commanders, ordered to execute all zero them, and gave us this transcript. take them in down. zero them, take them zero them. the officer says, got it. plus comes the reply once you zero then report back. he adds once they're all out, face down, the russians fire ukrainians we. spoke to left asking why to just terrify them or is it simply sport for the russians the main reason is to made russian soldiers believe they, it's very dangerous to surrender ukrainian forces because ukrainian soldiers will kill them. >> like russians killing ukrainian prisoners of war these force them not to surrender, but to go forward to their deaths a horror, not always publicize nice

struggle to hold the eastern line nick paton walsh, was horrific to watch. well, thank you for joining us. ac360 starts now good evening we start with breaking news, dramatic development in yesterday's mass shooting at appalachia high school in georgia. >> we are waiting a news conference by authorities that is to take place any minute. we have just learned the father of the 40-year-old suspect in that shooting has now been arrested in connection with the shooting. you can see authorities are gathering. we'll bring you that press conference has begins let's listen in. >> we wanted to come back and update you on the progress of the case this evening appreciate you being here in coordination with the district attorney with district attorney brad smith the gbi has arrested collin gray age 54, in connection to the shooting here at apalachee high school carlin

is coat grazed. father that was arrested yesterday he is charged with the following four counts of involuntary manslaughter, two counts of second-degree murder and eight counts of cruelty to children mr. gray, these charges stem from mr. gray knowingly allowing his son, colt to possess a weapon this is a very difficult time, as we know for students and parents and so many i know of students and parents here in this county and around this state are afraid you all have likely seen reports of incidents of other students making threats today. at various schools around our stake. in each of these incidents police law enforcement took charges. they made arrests acted very swiftly. as we take incidents like this very seriously across this state. this is a time for

all of us as a community and a state to come together and remain vigilant students must be supported, inc. an encouraged. here in this community across the state to contact a member of the school's faculty with any and all concerns of suspicious activity that they may seem local state and federal law enforcement will continue to work together around the clock in relation to this incident here. in any other incidents that come up around this state that raised concern to the safety of our students faculty and citizens here in the state of georgia additionally, cope gray that was arrested yesterday for this incident has now been charged with four counts of felony murder and again, we will continue to work tirelessly to finish complete this investigation as we move

forward, i will go ahead and mention to you, and as i say, sometimes i'm go ahead and apologize to you. as you all know that this is a murder investigation. it is a very serious investigation, one that we take serious one that we will continue to diligently work on. it'd be very thorough with it with a deal we are in our local partners here. so you'll have to forgive us if we don't add a lot of the questions that you asked, i know you had many and we wish we could ask for many of them for you, but we still obviously want to maintain the integrity of this investigation because it has a long way to go for it to be finished. again, i also want to remind everyone that we need to continue to pray and support the victims that were involved here. the school teachers, the faculty, the students, obviously those that lost their lives, their families and those that were injured. so i like to call them the sheriff to come and give

you a brief update on the status of those that were injured from yesterday's event. thank you. >> thank you director house. as rector house, he said i'd like to decide that obviously we lifting up those families, are hearts are hurting for them. our kids our students, our teachers but the nine injured i am very happy to say we'll make a full recovery and that's a testament to the response that we had in my opinion the response to medical staff happened, that responded with in my opinion and we're very happy to say that they will make a full recovery after that that response again, please lift up our community please keep these children, these teachers we call them teachers, but i called them heroes we met with him the day emotions are very high, obviously but we

told them that we love them, we love our teachers and what they do and we're very happy at the fact that they stood in the gap between evil to protect their children. and we want to include them in the save the lives that were saved as well yesterday but i wanted to report to you that all nine people that are injured will expect to make a full recovery thank you. >> several of them are still in the hospital, some have been released well, i'm i'm all leave it at you all mentioned it in the release that he knowingly allowed him to possess the weapons. director details about how the arrest happened today. did you turn himself when did you guys make contact with them? how did that go with investigators is afternoon i'm, honestly not familiar with the details i'll i can tell you is that he is in custody at this time it's

difficult to say at this point in time we're obviously still investigating is following all leads, all evidence and we'll see where it takes us as we progress forward. >> russian has been made sooner the arrest was made when we had the probable cause to make the arrest i'm not sure. no, no? i'm not sure about that either. i'm sorry. are you anybody explained the charges he has more charges not in great detail. the biggest thing is i mentioned earlier is that he is in custody at this point in time. his charges or directly connected with the actions of his son and allowing him to possess a weapon. >> should we be housing your facility? that where he will be told? >> how does that mean for he'll be held in the bear county detention center? >> his mug shot be available tonight or will take some time for that. >> depends on how long it takes us to book him. but if that if

it's available, we can get that to you all tonight. >> if not tomorrow. >> that's some good news. >> some have been released, you know, the numbers of patients release victims i don't want to speak to that because i don't know the exact number, but i know that i want to just report that all now would make a full recovery and be able to leave the hospital nine people that were injured. do we know if they are a mix of students and teachers or staff or are they just humans i believe i believe what to were adult teachers and the rest, which would be seven, would be students. i do i plead when there is precedent for charges like this i'm sorry. can you explain whether there is precedent in the state of georgia as far as the gbi is concerned for the father or parents to be charged for the crime. >> i don't have any details on any history of it, but i would venture to say it's not something nice. >> can you tell us about the evidence that led to these charges? >> know my that's part of the ongoing investigation. i apologize to all this time with

him being able to talk with investigators were pretty strong yesterday were saying this was an evil act it's very sad honestly but looking back at lead to the 14 year-old's been able to say to investigators over the last 24 hours, can you reflect on just what this community space in africa? >> what he allegedly did at the school while we're what we're facing heartbreak we're heartbroken a young person brought a gun into a school committed an evil act and he took lives and the injured many other people, not only physically but mentally but i'm proud of bear county i'm proud of our superintendent. >> i'm proud of these teachers. i'm proud of these schools. and i'm proud of where i live and we'll get past this you see behind me appear on the hill we've got a vigil going on at our flagpole i welcome you to go see those kids and those young people that are hurting can you please

explain whether we're still expecting more charges? i think i answered that earlier. our investigation is still ongoing so we'll see where things go without investigation. and i'll leave it there. >> thank you. he's so much this all we have for tonight. continue to follow the gbi on x. please monitor our website. we did not anticipate another update, but as you can see, it's fluid. things are developing. again, we appreciate your patience and your support and your continued prayers for the victims. thank you. >> so you were hearing from authorities there limited in what they will say, but that the father of the shooting suspect has like his son now today, been charged four counts involuntary manslaughter for a second degree murder, as well as a charges related to cruelty to children. i'm joined by isabel rosales. there's been covering the story in georgia, former federal prosecutor jeffrey toobin is with us and

john miller, our chief law enforcement intelligence analysts, also, dave collin, who authored a definitive book. i one of the most infamous mass school shootings in u.s. history, columbine john first of all, what do you what are you learning? >> well, we began to learn and this is based on reporting by ryan young down at the scene and mark morales here in new york, that this gun, an ar-15 platform, was something that the father, who was just charged, colin gave to his son as a christmas gift in december of 2023. now that has extraordinary significance on a number of levels. number one, it is just several months after we learned that the jackson county sheriff went to the house interviewed the father and the son about the fbi reports that he had made an online threat on a discord, read his son allegedly had a discord account in which he made online threats through a

school shooting. the local authorities contacted by the fbi i interviewed both the son and the father. who denied any any such threats, right. >> column said that wasn't me on the computer the sunset, i would have never done that. but it did come from an account that the provider said belonged at that location and to those people discord, by the way, he said they removed that accounting may of 2023. exactly. >> but that posting showed rifles dan talked about shooting up the school the following and pictures. so you really have to kind of when you look at a case like this, which is going to be about negligence and indifference to the probability of what could happen. factor that in that occurred before he gave them this gun as a gift. the other thing we can say in context is at the time he gave it to him, they were collin and his wife were in the middle of a very contentious divorce and child custody case with allegations and counter allegations and arrests and the wife had

accused alleged shooter's mother had accused the alleged shooter's father, her husband, of abuse verbal a hostile environment then in the course of that, she was also arrested in a car where she was charged with possession of methamphetamine and other drugs. >> so what you're seeing is an environment that might not be the ideal environment for a third ten-year-old or a 14-year-old to possess basically an assault weapon. another father argument was he doesn't have unfettered access to it. but if you listen closely to the interview with the sheriff at the time, jackson county, they talk about well, he has access to it, but not when it's loaded. and when we when we use it, we use it together. i just took them on his hunting in trip and so on but it it clear it clearly is a factor here that he did have access to it and ammunition because we know what allegedly happened. >> there were there's reporting also that as part of an eviction proceeding that had occurred, that authorities had

actually remove guns from the home and then returned from the father and then emily returned them again, this interview with police took place in may. it was a now according to run young and others reporting in december around christmas, that the father after having been interviewed by police, when and got an ar 15 style weapon for his son, jeff. i mean this is rare, although not unheard of second time in american history. apparently that a parent has been charged in connection with a mass shooting by a minor. i think people may remember in michigan, just an in april the crumbley family, it was again, a shooting where a minor shot and killed four people and in an unprecedented case at that point, the parents, jennifer and james crumbley were charged with involuntary manslaughter. the same initial counts as in this case. the facts of that case

involved was there recklessness? this was their foreseeability. there was a an issue in that case of not getting mental health assistance to the boy, which the school had recommended obviously, john's talking about the evidence. we know the key issue in the case against the father here will be the recklessness of foreseeability how he handled the gun in relation to his son. what's different from the michigan case in certainly jumped out to me when i heard the charges here in georgia. is that it's not just involuntary manslaughter, which suggests it's just recklessness. the father in this case is also charged with second-degree murder, which suggests a much higher level of intentionality which prosecutors will have to prove. >> what would that imply knowledge of a possible attack.

>> it could but even knowledge, i think it would be hard to make it rise to second-degree murder, second-degree murder. in almost every case that i'm aware of involves intention, knowing an intentional is intentional murder. and that obviously we're just getting the evidence in this case, but that's a much higher road, much more difficult charge to prove that involuntary manslaughter, which is really just about recklessness, carelessness which certainly based on the facts of john's are laying out that seems like a very mockable case against him. as father. but second-degree murder, very different. isabel. i mean, you've been reporting on this all day this news just broke just a minutes before we went on air. what are you hearing about reaction to it? what have you been hearing throughout the day?

>> yeah. and i spoke to sheriff judd's smith earlier today and he had told me that any option was possibly on the table, including charging cold grace, father in connection to this deadly shooting, one of the big questions i had after that interview with the sheriff is just how much cold great. is talking. the sheriff told me that he was read his miranda rights and that he just kept talking and talking, even saying i did it. the sheriff told me that cold gray did not deny carrying out that shooting. and of course, we have that stunning reporting from mark morales and ryan young that the jackson county sheriff's office spoke to the father. cnn obtained that audio of that investigation. the father saying, no, my son did not have unsupervised unsupervised access to these guns? yes. we like to hunt the sun denied i know i would never write something like this. not

even joke about it, but then we have here around christmas time, around the holidays, 67 months later the father buying him according to our law enforcement sources, buying him the same gun that was used to carry out this heinous attack. let me so the question becomes, sorry, let me just that that audio that you mentioned, we have that from that police interview. i just want to play that way weapon accessible to him they are having there's nothing loaded, but they are down we did we actually we do a lot of shooting. >> we do a lot there on he shot his first year this year so i'm pretty much in shock. maybe well, come a little off to be even really honest with if that is what was said that it's good yeah, they'll so sorry, anderson, the question

becomes, how does a 14-year-old get access to these guns to carry out this attack collin gray was the adult in the household. you have deputies knocking on your door, a talking with you about these very serious accusations, multiple tip saying that your son may be involved with sending out these threats. we have new reporting to about that incident report from 2023, that discord account that john miller was mentioning that the fbi linked to nicole gray, where he referenced the whoever wrote the post reference plans for future mass shooting, writing. i'm committing a mass shooting and i'm waiting a good two to three years. i'm ready posting images of the gun expressing desires to target an elementary school, expressing frustrations with the acceptance of transit it's gender, people. so how is it that these accusations, these threats are brought to your attention and then later on you end up purchasing a gun for your son. so the question becomes, what was the inaction

that was taking in terms of locking away guns or the action taken by this father in terms of buying him a gun that could have possibly lead to this shooting. they're going to have to prove that in court did call in yorba columbine really opened my eyes to so much about mass shootings in america. >> it's, it's a definitive study of what happened to columbine, which we hear that this alleged killer, this this young man looked at other school shootings and that is a common thing we hear in all of these school shootings that oftentimes they go online, they look up and they even look back to columbine in a sort of idealizing way, looking at the two killers at at columbine them i'm wondering what you're first of all, your reaction is now to the arrest of the father well, a couple of things i'll come back to the arrest. yeah researched this for 25th

anniversary. >> we did in for new preface and i believe they were there at 82 documented cases that we know of the shooter is directly said in the writings or erase that they were inspired by columbine or use it as a model but much more than that i think five or six the shooter's it went five generations deep, so they studied the bar county shooting. >> who's killers, study. >> i think northern illinois, who studied virginia tech in calamine virginia tech sunday columbine fine there's this. >> we have it in the book. this is incredible web and there's actually an atlantic piece you can link to it's incredible work all roads are leading back to columbine in the almost studying these kids they've learned because i'm the people

worst of all, they learned that bombs usually don't work. so they stopped that and just gone ahead per shooting in maximizing that horrible in there reenacting this smith of eric and dylan as heroic figures who stood up from the nobody's everywhere against bullies and the whole thing is there's huge tens of thousands of kids online in this community during this so much yeah, john, we talked he have you do you think this is going to be something that we hear more of parents being arrested. >> i think it is. i mean, you're watching states create laws, not all states about requiring the securing of firearms the school, even on its website, the school that was the school district that was attacked said we get

threats. we get unverified threats. but the biggest threat to human life is unsecured guns in the home. and this is from the perspective of georgia, where it's not unusual to have guns or rifles in the home where people go hunting words for sports and they said, you know, these, need to be secured. if you look at the history we were just talking about in new and newtown, connecticut he got the gun that he wasn't supposed to have access to and killed his mom. she was his first victim before did the massacre at the school remember the story in virginia of the first-grader who showed up to school and shot his teacher with a gun that was not secured, that mother was charged in that case in the fort lauderdale case the marjory stoneman douglas school that shooter got the gun from home where he was with his dad so this is a recurring theme that you have guns and you have kids. they have to be secured. it downs obvious, but i think

parents in these cases are going to be looking at their own liability. >> i mean, it is kind of incomprehensible to me that a father or a responsible for any responsible father would have the police show up at his home talking about his son doing this. it seems like there's some evidence that his son was on this discord thing and then months later go out and get a and i think that's one reason why he's being charged here. it's also worth mentioning. i mean, at this point, we almost take it for granted. assault weapons don't have to be legal. assault weapons like this were illegal in this country from 1994 to 2004 or bill clinton signed the assault weapons ban, but it only lasted for ten years. there have been many efforts to make assault weapons illegal, which would limit this problem considerably about kids having access to them. but we live in a country where the second amendment it's very much in ascendancy

and limiting access to any kind of weapon is very difficult. >> thank you, everybody. in a moment more on this talk the prosecutor first charge parents in a mass school shooting? karen mcdonald, and later my conversation with a childhood friend and a fellow coach of the high school coach who was murdered yesterday cnn special event, the abc news presidential debate tuesday at nine on cnn. >> hi guys. >> know, you look great. now that i have inspire, i'm free from struggling with a mask and the hose fire inspires of sleep apnea treatment and then that works inside my body with a click of this button where you go. i'm going to get inspired, learn more and do important safety information. it inspires sleep.com, university of maryland global campus is a school for real life, one that values that successes. you've already achieved, earn up to 90 undergraduate credit it's for relevant experience and get the support you need from your first day to graduation day and beyond. what will your next access pay he as long as i

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therapy's tough, huh? -mmm. it's like a lot about me. [laughs] a home router should never be a home wrecker. oo this is a good book title. 44 per month cabinet still go. >> wow, for less the breaking news that we're following right now, the father of the accused georgia school shooter has been arrested and is facing several charges, including four counts of involuntary manslaughter in connection with yesterday's shooting in appalachia high school? >> just moments ago at a press conference that the georgia bureau of investigation said

the father knowingly allowed his words, his son tap a weapon, joining me now, karen mcdonald, the oakland county, michigan prosecutor, who pursued homicide charges against the parents of a school shooter who killed four students at oxford high school in 2021, ms mcdonald, thank you for being here. i'm sorry, it's under these circumstances. first of all, your reaction action to these charges against the father of the alleged shooter, and we should know that they stem from him knowingly allowing in terms of according to prosecutors, his son, to have a weapon you know, it's unclear exactly what the facts are i don't know anymore than you do but my reaction is rage because you know it the prosecution of the crumbleys was never ever meant to be a floodgate of charges against parents because it was such an egregious set of facts and i am i think i share the

emotions of the entire country that even after that well publicized case we're still here. >> so it's it's it's enraging that this could still happen when it's so easily preventable so easily preventable? i just don't understand it it is. >> i mean, what you're the anybody who is a parent. i think would find it hard to believe that a parent would make the choice to give their child a weapon for christmas after law enforcement has already been at the house questioning you and your son about threats that were made likely by by your own son in the case that you prosecutor, you talked about how egregious it was when you first got that case, was it clear to you from the get-go that this would be

something that should be brought and that charges should be brought it was clear to me from the instant i discovered while and ask the question like every other parent is asking, where does he get that gun and those answers lead to an instagram post bragging about the present and so many more details the visit to the school of concern that i mean, all of it. we don't let me to go over it again, but it was i it really just came from a place of this flies in the face of what we know is right and wrong. you shouldn't you shouldn't walk away from that after four children were killed and several others injured, and hundreds terrorize say well, it's just not a crime. it is a crime. and to juries agreed agreed with us on that didn't really think about what precedent it was setting. >> and candidly, anderson, i really i'm just as shocked if

nothing else you would have hoped. >> i would have hoped that at least the highly publicized details of this case would at least detour deter parents and make them think twice. and actually, i think it did. i really i do believe that's happened these are allegations. we don't know the facts. >> i i as a fellow prosecutor i i don't want to engage in opining about the right and wrong of the charge because we don't know the evidence and these are allegations but on the face of it, what we do know it's just, i have all these parents and people that have just reached out to me, continuing to reach out to me as i'm sitting here and just experiencing such trauma and sadness that this is this is happening and it's so it seems to be so similar to our case and yeah. it's hard why i know

you you believe that it has been in certainly hope that it will continue to be the prosecution that you did a you know, a wake for parents out there. this case, obviously should be the same carlos, i mean, whatever happens with these charges in particular, but but again time and time again, we've thought there'd be wake-up calls and there haven't been but karen mcdougal mcdonald's anderson. >> there's something we can do this is, you know, i started a foundation called all of us.org and we can prevent gun violence but it's not just one thing. and access to weapons, obviously, you know, it would have taken it's ten as i demonstrated in the closing argument and crumbley it takes us in ten seconds to install a cable lock, but there's a lot we can do to prevent gun violence. and we have to just stop waiting for another tragedy and then argue about access to guns. we really have

to approach it. what it is, which is a public health crisis. >> i just want to. >> lastly say on behalf of i know these parents and teachers and students that were reaching out to me are our hearts are with these victims and all the kids in that school we are here to help. we are here their support. >> and it's tragic. >> karen mcdonald. thank you very much as we're learning more about the investigation to yesterday's shooting, the community is remembering those who were killed. we want to take a moment to talk about them tonight we remember 14-year-old student nation at sherman. sherman horn also a 14-year-old student, christian and guler and guler, whose family described him as very good kid, very sweet and so caring christina, you remi was known to be very active in the local remain need community. one of her students remembering her as a real nice teacher, would like to tell a corny jokes and math teacher and

football coach, richard aspen wall, whose students have described him as a really sweet and a good guy. earlier, i spoke to matt tanner, one of richards close friends who said they were like brothers matt first of all, i'm so sorry that we're talking under these circumstances and i'm sorry for the loss of your friend. first of all, how are you how's everyone holding up? >> yeah. it's tough as you can imagine but we've we're very blessed with a group of a group of friends that we have. and we've been surrounded by those folks. and we've tried to be there for his family as well, so it's made it a little bit more manageable. >> can you just talk a little bit about coach jasmine? well, what what he was like. i understand you've known him for a long time yeah. >> we we met way back in middle school. we wait when you were kids in time, we met oh, yeah.

>> oh, yeah. >> we've he's like he's like a brother to me. we we met after football practice one day. i was a year old and he wasn't we were both outside by ourselves. everybody else had gone from practice back before cell phones and supervision rules and we're just sitting there. so that's how we met my dad showed up finally and i asked him if he wanted to ride. he said sure and all these years later, been best friends you were best man. you are each other's best man in your weddings, is that right? >> that's right. yeah. >> we were i mean, that's incredible to have known him since since since middle school. what was he like he always had a smile on his face he had a laugh that was contagious. >> i can remember one time in school over the announcements, it was either an hour how smithson were the or the morning news you remember news for you what it was called way back then and somebody looked a

video of him laughing. when he was in probably probably seventh grade or so and so if you ask you about that knows him about his laugh. it was contagious, it was full of life and it was just awesome he has two young daughters i read that he loved being a girl dad it sounds like he was a tremendous father yeah. >> he he loved those girls. >> he would do anything for on family was really big for him, really big to him. and, you know that most folks always want to find a way to be to leave it better than you found it and do better than was done for you. and he really took that to heart he. played with barbies. he do the hair. he'd sit the teacups he was on the floor. he was very very involved. a president, father in you know he's a. superhero to those girls. >> was he the same guy that you knew middle school who seem

that the same little inside the same kid he was in middle school absolutely. i think that's one reason why we got along so well is because we're kids. >> we always have been he didn't change. she's the same. he was saying that he brought people together just just his personality and who we use. our friend group today has been together about 20 years they all came through him pretty much and you helped them get his first coaching job. >> is that right i did what i graduated and took my first job. he was working at a store in town and i just asked him, i said, ain't man, i think i can get you on with us as a community coach and if it's something we want, you want to do? maybe we can find a way to make it a career and he was like, sure why not? so we moved from south georgia, the north georgia, and that's where it all started did you ever think something like this could happen in this community? no, i

don't think anybody ever does you don't think you don't think it will ever happen, especially don't think you're ever happened to you and you hope that it don't you pray that it don't you always feel for folks it does happen too, but he's i don't know. nobody deserves it, but man, he's the least deserving of all the folks that don't deserve it. you know what i mean? you just just hard to gold help anybody give the shirt off his back had had was passionate about everything that he did yeah man so but you gave his life saving the kids, man. so that i could i could see him doing that to him. the maps you i know a gofundme has been set up for his his kids for it for his family, for putting that up on the screen thank, you for talking with us. >> i'm just i'm just sticking by this and so sorry that we're talking under these circumstances, i wish you

continued peace in the days ahead yes, sir. >> thank you. anderson? >> as, we mentioned a go fund me was created to help richard aspinall's wife and two daughters. you can contribute by visiting the page on your screen, a gofundme.com forward slash f forward slash assist. shaina aspen wall in this difficult time we'll be right back we've never spoken, but you've told us many things that loves stargazing, hate parallel parking, and occasionally, your right foot gets a little heavy the lexus es didn't begin in the studio again with you you're seeing skechers, famous glide step, but where everywhere. and now that famous design is available, enhanced free sketches, slipping, get the comfort and style guides step call 187786 at 5:55 kamala

harris, donald trump, the debate. >> everyone's been waiting for follows. cnn for complete

coverage and exclusive pre and post-debate analysis. a cnn special event, the abc news presidential debate tuesday at nine eastern on cnn and streaming on max which got new information about the fundraising numbers. the vice president harris's campaign is expected to report for august a source telling cnn the final number will be more than double what the trump campaign already reported. the trump team instead, they took in $130 million last month. that information comes the same day that the former president delivered a speech before the economic club of new york, which was billed as his vision for the economy, keeping them honest, much of what he said involved either nostalgia for his first term in office are mirrored comments. we've heard in his previous campaigns, including to cut taxes as well as regulation missions without a lot of specifics. also lean heavily on the idea that tariffs can pay for trillion-dollar tax cuts. despite the fact that idea has alarmed many mainstream economists. no details on how he plans to get gasoline, quote, below $2 a gallon but the most interesting comment he

made today may have been his response to a very clear and concise question. on how to help americans afford the expense of childcare. it's an absolute word salad. here's just part of his answer can you commit to prioritizing legislation to make child care affordable in if so, what specific piece of legislation? >> will you advance? >> well, i would do that and we're sitting down. i was somebody we had senator marco rubio and my daughter, ivanka was so impactful on that issue. two very important issue. but i think when you talk about the kind of numbers that i'm talking about, that because childcare is childcare has couldn't you know this something you have to have it in this country, you have to have it but when you talk about those numbers compared to the kind of numbers that i'm talking about by taxing foreign nations at levels that they're not used to, but they'll get used to it very quickly. and

it's not going to stop them from doing business with us, but they'll have a very substantial tax when they send product into our country. those numbers are so much bigger than any numbers that we're talking about, including childcare that it's going to take care. we're going to have i look forward to having no deficits within a fairly short period of time so the question was on specific legislation for childcare. >> he actually went on for another 53 seconds with an answer, but you get the gist joining us now, jamal simmons, former communications director to vice president harris, alyssa farah griffin, former trump white house communications director and scott jennings, a former special assistant to president george w bush what did you make the economic speech today well, that specific answer was this unintelligible as any of the worst moments and the biden debate that afterward, many of us said joe biden should consider stepping aside. >> there was not a policy proposal. i think he was referring to extending the child tax credit when you're referred to as daughter, but couldn't remember what the specific policy was. and this is a very real issue to

american voters on if you're, you know, a couple that has kids, many parents choose to forego one kind of working because it's actually cheaper for one to stay home. you also have the sandwich generation where they're helping with their aging parents as well as dealing with their children and there was not a single answer offered. their so, you know, if this is the kind of message we should expect in the debate, i think the american public is going to realize he's really short on details and doesn't have a lot of answers. i imagine in his folks are putting some policy papers in front of him to try to clean up what he's trying to say there. >> scott, i mean, it's interesting to have a speech at this group his vision for the economy and yet, again so many of his supporters said they want to hear specifics. there's just there's just not a lot of specifics well, he wasn't crisp on that one specific issue. >> i'll admit, but he did lay out a series of things making his tax cuts that he passed in his term permanent. talked about terminating the inflation

reduction act, which by the way, joe biden admitted today they totally lied about how he admitted they should have called it a climate change bill. but he talked about terminating that and giving back unspent funds. he talked about cutting regulations. he talked about unleashing more domestic energy production. so he did give a speech today that gave you an idea of the kinds of economic principles that he would put in place but with a broad brush. they would improve the economy. it's easy with a broad bar brushed your malta's say as he did in 2016 on day one, i'm going to eliminate obamacare is going to be so easy and immediately we'll have something else that i mean, it's easy to say all this stuff. >> the devils in the details, it is. >> it's funny to me because they clearly have been trying i lay on the vice president this mans all that she's not serious than she certainly had some word-salad answers and of course, of course, you know, she's been on the campaign, which he's doing rallies and nobody is paying attention she's been putting policy out and people are getting it the trump campaign is trying to put

policy out, but it's just not really working because the candidate wants stay on so instead al gore calls that the key wants his policy back. >> he's put out this efficiency thing with elon musk, the head of the efficiency counsel would sounds a lot like al gore's reinventing government proposal back in 1993 that cut $100 billion on a government spending i think trump is recycling things because they just don't have anything new. and as we acting to what the harris campaign is doing, do you think i mean, listen, do you think that idea of you know, elon musk like overseeing the government does that appeal to voters? >> do you think? i don't know that it well, i can't speak different appeals to voters. i making say this, it's not going to happen. he's not going to go through an sf 86 process of background and check to disclose his assets and then go work in the federal government and have to give up certain investments. so it's kind of just something you say to target a certain segment of the voter population that loves elon musk. but donald trump is really throwing things at a wall to see what sticks it's much like this announcement

proclamation that he's going to make ivf either paid for by the federal government or he's going to force insurance companies to casual going to release the jfk files, which he also said he would release in 20 i remember sitting i remember sitting in the oval when he was discussing in 2020 releasing the jfk files and it never happened then this many of these things, by the way, that he talks about require acts of congress. we don't know what the makeup of congress is going to look like, but it's certainly won't be easy as we learned with repealing obamacare, he's got the first ballots in north carolina are supposed to start going out tomorrow. that may be delayed because requests from rfk jr. to have his name removed from the ballot if it's decided that his name remains on, do you think that could hurt trump in north carolina? because i mean, obviously rfk jr. is supporting trump and wants his followers to vote in the battleground states for trump yeah, i mean, obviously if a few thousand people choose that line on the ballot and the race is decided by a few thousand folks. >> yeah. i mean, i look i think all these states are going to be incredibly close. so any kind of things that happened with the valets, names on names

off could make a difference if i may just go back on the efficiency issue do you actually do think voters want to hear a president of the united states say, you know, maybe the federal government does need to be more efficient. maybe we do waste money. maybe it's too big, maybe we need to take a look top to bottom to see if we've been stacking bureaucracy on top of your accuracy for so long that we have no idea what's working. so i think as a matter of well, what will voters say to this? and i don't know if elon musk is it's going to run it are the right person or running or whatever, but they do believe they do believe that outsiders, business people, folks from the private sector might have something to say about how government could run more efficiently. it's one of the lawyers of trump in the first place, trump, the businessman. it's why they think he would be good at managing the economy. so i do think there's some appeal to a politically, but we've all been long enough to know that every person running for president has talked about waste and inefficiency. and that's how they're going to reduce the deficit that's how i mean, that's always been the throw line in debates have like, well, i'm going to, i'm going to be relentless on it also, the elon musk reference goes

back to 2016 when trump was talking about carl icahn, that carl icahn is going to be in the government and it's going to be all these business leaders and he reaches out to that, didn't really pan out. >> i mean, i'll just tell you al gore smith, five years from 1993 to 1998, a 2000 page report they collapse can remind 800 agencies aid to $100 i was in the 2000 campaign for hours it didn't work out very well, right? it wasn't that good american public just doesn't really care that much about that when they have real concerns for their own personalized, they want the president to address jamal simmons, alyssa farah griffin. thank you. scott jennings, always up next to cnn exclusive investigation and how a man simple call to the police to help find his missing father ended up with him accused of murder and on a psychiatric hold, a cnn investigation ahead. we'll be right back.

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>> hi. >> how are you guys getting by? >> great. me to give me call you back. >> you never want to lose your edge. >> this suv that really understands that the alexis rx i'm alayna treene traveling with the trump campaign. and this is cnn tonight a story, you'll only here on cnn, it's about a man named tom perez who called police for help. he thought his father was missing, but police came to believe he'd killed his father and what happens next is stunning cnn's shimon prokupecz has the story in august 2018, tom perez called fantastic california police to report his elderly father missing this is he is openly and with fonts on a police took it up, put them in the system right now is on the south arson but 36 hours later, perez was placed on a psychiatric hold for trying to to take his own life and the

fantastic police department had gone him to admit to a murder. he never committed i was now in they're a little box of horrors they're a little boxes, they call it perez has never publicly spoken about what happened until now to cnn. >> i felt like they were my captors and i had nothing there was nothing i could do detectives at the fun tana police department brought perez in for questioning over his missing father. >> he soon became their prime suspect. >> it's really concerning to me that he hasn't been back yet. >> they were convinced perez's father had been murdered at the home. the two shared police said perez appeared suspicious and they suspected a violent act based on broken furniture. that's some of his father's things were discarded. they also said they found some blood evidence inside the home. perez told police domestos from home

renovations and they were getting rid of things before selling it after searching the home police asked him to go to the station. that's when detectives turned a missing persons called into a 17. our interrogation to get a confession when they were not successful, they recruited perez's close friend to help remember him impassable when the friend who later said he regretted his involvement dating get a confession. >> the interrogators brought his pet dog margot, into the room. >> you killed it and he's dead and your dog sitting here looking at you knowing that you killed your dad. detective suggested that margot might need to be put down after witnessing such a traumatic

event. >> just wanted to hope let go then they took her out of room sometime after that felt like the end of the world for me well, up here i've never, ever seen a situation where the police bring a dog this size through the police department, they transport there walk us through the police department, bringing it into interrogation room and use it as a tool in order to seek a confession. it's unconscionable it's simply unconscionable throughout the interrogation, perez says he was suffering from mental health issues, but was denied medical help. >> bring me my doctor gave jamie, are you don't even go to the e.r in the footage cnn reviewed police lead a sleep deprived and exasperated perez into a confession. today but if

you did, where we just have my belly they got them to affirm suggestions they made to him like, well, you stab them okay. as the distraught, psychologically be in an overwhelmed with grief, perez says he tried to take his own life using his shoe lace. they attacked me right at the very things that i loved most my baby, my father and i just seemed like there's anything left eye could see the reason to continue with more pain but his father wasn't dead margo, i believe was following me police learned from perez's sister that their father was unharmed but perez remained in the interrogation room. where he learned that tom's father was alive and well and was at lax airport ready to take a flight to go visit his sister? they did of the nerve to look them in the face. then in the

nerve to tell him his dad's okay they let me in that mental anguish and just suffer it continually. police put him on a psychiatric hold at a hospital were days later, he finally learns his father is alive. >> young, younger nurse came over to my bedside and says, i know it's it does it says in your file that not to speak to anybody, any family members? but your dad's on the phone. i went what she handed the phone to me and i just dropped to the floor crying because he's five days of hell after he called the police for help, he is reunited with his father and he said that is that you is that really you? i said he yes. >> we had tears in her eyes seeking accountability for what he endured. >> perez filed a federal lawsuit against the city of phantasm. >> police officers are trained that they can engage in

deception. but when you go over the line you engaged in deceptive action that would cause an innocent person to confess to a crime they didn't commit. that. that's where the line is crossed. >> one of the detectives defended his actions in deposition video, exclusively obtained by cnn. >> i don't think that the police warn would say we did anything wrong. we were just attempting to get some information from it mr. peres. and then we're been with mr. perez all day and we're running out of things to say to them to try to get the answer about where his father was located. >> there was no indications that there has been an internal review and none of the officers involved have been disciplined. several have been promoted earlier this year, perez settled with the city for $900,000. the city issued a statement to cnn saying the settlement included no finding of wrongdoing. the city added that perez was not isolated as claimed he was given his medication and fed multiple times for perez and his father. the trauma continues no amount

of compensation will ever compensate me for what i went through ever shimon joins us now, what happened after press was released from the hospital? the investigation did an end. i mean, they were so convinced that something happened in that house that the police within an hour after mr. perez was released from the hospital, they went to a court and got a warrant, put a tracker on his vehicle, and his father was alive while there was a live, but they were for whatever reason, they were so convinced that something happened and they didn't give up for weeks. they kept investigating him. it's pretty crazy, right? allison, i mean, incredible story. >> shimon prokupecz. thank you so much. appreciate it. that's it for us. the news continues. i'll see you tomorrow. the source with kaitlan collins starts now cnn breaking news breaking news on the source tonight