true that mark meadows wasn't the only one who was telling donald trump that he did not have proof for those fraud claims, something that he was hearing from everyone inside the white house. erin in. >> evan, of course, meadows is one of 18 co-defendants in fulton county. jenna ellis became the fourth person to plead guilty and agree to cooperate and she did emotionally, could we see meadows make a similar deal now that you're seeing this happening again and again. >> it raises a lot of pressure on meadows and some of the other defendants. we know at this point meadows is still contesting that indictment. still challenging that indictment in the appeals court in the federal appeals there in the 11th circuit, it's possible between now and whenever that case gets to trial that mark

meadows will have some kind of terms with the d.a. in georgia. >> all right, thank you very much, evan perez and thanks very much to all after you for being with us tonight. ac 360 starts right now. it's 3:00 a.m. here in tel aviv the news right now and the day unfolding on three fronts. the momentum towards sending troops into gaza, the effort to bring out more hostages. and the pressure on israel to allow humanitarian aid into gaza. most notably fuel to power generators at the hospital. there are governments in three areas. reporting on it throughout this hour. first, though, two new items. the idf a thwarted amphibious raid on tuesday, the other was a phone call played by the foreign

minister for the u.n. security council. cnn has independently translated it, we can't confirm when it was recorded. the foreign minister said it was made by a hamas gunman on a phone from a woman he just kil killed. >> proud murderer bragging to his proud parents. cnn's jim sciutto is with me. >> in a war full of astonishing moments of the depravity of what was witnessed on october 7th, this is one of those moments, as you listen to the audio, playing to the u.n. security council, an

attempt to show the depth of the depravity behind these act. this gets to the mindset behind it, that one of the attackers involved here and that seemed to be one they were playing. cnn can't confirm of where or how it was recorded. >> i would like to listen to this recording. >> this is a terrorist of hamas,

what he said there in arab, telling to his mother and father, that he's proud that there's blood of the jewish that he murdered. >> what struck me listening to this audio here and we have covered too many terror attacks we can barely account for all of them, we'll often see the depravity itself as it's played out, we don't often get a vision into the mind set of the people playing it out. what you hear here is the depth of the hatred where a young man would brag about it to his parents and his parents would respond with pride. >> a new level of personalization in this terror attack. in christchurch in new zealand when the gunman slaughtered people he live-streamed it. we have a 75-year-old murdered in her living room and hamas

gunman access her facebook account, live-streamed those images to her friends and family, they got friend requests and live-streamed that. the documentation on the slaughter, the self-documentation by the gunmen themselves is truly extraordinary, that's just now coming out. >> it's perform tif, too. they want credit. >> and tell their parents to share in the sick joy of it. what about the cell of hamas divers that we heard about? >> remarkable the number of level -- first of aural when you think of hamas clearly a terrorist group, a terrorist group with military capabilities and what we saw on october 7th for instance they don't have an air force but they were able to invade from the air with those motorized paragliders, right, and in this case here they don't have navy or ships, but this was a navy special option operation

that the idf says was carried out today. in effect, hamas s.e.a.l. if you can imagine that. idf was able to get them. not the first time we've seen this 2014, a similar attempted attack. beyond the capabilities it shows their continuing ambition, because gaza as we have been reporting every day is under punishing air assaults right now. hamas was still attempting to strike out of gaza and get into israeli territory. >> hamas is attempting to strike out of gaza every single day. we don't notice it as much because israel has an iron dome system. it's just they're not killing all the civilians they'd like to kill because of the israel defense. >> reporter: they're willing and able to attempt, not just from

the air attacks via shelling and rockets but also via a ground operation and a fairly sophisticated one. intercepted by idf but one shows that the sophistication of their capabilities. >> a lieutenant general has come over, very experienced and believe in particularly in urban combat. >> he commanded marines in fallujah. the message that american commanders seem to be giving the israelis is we've seen this kind of war that you're contemplating here in gaza. urban warfare with a terror group infiltrated throughout. we saw it in fallujah, it was bloody and long but we outgun them. part of the message you don't want that kind of war, right, and it's going to take a long time and have enormous costs. it seems the recommendation is something more like a

combination of air strikes and smaller special operations raids. and a perfect person to deliver that message because he commanded u.s. forces in fallujah. for more on all of this, the arrival, we're joined by former retired general kenneth mckinsey. general, appreciate you being with us. first of all, an audio like that was played at the u.n. today, what is your reaction web you hear that? >> so, two things, first of all, it's accurately captures the horrific nature of the attack. it's stark, ugly and frightening. but it also speaks to the difficulty of the operation that the idf is contemplating to go into gaza, these are people who are going to be fighting in gaza, people who will do everything they can to fight and

fight very hard against the israelis within they elect to come in and i know that's why the idf is carefully calibrating that to accommodate this. >> i talked to some former military officers who were in iraq, when asked about the comparisons to fallujah or mosul, they say they think what israel is or has a ahead of it in gaza city is even more complicated what the u.s. faced in fallujah and mosul because of the civilian population. >> i think that's an accurate s assessment. hamas is better equipment. long time to work at the problem and they're going to present a multidimensional threat to idf when they come in, you'll be fighting on the surface of the earth, fighting underneath the surface of the earth and in the

elaborate tunnel system that they've had decades to perfect. hamas is going to be flying small drones over israel. the israeli air force will be on top to provide precision fire. it's going to be a hard go. accurate to say this will be one of the most difficult urban combat problems. one more observation when you get into an urban environment many of the technological advantages are erased because you're at very close range with your opponent. you'll be fighting room to room, up and down stories in a single building, it's going to be a very, very close battle and that tends to then actually devolve on the small unit leadership. who are going to be able to keep their soldiers in the fight going forward.

>> i've read accounts of tunnel rats who fought in the u.s. army during vietnam in the marines, i assume tunnel warfare has evolved a lot, the sophistication of these tunnels, how do you fight in tunnels? >> you eventually got to go down in there. i'm sure the israelis will use robotics. but what you'll have to go down there and i will expect many of these hostages are going to be held. i'd note from my observation the hostages are clearly important, that's very important to us all, but hamas is going to use the entire civilian population of gaza as hostages in this attack. they're going to attempt to manufacture mass casualty events so they can play that out in the information space against the idf, the idf is going to work very hard to mitigate those

opportunities. the simple fact of the matter is on this battlefield civilians are going to die despite the very best efforts of the idf and they'll try to minimize that. i know they will. i know these leaders. however it goes in whether it's broad front attack or special operations forces, the israelis will attempt to minimize casualties. at the same time, hamas is going to work relentlessly to maximize civilian casualty and what's different about the comparison to fallujah and mosul is the presence of cameras and social media and the fast, i mean information moves faster than it did it in fight against fallujah and mosul. a multidimensional fight, that's another dimension to this, isn't it? >> it is.

personal communications, the internet, the web, the ability to reach out there, but only the technical changes but we have seen -- we've seen a difference in the approach to information. for most of my career, the event was what was important, an event occurred and you talked about the event. in the world today with hamas there's no relationship with the truth necessarily with what they're saying, i believe the israelis will seek to have a relationship with the truth that means you're always going to be slower because you want to check your facts. i think hamas has no requirement to have a relationship with the truth, or even have an event to occur to spin something into the vast and infinite web. that's another tactic they'll use relentlessly. they're using it now and they'll use it in the future. >> general kenzie, thank you so

much. want to talk about the hostages and the effort now under way to secure their release in larger numbers and the two yesterday and two on friday. clarissa ward has the latest on that and he joins us now from cairo, what do we know about these negotiations? >> so this is a very delicate dance that's going on now, anderson w multiple parties involved. trying to broker some agreement. basically, hamas is asking for a pause that they say would allow them to consolidate all the different hostages they have into one place, they would release them in exchange for fuel and in exchange for aid. israel has said no way you're getting a pause because if we give you a pause you'll be able to regroup and consolidate your own forces, then the americans are saying to israel, please can you avert or at least delay a

ground invasion, because we're worried that that would have a negative impact on these hostage negotiations. source telling cnn they believe maybe the israelis you know will delay somewhat but they don't think that time frame will slip beyond a few days so clearly we're getting to a very crucial stage with these hostage negotiations, but there's still a huge amount of daylight between the various different parties that are involved. idf today dropping leaflets over gaza imploring ordinary civilians living there to provide information about hostages' whereabouts and conducting some limited raids across the border presumably some of those with the design of trying to locate some of those hostages. but no sense yet of when this deal might actually come together and it's a deal, that if it did come together, to net

the release of dozens of hostages. so far we've only seen those two americans, two american women and also two elderly israeli women. this is a much more ambitious. and more complex, anderson. >> so, the dispute is over fuel and that's something that hamas is saying they want, i assume they're saying that is for hospitals and other needs for civilians, obviously the view of the idf that fuel may be diverted by hamas. >> reporter: this is interesting, because we've seen the israeli position move back and forth, just in the course of one day, anderson, earlier in the afternoon the head of idf came out and say they believed that fuel should be able to get to civilians and they were going to come up with some sort of mechanism that would prevent it

from being taken by hamas. a few hours after that, we saw a spokesperson for the idf come forward and say, actually no fuel is going into gaza because we believe that hamas is going to use it for their own military aims. on the other side, you have humanitarian organizations like the u.n. agencies unrwr come out we'll have to completely stop our operations inside gaza. we're hearing the same thing from the hospitals as with el the generators will be literally out of fuel, they'll turn off, the incubators more than a hundred babies across gaza in incubators. the ventilators, et cetera, they'll all turn off with devastating consequences. u.n. said already eight hospitals are no longer operational because they have run out of fuel, two other

hospitals have also had partial outages or had to cut off part of their operations because of the fuel. fuel is very much at the center of hostage negotiations and the center of the desperation in terms of getting aid to people inside. >> clarissa ward, thank you, from cairo. earlier tonight, i spoke the regional director for the -- middle east. what is the latest on the ongoing efforts to release hostages? >> look, i mean, the most important thing for us, it's first to reach out to hamas and be clear on the obligation, i know that for the time being we hear a lot about negotiation. and a transactional approach.

it's important to remind the parties in this case, hamas, he has a unilateral obligation to protect the people, that we should have access to them, people should be entitled to communicate with their family, and the ones who are hostages should be simply released because it's not acceptable and it's not allowed. as simple as this. that's the starting point at least for us as a humanitarian organization. >> there's been lots of concerns raised by israeli officials about humanitarian supplies being taken from relief agencies, used by hamas, fuel that should go to a hospital perhaps being taken, is that something the red cross has -- the international community of

red cross has had problems with in gaza. is that something you would call out? >> yeah, for sure. you know, we are as many humanitarian organizations, confronted with these challenges all around the world. we have the systems in place to be sure, to do whatever we can to make sure that the assistance we bring goes to the right person, if today we bring medical supply, we go to the hospital and we see where it goes and to whom it goes. in our case when it comes to fuel, we mainly provide it to pumping station, to hospitals, at the risk of diversion is quite low. i understand the concern. it's a legitimate concern. but in my view, it doesn't just

defy -- justify the fact that we wouldn't be allowed to bring in this case fuel. what we try to do is also to focus on people and i think one of the main challenges we have in conflict, especially in a conflict in gaza, emotions are really high and both party -- i'm not judging if it's right or wrong -- have a narrative of survival and when you're in conflict with all parties have a narrative of survival it's really hard to make a case for simple humanitarian values. it's important have an organization like the icsc to take a step back and remind that, yes, it's painful. yes, you want revenge, yes you're afraid, but nevertheless you need to preserve a space, a

space of humanitarian. it sounds a bit naive when we see what's happening around us, but it sounds naive but it's not, because the reality of conflict is so brutal that if you don't preserve this small space of humanity, the day after will be way more difficult. >> thank you so much. for being with us and for what you do. >> thank you very much. term trying to preserve a small space of humanity, not an easy thing to do in a war ahead tonight a potential big development back home, new reporting that former white house chief of staff mark meadows was granted immunity by special counsel jack smith. what it could mean for the former president. next, though from here, my conversation with a daughter of

one of the two women freed last night. some of the names and faces we'll be showing you throughout the hour the many others taken from a kibbutz nir oz.

today one of two women released by hamas last night spoke about their ordeal.

85 years old. she was taken on october 7th from kibbutz nir oz. their two husbands remain captive. >> translator: i was on motor booik on the side. they exploded the fence. the special one they built with $2.5 billion and it didn't help at all. hordes broke into our home, hit people, some were taken hostages, it didn't matter if they took elderly or young. it was a painful act. then they got us to a tunnel. as i was lying on the side of the motorbike, they didn't break my ribs but it was very painful and made it hard for me to breathe. >> the woman by her side during that press conference on her left that's her daughter. she was at london's heathrow

airport on her way here, when we spoke again this morning, she returned to the hospital where she found her mom sleeping peacefully. how is your mother doing? >> my mom is looking okay. it seemed that she did get basic medical care, the nurse said that she's very sharp and very communicative and she wants to tell everybody what she knows, and i think she's very aware that she can pass on information i know that she was with some children and then she would have done quite a lot of work with them. i don't think she would have been sitting in corner. >> so she'll be able to help families with information about their loved ones. >> yes. >> that's huge.

>> this is a wonderful moment. but it's also -- i'm sitting here talking to you not just to rejoice about my mom's return as wonderful as it is but to remind everyone that we're still in this situation, that there are over 200 people missing and that we want them back. we need to make sure that the governments of the world, that qatar continue to do its work, that we all work together, we stay focus, we bring these people home and my mom is back and it's a ray of light, but there's a lot of darkness. you've been to a kibbutz and you've seen what we're facing. people are going to funerals every day, only from our kibbutz there are still about 77 people missing. >> a kibbutz of about 400 people? >> yes, we're talking about 1 in 3, 1 in 4 persons that are

killed or missing. >> reporter: she knows them all. >> my father taught her the piano. my mom will come and make her cookies. she was one of her kibbutz grandchildren. we're all interconnected. it's like rafa, she had a smile that's so beautiful and so loving and so loving together and so many other people, i knew them all my life and they changed my nappies. i know for my mom and dad, they would say look after the kids, and to lose all these kids that will break my parents' hearts. >> your mom and dad would have wanted the children released first. >> yes.

>> my father and my mother got separated early on. my father it seems was injured and we don't know more about him. so, we're still in the dark. >> he was a well known journalist. a peace activist. >> he cared a lot about people. he wanted a very different path for this country. >> i've read that your dad in retirement would belong to an organization that would pick up people from gaza who needed cancer treatment and drive them to a hospital in israel and drive them back and forth. >> he would bring some grapes, cookies and bottles of water to make sure if they don't have enough provisions he'll talk to them, he could communicate with everyone and he participate in what, being a human.

he participated in being a human. something for of all us to take from it, participate in the little acts of kindness that makes the difference. >> even now in. >> what's the alternative? what's the alternative? i don't enjoy any death for anyone. i don't see -- it doesn't make me feel better. it's just makes me so sad in our world we're creating so many stories of dramtrauma and destruction. my father was very practical. he fought in wars, he thought you should work for peace but you should defend yourself. he wasn't, you know, he wasn't -- >> wasn't naive? >> no. and he believed firmly in peace,

because he saw war, he saw what war does and i think peace is what we're working towards. see other people as humans. fight when you need to fight to protect yourself, but never for revenge or your ego, just for protecting. >> do you think your father still feels that? >> i don't think he has another capacity in him. i think he thinks that this has come to that because of mismanagement by governments. because we are looking at the story rather than the humans, but there's two nations that are not working toward hiving together. >> she's still shocked by the brutality of the october 7th terror attack and beyond anything, anything we ever imagine zbld like her mother critical of israel's failure to prevent the massive loss of

life. >> we haven't been prepared. we've been destroyed. and the army didn't come for seven, eight hours, this is exactly what israel was built for, isn't it, to protect the jewish people, it totally failed this time. >> when her mour was released she shook the hand of a hamas gunman which has been criticized by many in israel. >> she was shaking the hand of the hamas person. it's very typical of my mom. she loved the human. >> she loves human beings. >> she would talk, she would come off the plane and she made three friends. she's always curious about people and i know that, you know, when i saw it, thrououghte did. she kind of couldn't stop herself. >> even though these people were holding her hostage she's the kind of person who sees them as

human beings. >> i mean, it's -- that image speaks for itself, doesn't it? >> coming up, earlier tonight, we briefly mentioned the paraflieders hamas used to terrorize israel in skies on october 7th to get deeper into israeli territory. coming up next, a new video on that part of our continuing investigation about how this terror group was able to pull off this attack.

cnn has received new video of how hamas was able to use paragliders as part of its ground, sea and air attack on october 7th to kill so many israelis on so many fronts. hamas gunman use d paragliders o kill to residents. we want to warn you some of the video is graphic. >> on that day, hamas delivered death on paragliders. as seen in this exclusive video obtained by cnn. hamas militants arrived here, killing 20 people in this community of just 800. >> that used to be an

american-style wooden house. >> reporter: now this is all that remains. they were at home that fateful saturday morning. when hamas terrorists burned their house to the ground, firing a rocket-propelled grenade. remains were found charred inside. all they found were her teeth. called it home since she was a child, living within a few hundred feet of gaza. now we can see here that there's smoke from gaza. >> gaza is very close to us. >> reporter: now after surviving the october 7th attacks she wants the world to know what happened here. >> it's a small community, everybody knows each other. there were 20 of them. we went to three, four, five funerals a day. eventually, they brought them to

be buried. >> reporter: this is her first time inside the home since the attacks. her first time seeing where her friend was killed. >> it's too difficult for me. >> this is where she lived her final moments, she died after the hamas terrorist attacked this house from the outside. as she was sitting there dying, her daughters, her three daughters and her husband, they went into this room, we're told that they left this door slightly ajar hoping that the terrorists wouldn't think anyone was in here and they hid here in this corner. two of the daughters injured by shrapnel and by bullets. for 40 minutes they didn't make a sound waiting for the men who

murdered their mother to leave their home. >> i feel responsible to tell this story, because i know today, i mean it's been two weeks today, after that saturday that our life turned into this. and i believe the world forgotten already. >> reporter: today, telling that story looks like this. so everywhere you go you have to travel with security. >> everywhere. for the last, i mean, for the last two weeks, this is how it is. if you want to enter your home for one minute you have to have somebody securing the house. >> reporter: when you're this close to gaza you have only seconds to react. but the sounds of war are not all that fills the air in the frontline community. a mother's wail and a father's

prayer. for their 17-year-old son. every parent's worst nightmare come true. anderson, this is very much a community that's still in mourning and also one where many haven't yet taken the time to really process what they've been through, many of them are keeping busy, as you saw some on are volunteering in town to helping to get people to their homes to get their belongings. but most of this town isn't living in their homes, right now it's an idf staging ground. preparing for the next phase of israel's military campaign against hamas. anderson. >> jeremy diamond, thank you. more ahead on the conflict between israel and gaza, including a conversation with the son of a holocaust expert.

want to go to washington for a report on a possible immunity deal for mark meadows. more on that ahead.

how's the chicken? the prawns are delicious. oh, i have a shellfish allergy. one prawn. very good. did i say chicken wrong? tired of people not listening to what you want? diit's truffle season!g? ah that's okay... never enough truffles. how much are they? it's a lot. oh okay - i'm good, that - it's like a priceless piece of art. enjoy. or when they sell you what they want? yeah. the more we understand you, the better we can help you. that's what u.s. bank is for. huge relief. yeah... ♪ we'll continue our coverage of israel at war in moment. but another major story breaking involving a an immunity deal for mark meadows.

paula reid joins us now from washington with that. what is the latest? >> reporter: anderson a massive development in the special counsel's investigation we previously reported here at cnn meadows had testified before a grand jury but now we're learning more about what he reportedly has told investigators, now according to reports he told investigators that in the weeks following the 2020 election, he says he told trump that these claims of widespread voter fraud were baseless, and he told investigators that he believed trump was being, quote, dishonest with the public when claiming there was voter fraud and he also said that he had never seen any evidence of fraud that would have kept now president joe biden from the white house and agreed with did i assessment that this was the most secured election in u.s. history. anderson, this is a huge break of course from trump's public rhetoric about the election but also from what meadows has said publicly including in his own

book and reportedly investigators were quite interested in talking to meadows about whether he believes sol of the claims in his book including his claims that the election was stolen and he reportedly told them that he does not believe that everything in that book was true. now that's something that the defense attorneys could have a field day with those inconsistent statements. this kind of cooperation for mark meadows, this is a pay jar development, perhaps the biggest development in this investigation in months. not just a witness he's the witness. he's former white house chief of staff and he can provide these insights into trump's actions, into his state of mind in the weeks and months following the election that almost no one else can. now, going forward, it's likely that this trial, this particular case, the january 6th prosecution is expected to go on in march and will likely be, anderson the only trial that trump faces before the presidential election.

>> a big development. paula reid, thank you. to the other breaking story the chaos for house speaker, that today got even more chaotic if that's possible, manu raji joins us now. >> reporter: right now -- they're voting on yet another possible nominee for their parting that three weeks to the day after kevin mccarthy was ousted in his or theic and unprecedented fashion. the house republicans have been unable to get behind a single nominee. three so far have seen their bids collapsed including tom emmer today. 217 votes needed to be elected speaker and move this chamber out of paralysis. they're frustrated. they're angry at their inability to get their act together and get this house reopened, worried about the impacts it can have on

control of the house and some republicans may cut a deal with democrats to reopen the chamber. >> we need to get our act tog together. >> my fear is if we keep doing this somebody is going to end upsiding with the democrats as the original eight did and this time it's going to be handing away our majority. >> every member is tired of those eight. that's why we're here. >> mccarthy continued to blame the eight republicans who voted him out of the speakership. initiated by republicans. but anderson, it's still uncertain whether any of those five candidates in the room who will be nominated tonight by their conference can actually get the votes on the floor to be elected speaker. that's still an open question as house republicans remain a total state of disarray. anderson. >> manu raji, thank you.

next, an expert on the holocaust is now a presumed hostage in gaza with a heart condition. ahead, my conversation with his son who's disappointed to say the least in the response by israel's government.

is it possible my network could take my business

to the next level? it is with comcast business. powering all your devices with gig-speed wifi. and you get fast downloads and uploads. pick it up! pick it up! oh we got this! because it's powered by the next generation 10g network. more speed for your business? it's not just possible. it's happening. get started for $59.99 a month for 12 months. plus, ask how to get an $800 prepaid card with a qualifying internet bundle. comcast business, powering possibilities.

the 58-year-old freed hostage was critical today of the idf their failure of the idf to respond quickly to the october 7th attack. our next guest and 13 members of his family survived his attack on the kibbutz nir oz where mr. lifshitz was from. his father is an expert on the holocaust and has a heart condition. i spoke with him earlier. your dad, 75. what do you want people to know about him, one of the leading experts on the holocaust, devoted his life to the study of the holocaust, jewish history in poland, he sounds like a remarkable man. >> he's a remarkable man.

he knows a lot. he's a great teacher. he's done a lot, a lot of exceptional work in poland and in israel. on the subject of the holocaust, like you said. and he's done a lot on the subject of the dialogue between the israeli youth and more. yeah, many, many people are students and admire him because they know -- they learned a lot from him. i learned a lot from him. it's the most conversation man that i know, because he knows so much and he also -- he speaks very interesting way.

so, he also loves his family and his grandchilds. yes, he does not deserve to be there. i think the government of israel made a big, big failure. and they should do whatever they can to bring him back and bring all the hostages back. >> one of things we heard from mrs. lifshitz today the disappointment and anger at the israeli government and intelligence failures by the idf to respond on that day and also to have advanced information, intelligence failures on that -- this upsets you greatly as well. >> yes. yes. i was there.

i was in nir oz with my family. inside a shelter. holding the hand of my the door and shaking from fear ander the fid because i know what's happening. i hear the shooting. i know what's happening. i know that people sent messages that burn alive. they just slaughtered us like nothing, like we were nothing, no one was there for eight hours, we were left alone. and these people that were kidnapped, these people should be the first priority, they should be back home as soon as possible. they deserve one time's enough. >> do you have confidence that that this government in israel is making the right choices, that this government is

prioritizing your dad and the other hostages? >> i will say this, i can't ignore the fact that this government failed and they're failing for a long time the last two months, they're destroying everything that's good in israel and this is just a continuation of this horrible government. i think netanyahu and his friends should resign immediately and bring back the case that people can trust. >> anything else you want people to know about your family situation? >> my dad is sick. he has medicine he should take. he has trouble sleeping. he gave his life, more than 50 years, he lived on the border,