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charge awaits him. also tonight, tracing his privileged past and more immediate history in search of a motive for the murder he's accused of and an explanation for the target he allegedly chose. and later, how? other notorious cases over the years, just like this one, have been broken by everyday people who see something, say something and help keep their neighbors safe. good evening. thanks for joining us. we have just learned that luigi mangione made a to do list for killing, as well as notes justifying those plans. that's what cnn's john miller just got from a law enforcement source briefed on the matter. according to the source, this material was contained in a spiral notebook, along with what police have already characterized as a three page handwritten note claim of responsibility. it comes at the end of a day that began with mangione making it clear he is not going quietly, not procedurally and not otherwise. completely out of touch. >> and insult to the intelligence of the american people. experience. >> well, that was the defendant on his way into a courthouse in

rural pennsylvania, where he elected to fight extradition back to new york on murder charge. unclear what he was referring to or responding to. he was lower key on his way out after prosecutors detailed the gun silencer, $8,000 passport and multiple masks he was carrying when arrested, and the judge denied bail. late today, his attorney took issue with that, saying anyone not charged with a capital crime is entitled to bail the judge could set $1 million bail. >> it could be $5 million bail. but you know, it, you get bail. that's what you do. >> well, he also told reporters that his client intended to plead not guilty to the new york second degree murder count he was charged with late last night you were under the impression, or you're trying to defend the client on the fact that he is not the shooter. >> listen, i haven't seen any evidence that says that he's the shooter. and remember, and this is not just a small thing, the fundamental, uh, concept of american justice is a presumption of innocence. and until you're proven guilty

beyond a reasonable doubt. and i've seen zero evidence at this point. and so i'm not even aware of what any charges. i'm sorry. >> that's just regarding the extradition request. >> well, diddy hearing today was the extradition. so we're going to take one step at a time. it's a long process as to that process, local da peter weeks pledged full cooperation with new york authorities. >> we acknowledge that the new york city police department and manhattan district attorney's office charges should take precedence there, more serious, and we intend to cooperate with them to the best of our ability to facilitate their prosecution of this defendant first. but we don't intend to withdraw our charges. >> earlier today, pennsylvania authorities released this mug shot of the defendant, a far cry from the smiling man flirting with a hostile employee in new york. and the state police put out a photo of him eating what appears to be hash browns inside the altoona mcdonald's, where police caught up to him just yesterday morning. again, it is this new so-called to do list that starts us off cnn. shimon

prokupecz has the latest with that. so what do we know about this? so this is really striking, anderson, and very significant, certainly for law enforcement to have this. >> it's how they describe it as being a to do list. and also information about his plans about how to do this. and there are two things that are very striking here. number one, he says that there was some talk about potentially using a bomb, but he was scared that innocence would be heard in that. so that was a bad plan. the other thing, and this is a quote, according to our colleague john miller, from this notebook, and he sort of says, in essence, what could be better than to quote, kill the ceo at his own bean counting conference? so, in essence, you know, law enforcement and certainly investigators will view this as a confession. >> so this is a this is not the man of quote unquote manifesto, which maybe is too grandiose a term, but or this is a notebook. >> this is a notebook, handwritten notebook. it's a spiral notebook. remember there was a backpack that he had with him. so presumably that's where this was found. all

right, shimon, thanks very much more. >> now, on how unexpected this all is to those who've known this defendant, said one former classmate. i feel like it's a cliche. everybody is like he was a quiet guy, but like, he was an even more normal than that. but then he added, quote, i know he kind of fell off the radar with everybody. that is what investigators are focusing on in part, what happened during that time. did this person apparent back problems or possible insurance issues play into it? police want to know. and what about his mother filing a missing person's report for him 16 days before the shooting? there's a lot to learn. cnn's brian todd sets the stage after graduating from the university of pennsylvania in 2020. >> shooting suspect luigi mangione maintained an active social media presence for years, posting smiling photos from his travels and gatherings with friends. he worked as a software engineer for the online car sales company truecar, according to his linkedin page. >> there was nothing came off weird about him. he had great friends, he had a lot of female

friends as well. he was a relatively unassuming kid. he was down to earth. he was smart, well adjusted socially. >> his most recent address was in hawaii, where he lived for about six months at a co-working and co-living space in honolulu, according to a building manager. his only known encounter with the law. there was a ticket for trespassing. people who know him in maryland, in pennsylvania, at stanford and in hawaii, and those who know his family have all told cnn that he was very bright and expressed surprise that he would be accused of murder. >> i was just stunned, shocked. couldn't believe it. it's just not who you would think of at all. >> about six months ago, his social media activity suddenly went cold. posts from x this past october show concern from friends. one post says quote, hey, are you okay? no one has heard from you in months and apparently your family is looking for you. in recent years, mangione suffered from back pain and underwent surgery for treatment. according to the hawaii building manager. >> he mentioned, oh, i need to go back to see my doctor and

then i'm going to have to have surgery. it also weighed on him that he knew that there was an impending surgery. >> the profile photo on an x account that appears to belong to mangione features what looks like an x ray image of a spine with hardware from a surgery, and posts from a now deleted reddit account that closely matches his biographical details, say that the user had suffered from back aches related to spondylolisthesis since childhood, but aggravated the condition after a surfing incident. quote. my back and hips locked up after the incident, the user wrote in july 2023, adding that intermittent numbness has become constant and i'm terrified of the implications. >> he was in bed for about a week. we had to get a different bed for him that was more firm, and i know it was really traumatic and difficult. you know, when you're in your early 20s and you can't, you know, do some basic things. >> police are investigating whether a back injury on july 4th, 2023 could be related to the murder of the unitedhealthcare ceo. >> some of the writings that he had, he was discussing the difficulty of sustaining that injury. so we're looking into

whether or not the insurance industry either denied a claim from him or didn't help him out to the fullest extent. >> brian, do we know anything more about his family's efforts to find him during the past six months, when he seems to have been isolating himself? >> anderson, according to the new york times, luigi mangione was the subject of a missing persons report filed in san francisco by his own mother on november 18th. we have reached out to the san francisco police department for more details on that. now, the nypd says that he does have some ties to san francisco, but the exact time that he was there is unclear. >> anderson. >> all right, brian todd, thanks very much. joining us now, cnn law enforcement analyst and former secret service agent jonathan wackrow, cnn shimon prokupecz is here, as well as cnn legal analyst karen freeman, agnifilo, former manhattan chief assistant district attorney. and kenneth cary, former chief of department and chief of training for the new york police department. so just big picture. where does the investigation? where does the investigation stand tonight? >> it's really i think at this point it's going to start to

move backwards, i think, because they need to really figure out more about him. you know, there's a point in his life where it seems i mean, the only way to best way to describe it is that he was radicalized, right? like there comes a point where there's a switch in his life and something changes. and i think for law enforcement and certainly for folks who study this stuff, they want to know where that switch was, what happened. and so while yes, they are still gathering a lot of evidence, they have all the evidence they need to charge him at this point. but i think there's still a lot to find out about him. and i think that is a very important part of this investigation. >> jonathan, what are you what stands out to you at this point? >> yeah, i mean, sherman's spot on the investigation is going to start slowing down, right? there's a big difference between apprehension, right? a crime was committed. we need to find that suspect. we need to gather items of evidentiary value to make attribution, to get this individual in custody. now he's in custody, and the investigation is is is going to slow down all in the furtherance of the prosecution. so investigators are going to work backwards, as you said,

they're going to start, you know, making sure that every item that they have lines up to support the ongoing prosecution of this individual, they have to go back and they're going to start over with all of the video surveillance evidence. this massive mosaic of thousands of hours of video, they're going to really piece that together to start to tell the story of everything that happened prior to the attack, the attack itself, in the moments afterwards, really showing that premeditated action that he took. they're also going to look at other witnesses that they may have. he was here for a long time as they were trying to apprehend him. they didn't have the ability to go out and cast a wide net on who else interacted with him. now they can. they have the luxury of time to slow down and find all of those additional individuals. >> and karen, i mean, we mentioned that he's fighting his extradition to new york. new york governor plans to submit a warrant to bring him to the state. what are the next steps for the manhattan district attorney? and how does the suspect contest contesting

his extradition? how does that complicate things? >> well, extradition is a very perfunctory process that happens every day all across the country because otherwise any fugitive, after they commit a crime could just go to another state and and not be prosecuted. so this happens all the time. the next thing that happens is you fill out a form, you get what's called a governor's warrant by the governor of new york, who requests from the governor of pennsylvania that he be brought here. he has a couple of weeks to file a writ, basically to essentially contest that. and that will trigger a hearing. and at the hearing, the prosecutors will have to put forth some of their evidence to show that they have evidence to support these charges. just a very thin amount of evidence, but they have to show that they have probable cause that a crime occurred. and and then the judge will decide. so it's going to happen either way. he's going to be extradited. the only potential wrinkle would be if pennsylvania said they wanted to go forward with their charges first, which i

think they've already said they don't want to. but that's the only thing that could delay it. this extradition, this type of extradition, as i said, is very common and i don't foresee any issue with that. at the end of the day. >> chief corey, i mean, we mentioned investigators are also looking to this notebook from the suspect who references the unitedhealthcare conference. he had a to do list on task to facilitate a murder, something like that. how does that impact the investigation? >> yeah. so i think that's one of the things that the investigators are going to start looking at now. like jonathan said right now, the urgency has has stopped, right. the suspect is in custody now. the detectives have to work to put a case together and a couple of other things that they're going to want to know is how long was he planning it? where did he get some of the information that he had? how did he know that the victim was going to be where he was at that specific time? had he been surveilling him? how long had that surveillance go on? and also, what has he been doing since he left new york city? you know, about an hour after

the murder, he was out of new york city. so where has he been for the last several days, and who has he been dealing with there? >> yeah. and they're looking into shimon, into this this back injury and whether that played some sort of a role. yeah. >> because they want to see if there's some kind of claim was denied or whether there was some other thing. you know, the other thing they may be looking at to see if he was on any kind of medication for it. so they're going to be able to get all of his medical records, the district attorney's office will be able to subpoena that and able to get that, you know, for the da's office and for the prosecution, they now need to start anticipating what the defense will be here once they get an indictment and potentially goes to trial. so you could start to see all of that information that the gathering of all of that. so, you know, it's kind of like they don't want to leave any stone unturned. and so they're going to try to get as much as they can as they get ready to prosecute him. >> i want to play that sort of outburst he had as he was entering court today

whoa, whoa, back up. >> and he's completely out of touch. and insult the intelligence of the american people and experience. >> i mean, jonathan, i'm wondering, does anything stand out about that? the thing that hasn't been talked about, i mean, most people who have mental health issues don't aren't violent, but that's certainly an option here. i mean, this guy disappears on his family for six months. they're trying to find him. he disappears on all his friends. it certainly wouldn't be a surprise if there's some something going on in his head. >> no, there definitely is not. from this video, though, this was performance art, right? this was this individual seeing the media seeing in seizing that opportunity. i mean, just look at the amount of people that have animated around him in support of him. you know, in the last 24 hours. i mean, this was performance art. the key is, is that notebook. right? and we talk about that pathway to violence. and actually, we spoke about it last night where it starts with a grievance. and i said at one point, we're going to see ideations of violence. here is the written proof of the ideations of

violence. we already know that there was planning and preparation that went on. we now know it's a very clear pathway to violence. shimon, your thought about he's been radicalized somewhere. that's key. right. so while he was a lone actor in all of this, he was influenced by something, right? you don't go from a grievance to killing another human being on the street that quickly without other influences. and that is what law enforcement is going to focus in on now is where were those influences? is anybody else at risk or being targeted by a broader group and they have to act quickly. >> i just want to bring up a point, and i don't think anyone's really making a big deal of this, but the missing person's report to the san francisco police department. i think we need to know more about what prompted that. and what did the san francisco police do? i think it's important because something had happened, and there was a reason the family went ahead and reported that, and maybe there were signs. you know, it's always important to sort of look at that, to see did someone try to go report him what was done. >> and karen mangione, his

attorneys, argued the judge should have imposed bail, saying that in pennsylvania, most crimes are bailable offense. is it unusual that he was denied bail in this case? >> i don't know that he would be have any chance at bail. certainly when he comes to new york, i can assure you a judge is not going to set bail. so that could be one of the reasons he's fighting extradition is to try to see if pennsylvania, that typically does set bail might give him an opportunity to to be released here because he's going to be in for a very long time. this case is going to take quite a while to go to an ultimate trial. and i agree with much of what everybody is saying. but i think one thing i just want to, i want to point out is it looks to me like this. there might be a not guilty by reason of insanity defense that they're going to be thinking about, because the evidence is going to be so overwhelming that he did what he did. and i hear what you're saying about being radicalized. i hear what you guys are saying. but as a former prosecutor in that

office, i would be concerned that you have someone who is a valid valedictorian of his class. he was brilliant his whole life. he comes from this great family. i mean, something changed, right? significantly. something changed. and and they're going to i think, potentially have a not guilty by reason of insanity potential defense. so the prosecutors are going to try to shore that up as well in, in their investigation. >> garrett reisman jonathan wackrow shimon prokupecz. thanks, chief. corey is going to come back shortly next for us at that point. more on the suspect's upbringing. what a forensic psychologist makes, what we know so far and later some of the other big cases over the years in which the public involvement has played a key role in breaking that and more, when we continue. >> you only come across an artist like luther vandross once in a lifetime. >> he was a boss from the beginning. luther said, i have a sound in my head. i got to get it out. you are my shining star. >> my, it was the most exciting time in the world.

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say i'm veronica miracle in malibu, california. >> and this is cnn. >> chilling words tonight from what a law enforcement source says were pages of notes in a spiral bound notebook made by murder suspect luigi mangione, who is now awaiting extradition from pennsylvania in the murder of unitedhealthcare ceo brian thompson. in one passage, again, according to our source who was briefed on the matter, mangione muses about what could be better than to, quote, kill the ceo at his own bean counting conference. now, earlier today, his attorney was asked about mangione state of mind. at the moment i wasn't looking for impressions. >> what i was trying to do was form a bond with my client. i want him to trust me and i want him to be confident that i'm here for him. and i feel that i'm very pleased how that went. >> as we mentioned before the break, some of his friends describe him dropping off the radar recently. we still don't know much about that. we know more, though, about what came before, and our gary tuchman has that the high school

valedictorian. >> congratulations. thank you. luigi mangione graduating from baltimore's gilman school in 2016, an exclusive private school. >> parents here today first off, sending us to gilman was far from a small financial investment. >> indeed, tuition at the private school was and still is pricey at almost $38,000 a year today. but murder suspect mangione had a family with plenty of money. >> i was just stunned. shocked. couldn't believe it. it's just not who you would think of at all. >> thomas meronek jr. is an attorney who knows the family. >> mangione family is one of the prominent families of baltimore county. they own a lot of real estate. they own golf courses. they're just a very well respected name. >> and this family picture luigi mangione stands third from the left. he is surrounded by his sisters. his father louis and mother, kathleen are on the right. in the late 70s, the murder suspects late

grandfather, world war ii veteran nicholas mangione sr and his late grandmother mary, started creating a business empire. the grandfather grew up in baltimore's little italy neighborhood. he ended up buying two country clubs, started a nursing home company, and bought wcbm radio, a well-known conservative talk station in baltimore. family members also run a family foundation that has nearly $4.5 million in assets and were longtime benefactors of loyola university maryland. the suspect's father today runs the family business. attorney meronek used to be a talk show host at the radio station owned by the family. >> well, they donated money for the the pools, the swimming center at loyola university. it bears their name. that's a huge amount of donating to get that one of luigi mangione cousins is a state legislator in maryland. >> i am delegate nino mangione for the record district 42 a in baltimore county. >> republican delegate nino mangione introduced a bill earlier this year to bring back

the death penalty in maryland. >> i believe we need to send a strong signal to the most vicious of all criminals that if you take a life, that justice in turn will demand your life. >> the bill failed. notably new york state, where unitedhealthcare ceo brian thompson was killed, also does not have the death penalty. state delegate mangione released a statement on behalf of the family that says, in part, our family is shocked and devastated by luigi's arrest. we offer our prayers to the family of brian thompson, and we ask people to pray for all involved. we are devastated by the news luigi mangione received an ivy league education, graduating with a bachelor's and then master's degree from the university of pennsylvania. that, coupled with his family wealth, afforded him advantages. most don't have to conclude his high school valedictorian speech. he said this. >> it's been an incredible journey, and i simply can't imagine the last few years with any other group of guys. >> a young man of promise, then

an alleged killer, now whose journey into darkness has only just begun. gary tuchman, cnn, new york. >> some perspective. now joining us is forensic psychologist kris mohandie and cnn senior national security analyst juliette kayyem. juliette, i'm listening to gary expand on his background. how does that or how might it fit into the puzzle that investigators are trying to piece together right now? is that this the usual profile for a shooter in this kind of crime the profiles differ, but the idea that he had a great education and came from privilege, we've had killers like this before, in particular the unabomber kaczynski was ivy league educated, was quite smart, had a had a purpose for his killings. >> so the thing that that they're going to try to connect, at least in the investigation is, was what happened to lead to this moment? was it the physical pain that he was in? was it outside substances, drugs or

whatever else? was it a radicalization process either through books or online? so they're going to be looking at that. that got him a focused on not just hating our health care system, but actually hunting down a ceo. >> chris. i mean, we've learned that the suspect fell out of contact with his friends and family for about six months ahead of the the alleged killing what does that tell you? how critical will his actions during that time period be for investigators? and just to kind of understand what what, what why he did this. >> i think it's going to be critical to piece together what was going on in those six months. the fact that his mom filed a missing persons report november 18th strongly suggests that there was deterioration, that they noted. his friends noted that he dropped off the radar. all of these things are consistent with and i don't, you know, provide these kinds of statements lightly, that there's a likely deterioration in his mental state. he

actually looks different than he did as the joyful younger man that he was. there's an intensity that is about him that he did not used to have. i believe that there's a chance that he could have a significant mental deterioration that doesn't change the fact that he had a grievance, that it was likely based in his his own personal experience, and then learning about the experiences of others and then immersing himself in the materials in books that he was reading. deny defend, delay, or some variant of that. and a couple of other books, as well as his identification with ted kaczynski, who was mentioned by our other esteemed guest here that led him to justify those other statements that were in that alleged manifesto of the parasites had it coming, and then ultimately to prepare, which is these are the steps that a person goes through to ultimately do and involve themselves in this kind of targeted violence. >> juliet, i just want to play again the incident as he was being led into court and asked

about it. >> whoa, whoa. back up and clearly out of touch and an insult to the intelligence of the american people explain the experience you know, i mean, there are some people out there who are portraying this guy as like an avenger for, you know, a cause. >> what i don't understand is how much is it just he read stuff and is impassioned and did this, which seems less likely to me than he had some severe mental health issue that then he started to focus on this particular thing through that, through that lens? >> yes. and or it could be all of the above that there's mental deterioration. then it's linked to what we understand is a physical ailment. and then this is the key and goes to what he was saying there. then him creating a narrative of why it wasn't just about him. right. and this is exactly what kaczynski did. and the ties, the clear ties

between kaczynski and and this case in terms of creating a narrative that the killing isn't just a killing, it's a killing for a purpose. that purpose then elevates the person, right? so they become sort of some sort of cult leader. and remember, kaczynski also had followers like this. we didn't have the internet or social media, but he had a lot of people who were kind of into him, and we see that now, and the danger of that isn't simply it's wrong. it's disgusting. he murdered and assassinated a person, but then you get into the copycat aspects of this. people who do not have the mental deterioration or the physical deterioration and just decide this is the way forward for social, for whatever i deem as social justice. >> yeah. kris mohandie, juliette kayyem. thank you. coming up, a tip from the public was the key to the apprehension of the suspect. we're going to take a look at other high profile investigations that came to a close. with the help of good samaritans. we'll be right back patients who have sensitive

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>> we're learning more tonight about the suspect in the murder of unitedhealthcare ceo brian thompson. a source tells cnn police have a notebook that includes a to do list for the killing. this comes a day after the suspect was arrested eating at mcdonald's in pennsylvania. an employee called the police after a customer recognized the man from photos circulated by the new york police department. tips from the public have played a crucial role in a number of high profile investigations. randi kaye takes a look when secret service spotted a rifle poking through the bushes at trump international golf club in florida in september, they opened fire. >> ryan wesley ruth allegedly there to shoot donald trump, quickly escaped because information was that the suspect was possibly headed north on i-95. that information came from a quick thinking witness at the scene who gave police a description of the suspect, as well as a picture of the car and license plate. minutes later, ruth was arrested. >> the witness from from the incident at at trump

international was flown to the scene by by the palm beach county sheriff's office, and he was able to make a positive i.d.. >> ruth pleaded not guilty and is behind bars awaiting trial. when escaped prisoner michael burnham broke out of jail last year, he was on the run in pennsylvania. that was until a couple and their dog, tucker spotted him in a wooded area. >> i knew who he was. >> as soon as he stood up and went from from photos, from video. >> i mean, from the photos. you'd seen him on tv? >> oh, absolutely. yeah, we've seen, you know, he's it's been what it was 9 or 10 days. he was on the loose. yeah. and you know, we've seen plenty of, uh, photos. photos and, you know, news coverage and whatnot, the news and everything. we're saying he could be armed and dangerous, so i don't know. does he have a gun? >> the couple called police. burnham was arrested and later sentenced to 25 to 50 years for the escape. and kidnaping. in 2022. frank robert james unleashed a smoke canister on a crowded brooklyn subway car, then opened fire. ten people were shot and at least a dozen

others suffered injuries. james escaped in the chaos. the 28 hour manhunt ended when keen observers spotted james and called police. >> i see him go, this is the guy. like, i can't believe my eyes, bro. like, we need to tell the police. and we told the police and the police came and the police just told me. thank you. and he left. >> james was arrested in manhattan's east village after admitting guilt. he was sentenced last year to life in prison. the manhunt for this pair gained national attention in 2022. alabama fugitive casey white was on the lam for 11 days, with former corrections officer vicky white, who helped him escape from an alabama county jail. hundreds of tips came in, but just one ultimately led to the location of the fugitives took it out wrong. >> i was like. the hotel authorities forced the fugitives car into a ditch in evansville, indiana. >> casey white was arrested and sentenced to life last year for escaping. vicky white died from self-inflicted gunshot wounds after the crash. four brave

citizens came to the rescue of eight year old shasta groene nearly two decades ago. in 2005, she was kidnaped by joseph duncan along with her brother, whom he later killed. authorities had been frantically searching for the children when they got a call that shasta and her captor had been spotted at a denny's restaurant in idaho. >> and all four decided that duncan would not leave the restaurant that night with shasta. >> two of the tipsters were denny's employees. the other two were customers. they all split the reward money. randi kaye, cnn, west palm beach, florida. >> well, my next guest worked to apprehend the new york city subway shooter that randi kaye just mentioned in her report. back with me is kenneth cary, former chief of department and chief of training for the new york police department. so what are the advantages? i mean, putting the information out there, getting the public involved in a manhunt, can it also complicate an investigation yeah, and it does. >> so the decision on when to go public with information is always a strategic one. and it's always one that's held in consultation with the case.

detectives. you know, normally once detectives have identified a suspect and they have probable cause to arrest, they're going to want to try to take that into individual into custody as quickly as possible, but also as quietly as possible. they obviously don't want to alert the suspect that they're on to him and have and have he or she run and at the same time, they want to have the opportunity to question the person without, you know, having them necessarily invoke counsel or i should say, without counsel invoking on their behalf. and that happens quite often, as soon as the suspect's name goes out, the police department gets a letter from an attorney that says, hey, that's my client. you can't talk to him unless i'm present. so, so, so they want to avoid that circumstance. >> so, i mean, you were chief of department of nypd in 2022 when the shooter opened fire in the brooklyn subway car, which was really, i think, the last major manhunt in new york city before this one. what were the main differences between that, that manhunt and the one we saw this time? >> yeah. so every case is different, obviously, and therefore every manhunt is

different in the frank james case, he had left behind a tremendous amount of evidence. at the crime scene. we had credit cards with his name on it, you know, in a bag on the subway train. of course, we didn't know initially that frank james was was the perpetrator in that case, he could have been one of the victims who left a bag behind. he could have been the property could have belonged to somebody that the shooter had robbed earlier in the day. but within a few hours, we were able to really to dial in on frank james as a person of interest. and probably by late afternoon that day, we had developed probable cause to arrest him. detectives then went out go ahead. >> no, but i mean, yeah, go ahead. >> detectives went out. they went to a bunch of locations that were that he was associated with when they didn't take him, when they weren't able to get him overnight, very early the next morning, we made the decision, the decision to go public with it. we actually lit up the emergency alert system in new york, only the second time that that's ever been done. the first time was after the chelsea bombing in 2016. basically directing every cell phone in new york, everybody carrying a cell phone, hey, go

to this website. look at these photos. have you seen this person? >> it's got to be difficult in a case like this one with this mangione that there's no criminal record to speak of. i mean, it wasn't in the system. >> yeah. so that's where the limitations of technology come in. you know, we talk about technology, video, facial recognition, even forensics, and they are all going to be key elements for the prosecutor here in ensuring his conviction. but in terms of identification and apprehension, they weren't getting us there. he's not in the system. so the facial recognition, you know, at least in new york, that's limited to what's in government databases. so it's going to be primarily mug shots, maybe some driver's license photos. but the nypd doesn't use it to scan social media. i also don't think that the photograph was adequate for facial recognition, because most of his head is covered. they talked about right joe kenny the chief of detectives talked about evidence left at the scene, the water bottle that he bought at starbucks,

the kind wrapper. they got a partial fingerprint off that his fingerprints aren't in the system. he's never been arrested. his dna is not in the system because he's never been convicted of a crime. um, so now that he is in custody, they will collect his fingerprints. they will collect his dna. they will do direct comparisons to connect those items to him. but they weren't going to aid in his identification. >> and are there other databases, like for fingerprints or a photo that law enforcement can access no. >> so the fingerprint databases, you know, in new york, you're going to go through every state is going to go through their own state's database, and then they're going to submit to the fbi for the federal database to see if he's been arrested in any other state. so that person has ever been arrested, convicted of a crime if they've ever been fingerprinted non criminally, they applied for a job. they had to get a background check if they were going to be bonded, like working for an investment bank, they would have had to submit non-criminal fingerprints. they're going to work as a teacher. um, so those would certainly return as well as

fingerprints in the system uh, dna, you know, uh, again, much harder, you know, unless you're convicted of certain offenses, the government doesn't have the dna of all 330 million americans on file. >> yeah. kenneth khouri, i appreciate your time. thank you. cnn's going to continue to monitor the story, bring you any latest developments we want to move toward in syria about this after the surprising fall of the assad regime, a new interim prime minister has been named with the potential to help reshape the entire middle east. what that might mean for russia's military and their influence in the region. we'll have details ahead luther. >> never too much new year's day at eight on cnn. >> finish ultimate engineered for the toughest conditions. dry, burnt on stains, old dishwashers, very hard water finish ultimate with cycle sync technology helps deliver the ultimate clean are they really going to spend all day streaming college football on directv? >> can you blame them? they've got the biggest rivalries and

bowl games. >> speaking of frank, run a slant to the bowl of chips. >> bobby buttonhook to the salsa. >> what are you going to do, coach prime? >> don't question your coach, man. >> when a tough court finds you on the go, it would be silly. hey, trying to robert hur john sauer juice pack with the power of robitussin and every bite easy to take cough relief anywhere. chew on relief, chew on a doesn't you don't stop being you just because you turn 65. >> but you do face more risk from flu and covid. last year alone, those viruses hospitalized nearly 1 million people 65 and older 1 million vaccines lower your risk of getting really sick so you can keep doing you hello, brad. >> dan. singh the world the

boys and girls. >> now, i didn't sign on for this. >> it's christmas. bah, humbug. christmas is the time to be with the people you love and talk to the world. >> talk. wow. >> talk to you and me. >> i used to think a holiday one stop shop was a myth. until i found michael's. oh, i need those definitely need those. i know this place is unbelievable. >> how did you fit in the front door? >> 70,000 people are here. and bobby is the reason for it. once upon a time, you dressed so fine. >> i hear bob is playing electric. >> not on our stage. he isn't. >> he just wanted me singing blowing in the wind for the rest of my life. >> how does it feel, bobby? what do you want to be?

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mohammad al-bashir will oversee the country's transition over the next three months. now, the fall of the assad regime has sent shock waves throughout the whole region. israel says it carried out hundreds of strikes across syria in the past two days on facilities it says contained chemical weapons and long range missiles. idf ground troops have been deployed into a demilitarized buffer zone between the two countries for the first time in 50 years, and the israeli defense minister claimed that the syrian naval fleet was destroyed overnight. still, though, one of the biggest unknowns remains what the collapse of assad means for russia's military influence in the middle east. fred pleitgen has more as syrians embark on a new era after ousting longtime dictator bashar al assad, russia fears the era of its massive military footprint in syria could be coming to an end. >> the former commander of russian forces in syria and now member of parliament, is already warning russia's leadership not to make concessions. any gesture of goodwill in the middle east is

perceived as weakness. weakness is unacceptable, he says. what should be done in this situation? he's asked. talk from a position of strength, he answers but how much power does russia still hold in syria? kremlin controlled tv strategizes over what might come next, with maps showing russia's bases in syria. a guest acknowledges moscow was caught off guard again. >> it would not thinking about how it all happened in syria reminds me about how it all happened in ukraine in 2014, he says. >> i want to highlight one universal lesson for world powers don't take wishful thinking for reality. when a power is crumbling in days and can't protect itself. this is a verdict seriously. for years, it was the russian military that kept the assad regime afloat. russia's air force pounding rebel groups, its navy firing cruise missiles at isis militants in eastern syria in

return, assad gave moscow a 49 year lease on both its main air base near latakia and a military port in tartus, allowing vladimir putin to project power throughout the middle east. the fact that russia has its military assets in syria also makes moscow a key player in the middle east. but now the russians acknowledge that that status is in jeopardy. once a key ally for the russian leader, putin now allowed assad and some of his family members to flee to moscow, a decision folks in moscow told us they support naim qassem. we don't abandon our men, he says. he is our man. it was the right decision. he has nowhere to go. he would have been killed. but even here, syrians living in russia telling me they're happy assad's been ousted. we will be able to live in calm and peace and be able to safely visit our country, he says. we don't have to worry that

someone can throw us in prison because they don't like what we said. we're happy that the dictatorship is over. moscow hopes the end of assad's rule will not spell the end of its military engagement in the middle east. while acknowledging it's still too early to predict and you know, anderson, the kremlin was asked today what role, if any, the russians played in actually getting assad out of syria, as, of course, things were collapsing really quickly around him. the kremlin spokesman said that leaving syria was assad's free will and the rest. he said the kremlin would leave without comment. anderson. >> fred pleitgen, thank you so much. coming up, the latest episode of all there is my podcast about grief and loss just got posted. wherever you get your podcast this week, my guest is tyler perry. he's built an extraordinary entertainment empire, but it's only recently that he's begun to turn toward the trauma he experienced as a child, and the grief he feels over the death of his mom, maxine, who died 15 years ago this past saturday. you're going to hear from tyler in just a moment

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allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. tell your healthcare provider if you're pregnant or breastfeeding. increased risk of guillain-barre syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can happen, so take precautions. most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling where injected. muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. ask your doctor about shingrix today. there he is. >> wherever i go, they always ask, where's waldo? you found me. who's waldo? sometimes it takes someone who really knows you to

than $34. go to deal dash dot com and see how much you can save. >> i'm elizabeth wagmeister in los angeles and this is cnn, an all new episode of my podcast about grief and loss. >> all there is was just released minutes ago. you can point your phone's camera right now, the qr code at the bottom of your screen, and follow the link that pops up to the podcast. this week, i'm joined by actor writer entertainment entrepreneur tyler perry. he's only recently begun facing head on the trauma and abuse he experienced as a child, and facing the grief over the death of his beloved mom, maxine. 15

years ago this past saturday. here's some of the interview from the podcast what have you learned in your grief that would be helpful to somebody listening to this? >> what i've learned is that it's it is what it is. >> and i would try and suppress it or not cry when it came or just push it to the side. you have to let it visit at will. you have to let it be what it's going to be so that you can move through it. and i really do feel like it's a living thing, like it is a visitor that will knock at the strangest moment. at the worst time. you can't fight it. let it be. because in order for it to to get better, eventually it's got to move through you. because when my mother first passed, it would literally take my breath away. i'd find myself gasping for air when i would think about her, or i'd fall asleep and she'd be in my dreams, and i would feel myself waking up, and i'm fighting to stay asleep so i can just talk to her one more time. so yeah,

after your mom died, you weren't sure you would survive? >> no. >> you were drinking. you'd said at one point that if you hadn't had so many work commitments, you might not have stuck around. >> no, no, that wasn't that wasn't, um, what was the point? you know, what was the point? what was the reason for feeling that level of love? leave me and leave me. >> but but also because all of the so much of the drive that you had and have was about her, was about providing for her and making sure that she had everything that she wanted. >> yeah, that was the goal and the purpose. and then when she was gone, so was that desire and that drive to keep pushing and working it hard. you knew the strangest thing was because there was so much trauma, because there was so much poverty. i never thought i had enough for her. i always thought, it's this. this is not going to be enough to make sure she's okay. anderson i'm angry, man. i'm so angry. i'm so angry. that's a part of the grief, too. i'm angry. um, that's that's another part

that that you have to be careful with when you're grieving. and this is why, around this time of year, i go away because i don't know how it'll show up. but the anger is is, um. oh, god. i remember the first mother's day when people were, like, saying, happy mother's day. and i'm like, i don't even want to hear it, you know? and then to see friends who won't even call their mother or talk to their mother, they get the business from me. i'm just like, what is wrong with you? um, and i would get angry because i wish i had her, so i'm just, i working my way through the stages of grief was hard. i think the anger was the hardest one. >> i have felt this rage. the it's the hard hearted rage of a child. and i remember feeling it as a little kid, just terrified when my dad died and stunned, but just filled with rage that has continued throughout my entire life. and i think there's it's been fuel in so many things i've done. but it's, uh, i was

yeah, it's hard. >> i wasn't allowed the rage. i wasn't allowed to to have that because culturally. yeah. um, just being six foot six and black. right. um, there was this from the time i was in school, it was like your bigs get to the back of the line. you're you're you're too big. so i wasn't allowed to have that kind of freedom to just be enraged about something. so anger. my anger was quiet and slow. slow to to build. um, but i felt this anger coming up out of me and all i could think of and hear was, don't. you can't do that. you're too big. and one therapist said to me, you deserve to take up as much space on this planet as anyone else because you're here. you don't have to be smaller. you don't have to make yourself smaller. and i was able to just let it all go. >> the new episode of all there is with tyler perry is now