very much anymore. they are kind of dicey, though. >> yeah, i guess that's why we don't see them much anymore. thanks very much. have a great weekend, lisa. hey, that's it for 360. thanks for watching. larry king starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com tonight, it's not politics as usual. democrat rod blagojevich, republican ron paul, and jesse ventura, that's me, sound off. on the supreme court vacancy, who should get the job? sarah palin, her mocking of the president. >> and from now until november when they say "yes we can," we stand up and we say "oh no you don't." >> jesse: newt gingrich, his stinging attack on obama. >> this is the most radical

administration in american history. >> jesse: the confederate history month controversy, and tiger woods, all next on "larry king live." >> jesse: good evening. i'm jesse ventura sitting in for larry tonight. let's get to it. joining us rod blagojevich, former illinois governor, and until he was fired last week, a contestant on "celebrity apprentice." ron paul of texas and former presidential candidate. stephanie miller, talk radio host, her website stephaniemiller.com. and andrea tantaros, "new york daily news." big news today. supreme court justice john paul stevens is retiring. who should obama pick to replace him? stephanie? >> well, i'm going to say the most liberal person in the world.

i'm going to say janeane garofalo, shakira, michael moore. andrea, the thing is, honestly, i hope that the president doesn't choose his centrist bipartisan path on this that he normally does, governor, because this is a very liberal justice, and in my opinion, the supreme court is already listing very far to the right with the citizens united decision. i call them scrotus, the very far right justices on the supreme court. so he needs to pick a liberal. there doesn't need to be any reason to reach out to the other side on this one. >> jesse: okay. andrea? >> you can sleep soundly tonight, stephanie, because i have absolutely faith that the president will stick to his liberal values and pick a liberal. you're saying that the court leans right. sotomayor is pretty liberal. >> no, she is not. >> yes, she is. here is how i stand on this. that's okay. obama is the president. he was elected, unfortunately, and he is allowed to pick

whoever he wants. i think it's a wash basically because stevens was very liberal. he is going to pick a liberal. do i think there still needs to be a very rigorous interrogation of whoever he nominates? absolutely. we have important issues we need to find out how they stand works they repeal the health care bill, do they think it's constitutional or not. we should be asking them all those questions. >> andrea, every legal scholar thinks the health care bill is constitutional. >> and stephanie, i really hope that republican senators don't make the wife of the nominee cry, like the democratic senators did to alito's wife. we'll be a little nicer, i hope. >> that's the main thing, making wives cry. >> jesse: governor blagojevich, your opinion on this? >> well, jesse, before donald trump fired me, i would have probably suggested donald trump as a way to stay on the show. but since i'm no longer on there, i think president obama

should probably pick someone who philosophically would be along the lanes of justice stevens. i think he needs to maintain that balance on the supreme court. whatever woman or man he chooses, my guess is he'll probably go in that kind of direction. >> jesse: representative paul, your opinion? >> well, i think we -- he should recommend and we should nominate somebody who will bring the people together. and that's not a moderate. what brings people together is the constitutional, the principals of liberty. therefore you need a libertarian. the libertarian brings conservatives on economic liberals, and a good libertarian will bring the progressives over, and there will be personal liberties. and any time there is secret prisons and assassinations and torture, they would be able to come down on the right side of that. so if you really want to bring somebody in, to look at jonathan turley and judge janet napolitano. they would be very good supreme court justices. >> i like that one. someone who is fair. i didn't hear anyone say fair. is isn't that the most important thing that they would follow the letter of the law?

i believe napolitano would do that. >> congressman paul, you were good with me right until you got up to the fox news personality, then you lost me. but everything else i think you said was true. >> jesse: now george w. bush picked two conservatives, of course robert and alito. so can we really expect obama to go liberal? or do you believe to beef up that side of the court after george bush picked two definite conservatives? representative paul? >> well, once again, i think that obama will pick liberals

for various reasons. and i do think the mushy middle doesn't really help that much. that's why i stick to my guns, that somebody who believes in the constitution and believes in personal liberty will be the kind of person we need. it used to be that way, you know. there used to be -- the document is libertarian. and we used to have libertarian presidents a long time ago. but i think he'll pick some very liberal one, and there will probably be a big fight over it. and, you know, maybe the libertarians will luck out. every once in a while a good liberal, a good progressive, you know, they're don't do too bad on personal liberties and they would be okay on tortures. but they're terrible on the real important issue of personal property and contracts and economically. i don't understand why -- why there is a good defense of personal liberty like progressives do, and lifestyle and all this, but all of the sudden the lifestyle of spending your own money the way you want, oh, no, that's off the books. that's why the libertarian is very appealing, especially to the young people and people who think about personal liberty and they say yes. liberty is one unit. it's economic liberty, it's personal liberty, and in foreign policy, it's mind our own business. that brings people together. >> rod, you know, you're looking for a new gig. if the country needs you, are you willing to put the robes on? >> i think first i need to be

vindicated. that's only fair to the american people before that happens. but, you know, i would like to say that congressman paul raises an interesting point. if you look at american politics today, and maybe this appointment to the supreme court can be a microcosm of the sort of new politics and maybe the new thinking that we need in this country. and to have a fusion of somebody who might be progressive in some issues if you want to put labels but maybe conservative on others there is a core belief in freedom in liberties and some of the principles that our country were founded on, and shake it up a little bit on the supreme court. my fear, however, is this is in so many ways a very political appointment in that the different interest groups that run and control the two different political parties, it's a litmus test for presidents to stick to that, you know, wing of their party that is essentially the base of the party. and my guess is president obama will probably do that as opposed to doing something different along the lines of what congressman paul suggested. >> well, you know, i'm a libertarian. maybe he should nominate me. >> why not? >> yes. and i like your idea of governor blagojevich. i think that since he has been on "survivor," judge joe or

judge judy has to exonerate him before he can run. i think congressman paul raises a good point. the president should be able to appoint governor, a liberal justice. but representative paul, i'm interested because you just won the straw poll in terms of presidential candidates for conservatives. and yet, you know, this party is already said they're going to obstruct. they're going to filibuster whoever the president nominates. how do you feel about that? >> well, we don't know exactly what he'll do. but if i were there and they were going to appoint something that was exactly opposite of a libertarian, to me that would be the opposite of the constitution, i would object, and i would argue against it. i don't particularly enjoy filibusters because i don't think it changes the outcome.

but no, i think that's their obligation. i don't think they should roll over and that president nominate somebody, and the senate consents. i think that's the rule. i don't know why anybody should get upset about debating and voting for it and using the rules of the senate. that just doesn't disturb me too much. but i know that's the big issue is there going to be a fight, is there going to be a filibuster. of course there is going to be. there is going to be objection unless you elect a libertarian, and this would please everybody. >> wait, wait-- >> obama filibustered as well. so to talk about -- stephanie, where you okay with barack obama -- >> jesse: excuse me. bart stupak's sudden retirement. did the tea party do him in? that's next. we got to go to break. stay with us. hey! increase in 6 months. pete, back it up! ( marker squeaking )

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then recommends the right orthotic. for locations see drscholls.com. yes, we can kowtow to enemies, criticize allies, vacillate, bow, dither, yes we can. but somebody needs to tell the president to just because we can does not mean that we should. >> jesse: welcome back to "larry king live."

i'm jesse ventura sitting in for larry tonight. sarah palin. you know, she is everywhere this week. you can't go anywhere without seeing her. and, you know, she was in new orleans, and they always say that's a cattle call for the next presidential nominee. is sarah palin going to be the republican nomination for president? >> andrea, please say yes. >> i don't have a crystal ball. i know you think i'm a genius, stephanie, but i don't know everything. you know what? i'm not so sure about that. i think the woman is on a track to building a media empire. i think she is focused on other things. i'm not certain that the presidency is top of mind for her. but look, she is out there. she is allowed to have free speech. we still have that in this country, i think, thank god. they haven't taken that away from us yet. and she is organizing communities. and what is wrong with a little community organizing, right? she is rallying. and essentially the people that she is rallying, this tea party movement is responsible for bart

stupak resigning today. so i think the group that was called manufactured outrage is proving pretty effective. >> jesse: congressman paul, could she be the nomination for the next president for the republican party? >> oh, she could be. i don't think it's likely. i'm much more interested myself in pushing the republican party into defending what they say they believe in. they claim they believe in individual liberty and personal liberties, and personal freedoms. but, you know, when it comes down the wire and they have to have legislation, you know, they're not very good at it, you know. they endorse the drug war and invasion of privacy and all these things, and government gets bigger. they don't even defend their budgets and spending. so it's totally out of control. so i'm looking for somebody that will stand up and say, you know, republicans believe is personal liberty and limited government. across the board, not just when you're out of office or not just in certain areas, but across the board all the time. and that we haven't seen the republicans have had a chance in

1980, 1994, 2000. and every time they get in office, you know, they tend to drift from their beliefs. they tend too act too much like democrats and expand the role of government and the size of government, which i think is unfortunate. >> jesse: well congressman, they always say balance is the key to the ticket. could it be a palin/paul ticket? [ laughter ] >> i don't think that will happen. i don't think they're looking for my kind of balance because i think we'd have a disagreement on foreign policy. i'm looking to bring the truth home. the country is totally bankrupt. i know a little bit about history. i know how empires end. and i know how ours is going to end. it's going to end badly. but it's a bipartisan effort. i'm tired of hearing this bipartisanship. that's all we have in washington. bipartisan supports the war. obama wants to expand the war and republicans love it. and when there is big spending, yeah, they agree. well, you spend on this item and this item, and both sides agree

to it. so i think we need somebody to stand up and say we need a new idea. i like the idea of progressives and libertarians and conservative constitutionalists getting together and starting talking about civil liberties and this war issue, because this is bankrupting our country. and i'll tell you politically it's much easier to sell spending a little bit less overseas. why are we building an embassy in london, now over a billion dollars. london? why do we have a fortress there? we have a fortress in baghdad, a fortress in kabul. it makes no sense whatsoever. and i think there can be a coalition. to me that would be a very good bipartisan coalition. but it would be principled people on the libertarian conservative right and principled people on the progressive left. >> well, i'm a principled person on the progressive left, as andrea can tell you, governor. and i get accused a lot as a woman of being just jealous of sarah palin. let me say i do want that stevie nicks outfit she was wearing but i don't think she is

intellectually or spiritually qualified to be president. >> you were a navy seal. what happens when you quit in the middle? >> jesse: you don't or you're not a navy seal. >> i don't disagree with what some of the other guests said. but i think it would be a mistake to underestimate sarah palin. but i'd like to say something about what congressman paul said. i really believe america is ripe for a political realignment. i think both parties are basically controlled and owned by the big powerful special interests. the political industrial complex that does business in and around washington. congressman paul knows exactly what i'm talking about. both parties basically decide what the solutions are that confront the american people based upon the different special interest groups that descend on washington. your success in minnesota, jesse, i think had a lot to do with the fact that even in the late '90s there was a real

hunger for some sort of new political way. and i think america particularly now with the economy being what it is ripe for that. and i think congressman paul says it exactly right. why are we in america in so many far away places fighting wars in different places when you really have to ask yourself whether or not that is really a vital american interest. and so i think the right person who speaks on these issues, there is a place for them. go ahead, sorry. >> jesse: i can tell you about the wars. people are making money off the wars, big money off the war. >> right. >> jesse: that's why we fight them now. is obama the most radical president in american history? newt gingrich thinks so. we'll see what the panel thinks. stay with us. we'll be right back. introducing quattron quad pixel technology. it adds a fourth color, yellow, to the standard rgb color system, creating a vast array of colors you can't see with your tv's three color technology. but, you can see this.

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the president of the united states, the most radical president in american history, has now thrown down the gauntlet to the american people. he has said i run a machine. i own washington, and there is nothing you can do about it. now that's where we are. >> jesse: welcome back to "larry king live." we're talking politics and other news of the day with rod blagojevich, ron paul, stephanie miller, and andrea tantaros. well, you know, my problem with sarah palin -- well, first, let's get to gingrich there. how can he make a statement this is the most radical president in the history of the united states? was he around 200 years ago. >> thank you.

>> jesse: to know what the presidents were like back 200 years ago? i think that's the silliest statement i've ever heard. >> governor, he is one of the most centrist presidents we've ever had. the thing that is hilarious, sean hannity has a book out now, a chapter how i'm a reagan conservative. he doesn't agree with reagan on anything. reagan is more of a socialist than barack obama will ever be. he was for zero nukes. he raised taxes more than any president in peacetime. he deficit spent every year of his administration. he signed an amnesty bill on illegal immigration. i mean governor, where do we start here? >> jesse: well -- >> i don't think barack obama would be so upset by being characterized as a radical. i think if you asked barack obama he would say that he is a radical. i don't think he views that -- >> no. >> as a bad word. and if you look at where we have been, and now where we're going, what he is doing is pretty

radical. >> how? >> a trillion dollar -- a trillion dollar entitlement program creating one when he said he would come in and balance the budgets? this vat tax we're talking about too. governor blagojevich brought about the politicizing everything out there. we're supposed to -- special interests are everywhere. a vat tax would essentially politicize every single thing in the economy. i mean think about it. if it's a tax on goods and services, you have just created a lobbyist feeding frenzy. you're going to have any kind of lobbyist out there funneling millions of dollars on special interest campaigns. that's pretty radical. so you go through the list of all the things that he has done, and, you know, it is a far cry from where we've been. it's definitely a different direction for the country. but i think that's what liberals want, and i think it's the wrong answer. but i think barack obama would agree that he is a radical. >> jesse: i think that george bush is more of a radical, the president we just got finished with.

i think he is far more radical. he takes us to a war based upon lies in iraq. i find that very radical. >> i think he is probably -- barack obama took us to a war as well. but i think -- >> jesse: excuse me, what warred by barack obama take us to? >> a good war, afghanistan. >> jesse: wait a minute. afghanistan and iraq were both started under the bush administration. how can you possibly say that barack obama took us to a war? >> he has continued a war. >> jesse: well, because it was fed to him. what is he supposed to -- >> so you don't think we should be there? >> jesse: i stand with ron paul. when you say we marched in, let's march out. that was a great answer. am i right, representative paul? >> that's what i think it is. it's not too much more complicated than that. i wouldn't call obama a radical. i mean, he may be -- he may turn out to be. he has had in a little over a year and most of the talks are on medical care. what did the republicans do? they gave us a prescription drug program. so the republicans aren't immune to the charges that move us towards a socialized system. but to say he is a radical. and newt is an interesting guy, but he says nobody can stop it, nobody can do anything. he is a strong believer in the strong executive. he pushed always to get more

power. of course at that time it was a republican executive. i think that's where the problem is. there is no real separations. there is no desire on the role for the congress to retain their prerogatives. over the war issues or anything else. the president, even in this medical debate, oh, we can't settle this dispute on abortion. oh, i'll write an executive order. that has the same aspect as a law. so they have executive orders and signing statements, regulations, and the congress just rolls over. and that's why the president does these things. but i think that this is a continuation. i've been more annoyed because he hasn't done a much better job on civil liberties and on the war. and economic liberties, i didn't expect him to do any better. but believe me, if you go back and look at history, i would think you could get woodrow wilson?

he was bad on war, bad on civil liberties, put people in prison, and it was a disaster all the way around. and it was totally unnecessary. so yes, i think -- i don't think there is a difference between the two parties. you had a bush policy and it's been continued. we have to have something new and put something together which will bring some people together that care about this country. >> i'm flanked. on the left and the right by ron paul. >> jesse: boy, i like this guy. we'll get rod's take on this when we come back. i like ron paul, i'll tell you. the most powerful half ton crew in america has a powertrain backed for 100,000 miles. chevy silverado half-ton a consumers digest best buy and the most dependable, longest-lasting full-sized pickups on the road. get 0% apr for 60 months on 2010 silverado half-ton models with an average finance savings around fifty four hundred dollars.

>> jesse: rod blagojevich, is president obama the most radical president in history, as newt gingrich says? >> no, he is not. no, he is not. president obama is governing i think slightly to the left of center. frankly, i kind of expected that he would. i'm disappointed that he is not more radical. the public option, for example. here i know congress paul probably disagrees with me. but the democrats promised the american people a public option, a place where consumers can go and test the marketplace when the private insurance companies aren't offering you a fair rate. that was scuttled. and unfortunately, the democratic congress didn't give

the president his public option, and he accepted the compromises in his health care bill, which i think is a step forward, but not nearly what it could have been. i'd like to see him be more radical in afghanistan and iraq. he didn't start those wars. he has a perfect opportunity to heed the lessons of history and make the decision to start withdrawing american troops and bringing them home. especially in a place like afghanistan, where history tells us you'll never, ever achieve a mission there in such a faraway place in the mountainous regions. that's going to benefit the country and instead it's a place that is ripe for being stuck and ultimately leaving at a time when you didn't want to leave. so i'd like to see him make those bold changes as opposed to essentially governing from the center, which is what i think he has been doing. >> jesse: well, sarah palin says it's no shame to be the party of no. and newt gingrich is urging republicans to pivot and become the party of yes. which one of them is right? >> you know, they have to make up their mind.

that's the problem is that, you know, they keep talking about the democrats, governor, being in disarray. i think it's the republicans that are. the tea party is pulling them to the radical right, you know. i think they're in a lot of disarray. and all they've known how to do is obstruct, obstruct, obstruct. even their own ideas, when the president is for it, governor, they're against it. >> the democrats never obstructed when the republicans held the majority? >> no not to this degree. >> oh, please that's absolutely false. to say the republicans are in disarray after we watched the democratic party basically conduct a civil war over health care. i mean, you talk about barack obama being more radical with the public option. he would have if he could have. >> we won. >> stephanie, it was the democratic party, your own party that wouldn't let you have the public option because the people didn't want it. >> but 70% of the american people wanted it. governor blagojevich is right. 70% in every poll wanted the public option.

the governor is right. >> stephanie miller institute, that where the polling was done? >> every poll that was done over the last year said about 70% of the american people wanted a public option, right, governor? >> i would love to see that poll. >> jesse: rod -- >> i agree. >> jesse: rod, obama socialist, like republicans like to brand him? >> no. no, these are the talking points that the gingriches and some of the conservative -- i don't want to put a label on it. but certain republicans, republican political operatives try to label democrats who are now the president. it's out of their old playbook. we've seen it before. it's the same sort of thing they said about bill clinton. it's the same sort of thing they said about previous democratic presidents. i, again, believe that president obama has a tremendous amount of skill. but i wish he would be more of an activist president. here probably again congressman paul disagrees me. but he was elected by the people.

i believe the executive branch, i believe in a strong executive and i believe president obama, frankly, on the health care bill could have been stronger in pushing the public option. i think he has the ability with his skill to lead our country out of wars like iraq and afghanistan, and then use that money to benefit people here back home in america and hold the line on taxes. i don't disagree with those who are advocating we shouldn't raise taxes on people, especially now at a time when people don't have any money. >> jesse: okay, thank you, rod. did you know the issue of slavery played a part in the civil war? the governor of virginia apparently didn't think so. that's ahead. stay with us.

>> jesse: there is my two guests holding up my new best-selling book, "american conspiracies." i've got a question now. that book has been on "the new york times" top ten best-seller list now for four weeks. wait. and yet there hasn't been one mainstream review of that book. why do you think the mainstream media will not do a proper review of my book? >> let me do one right now. let me read it real quick. i did evelyn wood. hang on. >> jesse: well, you don't have to -- but why wouldn't they do a

review of this book? it's obviously popular. it's selling like crazy. they review every other book, and not one mainstream media outlet has reviewed that book yet. >> that's the problem, jesse. we're so polarized these days. you've come on my show. you talked about 9/11. a lot of people have questions about 9/11.

that doesn't mean everybody is a kook about it. >> i think maybe the media is too busy following sarah palin around the country and trying to figure out her next move. and that's why they're just too busy. >> jesse: i doubt that. >> i'm kidding! >> jesse: congressman paul, why do you think they won't review my book? >> i am not sure, but if you figure it out, i want to know and maybe i can get a review of "the revolution, a manifesto" and we can all be happy. >> jesse: they wouldn't review your book? >> well, if there were some, maybe i missed it or something. but i don't remember seeing any significant reviews of it. i think everybody is biased, you know. if you have a website or you have a radio talk show, you're biased because you have opinions. there is nothing wrong with that. so when people are in the business of reviewing books, they're very biased, and they reveal that. they feel no obligation to give the people that they disagree with any time.

so, you know, that to me is sort of accepted. i think they're just biased, but i don't strongly criticize them for them because i'm very biased with my views. i'very sony diplomatimeodha buty stxcdeeoe chonvsy.y thnkilst uto sidered by the elites as pmnsea this has been, frankly, among the reasons why you'v bn ability to go directly to the people. you obviously are successful at that. and by the way, congratulations on being in the top ten best-seller list. but no, i think there are elites who sort of make these decisions in some of the usual places, and tnghathey want spend aimtainabt ner hds directl u d lie u d e d opst buying your boo >> jesse: well thank you, rod. >> le mta o ond to s3 pie adheos piper. e e ak >> jesse: at tt?3 %p>> we a ale as goldberg? >> jesse: i never wrestled goldberg. we're kind of a different time, a different generation. by the time goldberg came along, i had already retired. it's kind of like looking at babe ruth and hank aaron. i don't know. schools, organizations and businesses in every corner of the economy. we thank the many ministers that have come from all over our state.

we thank the red cross, all of our law enforcement personnel. and we thank, most importantly, the families that have stood by their loved ones during these most trying times. their loved ones are now smiling down upon them. and we all know that they are in a better place and that they did not suffer in getting there. >> none of the chambers had been deployed. and none of our miners suffered. so this journey -- this journey has ended. and now the healing will start. thank you. [ inaudible question ]

well -- you know, they're pulling on all the strength they have right now. they're pulling as deep as they have. and they're coming together. and the healing will start now. as we said before, the journey has ended and the grieving and then the healing and then we all stick together. we just got to help everybody through this. it will be quite some time. you know, we got a lot of small children. we've got a lot of grandchildren and we got a lot of brothers and sisters, some big families. >> governor, can you be a little bit more specific, please? did you find -- did your searchers actually find the actual bodies of the four or did they simply find the second shelter had not been used? >> no. we made sure that we have a

total count for every miner that was in that mine. so, as you know, we have 22 -- we have 22 brave miners that we're bringing out of that mine. the rescue started immediately upon ending the rescue mission. the bodies of our miners were found, three exactly where we thought they were and one on the long wall where we thought he was. so -- and they will went and checked and made sure that someone tried to maybe reach a shelter and none of the shelters were breeched at all. >> so the first -- the missing four miners, a total of 18 were found there and then you found the shelter had not been accessed.

is that correct? >> i listen -- congressman and i were up there. we were listening and watching this process and listening to this process from the rescuers deep down underneath. and they would keep advancing and advancing and advancing. they knew where they were looking and, you know, where we believe the three -- so that's -- they went right up into the, you know, the 22 main. that's where they went to immediately and worked their way in and went clear up to the face and that's -- they found them, as i'm told, about 500 feet behind the man trip where their six co-workers were seated. so our three miners were found there that we had been missing in that area. then they went down and they worked in the long wall area to find the other miner.

and when he was located, we had all 29 counted for, the seven that we brought out earlier and the 22 that were still there and the recovery and the teams and they're working and they're committed and working around the clock to make sure that the miners are treated and their families know that they'll be treated with respect and dignity. and they'll be brought and taken to charleston for our examiners. and then they'll be returned to their loved ones. >> when the rescue teams got there, what kind of conditions were the surroundings? they obviously had trouble getting to this point. when they finally arrived -- >> let me have kevin give you more of the details of the conditions and things of that sort which he's been pretty much up to speed on the whole thing and working with all the good men. >> our rescuers are tremendous.

>> we talked about that. i don't know how many rescuers do we have up there now? 80 or 100? >> probably 100. >> you're talking about 80, 100 to 150 of the bravest people that are in there and just would not give up, i want to thank all of them. they're the best -- they are the best. >> governor, you said that the miners did not suffer. how do you know that? >> kevin, the statement and then i think our rescuers told us as they were locating our miners and we got count and they all told us that none of them suffered. >> no. none of the 22 miners underground had a chance to use their scsrs. it was -- we entered long wall 22 section as we talked about.

we found the three bodies of the 22 section closer to the mouth of the section in where the man trip was. and there was so much smoke initially in this area that when the rescuers went in, they apparently walked by those three bodies. so we accounted for those three and then we again checked the man trip to make sure that we had -- we didn't miscount the last time we were up there and we ended up counting six. so we had our nine miners from that section. and we went a little further into that section and determined that the refuge alternative had not been deployed. so we knew we were missing one miner yet. and we came back to the fresh air base close to the long wall face. a team went across the long wall face and still could not find the miner. came back over towards where the head gate was and actually found the miner at that location.

so we accounted, as the governor has said, for all 29. shortly after that, we have 15 rescue teams total on site. and they are beginning to recover the bodies as we speak. and i would expect that that will continue until we are able to get all the bodies out. >> is that situation -- [ inaudible ] >> yes. it will be -- that's quite a guess. i mean this is a hard go in there now. i mean it's hard to turn a rescue into a recovery with the same group of people and ask them after they've worked hard to try to rescue someone to start carrying bodies because, you know, there's a lot of

debris. there's no equipment to use right now to transport the bodies. so it's going to be a lot of hand carrying and some long distances and there's just 22 bodies that have to be moved. so it's starting immediately and it will go on until completed is all i can tell you. [ inaudible question ] could you repeat that? [ inaudible question ] you know, when they reported to the command center, it was very professional with respect and that's on the outside. i'm sure on the inside it was hurting them more than anybody could imagine. >> what time was it? approximately? >> it was about 11:30, i would guess. and, again, the last body found would have been body on the long wall face.

>> i can't help but notice you're tearing up there and -- >> it's emotional for everyone. and i can't say anybody hurts worse than the families do. their loved ones are not coming home. but the rescuers hurt second most. >> how you are handling this? >> that will be up to the company to decide. [ inaudible question ] how long did it take and what did they actually find? >> how long it took the rescuers? it took about three hours for the rescuers to complete the task. it seemed kind of slow to everybody on the surface, naturally. five minutes seems like five hours. but i'm sure underground five minutes seems like five seconds as they moved. and we tied in the areas that we talked about earlier to make sure that the smoke was gone, that they weren't in harm's way

and they then began advancing up to 22 long wall. they kept calling back to the command center to give their readings, what the gas concentrations were, requesting that they could advance because the command center basically would control their actions and where they go to. and, you know, it's just a conversation back and forth. the majority of these people have done this for a period of time. they're trained to do this. and they performed to the upmost capabilities that they had. i'm really proud of everybody that was up there and part of the rescue operation. >> can you clarify about -- i want to make sure we understand what you said a little bit earlier. three of the four missing and unaccounted for miners, apparently could have been discovered in the mission that was aborted because of smoke and fire, that was mission number three, correct?

about 12, 15 hours ago. >> no. >> because of the visibility, they walked by or tonight they walked by? >> it was the night that this occurred is that the only time a rescue team would have been up in that area to that point. that team made it up to the man trip and found six bodies on the man trip. there was so much smoke and the conditions were so dire at that time with dust in the air that they apparently bypassed the three bodies that were on the ground prior to getting to the man trip. this would have only been the second time that a rescue team would have made it to that location. >> and what about the fourth individual? >> the fourth individual would have been bypassed on the first day as well when we -- when the rescue team entered the long wall face, they were looking for bodies. and naturally the numbers were added up and it was determined that there was one body missing and it was not known where it was. it wasn't known if they left the

face on the tailgate side or if it was somewhere on the face hidden under some structure. and it took us a little while tonight, in fact. i mean we went down the face and had to come back and look and relook and finally the body was determined to be near the head gate or near where you would enter the long wall face. >> is that -- one more follow up. >> is that typical in a case like this? not that this kind of accident, thank god, is tip kachypical. is it typical that they not only went to the refuge, but they were not in a different place in the mine at all. if the atmospheric conditions were different and luck were a little different, when the bad luck occurred when the original accident occurred, they would have been accounted for, there never would have been four missing men. you never would have to agonize whether they were in the refuges. is that unusual that they were

actually right there with the other victims of this? >> well, no. i wouldn't think it's unusual. i mean they were in the area. apparently the long wall crew was still mining coal. as they were there. and the development, long wall 22 apparently finished mining coal and they were the second crew going to come out of the mine behind the crew that was in the man trip on the way out when the explosion occurred. so, no, they were kind of in the area where they probably would have been expected. it was just the conditions and the smoke was just so great that the rescuers in a frantic means to try to get in there and see if we had any survivors just walked by them in those conditions. >> can you tell where the explosion started yet, specifically? was it on the inactive side or active side? >> we don't know. and that's what the investigation is for. after this recovery of the bodies is completed, there will

be -- the state will conduct a joint investigation. the company will be participati participating. i can assure you that no stone will be left unturned. and we'll find out the cause of this explosion. and quite frankly, the only thing good that can come out of this is to educate everyone, put regulations in place if needed to make sure that this doesn't happen again. >> can we tell how extensive the fire was? >> excusehe? >> can we tell how extensive the fire was? >> we didn't evaluate how extensive the fire was. we just wanted to locate the missing miners. >> what was your message to the families? what did you tell them specifically to night? >> i'm sorry, we didn't have a chance to help rescue the miners. >> is there any concern about the conditions the investigators are going through? the air is okay? there is no more smoke? everything is safe? >> it is still tough conditions up there. the long wall, the long wall

face is clear. it will be easier to remove bodies from the long wall than the long wall 22 section. we're still -- it's -- you need to be careful in these kind of conditions. and naturally we do not want another accident or injury occurring to one of our rescuers right now. >> how long is this investigation going to take? >> in the past, before a final report is released, it can take up to a year. by the time you have all the electrical equipment that's in the mine will be tested by specific manufacturers and independent labs to see if that in and of itself could have caused the explosion. there's going to be extensive interviews conducted. there's going to be extensive underground mapping. and it's just a very time consuming process. but if you want to do a quality piece of work, you have to put the time in and both the state and mser are committed to a

quality piece of work to see what happened here. >> two more questions. >> are the families still inside? >> i think that by now they would have left. it was hard. they've been there for five days. and, you know, naturally they wanted to kind of wait and take their loved ones home with them. and we had to explain that we'll make sure that they were taken care of with the dignity and proper respect they should. and so we tried to make sure they understood they can go home now and would be their families and start this healing process, hopefully. and so i think probably everybody is gone by now. we want to thank you all. we really do. >> i think one more plea ought to be made to respect their

privacy. they appreciate that you have done that thus farment but now is the most difficult part for them. they want to continued privacy. >> the ones that want to speak will reach out. the ones that don't, they need privacy. >> governor, we heard a condition of the last remaining survivor is still in the hospital -- >> you know, i haven't. i heard that hopefully it's improving, he's improving. i don't have -- we're so engrossed in what we've been doing here, i didn't get an update. i'll get an update tomorrow. >> okay. >> thank you all. >> this was in west virginia bringing the sad news that those four missing miners have been found and they are dead. that brings the number of dead in this coal mining explosion to 29 there in west virginia. we want to bring in now reporter live from west virginia with more about this.

perhaps can you give us perspective on what the hopes were in this final rescue that took place today. >> yeah, natalie. all week long the governor of west virginia had been saying that the odds were against them. but there is still that sliver of hope. and i think the first sentence of this press conference that you just saw kind of sums it up. he said the miracle we had prayed for didn't happen. he said that none of the chambers had been deployed. all week long officials had thought that if the four missing coal miners were alive that they would be in these refuge chambers where they would have food, water and oxygen. and the mission of these rescue workers was to go to those rescue chambers to see if the missing miners were there. but they, these chambers hadn't been used. and so for these families, this is really a closure to long five long excruciating days. >> all right.

ines beret, thank you very much. the sad nudews, the four missin miners were found dead. this is the worst coal mining disaster in the u.s. since 1970. the principal of succession would have prevented that civil war, save 600,000 people and the slaves still could have been released. >> there you go. rob, any comments? >> real quick, the governor of virginia gets an f in american history. he obviously got it wrong. if he was a history teacher, he should get fired. >> there you go. i want to take time out to thank all my guests to night.