, we don't -- >> very nice. >> until the end of the month, so. >> very nice to see. it's nice to see some cross border action there. thanks caitlin, even though this is playing out as a fight among house republicans, obviously the interest in having a functioning house of representatives is bipartisan, it is frankly nonpartisan. obviously it does include everyone, and everyone in the -- cnn's -- is at the white house kayla, what is the reaction at the white house this evening? there is not a speaker of the house? >> well jake, the white house is trying to project an image

of calm, and to strike a contrast with the chaos on capitol hill, and just this evening -- urging house republicans to elect a speaker quickly, so that both sides of pennsylvania avenue, you get back to the business of governing. but aides say the president biden's going to aim to strike a term of business as usual, throughout the rest of the week tomorrow, he has a policy focused speech in student loans. and today in the messaging blasted the white house has put out for many weeks, in days. they announced a split screen on president biden, touting his negotiations for lower drug prices, contrast it with republicans, trying to repeal the legislation that authorizes the president to do that.

not highlighting the motion to vacate, or any of the drama that was happening on capitol hill. we are that is the white house trying to stay above the fray, jake. the democratic national committee posting on social media platform acts, has reacted -- calling a gop -- posting movie memes. and in some of the same split screen images, taking their own liberties, and pointing out that chaos, for that motion to vacate. >> well, it was chaotic. and for some reason, for some reason that eludes my understanding, republicans have decided to take a weeklong break, before picking their next leader. although, they could be doing it right now, presumably, i'm not the only one asking this question. is there, and i realize that if you know the answer to this, the democrats in the building behind you might not want the answer public. but is there a particular republican, in the house of representatives, that the white

house might think would be the easiest to deal with, in terms of, let's think of two pressing issues, ukraine aid, and avoiding another government shutdown, which is coming down in just 43 days? >> well certainly, having a week off is not going to help the effort to avoid a government shutdown, by any stretch of the imagination, and securing more aid for ukraine would be seen as the administrative's first priority. just today, the administration suggested, once again, that it was assured by house leadership, and the chairs of the relevant national security committees in the house, that there would be support for that aid. but jake, when you look at their voting records, which is one of the things that the white house points too often, you sort of have a spectrum of support. and, a pretty wide range, if that, among the names that have been floated so far. tom emmer, based on his voting record, in his public statement so far, it will be seen as the staunchest supporter for

ukraine aid. and then you have steve scalise, the number two republican, who would be somewhat in the middle. he has made some neutral statements recently, and it is unclear whether it, when john kirby, the and -- what spokesman was saying that there was support among house leadership, whether he was referencing steve scalise is part of that bucket. and then of course, there are hard-liners like kevin hern and jim jordan, who would be seen as anti ukraine, based on their voting records. but again, kirby has suggested that those are a very vocal few, and they are in the minority, and they still believe that there would eventually be support. >> all right kayla tausche, at the white house, thanks. senate minority leader mitch mcconnell just weighed in, quoting from his statement which reads in part, quote, speaker mccarthy has my sincere thanks, for his service to our nation, in what is often a thankless role. the speaker's tenure was bookended by historic fights, but asked he reminded his colleagues, when he took the gavel, our nation is worth fighting for. minority leader mcconnell, from kentucky, tonight. back with the panel, and dana bash, i wonder if there are viewers are voters out there that are thinking to themselves if i worked for an organization,

that couldn't get its act together, i don't know that i would then immediately be taking a weeklong vacation. that doesn't seem, to me, to be the response that every other person in the rest of the world would immediately be doing, taking a week off. good job everybody. you know, we just did the first ever motion to vacate, we no longer have a speaker of the house, let's all go to barbados. >> i don't think they're going to barbados, although that does sound really nice right now. >> well, they are taking a week off? >> they are taking a week to pick a new speaker. i don't know the answer. >> do they not know each other? >> >> do they need to get

acquainted? >> we are in new territory, about whether or not committees are going to happen, and organize tomorrow. >> but they adjourned? >> no committees tomorrow. >> i think that. >> no one. >> the house adjourned. >> all right, so i don't know that it is a vacation, -- and i have been wondering, is why weren't they ready for? this i mean, this is, everyone's like oh my gosh, this is shocking. no, we knew, starting on sunday, when matt gaetz told you that he was going to make a motion to vacate, that it was a very likely, but this would happen, very likely. so, why wasn't there a backup? why weren't there are already discussions about who would be the person to go in there? i think the answer is because the people who might want to be speaker, didn't want to get out ahead of kevin car-t, because that would look bad. and, it would probably sink them, with the very people that they need, that is sort of

answer my own question. but, you are right, it doesn't necessarily take an entire week to do it. you saw, and you've mentioned the fervor, with which patrick mchenry hit that gavel down. and. i >> thought he was going to sprained his wrist. >> and to me, looking at it, he was trying to get everybody, he is trying to lower the temperature, get everyone to calm down. my experience, on capitol hill, is that. and, i don't know if you agree with me, and we cover the hill together as well. when you send people home, it stirs people up, rather than keeping people in town sometimes, it has the opposite effect. >> well one, you are sending them back to their constituents, who are going to call offices, matt gaetz included. if it to, shock and awe, these people are shocked. as much as they shouldn't be, it was very clear that they thought they were calling some sort of bluff, and that did not happen. and they all looked like they couldn't believe it. and, that is just weird. it is just like one of those

weird moments on the hill, that is unexpected. i think one thing i'd like to say is that, this is not kevin mccarthy's problem. this is our problem, as a country, because in 40 something days, we will be discussing the budget all over again, the continuing resolution all over again. and whoever the speaker is, will have had to make some sort of concession to be leader, that would it directly affect that discussion, again. so it's not like everyone can be like oh, kevin mccarthy is gone, i guess this thing is solved. >> no, they really have to figure how to reconstitute themselves. i mean, this is a big discussion, not only about oh, who is the person you would like to be the next speaker. they have to figure out how they change the rules, as mccarthy said, change the rules. do they? >> while there is that one. rule >> there is that one rule, about the motion to vacate.

but it is a rule that he actually asked to. so, if you are i want to be speaker next time, do you want that rule? i don't think you do. and then the question is of course, on substance, what do you do about ukraine, which has been raised here. and, what do you do about the recalcitrant aid, what are they going to demand? and so, it is really, it is reconstituting the party, in the house of representatives, but it is also taking a look at the republican party, writ large, and -- well a presidential campaign. >> while it is going, with donald trump as the dominant, republican front runner. >> and i would imagine >> well donald trump is in court, and rather silent on this issue today. i would imagine he is not going to be so silent, once all of the candidates. >> that's another issue. >> and he may want to inject himself, into this going forward. remember, he is the leader of this party. and, you are right to know, he is leading it from courtrooms, and leading it under indictment, but he is the leader of this party. and i know we are focused today on congress, but i don't think

we can disconnect that, there is a backdrop, of the republican presidential nomination race, that is underway as well here. and, >> he was reprimanded by the judge today, for posting things on social media, that were false, smears about the judges clerk. just to give you a little update. that, of course, is not the number one story, because what we have is the historic removal of the speaker of the house. >> you know, a significant serene, no doubt. and, there -- i agree, people were a little bit more shocked, i think today. that oh, this is actually happening. one person not, chalk it seems to, me was kevin mccarthy. i think over the weekend, as soon as he made the decision, that he saw no path to keep the government open, without making a deal with democrats, he understood he sealed his fate. and i don't think he was surprised at all. >> so he tweeted yesterday, literally 24 hours ago, bring it on. knowing that they were going to bring it. >> i mean, that's very warrior

vibes. that is a thing you would. do >> he really thought he -- >> but, you really think he said bring it on, knowing that he was going to get -- >> i think he said it for bravado, and to it -- in a position of trying to. fight >> knowing that he was going to? loose >> i think he was well aware. >> i don't think he was gonna -- one other interesting thing at that point is, that gaetz said that he talked to donald trump, although he hasn't said what donald trump said to him. we don't know if mccarthy talked to donald trump. and, what hand he played in all of this. and as you were talking about, what is he going to do in the future? will he endorsed someone, because remember, this was my kevin, as he used to call. i'm >> so let me just say, i'm going to do some that i have never done before, i'm going to say something nice about the new england patriots. which is, >> oh i can't wait for this. >> the new england patriots gotcha lacked by the cowboys, 38 to 3.

and i will tell you something that the new england patriots are not doing, after that slacking. they are not taking a week off. that is what they are not doing. they are not taking a week. off >> they literally need to figure out where the exits are, and they need to figure out, people have to start making phone calls, people have to start counting -- because if there is one thing that's clear, they have not been able to do for many many months, it's count votes. and figure, out when they have support, and when they don't have support. >> and then they have to reorganize. >> and i know. >> oh my goodness, you don't think that jim jordan has been secretly talking. >> i think if they were ready, they would have done it already. i think it is that simple. >> patriots fans, i hope you enjoy. that >> were going to take a quick break. coming up next, how this is being received in congressman mccarthy's district, in california. he is still there congressman, he is still there congressman. >> later, more on that judge telling donald trump to keep quiet. >> it's not cool to smear my clerk. i am in charge of the trial

here, we will tell you why, and what happens if trump doesn't, which is where my money is, stay with us.

welcome back, before the break -- talk about lawmakers going back to their districts, before coming back next week to choose a new house speaker. cnn -- 's in in kevin mccarthy's district, and bakersfield california. what were some the reactions there?

>> well anderson, i was actually sitting with one of mccarthy's most ardent supporters, at the current county republican party. and, as that final vote was announced, i can tell you that there was extreme disappointment, and frankly, she was pissed. i mean, this is a district that largely has united around kevin mccarthy, he is enormously popular here. in his last election, he won by 68% of the vote. that is more than double what the democrat was able to gather. so, what we saw throughout the day, we were sitting with people, as we're watching all the drama unfold, in washington. they were reminded that he was born and bred, here that he is one of them. so, there is a lot of concern about what happens next, not just for the party, but what happens to kevin mccarthy, what happens here in the district. but we also heard this, that there is a silver lining for moderate republicans, who hope that some of this right-wing fever may be broken, by what mccarthy is going through. take a listen >> some of these folks, that made this battle today, may find trouble when they run next year, in their

own party, let alone if the democrat convinces the republicans in those areas, you've got a member who is crazy, who's a whack job. and, if they convinced that, we're going to hold seats. but, that's the price that these folks are willing to pay. >> you know, i have to give him some credit, for finally standing up for what is good for all of us. what's the saying in america, e pluribus unum, out of many, we are one. and i think that the politics of today, are all for us, one for, all in the other side is just completely evil, has got to end, and it brings us to many extremes. and our country is about compromise, and slowly making inch by inch progress. i think matt gaetz is trying to burn it all down, and it was very disappointing to me. >> now, -- the last gentleman you heard, he stopped voting for mccarthy last election, he says he will vote for him again if he runs. anderson.

>> you know, california has the highest number of federal workers after washington d. c.. what are people saying about mccarthy -- the weekend possibility of another shutdown, in less than 25 days? >> yeah, that's the first thing that they thought about, right. they need this government to function, hear mccarthy's district, they are about 14,000 federal employees. we are talking about the faa employees, the people who work at the military bases here, the contract employees. they need the government to be funded. they are worried about being able to pay the bills, to pay the electricity bills. and, so that is a concern. they are looking at the clock, they say they need a speaker of the house, not just for government to function in washington, but for them to continue to be paid as federal employees, anderson. >> all right, -- thanks so much, appreciated. kaitlan? >> speaking of california,

anderson, i'm joined now by california democratic congressman adam schiff, and 2024 candidate, of course. congressman, thank you for being here. does it -- the white house is going to wait till next wednesday, to at least try to elect a new house speaker? >> well, it tells me they had no backup plan for what happened today. it certainly appeared from mccarthy's comments on sunday, he wasn't expecting to be voted out. and, so it doesn't surprise me now that they are in total disarray, that any time to figure out what is next. can they unite behind someone? or, are they going to lead patrick mchenry to play speaker pro tempore, on a more indefinite basis? >> what was the, i imagine there were a lot. but, including with you personally, erekat of the house intelligence committee by speaker mccarthy, back in january. what was the deciding factor, for democrats not to try to help him, or save his speakership? >> just, a complete lack of trust in him. we don't trust him, his own members don't trust, him his word is not worth anything. you know, he gave the president his word over the budget deal, and couldn't honor it. he initiated an impeachment proceeding, without merit, in order to buy off the right wing. i think my own -- has decided to do the same

thing. all of those -- to the right-wing, ended up just feeding the beast. and, the beast ended up taking him down. but at the end of the day, we need someone who can govern, who if they don't have our confidence, at least they have the confidence of their own members. there are too many challenges of the country is facing to have the house continue to be in chaos. >> there was reporting that during your closed-door caucus meeting, you quoted the big lebowski while speaking with colleagues. and you, said you agree with matt gaetz about mccarthy. you said gaetz quote, isn't wrong, he's just an a-hole. is that an accurate quote? >> it is one of my favorite line from the big lebowski, which as applied to matt gaetz in this, moment seem to be very much on point and, the caucus certainly fought. so >> are there any republicans that you think could be a good house leader?

obviously you are democrat, but do you think could leave the house? >> i think you are i think there are right many republicans who are people who are very conservative, we can agree on a lot of policy positions, but we also agreed on delivering on -- others like liz cheney and adam kinzinger, i have great respect for, because i knew if they -- -- there are republicans who, i think, could be trusted with that responsibility, where we can fight over policy, but at least they could govern. >> which ones? >> you know, i don't want to identify them, it certainly wouldn't help them within their own conference if i did. but, i think there are republicans who could serve the country well. at least they could govern, and that would serve the country well, even if the policies they want to bring about are ones that i think would ultimately not be in our best interest.

>> what did you make of what, you mentioned patrick mchenry of north carolina, who has now essentially temporarily filling in. he issued a letter to former speaker pelosi tonight, asked her to vacate her highway office, these offices that are in short supply in the house, as you know. she is not, here she is in california. what did you make of that move, that being his first move, as taking over in this position? >> you know, it's a bad omen. it seemed like a very petty thing to do. speaker pelosi is in california, to attend the funeral of dianne feinstein. there is not only a gym in california, but also a lifelong, dear close friend of speaker pelosi's. and to do this, as what seems like his first act, as the speaker pro tem, is to take away one of her offices, that seems very childish. i don't know whether this is a decision he made on his, own or one kevin mccarthy wanted, as a bit of payback. but, it doesn't portend well. >> nothing can happen in the house, until another speaker is elected. i mean, what do you envision the next week looking like? are you concerned that whoever is the next house speaker will be constrained, when it comes to ukraine funding, or whether speaker should power actually

looks like? >> you know, i mean i think in theory, we can actually continue with mchenry in that position. it wouldn't be ideal, but i think they will arrive on someone who, at least could fulfill that role. and i would hope that we can bring up a vote on things like ukraine funding, which enjoy broad, bipartisan support. when people say that washington is broken, it is because of things like this. the vast majority of americans, the vast majority of democrats and republicans in the house of representatives, want to see u.s. aid to ukraine continue. so, why don't we do that? because, they won't bring up to a vote. and while they bring out for a vote? because a handful of their crazies don't want them to. well, they shouldn't be running this place. but, they have been running the republican conference for sometime. >> yeah, we have certainly seen the supports often, in some of the cnn polls as well. a busy week ahead to, maybe not for democrats as much, we will see. congressman adam schiff, thank you for coming over here for the night tonight. >> thank you. >> of course coming up, why the former president has been noticeably silent today, to save the job of a man he often referred to as, quote, my

kevin. kristen holmes will join us, next.

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♪ the new summer family meal. starting at $24. only at el pollo loco. since the early days, of donald trump's campaign, and presidency, kevin mccarthy stood by him. trump would go on to call him quote, my kevin. it is a relationship that trump would lean on, after the january 6th attack, when mccarthy flip-flopped on

whether trump bears responsibility for what happened on that horrible day. so, where was donald trump today, when my kevin could have really used his support? kristen holmes is outside trump tower, in manhattan, and joins us now. kristen, where was mr. trump? why didn't he intervene publicly, to help kevin mccarthy, save his job. he certainly could have swayed some votes i would? think >> well jake, he obviously could have. because i know -- once trump's moved in the 11th hour, after more than a dozen of failed speaker votes on mccarthy's part, that he was able to convince some of the opposition to mccarthy, who changed their votes. i mean, this was what he does. and, what we were told was that there was a multitude of reasons. one is that one ally told, us he can't always stick his neck out for mccarthy, whenever there's a problem on the hill, particularly given that he has allies on both sides of this issue. he is very close with matt gaetz, and we know he spoke with matt gaetz before he even

brought this motion, to gaetz over mccarthy. so, there is a lot going on there. now the other thing we are told, is that he hasn't even been really paying attention. he is fixated on his trial. we know that -- >> now he has been going back to trial, tomorrow, he is enjoying the media coverage, he is blasting out tweets. just a few seconds ago, he posts on truth social, and i was looking to see if it had anything to do with kevin party. and instead, it just said, change the border, or fix the border. so clearly, he is not weighing, in and he is intentionally not weighing in. he could have swayed some of these votes, he could have helped with this, and he did not. >> kevin mccarthy, need i remind our viewers, is credited, or blamed, with resuscitating donald trump, after january 6th. it looked as though the republican party was going to turn away from donald trump, after january 6th. 2021, and then, kevin mccarthy went down to mar-a-lago, and did a photo op with him, and breathed life back into him.

and, i mean i guess we've always known that loyalty is a one-way street with mr. trump. but i guess that doesn't matter to him at all? >> i think if you look at donald trump, and what he believes his loyalty to. beat let's take a look back to about two months, ago when mccarthy was on air on cnbc, and he was asked if trump was the best candidate in 2024, and he very clearly said he didn't know. he thought that donald trump was strong, but he did know he was the best candidate in 2024. that was something that trump and his team took a huge amount of issue with. now, we were also told that kevin mccarthy has given some excuses, to several of trump's allies, as to why he hasn't endorsed trump in 2024. some of it is about fund raising, or about the fact that he didn't want to impact certain sections of republican voters on the hill. but that is still irked people close to trump. i am even told, at some points, that people have said, they have told trump that they don't like kevin mccarthy. but yet, trump stood by his

side, again. in the speakers race. so i do believe there is some pledge of loyalty, being a two-way street. i think that trump did give him some loyalty back in january, and he is a very quick, and very fickle as we know. and i don't think he has really require recovered, at least hasn't seem to have recovered, since mccarthy said he was not the strongest candidate in 2024. >> yeah, but then he quickly took it back. anyway i, take your point. kristen holmes, thanks so much. anderson >> also joining, us the new york times maggie haberman. maggie, what do you think about the former president, not exactly stepping in to help mccarthy? >> i think it was clear this was where it was headed, anderson, last week, when matt gaetz was threading a shut down, and all trump was encouraging a shutdown, and had been for days

and days and days. whether his intention was to give cover to matt gaetz or not, that is what it did, and i gave cover to other people to join matt gaetz in this push against mccarthy. and, that is how we ended up here. donald trump will always leave as many options open as possible, so we never has to foreclose anything, and then you can end up on the side of where something is going, that is often how he decides what he is doing. i think he waited to see where mccarthy was, he didn't especially feel like wading in, for all the reasons we just heard. and another one, which is that mccarthy, and this trump did raise a lot, and frankly this, came out more than the endorsement issue. trump wanted his impeachments expunge from the record, he wanted mccarthy to introduce, this and push this. mccarthy did not do that. impeachment of biden, was less of an issue for trump, then his own record. and so, you put all of this together, and i think it is true that trump had not been especially focused on this, in the days leading up to this. i think he is pretty focused on right now, because i think that

he sees this as some kind of an activity that he can be talked about in, with his people, or are talking about him running for speaker, which don from has a long history of people running non organic drafts for him. this has the same feel. but, it is not surprising to me, because i think. somebody said to me close to trump last, week he doesn't think kevin needs rescuing. now, i message that person today and said, to does he still think kevin doesn't need rescuing, and i didn't hear back. but, he decided he was not going to invest capital in this, and i think he saw where this was headed. and, mccarthy is not good for him in a primary, of his own. and i think that is something else that gets missed. here >> alyssa, do you agree? >> i think that is spot on. listen, anyone any of the candidates who are considering running for speaker, going to have to deal with the trump factor, and i think you're gonna see a lot of jockeying vying to see you can appeal the most to trump, and potentially, if not get an endorsement, get the sort of tacit in your portsmouth, or at least get him not to endorse some of. and that is going to come with concessions. that is a really good point, because we forget about this. the impeachment inquiry into biden, that was sort of an organic house thing, that members truly wanted to do. but, the former president has wanted his own impeachment expunged. and, no one is going to move

forward with that, i would suspect, of the candidates were putting their names forward. so i think that is one to be one of the biggest things that people are deciding. it is not just the number of -- it is how far am i willing to go to this, both to appeal to those eight members, but also don't. from >> you don't think jim jordan would move to try to expunge? it >> i mean, expanding the -- records >> you would know better than, me i'm not sure that's. >> look, some of these guys are capable of just about anything. so yeah, they could move t o try to expunge. but again, these more pragmatic republicans want no part of that, at all. and, this whole palace of injury is kind of interesting, as it is dramatic. but we have been seeing this in years, not with this point with the overthrow the speaker. but, the party has two big problems right now. donald trump, and abortion. when you get beyond those two issues, all the stuff that we are dealing with right now, this is going to be resolved sooner or later. but those are the two issues, and every one of those republican house members, most of them i should say, for those who aren't drinking the kool-aid. but those, they understand the

liability that trump is to all of, them to their majorities. and particularly, to those in those swing districts and swing states. everyone knows it, and we -- scott sorry, >> well, i've never understood this expungement business. because, he was acquitted in both trials. he got impeached, and then he was acquitted, so he effectively won, on the question. >> it doesn't matter it happened in the first place he has to get rid of. it >> yeah, but how do you expunged for every article that was written about it, the history books, or every television show that we have ever done on? so you can't erase it from peoples memory, nor can you erase the fact that he was acquitted. so, i have never understood this. i don't know if there is a thing in the world, that kevin mccarthy could have done to stave this off. he had to agree to the rule that led to his downfall, to get in the first base. except for one thing, there is some reporting that maybe, he had wanted to go down the road, working with dems on this, that his face the nation appearance on sunday, >> it seems to have been a big. >> it seems to have turned some. people >> now, he said in his press conference, i didn't want to make a deal with dems, i

didn't want to be that kind of the speaker, i am a republican. and i get that messaging now. but, if he had to go back and, go back and build a delorean and go back in time, and redo it. maybe you leave the democratic messaging out, and keep that option open, so that you don't lose right out of the gate. >> yeah, i don't know if they're really that many democrats who would have signed up with kevin mccarthy. but you know, i watch all this today, and i think about. at the white house today, the president was getting drug companies to negotiate for prescription drugs for seniors. the vice president was in the senate, swearing in laphonza butler as the new senator from california, who is going to be in that seat, as a stand in for senator feinstein. meanwhile, donald trump is getting a gag order from a judge, because he is smearing people online. kevin mccarthy is getting kicked out of the speaker's chair. it's, i wouldn't trust these people to run my daughters free school. i think the government, the

people who are watching this are seeing a government that is working, that is being led by democrats. and they are seeing a government that is falling apart, at the seams, which is being led by republicans. >> jamal, let me read you some numbers. >> you're talking about a poll, listen >> 40, 36. >> the polls said democrats are going to lose the -- >> they won the -- i don't want anyone to hear these numbers, because what i am reading our joe biden's approval ratings. >> it just doesn't matter. >> you don't think it matters who the president of the united states, is at a approval rating charitably at 40% >> -- barack obama had bad approval ratings before he went into his reelection. i think george bush had bat approval rating before he went into his reelection. it doesn't matter. >> he won a majority of the -- popular the last revenue. >> everyone thank you. up next, the gag order that jamal simmons just mentioned, in the trump new york fraud trial, and where the why the judge imposed, it. next

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earlier in the hour, jake and his panel talk about former president donald trump's day in court. and it was indeed, quite a. the judge, for his social media comments. he seemingly unfazed though, he is already fundraising off of this into the courtroom, calling it a sham trial. a reminder, trump is one of several defendants in this 250 million dollar civil fraud case,

and he is in the courtroom of his own volition. more now -- from so, what happened today? >> there was an unexplained, 45 minute delay, and then the judge got on the bench this afternoon, and said he was issuing a gag order in this case. that was after trump had posted on his social media, a photo of the judges clerk, and senate majority leader chuck schumer, suggesting that she was his girlfriend. now the judge said that that was an untrue post, and trump did not post any evidence to this. but he said, it was unacceptable, saying personal attacks of any member of my court staff are unacceptable, inappropriate, and i will not tolerate them. consider this statement, in order for bidding all parties from posting, emailing, or speaking publicly about any members of my staff. failure to abide by this and will result in serious sanctions. and the judge said that he had warned the councils for the defendant yesterday about this, because trump had spoken in the hallway, about this clerk. and this clerk is the judge's right-hand person, she sits often next him, just to his side on the bench. so, someone that he works very closely with. so after that testimony

continued, it was trump's former longtime accountant, on the stand. his defense lawyers got a chance to begin their cross-examination of him. trump saying today, it's he will get back in court again tomorrow, anderson. >> all right, kara scannell, thanks so much. jake >> thanks anderson. and joining us now to discuss, cnn senior legal analyst elie honig. elie, i mean obviously, a disgusting smear by donald trump. but, do you think that that statement, the smear about the judge, and his clark, warrants a gag order? >> i do, jake. because what donald trump did here is, you violated a courtroom commandment. you do not go after the staff, you don't go after the clerks, you don't go after the deputies, you don't go after the court reporters, the marshals. when you are a prosecutor, or a judge, you take on that role knowing that sometimes you may

be attacked verbally, that there may be insults and criticism. that is part of the job. but these folks who work in the courtroom, they are a public civil servants, they did not sign up for this. the need to be protected. i think this gag order was very much appropriate. >> and, need we remind our viewers that there is a huge trend, donald trump does this, and puts this information out. and, these individuals quite frequently, then start experiencing death threats in not just trash talk on social media, but actual legitimate death threats that require police, and secret service protections from people. >> yeah, it is a trend, it is a multi times per day trend that we are seeing from donald trump. and if we look at the nature of this posting, i don't want to give it too much attention, but what he is suggesting about this courtroom staffer is a-completely false according to the judge, and b-completely inflammatory.

and see, quite likely to result in those kind of attacks and threats. >> yeah, special counsel jack smith, in a separate cases, the criminal cases of jan six, and the classified documents. he has a penny request for a gag order, in the january 6th case, for donald trump. how does the gag order he is requesting compared to this one, in a civil fraud? case >> so, i think the judge in d. c., in the criminal case, judge chutkan, can absolutely and look at donald trump's statements, in this other case, the new york fraud case. i do have to say though, with the doj is asking, for in the d. c., cases in my view, over proud. they are asking the judge to prohibit donald trump for making disparaging or inflammatory comments about anyone involved in the case. look, i was a prosecutor, you are allowed to make a disparaging comment, if you are a defendant, about a prosecutor. you can say, these prosecutors don't know what they are doing, this case against me is worthless. that is okay. so, i do think judge chutkan is going to initiate a gag order. but if i was in her shoes, i would say, you cannot make statements that could intimidate, or threaten, or pose a danger to a witness, or to a juror, or to our staff.

i think it needs to be narrower, than what the doj is asking for. >> trump's defense team, they claim he is eager to testify in his own defense. do you think his lawyers are actually excited about that prospect? how likely do you think it is that he will have to testify? >> they can't possibly be excited about. he doesn't have a great choice here, jake. because this is a civil case the, plaintiffs can force him to testify, and he is only got two options. one is testify, that is a risk. the others take the fifth, he is entitled to do that. but because this is a civil case, this can be used against, him if he takes the fifth in the civil case. so, if i'm his lawyer, i don't like either option. it's a rock and a hard place here. i would refer he takes the fifth. but, it seems like he is intent on testify. >> all right elie, thanks so much. we will be right back.