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859 2400. >> a bottle of water and a flirtatious exchange. the new clues that may help investigators track down whoever shot and killed a health insurance ceo on the streets of new york. >> plus president-elect donald trump publicly rallying around his pick for defense secretary pete hegseth as his confirmation chances dim. ahead the new instructions the trump administration is giving his transition team on how to handle the controversies surrounding hegseth. and nearly two years, five continents and more than $1 billion later, the end of the eras. and i know what you're thinking. is it over now? but listen, you need to calm down. we'll tell you what taylor swift is planning after her tour. that this show knows all too well. we're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to cnn news central

the clock is running in the search for the suspect in wednesday's killing of unitedhealthcare ceo brian thompson. >> we're told a possible key new clue was discovered at the crime scene detectives finding dna on a water bottle and a cell phone and testing is now underway. a law enforcement official also tells cnn police are trying to find more images of the suspect as they use facial recognition software to help identify him. cnn's omar jimenez is with us now on this. omar, i want to talk a little bit about this possible dna evidence. i do also want to note that our shimon prokupecz was just interviewing nypd and they believe that the suspect has left the city. so that's an interesting new detail that we are learning. >> yeah. so that interview is ongoing right now. we're going to bring you a lot more of those details as we get them in. again, it would be the first time we're hearing from

new york police top brass sort of since their initial press conference in the aftermath of this. but then as far as what we do know, outside of that, so far, we know the medical examiner's office has now begun testing or at least has is testing possible dna evidence in the killing of this unitedhealthcare ceo and that evidence would come from a water bottle found at the scene that investigators believe this shooter may have sipped from leading up to this also, a cell phone was found at the scene as well. they're also looking for for potential touch dna that they could pull from it. on top of that so that's the dna aspect of it. but another thing that we're learning as well, of course, is around the path to new york city for this shooter. now we know he arrived ten days before the shooting as a law enforcement source tells cnn. but another aspect of it is that we believe he arrived by bus, a bus route that

originated in atlanta. and that's where the bus originated. it's unclear where exactly the suspect may have boarded the bus, but interestingly we are hearing from the atlanta police department that said that they heard from the nypd, the afternoon of december 6th. today and that they are now assisting with whatever the new york police department might need you see some of the timeline there when this person arrived in new york, they checked into a hostel in the upper west side of manhattan stayed for a few days, checked out came back and then stayed for the the few days leading up to the actual shooting and that all that all goes into the question of who this person was, is and what they might be doing. you see this picture here as well. the new york police department put this out as a person of interest. they want for questioning. this was taken at the same hostel, though, where they believe the suspect was staying over the course of this. and you see the mask down smiling right there. law enforcement believed based on interviews they've done, that was a moment where this

person was literally flirting with the clerk at the front desk there, and that was why that mask was down could end up being one of the more significant clues in this case, brianna. >> yeah, it's certainly a clear shot of the person's face. omar thank you for the latest there. we've also seen just a flood of frustration on social media following the killing of unitedhealthcare ceo brian thompson. actually mainly aimed at the health industry. health care industry, health insurance industry itself. let's watch this. >> of course, i would have been happy to send my condolences after the unitedhealthcare ceo was killed this afternoon however, unfortunately sympathy requires a prior authorization and i have to deny that request. they also denied my son his afos ankle foot orthotics because he did have a stroke. so half of his body doesn't work the same as the other half, and he needs those to walk. they denied him because he grew too fast. they said he just had some five months ago. i was like, yeah. and then he grew because he was

two years old. and two year olds tend to do that cnn's clare duffy is with us now. >> clare, i think normally you have an instance like this. we do not see some of what we are seeing on social media. there is a lot of frustration that has come to the surface, even in the midst of what is a horrible tragedy for this company and this family. >> yeah, brianna, i mean, look obviously there is no justification for this kind of violence, but i do think what we're seeing on social media is the sort of bubbling up of a lot of the pent up anger and frustration and distrust that americans feel towards the health insurance industry. another example of this that i found really striking is this facebook post from unitedhealth, expressing sadness over thompson's death. it got tens of thousands of reactions from facebook users, and the majority of those were laughing face emojis. we're also seeing a lot of these stories of people talking about claims that were denied, and experts say that is a big source of the frustration that many people feel over this industry. in one study, a majority of americans insured

americans. 58% say they've experienced a problem with their health insurance including denied claims and pre-authorization request issues and of those, 15% of those people say they actually experienced health impacts because of the denials, those denials can cause anxiety. they can delay treatment. >> another thing that i think is really interesting is that unitedhealthcare in particular, has faced scrutiny over its use of artificial intelligence, allegedly to deny claims there was a lawsuit filed last year that claimed the company has used ai to deny claims from elderly patients, and unitedhealthcare is seeking to dismiss that lawsuit. >> but i think what we're seeing broadly on social media is people expressing frustration over the sort of power that they feel this industry has in comparison to the individual patients that it's serving. brianna clare duffy, thank you so much for talking to us about that element of the story. kayla donald trump is giving an end of the week boost to his pick for defense secretary pete hegseth, who just two days ago

was a subject of talk about who could replace him. but today, the president elect posting that support for hegseth is in his words, strong and deep adding, quote, pete is a winner and there is nothing that can be done to change that. the military veteran and former fox news host has been on capitol hill this week, fighting back against the allegations of sexual assault money mismanagement and alcohol abuse. he has denied the assault and mismanagement allegations and says he does not have a drinking problem. let me turn now to cnn's alayna treene for the latest. elena, the vice president elect, jd vance just a short time ago, said the transition team is not abandoning the hegseth nomination. is this a gaining of momentum? >> look, i would argue that it hasn't really changed that much behind the scenes because one key difference between someone like pete hegseth, from what we saw happen with matt gaetz, who ended up donald trump, ended up calling him and telling him he did not have the votes. >> is that so far, both hegseth team, but also senators are telling the transition this as well. there are no hard nos on

that. that's really been their bar. so far for saying that they are still optimistic and part of the reason trump issued that truth social one is to kind of put to bed any anxiety that people think he is having over hegseth, but also donald trump has been and i'm told this from a number of people at mar-a-lago giving his team the directive to go out there and post in support of hegseth to publicly back him and show that they are not moving away from him. now, we also heard the vp elect, jd vance, issue a statement of support for him as well, telling reporters this in north carolina pete hegseth is going to get his appearing before the senate armed services committee, not a sham hearing before the american media. >> we believe that pete hegseth is the right guy to lead the department of defense. that's why president trump nominated him now, kayla one really interesting thing that i've been picking up in my conversations with trump's transition team is that part of the reason they are all in on seth is because a lot of people think that if donald trump gives in to the pressure from

senators on another nominee and another nominee withdraws their name that will give lawmakers too much control over donald trump. >> this is what one source familiar with the conversations told me. they said if he drops pete because of pressure from establishment republican senators, all it will do is have the effect of the senate essentially controlling trump and not the other way around. >> well, you have the fbi background check that's now underway, and that is going to be one high stakes committee hearing when it happens. elena. thank you. we appreciate it brianna. >> joining us now is democratic congressman jake auchincloss of massachusetts. he is a member of the defense spending reduction caucus and a former marine and also, i should mention, a member of the select committee when it comes to china. and us. so i'm curious congressman, you are watching what we're all watching, which is we've now seen the president elect and vice president elect vance backing pete hegseth on social media. do you read this as yeah, there may be a chance that he could actually be defense secretary not at the

united states senate. >> does its article one job. and actually vets him thoroughly, because if they do that, even senate republicans are going to have to see that he can't do any of the three core jobs of secretary of defense. one be a manager, two, be a leader, three be a foreign policy maker. i mean, he was a manager of two small nonprofits, ran them into the ground. he has failed to meet the officer and a gentleman. standards that the uniform code of military justice asks of military leaders, and he has zero foreign policy experience so how do we trust him on the phone with the israeli defense minister or the ukrainian defense minister, or the taiwanese defense minister when snap judgment calls are the potential between between war and peace? so he just he fails on all three fronts. >> there are sources that kayla is talking to who say trumpworld sees pete hegseth, you know, at least as an effective heat shield from other controversial picks like tulsi gabbard and rfk jr., who quite frankly we've heard much

less about than we might otherwise hear because he's getting so much attention. how much does that concern you that all this attention on him, with him staying in benefits, some of these other picks i think that's exactly right. >> and the founders, in their infinite wisdom understood this dynamic. they knew that at one point in our history, we would have a strongman populist in the oval office who would want to project his own power and his own preferences ahead of the american peoples. and so they said the senate has to advise and consent on these important nominations. so these picks are actually less about the individuals. we know that these individuals are going to be. yes, men for donald trump they're more about whether the senate takes seriously its own constitutional responsibility. this is john thune first real test on the national stage. he's the new senate majority leader, and we're about to find out what john thune is made of so i want to ask you because you have noted, i'm sure, as we all have, that hegseth has put a

real emphasis on lethality, saying that that would lethality, lethality, lethality he actually said that that would be his only focus if he's chosen to lead the pentagon. >> i think the question may be what does he really mean by that? because he's spoken out against the constraints of current rules of engagement, the constraints of the geneva convention. he supported accused and convicted war criminals. what do you take him to mean when he's saying that he's focusing on lethality only well, there's a lot of dimensions to that. >> one of them, yes, is rules of engagement. the other would be tactical and technique training for officers and for enlisted. just yesterday though, the select committee on china had a hearing about a third dimension, which was our defense industrial base which is a really important component of that. and one thing that the next secretary of defense should do is really overhaul how the military buys things. i've voted against every defense budget since i've been in congress, not because i don't want a stronger military, i do. it's because i'm so frustrated with how badly the pentagon procures things. instead of buying these

expensive, exquisite weapon systems that only monopolistic vendors can provide, we got to start building modular, uh commercial scale and autonomous systems that we can wage against china in the indo-pacific, things that are built by companies like anduril or hadrian or others. we've got to move into the 21st century and outproduce our enemies like china and russia we'll have to see if that's what he means. >> if he makes it to the confirmation process perhaps some of your senate colleagues will be asking him those very questions congressman jake, thanks for your time good afternoon we do have some breaking news in the daniel penny manslaughter trial. that is the ex-marine accused of killing street performer jordan neely on board a new york city subway after penny held neely in a choke hold for several minutes. the jury says that they have deadlocked for a second time. cnn's gloria pazmino is outside of court there. gloria, tell us what's

happening well it is a bit of a dramatic moment, right now, brianna, i have to tell you, because it is friday. >> we've been at this since monday. we're almost done through the day, and the jury has now just said for the second time to judge wiley, we cannot get to an agreement on the first count. now, the reason that is important is because this jury cannot even begin to consider the second count until they get through the first. the first is the most serious of the two charges. manslaughter in the second degree. now early in the day today they said that they were deadlocked. and judge wiley instructed them to go back into the deliberation room and keep at it. keep doing the job that you're here to do. try to get to a verdict, try to get to an agreement, review the evidence and try to get there was what he told them. they came back. they asked for a definition, a legal definition of what it means to be a reasonable person. so they're going through the details. but now once again, a little bit

after returning from lunch today, they're telling judge wiley they cannot get to an agreement. this is now the second time this this jury is hung on this top charge. now, before they were sent back to deliberate while the parties were talking about what to do without the jury being in the room, there was a discussion about whether or not the prosecution in this case would would consider agreeing to dismiss the top charge if the jury remained hung on it. so that they could be allowed to move on to the second charge. the prosecution said that they were open to that and right now the parties are conferring. they have not reached a decision yet. but there is a possibility where the prosecution here led up by alvin bragg, the district attorney here in manhattan, might say we'll let the first charge go, but we got to move on to the second one. now, you have to wonder how that may play for this jury it's unclear. right? they could say, okay good, we can now move on. but they could also say, well,

if the top charge is something you're willing to let go, what does it mean for the second charge? so it's just a really intense moment of of trying to figure out where this jury is at, trying to imagine what they're thinking. but at least for now we can tell that they're really making an effort to understand what the law requires them to do. and trying to get to a place of agreement. we don't know. there might be one person or two people in there who are just not in agreement with the rest, and they're trying to work through that. it is friday brianna. the weekend is around the corner. perhaps they don't want to be back here on monday. but on the other hand they know that they have someone's life in their hands and it looks like they are taking that very seriously as they should. in the meantime, throughout all of this, the defense has moved for a mistrial. multiple times at this point, saying that this should not be such a complicated case. according to them, the judge has disagreed telling them that it's not time

to declare a mistrial just yet. brianna. >> all right. gloria, a lot happening there. we know that you'll stay on it. let's go now to criminal defense attorney misty morris, who's with us? misty what do you make of the jury deadlocking a second time here yeah, there's a lot going on in this case. >> so the jury. no deadlocking a second time on the manslaughter charge and right before that, really interesting. the jury had asked for a clarification on one of the instructions relating to justification relating to the self-defense argument. they asked the judge for clarification on what the standard is. as far as justified self-defense. it's called the reasonable person standard, and the judge read that to the jury. that is very relevant because it seems like now that we have a second deadlock, the jury is likely grappling with a some individuals who believe that daniel penny actions were

justified versus other individuals who do not and in that case, if justification is the is the linchpin here, that's what's keeping the jury from agreeing the second charge criminally negligent homicide. the same the same will happen because that is the same element to both of the charges manslaughter and criminally negligent homicide. so that was very, very telling the question. and now the second deadlock. >> misty, we can't know what's happening between those jurors, but i think people looking at new york city and the city's experience with crime in recent years, they're going to have some questions about what kind of conversations people are having in that jury room. when you look just at the law, is it that complicated to you? what kind of conclusion do you think a reasonable jury would come to and is it is it a potential that the experience of new yorkers with the recent crime in the city, you know, informed

of that over the last few years that that could come into play here absolutely. >> so i'm a new yorker myself. so i've taken the subway. i've lived in new york city for 20 years, so any new yorker that you speak to about this case it's actually really interesting because you do get reasonable arguments on both sides. there are some people who say this should have been a guilty verdict right away and there are others who say this case should have never been brought, but keep in mind those jurors, those jurors are new yorkers, many of whom had said during jury selection that they ride the subway frequently, and even some who had had negative experiences they're told when they enter that jury room, you have to base your decision on the evidence, what you heard in court. nothing else. but they're also told you don't leave your life experience and common sense at the door. that's part of the jury instruction. so any juror in that room looking at this case, looking at the evidence, is looking at it through the prism of their own experiences. so

when they're in that jury room, i'm sure that that's what we're that's what we're seeing manifest in this deadlock is that they're grappling with that it will be very interesting to to find out. >> misty marris, thank you so much. and ahead on cnn news central, cnn shimon prokupecz just spoke moments ago. you heard this happening as we were here on tv. he spoke moments ago with the commissioner of the new york police department about this search for this person, the suspect in the shooting of the unitedhealthcare ceo. we learned just minutes ago that police believe the person of interest has left the city. we're going to bring you that interview after a quick break erin burnett out front tonight at seven on cnn it's closed. >> what about my letter? >> call uncle brian to the north pole never to december to remember sales event. >> get offers on select models everywhere but the seat. >> the seat is leather.

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tell us what you learned. shimon yeah. >> so they gave us about 12 to 15 minutes to sit with the police commissioner and also the chief of detectives who is running this entire investigation and some significant new information that i can report now, is that the suspect, the nypd believes the suspect is no longer in new york city. >> they've been able to track his movement. and what they say is that on that bike, remember, there's that video from 85th street west, 85th street where he comes down the road, makes a right. they now say that they see the suspect get in a taxicab and head north. they also say that they have a lot of evidence that they're still working through. here's some of what they told me there was this guy who is this guy? >> so i'll start by saying we have every reason to believe that this was a targeted attack on an individual, rather than a

random act of violence on new york city streets. >> we do have a person of interest in the case, and we have released the photo yesterday. we would appreciate you getting that photo out to your audience because we also have reason to believe that the person in question has left new york city. so we want a wider audience to see the picture outside of new york city. >> okay, so that's new information. and what is that based on? why do you believe that this person has left new york city? >> well, before we do that, i want to say that if anyone sees that photo and recognizes that person we ask them to call one 800 577 tips. that's if you have information about who that person is. and it's a pretty good shot of a face. so if you know that person when you see the photo you should be quite sure. but if you do see the person on the street, don't call 805 seven seven

tips. call 911 wherever you are. got it? >> sir, if i can ask you now. yes. what? what has led your investigators to believe that this individual has left new york city? >> well, our detectives are doing a very, very extensive video canvass. >> we're working from back from the hilton hotel from the incident itself. >> all the way to uptown manhattan. so we have our perpetrator leaves the hilton hotel after the incident takes place we have them getting on a bicycle and riding into central park. >> we then later pick him up on 77th street, exiting the park on central park west. >> still with the bicycle. >> eventually we have him on 86th street and columbus avenue walking. he loses the bike and then from there we have him in a taxi cab, and the taxi cab takes him up to 178th street and broadway, which, as we know, is a port authority bus center. those busses are interstate busses. that's why we believe he left. he may have left new york city. >> do you know what bus he got on? where that bus was going? >> we're working into that and we're looking into that now. it's a very busy bus terminal. we want to make sure we have

the right bus, but we're working through that right now. it's all new information. >> and actually now as we speak, we have a huge canvass going on in central park. we still have not found the backpack. and so we're doing a full sweep of central park to find that backpack, which we believe he dropped in central park. we're using manpower, but we're also using our drones. >> i want to get back to that quickly because this is new information. i think it's important for new york city residents to know that this individual is no longer you believe he's no longer. >> we said we have reason to believe he's no longer in new york city. >> that, i assume, is based on video. >> we have we have video of him entering the port authority bus terminal. we don't have any video of him exiting. so we believe he may have gotten on a bus. >> we don't know what bus. >> no, not at this time. >> um did he say the cab driver were you able to interview the cab driver that the taxi driver that took him to the. >> we want to be careful not to get too far in the weeds of this investigation. it is an active, ongoing investigation

and so there you go. >> that's the basically the important new information, i think, for investigators. right now that this manhunt is obviously now going to have to expand the race is on to figure out what bus he got on at the port authority bus terminal in upper manhattan. remember, he took a bus here. they believe got on somewhere at some point maybe transferred through atlanta made his way to new york city spent about ten days or so here before committing this horrific crime and now again, it appears that he has left the same way. he came via a bus. again the chief there telling me that this was really well planned. this was targeted and that the suspect here really did a lot of work and preparation before he came to new york city to commit this murder. the other thing i want to stress about is the photo that police released of the man at the hospital that man,

police believe is the same man that they are looking for in connection with the murder. they believe that is the same individual who shot the ceo. the other thing that's important, they say, is that if you look in that photo from the hospital, he's wearing different clothing. they believe based on what they can see there he is wearing different clothing again, obviously it all goes to the preparation here. and the other thing is the nypd wants to stress it's just the dozens and hundreds perhaps, of detectives that are now working on this case, that literally one detective could sit in front of a monitor and watch videotape. the cctv that are all over new york city for hours and hours for just an eight second clip to try and locate this suspect. they say they're not using ai technology. i know there's a lot of questions about that. they say they're not. so it's painstaking work really, for these detectives to look through this video. and they also say the commissioner there told me there is a lot of

evidence, the forensic evidence that they've recovered the cell phone that they've recovered. she didn't want to get into specifically what they've recovered in terms of fingerprint dna. but it's certainly going to help them when eventually they catch the suspect for a criminal prosecution so much news in that interview shimon prokupecz, thank you so much for bringing that to us. >> we'll come back to you again. a lot to discuss on this case. we're going to take a quick break and talk more about it on the other side. stay with us and here we go. >> consumer cellular uses the same towers as big wireless. but then passes the savings on to you. >> so i get the same fast nationwide coverage if i switch. >> yup. >> for unlimited talk and text with reliable coverage and your second month free call, consumer cellular. >> look out. >> cause here i come. >> have you always had trouble with your weight? same. >> discover the power of wegovy with wegovy. >> i lost 35 pounds and some lost

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s customink makes it so easy. get started today at customink dot com. >> all there is with anderson cooper. listen, wherever you get your podcasts let's go back to our breaking news out of new york. >> moments ago, our own shimon prokupecz sat down with the nypd commissioner and the chief of detectives who is leading

this investigation about the manhunt for the gunman suspected of killing unitedhealthcare ceo brian thompson they said that they have reason to believe the person of interest left the city shortly after the shooting, riding away on a bike. then hailing a taxi before finally being seen entering the port authority bus terminal in upper manhattan. >> they also told cnn they are still searching for the suspect's backpack, which he apparently got rid of somewhere in central park, and they said the suspect appeared to know when his victim would be walking to the conference on the morning of the shooting. i want to bring in steve moore. he's a retired fbi supervisory special agent. steve, what happens now that they believe he's left the city? we just heard them say that's the reason why they published the photos of the suspect so early in this process to try to get a wider audience there. what do you think the results of that will be well, i hope the results are going to be positive. >> the photographs are fairly distinctive, fairly detailed

and i think somebody who knows this person would recognize him in those photographs. the problem is you don't know where to aim that photograph. you know, if he's from atlanta, you you aim it. obviously at atlanta, you blanket it there. but between new york and atlanta, there's a lot of stops a bus makes. so they're really kind of in a in a bind here trying to figure out where he went of course if they later on determine exactly which bus and what ticket he purchased, it's going to be a little easier. but these photographs are very distinctive. >> yeah. it's so tricky because that bus did come in from atlanta, but they don't know where he got on it. so they're trying to figure that out at this point in time. can you talk a little bit about the search for the backpack because you heard these nypd officials saying they've got manpower and they've got drones, but they're searching. it sounds like a wide swath, if not the entire

entirety of central park for it right. >> and what they'll do is they'll measure the time from when he entered the park until the time he exited the park, then determined whether he had to have taken a direct route or whether he had time to loiter around and look for a hiding place for the backpack. so you know, you've got two pieces of information there that will help the search or at least inform the search. um, and, you know, we've had the fbi and law enforcement have had massive success in these grid searches where we just walk along fingertip to fingertip and take out, you know, football field sized chunks of, of area where you're not going to miss anything and that's what they're doing. the issue now becomes he this park wasn't searched for hours and hours after the after the

attack. so it's possible somebody just found it and picked it up and went away with it and that really causes a problem. you're going to have to try and determine, you know, they'll even interview homeless people who who uh, who work or who live around the park and see if they know any information about who might have found a backpack. there's a lot of things that could have happened to it, steve. >> you know, we have this one lethal suspect still at large. but then there's also been the vigorous debate over the practices of the health insurance industry that's been sparked by this, by this killing and i'm wondering what you see as the risk of a potential copycat attack well, i think once you put it in somebody's mind that this is a possibility. >> and so far the guy seems to have gotten away with it. it's certainly going to put a spark in somebody's mind. i mean, 20 years ago or 30 years ago, we weren't dealing with school shootings but we know now that

most of them are motivated by other school shootings. and so this becomes a real problem. and from what i've been hearing security companies who provide executive security are having their phones ringing off the hook now. and it's not just health care, it's airlines it's any, um, it's any company that interacts with somebody in a way that can cause serious, serious emotional problems. if things go wrong. >> yeah, that's a good point. steve moore, thank you so much for your insights. we do appreciate it. and we're going to have much more on shannon's interview with the nypd, including the commissioner of the police department on the lead at the top of the hour. ahead on cnn news central, the new details that we're learning from actor jamie foxx about a health scare that he says brought him within an inch of his life i'm kevin hart. >> i'm a leading man, ceo

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>> write for a higher purpose publish with us. christian faith publishing is an author friendly publisher who understands that your labor is more than just a book. call or scan for your free writers guide ( 800) 455-1827. >> we do have more breaking news. prosecutors moving to dismiss the top count of second degree manslaughter against daniel penny after the jury said they were deadlocked twice on the charge. this of course, is that case involving the death of jordan neely on a subway car after penny put him in a headlock. >> cnn's gloria pazmino is outside the courthouse. gloria, what can you tell us well, we're at a crossroads right now, and we are waiting to hear whether or not judge wiley will agree to dismiss that top charge. >> the prosecutors have said that they would like to do that. now that they know that the jury has been hung on the first charge, the manslaughter charge, twice now they are saying we are willing to do

away with the first charge, manslaughter in the second degree. remember, in order for this jury to reach a verdict they have to rule on that first charge before they can even begin talking about the second charge. but the judge has not made a decision now, it's very important to to highlight that while this discussion is happening, the defense has been opposed. they are saying that the jury cannot dismiss the charge because it will be coercive to the jury. they are saying that this should be a mistrial they have called for a mistrial multiple times throughout this trial but now that we are in the phase of deliberations and this jury has said twice now that they cannot get to an agreement on the first charge, tom conniff, the lead attorney for daniel penny, is asking the jury to the judge to declare a mistrial. they are going over the case law. judge wiley is looking closely at the

proposal by the prosecution. but this is a very interesting development. and it just gives you an idea of how difficult it is, but also what these jurors might be talking about inside that courtroom. we know that they have asked for the definition of recklessness. the definition of what it is to be a reasonable person. they have asked to review video evidence. they have asked what it means to be charged with criminal negligence. this was part of the instructions that they received when they began deliberating this monday. so it hasn't been that long, but it is friday there may be some people in there who want to go home and not come back here on monday morning, but it's unclear to me as of this moment whether or not that is going to happen now, there is something that we can sort of interpret here from the prosecution's willingness to dismiss that first charge. they

might be looking at this and saying to themselves, we may be only able to get a conviction on the lesser charge, and that's the only way they can sort of get a win on this case. so maybe that is why they are willing to let the first charge go. but you have to worry about how that could play with the jury who might hear, we're letting the first charge go they might think, well, why are we even here in the first place? so it's a really difficult position to be in. and the big question right now is whether or not judge wiley is going to allow the dismissal of the first charge. we're getting closer to the end of the day now. so he's either going to have to tell this jury, you're going to have to come back here on monday or he's going to have to make a decision on whether or not there is case law that allows him to dismiss that first charge, or if he needs to give a real consideration to what the defense is asking for, which is a mistrial. just hours ago he told them it wasn't time

for that yet. so we'll see if this jury is going to go home for the weekend and not come back here next week, or if they'll be back here first thing monday morning to continue deliberating on a case. they seem to be not getting to an agreement on. brianna. >> yeah, we'll see if the judge thinks maybe they just need a break. gloria pazmino, thank you so much. we'll have more on this and other news when we come back where are you headed? >> where am i headed? am i just going to take what? the market gives me? no. i can do some research. >> you know, that's backed by jp morgan's leading strategists. like us. >> when you want to invest with more confidence, the answer is jp morgan wealth management. >> no matter what kind of teeth you gotta brush or will be, electric cleans better with one simple touch. oral-b's dentist inspired round brush head hugs them cleans them and gets in between them for a 100% cleaner teeth your perfect clean starts with oral-b and here we go. >> your consumer cellular tower. >> i didn't know they built

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breaking news. >> the judge has just made a decision. this is back to the penny subway chokehold trial, i should mention. but the judge has just made a decision on the prosecution's motion to dismiss the first charge when it comes to daniel penny, the jury has been deadlocked twice now. >> we were just speaking with cnn's gloria pazmino. she has new news outside the courthouse. gloria, what's the update yeah, we heard that this motion was going to be approved just in the last minute since we went to break judge wiley, now granting the motion to dismiss the first count of manslaughter in the second degree. >> what this means, in simplest terms, is that daniel penny, who was looking at 15 years in prison if convicted is now looking at a maximum of four on the second charge that criminally negligent charge, that's what he is facing now, the 15 year possibility is out the window after this jury has said twice now throughout today that they cannot get to an

agreement now, the defense has motioned for a mistrial. multiple times now, but the judge has not has not granted that motion. and we have also juedhat not only is he is he going to allow to dismiss the first charge he's going to have them back here on monday. so this is not over yet. even though the defense has objected to the fact that they are allowing the first charge to be dismissed. judge wiley is telling them he will bring back the jury on monday for them to continue deliberating on that second charge. >> all right, gloria pazmino, thank you so much. big developments today in the case of daniel penny. we'll have more news when we come back the online store that was just breached has my payment info during the holidays. >> think of all the places that can expose your info. lifelock monitors millions of data points jen b asks, "how can i get fast download speeds while out and about?" jen, we've engineered xfinity mobile with wifi speeds

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ask about a humana medicare advantage dual eligible special needs plan. and remember, annual enrollment ends on december 7th. humana a more human way to healthcare it is the end of the eras. >> after more than 150 dates in 21 countries across five continents. taylor swift will wrap the iconic eras tour sunday night in vancouver, and it's been estimated that this tour made more than $2 billion. >> joining us now, the host of the ringer's every single album podcast, norah pinciotti and nathan hubbard. norah, it's hard to imagine other artists matching the scale of the eras tour anytime soon, but what do you think is the legacy from this tour yeah, well, i think you're smart to talk about other artists who could match this type of cultural resonance. >> i think, you know now we know that taylor is on the level with the beatles, with sinatra, with elvis, nathan and

i would say we've known this for a long time, but i think post eras tour, that's sort of common knowledge in a way that it wasn't ever. >> yeah, it sure is. and that's the thing, nathan, is the show lasted two years, and then you had demand increasing rather than waning. it's like people can't get enough even after all that time. what was it about her show that created that dynamic? and also tell us how many you went to to base your opinion on i'm a little embarrassed to tell you that i went to seven shows. >> at least i saw it in london i saw it in la, i saw it in las vegas. my girls made a made a cameo in the eras tour film. so i have a lot to base it on, but to me it was this mono cultural moment at a time of a lot of division around the world and in this country. it was just this safe haven of a place where people could go and just be together in community. with 70,000 of their best friends. every single night. that, to me, is really what the lasting legacy and impact of this is

going to be. and the fact that it was just this athletic feat. no one really had been up on stage for three and a half, three hours and 45 minutes playing their entire catalog and i think as the world started to hear and see this through, the online introspection, every night and into some of the surprise songs, they started to understand this was something you just had to go be a part of. >> nathan, you're the former ceo of ticketmaster, which did not emerge from the eras tour entirely unscathed. there were a few snafus, but i'm wondering how you think the tour changed the game and the cost for these live events well, i think look, people are going to talk a lot about the money that she made. >> she left a lot of money on the table, and that's one of the legacies of this tour, is she made an effort to get everybody in. look, anytime you're trying to sell a lot of inventory to a small number of people at the same number in time, that's a good recipe for a stampede. more so than a fun buying experience. but at the end of the day i think even with this last set of shows in vancouver, she sold some seats that supposedly had no view for people to go stand in. she put

up screens for people to see. and i think the legacy for me of this tour is how much she invested in the fan experience, and it really raised the bar on a go forward basis for all live performances, where you're going to be expected to get up there and work your backside off, but also the visual component, the breadth of it and the fan experience at the end of the day, she's really raised the bar for everybody. >> yeah, that's a really interesting point and nora, of course, i think you know, we all track where we all her fans anyways. track history. yeah, we all track some of the easter eggs we always wonder what's coming. any hints about what could come during the sunday finale? and also what do you think is next for taylor swift oh my gosh. >> well, nathan always teases me because i'm always predicting, you know, the big surprise, the reputation taylor's version announcement. >> and then i have my clown mask on when it when it never comes true. i'm sort of convinced that we're all going to tune in you know, on tiktok or live or whatever wherever

we're watching to the last show, and it's just going to be an awesome show, and she's not going to announce anything. and then her birthday is in a couple of days. just after that and i know that i will be, like, refreshing and scrolling and just seeing if there's a surprise because she's always got something up her sleeve. i you know, i hope she takes a break ultimately. but i don't know that she will move into whatever her next chapter is without doing something that we didn't see coming. >> yeah, she always does that. the next thing you know, we wake up in the morning and something happened at 3 a.m. she always leaves us guessing. nathan hubbard, nora franciotti. thank you so much to both of you. we're going to be watching. we're going to have some conspiracy theories just like you, nora. thank you thank you. and the lead with jake tapper starts right now