changes. all of us do. i understand that i'm a chief elected official here in the city of milwaukee, the top ranking elected official in my city. but you don't come in and just simply lob off entire departments. or significant portion departments without using a scalpel. in order to do that, because the consequences could be dire. and that's exactly what we're seeing on the ground in milwaukee. when the department tries to contact our partners at the federal government that we need to work with in order to solve situations like this, it's. it's unspeakable. >> the science here, the effects of lead paint are just debilitating. i mean, there's been so much experience, so much, so much study of this in other schools around the country. do you have any idea now of exactly how many children would have been exposed and potentially affected by this? >> well, there are a

children's wisconsin or children's hospital. 16th street community health centers, others to provide clinics for children and families that may have been exposed to lead, to make sure that there are no additional health consequences for those young people. so it's a situation that we continue to keep an eye on. fortunately, there haven't been that many young people who have tested positive for lead, but it's something that we continue to keep our eye on. >> yeah. but before we go, what do you tell to parents who say, hey, is it safe for my kids to go to school? >> we are leaving no stone unturned. the city of milwaukee, under my leadership, in collaboration with the new. we have a brand new superintendent for milwaukee public schools, doctor brenda cassellius. we're taking the matter very, very seriously, and we're working to make sure that we address the issue for all families. so.

it's safe. >> mayor cavalier johnson of milwaukee. we do appreciate you joining us tonight. >> thank you jim. >> and thanks to so much to all of you for joining. i'm jim sciutto in tonight for kaitlin. cnn news night with abby phillip is up next. >> tonight as markets crater, a defiant trump says he's not budging on his unprecedented war. instead, he's going golfing. plus, from billionaires to barstool, maga promoters get a wake up call. >> and everything's in the because of it. >> also, you may say he's a dreamer, but barack obama sings the imagine if he did this song and calls out voices in the crowd. >> they are mute right now. >> and return to sender. a judge orders trump to bring back the man mistakenly shipped to a mega prison. >> in a blink of an eye. our three children lost their

father. >> but is it too late? live at the table, van lathan, joe. borelli, jeanette. hoffman, john fugelsang and an economic debate. americans with different perspectives aren't talking to each other, but here they do. good evening. i'm abby phillip in new york. let's get right to what america is talking about. donald trump doesn't give an f. that's what one white house official says about the markets plunging over his trade wars. and it appears to be true as 401. s and companies suffered today. trump and his allies, including many of whom cheered him on in the rose garden event, were mia. the house is in recess. and as for trump himself, he spent the day working on his golf swing, which is interesting considering what he has said about democratic presidents. >> obama. it was reported today,

played 250 rounds of golf. everything is executive order because he doesn't have enough time, because he's playing so much golf. obama ought to get off the golf course and get down there. i'm going to be working for you. i'm not going to have time to go play golf. he played more golf last year than tiger woods. that plays more golf than people on the pga tour. i love golf, i think it's one of the greats, but i don't have time. if i were in the white house, i don't think i'd ever see turnberry again. i don't think i'd ever see doral again. i'm not going to be playing much golf. believe me, if i win this, i'm not going to be playing much golf. >> unfortunately, since trump began his economic war, bad news is becoming a trend. the dow dropping 2000 points for only the fourth time in history. the nasdaq in bear market territory. nations have begun retaliating already. that includes china. but despite all of this, trump says that he's not budging. he is not changing his policies. joining us at the table are our economic experts. cnn business editor at large richard quest. also with us, cnn global and

economic analyst rana foroohar. also with us, mark. lopresti, a market strategist. and donald trump is moderating, i think, a debate within his allies and among people in the white house, even. is this a negotiating tactic, or is this just a thing that we're doing now? because the united states of america, we like tariffs now. we didn't for 100 years, but we do now. so in a truth social, he says big businesses are not worried about tariffs because they know they are here to stay. so are we negotiating or are we just a tariff country now? >> donald trump is always negotiating. abby i mean, let's let's understand this is this is his approach. he's been a dealmaker his entire life. it makes for great soundbites to say, this isn't a negotiation. this is what it's going to be. it's tariffs, maybe tariffs. but of course it's a negotiation. and we've already seen elements of behind the scenes talks even with china that are going on. notwithstanding his time on the golf course. and i'd like to say on the record, i have not been on the golf course myself

since last august. >> too busy, too. >> busy, too busy, not not in the white house, but. >> too busy. do you buy that? >> i think it's always a negotiation. i agree with that. and you have. it's interesting you saw it. you know, certain retail stocks going up just a little bit today on the news that oh you're going to pull back tariffs on vietnam or oh there's a behind the scenes negotiation with japan. but i think there's something more fundamental happening. and i believe donald trump has bungled what could have been a reset of the global trading system if we had done it with our allies and really gone after china, gone after the low hanging fruit, had a plan and communicated it? no. instead, we're bringing down the u.s. economy and the global markets, and we are undermining trust. which of our trading partners, even if he pulls back from tariffs, is going to believe anything he says tomorrow, next week, next month. i think it's going to take a long time to claw back the value that has been destroyed in the last couple of days. >> there is a new sadness, in a sense, a sort of upset by many

of us who cover this because there's a realization, as the week has gone on, that this is totally an absolutely unnecessary. this vandalism, as i called it, this destruction of wealth, was completely unneeded. and it was done with just wanton disregard. you do not have two consecutive days of market falls of 6% into bear market territory on the whim of a of a policy. now put this in perspective. the last time we had two two days of 6% falls was the pandemic. strip out the pandemic as being sui generis, and you're back to 2008. strip out 2008 and you're almost back to 1987. when i started covering all this stuff. there was no need for this. this is the point. this is why so many of us are upset about this. there was no need for this to be done in this way. there was a proper way to do tariff or to do

trade reform. but bullying, haranguing and then literally hitting them over the head was not the way to do it. >> i've been listening to what they've been saying because i really want to understand this, and i'm going to take the other position. i think that donald trump and scott bessent and all of them, they mean it. they mean it because they want to raise a lot of money. and here is what scott bessent said to tucker carlson in an interview that was released today, about just how much money they need to raise through these tariffs. >> do you have any sense of how much the u.s. government anticipates bringing in from the tariffs announced yesterday? >> it's going to be a moving target for sure, but could it could it be anywhere from 300 billion to $600 billion a year? sure. >> okay. so that's that's meaningful revenue. >> very meaningful. but what will happen with tariffs over time. the ultimate goal of the tariffs. and the president says all the time. bring your factory here. that's the best solution

toward getting away from a tariff wall. >> so okay. yeah. give your reaction. >> 300 maybe. but that assumes that the rest of the world is just going to stay stationary and not cut deals with each other. if i were china, i would be in brussels right now saying to europe, you know what? let's go. let's let's figure this out together. and who is going to trust as an investment coming to the u.s. with a president that's acting like this? i have actually been for tariffs and reindustrialization in very targeted ways for a long time. i think it's important to have more manufacturing in the states. i think it's important to build chips and ships and all of those things. but you've got to have both. the tariff tool used very precisely and a real industrial policy at home and stability. we don't have stability. the state of. >> that business. the other part of what he said was that, oh, bring your factories here and then we'll have some workers, but then we'll also have

robots. and i. workers are not going to be ultimately the beneficiary of any of this. and i think they are acknowledging that. >> that's right. i'm the average american right here at this table. because you guys are talking and i don't really understand what it is that you guys are saying. like, seriously, i don't get it. the only thing that a lot of people who have families who carpool, who go to and from the work, who live in the suburbs, who live in the cities, they're just wondering when things are going to get bad. that's what they're wondering. and all of the macroeconomic talk is going over their head. and honestly, i feel for them. i feel for them because it doesn't seem like anyone is talking directly to them. they're talking to the markets, they're talking to each other, they're talking to the financial system. but no one's telling somebody, hey, at the end of this summer, when you need to buy school supplies for your kids to go back to school, when it's backpack time like that, money will be there and those prices will be stable. no one is talking to them. and i think that's the biggest tragedy

in all of this. >> the truth to be told to them. most people don't want to say, because we had it today. from jerome powell, chair of the fed, for the first, he said there will be higher inflation, there will be slower growth. so the real sadness tonight is the people at home who are about looking to retire. absolutely in the next year or two and have suddenly seen their retirement funds go down by 20, 30, 40% because they wanted to take advantage of the magnificent seven and all of those sort of things. tonight, they're wondering, how the heck do i actually do it? this is real life economics. to your point, you're right. the sort of nonsense that we can all go, go, go on about. >> it's not nonsense. i'm just saying. yeah. >> but it's totally true because you're making a really important point. there is not some kind of 360 plan that has been articulated to america here. you know, trump said, well, we're

going to have to take a little pain. what does that mean? who's going? who's taking the pain? the average working person will be taking the pain because when inflation hits, those are the people that spend 60% of their take home in energy and food fueling their cars. i mean, we're going to be in a very, very difficult situation. >> i find it insane that we're all finally concerned about inflation. that was a word that that really didn't exist for many years while joe biden was president. but i want to point out something last night, richard, you took off your shoe. you said it's made in vietnam. it's going to be it's going to be 34% more expensive next year. today, the secretary general of viet nam reached out to president trump and said, we want to have zero tariffs for both countries, proving to some degree, to some degree, that this is a leverage play. >> does that prove, joe? >> it proves it proves it. >> proves what is that? what does that prove? it proves at the end of the conversation, the president said, nice talking to you. and nothing about, oh, we're going to great. we're going to lower our tariffs. >> i'm going to tell you.

>> what he said. great conversation. >> let's look, historically, 1996, there was a member of congress who stood on the floor looking at 2% tariffs. we had on china, 35% tariffs they had on us. this woman demanded that we had reciprocal tariffs. you know what that was nancy pelosi 2008. same thing. a guy stood on the senate floor lamenting, lamenting. i'm just saying they lamented the loss of america's. >> workers, lowered its tariff barrier to zero. you know what we did? we raised our tariff barrier to 17%. >> again, just going back. democrats have repeatedly said, i have a list of quotes here, repeatedly said we should have reciprocal tariffs on different countries and did nothing. they're a party of cory booker's. let's just talk. i didn't do anything. >> you talk about the vietnam. i'm so glad you brought up vietnam. >> i tipped. >> you off. and i'll also bring up cambodia. the problem with going to zero tariffs with vietnam and cambodia. great. first of all, the u.s. exports almost next to nothing. to those countries, it's negligible. it's less than less than 500 million. but let's assume you go to zero. the problem with both

of those countries is not the nominal tariff rate of 30% 15%, it's the non-tariff barriers, the government procurement rules, the ownership rules, everything else that donald trump quite rightly said on wednesday, quite rightly. >> took his shoe off. you said it's going to be 34% more expensive because of the tariff today. the secretary general, forgive me, i forget the party name. the president's called called donald trump and said we want to actually negotiate, but that's not going to help favorable. that would be favorable. the problem is democrats have been promising this. bernie sanders used to call free trade a right wing conspiracy or something like that. never did anything about it, never did anything about it. >> i'm sorry i got to beg to differ, because here's the history and i'm going to give both sides some credit. trump won. bob lighthizer, the ustr comes in and says, you know what? we got to rejigger the global trading system. it was a good thing to say tariffs on china. fine. biden keeps those. then he actually articulates a real industrial policy. he says what do we need most of all in this country? chips. we brought

back the semiconductor industry in 18 months. that's how you do this. trump now comes in. and he had just let me finish. he had an opportunity here actually given the strength of the u.s. economy at this moment to really work with allies and say, this is the time europe, canada, mexico, we're going to go to china and say, here's the new game and here's how it's going to be played. he didn't do that. he is squandering. >> our did i not say taiwan? >> i have to disagree. >> i have to disagree with that slightly because that's not giving president trump any credit for the amount of foreign investment that has been pledged in this very brief time of this administration. it's, by most estimates, between 2 to $3 trillion commitments from softbank, from taiwan semi to bring back richard. you scoff, i do. >> scoff, i do because these are these. >> are issue with the scarf sir. >> no you can take as much as you like but these are these are of course if it happens. >> they are. >> wisconsin wisconsin and the factory that was supposed to be built by i can't remember. the company in 2018 never happened.

these are promises being made to appease a president, to get him off your back. let's see how much of that. >> including some promises that. >> we're making, including some promises. hyundai motors. >> some plans that. were already in the. >> works opening up. >> just a second. >> sorry. >> justin trudeau is the guy from. >> including some promises that were made that were planned when joe biden was president and held off to announce after they waited to see who won the election. businesses are not stupid. they they do what they need to do to get in the good graces of donald trump. it's not rocket science. one one last note. they were supposed to have a deal with china on tiktok. supposed to be announced this weekend. that is on hold now. >> and why do you think that is, though, a.b.? >> well, because china says we want you to bring down your tariffs, and we're going to hold tiktok hostage until you do. and they're they're getting their way. >> but that's to your initial point. it's part of the negotiation. >> we are on the winning side of that game. >> but that remains to.

>> be seen. >> not on the winning side of something. china has all the power. >> if chaos is the only thing that you can count on, people will bet on chaos. and when you're betting on chaos, that keeps you tense, it keeps you tight and you don't move in good faith, you think, hey, this guy changes his mind every single minute, every single hour, and you start to kind of hold on to it. right? >> correct. >> all right, everybody, we got to leave it there for this conversation. but more ahead. mark and ryan, thank you very much for joining us. everyone else, stick around. up next, trump's favorite billionaires are taking big hits from all of this. and so are some of trump's biggest supporters. more special guests are going to join our table. plus, barack obama and kamala harris are speaking out for the very first time in months, and they are not holding back on trump's second term.

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now. >> welcome back. >> have i got news for you. new tomorrow on cnn. >> donald trump's tariff wars are taking off. even some of his loudest supporters. >> his giant tariff policy that he just dropped on the market unilaterally, probably unconstitutionally. president trump is doing should never, if it was ever delegated by congress to the executive. that's insane. and it probably wasn't is not a national emergency that justifies one of the biggest tax increases on american consumers in the history of america. >> trump has put his tariffs all over the place. i've been trying to understand them. i don't like it's more a trade deficit. tariff, tariff to me like, hey, we get this much from you and you get this much from us. let's even that up. let's get some wacky formula and do tariffs and everything's in the because of it. >> but beyond the rabble rousers, take a look at the

fascinating snapshot in time that's ri index from bloomberg, which tracks their bottom lines. and three of those people on that list. the top four are in the red, and they all sat front row, by the way, at trump's inauguration. and they have bowed in many ways to trump over the last several months. the fourth in the green you see there, that's warren buffett. he wasn't in the front row at all. he's made money over the last year, unlike the other three, he's been no fan of tariffs. and he recently called them an act of war and likely anticipating this. buffett has spent the last year dumping stocks and building cash. so if anything changes trump's mind, could it be elites? on mar a lago's patio, jeannette hoffman and john fugelsang are both are are all fugelsang. excuse me, are all are all here with us at the table? you know, the portnoy and shapiro of it all really just shows there is some

nervousness happening here. portnoy is. he says he still supports trump. he's going to give him some time, maybe six weeks. but the fundamental thing and i thought his explanation was pretty good. they made up a random formula. now i'm losing money and everything seems like it's going down. that's not a good set of facts for the trump administration. >> yeah. and you know, look, dave portnoy has been pretty honest and pretty candid. and when he agrees with trump, he says it. when he disagrees with trump, he says that too. but, you know, i am old enough to remember when republicans were pro growth, pro trade, anti-tax, anti-tariff. and it seems like we're upside down right now where democrats are the ones who are saying no tariffs, no taxes, and republicans are the ones that are saying, this is a great idea. let's tariff everybody. it doesn't make sense to me right now. >> it is the upside down. actually. >> yes or no. in many ways, we're exactly where we were five years ago. there's a gigantic existential threat over us, as was with the beginnings of covid. we don't know how bad this threat is going to be. how

many of us will be hurt? we're all around the world shivering in the shadow of this giant question mark, and the only thing we know for sure is that the american president is not going to tell us the truth day by day. this has been a bloodbath. jeff bezos is now middle class, i think. i think jeff bezos just moved back into his mother's garage and he's selling books again. i mean. >> he's going to have to sell his little van jones. >> you can buy amazon stock pretty cheap. so think of it as a sale. >> but in february they pulled back at the last minute, which made it seem like they were manipulating the market in march. the first week they pulled back. you know what i'm talking about, mr. quest. they pulled back at the last minute, making it seem like they were manipulating. >> going to pull back now. >> they can't. >> say that. they're not. >> going to. >> what i would like to know from our republican friends here is how much pain are you prepared to take from middle america? good question. well, before. well, so i'm not tarring you with the entire brush of the issue. but before you recognize whether you recognize it as a terrible mistake or not, how much political pain? never mind economic, has everybody prepared

to take? >> well, if you look at the latest polls, if you look at tariffs, 69% of republicans oppose tariffs. i don't think it's about whether republicans are going to take it. it's how voters feel. >> well. >> i mean, these politicians. >> feel okay. well, let me let joe answer that. yeah. >> i think this is something that trump didn't hide from us. right. if there's one thing that you could say about donald trump on the campaign trail is that he promised to do exactly this. he promised to issue tariffs. and i recall being on panel similar to this in 2017, 2018, when sort of his first round of tariffs came out in his first administration. and there was this prediction of panic and doom and gloom and ten years of stock market gloom in the future. and then they went so well that joe biden kept most of them and then actually added tariffs on chinese rubber, on chinese medical supplies. et cetera. et cetera. so, so i think a lot of this is just a little bit of a little bit of genuine pain. right? richard, point out if you are, you know, facing your retirement, if you are ready to cash out in your stock. yes. it's not a good day to do that. trust me. it's not a good day. however, if you're looking at the long term, this is something that probably will

play out to the benefit of american workers. >> was paying one of the promises? >> no. look, i mean, there has to be. a little changing. >> the lower prices. >> day one the macroeconomic system of our country is going to be painful. that's why most politicians have both parties promised to do it. never actually do it. well, he i think we're seeing the first time someone actually doing it. and yeah, it's going to be some kicks in the shin. >> two things to be to be fair. number one, he didn't run on that. what he ran on was being the economic savior of the united states of america. he didn't run on. listen, you guys, things are going to get a little worse, but they'll be better in 2 or 3 years. so a lot of people are waking up to the reality that they're getting a return that they didn't really cast their vote for. that's true. secondly, it's interesting with portnoy and shapiro because of what they represent. they actually represent just people because they're not politicians. like they don't have to wait two years for someone to cast their vote. and on a referendum on whether or not they'll still be in power, they have to maintain credibility with the people that listen to them day after day

after day after day. which means if those people are feeling pain, they just can't lie to them or those people will actually in the market choose somebody else to listen to. >> also, portnoy said he lost $7 million, right? >> i'm not i'm not a huge dave portnoy fan, but he i'm not a huge dave portnoy fan. but like, he keeps it real with his audience. >> well, the other thing is, i mean, to joe's point, though, i mean, look, trump, it's a complicated picture. he ran on actually 20% tariffs that was thought to be crazy. now the tariffs are actually higher than that. but this was trump back in 1988 okay. 1988 talking about this very issue. >> i'd make our allies forgetting about the enemies. the enemies you can't talk to so easily. i'd make our allies pay their fair share. we're a debtor nation. something's going to happen over the next number of years with this country, because you can't keep going on losing 200 billion. and yet we we let japan come in and dump everything right into our markets and everything. it's not free trade. >> okay. two quick things about

this. one. donald trump is stuck right there okay. his his mindset is right there. and it has not gone anywhere for 30 years. but the other thing is he was wrong about that in the last 30 years. we left japan in the dust. the united states economically did really well. but he's taking the country down this path. >> they did it through the united states, had really well through things like the plaza accord, the louvre accord, through the various agreements that the reagan administration and others put in place that managed trade and managed that bilateral deficit. the china tariffs that you're talking about, they were targeted. they were specific. they were directional. by the way, the other two sets of tariffs, the aluminum and steel and the solar panels, they were an abject disaster. >> a thousand jobs gained, 75,000 lost. exactly. because just steel. that was just steel. >> donald trump has had a myopic obsession with tariffs. for as long as i've been covering him. and i'm talking about tunnel

vision. and what you're seeing is the fruition of that view. >> over on capitol hill, just quickly over on capitol hill, they sent stephen miller, sent himself. i don't know who sent him, but here's how it was received. according to politico, people in the room described the appearance as bizarre. miller alluded to the british empire and prompted befuddlement. what on earth was that? one senior leadership aide said, describing the reaction afterwards. he was very arrogant, said the second aide. miller was lecturing folks while the market was in freefall, said a third. i mean, this is on capitol hill, where in the senate they've got four republicans already saying, we got to put a stop to this. and now a republican in the house, don bacon, is introducing a similar bill. there's going to be a little bit of revolt happening. >> but it's like they've seen the first three star wars movies and they figure out darth vader is the bad guy. in the last ten minutes of return of the jedi. i mean, this is a man who actually outsourced his own manufacturing to china and mexico to avoid paying a living wage to

americans. but he says he wants manufacturing. this is a man who has hired undocumented immigrants to work on his properties in two different centuries, because he did not want to pay an american worker a living wage. but he really cares about illegal immigration. i mean, we could do it all night. we can't believe what he actually says. and a lot of conservatives are realizing we never signed up for this. >> well, i think our senators and our members of congress are going to hear it back home, especially if there's pain for more than a couple of weeks. you know, you had the four senators that voted with the democrats, but you've also had some senators publicly say thom tillis in north carolina said, our farmers are one crop away from bankruptcy. they can't withstand pain. you had senator kennedy say, okay, he might be right in the long term, but in the long term, we're all dead. short term matters, right? >> ain't that the truth? the long term is going to be a long, long way from now for so many americans in the next few months. coming up next, richard quest, by the way, thank you so much for joining us. everyone else, stay with us. coming up next, imagine if joe biden or barack obama were doing this,

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>> i've noticed. >> this among. some. >> wealthier folks. >> who, you know. >> after george floyd. >> they were right there. >> and a. >> bunch of. >> companies were. >> talking about how. >> they cared about diversity, and they wanted to do this, and they were all for that. and they are mute right now. but what that tells me is it was okay when it was cool and trendy. and when it's not, not so much. >> obama also took time to slam president trump, calling out his treatment of the press, student protesters and bullying law firms. quote, imagine if i had done any of this. it's unimaginable that the same parties that are silent now would have tolerated behavior like this from me, or a whole bunch of my predecessors. i don't know. i can't say he's wrong about that. i mean, frankly, we kind of know because there were times when obama did things on the press. he

investigated a fox reporter over a leak. he tried he tried to not let fox into you know, a set of interviews with an official and then actually relented, but got a lot of heat for it. and now those people are silent. >> yeah. i mean, he's 1,000% right, but i'm not sure that it matters what i want to hear from prominent leaders on the left is vision. vision. vision. what vision do you have for the american people who have entrusted you as their power brokers? i get it. it's unfair. it's not right. it's. there's a double standard. all of that is true. how are we going to get out of this? vision. vision, vision. and i think if there's one thing that the left or the democrats more specifically are failing at right now, it's not about diagnosing the problem. it's not about looking into the hole. it's about getting shovels

to put the dirt back in and tell people how they're going to be able to sleep soundly on that, on that turf. so while i agree with the the former president, i agree with president obama. i just want to hear the democrats give us the diagnosis for how this is supposed to go. >> what is the. >> vision like? i think that's what the problem is. i don't think there's an agreement on what the vision should be for the democratic party. i think some people should think it should be over here to the left, and some people think the party needs to come back to the center. >> so it's always been for both parties. i mean, the republican party has the same civil war, and it's going to get a lot tighter right now. we're still living in the bernie fan hillary fan civil war. but for all the democratic party low poll numbers, their positions are consistently more popular than the republican party. women's reproductive rights, paid family leave, taxing billionaires, medicare, covering vision, hearing and dental. decriminalizing cannabis. gun safety legislation on issue after issue. the majority of americans agree with the democratic party platform, so shame on them if they can't. >> sell it at 21% historic. >> again, republicans aren't

that higher either. >> because van is right. because van, i think, pointed out very articulately that the democratic party doesn't have any vehicle, meaning a person, to convey their message in any fundamentally positive, uplifting and hopeful way. look, i didn't like president obama. not a fan, right? but he was an excellent conveyor of the message of the democratic party that people wanted to hear and saw it in 2007 and 2008. there is no one. and i mean, look, cory booker got so much credit for just giving a filibuster. he won an award for speaking the most right. that is the low bar. >> i can't. >> take the democratic party is standing. >> right now because i can't tell you something, though, that actually cut through. and the reason why it cut through, i was surprised that it cut through. >> because somebody was doing something. >> it cut through because they saw somebody willing to put it on the line for them. >> they want to. >> fight her. he stood up there and he didn't go to the bathroom for 25 hours. he made himself. >> god bless, uncomfortable. >> we are witnessing so many business leaders and people on the capitulation weasel train bowing down to a man they despise. people on my sirius xm

show call in every night, hungry for someone to be a leader in the democratic party or in the movement. and i keep having to remember that this is not how it works. it's great that barack obama gave a speech. jimmy carter would have done ten protests in a hunger strike by now. but at the end of the day, it's going to be the people who lead, and eventually a democrat will sign a law and take. >> that away a little bit more from obama, because he kind of touches on that. listen. >> easy. during most of our lifetimes. to. say you are a progressive or say you are for social justice or say you're for free speech and not have to pay a price for it. and now we're at one of those moments where, you know what? it's not enough just to say you're for something. you may actually have to do something and possibly sacrifice a little bit.

>> yeah. i mean, it's to your point, but i think it's a couple of things for obama and for the democrats. one, there are a lot of performative ness over the last few years probably needs to go by the wayside. but the other thing is that you listed a bunch of issues that are very popular. but democrats also ignored the other things that are very important to americans, like the cost of living. and. >> biden administration ignored the cost of living for working class people. >> yeah. >> yeah., yeah, yeah. >> i think. >> i. >> mean. >> i mean, the voters. >> said to the voters, yeah, the voters. >> that's why the voters. >> voted for trump. >> well let me. okay. well, the. >> stimulus, the student loans. >> here's what i would say. >> capital insulin. >> here's what i would say is the argument that that you could make about the biden administration not understanding the catastrophic effect that inflation would have on the psyche of americans. was that a they denied that inflation was an issue for a very long time, and b, rather than crafting an economic message, a lot of times they just didn't want to talk

about it. and i think that's an issue. >> i mean, they denied that. >> i think that they didn't. if they had an economic message, i think that would have broken through. >> but i think that they denied that inflation was an issue specific to america. thank you. meaning that inflation here was something very insidious that wasn't happening. >> and i. >> get that to the rest of the world. >> as we were talking earlier in the show about these economic arguments that go over people's heads, they don't care what's going on in the rest of the world. >> the reality. >> but you know what? >> they want to know how much food costs, why their housing is so expensive, and do they feel safe in their home. >> but the reality is that the u.s. has lower post covid inflation than all of our g7 allies. and the biden white house wasn't able to sell that reality. >> democrats failed on. right. just like you could say, the tariffs will have an impact on consumer prices. there's no doubt people will feel that just like the hit to the stock market over the last two days had an impact on people's wallets. they feel that the denial that inflation, whether it was higher in germany or higher in france, nobody gives a if you lived, if

you live in new york, if you lived in alabama, that's what you cared about, right? >> it's just the lie that was joe biden's inflation. that's what stuck. the lie stuck. >> in joe biden owned it. owned it. he didn't come up with a plan. as you pointed out. he didn't come up with a vision. he didn't execute anything. >> he had lower inflation. >> than all of that. we got to leave it. >> we got. >> to leave it. >> we got to leave it there. well, we didn't even i mean, that is an issue. that's a big issue. the immigration issue as well. coming up next, more breaking news tonight. a judge now ordering trump to get the man that they mistakenly deported to an el salvador prison back to the united states, but is that even possible? >> ever since they got directv, they don't miss a game. not the opening pitch. not even the pregame flyover. >> bobby, look. it's baseball season in america, baby. you know, those geese are canadian, right? they've got baseball there, too. >> to me, law. >> service is a scam. there's no. >> lawn service. >> for you.

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i'm pretty sure this is not what they meant. >> g20. >> rated. >> are april 10th. only on prime. >> when it. >> comes to family. >> i always do what's best. my parents taught me that. that's why i called a place for mom. their personalized guidance was just what i needed to find. senior living for mom, and their advice is free to families, not just free. invaluable. our advisor gave us options based on our needs and budget, guiding us to the best decision. i never expected a free service to make such a difference. our service comes at no cost to your family. connect with us today. >> i'm pete muntean at reagan national airport. >> this is cnn. >> breaking tonight. a judge says the trump administration must bring back a man that they sent to an el salvador prison over a, quote, administrative mistake. and now the trump administration is appealing that ruling. the judge imposed a deadline of late night monday to

return kilmar abrego garcia to the united states. he denies being part of any gang and in fact, another immigration judge had said that he could be deported anywhere, but just not el salvador because of the risks to his life. but the white house is mocking the order, suggesting that the judge contact el salvador's president because, quote, we are unaware of the judge having jurisdiction over that country. this might be the first test of whether the trump administration is going to abide by a judge's order. and the lawyer for garcia is basically saying, look, you guys went to this prison. you came back, you can get somebody in this prison, you can get them out. >> look, we'll see how the appeals go. but i've been of the opinion and maybe people will call me heartless, and that's fine. the way that this person would have not ended up in an el salvador prison is if he never came to this country illegally. he was violated our laws in the first place.

>> he was here legally. >> no he wasn't. >> he was temporary protected status. >> no he wasn't. >> he had temporary protected status. >> he was. they're not even challenging his right to deport him. they're challenging. whether he went to el salvador. >> he was not an illegal. >> he was here against the law of the united states. >> he had temporary protected status. >> he was here against the law of the united states. >> so that means deportation and rendition to torture. donald trump hired. >> one of the reasons they're not. challenging are the reasons that the judge didn't want him sent back to el salvador. >> and i understand. >> that's because is because he had made a claim that his life was reasonably in danger if he were to go back, that he had come to the united states fleeing, essentially gang violence. so that's that's the context for why he was here and why he shouldn't have been sent back there. but the administration, i mean, i think the interesting thing about this is how they are responding. the press secretary essentially saying the the judge can go and talk to the president of that country because, you know, he doesn't have jurisdiction over el salvador. >> i'm going to do something. i'm going to get super weepy eyed over america, over america

right now, something i never thought that i would do on the show. you know, when you look at the declaration of independence, it says, you know, we hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal. now, obviously, if you're black like me, there are problems with the document in terms of the way your people were treated and have been treated here for generations. but it's very important to understand that that says men, humans. it doesn't say americans. it says that that our entire way of life, our entire government is undergirded by a belief in human rights. meaning, if you happen to find yourself in america, then you are entitled to treatment that is different than if you find yourself in china or in russia or in germany. in 1939, or any of those places that we have a specific belief in human rights and the value of a human person. that means that we are not going to send you to a torture chamber without due process, and we're not going to subvert the rule of law to.

dehumanize you. and that has to mean something. and if it doesn't mean anything, then we lose our entire way of life and who we hope to be at some point, even if we haven't been that person in the past. and i just think everybody who's talking about whether or not this guy is american or not, or how he was here or like what he means, just sit back and think about who it is that you want to be. and that's not who we want to be. >> if you're standing on american soil, you're allowed to claim asylum. and the scariest thing is that how can el salvador ever let this man back? we paid them $20,000 to take him. no one comes out of this place because you think el salvador and i've been to el salvador. i've done stand up there because we have troops there because we're still doing the drug war there. the drug war is still in progress. i played at military bases in el salvador. they're not going to let this man out to come talk to american media about what conditions are like in there. and this man has a wife and kids. he has an autistic son, and we have renditioned him like it's 20 years ago to a gulag

for torture with no plans to get him back. >> stephen miller calls the judge a marxist judge who now thinks she's the president of el salvador. i mean, i guess i'm not surprised anymore about rhetoric, right? but it just it's not really how our system works. if you disagree with the judge, just appeal it. like the trump administration actually did. >> well, so what i this this whole thing is really unusual to me because they launched like a pr campaign against the specific person saying he's an ms-13 gang member. like for for weeks, like jd vance got involved. the press secretary. and they've really gone hard on him. but yet the doj attorney who was prosecuting this case basically said, well, we don't really have anything on him, so why wouldn't the doj attorney and dhs, who says he's an ms 13 gang member, have done their due diligence? administrative error. so and they doj administrator said they had made and admitted they made an administrative error by sending them there. so it's like

the administration's not even talking to each other. >> yeah. i mean, there's there's what's happening out in the public where they can kind of say whatever they want. and then there's what happens in the courtroom where they have to say things to a judge. and that's when really to your point, the rubber meets the road much more to the story. in the coming weeks. i'm sure we'll keep you posted. everyone else, thank you for joining us. coming up next, more on the economic turmoil and what tomorrow means for you when you go to the grocery store. anthony scaramucci and kevin o'leary will debate stand by. >> gum. problems could be the start of a domino effect. periodontics, active gum repair, breath freshener clinically proven to help reverse the four signs of early gum disease a toothpaste from periodontics. the gum experts. >> turbotax free edition 37% of

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>> closed captioning brought to you by aarp. join and get instant access to member benefits. >> join aarp for $15 for one year with automatic renewal, and get instant access to member benefits and social programs. join and get a free gift. plus aarp, the magazine. >> the comedians of have i got news for you are back, and they are just trying to figure out how many countries are in the trump administration's list of the worst trade violators. take a look. >> question does anyone know the. name the administration has for the countries that. >> they think are ripping america off? the worst. >> countries that. >> just have penguins? >> let's hear the name of the countries. >> the dirty 15. >> the dirty 15. >> the dirty 15. >> question how many countries comprise the dirty 15 countries? >> roy it has.

>> to be 15. i don't like it when we're this dumb. >> i'm going to say 23. >> i'm going. >> to say. >> 329 countries. >> the administration has not given any type of clarity. it's like, well, what is the dirty 15? is it 15% or is it 15? it's like it was a baker's dozen plus two more. and then. i would like to file a motion that we be known as the dirty five. >> oh. >> okay. >> i mean. >> can't we be the dirty eight? i mean. >> oh, yeah, that's better. they're dirty eight because there's five of us. >> you can catch the all day episode tomorrow at 9 p.m. on cnn. thank you very much for watching news night. we'll see you tomorrow morning at 10 a.m. with our conversation show table for five. and thank you for watching news night. you can catch me anytime on social media, instagram and tiktok.