go to loudobbs.com to get the local listings in your area and follow me if you will on lou dobbs news on twitter.com. we thank you for being with us tonight. next, campbell brown. tonight, here are the questions we want answered. what turned a routine continental airlines flight into a brush with death today? >> i feel like i was on a roller coaster. >> i've never seen turbulence like that. i really thought we wouldn't make it. >> pictures from inside the plane. and americans love cash for clunkers. >> i think it's a great idea. we need the fuel efficiency. we need the lowered emissions, everything, and i think it's great for the car industry right now. >> so why are some republicans trying to put the brakes on the program? plus, voters gone wild.

are members of congress afraid to face the folks back home angry about the economy and health care? >> they're likely to have a very, very hot summer. also, how should kids be punished for illegally downloading music? we'll talk to one college student who is being forced to pay $675,000 to the recording industry. is it too big a price, or are musicians finally getting their fair share? and ryan o'neal's shocking behavior at farrah fawcett's funeral. he says he hit on his own daughter after putting the casket in the hearse. hi, everybody. those are our big questions tonight. we start as we always do with "the mash-up" -- our look at all the stories making an impact, the stories you may have missed today. we're watching it all so you don't have to.

the the white house tonight struggling to put out a political brushfire set by treasury secretary tim geithner and larry summers on their sunday shows yesterday refusing to rule out a middle-class tax hike, something the president himself has ruled out many times. read their lips. >> what the country needs to do is we're going to do what it takes to fix it, whatever is necessary. >> it's never a good idea to absolutely rule things out no matter what. >> definitely off message. reaction was swift. here's the view now from the right and the view from the left from "the view." >> at this point you need a promise to go back and look back at the promises that were made during the campaign and examine them, say this is something our president promised us. our taxes would not go up a single dime.

>> there's no way you can do all the things you want to do without raising taxes. it's just the way it is. >> not the conversation the white house wants to be having right now. this afternoon press secretary robert gibbs on message trying to shut it down. >> the president's clear commitment is not to raise taxes on those making less than $250,000 a year. he's not raising taxes on those making less than $250,000 a year. the president has been clear on this. the president has been clear about his commitment. clear commitment. clear commitment. the president was clear. made a commitment. that commitment stands. the president made a commitment on the campaign. he's going to keep it. i don't know how much more clear about the commitment i can be. >> still, geithner's comments a gold mine for republicans who wasted no time blasting him today. terrifying moments high above the earth, a nightmare of a plane trip but the passengers lived to tell the tale. listen. >> it's why the captain always

says we ask that you keep your seat belts fastened at all times. >> it was flying from rio de janeiro to houston when it made an emergency landing in miami this morning after experiencing violent turbulence. dozens of people injured. >> i feel like i was on a roller coaster. >> i was scared. all the people so scared. >> at least four people aboard were seriously hurt. passengers flying up and hitting the ceiling, getting knocked unconscious by flying debris. >> showered in glass and i was lucky, though. there were people in there whose faces were cut up. it was terrible. >> somewhere in here it just experienced a considerable drop in altitude like it hit a hole in the air. this must have been something called clear air turbulence. passengers say without warning the plane violently jolted up and then dropped. photos taken onboard by one passenger show how in some cases heads smashed into the ceiling breaking the plastic.

>> as you heard the passengers say there the turbulence just coming out of the blue with no warning whatsoever. in afghanistan six american troops killed over the weekend. july now the deadliest month of that war. and tonight a moving image of marines searching for faith. this is captured by "the washington post." check it out. >> there you go. >> in your profession in jesus christ i baptize you my brother in the name of the father and the son and the holy spirit. >> there's symbolism to this, a lot to say about this. first of all the fact that's taking place in a combat zone. >> they're going through in very dangerous situations. >> that was lance corporal ludwig about 20 years old from

marco island. a planned construction implosion gone horribly wrong. >> you're almost guaranteed to have a better day of work monday than this demolition team in turkey over the weekend. >> a building in turkey was dancing to a different tune this weekend. less ballet, more rock 'n' roll perhaps. you can see it just fell over in one big piece. >> narrowly missing an apartment. the remarkable thing is that no one was hurt. >> the remarkable thing is how well that building was built. that thing stayed together like that. >> i'm not going down, baby. >> imagine if you're standing on that balcony. >> this isn't good. this isn't good. no, we're okay. >> the building, a former flower factory, could be a shopping mall. a big win for the pop star mother's katherine but without a heavy dose of drama. today a judge in los angeles approved katherine jackson's

guardianship, also a monthly allowance for raising the children but the amount was not revealed. lawyers for jackson's dermatologist making an appearance, he wants to be involved in the children's lives. >> whether or not arnie klein may be the biological father of these two children. he has said that to his knowledge he's not the father but he does admit he did once donate sperm. he told that to cnn so he's clear at this point. the judge told his lawyer he could not have a say. >> and probably not the end of that story. and that does bring us to the punch line courtesy of conan o'brien taking a shot at the gift that keeps on giving. a company has begun selling a version of the popular infomercial blanket the snuggie, a version of it made just for dogs. a snuggie just for dogs.

the perfect way for telling your dog, i've taken your testicles and now your dignity. >> and there actually is a snuggie for dogs. never too soon to start your holiday shopping, folks. the big question tonight, should we pay more cash for clunkers? the wildly successful program has been a big boom for car dealers. why do some republicans want it to stop there? plus, listen to this. two new pieces of music from mozart. we have the tracks. listen. ♪ using a mifi, a mobile hotspot that provides up to five shared wifi connections. two are downloading the final final revised final presentation.

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well, you can say this, the cash for clunkers program has been a big hit for consumers. maybe too big. >> the whole auto industry feels

a new burst of industry. >> the big three reported their sales numbers for july. ford posted the biggest improvement over june with showroom sales up 27%. >> so far more than 127,000 people have traded in gas guzzlers like this for more fuel efficient models, often small cars. >> the popular program has revved up auto sales but now it's broke. will the senate step in to give it a jump-start? >> the initial pool to trade in gas guzzlers was a billion they will end the program next week if they don't get more money. >> all right. so the house voted to extend cash for clunkers but some senators balking because of the costs. joining me now to talk about this, the president of the washington, d.c., area's auto group, also republican congressman trent franks of arizona who voted against extending cash for clunkers. gentlemen, welcome to you both.

jeff, let me start with you. i know you have about 15 dealerships. give us a sense of what this program has been like for you. how it's changed your life at the dealerships over the last week or so. >> well, there are a lot of stimulation programs out there but this one i haven't felt the impact of those. this one i'm feeling. it's brought a lot of customers into the dealership. our dealerships have done 100 of these so far. customers are excited about the program. i'm excited. we've been on our knees. car sales have been down about 35% and this is having a stimulative effect that was intend intended. >> but beyond that -- okay, it's been really good so far. beyond that why do you need another $2 billion on top of what's already been put into it? >> that's a good question. this program has been used in europe, north america and china and worked everywhere it's been put in and the idea is to try to get our industry going again, stimulation. and it's working.

now the original intent was to spend $5 billion on the program but only a billion dollars was allocated. certainly that's going to result in about 250,000 unit sales. the original intent was 1.25 million quarter sales. it was funded 20% of the originally intended. as such it's gotten cash starved because consumers have embraced the program. >> right. so to that point congressman franks, you heard what jeff just said. look at it more big picture. ford motor company saying their sales shot up 60% in july. isn't this what we wanted to help the automobile industry to boost the economy? >> look, campbell, the reality is, though, the money that it took to finance this came out of other people's pockets. that impacted the rest of the economy. when this country first began, a guy named fred said government is that great fiction to which everyone endeavors to live at

the expense of everyone else. it shouldn't surprise us the auto industry is glad to see this and there have been some positive elements of it but the bottom line is this has hurt the poorest of the poor more than anyone. >> how? explain that. how are the poorest of the poor being hurt? >> the really poor people who couldn't even take advantage of this were dependent upon used vehicles and this has caused used vehicles to rise in price and some of the parts that other used vehicles were used to be able to buy at a junkyard or something like that, the used vehicles are coming at a premium and hurting the poorest of the poor. the program comes at the expense of the rest of the economy. they choose winners and losers and the constitution said we have the power to regulate commerce but not that we should be the biggest participant in it. and always the same happens when government gets involved. it ends up discombobulating the economy and hurting some of the people that it was ostensibly

meant to help. as you certainly know government is involved in the economy for better or worse and a million different ways. >> for worse. >> let me ask you about the other arguments the obama administration put out. there are long-term benefits to this. the effect it will have on the environment. by forcing people or incentivizing people to stop buying gas guzzlers and lessening our dependence on foreign oil. >> i am strongly committed to lessening our dependence on foreign oil. i have worked hard to see us be able to drill more of our own oil so we're not depending on foreign oil. there are other impacts of this. most of the cars that this allows people to buy are mostly smaller cars. they may do well in crash tests but passengers don't. there are other secondary impact we never measure. the bottom line is when government comes in and decides

it is going to choose winners and losers, the economy is the loser and a lot of these cars that are bought people would want to buy them at some point. in this case we've incented people to go ahead and buy them now which has lessened their financial security even worse. >> let me let jeff respond to some of the points you made there. >> i respectfully disagree that it's harmed the poor americans. it's a system that may be hard for someone outside an auto dealership to understand how this works and sometimes things don't work like they're intended. this one really is. i've been on the showroom floor talking to customers. i'm curious their reaction to this. this helps the poorest americans. most don't have credit. they don't have a down payment and often they're upside-down. if they owed money on the car, they owe more than it's worth n. this case people come in and they have positive equity, money to put down. they can get a better interest rate.

the banks are hard to loan money to people nowadays. on friday we had a customer who only paid $500 for a used car. they've had it for over a year and they got $3,500 to buy a new car. they were so happy. i respectfully disagree. this has helped. there's different types of stimul stimulus. this is good stimulus. why is it good stimulus? it's cost effective. it's very efficient. in fact, up to 40% of the stimulus money going right back to government in the form of sales tax once the car is purchased. >> go ahead, quickly, congressman. >> the bottom line is that for a small sector of the middle class, the gentleman is correct. overall it hurts the economy and for the poor who don't have access to this program it has driven the cost of the used cars up and hurt the poorest of the poor profoundly. >> a debate that will continue

obviously. we're wait to go see how the senate will vote on this. thanks for your time. appreciate it. >> thank you. should a college student really be forced to pay $675,000 to the record industry for illegally downloading music? plus, why ryan o'neal hit on his own daughter at farrah fawcett's funeral. his disturb tell-all. to stay on top of my game after 50,

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a look now at some of the other must-see stories of the day with erica hill. breaking news out of australia where police say they have foiled a terror plot. four suspects arrested in predawn raids across the city of melbourne. a suspect allegedly has ties with islamic terrorist groups. families of three american hikers detained in iran say it is a case of wrong place, wrong time. the iranian government, however, isn't buying it. iran today accused three american hikers of being cia agents. a state department official called the accusations against shane baur, joshua fattal, and sarah shourd ridiculous.

>> we want this matter brought to a resolution as soon as possible, and we call on the iranian government to help us determine the whereabouts of the three missing americans. >> state department officials are saying that swiss diplomats were unable to obtain any information after meeting with iranian officials of the three americans who have gone missing. >> the hikers have been in iranian custody since friday. bank of america will pay a $33 million penalty in connection with the huge bonuses paid to merrill lynch execs. now securities and exchange economics has charged bank of america with misleading investors about plans for the bonuses. as part of the agreement the bank does not have to admit or deny any wrongdoing. your local post office will soon be on the chopping block looking at consolidating or closing as many as 1,000 post offices across the country that two cent

increase back in may not enough to help manage a potential $ billion loss this year. one big reason for that loss, more people turning to e-mail. a new revelation about very old music. take a listen to this. what researchers say was written by mozart when he was just a young boy. ♪ one of two pieces thought to be composed by mozart when he was 7 or 8 years old. they say he didn't know how to write music yet so his father transcribed the notes. that's what your husband does for your kids, right? that's what i call baby mozart. >> erica hill, thanks. the big question, are congress members really ready to take the heat when they go home to face voters?

>> just say no. just say no. just say no. just say no.

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just pick up the phone and call. you will lose weight. it's going to be a long, hot summer for a lot of members of congress. the folks back home pretty angry right now about the economy and about health care. to quote the movie network, they're mad as hell and they're not going to take it anymore. listen. >> as lawmakers head home for the august recess, they'll be getting an earful from constituents fired up over health care reform. >> just say no. just say no. >> democrats across the country from new york to florida to virginia and iowa were seeing a series of town halls gone wild here. >> safb our seniors. save our seniors. no obama-care. >> kathleen sebelius and senator

ar lek spector found themselves on the defensive hosting a town hall event. >> i look at this health care plan. i see nothing that is about health or about care. what i see -- what i see is a bureaucratic nightmare, senator. >> so does congress have a voter rebellion on its hands? and what could or should members of congress do about it? here now to talk about this, columnist for the new york observer, contributor to the daily beat, gloria borger also in washington for us tonight. we've heard some members of congress actually say they're afraid to go back to their districts to face their constituents? how bad is the anger out there? >> well, i think folks are very angry. i think they're afraid. the economy has been terrible and they're having a very tough time. they see a health care bill out there that frightens some of

them because they don't understand it because, guess what, campbell, there isn't any health care bill yet. and so they're hearing all kinds of rumors, this will take away your health care, government-run health care. it's risky. they don't know what to believe. >> we don't even know what we're debating at this point, steve. i know you think the town hall meetings are a little bit overhyped. >> i think they're very overhyped. this is reminiscent of the tea parties earlier this spring. this is sort of top down, grassroots activism. what you have are a few sort of lobbyists groups out of washington, d.c., conservative groups run by lobbyists, paid for by industries. one was called freedom works. and they're sort of manufacturing with the help of conservative media outlets outrage. what's the outrage about? i listen to the tape you rolled there. this woman says i read the plan and i don't see anything about health care. as gloria pointed it out, there is no plan. she hasn't read anything. i heard mike huckabee talking

about -- he tells his viewers, you have congressmen going home. talk to them about how you want to stop their effort to take over health care. there is no effort. none of these plans involves single pair universal health care. there is no government takeover. you can criticize the plans. there is no government takeover. >> who is to blame for sort of this massive miscommunication if that's what it amounts to? is this president obama making a mistake by not putting his own plan forward and letting congress deal with it? >> during the presidential campaign and more recently he has empathized to people if you like your health care, you're going to keep it. you're going to have to make really dramatic changes and so you have this kind of double game and i don't blame president obama for it. on the one hand you have to move to a more sustainable system and reassure voters nothing is going to change. and people are catching wind

there is a deep con stra dix here. i think the anger is real. i don't think it's entire astroturf or top down. people have a real anxiety about a real radical change. we need radical change. i don't necessarily agree with the various proposals and there have been various proposals put forward by democrats. that's the basic contradiction. our politicians aren't acknowledging that. >> so, gloria, how then does the president get democrats to fall in line to stay with him on this when they're facing this kind of anger when they go back home? they have a month of this. >> that's going to be very difficult. the white house is in the process now of changing tack. at the beginning of the debate they thought they could keep the voters in line by saying, look, in order to reduce the deficit, we know you're all concerned about the deficit. we have to reform health care. that message didn't resonate when they said, guess what, this doesn't reduce the deficit. now they're taking tack.

what you're going to hear out there is the democrats taking on the big insurance companies. so suddenly they're going to have a boogieman here. the only problem is the insurance industry right now supports health care reform. they support reform. >> so making the insurance companies bad guy in all this, is that going to rally americans? >> it ought to after how many decades of this. how many decades was lunacy? >> but if they're onboard -- >> they're not onboard with the public plan. are we getting to the point where so much has been compromised? even more will be compromised to get a plan through you're not going to have anything meaningful two, three, four, five years from now voters look at and say it was worth doing that. i wish i was sitting here now telling you we were debating having an actual single pair medicare for everybody plan in congress. something that the right could then call socialized medicine. but we're not talking about that. we're talking about what's going

to be piece meal reform. >> but if you wind up with some kind of serious cost containment, that's going to be very, very important. >> the best way to contain costs. >> go ahead. >> look, we're not going to get serious containment. i think that what you're going to see happen is a system where you have these huge premium subsidies people in insurance exchanges and people who are in the employer based system that's going to slowly crumble because they're not getting the same subsidize and they're going to be resentful. i think that you're going to have this unsustainable system rather than moving to a new system not employer based. senator widen had the right idea. you need to get rid of the employer system whole hog. you have republicans talking about the same thing. i think that's why this argument isn't fantasy land because the employer-based system is what's broken and it's at the heart of

the way most americans get their coverage now. they have to face up to the fact it's not going to last. >> we're out of time. we have to end it there. thanks. i appreciate it. angry voters, grade president obama on his second 100 days by voting right now. on thursday night we are going to bring you a special show with all of the results. you can join me and the best political team on television. a boston university student found out crime doesn't pay. he is facing a $675,000 fine for illegally downloading 30 songs. that works out to about $22,500 per song. but does the punishment fit the crime. we'll talk to him when we come back.

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a jury has ordered a

staggering amount of money to be paid by a student, joel tenenbaum, to pay $6 5,000 to four music labels after he admitted sharing 30 songs from bans like nirvana, greenday and the smashing pumpkins. that comes after last june's nearly $2 million judgment against a minnesota woman. so does the punishment here fit the crime? a short time ago i spoke to tenenbaum along with a spokesman for the recording industry association of america. listen. >> we knew you were doing something wrong and that you ought to be paying for it, why did you do it? >> it was something that came naturally to my generation f. you go to any college campus, try to find the kid who is not doing it. it doesn't seem particularly unusual just in sort of my background and the people who were my friends and so forth. >> these are artists you admire.

don't you believe they deserve to be compensated for it? >> absolutely. artists deserve to be paid for their work. >> and that's who you're stealing from. >> well, again, this idea of stealing, i think the whole debate about file sharing as to whether or not it is beneficial or harmful, and i don't even think it's necessarily the same amount of benefit for any given user. they use file sharing different ways. >> hold on a second f. you're not paying for it, how is that different? i don't understand. >> sure. for example, campbell, my roommate a while back, ever since hearing that i went out and bought every single one of his albums on itunes and i never would have discovered that. same thing with pink floyd. i actually bought two pink floyd albums. this is a question, is this something that helps the music? does it not? there is a legitimate debate on the issue. >> joel, now according to a

judge you have to come up with $6 5,000. >> i don't have $675,000 or any appreciable fraction of that. we have various legal options. i'm not an expert on this but if it comes down to $675,000 actually standing, then i file for bankruptcy. i don't have any choice. >> all right. let me go to kara now and bring you in here. i have to ask, are you happy with the results? you heard joel there. you're not going to get the money from him. he doesn't have it. push comes to shove he's filing for bankruptcy. what does that mean for you. >> we're certainly not happy because we didn't want to be here in the first place. this was a step necessary to take after many fruitless settlement offers we did extend to him which actually were much lower than the numbers that he has thrown out. we did extend numerous settlement offers and instead of

accepting responsibility and settling, he chose to drag this out and wage a protracted legal battle all in favor of illegal file sharing in order to get music for free. we wanted to settle with him early on to avoid this and when it comes down to it he admitted in engaging in this behavior the fourth day of the trial which baffled us as to why we even had to be here. absolutely not, we're not happy to be here in the first place. >> let's be honest here. this is not about joel really for you guys. joel is one of probably millions of people doing this on line. in a way it's a way to exchange music and he wouldn't have bought a pink floyd album had his friend not given him or shar shared, how do you stop this given the way so many people

view it? >> we can limit it and manage it and what i find interesting about joel's point, he believes artists and record companies and all those involved should get paid but he doesn't believe he should be the one to pay them. it comes down to making sure artists, music creators, everyone in the chain down from the sound engineers to the backup singers, all of those real working-class individuals are paid for their work. they rely on the sale of music. >> let me go back to joel and give you a chance to respond to some of the issues cara has raised here. >> i've always said i don't think i can compete with the riaa on spin. i'm not a professional spokesperson. but the artists have spoken out on this. the majority don't see file sharing as a trent. reser in has been a critic of the riaa and its campaigns. i've gotten so many people just reaching out finding me on

facebook, on twitter just saying -- just offering warm wishes of support saying way to fight that battle. i feel a part of that, too. no one ever says -- everybody says take the riaa down or make them answer in court. no one says screw the artist. they know it's about the artists and having creative control. i can't compete with spin. all i can do is post everything we can for the sake of transparency. >> my thanks to joel tenenbaum and to cara duckworth. when we come back tonight's wing nut watch features a former presidential candidate using a word some might say can't be taken back. and pythons on the loose. tonight we're on the hunt. that's a big one. >> this is a good ten feet. >> nah. >> at least. 12. there's the life i live. and the life i want to live. fortunately, there's enbrel.

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time for our wing nut watch. daily beef contributor fearlessly calls out those who divide rather than unite us whether they are on the left or

the right or totally off the map. john, who do you have? who is the latest wing nut? >> this night a hall of fame wing nut many thought to be in retirement, congressman tom tancredo who weighed in on the is the president racist. he managed to mispronounce sonia sotomayor's name. >> i can say that his statements, and by the way his appointment of someone i do believe to be a racist, sonia sotomayor, for her racist views, by the way, that is an indication that could be used as an indication by some that he is indeed a racist because it's depending on what you use as a definition. >> depending on what you use as a definition. that sounds like a teachable moment. my dictionary says hatred for other races. i don't think that sounds like the president or a supreme court justice nominee.

not by a long shot. >> you say this isn't the first time tancredo has used -- >> this is not the first time. he's been like a moth to this particular brand of stupid. earlier on in the sotomayor debate, he compared the nation's largest hispanic civil rights organization to latino kkk without the hoods. calling your opponents racist was the purview of the left and now it's migrated to the right. the kkk is the kkk. it's not a metaphor. it's the reality. the president is the president. judge sotomayor is judge sotomayor. >> all right, john, with his wing nut of the week. appreciate it. "larry king live" minutes away. new developments tonight in the jackson case, i understand. what have you got. >> larry: you have it, campbell. katherine jackson's attorneys will be with us tonight. an exclusive. inside the hearing regarding michael jackson's affairs and what was the lawyer for dr. arnold klein doing there?

plus, griffin o'neal sounds off about his father ryan and farrah fawcett. a look inside a troubled hollywood family. you'll see it only here and you'll see it next on "larry king live." how did you do that, campbell? was i effective? >> you're always effective. you never miss a trick. there is an astonishing story coming out about actor ryan o'neal and what he did during the funeral for his longtime companion farrah fawcett. was he flirting with a member of his own family? wait until you hear what he told our next guest. let me make it easier for you. let me show you how i can make it easier for you. we have the number one rated online banking website. online banking is going to be your best friend; it's going to help you manage your money. it has an alert system that can text message you, so you're mobile banking, your bank's telling you what you current balance is. it's telling you a certain check is cleared. customers that use the internet, use online banking.

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now an article makes a stunning revelation about his behavior at father set's funeral and one moment in particular. >> he said i was a pallbearer and i had pushed the casket into the hearse this beautiful blonde woman came up to me and he launched into his dawn juan and said, hey, you got a drink on you you got a car? >> he didn't recognize his own daughter and started flirting with her until she said, daddy, it's tatum. >> daddy. who does he think he is? woody allen? come on. it's so gross. >> he's not the world's best father but i will tell you he looked after farrah on her way out and we can at least put that in the positive column. >> the article was by "vanity fair" contributing editor leslie

bennett. it hits newsstands later this week. leslie is here with me now with lots more detail about all of this. first of all the daughter, his daughter, tatum o'neal, at the funeral? >> tatum said, well, he hadn't seen me in a couple of years. >> she thought he didn't recognize her? seriously. >> she had a different hair color. i was incredulous because he was telling me this story about trying to pick up his own daughter at the funeral of his lover of 30 years, farrah fawcett. he finishes tell the story and he says, can you believe it? it's so sick. >> and you're like, yeah. >> so i called tatum after that, and the interesting thing was she told me the exact same story in the exact same words. clearly had happened just as he described it. and when she finished talking about it i said, well, how did you take this?

she said, well, that's my relationship with my father in a nutshe nutshell. make of it what you will. >> what did she mean by that? >> she said he's always been a don juan, a ladies man. and i think he has delivered that line a million times, hey, you got a drink on you? let's go out and have some fun, but it was his daughter. >> you interviewed him both right before farrah fawcett's death and after. explain his state of mind. >> ryan's state of mind even in the course of ten minutes was all over the map. he would be maudlin and teary and then he has really cutting wit. he's very funny. a lot of times you're laughing even though he's saying something completely outrageous and you shouldn't. one afternoon i spent with him on allah in a stewart and she

kept hitting him with a sofa pillow saying, ryan, do you have any idea how this is going to look in print because he says these terrible things. and then he would burst into tears. they were under enormous emotional stress. farrah was dying. and had died when we were concluding. there's a tremendous amount of grief. i'm not sure he isn't, minus the grief, pretty much the same under normal circumstances. >> well, this whole family really opened up to you about their dysfunction, off the charts. >> absolutely epic. it's an astonishing family story. >> explain how. there are so many angles to it. >> there's so much. you could spend half an article

listing the drug arrests. the criminal arrests, the incarcerations for various things of various family members and you're sitting talking to ryan and he'll be telling you of some story, that was the night i shot my son. i didn't shoot him. i shot into the bannister. >> you don't want to laugh but you can't believe the things he's saying. >> there was another story, his son griffin, son from a previous relationship, maintains he was mostly after farrah's money. >> i think that's silly. they were involved for 30 years. griffin was say that go at the very end he was inheriting her money. the money goes to her son. when i asked ryan about it, his first comment was, i hate him, because it made him very angry griffin was saying this. then he said i have plenty of money of my own, more than i

deserve. alana said ryan has more money than farrah did. griffin is kind of a black and white reverse image. whatever ryan says, griffin sees it exactly the opposite way. >> it's a fascinating article in the new "vanity fair." good to have you here. appreciate it. >> thank you. tonight's breakout story will take you face-to-face with a predator roaming the florida everglades and we're not talking alligators. the number of pythons is exploding. this is corowise, a natural ingredient that can lower cholesterol. put them together... and you get 0tntrum cardio. the first and only complete multivitamin... that can lower cholesterol. centrum cardio.

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if you hate snakes as much

as i do, you are going to love tonight's break yowout. >> reporter: joe drives along a narrow stretch of road that bisects florida's everglades. night is coming on quickly. he's looking for snakes. one in particular. >> the next ten miles seem to be the hot spot for burmese pythons. >> reporter: a reptile expert is one of a handful of men sanctioned by the state to hunt down and rid the glades of pythons. an extraordinary move in response to what scientists believe is a rapidly growing threat to the ecosystem. >> it's a large predator and they're eating basically everything in sight. and that's the problem, 20 years ago there were none here. today perhaps 100,000. no one is quite sure. night is the best time to catch these venomous snakes. that's when they're on the move. he spots something. he jumps from the truck, runs to

it. >> this is not a python. it's a banded water snake. do you want to pick him up? >> reporter: do i? >> he'll bite you. >> reporter: an hour driving back and forth across the roads, still no python at least not alive. there's a dead one and several more small snakes. a baby alligator, too. oh,man. he got hit by a car. two hours into our hunt suddenly he is on it. he sees one. look at the size of this one. skillfully he grabs it behind the head. it instantly coils around his arm. he will lock the snake in a crate and take it to a park b biologist to be studied and destroyed. first we have to untangle it from his arm. this is a good ten feet. oh, yeah, at least. 12. he doesn't get paid. it's voluntary. while he knows they have to be