message, cole. >> i have heard a lot of people today saying misogyny is the reason kamala harris lost. it is a real thing but it is not a good explanation of why she lost. we had over two dozen women governors in the country since 2000, half in red state. republicans have no problem voting for a woman governor. i think it is something that the democrat party alienated male voters. i think the democrats have to look into that. >> catherine, sorry to squeeze you, but real quick. >> i have something sillier i wanted to talk about, which is the list of things that a judge reprimanded rudy giuliani today for not handing over as part of his defamation judgment. it included his apartment in new york, his mercedes- benz, a bunch of sports memorabilia and 26 watches. why does this man need 26 watches? that's what i want to know. >> i don't know, but i'll take one. everyone, thank you very much. thank you for watching "news night. "

♪ ♪ tonight on "360" breaking news. president- elect trump names chief of staff making susie wiles to be the first woman to hold the title. what it may look like and mean for millions of people. elon musk, what does he do for a new trump administration and what does he get in return? we will talk to professor scott galloway and musk and the impact young men had on the election. good evening. we begin with his choice of chief of staff, susie wiles, to do what others had mixed success, and which cnn learns she put conditions on taking especially concerning access to the president or, in the source's word, the clown car can't come into the white house at will. that same source adding he agreed with her. in a statement announcing

his decision he said, she is tough, smart, universally admired and respected. susie will continue to work tirelessly to make america great again again. she had a job to do. in thanking her and fellow campaign official chris, he highlighted her preference for avoiding the spotlight. >> let me also express my tremendous appreciation for susie and chris. the job you did. susie. come, susie. come here, susie. chris. come here, chris. susie likes to stay sort of in the back, let me tell you. the ice maiden. we call her the ice maiden. >> well, susie wiles is the first of many people who will be chosen to serve in the second trump administration. critics and supporters alike say will differ from the first. something donald trump jr. underscored today while saying he would have a role in the selection process.

>> i'm going to be heavily involved on the transition. i want to make sure -- now that we know who the real players are, the people who will actually deliver on the president's message, the people who don't think that they know better than the duly elected president of the united states. >> he seems to indicate there will be more loyalists to carry out the promises trump made on the campaign trail. >> on day one i will launch the largest deportation program in american history. and if these companies don't make their products here then they will be paying a stiff tariff when they send their products into the united states for the privilege of competing competing our workers and our now protected companies. >> i will end the war in ukraine. >> i will stop the chaos in the middle east and i will prevent world war iii from happening. >> we will build a missile defense shield massively. we are going to build the greatest, the biggest

missile defense shield. >> bobby kennedy. robert f. kennedy jr. , rfk jr. and he is going to work -- and he is very strong, you know, on the pesticides and all of the different÷÷ things. >> we'll talk more tonight about how he plans to deliver on some of that and some of the repurchase repercussions if he does. first, kristen holmes, what should people know about susie wiles? >> susie wiles is a trump loyalists. she is one of the only people, anderson, who stuck by his side after he left washington in disgrace in 2021. she came to work with him and she stuck with him throughout the entire campaign. she served as de facto chief of staff after hishis u.s. term. i was there on election night when he threw a fit because -- this was in 2022, excuse me, because none of his candidates won. she was by his side then. she was by his side when he announced his candidacy shortly after warts and remained by his side. one of the important things to

point out is a quote that someone got about the clown car, because that's something she did and did well on the campaign. one of susie's mottos when talking to people close to her is she can't control donald trump and she understands that, but she can control everything around him. that means access to the former president, now president-elect. that's clearly something she is going to do in the white house. they believe she did this well. it was keeping controversial figures away from donald trump. obviously she couldn't always do it but it was trying to keep the chaos around him, who is a chaotic person, to a minimum. now, this is really setting the tone for the entire administration because it is clear that she is someone who is taken seriously in republican circles, particularly not just the maga side of things but also the establishment side. people respect susie wiles. so this is really giving you an indication of where this is going to go, but first and foremost, anderson, the thing he cares about most is the fact she was loyal to him.

>> and who are some of the other people being talked about for high- profile jobs? >> yeah, there's quite a long list here, and, again, i want to make sure we are being clear there will be a lot of lockieing and the positions will roll out. some might come as early as this week but the names are some being floated around. secretary of state, one big one, senator marco rubio. this has been floating around since he didn't get vice president. one thing to know, don junior, top adviser to donald trump, his father, lashed out at mark yo rubio. had some really nasty things to say when he was up for vice president so we'll see how it plays out. attorney general, which will be one of the most important positions in donald trump's administration because donald trump wants to control the justice department, ken paxton, the texas attorney general, on that list. mike lee also on the list. i want to add one we don't have on this one but it is john radcliff, former director of national intelligence. these are names floating around. elon musk is up for some kind of government efficiency advisor.

donald trump has joked about the fact elon musk won't join the government. he doesn't want to get rid of his properties or accounts, he doesn't want to divest. we are told it will be a workaround for elon musk in some kind of form of committee or advisor role. now, obviously robert f. kennedy jr. , someone very interested in that, a public health advisor likely. we will see how it plays out. we know rfk talked about potentially wanting to be a secretary. elise stefanik we are told has met with the transition team. this is moving fast. we will see what the next position is that he puts forward. >> kristen holmes. joining us david xelrod axelrod. david, what do you make for the pick for chief of staff? >> look, i said many times here during the course of

this campaign that donald trump -- you know, that the trump campaign, they had a rational campaign and irrational candidate, and she kept the campaign -- she and chris lasavida kept the campaign on track and to a large degree kept the clown car away. it is tougher in some ways in washington, but -- >> yeah, talk about that. i mean the role of the chief of staff, you saw this obviously in the white house yourself in the obama administration. there were in the last -- in the former trump administration, there were, you know, meetings with some of the -- >> well, my guess is one thing she will try to do is tightly control who goes into the oval office so people can't wander in and influence things without her knowledge, and that will be very important. i mean a chief of staff, if a chief of staff is empowered can be really, really important in terms of the paper flow to the president, the people that the president sees, the

decision tree. it can be very, very important, but i'll tell you this. chief of staff is very effective if the feeling around washington is that chief of staff has the confidence of the president. the fact that they've developed this close relationship, very important. >> michael, as a republican what do you think of the selection? >> i'm excited about it. i mean i have known of susie wiles for a very, very long time. there are people who are not necessarily pro trump but who are pro susie wiles because to them this signals that the second coming of a trump presidency will be very different. i mean she is a trusted thinker. she has several decades of political experience and she is one who can prioritize and manage an operation. david, you know this very well. that's going to be critical, to david's point, of controlling the flow of information and access to the former president. and having someone that he trusts who sort of set up the guardrails÷÷ will be critical to making sure that whatever times of judgment calls that are made the best advisers are getting to him first and not anyone else.

i feel confident about how it is shaping up so far. >> controlling though, i mean obviously donald trump is a unique figure in american politics, and given what we've seen the -- i mean there's only so much one can do i imagine. >> she obviously was doing something right because she has lasted a long time with him. the idea that she was as disciplined with him as possible, i mean i'm thinking about laura loomer who, you know, was with him during the 9/11 ceremonies, which was not a good look and she probably wasn't happy about that. one thing i want to focus on though is she is the first female chief of staff, which when i heard that today i was like, wow, like that has never happened before? the first thing i thought of actually after that was mark cuban owes her an apology for saying that donald trump was not surrounding himself with strong and smart women because obviously she's been able to hang on to this role as a smart, strong woman with donald trump this long. i did also like the fact that she's going to keep the cologne car out. i think donald trump

is influenced by the last person he so that's really important. i also thought about the fact he brought in corey lewandowski this past summer and i'm sure she didn't like that as well, because the talk at that time was maybe she will be on the way out and corey lewandowski will be higher up. i think it is a well- deserved for her. >> you follow the campaign very well? >> i think for me it will be interesting to see voter reaction to this. i think voters are less concerned about who exactly are the people that will be executing the policy. what they want to see is donald trump come into office on day one and do the things he promised he would do. a lot of the things are lofty, ambitious plans. to execute the largest mass deportation effort in u.s. history will require a lot of coordination. we know from extensive reporting behind the scenes trump allies have been planning for this for a while. it is a question of watching him set up things in the next

few month to be able to implement things on day one. >> in terms of selecting people, david, in a new administration, what is that process generally like? you know, they have an advantage this time, they've done it before so they know what mistakes they made the last time. >> and obviously a lot of people have been thinking about this and they've had a process going on. >> and loyalty seems to be top of the list. >> what happened last time was they had a transition team, and chris christie was heading that transition team. he had differences or jared kushner had differences with him and took his transition report and threw it in the garbage. obviously this is a little more orderly, and now that she is empowered as the chief of staff you would think that she is going to play an even larger role in this. one thing we should mention, this will mean nothing to you, anderson, but a lot of people will know this. pat summer all was her father, who was a great football player and kicker and broadcaster. so she as been around blocking and tackling all her life. that will

be useful. >> is it -- you know, i'm know you heard donald trump jr. saying he would be involved in looking over the vetting and hiring process. loyalty, they feel they had people around the president, then president trump the last time who were trying to kind of control his impulses. it seems like they don't want that same type of person around. >> i think susie wiles is going to try to do a little bit of that. look, he is the president. you want individuals who will serve the president and serve him well. i was part of the transition team in 2016 when dr. carson went to hud. i'm familiar with that process. you have some good people. you have some not-so- good people i suppose. i have a feeling looking at some of the names we've seen suggested for some of the key roles, this is going to be different. you saw sabrina talk about the mass immigration. how are you going to execute that? you need people that will be able to do it and do it well. what is that going to look like? who are you choosing?

there are a lot of complexities there, and i think if you are looking at this from trump's perspective, looking at the first 60 to 90 days, not only immigration but the economy. what is that going to look like? what will be the focus there. it is not necessarily about finding people uber loyal to the president, but loyal to bringing to fruition his ideas for the american people. >> and i think that this time around, you know, he's going to win the popular vote, and so i think that he feels like his mandate, he has more power in his mandate, thinking that a majority of the american citizens want him to do what he campaigned on. whether or not that's true to the 46 other percent that didn't vote for him, that's another story. but i think he is going to take control in a different way this time. he didn't understand washington, d.c. when he came in in 2016 so he brought in people who understood it better than he did he clashed with a lot of those people. >> it is interesting, sabrina, to see what role vice president vance will have in

this administration. obviously when you are running you see the vice president out campaigning a lot, as we saw when biden took office, vice president harris sort of disappeared from public view for a long time. >> yeah, i think it is an open question at this point how involved vance is going to be or what exactly donald trump will want to see him doing. i mean if it is going to be having vance out touting, you know, what trump is doing in those first days and really being a cheerleader for donald trump, i think we'll see some of j.d. vance. if j.d. vance goes off script and gives some different messaging around how things will be executed, i think he will be in a more behind-the- scenes role and sort of what we expect from vice presidents often. the new planning under way to implement the president- elect's mass deportation promise. also, he promised to investigate political rivals, and the knierim munity that the supreme court gave him, does that add

up to the threat to the rule of law? we will look at that next.

mother breaking news tonight. federal judge struck down the biden administration's policy of giving legal status to certain undocumented indndividuals married to u.s. citizens. this comes as multiple sources tell cnn the trump

transition team along with some in the private sector are prepared to carry out trump's promise for mass deportation. joining us for more on what it might entail, what would mass deportation look like? >> anderson, that hasn't been anything like mass deportation in recent memory because it is so challenging to do with limited federal resources that there are. but donald trump has said no doubt that his first order of business is mass deportation. there's a key difference from his 2016 campaign which was focused on the border and the border wall and it comes against the backdrop, of course, of the last few years of border crises under the biden administration, which resulted in criticism of this administration from republicans and democrats. now, i have been talking to homeland security officials over the last several days, and they are preparing for seismic change in immigration policy. they are no strangers to

the whiplash. remember that when president joe biden took office he reversed the trump administration policies and now the same homeland security officials are anticipating the return of the policies. in talking to them they tell me it is a mixed bag of emotions. some are shell shocked by the election results while others are more optimistic and hopeful, wanting a stronger posture on the u.s. southern border, but it speaks to the reality of the situation, anderson, which is that immigration policy has been dictated by executive action which÷÷which in the whiplash from one administration to the next. now it is paving the way for these mass deportation plans that donald trump has promised repeatedly on the trail. >> so how difficult could it be to put this into motion? >> well, there's a lot of moving parts. what i am being told by sources is that even before election day trump allies and some in the private sector were preparing for detaining and deporting migrants on a large scale. i mentioned the private sector because the federal

government largely leans on contractors to manage facilities. so they need them to do this type of work mostly because there are very few federally owned facilities, and that's the key element of all of this. detention. you cannot mass deport without mass detention. if you arrest someone they need to be detained somewhere billion they are repatriated to their home country. that's a key element of this and that requires money. earlier donald trump said there's no price tag to mass deportation. there is however. in fact, for one undocumented immigrant to be apprehended, detained, processed and removed, that's nearly $11,000. that's just for one individual. add that up, you are looking at millions if not billions of dollars. now, the department of homeland security has previously moved money around to try to shore up funds for more detention space. i have spoken to officials who say it would have to be so much more than what they can do right now with the money that they have. so that's part of it. they also need more personnel and, of course,

anderson, there's an element of diplomacy here. there needs to be agreements with countries if you are sending people back. certainly a lot at work here. what i'm told by sources is that this is being discussed and there are preparations ongoing to try to execute on thisthis as soon as donald trump takes office. >> all right. thank you very much. back now with the panel. david, i mean you went through this with the obama administration early on. there were deportations. what are the difficulties? how do you see the trump promises being met? >> well, but those are -- priscilla lafd them priscilla laid them out. it is a very involved process to deport people. you know, one of the questions i have is whatever deportations donald trump has, he will say is the largest mass deportation in history. what that number actually turns out to be is another question because in addition to all of the expenses of deporting people, you know, there's a

disruptive element. if you were really to engage in mass deportations in this country, there are economic implications of that. there are diplomatic implications of that. there are all kinds of implications of these decisions. >> there's also -- i mean there's people who are in prison serving sentences. >> yes. >> they are not deported until they finish serving those sentences. i mean it is complicated. you get -- if you are looking to deport a million people, it is not all people who have committed crimes. >> right. >> it is people who are married to an american citizen but they don't have citizenship. >> yeah. i mean, you know, people in this country are frustrated about what happened at the border. they're frustrated about people who jump -- who break the law to come into the country, and he was speaking to that in the course of the campaign. living up to the words, which were really meant to

provoke, actually implementing them as a policy, far more complicated. >> i dug up the numbers. 11 million undocumented immigrants in 2022. trump says there's more. $315 billion to deport them. you don't have the manpower to do that. >> yes. >> you would have to get the national guard out there, which he may do, but you are also talking about huge employers who are not going to necessarily be happy with this because these are the workers that are working for them. so suddenly in the hospitality industry, for example, in las vegas or other big cities, they potentially would lose all of those workers. so you are going to have the influence of these ceos coming to trump now that he is elected and saying, i don't know, maybe not so fast. there are tons of implications as david is pointing out. >> sabrina, you attended a lot of rallies where it was talked about a lot? >> this was the number one talking point. some of the loudest cheers you would hear in each of his rallies was when he was denigrating undocumented immigrants that have come in recent years and him making

this promise repeatedly throughout his rallies. i think what is interesting is from talking to voters, i mean a chunk of the people who voted for donald trump don't actually believe he is going to deport every single immigrant. there is an expectation, a belief he is going to focus on criminals, that he is going to focus on people who have come in the last four years under the biden administration. there's going to be distinctions made on who exactly gets deported, and a lot of people -- so a lot of people are not necessarily expecting on day one he is going to start, you know, rounding up people, and a lot of people don't actually believe the concept of, oh, there are going to be camps, you know, to help transition people in the process of deportation. i think there's a real question of how it will be executed and i think that for some of the people who voted for donald trump there's certainly going to be a grace period of them trying to see how exactly he navigates it. >> shermichael, is it as david said you call it mass deportations and it is not actually mass deportations? >> he has to address it. i think our immigration laws have been modified in such a

way that leads to an influx of illegal immigrants, thus low- skilled workers who compete against a lot of americans who would typically fulfill those jobs. i think some could also argue that they do put some, i guess, extremities on already existing limitations of social programs in many cities across the country, whether it is housing, health care and other things. so i think the mandate on the former president will be -- or president-elect will be to address this in some capacity. does it appear to be legislation? does that appear to be removing some individuals that they would say, well, these individuals have created heinous acts against americans therefore we are going to deport them? you need to have some of this in order to fulfill that desire for people who voted for him. >> david, it wasn't just a tag line that he -- i remember at the convention there were printed signs that they passed out to everybody at the convention saying mass deportations. is it enough if he throws out some people who have, you know, committed crimes, served

their prison sentence and makes a big deal of throwing them out? or if it gets into separating families, that's a whole other level. i'm not sure people are prepared for. >> i think donald trump, and sabrina can speak to this, you know, this is an applause line for him. i'm not questioning that he does -- i mean most americans believe the border needs to be secure and people shouldn't flow in here illegally, but it played well. i think that that was why he said what he said. if aspects of this starts not to play well, i think he will pull back from it. he's not going to want to go to places that will create problems, political problems for him. one thing we should mention though in addition to everything that gretchen said, the strain it would put on local law enforcement. so it kind of conflicts with another goal of his, which is the notion he is going to somehow impact on crime, which has been coming down

anyway by the way, but he is going to impact -- and i think local law enforcement around the country are going to have some feelings if they're going to be drawn into this. >> the only thing i would add to that though is that poll after poll showed that the majority of americans, whether or not it was a tag line or just to get people thinking about it and riled up, the majority of americans agreed with mass deportation. >> and as a concept. >> as a concept, yes. >> but if it means, you know, all of these restaurants and hotels -- >> they weren't thinking that through. >> there also wasn't a compelling argument on the other side. we did an analysis on the amount of ad spending. the trump campaign republican groups spent $233 million since kamala harris joined the race on immigration- related ads. democrats on the other side of this spent $15 million. let's just think about those numbers. so the american people were repeatedly hearing about a crisis on the border, about, you know, fear- based messaging about how bad it was, all of the immigrants that have come in the last four years. on the democratic side it

was not something that kamala harris was leaning in on, on immigration. democrats have struggled to talk about this issue in these years since the biden administration came into office. so that's part of it, is, you know, you are listening to one person offer a solution and that's the one that a lot of people went with. >> but the mandate is to redress this grievance from a lot of his voters. i'm looking at it in two ways. you have to address those who committed heinous acts and you also have to address it is an issue as rear pains to low- skill workers and repetitiveness. if you can do that, that's will take care of it in my book. >> just ahead, the president- elect suggested prosecuting high- level democrats and called some the enemy from within. the question is what will the department of justice look like in his second administration. someone who knows his wrath, deputy director andrew mccabe joins us next.

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military should be used against the, quote, enemy from within. days later he called adam schiff and nancy pelosi each an enemy from within. also over the course of a few days in june he said this in two sit- down interviews. >> well, revenge does take time, i will say that. >> it does. >> and sometimes revenge can be justified. i have to be honest here. >> on no -- >> sometimes it can. >> those who want people to believe that you want retribution, that you will use the system of justice to go after your political enemies. >> number one, they're wrong. it has to stop, otherwise we're not going to have a country. look, when this election is over, based on what they've done, i would have every right to go after them, and it is easy because it is joe biden and you see all of the criminality. >> former fbi deputy director andrew mccabe fired hours before

his retirement. mccabe filed a lawsuit claiming it was politically motivated. andrew, what do you think the rule of law will look like in the second trump term? >> i think it is going to look very different, anderson. i think that the entire administration of the justice department, the leadership in the department, the way they think about their mission, all of these things could be fundamentally changed in ways that we haven't seen since the imposition of the civil service regime so many years ago. i think the chief bellwether, what do look for first in terms of those things, will be whether or not the president goes back to his plans with schedule f. so basically, signing an executive order that would change the nature of all of the high level and mid level leadership positions in the department in the fbi to political positions.

so jobs that could be held by political, you know, flunkies and hacks. >> explain why that would be such a big deal. >> if he does that. >> because of sounds granular. people may not understand what that might mean. >> yeah, sure. those positions right now are protected federal government positions and people in them have the protections of the system. they can't be fired for political reasons and things like that. if you change that kind of position description to some -- to one that could be filled by a political -- someone appointed at the will of the president rather than someone who has come up through the meritocracy, you completely shift the nature of the leadership of these organizations. they will be filled by people who are there to follow the will of the president and the administration rather than to make decisions based on the facts and the law, which is what the department does today. so i think that shift will be seismic if, in fact,

he follows through on that plan. >> some in the trump world refer to it as the deep state. others say they are civil service who have institutional knowledge, who have been there for years and built up a skill set as opposed to somebody who is just coming in based on a political basis. how important will trump's choice for attorney general be? >> critical. critical, right. so you have -- we have enjoyed attorneys general, whether you like them or not personally, our attorneys general since the nixon era have been committed to this idea that the department should act independently when it comes to making decisions about investigations and prosecutions. despite what you have heard in the campaign rhetoric and all of the other stuff, the department doesn't decide who to prosecute and investigate based on what the president tells them. that will all change if you if the department is led entirely by people who owe their jobs and their careers to the president and not to the organization itself. so, yeah, if you have one

who takes over the department, who is open about the fact he is there to do what the president tells him, the implications for that on individual cases and prosecutions, people who are affected by those actions, are enormous, enormous. in fact, it sets a tone for the department where people will be afraid to stand up and take independent action, to push back against politics when the facts and the law don't call for that sort of action. those people might very well be afraid of standing up for the facts and the law when they're afraid of losing their jobs to the political folks that they report to. >> do you think he is going to follow through on sort of the vengeance talk? >> i think we have every reason to believe he will, anderson. i mean he has said it, as your introductory piece made very clear. he has made his intent, as we saw in the criminal investigative business, very clear, and the conditions within which he will be operating are very different than those

he faced in 2016. he's not going to have people around him who are committed to kind of keeping him within the guardrails and telling him what is unlawful or inappropriate. he will be surrounded by mostly political sycophants who are there to facilitate whatever it is that he wants to do. he is not running for reelection ever, so he's not constrained by that. of course, the supreme court has bestowed him with essentially complete immunity. everything he tells the department to do comes within the immunity and he essentially can't be held accountable for those statements or actions. >> andrew mccabe, appreciate your time tonight. up next, elections have consequences on the country and the party that loses. the question where do democrats go from here. david axelrod and mike murphy join me next.

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day after democrats lost the white house, ver monsen tore bernie sanders offered this diagnosis on social media. it should come as no surprise that the democratic party that abandoned working class people would find the working class abandoned them. the party chairman responded, this is bs. biden was the most pro- worker president of my

lifetime. some of the examples of recriminations going on right now. david axelrod is back and michael murphy is here. david, first of all, what do you make of the back and forth between sanders and the head of the democratic party and also where should democrats be pointing the finger? >> well, you have heard me over the last few days. i do have concerns about the way the democratic party has -- relates to working class voters in this country. the only group that democrats gained with in the election on tuesday was white college graduates, and among working class voters there was, you know, a significant decline. the only group they won among were -- democrats won among were people who make more than $100,000 a year. you can't win national elections that way and it certainly shouldn't be that way for a party that fashions itself as the party of working people. so i think he has a point. mike knows this because we've been

talking about it. you can't approach working people like missionaries and say we're here to help you become more like us. there's a kind of unspoken disdain, unintended disdain in that. i think biden has done, you know, programmatic at least things for working people, but the party itself has increasingly become a smarty- pants, suburban college- educated party. it lends itself to the kind of backlash we have seen. >> mike, where do you put the blame in terms of the democrats? >> well, yeah, they do have a problem with working class voters. trump's populism, like it or not, has been an effective magnet. if you look at exit polls they won college educated white people, the democrats did, by single digits. trump blew away among non- college educated white people by 30 points. so you can't have a lopsided deal like that. part of it is cultural.

the democrats need to step back. there will be a need to analyze the bumper stickers and kamala should have gone somewhere. i don't think a great one -- >> you think even the greatest run campaign wouldn't have worked? >> yeah, i think the truth is technically i think the harris campaign was still stronger than the trump campaign, but trump had what i was calling the 100- mile wall of lava behind him. people wanted to fire everybody connected to the democratic party based on inflation and immigration. so, you know, what they need to do is back up and look at how do they make a case to these workers, how do they fix the democrat woke liberal wine-and- cheese brand? how do they get ready for the mid terms because that's the next big contest. 5 percent more of what they're doing now, a tweak here and there isn't going to cut it. they need a hard- headed look at why they can't connect to

people who don't have a college degree. >> i don't necessarily agree on one point, which is that the -- that the trump campaign didn't run a good campaign. they had an easier campaign to run. they just needed to say over and over and over again, "she was joe biden's vice president, she was responsible for these policies, and she is going to continue these policies." >> in past defeats, i mean how do parties change? i mean whether it is republicans or democrats, you have talked before about, you know, bill clinton came out of kind of a turn inward where governors, democratic governors around the country got together and started -- >> listen, mike murphy was part -- he was one of the mischief mischievous fellows behind the reagan conversion of democratic voters in the '80s, and democrats had to consider how have we drifted away from our base. there are these periods of renewal, but they require you

to think deeply. not to lash out, but to think deeply about what are we missing why aren't we connecting. you afford voters the respect of listening to what they're saying. governors understand that better than people who live in washington, d.c. most of the time, and there are a lot of very strong and successful democratic governors. look, in pennsylvania josh shapiro has really a lot of support in rural areas, in small towns, and he's -- and he has articulated positions such as state jobs for people who don't necessarily have a college degree but are qualified to do them, and he has broken through. so there is going to be an effort to try to think this through i believe. >> mike, do you think it is -- yeah, how do you see it? >> yeah, there has to be an effort, but the problem is -- and this will be the battle, is the moderate democrats will say, well, it is obvious we

need to be more moderate. the progressives will say, we lost because we weren't committed. i call it the fight between the mathematicians and the priest. the mathematicians say look at voters with high school education, look at blue collar workers. then the priests come in and say, it is faith, shout the gospel louder, go to the left. you know, they've got a fight on their hands, and i can't tell you how it is going to turn out. i'm a mathematician. i think the numbers are pretty clear. i think david knows exactly what needs to happen, but you have to look at the internal incentives within the party where ideological interest groups have a lot of power. i think axelrod is right. look to the governors, those outside of the dc hatfield and mccoy thing and operate with creativity. >> thanks so much. still ahead, what elon musk does in a new administration and what he gets in return.

professor scott hallow olloway joins us to talk about musk.

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returnsreturns super pac spent millions of dollars on the campaign. the president- elect gave his victory speech yesterday morning. >> who did you say? oh, let me see. we have a new star. a star is born. elon. >> the president- elect hailing elon musk. perspective from scott holloway, professor of marketing from the sterns school of business. in terms of elon musk how much influence do you think he will have in this administration? >> i think he will have real influence. mostly on his own companies. i don't know if he has the time or inclination to get involved in real kind of government reform, but i think he will have a pretty heavy hand when it comes to regulation. >> you said before the election something that i think's really pressing and important. he said this election will be decided on who presents a more aspirational vision of

masculinity. donald trump doubled down on young men, real owe focused on reaching out. elon musk, i guess you could see as sort of part of that. but could you talk about that idea of who presents a more aspirational vision of masculinity and why it is so important? >> yeah, everyone thought this election would be a referendum on women's rights. i would argue it was a ren referendum on who presented more aspirational masculinity. elon musk is sending satellites into space, building cars, magnificently wealthy, entertaining. i would say he is the most aspirational role model for young men globally, even if you think it is healthy or not. in addition, the right embraced the manosphere. i would argue it was the manosphere. he went on joe rogue an, election friedman, basically

the manosphere podcasts. the joe rogue an interview of donald trump got 40 million views on youtube, approximately 15 million down loads. that's 55 million people saw donald trump for three hours. that's more people or about the same number of people that watched the entire world series. if you were to try to get that same audience on cable television you would have to go on this and every other primetime cable network for two weeks. it was not only the manosphere but the podcast election. going on this progressive, i'll put money in your pocket, get you out of your parents' house, i'm all about the economy, i'm not worried about social justice issues, i'm a little irreverent and provocative, boy, it resonated. simply put, i would argue it was more of the testosterone election than it was a referendum on bodily autonomy for women. >> you are saying this, by the way, as someone who

publicly endorsed harris. you were critical of the campaign of the democrats' efforts, if there were, to specifically reach out to young men. >> well, anderson you were at the convention. there was a parade of every special interest group. there were no young men. there was no acknowledgement of the group that has fallen further faster than any group in american history over the last 20 years, and that's young men. more single women own homes than single men. women are making more money in urban centers under the age of 30, which i think is fantastic, but here are grim statistics. young men are four more times to kill themselves. only one in three men under the age of 30 is in a relationship. one in three live at home. whereas two out of three women are in a relationship. what do you have? a bunch of men not engaging in work. not engaging in relationships. not engaging in school.

them and their parents feel it. if you look at the polling results, the group that swank most aggressively toward trump other than latten men was young people 18 to 29. the second biggest demographic by age that swung towards trump was people age 45 to 64. my thesis is that that is their parents. social justice issues and what is going on in ukraine take a backseat when your son is in the basement vaping and playing video games and can't find a job. >> and yet you've pointed out that you believe in the trump administration it is likely there would be a tax increase for young men. >> the harris campaign was unable to expose a basic economic truth, and that is deficits, which have been bad under the biden administration but under the trump administration versus the harris economic plan the deficits are going to be triple. it is great for you and me, anderson, because we own homes and we own stocks, and

the stimulus of that deficit spending will take the value of our stocks and our real estate up. but our kids are going to have to pay that back at some point, and they're facing inflation, impossibly mortgage rates of 15% to 20%. all deficits do is take the credit card of youth, run it such that we can have champagne and cocaine in the club. deficits are nothing but delayed taxes on the young. the harris campaign was not able to square that circle for young people. the largest tax increase in history is about to happen vis-a- vis a massive increase in deficits from donald trump. >> i know you were speaking cnn this morning. >> susie