technology in real time. here is conservative justice samuel alito trying to understand what those sites offer these days compared to, you know, hugh hefner's creation back in the day, one of the parties here is is the owner of pornhub, right? >> yes. and what percentage of the material on that is not obscene as to children? >> well, your honor, if we're talking about the youngest minors, i would agree that most of it is. >> and that is how we read it. >> is it like the old playboy magazine? you have essays there by the modern day equivalent of gore vidal and william f buckley jr.? >> not in that sense, but in the sense you have sexual wellness posts about women recovering from hysterectomies and how they can enjoy sex. that's on the on their. >> anna. >> no puedo. i don't understand. i really don't know why you're making me think of alito. >> god knows i call on you. >> maybe now i understand why his wife is hanging 16 and your

mother caught you with a playboy. >> i'm only reading the articles, mom. >> i'm reading about reading william f buckley. >> also a little scary for those of us who know the technology is going to come before the court a lot. everyone, thank you very much. thanks for watching newsnight. laura coates live starts right now. rahel solomon well, tonight president biden says goodbye from the oval office and takes a shot at the likes of elon musk as he delivers a new warning to america. >> plus, pam bondi on a glide path that seems to be the next attorney general, but not before some pretty thorny exchanges between her and others about the way she'll lead the department. and the clock ticks for tick tock. but new tonight, donald trump may be thinking of a way he could save it. could it work? tonight on laura coates live. well, president joe biden tonight had his last chance to speak to the american public in a major way before he leaves

office. it was a primetime oval office swan song. and while biden said he remains optimistic about america, he also delivered a warning, one that we really haven't heard from him before, at least not like this today, an oligarchy is taking shape in america of extreme wealth, power and influence that literally threatens our entire democracy, our basic rights and freedoms, and a fair shot for everyone to get ahead. >> americans are being buried under an avalanche of misinformation and disinformation, enabling the abuse of power. the free press is crumbling, editors are disappearing. social media is giving up on fact checking. the truth is smothered by lies told for power and for profit. >> well, if you're expecting some sort of subtlety there, joe biden did not deliver that. now, he mentioned no one by

name, of course, but it's hard not to think about the billionaires like elon musk and mark zuckerberg. musk spent at least, what, a quarter of $1 billion to help elect trump. zuckerberg just announced that meta is, in fact, ditching the very fact checking that biden mentioned. both are going to attend trump's inauguration, along with jeff bezos and openai ceo sam altman. now, biden's warning about what he called the tech industrial complex took up a lot of his speech. he did take a few indirect digs at his successor, also his predecessor, america, but ultimately wished him success. biden also touted many of his own accomplishments getting america through the pandemic, creating jobs, lowering prescription drug prices and costs. but the reality is, right now, most americans are not happy with how his presidency went, at least according to a new cnn poll that shows 61% of americans actually view it as a failure, which means biden is leaving office with his

approval rating matching the lowest of his presidency. one of his advisers telling cnn, we lost the narrative. well, time will tell if the narrative changes. issues that dogged his administration could be seen very differently later on, with maybe the benefit of hindsight or historical review like the israel-hamas war. perhaps today he announced a hostage and ceasefire deal in that conflict that could start getting at least some hostages home as early as this coming sunday. now, trump went on truth social, saying it only happened because of his election win. well, here was biden's take on that. >> thank you. >> folks credit for this, mr. president, you or trump? >> is that a joke? >> didn't sound like the question was. but sources telling cnn the biden team and the trump team both worked together behind the scenes to get this done. one administration official saying to us that the operation and

the cooperation was, quote, almost unprecedented. even biden himself alluded to it in his speech tonight when he said, quote, that's how it should be working together as americans. joining me now, cnn analyst and new york times, white house correspondent, zolan kanno-youngs, former state department spokesperson for the obama administration, neera hawk and republican strategist brad todd, who has done some work for hostage families and aipac. thank you all for being here tonight. it is a very momentous occasion. it is in progress. people are hopeful that this will be the change, and people will actually be able to go home. at the very least. biden, though zolan, was warning americans about an oligarchy and the power or the concentration of power, this is his last farewell address for the nation. were you surprised that he was focused on that in part yeah, i was. >> this speech, in a way, was a departure from other major speeches that we've seen the

president give, which recently have really been focused on sort of describing his legislative achievements that he has long felt he has not gotten credit for. that wasn't the case with this speech. it wasn't just tacking through the different things that he did in his presidency. it wasn't just an effort to define his legacy as a president. it really was more so a warning to defend the democratic institutions that he's spent now decades working and believing in. it was almost twofold, one, to describe how he views sort of the american experiment and then also describing the stakes of that american experiment. >> presidents make different choices about their farewell speeches. and to go back to the first one, washington, who decided not to run for a third term. he also issued three very stark warnings to the american public about how they should proceed in this democracy. and that's some of the function of how biden chose to approach this speech, as if it's it may be right on substance. it may not resonate now. it may. he

didn't win despite having felt and thought these things. but 50 years, 60 years later, will people look back on this as a sign of okay, in the end, this president did understand the forces that were surrounding the country and challenging the country. he just was not reelected to do anything about it. >> the big force he mentions is social media, which for many presidents would not have been the focus. but he is talking about combating misinformation at a time when, frankly, people are siloed, they're getting information from nontraditional media sources. and he mentions the absence of fact checking specifically that might resonate for people even more immediately. i don't know joe biden. >> we know his presidency and his administration coerced and bullied social media companies to change the flow of information. >> he's just zuckerberg indicated something like that. >> he's just mad that he didn't get his way anymore. he wants a government where you read and see the things that he wants you to read and see, read and see. but, you know, the thing i thought was missing most in this speech tonight was contrition. we alluded to the fact that joe biden's approval rating is 38. some polls have

it at 36. you'd never know that from listening to it. he never said, i let you down. i know i didn't succeed. i know you're disappointed in me. he also didn't talk about immigration, the issue that probably played more into his defeat than anything. we didn't hear one word. i find it funny that after four years in office, joe biden thinks he did nothing wrong, did no failure, and i expected tonight to hear a little bit more of that sort of a healing bridge. >> did you really? >> i mean, i hear you. i hear the point of why you thought you should hear it, but did you really expect biden to suggest contrition after he's comparing himself to his, as he would say, the alternative? >> when he ran, he was going to be the healer. he was going to return to normalcy and he was going to he was not. he was trying to be a counter position to what he saw as a divisive partisan administration from trump. and he's going out the divider. >> this is what he did at the end of the speech, right? that was that missing piece of this is what america is supposed to be. it's about having a fair level playing field. i think he called an even playing field. that's the promise of america. and that in all of the campaign

and all the other rhetoric, we just hadn't heard that very direct statement of the american promise. so i found it to be very welcome. but the idea that a president is to take his last big speech in the white house and apologize, i you know, there's there's just no president. you got to start where the audience is, though, and the audience is very down on joe biden. >> he has to accept that. >> i did find it striking, though, that, look, joe biden, when he came into office, did pledge and promise to bring back a sense of normalcy in government. he's an institutionalist. he has defended these institutions. he promised to bridge and unite a divided country. four years later, he centered his farewell speech on now, saying that there are systemic changes needed on those very democratic institutions. somebody who came in pledging normalcy in almost in effect pledging the status quo as well for government process, is now saying that the supreme court needs term limits. there needs to be a constitutional amendment as well, to prevent a president from being immune from crimes

or being accused of crimes. i mean that that should also be noted. just, you know, four years later, somebody who really, throughout their life centered their political identity on defending the connective tissue on that point, i want to play for everyone. >> i want you to respond to this, neera, as well. but there is a connective tissue. he's he's without saying it, he's talking about a particular person who was very disruptive to the norms. i think he was talking about whether the supreme court involved in all. here's what he had to say about a reference to maybe an unmistakable person. >> we need to amend the constitution to make clear that no president, no president is immune from crimes that he or she commits while in office. the president's power is not limit. it's not absolute, and it shouldn't be. >> i wonder who he's talking about. >> i don't know, and it could be somebody that the supreme court just gave quite a few waivers to. and that's ultimately where i think the progressive left left biden because earlier in his administration, they had asked

for institutional reform. they said that the supreme court was a challenge. they could. supreme court reform got turned into a long report. the george floyd justice and policing act. the filibuster never got busted for that. so that's where he started losing a big part of his base early on, and now has come to recognize some of the systemic challenges that many americans are feeling. and he's leaving it as his own farewell warning to the country. >> but you don't hear joe biden or democrats talking about getting rid of the filibuster. now. they didn't. that's a systemic change that they no longer think is necessary. now that the republicans have a majority in the u.s. senate, which tells you this was all about partisanship, i think we give joe biden way too much of a pass as a defender of institutions. he's the partisan in chief. he wants what's good for democrats, and he always has. >> the irony being that most democrats wanted merrick garland to exercise more power. right. the idea, i would say biden is less the partisan and more the norm. i wanted to norm my way back to calm in america, and we are in a clearly a time where people are demanding

dramatic change, whether it be systemic or partisan, and the normalcy wasn't going to bring people back together. and that said, given the accusations and the convictions against the sitting president and what we've seen elsewhere in the world, how people have reacted to insurrections, it is not with a multiyear investigation process. it is accountability immediately. >> well, partisanship, i mean, certainly is a hallmark of washington, d.c. and the post-watergate world in particular. but they republicans have a trifecta. and frankly, as much as you'd like to exercise some bipartisanship, they may not have to in the traditional sense. how is that going to how do you think that impacted his his address and his warning? >> well, i'm sure i mean, i think he is looking at the horizon and sees big, big changes coming. i think he, you know, the president biden as well as the people around him believe that the president elect means a lot of what he says on the campaign that he's going to bring, you know, massive changes as far as immigration. i think that he

talked about a fear also, and he's mentioned it in his farewell address today for institutions like the justice department, the courts, the press as well. um, so in a way, this warning came. but i think your point is also important. you know, just how much weight and how impactful is a warning when you're on your way out. you know, president biden, in a way, did center his presidency and will always be linked to trump. the goal for him was to defeat trump. he did it once. his aides often said throughout the four years that he was the only one that could do it, and he did not do it. and now, as you leave office, right, this warning to many of his supporters will, you know, i come at a time where the person that you are warning against is about to take power. >> and if you look at the legacies of different presidents, right. jimmy carter, having just passed, was deeply unpopular when he served, you know, finished his one term in office. and 50 years later, we look at his foreign policy and national

security accomplishments. >> well, they say that the successor is a direct reflection of how the people viewed the current president. this might be a good indication of what it goes from here. thank you all so much. well, president biden was stressing tonight the existential threat of climate change has never been clearer, to quote, more than a week, a week after the most destructive fires in southern california history are continuing to burn, the winds are dying down, at least for now. and local officials say the danger, however, is not yet over. i want to go to cnn's bill weir in pacific palisades. bill, as you have surveyed much of the destruction today, you actually came across a kind of an unusual sight. there was a home that seemed to be totally untouched by these fires. why was this home spared? do you think? >> well, that was the question that piqued our interest. >> this home behind me went viral on reddit and other

social media channels because it looks like it was just shot for architectural digest and every other house on this street has turned to ash. so i reached out to the architect, a santa monica guy named greg chasen, who says it was a mixture of luck and design. the the other neighboring lot on that side, the windward side is vacant, so they didn't have a burning home on both sides of them. but he also credits the tempered glass windows, the steel roof, the the walls that are designed to burn for an hour. the fire smart landscaping. know you know, combustible plants, a lot of pea gravel instead of grass in the front yard there. and then he has this concrete wall instead of a picket fence, which protected his house from a burning car. you can see how the aluminum melted. that's like 1200 degrees. i talked to greg about that. he said one part of the plan, but in the end, they're so glad they had it. >> obviously it wasn't there because we thought a car was going to be burning next door,

but it was a big help in this case, and i think everyone needs to be concerned about the flammability of the fences around their property, the lack of roof vents. we have a fully insulated building envelope without any eaves, so that reduced the number of vulnerable areas. >> there's going to be so much rebuilding, laura, going forward here. there is so much need. there was a housing crisis before the fires, as you know, but now you got to figure people are thinking about shelter in the age of climate change in southern california in a whole new way. they pay a premium for some of these features here. hopefully the prices come down as more people adopt these ideas. the insurance companies, in fact, may make it mandatory going forward. >> i'm sure there's a backlog in trying to get this sort of plan. and of course, the permitting process to get it all done. bill weir thank you so much. still ahead, pam bondi fielding questions about everything from jack

smith to pardons and a whole lot of questions. i mean, a lot of questions about kash patel. so what exactly did we learn about the kind of ag that she will be? we'll talk about it next and later. much more on the cease fire deal to get hostages home. and the unprecedented cooperation to get it all done. >> with tailplane sonic toothbrush, you always get a professional level clean featuring a patented whitening brush head that breaks up tough stains like coffee and wine towel cleans, not like any other toothbrushes. >> the base automatically sanitizes charges and dries the brush, making it the perfect gift for anyone who's looking to elevate or add style to their routine. get yours today at talkline.com. >> this is the story of the one who doesn't just see a broken dock. he sees lost revenue, a

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>> the making of a legend premieres january 25th on cnn. >> all right, so truth be told, some of trump's cabinet picks are going to have some tough votes, but perhaps not pam bondi. she had her confirmation hearing today, and it's almost certain that she'll have some pretty smooth sailing trying to get that nomination confirmed and become the next attorney general. let's examine some of the pressing questions that democrats did in fact have for bondi today. shall we? first up, election interference so i want to ask you a factual question. >> who won the 2020 presidential election? >> joe biden is the president of the united states. >> miss bondi is jack smith one of those bad prosecutors that you will prosecute as a.g.?

>> senator, you hesitated a bit when i said the bad ones. every decision will be made in the eye of the beholder. >> i'm just asking whether you would consider jack smith, senator, to be one of the people. how about liz cheney, senator? >> how about merrick garland? i am not going to answer hypotheticals. no one has been prejudged or nor will anyone be prejudged. senator, as i said, the pardons are at the direction of the president. we will look and we will advise. i will look at every case on a case. let me finish on a case by case basis. okay, good. and i abhor violence to police officers. follow up. >> what would you do if your career doj prosecutors came to you with a case to prosecute? >> grounded in the facts and law, but the white house directs you to drop the case. >> senator, if i thought that would happen, i would not be

sitting here today with me sitting here today. >> david ehrenberg, former state attorney for palm beach county, florida, of course, who worked with bondi during her time as the florida attorney general. he'll be testifying at day two of bondi hearing tomorrow. also here, harry litman, former federal prosecutor and deputy assistant attorney general, and also brad todd is back with us as well. all right. let me begin with you here, harry, on this point, because she didn't want she did not give a yes or no answer to the question of who won the election. that ruffled some feathers in that room. why did she go that route? >> well, we know why she went that route. she was a noncontroversial nominee, and she's going to get by anyway. but, look, she wants to be the top federal law enforcement officer in the country. this is a factual question. it's a roman said that really, it's not a stray question. it goes directly to her qualifications. it still matters for the cases she'll have. this is the senate. and besides being

snarky on a lot of occasions, you understood some of her answers. but this, i think, is really disqualifying. you have to be able to answer yes or no questions. do you think about previous controversial nominees? they answer the questions. they don't. they don't try to evade them from the senate. and of course this matters. it's not the stray thing. she needs to be able because she has a history of election denialism. she needs to make that clear. she refused to, mainly because she knew she would get through anyway. >> can she compartmentalize at this point? i mean, one thing that was said consistently, it wasn't about her qualifications or her credentials, but her ability to say no and push back on a president who has a history of putting his thumb on the scale with his ag's. but on this issue, can she compartmentalize and still be qualified for this office? >> i think so, laura, because when she was out doing political rhetoric, saying, let's prosecute the prosecutors or doing a press conference with rudy giuliani, that was in a different role. that was a role of an advocate. this is the chief law enforcement officer of the united states.

and as someone who has worked with her, i've seen her as a chief law enforcement officer of florida. so she can do that. she knows the difference in the roles, and i thought she did pretty well today. she never used the f word fraud when it came to the election. she said she saw some things. she went about as far as anyone could go who would be appointed by donald trump. she said she accepted the election results. so i know i hear what harry is saying. i mean, look, it's a fact. there was no widespread election fraud, but donald trump was never going to nominate someone for attorney general who was going to contradict him on that. >> well, that's part of the concern. i think, that people have. and we know from confirmation hearings, people will say what they will say to make sure they've got that title. in the end, she actually pushed back on that point when she was questioned and made a comment like, i don't have to say anything to you. i'm here to tell you my actual views on this, but should this be the sticking point? it is for these senators. >> well, i will tell you, i think the best thing for the republican party could happen is if the democrats on the senate judiciary committee got more air time, i thought pam

bondi humiliated. senator horner. she noted that senator hirono was the only senator who wouldn't meet with her in advance. she only wanted to use her seven minutes of tv time to get go viral on the internet. she didn't want to ask serious questions, or she'd taken a meeting with pam bondi hirono on that point did suggest that she wanted her answers under oath. >> that was the distinction. >> every other senator asked questions in private and at length where they could discuss things at length, and then they used their seven minutes. it's just an insult to the entire process. but senator hirono is a hack, and she does this all the time. i thought pam bondi was strong. i thought she she didn't let senator padilla push her around. and when chris, the senator from delaware democrat, engaged her responsibly, she engaged him intellectually. i thought she did a great job today, and that's why she's going to be confirmed. >> well, you know who is. >> that's not why she's going to be confirmed. she's going to be confirmed because she already had the votes. and i just think it's no, it's no. sure. and she had him already, but it's no credential that she was nasty to other senators. she wants to be the attorney general. she didn't give the senate their condign.

>> she wasn't nasty. she just didn't let the democrat senators bully her, which she should. she was she was nasty. >> well, let me ask you this question, because the elephant in the room that's not the problem was kash patel. i mean, that certainly pam bondi got her fair share of questions from the senators, but they were also largely concerned with kash patel also concerned with the fact that people that she has worked with in private counsel will be, you know, under her at the department of justice, the emphasis on kash patel knowing the role of the fbi director in relation to the doj, they are part of the investigative bodies that help to aid the prosecutors in their cases and investigations. were they right to focus on how she would work with somebody who, in a different role, has articulated things that run counter to what she expressed today? >> sure. because even though she has the final say when it comes to a prosecution, there's an old saying, you can beat the rap, but you can't beat the ride. so kash patel could make things very difficult on individuals, even at pam bondi decides not to prosecute them. so it's important to get her thoughts on the record. and she did go

against some of the things that kash patel was saying, saying there will be no enemies list inside the department of justice. so i thought she acted in a way that showed that she was above that, above the rhetoric, and was in the role of attorney general. >> did you you've worked with her. you have praised for her as well. do you have concerns that what she has shown you thus far could be compromised by the power dynamic of trump and his attorney general? >> i really believe that even if donald trump asks her to do something that is illegal, that she won't go over the line. she'll still be tethered to the law. you know, the last time you saw attorney generals go beyond the law, like mitchell and nixon, he was imprisoned. you know, no one wants to be like mike nifong, the duke lacrosse prosecutor. there are built in guardrails for an out of control prosecutor. so i think she will go close to the line because she is loyal to trump. but i don't think she'll cross it. she is a 20 year prosecutor and knows the consequences. when you go too far, we shall see. >> i mean, a lot of people who have asked for that role have

auditioned on television in the past. bill barr, for example. they didn't like what it looked like inside. we'll see if she does. thank you everyone. up next, the agonizing wait for families of hostages held by hamas and american edan alexander is among them. but will this ceasefire deal help get him out? and if so, when? the congressman representing the family and their district, josh gottheimer, joins me next. and later, tiktok is now days away from being banned. it's the 19th, but tonight there may be new hope for those who try to save it. ready to party? >> i'm talking about jackpot party, the leading free to play mobile slots game that always gives you more download jackpot party for free and get a 45 million coin bonus jackpot party a party in every spin. >> super beta prostate is the number one selling brand for

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americans are still being held in gaza. four of them are confirmed dead. three of them are presumed to be alive, including new jersey native edan alexander. he is an idf soldier who was stationed near gaza when he was taken hostage on october 7th, 2023. despite the deal, his family is still filled with anxiety. >> he's not on the humanitarian list, and these are the first to go, so we have to sit tight and see what is exactly happening. >> joining me now, congressman josh gottheimer, a democrat from new jersey. congressman, thank you so much for being here today. this has been quite a day. the revelations that have occurred with the cease fire and beyond. unbelievable. and. well, a long time coming, frankly, for so many. you have. have you heard from the parents of edan alexander and how are they feeling tonight about the

possibility that they could be reunited with their son? >> well, as you know, this overall is an incredibly promising. >> we're not there yet, right? and there's phases here. and until the last hostage is released, until the last american comes home, we won't be there. and, you know, i speak to the family regularly. they're just unbelievable people there from my district. they live in, in northern new jersey. and they're incredibly strong. but i think, you know, we've been here before where you seem like you get very close and something happens is often hamas that pulls the rug out. and so, you know, and we're there. i think we've got to keep focused on just making sure we move this forward. >> it's very hard to have that cautious optimism and at the same time want so badly something to happen. i can only imagine. and you're right about the negotiations and the long process. there is thought that it was the combination of the biden administration and the incoming administration working together to some degree, to try to get where we are right now.

does that give you some level of hope about the prospects of democrats and republicans working together? >> i'm melissa, and i think this is the way it should be. you've got an outgoing administration that really built the structure for this deal over many months, working with international partners. and then now, of course, the president elect working together with the incoming administration. and they have now, by the way, for for a while been working closely together. and i think that's a good thing. right. this should not be about credit. this should be about getting the hostages home, making sure we can get that this can come to an end. now, as you know, this is over several phases over the next six weeks. so there's a lot that can happen here. and we've got to make sure this proceeds. and even hamas leadership. i think today said they'd do it again. right. and so i think it's a question of whether they would do october 7th again, that they won't, that they will not stop until there is no israel and jewish people. right. so you have to keep mindful that we've got to make sure that we protect american

interests, our key ally, as this process goes on, of course, you know, continue to make sure we we stop all terrorist activity and get humanitarian aid into the region. right. so a lot of goals while we're getting the hostages out here and as you know, in these phases continue. and then, of course, the last phase is reconstruction. what happens as as israel pulls out in phases out of gaza, what will you know, and then what will it look like afterwards? right. so there's a lot of work to be done between now and over the next six weeks. >> and in fact, the bulk of that work will be under really the administration of donald trump. obviously, they've worked together. i assume you would think that they both deserve some level of i guess credit is the wrong word. but in the spirit of trying to figure out who has to carry the water now, do you have confidence that trump will be able to effectively govern and be at the helm for those next phases? >> i mean, he's made it very clear that he wants the hostages home and that he wants to crush the terrorists. and i

think that's that's all, you know, i agree with that. and by the way, again, when it comes to credit, everybody can get credit if this happens. right. and the hostages get home. it's not about credit. it's about getting these families home, especially the americans. it's making sure that edan alexander is home with his family, and the other americans are home. >> you know, you're on the house intelligence committee and there was some changes tonight. speaker mike johnson actually removed mike turner as chairman. and then you have your fellow democrat, jim himes, who hinted that the move could be to appease the incoming president, donald trump. johnson, of course, has denied that, says it's an independent decision. are you concerned that lawmakers are already coming under perhaps the the fear of reprisal or trying to ingratiate themselves to him? >> listen, i think mike turner is deeply respected by democrats and republicans on the committee and has and led in a way that really brings people together. the

intelligence committee is not a very partisan place. it's a place where we go and do our work to protect america's national security and work with the intelligence community. and i think whoever comes next, whoever the speaker decides to appoint, i hope continues that spirit. it's very, very important and doesn't bow. we have a responsibility as congress to oversee the intelligence community. that's the responsibility. that's what our very solemn and important responsibility and to and to be briefed regularly. and we want to make sure you keep that separation of powers is very important overall. and i think as congress goes forward, we have a job to do. and part of our independent job right in the constitution is to be a check on the administration. right. and i hope that leadership in the house and the speaker and others remember that, how important that is. >> thank you so much for joining us today, congressman. still ahead, does donald trump have an ace up his sleeve to save tiktok? details on the new decision he is now considering and the major invite he's reportedly extending to tiktok

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potential buyer. and that's not all. the new york times is reporting that the ceo of tiktok will be attending trump's inauguration. but even if trump succeeded with the executive order on day one of his administration, it would be a day too late. remember, the ban goes into effect on sunday. now, congress passed this law with overwhelming bipartisan support. many lawmakers think that china's government could manipulate content or get data from american users. since tiktok is chinese owned. this is a case that has huge implications for national security and free speech and freedom of association and politics. but it's also economic. 170 million americans use tiktok, according to the company, around 7 million americans. small businesses are on it, and they would lose $1 billion in revenue in just one month of a ban. as for the 2 million creators who use the app to make a living, they would

suffer $300 million in total lost earnings in just a month. now, one of those creators is brian firebaugh. he's a texas cattle rancher with more than 450,000 followers and one heck of a beard. he's also one of several tiktokers suing the government over the law, arguing that it violates their first amendment rights. brian joins me now. brian, i know you're known as cattle guy. it's good to see you tonight. thank you for joining us. i have to ask you if tiktok goes away for american users on sunday. tell me how that would change your life. >> to say that i've made a few mistakes. honestly, as a first generation rancher, it's almost crippling. tiktok is how i reach our customers. that's that. they're the customers that are buying our beef. that is basically putting the roof over our head. those are the customers that are buying our cattle. um, it's very, very hard as a first generation business and just in general, just in your marketing aspects. and so tiktok has been such a fantastic marketing platform

for us as a first generation ranch. and so essentially, if you take take it away, you've taken away our megaphone for reaching our customers. >> did you expect when you first started using it that it would have such an impact on your livelihood? >> you know what that means? >> absolutely not. no. it's i originally started as just a way to kind of help advocate for agriculture is just a way to provide some education regarding, let's say, the texas longhorn cattle out there, because there's a lot of myths and such. and in the process of it, it just grew so much. that was the great thing about tiktok is its algorithm. so we reached a lot of people that wanted to hear what what it is that we had to say. and ultimately, at the end of the day, when we showed up at the farmers market and we said, hey, look, we're here. we had people driving in from out of the state to show up to farmers market to buy our beef, which is just absolutely incredible. and it was not expected. >> you know, there's this balancing act at the supreme court says it's weighing. on the one hand, the government says that there are national security concerns with the app.

on the other hand, they're saying, hey, there's other things you can use in social media. you could use those instead. how do you see this balance? are you concerned at all about the government's thought that there really is a national security concern? >> no, because if it was truly a national security concern, let's face it, president biden, vice president kamala harris and donald trump would not be actively campaigning on that app. let's i mean, we need to be honest about this. and when we start looking at is, is this truly are we truly scared as as a nation? are we truly scared that of our national security? but i'm scared of our our data security rights with within our own country, within our own government, you know, and you're telling me that you're just concerned about it going over to china? well, hello, it's we are americans. we get to choose where our data goes. as many americans right now have chosen to go over to a

chinese app. it's we need to understand that it's we're going to give it to wherever we want to. the big thing, though, is truly understanding, oh, go ahead. i'm sorry. >> no, no, i want you to finish your point. it's an important one. >> well, the thing for me is understanding. it's i do not feel that this is truly a concern over our data security or our national security. what? i believe that this is predominantly the federal government wanting to control the narrative. and if they can't control the narrative, they're just simply going to shut it down. >> brian farber we're talking about days away from that happening. thank you so much for joining us and sharing your experience. >> yes, ma'am. thank you. it's an honor up next, they have dedicated their lives to helping the homeless. >> but now they are the ones without a home. and yet the work continues. the inspiring

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>> cnn this morning with kasie hunt next they have spent their adult lives working to help the homeless, and now they have lost their own home in the blaze that consumed much of the altadena community. >> that's the story of the couple i'm about to speak to. you'd think they'd drop everything to get their own lives together, but that is not the case. the ruffins are social workers, their clients, the homeless of skid row, people who most of society tries to avoid. not the ruffins. they went straight back to work helping those who need it most. anthony referencing the l.a. times i got my own problems, but i'm fortunate so many of the people down there on skid row are dealing with addiction and

homelessness, and don't have some of the resources i have. i mean, i got a motel room right now and they don't have that. an incredible act at a time when anthony is mourning his own home. and it wasn't just any home. the home was purchased back in the 1970s by a black man, carl williams, who found certain neighborhoods in l.a. were off limits to black people, but not the west side of altadena. williams raised his family there with his wife, myrtle, eventually selling the home to his stepson, anthony ruffin. ruffin told the l.a. times. he worked two jobs to keep the property, knowing how much it meant to his family, and now it is gone. anthony ruffin and johnny miller join me now. thank you both for being here. your story is so powerful and moving to me. i'm so glad that both of you are here to share it, because anthony, you are face to face with homeless individuals. every single day. and i wonder

now, did it ever occur or did you ever think that you might end up in that same situation? >> well, i always knew that i was a sickness or a tragedy away from being homeless myself. um, so that's why i give to the homeless population the way i give to the homeless population, because i understand that people are just a paycheck away or a crisis away from being homeless themselves. um, and they need somebody there to help them guide them through the process. so i'm there all the time to help with that process. >> i mean, the strength that you have to devoting yourself and you way you speak reminds me of that phrase. but for the grace of god go i. knowing how vulnerable so many people are, not only in this economy, but in life, and you have been devoting yourself to others even when you have just lost so much, you're still out there. what has continued to motivate you to

do that? >> well, i have people that i'm working with that i have appointments for housing and stuff like that, that that needs to happen. um, um, although i am homeless and in between housing right now, my situation is temporary, but their situation is permanent. um, and it is dependent on me to, to come through and keep my word and, and, um, do what i say i'm going to do. and, um, that's that's what i do because i, i'm a beacon of hope for people. and i want to continue to be that beacon of hope for people. >> johnny, just hearing what he has to say is so this is so inspiring to think about. and just to a man of his word, when many would understand for both of you to stop at a time like this. and yet you keep going. and johnny, johnny, you were able to save your dog's dog and one of your cats, but you also lost

another cat and two chickens to the fire. can you describe what else you have lost? >> yes, um, i lost a lot of family heirlooms that i feel like my family entrusted me to take care of and pass on. um. and i feel like i've let my family down. um, i lost a ring that was my grandmother's that my grandfather had given her. um, as an anniversary gift. and, um, they're all sentimental things, but they're things that i can't replace. um. and so that's that's what i feel i've lost, and i miss, i miss our other cat very, very much. um, because it was such a fun, fun cat. very interesting cat. >> um, johnny, that makes me my heart hurt to think. but you should know. of course, you are the culmination of all of that legacy, and i hope you don't forget and lose sight of what is important. i know it's hard in these times, anthony, to think about what you've lost

physically, but could you help and share with the world right now the history of your home and why it has been so special to both of you? and of course, your family? >> oh my father, i call him my father. um, but that homan 1972, uh, with a bunch of other african americans on on that side of town. um, i've been living in that home since 1978. um, a lot of my cousins lived in that two bedroom house. um, sleeping in bunk beds and us up under bunk beds. and it was love up in that house. um, my father worked really, really hard and sacrificed a lot. my mom worked hard and sacrificed a lot of clean homes and everything else to sacrifice. um, so we could have somewhere to be in a safe neighborhood. and it was a neighborhood of of people that cared about people. um, um, the

leaves around the corner, the phillips is on the corner. the wallace is the graves down the street. uh, um, robert across the street. lily and steve down the street. and i could walk down to these people's house today and get something to eat. if i wanted to. they watched. they raised me and watched me grow up. up in that neighborhood and, um, and being in that neighborhood when i was younger, i could walk around and eat fruits from every tree that i wanted to. and wow, it was just a great place to be. and it still is a great place to be where i can sit back and somebody will be, um, riding a horse down the street and and they'll let you jump on a horse and ride the horse with them for a little while. and it's just that type of type of place up there. um, and it's a beautiful place to be. >> well, anthony ruffin, johnny miller, it's no wonder that a great place to be had such great people there as well, like yourselves. thank you so much. and thank you all for watching.