until high noon the next day. and that's going to do it for us tonight. we'll see you back here tomorrow night "larry king live" starts right now. tonight a nation's rage, as a teenage honors student out for an innocent run is raped and murdered. the man charged with a crime, a convicted sex offenders who once molested a 13-year-old, served prison time, and got out. how can the state explain chelsea king's death to her grieving parents? what about the others? is anybody safe anymore? can the senseless loss of young lives mobilize an entire country

to say enough is enough? but first, showdown, president obama ready to rumble, telling congress to bring it on. >> everything to say about health care has been said and just about everybody has said it. >> larry: next on "larry king live." good evening, a program note. we're in woorkt tomorrow night and charlie rangel is our guest. it will be his first interview since stepping down today as chairman of the house ways and means committee amid controversy. he has taken a leave of absence. now tonight, after a year of increasingly bitter political debate, president obama is pushing for an up or down vote on his nearly $1 trillion health care proposal. here's what he said about it today. >> the american people want to know if it's still possible for washington to look out for their interests and their future.

they are waiting for us to act, they are waiting for us to leave, and as long as i hold this office, i intend to provide that leadership. i do not know how this plays politically, but i know it's right, and so i ask congress to finish its work, and i look forward to signing they reform into law. >> larry: joinings us in washington, congresswoman michele bachmann, she's championing what's billed as the health care declaration of independence, and congressman alan grayson. last fall he said the plan is don't get sick, but if you do, die quickly. congresswoman bach mann, what's wrapping with an up or down vote? >> it's a good thing, larry. it's just how many votes will it take? 60 or 50 votes?

>> larry: what's wrong with majority rules? >> well, because that's not how the senate works. the senate works with 60 votes. now what the president is promoting is nuclear option, which is 50 votes. so we should have an up or down vote. >> larry: but it used -- it used that majority rules on the bush tax cuts, was 51 votes. >> well, the house uses straight majority rule, the senate doesn't. what this would mean, larry, is the senate has to break their own rules in order to pass the bill. >> larry: and that's wrong? >> owner i think so. sure. >> larry: and congressman grayson, why do you think they should break this resume, which they have done in a few times in the past. >> my esteemed colleague is entirely wrong. there's nothing that prevents reconciliation. it's been used 22 times overall and 14 times by republicans. if it's good enough for tax cuts for the rich twice until bush, it's good enough to provide health care for all americans. >> larry: let's get into some

specifics. congresswoman bachmann, what's wrong with the president's plan? >> number one, it's a job killer. number two, it's the government takeover of 18% of the economy and massive tax increases, plus it will cut $5 million from vulnerable seniors. so there's not a lot of up side, especially in the perilous situation we're in the "time" magazine said it's laying the groundwork to double taxes in ten years. that's before this health care bill passes. so we're looking at massive increases in taxes going forward with all this spending. that makes a lot of americans very nervous. >> larry: alan, why do you favor it? >> again, that's simply not the case. look, we spend 17% of our income on health care. no one else in the entire world spends more than 11% of our income, yet 50th in life

expectancy. the japanese live five years longer than we do. how can we spend so much money and get so little? the sim is broken and needs to be reformed, and that's what this bill does. congresswoman bachmann, what's your solution in a nutshell, in agreeing there's a problem? >> i agree there's a problem. we should let any american bike the insurance policy that they want, and fully deduct the rest of the expenses. that's what they're facing right now. unfortunately president obama's bill won't bring down the costs for average americans or really for very few americans, if anything. >> larry: would that idea, congressman grayson, allow for most of the 38 million to have insurance? >> according to the congressional budget office, the democrats' plan will provide shuns to over 80% of people who

don't have it. there's 122 people dying every single day in this country because they have no health care. according to a harvard study, if you take two people identical, same race, same age, same gender, same smoking experience, and same weight, two people who are identical, except one has health care, the other one does, the one without health care is 40% more likely to die each year. and we have to make health care not only universal, but affordable and accessible. too many people find they get the health care that they need, unit they need it. michele, why can't you come together on this? >> i believe we can, but a big question is, what what in the world is going on in the white house? because the president offered a judgeship to a brother of a member of congress. tonight they have the same congress pressuring him to change his vote on health care.

we need to have an independent investigation into this matter, because we've seen the cornhusker kickback, the louisiana purchase, the union loop hope, and now the big question is, is the white house trading health care votes for judgeships? this is a pretty serious issue, larry. >> larry: do you have to respond to that, alan? >> my esteem colleague has deployed another weapon of mass distraction, that the republicans use to try to change the subject. >> corruption isn't a distraction, corruption is an issue. >> what's the issue here -- >> we need to know if --l already let alan finish. >> we need accessible health care that's accessible. if you want to go off on a tangent, you're doing a disservice to people. >> it isn't a tangent. this is a real issue. this is pretty serious. if you offer a judgeship to a brother of a member of congress, and the same night you have that member at the white house, where the president's twisting his arm

to ask that member of congress to switch his vote on health care? this is very serious. we have to have an independent investigation. >> larry: alan, are we going to get a health kaye? >> we need -- yes, we're going to have a health care bill. the speaker has been very consistent about this now for weeks and months. it's going to happen. it's going to happen, because that's what america needs and that's what american deserves. >> larry: and in the weeks ahead, we'll do a lot on this subject and have both of you back. thanks very much. >> thanks, larry. >> thanks. the senseless death of a teenager allegedly at the hands of a convicted sex offender. crime and punishment is next.

the man accused in the death of chelsea king appeared in court today. john gardner iii, a convicted sex you've hadder, his dna was found on chelsie's clothing.

with us is the king family spokesperson, the peer counseling supervisor for poway high school north of san diego, and she knew chelsis chelsea, h doing? >> i'm amazed at their strength. when i talk to them, they want to know how everybody else is doing. >> larry: that's a well-known high school. how are the students? >> they've been incredible. they're angry, they're sad, they're scared, you know, the world the way they know it has changed. security has been taken away from them, but they're troopers. they've been a wonderful community coming together and doing so much for chelsea and the family. >> larry: most of our viewers, 99.5% of them knew her only in death. as the victim of a terrible

crime, you knew her in life. tell us a little about her. >> chelsea is one of those girls when she walks in the room, you feel a ray of sunshine. she is quirky, she makes kids laugh. if there's an awkward moment, she had this ostrich dance she would do. i know that they've said she's a straight-a student, but she had four ap classes with as in all of those. she did community service. she was in the symphony, peer counseling, she is was an athlete. she did it all. she's missed. >> thank you, traci. traci barker-ball. joining us alex michael son, reporter/anchor for xetv. he covered the court. and jane velez-mitchell, host of

"issues with jane velez-mitchell." what specifically was he charged with today, alex? >> charged with murder with a special circumstance of rape. he also was charged with intend to assault another girl, which happened on december 27th. that was somebody who was able to get away. we heard from her that she elbowed him in the nose and she was able to get away from him, but it was very close to the area where this incident happened with chelsea. >> larry: is this possible death penalty if convicted? >> the district attorney wouldn't confirm that. they said they will make that determination later on, whether they're going to pursue that, but it is possible, with the special circumstances that they will pursue the death penalty in this case. >> larry: and he pled not guilty? >> he pled not guilty. we did see chelsea's parents in the courtroom, very emotional, but tried to stay strong. about 15 family members held

hands during the proceedings. they were wearing orange and blue ribbons, which they say is chelsea's favorite color, and they looked straight ahead toward mr. gardner. it was a kind of look of rage and despair at the same time. many of them had tears in their eyes, just with the visual of him. >> larry: did he have his own lawyer or court-appointed? >> he had a court-appointed lawyer, a public defender. that's what about 90% of criminals here in san diego end up going with. jane velez-mitchell, what's your reaction to this story? >> this is an outrage. this is a totally preventable death. it didn't have to happen. i'm calling it junk justice. here's the sentencing report from 2000. this guy molested a 13-year-old girl and pummelled her in the face in 2000, and in the sentencing report it said he showed not a scintilla of

remorse, he's extremely predatory and a psychiatrist warned he will do it again and cops say he did it again. he could have been sentenced to 30 years if prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. instead, he served five years in prison, and then he got out. on top of that, you heard that there was another jogger who was allegedly attacked by this very same man just in december, december 27th, okay? she got away by hitting him in the nose. was there any signposted in that park that there was a predator looking for a female jogger? no. if there had been signs posted that day, chelsea wouldn't have gone jogging. if this guy had been in prison she could have gone without being afraid. the fact is we've got a broken justice system. this is junk justice. the number of mistakes made along the way is so extraordinary that i'm actually saying we need a movement like a nonpolitical tea party movement

so that it doesn't matter, republican, democrat, left, right, people who care about protecting their children and loved ones need to come together and say we've got to fix this criminal justice system. this is happening all over america every single day. >> and larry -- >> larry: and jane, isn't also part of the justice sim presumption of innocence? >> yeah, he's going to go to trial and he's pleaded not guilty, but they really had him back in 2000. he admitted he did these things. they could have easily prosecuted him and locked him away for 30 years, and they didn't do that. that's why we had a predator roaming the streets. >> larry: well said. elex? >> we've talked to thousands of people who made that very point. some people saying they should be castrated, others say they should be microchipped.

protesters were out in front of the courthouse with a sense of anger that this didn't need to happen. how does our society allow this to happen? >> larry: both of you, very well said. we'll be doing more on this. thank you. >> thank you. why are convicted sex offenders allowed out of prison? is there any way to keep them behind bars for the total length of sent? we'll talk about that after the break. hold on a second... come on up here where your brothers sit. [ birds chirping ] wow! did i ever tell you what it was like growing up with four sisters? that sounds fun. yeah...fun for them! [ male announcer ] chevy traverse. a consumers digest best buy. with a 100,000 mile powertrain warranty. it seats eight comfortably -- not that it always has to.

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every morning she would say good-bye, mom and dad, have a great day. when she got home, she would also ask you, how was your day? we would sit down and talk about it. she just couldn't wait for the next day. >> how sad. in san diego, san diego's dr. mark kalisch, psychiatrist, dip lo mate, in francis, our friend marc klaas. dr. kalisch, you are a colleague of dr. matthew carroll, the court-appointed psychiatrist who interviewed john gardner with a sentencing recommendation on the 2000 molestation. what was that assessment? and did you agree with it? >> well, larry, i've been doing

this work for 30 years, and i have rarely seen a report that was more clear that dr. carroll did. it was well thought out. he threw up as big a red flag as any psychiatrist possibly could. he was deliberate in his thinking and his analysis, and pointed out that this is a man who had no remorse for what he did. hoe took no response. >> larry: so why did he only serve five years? >> apparently there was a plea agreement that dr. carroll's warning wasn't heeded, and he wasn't charged and prosecuted as fully as he could have been.

>> larry: marc klaas, why does this go out? >> first of all, i think we have to listen to the experts. as dr. kalish said, he's been in business 30 years doing these kinds of assessments. we've taken it to another level. larry, in 2006, californians passed jessica's law. among other things, the law mandates that any violent predator being considered for release first must have an expert evaluation by two psychiatrists or psychologists. if that expert panel feels that the prisoner is a sexual predator with a high expectation of reoffense, it has to be sent to the district attorney. civil commitment simply means they can maintain a dangerous person behind bars after the day of release. currently in california, the sex offender commitment program managers have -- they've set

that aside. what they're doing is allowing one health care professal to do a paper screening or record evaluate out any kind of in-person interview at all. >> larry: all right. i got it. >> this has put 17,000 of these sexual predators back on the streets. >> why, dr. kalish, are you not licensed to? >> well, i don't know the answer to that, but in this case there were a couple places where they missed the because. they missed the ball during the initial assessment where dr. carroll put out his very strong warning, and then after he had served his time, the district attorney did have an opportunity to start the civil commitment proceedings as dr. carroll kind of warned them about. for whatever reason, they didn't

take up that burden. >> larry: as we had earlier, time is limited when we have so many guests, but both these gentlemen are always outstanding. it's always great to have them. they'll be back in the nights ahead. the man arrested may be linked to the disappearers of amb amber dubois. that tragic story is next. really? (announcer) people everywhere are discovering what's really going on with their feet. you have flat feet. i do? (announcer) foot care scientists are behind dr. scholl's custom fit orthotic center. as flat as kansas, sir. that's flat. whoa! (announcer) its unique foot mapping technology identifies the areas you put the most pressure on. then recommends the custom fit orthotic that's best fo@)your feet. for customized comfort all day long. for locations, see drscholls.com. ♪ ♪

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>> larry: carrie is with us, the mother of amber dubois, who weren't missing from the same area. she was walking to school. cases may be related, by the way. amber's grandmother has written a heart-wrenching article on our blog, you've got to read it, go to cnn.com/larryking. a year? >> just over a year, yes. >> what happened that day? >> she was walking to school, had a check in the back pocket for her lamb. she shall presents in her backpack, she never made it to school. she was last seen by two parents, supposedly, and vanished. >> larry: what kind of area is it?

>> it's a suburban -- nice area. >> larry: the school isn't in a remote area? >> no, it's very populated, lots of traffic. >> larry: would chef gone over to a stranger in a car? >> absolutely not. we knew better. we had talked about it the week before, because there were some attempted abductions in poway. >> larry: what do authorities guess? >> at first runaway, but after that endangered missing. >> larry: no chance runaway or boyfriend you didn't know about? this is what you're hoping for now? >> absolutely, but i know my daughter. >> larry: how are you affected by the occurrence we learned about now with chelsea king? >> mixed feelings. i went down and help with the search, met the parents and gave my support to them, but it disgusts me this guy was on the street and it scares me he might have done something with my

daughter. >> larry: since it is the same area. >> a few miles away. >> larry: do you have any optimism? >> i have hope that she's still alive. i have hope that she is somewhere, that it's another jaycee story or shawn hornbeck. >> larry: how do you sleep? >> not very much. >> larry: you're separated from your husband? >> i am. >> larry: how is he taking it? >> we complement each other. when i have a good day, he's having a bad day. it's brought us closer. >> larry: do the authorities have any leads. >> no, they've been through 1,600 and are back at square one. >> larry: this suspect -- and he has to be called a suspect in this sum -- do you think he might, at least tell you something? >> i want closure, yeah, but i don't think he's going to talk, even if he had something to do with it. the police haven't found anything at least of today, that

links him to amber. the possibility is great. >> so what keeping you going is hope? >> hope and faith. >> what high school is amber go to? >> escondido. >> is that near poway? >> 7 1/2 miles. >> the schools are football rivals? >> yeah. >> larry: it's a beautiful area, a little north of san diego? >> yeah. >> larry: very middle income -- >> yeah, nice neighborhood. in talking with chelsea's aunts, the girls were a lot of like, both nature girls, stuff like that. >> larry: good luck, carrie. >> thank you very much. >> larry: a woman kid napped and raped by the man accused of taking jaycee dugard. she was shocked. that's next. new total effects body wash fights 7 signs of body aging, increasing elasticity, locking in moisture and more. new olay total effects body wash. total anti-aging for your body from olay. i was short of breath,

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holding her in sexual captivity for over 18 years. . when you hear about the chelseas and ambers, does it bring back memories? >> terrible memories. it makes me realize how lucky i was. my heart goes out to the kings and of course to carrie and amber's father. i hope they get some closure. i hope they find her, even if it's in a situation like jaycee. >> larry: you were taken into a building? >> in a mini-warehouse, yeah, out by the airport in reno, yeah. >> larry: how did you get out? >> i was rescued by a policeman who wasn't looking for me. i was very lucky. when he banged on the door and garrido went out to find out wo it was, and came back and said, you know, it's the heat, he wants to see a receipt.

do i have to tie you up? are you going to be good? i said, no, i've been good, don't tie me up. when he went back with the receipt, i went right after him. >> larry: smart move. >> yeah. >> larry: do you think he would have killed you or tried to hold you? >> i think he was planning on keeping me for a while, yeah. he talked about it. he talked about how he was going to take me home to meet his wife, that she would like me, you know. >> larry: what's your reaction, first, that he got out. >> i was shocked when he walked up to my ruelet wheel and stood in front of me. i thought he was in prison. >> larry: you were working? >> the last i had checked, his scheduled parole date, relight date ways april 2006. in november of 1998, there he was. >> larry: you were scared is it. >> i was terrified. i had left town, i moved. >> larry: what do you think should be done to sex offenders? >> you know, larry, the rate of

recidivism is so high with this type of predator, i don't think they should be let out. i don't think there should be any chance 2 or 3. how many more young women and children do we risk? >> larry: your thought is they're not curable. >> no, they're not. >> larry: what about registries? do you think they help protect people? >> they're only as accurate, you know, as the use they're being put to. they tend to give people a false sense of security in a lot of situations. >> larry: do you feel safe? do you always -- how do you feel? it's been 34 years. >> now, i my, my boogieman will be put away forever, but you still have to use some common sense. i still am always aware of my circumstances, but until this happened with garrido, i always had to look over my shoulder. >> larry: you don't have any role in the prosecution now, do you is it or do you? >> my role is self-appointed.

i've decided i'm going to go to every trial and just be present and watch and listen. i was in fact at his last hearing on friday. they've told me that i might be called to testify if it goes to trial. >> larry: because they can't bring up any prior convictions of his. >> but there's a new law that allows past victims to testify in california. so i may be brought in. >> larry: and you would happily do that? >> absolutely. >> larry: this is hard to say, probably a tiny bit of hope for amber, right? >> there's always hope. you have to hope. look at terry probyn. she had to live with hope for 18 years and it came through. >> larry: yeah, her daughter was alive. so the hope is she is being held. >> the hope is she is being held. that's sad. >> larry: that's weird that's what you're hoping for. >> it's weird to think of it that way, but you have to hold on to some hope. >> larry: katie will stay with

us. information is one important tool in protecting the public. the fbi's crimes against children unit maintains a national sex offender registry with state-by-state data. should there be tougher laws? we're going to try to answer that, next.

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catherine katie calloway hall remains with us, and mark geragos joins us. he comes to us from cincinnati, here in los angeles, robin sachs, activist, former prosecutor, author of "it happens every day." and judge greg mathis presiding over the tv court show. mark geragos, this is going to be different to have presumed innocence here, isn't it? what are your thoughts generally on this whole matter of the sex offender getting out? >> well, there's -- you know, part of the problem in defending these cases and prosecuting them is one and the same. that is, how do you distinguish

who is really a sex offender and who you may actually have a problem with in terms of recidivism, verse something whom the net where has been cast too wide. once you hear that somebody is a sex offender, it's extremely hard to unring that bell, and i think there's a presumption of guilt, unfortunately. >> larry: isn't that true, robin? can he get a fair trial? >> he can, but did the victims get a fair chance at surviving? >> larry: i know. we have a system, though, with the presumption of innocence. do you think none in the world is presuming him innocent is it. >> right now, the people wore watching television are probably just as outraged as i am, but the people sworn to that jury will be taking an oath to listen to the evidence fairly, and that's the jury system that we have in place and i have to true it will work. >> larry: what are your thoughts on what to do with predators is

it. >> i think the biggest problems is we have is clumping all predators together. >> larry: so as marc said, some don't have recidivism? >> i think perhaps when we look at the registry and define who is on the registry as a predator, we start getting into approximate. the problem is, the registry, which is designed to alert people. >> larry: of who's in my neighborhood. >> has encompassed people who you may not be worried about. >> which is exactly the problem. >> larry: in other words, if you urinated in public, you might be listed as a sexual predator? >> right. or somebody who has sex with a 17-year-old -- >> i think we need to enhance the notification, we need mass mailings going to perhaps a one-mile radius of a neighborhood, just like you send a tax bill, send a notice.

the sex registry, people have to take it upon themselves to look, how many people take their day out and look at the sex registry. >> larry: i got you. katie, you were nodding your head? >> i think it's an absolutely great idea, there should be notification directly to people's homes. >> larry: what if someone is falsely accused by a 17-year-old girl, labeled for life as a predator? >> the more important shiver is notification and monitoring. the idea of citizens having a duty to have to look at the registry and decide which crime, which means and which person, what happened where? that's not the way it should be. law enforcement should be watching the most serious of the serious. >> larry: to your knowledge, judge mathis, is a sexual predator like this gentleman who's been charged, are they ever curable? >> i've read studies. there are studies to did you get that they're psychiatric

illnesses in some, and some are environmental. so i think that some instances there is rehabilitation available, but in many instances, it's incurable. in such instance, i think we should look into what california and florida allows, and that's chemical cass traces, particularly after a second offense or conviction. >> larry: you both are nodding your head? >> absolutely. >> larry: you too? >> absolutely. i don't think that would change the sex offender offending, because i think they'll use their finger, their tongue -- >> it reduces the desire. >> larry: mark, what did you think of that idea? >> well, i've known people who have actually done it. as robin just said, i saw one of the guys who chemically castrated himself in a bid to kind of win leniency, then when he was back in court a couple years later, precisely because he had used his tongue. there are certain cases where you just can't deal with t. and

the system isn't equipped to deal with it, but the fundamental problem is we cast too wide of a net. if they focused on the worst offenders, the offenders you should be worried about, i think you would have a much better system than we have now, cuss basically a laundry list of crimes that gets put on the registry. >> larry: let me take a break and we'll be right back. don't go away. it can happen anytime,

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with a 100,000 mile powertrain warranty. it takes you farther... and brings you closer. >> larry: we'll be right back with our panel. a reminder, charlie rangel tomorrow night, first interview since taking leave of absence as chairman of house ways and means. let's check in with anderson cooper, he hosts "anderson cooper 360" at the top of the hour. what's up tonight? >> tonight on the program, the raw politics of a president pulling out all the stops. did the democrats actually have the thoughts? david gergen, bill bennett and donna brazile weigh in. how is it that one of the most powerful democrats on capitol hill, who larry was just talking about, temporarily resigned after accusations of an ethics violation, and believe me there are plenty of our accusations still pending, so if they care about accountability,

how come it took this long for charles rangel to step aside. and a tsunami scare caught on camera. the details on rescue efforts. those stories and more on "360," larry. >> larry: thanks a lot, anderson cooper. our panel is assembled. >> caller: my question is, why in the world, when victim.

i absolutely am for the death penalty. one and you're done. >> larry: judge mathis, what but? >> i'm against the death penalty because of the kbris and the problems inherent in it. i'm in favor of life imprisonment. three strikes law, many instances, there's a theft as the third strike and you go to prison for life. here we have in many instances child predators and receiving less time than a drug dealer on the corner. >> larry: mark, what are your thoughts on this? >> well, you already have a -- basically a one-strike law in california where you can face life in a crime -- actually, in fact, the prior crime, the prior

conviction. in a case like, this the death penalty is not going to do you any good because it is just going to tie the system up forever. life without parole, which is an option i think is much more horrible and a much cleaner way to punish if the person is, in fact, guilty. and i don't think it makes a whole lot of sense to tie it up -- none other than the chief justice of the state of california has called the death penalty system dysfunctional and it clearly is. >> larry: all right. >> and mark is absolutely correct. there is a one-strike rule here in california. the problem isn't with the rules and the laws. the laws actually are pretty darn good here in california for victims it is a matter or prosecutors and judges to know how to use them and use them effectively. the one strike could could have been a fact in 2000. this guy should have been in prison for life then. >> larry: mark, have you defended anybody accused of being a predator? >> i have. i have. >> larry: have some actually

been plead senators. >> i won't talk about my individual clients but i will talk based on -- >> larry: leads to the question what have we learned about predators? >> there are predators there is no doubt about that. there are people who cannot be cured and i don't even like that term. there are people who should be -- another term is warehoused and that's basically what you have to do in certain cases when they fit a certain mold and you have a situation like this. >> larry: is it -- >> something else though. part of the problem is understand that prosecutors make deals sometimes because their case may be weak or their evidence may be weak. the person -- the parents of the child may not want that person to go through a testimony or testifying. so, sometimes there are problems in proof and when that happens, rather than go forward and potentially lose the case, prosecutors make deals. >> why don't we have mandatory sentencing? we should have mandatory sentencing. >> we do have mandatory

sentencing in a lot of cases. >> well -- well -- >> the fact remain it is you have problems with proof, you can't mandatorily sentence somebody if you don't win the case. >> the judges have discretion in california when it comes to child predator case and as i'm saying, as they do with drug dealers, you have mandatory sentences for drug dealers, little kid on the corner, one 8-ball of crack, he gets five years. so, we should have mandatory sentencing for the first. >> actually -- >> larry: get a break and come back with some more moments right after this. don't go away. ♪

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>> mr. gardner wishes to enter a plea of not guilty to both counts and deny the allegations that are attached thereto. >> larry: can a person like mr. gardner, in your opinion, robin, be helped? >> mr. gardner cannot be helped. the only thing that we can do is help victims and help everybody that we don't know about that he's assaulted. >> katie, do you think he can be helped? >> no, i don't think he can be helped and i think he should be put away or get the death penalty, absolutely. i think there needs to be an effort for victims of this man that have not come forward and victims of garrido come forward. >> larry: there have to be other victims? >> i have come in contact with other victims who have not reported it with garrido. lear didn't take them prisoner? >> yeah, but they didn't report it and they wish they had. >> larry: judge mathis, you

think he can be helped? >> i think we need a psychological -- a psychiatric analysis because i don't know whether it's incurable or to environmental. could be power and control which is what many rapists operate off of. not sure. >> larry: mark, you have a thought? >> well, until they are convicted, i generally like to reserve judgment. >> larry: he was convicted of a prior instance. >> i understand that. >> larry: in that matter, can he be helped? >> in that matter, somebody made the determination, what was it, a six-year sentence i believe is what the appropriate sentence was at the time. i have got to believe there was some kind of a problem with that case at that point. >> larry: do we have an answer, robin? >> i think that that's an example of a weak prosecutor who hides under the auspice of we are going to protect the victim and we are not going to make the victim go through it when, in fact, i think very often, victims feel empowered, find the experience much more cathartic

than you would imagine and can find closure and understanding when you have people believe them. >> larry: we thank our panel, katie calloway hall. continue. good spirits. mark geragos, the noted defense attorney, robin sax, the legal commentator, victims advocate and judge greg mathis hosts his own very popular tv show. we have a sad announcement about a member of our "larry king live" family. the brother of our senior supervising producer, carey stevenson, passed away saturday. ca carrie was pre very proud of her big brother, sergeant craig w. stevenson, 44 years old, a decorated 19-year veteran of the lima, ohio, police department. he also proudly served as an officer in the united states army reserve. he served in desert shield and the desert storm campaigns. he is survived by his two children, 9-year-old