18% believe that they would lower prices, 23% say no effect. so the bottom line is the folks are tuned in to what tariffs will actually do to prices, even so, they believe that new tariffs are a good idea. >> all right. and that's important right. you can't you can't say that that people don't know. they know and they support it. so informed all right before we go harry, tell me something i don't know. >> how am i supposed to tell you something that you don't know about? you know far more about tariffs than i do. but i went to google, and this is so interesting. so i looked at how many people were searching on google for tariffs. we have reached a 20 year high in november of 2024 compared to the 20 year average. look at that rise up nearly 1,200%. so the bottom line is you may think that tariffs are a bore if you're out there. but the american people think tariffs are quite hot at this point. >> wow i mean that's that's a huge increase. and it's not just off a small base. it's a 20 year high correct. wow all right. thank you so much harry. thank you

fire deal between israel and hezbollah is set to go into effect in 60 minutes. will it hold? we head live to israel for the latest on the ground. and later, an angry outburst in court today from rudy giuliani over the nearly $150 million he owes to georgia election workers. also tonight is corporate america turning its back on dui policies. we will discuss why walmart and others are trying to roll back more than just prices. good evening, john berman here in for anderson. the breaking news one hour from now, a cease fire to end more than two months of fighting between israel and hezbollah is supposed to take effect. thousands have been killed, hundreds of thousands displaced. and it's all supposed to stop in 60 minutes. the deal came together today after one of the most intense israeli strikes yet around lebanon's capital beirut. at least 25 people were reportedly killed. president biden

announced the deal from the rose garden this afternoon. he says it is designed to be permanent. israel and hezbollah will have 60 days to withdraw from the fighting area. the president said he hopes the deal puts pressure on hamas. now to make a deal as well just as the lebanese people deserve a future of security and prosperity. >> so do the people of gaza. they too deserve an end to the fighting and displacement. the people of gaza have been through hell over the coming days. the united states will make another push with turkey. egypt qatar, israel and others to achieve a ceasefire in gaza. with the hostages released at the end of the war without hamas in power, that becomes possible all right, our jeremy diamond joins us now from northern israel. >> jeremy, what do we know about the terms of this agreement well, listen, john, after 14 months of cross-border attacks between israel and

hezbollah that intensified into an all out war over the last two months, we are finally expecting to see a ceasefire go into effect between israel and hezbollah. >> 60 days. initially, in order to implement the terms of this agreement that means israeli forces, which have been on the ground in southern lebanon for the better part of the last two months. now withdrawing from that area. hezbollah forces set to withdraw north of the litani river, some 20 miles north of the israel-lebanon border, and the lebanese military, now moving into those areas in order to monitor any ceasefire violations going forward. the united states is set to now lead a monitoring committee alongside france and other countries to ensure that neither side is violating terms of the agreement and to enforce effectively this agreement. israel, though, is saying that it will maintain the ability to act of its own volition to enforce this agreement, to enforce any violations of

hezbollah, to this agreement in southern lebanon. the united states and israel supposedly have a side agreement that discusses that president biden would only say that israel has the right to self-defense, but the israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu, is far more adamant about israel maintaining unilateral ability to strike against hezbollah. >> jeremy, how are people where you are in northern israel right now reacting to this deal well, there has been a mixed reaction, but certainly those in israel's northernmost communities that have been the target of not only rockets and drones, but also anti-tank ballistic missiles that have a range of about ten kilometers, they are upset tonight. >> they do not feel like the israeli military has accomplished enough against hezbollah. they would have liked to see israel establish some kind of a buffer zone in southern lebanon. i spoke with the mayor of kiryat shmona, one of those communities that has been devastated by those rockets, missiles and rockets. drones and anti-tank missiles.

and he told me that he met with the israeli prime minister tonight alongside other mayors from those northern communities. and he left frustrated. he left feeling like the israeli prime minister did not was not able to convince him of the security of his community. following this agreement. but he is going to see, you know, what it will take for residents of those communities to return, not only from a security aspect, but also, of course, a lot of the rebuilding that will have to be done there. all right, jeremy diamond, stand by for a moment. >> i want to bring in cnn political and foreign policy analyst barak ravid. barak, thank you so much for being with us. what was it in your reporting that got this security agreement over the finish line well i think there are many factors and if you, you know, if you take all the, you know, nitty gritty and you look at the big picture i think that mainly on the israeli side, there was an understanding both in the idf and the military and in the

political echelon and especially prime minister netanyahu, that any additional day in lebanon will just mean that israel will get bogged down there without any real reason and without any real benefits, and with getting more and more casualties every day. >> and i think that that that was the bottom line that's what led netanyahu to take this decision. >> so you heard president biden, barak say that he wants this ceasefire to be permanent. in your mind and in your reporting, how long is it reasonable to expect it to last? and what are the potential pitfalls well, look john, let's go back to 2006. >> the second lebanon war ended with a deal that, to be honest is more or less like this one. and the ceasefire lasted something like 17 years. there were some incidents here and there, but mostly it was quiet. 17 years is quite a long time.

it doesn't mean that this will be the same in this case, especially that the israeli prime minister says that he will enforce this cease fire with israeli military action if needed this means that if in two days or two weeks or two months, israel sees any violation from hezbollah, it will act. this will mean in my opinion, that hezbollah will fire back, and then this whole cease fire will collapse this is why i think a a i'm not sure hezbollah will be will violate this deal. so easily. and and b i don't see netanyahu rushing towards a renewal of the, of the fighting in the north especially when we know that donald trump is about to assume office in less than two months. and donald trump said that he wants to end wars, not start new ones. this is why i think netanyahu this is another reason why netanyahu had the incentive to cut this deal. >> now, jeremy, you mentioned

it also what barack was just talking about. the fact that netanyahu says that israel will maintain full military freedom of action. what is your reporting tell you about what it would take for israel to use that well, look, the israeli prime minister made very clear that this cease fire in lebanon is only going to last as long as the conditions on the ground allow for it and that is to say that he is i mean first of all, it's a political message. >> we have to acknowledge that he has been facing. so much criticism today from right wing members of his own government. some people outside of his government, even to the left of him, and also, of course, from these mayors that i was talking about, from those northern communities. and so on the one hand, he's trying to assuage those criticisms by insisting that israel will still be tough, will still have the ability to carry out these strikes. i think it's very clear that israel will maintain that ability operationally and i am told that israel did get

some assurances from the united states in this side letter between the assurances, i was t they probably would not have moved forward with this agreement, both because it was needed from a political perspective here in israel and also, of course, from an operational one on the ground. >> and barack, president biden said he wants to see now a deal with hamas or hopes for a ceasefire with hamas. does this make that more likely? i know there are so many in israel who would like to see a return of the hostages well, you know, president biden is a man of faith faith is important on on this issue. >> and he also to his credit, put a lot of effort into trying to get this gaza hostage deal but i think that it is still very unlikely that we will see such a deal before january 20th. i would be surprised. i would be highly surprised. mainly because the basic terms

haven't changed and this means that hamas wants to know that if he if it cuts a hostage deal with israel, this means the end of the war and withdrawal of israeli forces from gaza and prime minister netanyahu still refuses that. so it is possible. i can see a scenario where maybe they can get the first phase of this deal meaning a release of a dozen or two dozen hostages in return for 40 or 42 days of ceasefire. but even for that to happen, hamas will have to move and netanyahu will have to move and i'm not sure both sides are willing to do it in the next two months. >> all right barak ravid, jeremy diamond in israel, thank you both. so much. now to russia's war in ukraine. one night after russia launched what ukrainian officials say were a record number of drone attacks, russia says ukraine recently carried out two more strikes on russian soil using those longer range u.s.

supplied missiles kyiv hopes can now give it an edge in the war. our fred pleitgen has more from moscow moscow for the first time, acknowledging the effectiveness of ukraine's use of u.s. >> supplied missiles to hit targets inside russia admitting atacms struck a radar and an airfield showing photos of fragments they claim come from the american rockets kremlin controlled tv ripping into u.s. and british officials lobbying to give ukraine more firepower these same people are then sincerely outraged that putin is preparing to strike an american air defense base in poland. and not only there, the host says. the kremlin says it's trying to send a very clear message to the west if the u.s. and its allies continue to give ukraine longer distance weapons and allow kyiv to fire those weapons deep inside russian territory the west is playing with fire and that message is playing on

repeat across russia. since vladimir putin ordered a strike against ukraine with a new type of intermediate range ballistic missile called oreshnik missile state tv showing behind the scenes footage of putin after a televised statement announcing the launch last week, the russian leader saying i think it's clear and understandable enough and if it wasn't clear enough, a russian lawmaker showed up to parliament in a putin t-shirt and the oreshnik missile launching a reznik is the russian word for hazelnut tree the writing on the shirt means tough nut perhaps after oresnik was put to work, they scratched their heads and understood that they need to listen and hear what our president says. the lawmaker says he never throws words into the wind. he warns with ukraine's army on the back foot struggling against overpowering russian forces on several fronts. moscow accuses the biden administration of escalating the conflict in the

final days before donald trump takes over the countries of the western bloc are suffering a fiasco in the conflict in ukraine, but at the same time, we believe they won't calm down russia's foreign spy chief says they'll act as usual and will try to create chaos on the territories of our allied states and chaos in the russian federation. and u.s. missiles fired at russia. the kremlin says, will make it harder for the incoming trump administration to end the ukraine war. and john of course, president-elect trump and some of his cabinet picks have said that they want to try and end the ukraine war as fast as possible. however, today a senior aide to russian president vladimir putin came out and said to his knowledge, so far there have been no contacts between russia and the trump team. john. >> all right fred pleitgen, thank you very much. still to come tonight an angry, defiant rudy giuliani with a list of grievances. but not nearly the $150 million he owes to georgia

poll workers. the latest on a heated day in federal court for the president elect's onetime attorney. plus, a kentucky man was in the or about to have his organs harvested. but he was alive and eventually left the hospital. and now a major investigation is underway. the report from our doctor, sanjay gupta, coming up supersize the celebration of america's favorite holiday spend thanksgiving morning with cnn with live coverage of parades around the country and special guest appearances by chef bobby flay. >> the property brothers, drew scott, the temptations, t.i. the inside the nba crew andy grammer, and more john berman and erica hill host cnn. thanksgiving in america live coverage starts at 8:00 on cnn how do you sleep at night on a mattress from mattress firm? >> so i sleep all night long.

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defamation suit against him. kara scannell was at the court today and joins us now with more all right. so kara, what did rudy giuliani have to say in court today? >> so this was the hearing to try to enforce that nearly $150 million judgment. and the judge was chiding giuliani because he hasn't complied with all the deadlines. he hasn't turned over or said where this signed joe dimaggio shirt is. and also that 1980 mercedes. giuliani gave it to the women along with the keys, but not the title. and so the judge was calling that out and saying he was the u.s. attorney for this district. he can get the title to the car that then giuliani just cut off the judge and interrupted and said that he has made efforts to try to get this title. and then he went on a rant about his financial issues, and he repeated some of those statements outside of court i have no cash. >> it's all tied up. so right now if i wanted to call a taxi cab, i can't do it. i don't

have a credit card. i don't have a checking account. i have no place i can go take cash out except a little bit that i saved. and it's getting down to almost nothing. >> now, the judge had warned giuliani that he can either represent himself, or he can have the lawyer who's sitting next to him represent him, but he can't have both. >> yeah. judges don't normally react well to outbursts and behavior like this. so how did the judge handle it? >> so he he told him that, and then he said, you know, earlier, he also reminded giuliani that, you know, there could be issues of contempt here if he doesn't hand over these assets or show that he's made a good faith effort to find them and hand them over. so he didn't use the jail word, but he said you know what i can do here? you don't want me to say it. i just want you to be aware of what the potential consequences could be. >> he all but said jail. so what happens next? >> so giuliani is actually going to trial on january because they're trying to figure out who has the actual owner of these world series rings that could prove valuable and could be turned over.

giuliani had asked the judge to postpone the trial because he wants to attend the inauguration. the judge said today he wasn't doing that. he said he might move it up and he wants to hear from both sides in the next few weeks. >> all right. kara scannell, thank you very much all right. money news now, not rudy, but all of ours. the dow jones and s&p 500 both closed at record highs today, apparently shaking off any concerns after the president elect posted that he is going to impose 25% across the board tariffs on imports from canada and mexico quote, this tariff will remain in effect until such time as drugs in particular fentanyl and all illegal aliens stop this invasion of our country. he said much the same, about a 10% tariff on imports from china. now companies like walmart and lowe's have said tariffs could cause them to increase prices on consumers. mexico's president has already promised to retaliate with their own tariffs, but will donald trump actually follow through? this is what his pick for commerce secretary howard lutnick said in september before the election the question is

whether you believe the president is going to do it strategically or across the board. >> he keeps saying it across the board. >> well, when you're running for office, you make broad statements so people understand you. >> all right. joining us now is cnn political commentator shermichael singleton. alyssa farah griffin and ashley allison and alyssa. one of the things here is that so many of trump's allies say it's a negotiating tactic. it's a negotiating tactic. can it still work if everyone knows and says it's a negotiating tactic? >> yes and no. listen, i think one of the maybe brilliant things about trump is he's often open to interpretation. so i think a lot of folks on capitol hill, even people who will be serving in his incoming administration, are looking at it as a bargaining chip and thinking that these may be much more targeted, not across the board, not, you know, 20% on any goods and service that may be coming in to the country. and there's some reason to believe that, like we saw in the first term, where donald trump loves him, some tariffs, he genuinely believes that they work and they're a good pressure point. but we saw that they were a bit more limited in

how he used them with steel from canada and with some imports related to washing machines, i believe it was. so there's ways he could do this in maybe a more targeted way but donald trump reacts to the public and to the markets. now the markets are steady now. but say he comes into office and signs this. if he sees the dow drop in a massive way he's going to react to that. he's not going to do something that's going to massively rattle the markets. >> there's wall street, then there's main street. sure, michael. i mean, if terrorists do go into effect and if it does start to affect the prices that we all pay as economists genuinely agree that it will. i mean, how much pain do you think the american people will be willing to put up with? and how much do you think the president elect is willing to take well, i think the president elect is going to attempt to avoid that as much as possible john. >> the worst thing you want is to cause economic instability. now as we saw justin trudeau stated today that he spoke with trump. they had a great conversation he looks forward to more talks to come. i think they'll figure out a meeting ground at some point. uh

mexico. look, there are a lot of issues with mexico. and i think if trump is going to use the threat of tariffs to tell the incoming or the newly elected, rather president of the country that you guys need to do a whole lot more to stop the caravans from traversing through your country, uh, impacting the united states. in southern border states such as texas i actually think a lot of americans would potentially agree with that. and we'll see what mexico decides on china. my concern with china is that i don't know if tariffs is the best strategy here. i'm more concerned about ip chinese corporations stealing u.s. manufacturers intellectual property. i think you need a more targeted economic approach to dealing with china and leveling that playing field there. but we'll see what happens. >> well, we may see what happens very quickly since he says he's going to do it on january 20th, which is his first day back on the job. ashley, what do you think that democrats response should be, particularly when it comes to tariffs? >> yes, i think there's two things that democrats are going to have to do and do it quite nimbly. first, this whole campaign season, democrats have

argued that the economy is improving. so you don't if something if it continues to trend in the way it is, you don't want donald trump to get all the credit for that. for the four years of joe biden's presidency. simultaneously, if he does this to alyssa's point and the dow drops or prices increase rapidly, you got a strike. you got to remind the american people, he told you he was going to make your lives better, and he's making it worse. we bank on elections we bank on people's behavior or elected officials behavior being determined before elections. and so i believe that democrats will start running on january 20th and banking on bad things happening to the economy, because donald trump and having him have to answer to the american people. that's the challenge of governing. >> you said they're going to have to be nimble. we'll see if they they're going to have to get some mojo back. >> optimistic thinking alyssa, you know mark dannels report on rudy giuliani. >> i mean that was something to hear him outside the court and to hear her account of him inside the court basically blowing up at the judge. what

do you think is going on here? >> honestly, i find the whole thing very sad to watch this as a person. i think many of us once held in very high regard, and he's chosen a course of action over several years that have really jeopardized other people's livelihoods and their futures and how they're living. and it's a result of his actions that he's in this position. but it is pretty stunning to see that this is one of the few people who's actually going to see consequences from the events around the election being stolen and lies told around that, and impugning people who were just doing their jobs. whereas juxtapose that to donald trump, who basically just got away with everything related to the january 6th investigation. i think it should be maybe a cautionary tale for folks around donald trump he may be teflon don and get away with anything, but you will not necessarily. >> all right, friends, stick around for a moment, if you will. we are going to have much more coming up. i want your takes on this next story. walmart says it will curb its diversity, equity and inclusion efforts following right wing backlash. and it's not the only company to do so. so is this a sign of a larger cultural shift? that's next

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call now is not the time to lose faith sisterhood above all doom. >> prophecy streaming exclusively on max all right. >> walmart is the latest major corporation to be caught up in the culture wars. the company announced it will roll back its diversity equity and inclusion efforts in the wake of right wing backlash. that includes ending racial equity training programs for staff and evaluating programs designed to increase supplier diversity. walmart, the largest private employer in the u.s., joins harley davidson, tractor supply company and john deere in revising or pulling back on their dei programs. and that's just to name a few of the companies doing so you remember that bud light's decision last year to partner with a transgender influencer sparked a boycott. the parent company, anheuser-busch says, may have cost the company more than a billion dollars in sales. now, experts say the reelection of donald trump will likely

accelerate corporate america turning its back on dei initiatives. now, some top democrats believe the last election was at least partially lost on the battlefields of the culture wars. as the party continues to do some post-election soul searching, the architects of the harris campaign are speaking out for the first time about what they think went wrong, making a wide ranging appearance on pod save america. deputy campaign manager quentin fulks offered one potential explanation that democrats are simply out of touch with where the country has moved culturally there is a cultural dynamic that's at play in politics today, where it is converging like we've never seen. >> and we're losing the culture war, and we're losing the culture war and whatever it is, woke whatever word you want to use, i'm not you know, i leave that to anybody to define on whatever value. >> but we are not aligned on where we can be within that. all right back with us. >> alyssa, farah, griffin, ashley, allison and shermichael singleton. ashley, you were

laughing there. >> i didn't know we were going to play that clip. okay so i'll talk about walmart because i've actually had some interactions with walmart when i worked at the white house. walmart was the first private employer actually to ban the box for formerly incarcerated individuals when it was not an extremely popular thing to do, which really set a trend in the corporate america eco like zeitgeist where, you know, criminal justice reform was somewhat of a new approach to the work. and so to see them do this with dei, am i surprised? no. am i disappointed? yes. often when social movements happen, there is a backlash. whether you look at the civil rights movement, whether you look at the women's rights movement, whether you look at the black lives matter movement there is backlash that often happens with progress. the question is how do you sustain it? if you want to see the movement move forward? so walmart does well on ban the box. but then donald trump and they move back on die. die is not a bad word. it is about leveling the playing field. but i do think some of the messaging that has been around

dei, that has been done quite well by the right, is why we find ourselves in this predicament with the walmart. i'll also just say the supreme court decision on affirmative action played a huge role in this. many people, many legal scholars, have looked at that decision that it should only be applied to higher education. but when that decision came down, a lot of people said that it was going to have a rampant effect across institutions, that it really is not discussing. but that's what happens when your highest judicial institution makes a decision. it touches parts of the country that you might it might not need to, but it does. >> you know, shermichael what ashley was saying there, you can actually see the action and reaction in walmart's own statements. this is language from walmart in 2020, the chief executive wrote that, quote, slavery lynching and the concept of separate or equal have morphed into a set of systems today that are all too often unjust. compare that to the company's statement today. quote we are willing to change

alongside our associates and customers who represent all of america. that's a shift right there. >> i mean, look, john, i have a lot of thoughts on this. i mean, i'm a quality of opportunity kind of guy. and i think in an ideal world, people should rise and fall based on their merits based on their tenacity, their hard work, their natural talents. i just don't know, as someone who owns a business, if i'm looking at hiring people and we have quite a few people we've hired and we're hiring even more as we're growing, and i'm not looking necessarily at a person's race i want to look at who's the best person. and obviously we're going to look at black people, women, hispanics, white, whatever the case may be because skills are most important to us. and i think in the business world, you want people who can do a great job so that you can maintain your capital market position for your investors and also serve your consumers. so i don't know what the end result of this ultimately is but i think if you're giving everybody an equal opportunity

for a position for a role to do the job, and you're selecting people based on that solely, then i think that's pretty fair. >> i will say that i think the 2020 walmart would have said those two things aren't necessarily in conflict. i'm not sure the 2024 walmart messaging would say that same thing, but but alyssa to the political point that quentin foulkes was making, and i think that that ashley referred to here, i mean, how far away are democrats from where the feeling around the country is? >> yeah, because my sense is somewhere between shermichael and ashley on this which is that diversity equity, inclusion, these are all noble goals. representation is good. having a company that looks like the country is a good thing but there's a world in which these things can go too far. and the identity politics, i think to many in this country feel like it became so front and center. and i juxtapose hillary clinton in 2016. i'm with her i'm going to be the first woman. i'm going to shatter the glass ceiling. really leaning into that. it was notable to me that kamala harris wasn't really talking

about that. they weren't leading with i'm a woman, i'm a woman of color. i'm going to be the first. but to me, that was almost a tacit understanding by her campaign that people were sick of vote for me because i'm x. it's more, i want to vote for you because you're the most qualified person. but i think that democrats were so far down the path since 20 2016, 2020 that a lot of voters just didn't see it that way. and she kind of got lumped in with that. she's part of the identity politics the 30s left here. >> i mean, how do democrats i assume there are a lot of democrats don't want to necessarily abandon these efforts. so how do they then approach them? >> look i'm not in the business of giving hot takes in 2024. on why democrats lost the election. what i will say is that there is a lot of accusatory language, i think, right now about being woke, about being the dea all of those things, the people who ran this campaign were democrats. so i just say like, everybody should take a beat and look in the mirror. >> all right, ashley subtle shade. alyssa shermichael i

appreciate it all. everyone have a wonderful thanksgiving up next thanksgiving, john. a strange shift here. a terrifying ordeal. a kentucky man nearly became a full organ donor, even though he was still alive, leading to an investigation and calls for changes. the report from our doctor, sanjay gupta ahead there are amazing things that are happening all over the world, things that can make our lives better. >> that's the goal of my podcast to try and find the secrets to a longer and happier and healthier life and then we bring those secrets to you. listen to chasing life wherever you get your podcasts amelia. >> turn off alarm amelia. >> weather 70 degrees and sunny today amelia. >> unlock the door i'm afraid i can't do that jen. why not? >> did you forget something my protein shake the future isn't scary. >> not investing in it is so dramatic amelia. >> hi jen, nasdaq 100

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it because i worry that there might be some erosion of trust in the organ donation system. you got 100,000 people who are on the list 17 people die every day. but i think it was pretty clear as well that some pretty significant reforms may be necessary tell me about that day we were there saying our goodbyes. >> that was it we felt like we were doing the right thing as a family. and they were trying to kill him. we had made the decision to remove him from life support because we were told, you know, he was brain dead what you are watching is the honor walk. >> it's one of the most revered traditions in a hospital. it's when family friends and staff all pay their respects as someone is wheeled off to give the ultimate gift donation of their organs yeah it's okay, but

sometimes they just want somebody except this man, t.j. hoover, was still very much alive so out of respect for moore and for the patient's family, we can stop recording at this point i think organ donation is a beautiful, life saving gift. >> when it's done ethically i was just scrolling through tiktok about different kind of donation stories, and it was a little search bar across the bottom that said, he woke up during his honor walk. so i watched it and the people looked familiar. the hospital looked familiar, and i said, that's this is our donor nothing makes me more sad or off. i don't know it's a very emotional thing for me because nobody should have to go through that. and i just feel like there were so many opportunities for someone to step in and say, we're not doing the right thing. >> nikki martin worked for

kentucky organ donor affiliates, or coda. it's known as an organ procurement organization responsible for recovering organs from deceased donors. nikki was so disturbed by what happened to tj that she penned a letter to congress trying to bring more attention to cases like his. >> i believe in organ donation, and i've devoted much of my life to it. however, in too many parts of the country like kentucky, it's unsafe, and i'm pleading with the government to change that do you remember when you were driving to the hospital that day? >> what did you hear that sort of triggered the alarm bells? >> the tracking with his eyes and moving around trying to pull his tube out. trying to move his hands away. just all of the reflexes that he had. normally our dcd donors don't have those kinds of reflexes, and they're not awake and they're not you know, conscious of what's going on. so it was kind of really shocking for all of us to know that cota's admin was pushing to continue is this money? >> i mean, is that the

incentive fundamentally, i think, for for cota, it is or for any apo, you know, they're they're paid for the organs. you think of organs as being a gift of life but what you're describing is a big money making operation. and that's really you think what sort of incentivized that push yes. in a statement to cnn, network of hope said that cota does not, quote, receive financial incentives based on the number of organs recovered and that its focus is on compassion, not on pressure. baptist health hospital wrote to cnn that they work closely with our patients and their families to ensure patients wishes for organ donation are followed, and cota said it reviewed the case and remains confident that accepted dccd practices and approved protocols were followed. when asked about the specific accusations by nikki, cota said she was not present in the hospital and added this case has been inaccurately represented by individuals

never involved in the case. so we did track down someone who was in the operating room that day and did see what happened firsthand. her name is natasha miller. she's a transplant perfusionist and i'm driving to see her now. from what i understand, he was mouthing the word no and pushing hands away and things like that. >> yes, he was very aware of the pronouncing physician comes in, and when she comes in, she walks back out and she says, i'm not doing this. i'm not doing this case. i don't feel comfortable. the organ coordinator that was there, she steps out to call the supervisor at the time to tell him that the pronouncing physician was refusing to do the case. she said that he was yelling at her, telling her she needed to find another physician to come. and she's like, there is no one. there's no one else to come. do this case. >> is there any part of this that makes sense to you? is there any part of this defensible? >> no because it seemed like at first they were saying, well, family family consented, family consented, family consented.

and i get that. but again, it seems like family wasn't made fully aware of his actual state. none of it makes sense. we should have never went to o.r. about an hour. >> an hour and 15 minutes later, the doctor came out and got us and told us to pull up a chair. she said he's not ready. he woke up army coming on brian harman i mean it's going to be a good day inside that's right. >> that's tj, who is now home. i just want to check your strength here. can you pull your hand towards your face? >> i'm roxie. >> try and touch your nose that's pretty strong. good. how about with this? this hand? can you do it here? i know you told me that this first thing that he really remembers is being in the operating room and having all these people around

him. but have you been able to explain to him everything that happened the same way you explained it to me? i am how does he react? >> why did they want to kill me? of course he remembers he was an organ donor and he has survivor's guilt. he's like, all of these people thought they were going to get to live live read, live. i was a registered organ donor and i'm not anymore really? >> because you don't trust the system. >> i don't trust the system. >> what does tj's life like now? >> he wasn't supposed to make it a year if he made it. hold your head up bud. >> for tj, it's not just about being alive, but living and getting to be a part of these moments like walking his sister down the aisle and meeting nikki for the very first time. >> how t.j. do you know how special you are no, you don't you're pretty special, bud

well so many reasons. >> you survived, bud. >> you're my hero, tj i mean this story is incredible. >> i've actually signed up to be an organ donor. how is tj doing? >> yeah, and i signed up to be an organ donor as well. just just to be clear, because i know again, i'm worried about this erosion of trust. he's doing really well, you know, you know, the most remarkable thing is that he kind of felt bad that he did not get a chance to donate his organs because he it was like one of those things where he felt he could have saved. so many lives. i think what's really at the heart of this story are people who are just marginalized. he went in as a person who had overdosed on drugs. his sister, they felt that maybe she didn't understand everything that was going on. and i feel like they sort of were taken advantage of a bit in the system. but he is he's doing really well. there's a huge investigation that's now going on by the kentucky attorney general's office, and i'll tell you,

sadly, there are other incidents like this in other states that are now starting to come to light. anderson. >> it's just incredible. i'm so glad you did this. thanks sanjay. yeah and next, a preview of anderson's moving conversation with actress, author and mental health advocate ashley judd. >> she talks about the grief she has faced since her mother, country music star naomi judd, died by suicide. a preview of anderson's podcast, all there is coming up super size the celebration of america's favorite holiday spend thanksgiving morning with cnn with live coverage of parades around the country and special guest appearances by chef bobby flay. >> the property brothers, drew scott, the temptations, t.i. the inside the nba crew andy grammer, and more john berman and erica hill host cnn thanksgiving in america live coverage starts at 8:00 on cnn the polar vortex is bringing a

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collins next on the latest episode of all there is anderson's podcast about grief and loss is available right now. >> this week you will hear from actress and author ashley judd, who talks about the death of her mother, country music superstar naomi judd, by suicide. more than two years ago. here's anderson with more love. can feel a bridge on april 11th, 2022. >> naomi judd and her daughter wynonna, one of the biggest country duos of all time, performed at the country music television awards. the song co-written by naomi, was love can build a bridge. don't think it's time this was naomi judd's last performance. she died 19 days later by suicide her daughter, ashley actress, author and mental health advocate, first spoke about it in this interview just 12 days

later. >> because we don't want it to be a part of the gossip economy i will share with you that she used a weapon mother used a firearm. >> ashley judd had never spoken publicly in depth about those final moments of her mother's life and the trauma and grief that she's been living with until her conversation earlier this year my mother's death was traumatic and unexpected because it was death by suicide and i found her my grief was was in lock step with trauma because of the manner of her death and the fact that i found her. >> i held my mother as she was dying and there was blood, and i just needed to like, process the fact that i was with my mother's blood. i'm so glad i was there, because even when i walked in that room and i saw that she had harmed herself, the first thing out of my mouth

was mama. i see how much you've been suffering you said that to us okay it is okay to go. it's okay to go. i am here, it is okay to let go i love you. go see your daddy. go see papa judd go be with your people and she heard you. oh, she heard me. and i just got in the bed with her and held her and talked to her. and said let it all go. be free. all was forgiven long ago all was forgiven long ago leave it all here. take nothing with you. just be free. this is an extraordinary blessing that you were able to do that. oh, it was i'm so thankful i was there

one of the reasons i wanted to talk with ashley for my podcast was that i still struggle with my brother. >> carter's suicide, 36 years ago. one of the things that, um i'm sorry i'm here anderson one of the things i have found so hard about one of the things i found so hard about losing my brother to suicide was a the i get stuck in how his life ended and the violence of it. and he killed himself in front of my mom and um, and also the realization that and my shock over it and the realization that i didn't

really know him and i'm wondering if the manner of your mom's death made you question how much you knew her. >> thank you so much for sharing that all our stories are sacred and i really honor the place in you that that's coming from and i think we all deserve to be remembered for how we lived and how we died is simply part of a bigger story if you or someone you love is struggling, help is available. >> please call or text the nationwide suicide and crisis lifeline at 988. you will find the full episode of anderson's conversation with ashley judd on apple