here's that video. ultimate display of naked ambition. we warn you, some might be disturbing. a public plunge in the buff. people strip down to their birthday suits. a well-timed swim aiming to make the guinness book of records for the largest simultaneous skinny-dip. no word yet if they succeeded. there you go. hope you blurred your eyes. we didn't let anything slip out. i hope not. i'm don lemon in atlanta. see you back here tomorrow night, 6:00, 7:00 and 10:00 p.m. eastern. have a great evening. cnn "primetime" begins right now. tonight, hear the questions we want answered. could a family intervention have saved michael jackson? tonight, new information about how his sister janet and his mother tried to get him help.

was there anything more his family could have done? we'll talk to a doctor who may know. also, why is sarah palin still so popular with republicans even after her controversial resignation? >> i'm certainly not a quitter. i'm a fighter. that's why i'm doing this. >> is she outsmarting the beltway pundits and clearing the decks for 2012? plus the tapes you have to hear. a man holding his wife hostage calls a reporter during the standoff. >> this is your only source for news. cnn "primetime" begins now. here's campbell brown. >> hi, everybody. we've got those questions tonight, but we start as always with the matchup, of course, our look at the stories making impact. we are watching it all so you don't have to. the top story this week, no contest.

it was as close as we come to a cultural happening these days, both moving, captivating, and a little bit strange. something we're all going to be talking about for a very long time. >> from the staples center today, part church, part concert hall for the final good-bye to michael jackson. >> there's no model for this. i don't think we've ever seen anything like this. 20,000 people, a service, the kind of speculation and outpouring and whatever we have seen in recent days. we didn't know what we were going to get. >> michael jackson's brothers were his pallbearers all wearing his trademark white glove. this would be the last time the jackson 5 would share the stage together. the fans and the curious gathered to say good-bye. dancing in harlem, crying in london. jamila abdullah flew from london on her own without a ticket to the memorial. finally someone gave her one.

>> it was great to be amongst the fans and to just share the grief of the loss and also to celebrate michael and his life. >> today's final tribute to the king of pop was something of an international spectacle, wasn't it? >> it sure was, wolf. >> to give us a sense of what this all means for us in india, it's our top story. >> in the dark of australia's winter night with balloons in moscow and makeshift shrines in london. >> early viewer estimates have been estimated at above a billion people. online activity also through the roof. global web traffic surging nearly 33%. and the ceremony itself, well, a true jackson-worthy production, a showbiz spectacle that felt surprisingly intimate. ♪ >> i feel the king of pop is not

big enough for him. i think he is simply the greatest entertainer that ever lived. ♪ hold me like the river of jordan ♪ >> maybe now, michael, they will leave you alone. >> i want his three children to know, wasn't nothing strange about your daddy. it was strange what your daddy had to deal with. but he dealt with it. >> of course, for all the star power in that room, for all the glowing tributes and the stirring harmonies, this was the moment that really hit home. >> ever since i was born, daddy has been the best father you could ever imagine. and i just wanted to say i love him.

so much. >> little paris jackson, obviously, a totally unscripted moment as we just heard. >> broke your heart when she started to cry to say my father was the best father. absolutely. it was the closing words of the memorial. >> i think 11-year-old paris jackson, i think, just reminded the world that this was a man, and not just a musician or a dancer or a performer. >> there's been so much curiosity surrounding the children. with a life already live and so much ahead with so many questions left unanswered. >> jackson's three children now living with their grandmother, katherine. the next custody hearing when we might hear from paris and prince michael's mother debbie rowe is set for a week from monday. also monday, president obama will be back at work in washington. he's now on his way home from ghana following his trip to the

g-8 summit in italy. had in rome, mr. were obama did as romans do, or as presidents do. he had an audience with pope benedict xvi. they sat for 30 minutes, quoting now, disagreeing without being disagreeable. on subjects like stem cell research. >> the president met up with benedict xvi in rome. the vatican says the two discussed immigration, middle east peace and aid too developing nations and also reportedly discussed abortion rights. the pope met the first family and he gave them a special blessing. >> you can see some of the pictures there with the pope and president barack obama, a very significant especially given the reception that president obama received from some catholics in this country just a month and a half ago. you remember the controversy at notre dame. >> it certainly was friendly, respectful. obviously there are differences but there was this search for common ground, no doubt about that. vatican in the preparations i think going out of its way to show respect for the american president. >> cnn's anderson cooper

traveled with the president in ghana and will be here monday with his one-on-one exclusive access with the president. and with president obama abroad, republicans seized the moment saying rome is burning back home in the usa. they hammered him on the economy saying his plan to create jobs is failing big-time. funny thing though that very same day some democrat governors were on capitol hill saying pretty much the exact opposite. here's the view now from the right and the view from the left. >> the purpose of the stimulus was putting the unemployed back to work. mr. chairman, these troubling job numbers have shown beyond a doubt that so far, the stimulus has failed to do that. >> we are killing jobs with every proposal we see here. >> we're doing everything other than helping to create jobs. >> the american recovery and reinvestment act has really been a lifeline. it is helping us to create and save jobs in maryland.

>> helped us retain thousands of teachers, social workers, health care workers and others. >> remember, it's just barely july. july, august, september, october. you will see inbelievable amounts of people coming back to work. >> well, i guess that depends on who you ask. in north korea, a rare sighting of leader kim jong-il this week appearing in a memorial service for his father, not looking too healthy himself. >> this is the second major state event he has attended since reports surfaced last summer that had he suffered a stroke. >> obviously appearing much thinner than we had seen in the past. >> the 67-year-old leader walked with a slight limp thought to be a lingering affect of that stroke. >> kim jong-il's youngest son expected to take over north korea when the time comes. well, it is july. it's getting pretty buggy out there. and this week, that has some powerful folks dodging some fearsome flies. check this out.

>> going to swat it like president obama? >> i'm trying to see if i can find it. [ speaking a foreign language ] >> asked me to sit -- who are you killing? >> a fly. there's a fly. someone i know. >> let me just tell you that barack obama went boom and got it. >> we need barack here. >> yes, our staff did add those sound effects. okay, people. let's take a break and learn from the master. >> hey. get out of here. >> that's the most persistent fly i've ever seen. >> nice. >> now, where were we? >> and that is how it's done. that is also the mashup. janet jackson trying to intervene to save her brother from drug abuse. that is next. but first, here's what one of jackson's long-time doctors told

larry king about his addiction. >> i knew at one point that he was using diprivan when he was on tour in germany and so he was using it with an anesthesiologist to go to sleep at night. i told him he was absolutely insane. protected... ♪ seems you've always been right there ♪ this life was saved... ♪ soothing sadness ♪ healing pain and this life was made easier... ♪ making smiles appear again because of this life. nursing. at johnson & johnson, we salute all those who choose the life... that makes a difference. ♪ you're a nurse ♪ you make a difference

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of course, michael jackson dominated the headlines this week, and cnn reported earlier that janet jackson was so worried about her brother's drug use, that she tried to stage an intervention. but michael ordered security guards to keep his family out. we wanted to find out how an intervention might have helped. howard samuels runs the wonderland center in los angeles and he's joining us tonight. welcome to you, dr. samuels. >> thank you, campbell. >> i do want to ask you about those reports that you were in contact with michael jackson's family to try to get him some help. can you confirm that? >> no.

all my conversations and all my clients are all confidential, and i cannot talk about any of that. but i can talk about the process of addiction. >> we just heard that janet jackson had tried to stage an intervention of sorts. but that michael jackson had refused to speak with her, refused to take calls from his mother. i mean, is that typical behavior i guess for a long-term drug addict? >> without question. you know, families -- it's so important for families to continue interventions on the people that they love. and the addict will do everything possible to run from the family, not take phone calls, to cut communication because when their drugs are threatened, then their whole existence is threatened because they are so dependent on the drug itself. >> so given his resistance, if you had had an intervention or if you had been asked to do an intervention for michael jackson, like you've done with so many celebrities, what would you do? what could you say? what might have worked? >> well, first of all, it's in

any intervention, the power is with the family. if you don't have any financial power over the addict, then the only power you have is emotional leverage. and so in doing an intervention on somebody, you have to bear the family to come in and to try to hit some kind of emotional connection with the client where they can have an understanding that their drug is blocking that intimacy and that love from their families, from the people that care about them the most. i mean, i'm a recovering addict myself and i'm 24 years clean and sober. my family saved my life by doing an intervention on me. they continued to intervene and the only way they were able to get through to me was being able to hit that emotional chord that i was so sick and i was so damaged during that time. >> we've heard so many reports about the people around him who were enabling him. it's charged. what do you think about the people who surround michael

jackson or from what we know? and presumably this applies to a lot of celebrity who have drug problems. this is the biggest obstacle to getting help. >> oh, it's horrible. i mean, when you have somebody that has so much money, so much fame, they surround themselves with a minion of individuals that will help that addict continue in their addiction, they'll get drugs, they'll lie, they'll do whatever they can to protect the celebrity because if they don't do what the celebrity asks them to do, then they're out of a job. and then they are replaced with somebody else. so it's, you know, have you you have these people. it's like the cult of celebrity that need to be around these individuals, and they don't care how they do it. they don't even really care about the individual. they just care about the "celebritiness" of it. >> let me say thank you to dr. samuels for being with us tonight. appreciate your insight on this issue.

>> absolutely. >> michael jackson asking about lisa ling in north korea in the days before he died. a close friend of the pop star joins us on what was really going on in those final weeks. op of shell gasolines... contain a nitrogen-enriched cleaning system... that seeks and destroys engine gunk... left by lower-quality gasoline. it protects engines from performance-robbing gunk. try new nitrogen-enriched shell gasolines. but with aleve, i don't have to worry about my knees hurting. only two aleve can stop pain all day. that would take three times as many tylenol arthritis pain. aleve works for me.

tonight's newsmaker was a long-time friend of michael jackson and has some revealing insights into the final weeks of the pop star's life, including, of all things, jackson's desire to help free two american journalists being held in north korea. gotham chopra is the son of well-known dr. deepak chopra and runs his own blog defeated to social wellness. he joins us earlier from los angeles. gotham, you last spoke with michael jackson a few weeks before he died. tell me about that conversation.

>> yeah. it was an unexpected conversation. i've known michael for many years. he called me in the middle of the night as he often did, inquiring about another close friend of mine named laura ling who as you guys have reported extensively is one of the journalists who's been detained in north korea for the last several months. michael had read online somewhere or heard about laura's predicament and become curious and sympathetic to it and wanted to know if i had spoken to laura, her family, and how she was doing. then he went on further to say while he was looking online, he saw pictures of kim jong-il wearing the same sorts of military jackets that michael often wore either in public or in his shows and he suspected or he thought maybe hoped that perhaps kim jong-il, the dear leader in north korea, might be a fan of his and in which case he might be able to get involved in some sort of diplomatic mission.

>> i mean, it's shocking when you think about it, but what do you think he would have done? would he have really tried to reach out to him, to kim jong-il? >> well, it is shocking i suppose to hear, but if you've known michael and i had known him for many years, i mean, he's many things to many people but one of the things certainly is a humanitarian from big huge things like "we are the world" to smaller issues like this that he felt deeply about, especially when there was a personal connection. what he would have done, i mean, michael was, yeah, i mean he talked to many people. he would call them in the middle of the night, even strangers and you know ask questions. he was someone who was hungry for knowledge. as we all know, he lived a pretty isolated life so he was not above just picking up the phone and making a phone call, now, how you get kim jong-il's phone number, i'm not sure, but if anybody could, he might have been able to. >> you're probably right on that front. earlier in the show, one of our reporters reported that in 2004, michael jackson's employees told authorities that he was taking

ten or more, even up to 40 xanax pills a night to sleep and that he was drugged up, that he was incoherent. did you see him that way? >> no. i mean, you know, i think as has been talked about and i certainly talked about it, to some degree, i think there was an awareness that he had a problem, and it was something that some of us close to him tried to get involved with, but i certainly wasn't aware to what intensity and you know, even now to be honest, talking about it, i don't think, i certainly as a friend of his and you know, somebody who empathizes with what the family's going through right now don't really feel comfortable. it's an investigation like we all know, and certainly it will come up with some conclusive answers hopefully, so that the family and michael can rest in peace. >> you have said that you weren't entirely surprised when you heard the news about his death and that he had a lot of agony in his life. i mean, give us a sense what he was going through that made you feel that way.

>> well, i mean he was going through everything that has been talked about for the last ten or 15 years, and yes, michael's life was one of agony and ecstasy and i would say except for his children which were the light of his life over the last 10, 15 years, it was mostly agony. and i think that was difficult for him and it was something that he talked about and it was painful to watch as a friend but you know, it's something that he did deal with, and unfortunately it may have led in some ways to his premature death but you know, yeah. i don't think it was surprising necessarily. it was some degree shocking to hear about it, obviously. >> do you think people feel differently about michael jackson now than they might have before he died? do you think people have the right image of your friend? >> yeah, i don't think there is a right or wrong image. i mean, he was a very charismatic, very conflicted person, you know, he achieved a lot, obviously, during his life. he'll, i'm sure as time goes by,

he won't have a single legacy. you know, today we're talking about his humanitarian endeavors and certainly hopefully, those will be some of the ongoing legacies. certainly his music will live on forever and i'm sure there will be other things that people will talk about, but you know, i think it's been nice certainly in the last week or so the way he's been remembered, you know, i think it's been meaningful to his family and ultimately that's very important to anybody who cares about him. our newsmaker monday, judge robert bork, his nomination to the supreme court fails. we'll ask him about current supreme court nominee judge sonia sotomayor after the first day of her nomination hearings has is monday at:00 p.m. right here on cnn. 8:00 p.m. did a suburban philadelphia swim club really ban kids because they're black? shocking charges of discrimination and tonight, a response. dinner bell sfx: ping ping ping fancy feast elegant medleys tuscany entrées restaurant inspired dishes with long grain rice

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i'm don lemon. here's what's happening right now. police in beulah, florida, are closer to finding who murdered a couple leaving behind 16 children. a van captured on surveillance video at the home has been found. two people are being questioned and police say they're making progress. >> our investigators slogged for the theirs 36, 4 hours and did a numerous number of walls. here within the last ten years, the damage broke. see we've got some very, very good leads we're currently pursuing. >> police are still looking for a third person sought for questioning in that case and president obama visited africa for the first time since taking office. crowds clamored to get a glimpse

of the president who wrapped up his visit saturday night. in a speech to the par innocent of ghana, the president praised the country as a people of democracy. >> they've put the country on firmer footing even in the wake of closely contested elections. >> the president and the first family also toured the cape coast castle which the british used as a slave dungeon. he compared that to a recent visit to a german concentration camp. it is a no go for the space shuttle "endeavour." saturday's launch scrub about a stormy night. you can see bolt after bolt of lightning hitting right near the launch pad. technician, looking for damage and so far haven't found problems. this is the third time "endeavour's" liftoff has been delayed. nasa will try again on sunday. we shall see. i'm don lemon. those of your headlines.

keeping you informed. cnn, the most trusted name in news.

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we have new developments tonight in the controversy over a swimming club in the philadelphia area where dozens of kids were asked not not to return to the pool after a visit last month. in all, 65 kids from a day camp, many of them black or hispanic were kicked out, and there are claims that the children were subject to racist remarks. the club's president june duesler only added to the tension when he told a local tv station "there was concern that a lot of kids would change the complexion and the atmosphere of the club." well, today he tried to clear the air and you're going to hear that in a moment. but first i want you to hear from the woman who runs the day camp and her son who was at the pool that day as they describe how it all began. >> 35 minutes until our swim session, the children came down the hill and said miss wright, miss wright, some of the members are saying things. they don't want any black kids in the pool. i said wait a minute, shh.

who's saying that, they said right up there, miss wright. so dr. john duesler was sitting on the picnic benches and i addressed one of the members that was saying derogatory remarks and dr. duesler assured me that he would handle it. >> marcus, when you were at the pool, you heard some of the grown-ups talking about you and your friends. tell me what they said. >> they were saying like they didn't want like these black kids in here. and that they were upset that they were in here and they were also saying like how, like they, like were afraid that they might like we might do something to their children or try stealing something from them. >> how did you find out that you weren't welcome back to the valley club? >> as i explained before, dr. john duesler said he would take care of it. a couple of days later, one of the members was shouting out, they assured me that they would

make sure that we would never return, but dr. duesler told me that he would handle it, but two days later, dr. duesler called me and said regretfully miss wright, the membership has overthrown me, and we're going to have to rescript you from coming to the club. >> you just finished a parents' meeting. what happened? >> it the parents are still outraged. some of them are trying to explain racism to their children. we have children that are upset. we're probably going to have to have, more than likely, a psychologist come in to speak to the children, and this -- we should not be experiencing this in 2009. we are just coming together as a country. we just made a statement to the world, and here we are, back at this again. it feels like it's a slap in the face that a country for where we're trying to move, and the valley swim club is going to get left behind because america is going to move forward. and we're going to send a message that this is not acceptable and the message that

i'm told, the other statement, the initial statement they sent, we did not want to change the complexion and the atmosphere is of our club? i'm appalled that they would even put something like that in writing. >> now, when a cnn camera crew showed up yesterday to try to get some answers the club told us to leave. since then, the story has swept through the national media, and now, finally, the club's president john duesler and his wife have decided to tell their side of the story to our own susan candiotti. >> we severely underestimated the number of children and our capacity to handle these groups. we were not prepared for it. and that's the only reason it was a safety issue and that's the only reason that the children we felt it was not safe for them to be here. i think it's important for everyone in the nation to know that this is totally untrue and it's unfounded. and this is not what we represent here at the valley swim club. >> what would you say to the little boy who you saw cry, the youngster that couldn't believe

that this kind of thing was happening in this day? >> well, like i said, the week before, you know, he was here with his class. we were kidding around together. you know, i was making jokes with him. it was miss wright's son who actually i had spoken to about the camp coming. i would tell him that i apologize deeply for any misunderstanding. it was never our intention to hurt anyone or for anyone to be offended here. and this is a terrible misunderstanding. and i would actually, i would send my best wishes to the camp and all the camps really because they have gotten an outpouring of support from all over the country. >> and they deserve it. she's doing wonderful work giving these children a safe place to be, which is what we were trying to do also. the response against my husband is unbearable because as i said, he's not one of the good guys. he's one of the great guys. he doesn't deserve this. he is a kind, tolerant person. that would do anything for

anyone. >> now, this controversy is far from over. pennsylvania's human relations commission has now launched an investigation and senator arlen specter who calls the allegations extremely disturbing is also looking into the case. a reporter covering a hostage crisis becomes part of the story when the suspect calls her. you'll see it all play out on video. >> the only one i want to die are cops. i don't want anybody else to die, just cops. the cops challenge me and try to, try to take me and six to eight cops lose their life. and, of course, i die. to me that would be the ultimate success. gecko vo: geico's the third-largest car insurance company in the nation. but, it's not like we're kicking back, now,

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this next story is almost too incredible even if it were a movie plot. but it is real. a lot of it caught on tape. police say this man kidnapped his ex-wife. he held her at gunpoint for most of the day. holding off police by threatening to blow up the house. well, luckily she escaped and he later set fire to the house, which burned to the ground. during the standoff, the suspect

richard shenkman repeatedly called a local newspaper reporter. listen to this. >> what made you call me? >> i trust you. >> you do trust me? >> i do absolutely. i think you're a good reporter and i think you mean well. the only one i want to die are cops. that's it. i mean, i don't want anybody else to die. just cops. to me a success, this would be the ultimate success. i get my 12 demands i walk out of here. the cops challenge me and try to, try to take me and you know, six to eight cops lose their life. and, of course, i die. to me that would be the ultimate success. >> karen floren who writes for "the day" in new london, connecticut, is joining us right now. karen, first off, you had a little bit of history with this man. you did know richard shenkman sort of socially or casually i

guess. what on earth is going through your mind as this is happening? >> i was panicked that he was going to kill his wife and kill himself and take anybody else out that he could possibly take out. he was crazed. >> well, did you, based on what you knew of him? because as i said, you did know him. did you think he was unstable? i mean you were very concerned this could go in any direction, huh? >> i'm the court reporter here and i've been covering his nasty divorce and an arson case, and he's been growing increasingly unstable and had promised me during several other phone calls that something big was going to happen. >> richard shenkman called you four times that day, and at three of those times he actually did let you speak to his ex-wife nancy. and i want to play for our viewers some of that. listen. >> whatever you want to say, nancy, i don't want this to be that i'm controlling what you say. karen's a friend. you can say anything you want to say to karen. i don't want either of us to be hurt. i want both of us to come through this and move on.

>> i don't want to take innocent people's lives. >> well, then do you have your wife there, ex-wife? >> because she had her head on my shoulder and i waited three years for that, and it was worth it. on my last day, it was worth it to me. there's nothing at risk to have a priest at the police station giving her her last rites. >> i don't understand why you want a priest to give her her last rites if you're going to if you're not going to harm her. >> they're going to call my bluff. they're going to storm the house. they're not going to let me continue this much longer. >> she had to have been terrified. what was your sense of how she was handling this situation? >> i thought it was amazing that she was composed enough to string together sentences, honestly. and i was so happy that he put her on the phone so that she had a voice and she had a say in what was going on, as well.

>> and karen, nancy did eventually escape. explain how she escaped and what quickly what happened after that last phone call. >> okay. well, i guess they had sent a mechanical robot up to the front door, and it freaked out richard and he went to go investigate noises and pulled her down into a bunker and chained her to a wall, and when he went to investigate the noise, she unscrewed it, broke loose and ran for her life. she said she was afraid he was going to come up behind her and shoot her in the back of the head. >> wow. karen, i got to give you credit for staying so calm while all this is happening and giving her time or, you know, the police time to deal with this, and the facial expressions were worthy as well. karen floren from the day in new london, connecticut, thanks so much for joining us. appreciate it. >> thanks, campbell. tonight's breakout story. cnn's michael ware's incredible reporting from pakistan deep inside taliban country and his

warning about what it will take to defeat them. >> to put it simply, america cannot win the war in afghanistan. certainly can't win it with bombs and bullets and it can't win it in afghanistan alone. i use every day-- and save even more. so that's what they mean by unbeatable. save money. live better. walmart. now every drop of shell gasolines...

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reporting. he tracked the taliban leaders who are targetings and killing u.s. soldiers to their hiding places in a remote mountain region of pakistan. >> reporter: i came to these mountains to unravel how the taliban in afghanistan are based from here across the border in pakistan. in these remote mountain valleys of pakistan's northwest frontier province, the taliban can hide, train, smuggle weapons, and launch military strikes against u.s. forces in afghanistan. for generations, the border here has been little more than a vague blur among the peaks. and that is what is crippling the american effort in afghanistan. to put it simply, america cannot win the war in afghanistan. certainly can't win it with bombs and bullets and it can't win it in afghanistan alone. so part of the answer lies here

where i'm standing in these mountain valleys in pakistan on the afghan border because this is al qaeda an taliban territory. right now there's as many as 100 taliban on that mountaintop between the snow-capped peaks and amid those trees. they're currently under siege from local villages who are driving them from their bunkers. but at the end of the day, it's the pakistani military who tolerates the pressen of groups like the taliban, and it's not until america can start cutting deals with these people that there's any hope of the attacks on the american troops coming to an end. the key leader the u.s. may have to deal with is this man, mullah mohammed omar. the one-eyed cleric who actually created the taliban and led its regime. the man who after the 9/11 attacks sheltered osama bin laden. choosing war with the u.s. rather than surrender bin laden. even with a $10 million reward on his head, mullah omar has

defied all-american attempts to capture or kill him. he still commands the afghan taliban as they continue killing u.s. and nato troops. he and other top commanders do all of this, according to u.s. intelligence, from sanctuaries here in pakistan. it was the pakistan military who helped create the taliban. when the cia was funding many of these same afghan gruchs in the 1980s in their war against the soviets, it was the pakistan military that delivered the money, expertise and weapons like stinger missiles. now, for the first time in this cnn interview, the pakistan military concedes it still maintains contact with the taliban. at the military headquarters we met major general athar abbas

who concedes the army's links with the taliban were toned down after 9/11. >> but having said that, intelligence organization in the world shuts its last door on any other organization. >> and more than talking to the taliban, the general says the pakistan military can actually get the taliban to sit down with the united states and broker a cease-fire. >> and that's where pakistan can perhaps provide valuable assistance to the american mission? >> i think, yes, that can be worked out. that's possible. >> reporter: and this is one of the men who says he can help work that deal. >> people like me who serve the cause of the freedom of afghanistan. >> former cia ally general hamid gul, once the head of pakistan's equivalent of the cia known as the isi, he is famed as the godfather of the taliban. >> the guarantees can be given, no problem. >> how? in terms of american national interests, who does america need to dialogue with? >> mullah omar, no one else. >> mullah omar, the most

important taliban leader. but to get him and the other talibans to the table, pakistan wants something in return. it wants the united states to wants something in return. it wants the united states to use its influence to reign in pakistan's number one military rival, india. india's close association with the u.s.-backed government in afghanistan worries the pakistanis. and the pakistanis accuse india of supporting armed separatists in one of pakistan's provinces. and senior u.s. officials tell cnn the obama administration is willing to raise those concerns with india. and the u.s. is willing to talk with mullah omar and other taliban commanders. michael ware, cnn. >> has celebrity overtaken experience as a qualification to be a successful politician? we're going to tackle that question and consider sarah palin next. >> though i think of the thing on my parents' refrigerator a little magnet says don't explain, your friends don't need

it and your enemies won't believe you anyway. decisions, decisions. which beneful prepared meal tonight? roasted chicken recipe? - savory rice and lamb stew. - [ barks ] you're right. tonight is a beef stew kind of night. [ announcer ] beneful prepared meals. another healthful, flavorful beneful. the place that inspires her to go faster... and slower, elk mountains, colorado. where's yours? 100% natural nature valley granola bars. the taste nature intended.

ever since sarah palin announced she is stepping down as governor of alaska, the questions have been flying fast and furious. why is she quitting? why now and what will she do next? our drew griffin was one of the reporters who tracked her down during a fishing trip this week. listen to what she told him. it was all a bit surreal. alaska's feisty governor in a white t-shirt and waders in what may end up being her last photo op in office. >> everything changed on august 29th in politics in alaska. that's the day i was tapped to run for vice president of the

united states. >> everything changed august 29th in alaska the day that i was tapped to run for vp. that was obvious. when that opposition research just, those researchers bombarded alaska and started digging for dirt and have not let up. they're not going to find any dirt. we keep proving that. >> is this your unconventional way of announcing you're going to run for president in 2012. >> as i said, i do not need a title. nobody does to effect political office. >> i can't see me being totally out of public service because that is within me. it is the way that i'm wired. >> governor, i'm asking you, are you ever going to run for president? are you ruling it out? >> all options are going to keep on continuing to be on the table. >> i don't know what the future holds. can't predict what the next fish run's going to look like. don't know what the future holds. i'm not going to shut any door that who knows what door is open. can't predict what the next fish

run is going to look like so i certainly can't predict what's going to happen in a couple of years. >> sarah palin's got some very good reasons to keep her options open right now. 72% of republicans in a recent poll said that they would consider voting for her for president in 2012. so is quitting the new winning? joining me to answer that republican strategist and cnn contributor mary matalin with us tonight, the daily beast editor-in-chief, tina brown and npr contributor john ridley also here. welcome everybody. mary, let's start with you because you're a little bit out of lock step with some of your republican friends about this decision and sort of how she handled it. karl rove called said he was rather perplexed by it. ed rollins calling it a disaster. but you disagree. >> well, it was unconventional to be sure in the veracity and the velocity rather with which the opinion class -- and i'm

excluding carl, they took it as unconventional and they were asked to give an opinion more quickly than it needed to be did i jedigest what i find more interesting is it the resistance to which everybody in the chattering classes refuses to accept her at face value. she couldn't do her job anymore. ed. her family was under assault. she was receiving the political equivalent of a stoning. and she could not function in her job. so the reason i thought it was smart was that she can continue to be a strong voice, build political capital out there in the next two years. and get her equilibrium reset, the word of the week and do what she does well, which is communicate a conservative message. >> tina, you've compared palin to princess diana. explain what you mean. >> well, what i mean is that that speech that an she made when she resigned from the governorship just reminded me of a speech that diana made in 1993

when she suddenly got up at a charity benefit and said she was coming out of public life because she needed more time and space and then burst into tears. there's a certain feeling i have anyway when i listen to palin that was a kind of suppressed hysteria almost about the way she conducts herself right now as if she does feel that her life is somewhat unraveling. i think her life has been hell for the last ninth months. i would much preferred if she had said look, my life has become so complex, i need this time with my family. of all the politicians who want to say they want to spend more time with my family, i would welcome that. a lot of women would. she did all this wacky stuff about it's better for alaska and i'm going to have a higher calling almost as if she couldn't say i want to spend time on getting myself straight. >> which left a lot of people going huh. >> i also do think he's kind of canny. i think she understands her own celebrity right now is sort of bigger than politics. a new kind of politics out there

which is a kind of hyper politics which is i don't need office to be a major political figure. >> that's a fascinating point. do you agree with that, that celebrity may have overtaken like actually doing the job? >> i absolutely believe that. you remember when senator obama was running for president and the ad came out, oh, he's just a celebrity. turns out that celebrity is a big thing. i don't think that's new in politics. there is a celebrity culture. people are attracted to what they like and that reflection of their values and beliefs. i do think, again, sarah palin made the right decision for sarah palin. i agree with tina. there probably would have been more cache in actually telling a truth or some version of i'm doing this truly for my family but again, for the people who like sarah palin and the people who like any politician, the wackiness or craziness or the failings, those don't matter. it's do you connect with these people and when you don't have to respond to the electorate directly, you don't have to worry about explaining yourself.

do what you're going to do. >> mary what, does she do next? if this was such a brilliant mof, how does she capitalize on it. >> it's brilliant in the sense of if have you two bad options you take the least bad option. i want to speak to what tina said. this is still an unfortunate situation that women are judged differently in politics. so it would be great if she could say and she did say a version of. no family has been treated like this. i need to get with my family. if she had said it the way tina said it which was quite eloquent, she would have been wiped out. she would trying to say it in some conventional way. everyone is discarding the fact that her saying she did this for alaska that something is false about that. she put in place a system to finish what she starred there and she literally for the past six months could not get work done and it was costing lots of money. a small state like that, i don't know why anybody rejects it as an authentic answer but it's sad that you couldn't say it the way tina said it because i think that was a huge big part of it. >> got to end it there.