interesting look at where we are right now in iraq. it certainly has been a very important night. i'm glad that you've been able to share this with us. i'm especially appreciative of all the wonderful comments you've tweeted. not about us or shot, but about those troops. the ones who are not making it back and the ones that we're going to be welcoming home soon. thanks for being us. here, now, "larry king live." -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com tonight, new york governor david paterson opens up for the first time about the islamic center and mosque near ground zero. will it be built there? can he solve this crisis? could it he be a deal maker? president obama says he's not sorry for speaking out over the controversy. who's right, who's wrong? we've got lathe latest on the

governor's efforts to talk to muslim leaders -- next on "larry king live." first, we have breaking news. a milestone in the war in iraq. the last u.s. combat convoy is leaving the country. let's go right to cnn's chris lawrence at the pentagon. in a couple minute, we'll talk with governor paterson. i thought the last date was august 31st. aren't they still 6,000 troops there of combat level? >> yes, you're right. the last combat convoy is now pushing its way out of iraq, into kuwait. but this is the 4th stryker brigade. there's still a couple hundred members of this brigade, combat members of this brigade, who stayed behind in iraq, to finish up some logistical duties. they're not going to fly out of iraq until later thursday. there's also another 56,000 u.s. troops still in iraq. now, 50,000 of them will stay

beyond next month. they'll stay to the end of 2011. but you've still got the matter of those 6,000 troops still there. now, they're not designated necessarily combat troops. a pentagon spokesman said, look they can still perform a combat function. and our combat mission doesn't end in the end of the month. he said, in fact, a couple of them were originally combat brigades but they got transitioned to this new role of advise and assist, which is going to become the main u.s. mission once the handover takes place at the end of august. >> larry: thanks for clearing that up. chris lawrence. he's been on the scene all day. chris lawrence, cnn pentagon correspondent, putting some clarity on this moment in history. let's go to the governor of new york, david paterson. what's your position on this proposed islamic community center and mosque? it's going to be two blocks, if built, prom ground zero. what do you think? >> well, larry, i think that

there is no local, state or federal statute or any clause of the constitution that would prohibit the mosque from being there. and so, therefore, anybody that thinks otherwise clearly is not realizing what has really been the bedrock core of the principles of our liberty. but i think the issue -- >> larry: how about -- i'm sorry, go ahead. >> well, no, larry, i'm waiting for you. >> larry: all right. what about the emotional aspects? legally, of course, you may be completely correct. people have a right to build. how about the emotional aspects, over 3,000 killed? >> well, that, larry, is exactly the point. you know, the presept of greek tragedies is that the right are clashing with the right. i think that's what's happening here. i've just defined why the reasons the mosque and the developers have every right -- it's their property -- to build on it. ground zero. first, they were the epicenter of the first attack on this

country, on our own soil. we were, in addition to that, subjected to traffic delays for security. service interruptions. for years. and then people were living in peace and working in safety as they were promised were not. you've got a 9/11 bill we're still trying to get through congress to help the sick and the families of those who were lost. then you have a trial of some of the person traitors scheduled to be put right in the area. that issue has never been resolved. so i think that the stationing of this mosque and that area really has just been further anxiety and creating great fear for the people who live there. and i hear that fear. what i'd like to do is talk it over, if possible, with those who are developing and looking to build -- >> larry: you have not talked to them yet? >> we've talked on the staff level. we had a meeting schedulinged for monday.

we postponed it because the imam was still traveling in the middle east. and we're hoping to get together. but only if they want to get together. there's no attempt at pressure or coercion here. i just like to talk about what might be a magic moment in our history. we don't want those who -- terrorists who attacked our country to have any more time than they deserve offering division among us. it's my firm belief that if we talk about perhaps maybe some way of working this out, which would be suitable to both parties, it would be a great day for this country. >> larry: simply put, governor, if they asked you your input, would you ask them to seek another location? >> i'm -- it's certainly a suggestion worth considering. we wouldn't violate any laws. all these transactions have to

be at arm's length. but i think that might be a way that would suit the needs of a community that was actually there in some form before what happened on september 11th. and at the same time, recognize that i think the people who have lived in that area have been through too much. the scars of that day have not healed. and we owe all of them, more than anything else, our greatest respect and admiration for staying there and trying to rebuild that need section of lower manhattan. >> larry: all right. as governor of new york, you can't stop it legally. you can certainly put the pressure of your office on them or suggest it. do you think the president should -- >> i would never do that, larry. i'm not putting the pressure on anyone. i just want to have a dialogue, to think about what a magic moment -- you know, sometimes -- you know, back in 1984 in iss auschwitz, there was heightened tension and intervention by the

vatican. what he said at that time is this would help to keep the peace. so the sacrifice often ignites compassion. so if one of the two sides of this issue would stop engaging in who's right, who's wrong, who's winning, who's losing, what's good and what's bad, and think about how to bring us together, that sacrifice might bring us all together in a way mo so than we had been before this. >> larry: should the president get more involved? >> well, i think that the president spoke very eloquently on the issue and so have many others. not to leave out the mayor of the city of new york. but i think there's another half of this problem. which is that so many people who normally would understand this issue are very upset by the fact that this is happening. what that tells me is the wounds of 9/11 haven't healed. and i think if they haven't, perhaps we can find ways to bring about that healing by perhaps creating a situation

where people will feel more comfortable and if anything else, what i think was wrong after september 11th is that we did not appeal to the religious leaders of the world, all of them, to condemn this act of wanton violence. and so perhaps spiritually we can get through this period by dialoguing with each other in a way we never have before. >> larry: so you think there is a solution acceptable to all sides? >> i think if we work hard enough that we can find one. and if people would stop talking about what's impossible and talk about what is -- that what could actually happen, if people put their heads together, maybe we could find a site that's away from the site now but still serves the catchman area, that would be a noeble jess clur to those who live in the area who suffered after the attack on this country and at the same time would probably in many ways change a lot of people's minds about islam which is really a

peaceful religion practiced by peace loving people. >> larry: always good having you with us. thank you, governor. >> thank you, larry. >> larry: governor david paterson, the governor of new york. russell simmons supports construction of the islamic center and mosque near ground zero. and he'll tell us why next. and, later, we'll have a live report from iraq. the last u.s. combat convoy is leaving the country so some troops, the convoy is leaving. stay with us.

>> larry: russell simmons is the founder of global grind.com. we welcome him back to our show. what did you think of the governor's idea of sitting down, trying to reason together, and maybe, maybe a different location? >> well, i'm here in the capacity of the chairman of the foundation for ethnic understanding. we've worked with the imam on promoting tolerance. we have a twinning program where imams and rabbis work together. the thing that's troublesome to me, larry, is this mosque is a replacement for one that's been there since before there was a world trade center, for 40 years imam has preached in that neighborhood. they've been working on that

project for four years. recently, it's been polly the sized. the idea of moving it might have been okay until it was politicized. we should make every effort not to move it. i think it's critical that we recognize that we built this country on religious tolerance. and on religious freedom. and so if we can't to penalize the 2 billion muslims because of the actions of a few, then we have to xexamine the way we loo at each other and all religions. so i think it would be a terrible idea to move the mosque. >> larry: but how about, russell, his statement about the sensitivity of people in the area, that yes legally they have a right but 2000 souls were killed -- >> yeah many of them were muslims. >> larry: isn't there a reasonable solution? >> muslim-americans and other americans are fighting to free muslims. we're saying we can't have muslims have a religious center

or a community center in the community where there are two churches, there's the holocaust museum or the museum of tolerance, and we can't have a mosque there. that says something very bad about the state of america today. even if there's a discussion, for me, is hurtful. but the 2 billion muslims who are watching us now are being hurt. when you talk about the muslims who are tolerant, which are most every muslim in this world, and the ones who -- i guess they like to say they're -- they accept everyone and they're tolerant and they're reasonable, how do they feel when we tell them that they can't build a mosque somewhere in the united states? and the sensitivity, the fact is al qaeda attacked us, not the muslim religion. and if islam didn't attack us, we can't hold them all accountable. and if someone had -- if someone believes that they hold ill will towards the whole muslim faith because of it, then they're

wrong. it's like telling someone it's cold outside but we're -- you don't need a coat. the fact is, that al qaeda attacked us and not the muslim community, and we should be -- the plans are to have a vigil for -- at ground zero every year in honor of the people who lost. it's a center that is open to everyone. and i think we should respect their plans. in fact we should support their plans. and that's been my opinion as the chairman of the foundation for understanding and the rabbi who is also the chairman of the world jewish congress. there's a whole group of us who promote religious tolerance, who know how important it is. because if we don't promote religious tolerance, then we could create -- we already have created, after 9/11, a very negative reaction when, in fact we had our chance to promote world peace. after 9/11, with all the compassion that was given to us,

we threw a lot of it away, and i think now is an opportunity for us to turn it around. and promote a relationship with the islamic world that makes good sense, not one that's based in fear and ignorance. >> larry: all right, russell, let me get a break. when we come back, we're going to play a little clip by newt to platry new zegerid otc.ewt

. >> larry: russell simmons is with us. this controversy has drawn lots of political commentary. newt gingrich. watch. >> building an interfaith center. a building that had a church, a synagogue and a mosque. with an interfaith board. that would at least be interesting. but to suggest that a few blocks from the site in which islamist extremists killed nearly 3,000 americans, that we should

tolerate an act of triumphantism? >> i'm sad he feels that way. it's sad in this day and time that americans who built this country on interfaith respect and dialogue would think that -- that he could think that -- and i'm sorry not only that he thinks that, that he has support. it's very -- it's saddening that we have this kind of belief system. there was a moment when i moved in to queens, a past queen, and there was some sensitivity neighbors there. was i supposed to move because i was an african-american and they were sensitive? the fact is we were attacked by al qaeda, al qaeda, and not by islam, islam, and the fact is, there are hundreds of millions of law-abiding, respectful muslims, and american muslims are respectful and they built this country, and they're an important part of this country, and if we can't respect them,

then we don't deserve the respect that we can't give them. we don't -- in other words what we give to others is what we get for ourselves. and there's -- it's a terrible state that we're in. we can have this kind of discussion. that we're even talking about this. again, it was not politicized for years. they've been working on this for a long time. and the fact that they're making -- that there is such opposition, and there's so many people who have lost people in the world trade, who are supportive of this, and they're not being promoted. there's a lot of dialogue about some people are sensitive. but, again, like i said, if you're blaming muslims, then you need to change your mind. if you're blaming muslims for the attack on 9/11, then you need to change your mind. do we blame christians at the first world trade attack? we didn't. and i think it's insane and it's wrong-headed. it creates a negative -- cycle

of negativity. >> larry: russell, do you think the president should be more forceful? >> i think the president was eloquent. he made the right statement. it wasn't for him to comment on the wisdom of building it there. that's fine. but the truth is, for me, as the chairman of the foundation for african understanding. i know the best thing a jew can do today to fight anti-semitism is to find islama phobia. this muslim, the imam who is a preach preacher, he fights anti-semitism. the work he's doing. and the fact that he wants to be there as an example of the moderate muslims in the rest of the world, to make a good statement. i think that's a great statement. and i think we should support it. if we don't, it says something very bad about this country. >> larry: one other thing i want to -- dr. laura was with us last night, you know the music world very well, no one knows it

better. what do you make of the argument of the "n" word that she used, a great deal of outrage is used by rappers and comedians all the time? >> i don't want to comment on that. today we're talking about a very sensitive issue. and it's sad. it's a sad state we're in today. and i'm very, very sorry that i have -- am having this dialogue. i wouldn't believe it possible. the research we get year after year says we're becoming a more tolerant, a more loving community. and i think over the -- i haven't seen research in the last six months, in the last year. i'm worried that we're going the wrong way. and that for me -- that's the work that i do as the chairman of the foundation for ethnic understanding. and i think that -- i'm going to keep doing it despite the fact that we're in such a sad state but we are, and we have to look at ourselves and make some different choices. >> larry: okay. very eloquent. russell simmons, the founder of globalgrind.com, the hip-hop pioneer is chairman of rush

communications. thanks, russell, always good seeing you. >> thank you, my pleasure. >> larry: two congressmen, one for the islamic center's construction near ground zero and one against, are next. and the cast has been gathered. when the curtain rises. and the spotlight is yours. having a strong signal at your back... is like having invisible power everywhere. because in that moment... you're not there to take up space. you're there to fill the room. rule the air. verizon. right now, buy a blackberry smartphone and get a second one free. like the bold. only at verizon.

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got it. wow! you win this time good twin! there's no disguising the real deal. >> larry: in a moment, we'll be joined by representative peter king of the state of new york and representative keith ellison, the democrat of minnesota, to discuss the islamic situation. let's get more on that breaking news. the last u.s. combat convoy is leaving iraq. here's cnn's arwa damon in mosul. are they pretty -- is the convoy all gone now? >> yeah, larry, they pretty much are. they've safely left iraq. they were very anxious about that journey, just because so many of these troops are hoping it will be their final one. but they have crossed the border into kuwait. this draw-down has been going on for months now. remember, the u.s. military's trying to reach that white

house -- trying to have its troop level also at 50,000 by the end of the month. at that stage, the combat mission in iraq, "operation iraqi freedom" that began over seven years ago is going to come to an end. on september 1st at midnight we're going to end near this "operation new dawn." the u.s. military in an advise and assist rule. their ability to impact security on the ground here is going to be drastically reduced. we've been talking to soldiers throughout this entire draw-down process. many have been reflecting on their years in iraq. many of them have been here on multiple deployments. up to four, even five, years in iraq. more time here than they've spent at home. they've seen their friends die. some actually had to carry them off the battlefield. it's been an incredibly intense experience. also remember at the onset of this many of the soldiers were saying they thought it was only going to last for a few months and here we are right now, larry. >> larry: thanks, arwa.

arwa damon, our cnn correspondent. staying atop this historic story which will really be complete august 31st. we're joined now by representative peter king, republican congressman from new york, he's' po opposed the islamic center. and keith ellison, democrat, from minnesota. he's the first muslim elected to congress and he supports the proposed islamic center and mosque. congressman king if it's not a legal question, why can't they build it? >> first of all, larry, let me make clear that the muslim community has the absolute right to build a mosque. but i think it's the wrong location. it's the wrong time. and it's insensitive. the fact is there were so many people murdered that day. and to have this 13 story, $100 million etiface constructed. certainly causing pain to many of my constituents. and to me, the fact is whether

or not -- obviously, 99% of muslim-americans are outstanding americans. the fact is, this attack was carried out by an islamic force. to have that mosque that close to ground zero i think is just -- it puts salt into wounds. i think governor paterson's entirely right. i've had discussions with governor paterson. if he can make another site available, state promperty or a land swap. which would satisfy all the needs of the muslim community. satisfy legitimate needs of the family members who feel offended by this. i think that's the route to go. i think that muslim officials, including the developer, should find a way to sit down with the governor. >> larry: congressman ellison, it's legally okay, but how about congressman king's point, that there's a sensitive question here? >> well, of course it's sensitive. the fact is constitutional rights must always take precedence over people's sensitivities. there are in fact a number of

people who were first responders and who lost loved ones in 9/11 who support president obama's position and that of mayor bloomberg and that of representative nadler and that of representative wiener who all believe there's no problem with the developer and the organizers going forward with the mosque project, with the islamic center project. so the fact is, you know, we cannot simply yield to sensitivities when constitutional rights are involved. and, plus, i think -- i'm concerned about the international picture and the message that it sends. you know, the fact is, is that our constitutional rights are our best protection. because we send the signal that america's about -- is about tolerance and about religious inclusion. if we send an opposite message, basically, we allow the anwr al lackeys to say america's at war

with islam and that's a message i'm against ever being sent out. i want america to stand firm on the idea of liberty and religious tolerance as we always have. >> larry: congressman king, isn't that a good point? >> larry, the fact is, that rights have responsibilities. just because you have the right to do something doesn't mean you have to do it. also responsibility to take into account the consequences. the imam and developers said they want to build bridges. bring about reconciliation. but obviously the backlash of the -- results that are happening are people who feel deeply offend and hurt by this. so if they really are interested in reconciliation, to me, it would show tremendous statesmanship, tremendous class, by moving the site. i think -- made the analogy today to auschwitz. how pope john paul ii asked the nuns to move the convent away from auschwitz, even though they had nothing to do with the holocaust. the fact is, he realized this

would be insensitive by the jewish community. and even though they had every right to be there, he asked them to move. i think archbishop dolan was making the analogy to new york, while the muslim community has the right to be there, it's causing such pain -- among good people. i think it's wrong -- keith and i get along great so i'm not saying he does it but other people in new york who say those who oppose this are biased, are big gotted. these are some of the most wonderful people i know. i'm asking the imam and the developer to take it into account. >> larry: congressman ellison, is there, in your mind, a compromise acceptable? >> in my opinion, the fact is, this the developer and the organizers have the right to build there, and we have to stand up for the constitution. larry, i swore an oath to uphold the constitution. so i'm going to do my job and my duty, as i swore to uphold it, but this great country afforded

me the opportunity to swear that oath on thomas jefferson's koran because we are a country of religious liberty and we respect the religious diversity of this great country. um, i think that governor patterson is making a mistake. i think that he ought to stand up for the constitution. and i think that if we -- if before this whole thing blew up, if he wanted to work out a compromise, maybe if it was in everybody's interest, it would make sense. but once you have people protesting and trying to stop americans from exercising their constitutional rights, i think that you can't possibly back down at this point. because the message is the churches are allowed within two blocks of 9/11. other religious institutions are allowed there. hey, even off-track betting establishment is allowed there. but not a mosque. and that means that we have second class citizenship for people who would go to a mosque.

well, that's muslims. >> larry: we'll be calling -- >> -- to go that way again. >> larry: we'll be calling on both of you again. we have a major debate coming up on this same issue. we thank congressman peter king and congressman keith ellison. who by the way are very good friends. weeble rig we'll be right back. >> thank you, larry. waking up with morning pain drain the energy right out of you. fight it with (new) bayer am. it combines extra strength bayer aspirin to treat pain plus an alertness aid to help you get off to a running start. try bayer am - the morning pain reliever.

>> larry: marco is professor,

columbian university, and host of "our world" with black enterprise. david web is co-founder of the tea party 365 org. and a sirius xm radio host. we'll start with you, susan. we've heard both sides. we've heard the governor saying he's going to try to sort of moderate this. why are you opposed? >> i stand firmly with what the governor said today. i think so much is lost in this situation, with the president of the united states standing up, saying we stand for freedom of religion, and we stand by the constitution. which we all do. including those families that lost loved ones on 9/11. what the families of 9/11 are asking for, though are some information, are some concerns to their sensitivities to what's being built in that general area at all, and a larger discussion because they're concerned, because questions aren't being answered, and because -- you know, congressman peter king pointed out, we can have a

conversation about the constitution and honoring freedom of religion, while also sitirities of those people who lost their sons, daughters, you know,t the be exclusive. >> larry: peter, are we demonizing muslims there, do you think? >> i think so. i think one has to see this in the larger context. there is now -- "the new york times" reported, a whole wave of campaigns against the building of mosques all over america very far from 9/11. i don't think we can be naive about what's going on here. of course. we all want to be respectful to people who had tragedies occur to them. but sensitivity is not an excuse for bigotry. if an evangelical church opposed to gay rights wants to build in san francisco, i say let them do that. even though there may be some gay people in san francisco that maybe offended by that. the whole point of the first

amendment is we allow free speech. even points of view that might be offensive. that's why we aloud the nazis to march in a neighborhood filled with holocaust survivors. we were right to do it. >> larry: there's no shortage of politicians speaking out. here is speaker nancy pelosi. and then we'll have you comment. watch. >> there is no question that there is a concerted effort to make this a political issue by some. and i join the -- those who have called for looking into how is this opposition to the mosque being funded? >> larry: david, what do you make of that? is this a -- is this a tea party issue? >> no, actually, and it's neither a legal issue. look, america doesn't have to prove her religious tolerance. it exists. we have it. the simple fact than pete worr d refer to anyone who has a different point of view as a bigot is also another speechess

argument. the imam talks about having tolerance and building bridges. yet the very first act is to do something that is intolerant of other's feelings, and about the promotion of sharia. this is a man who has not denounced hamas as a terrorist organization. ness own writings, in his own book, supports violent jihad and is a purveyor of sharia law. and, peter, people who have different points of view aren't all bigots. >> larry: mark hill, what's your comment on all this? >> well, first of all in response to david, i'd have to strongly disagree. since 9/11, america has not demonstrated religious tolerance towards muslims. we see all sorts of human rights violations in public places. where muslims are not being given the same rights and privileges as other americans. ath thingsensitive or intoleran

build a mosque is only true if we buy into the perverted logic. or that islam did it. as opposed to a few radical fanatics. that's the issue here. we have somehow made a war on terrorism a war on muslims. that's a problem. and america has to deal with that. >> larry: was the president having it both ways when he said on one day they have a constitutional right based on religious freedom and the next day said he was talking about the right and not the wisdom? >> the president of the united states -- to hear speaker pelosi, a friend of mine, talk about people who want to make this a political issue clearly the president of the united states helped to make this a much larger political national issue than it was a week ago. the president was trying to have it both ways. even today, to be so -- with all due respect tore the president, offhanded, when we have, you

know, so many days of people talking about the concerns of the survivors, the victims of 9/11, and the question is do you have any regrets and all he can say is no regrets. not no regrets other than the fact that i'm sorry that the people who were hurt by 9/11 by losing their loved ones didn't understand that, you know, i have a stronger obligation to the constitution. there was absolutely no attempt to try and feel the pain or the concern or the sincerity of the people who are against the mosque. and as president of the united states, i think he's got a responsibility to both sides of this argument. >> larry: peter, did you understand, peter, the governor's statements tonight? >> they don't really make a lot of sense to me. i mean, the truth of the matter is, once you tell people you can't build a mosque here but you can build a mosque here, you're creating a kind of second class citizenship. what about the muslims who were in those towers who died on 9/11? what about the muslims who were first responders on 9/11?

don't they deserve, also, their sensitivities to be concerned, to be involved? the reality is people who went through this terrible trauma of having loved ones die on 9/11 have pretty much the same set of political views they did before 9/11. we as a country, it seems to me, should have, as a principle, the idea that we have exactly the same rules for building a form -- a religious institution, one religious and of another. that we make no distinction. that that should be central to the way we operate. i don't want to keep baptists or whatever timothy mcveigh's religious was from building a church near oklahoma city where he blew up a bomb. it doesn't seem to me we should punish innocent people -- >> larry: all right. we'll have more with the panel right after these words.

>> larry: let's check in with john roberts before we get back to the panel and see what's on "a.c. 360" tonight. john sitting in for anderson.

>> larry, great to see you're tonight. we continue with the breaking news tonight on "360." you remember shock and awe, march of 2003, it marked the beginning of major combat operations in iraq. the last u.s. combat brigade has now left iraq. what was achieved for the $751 billion spent on the war? we'll speak with former u.s. ambassador to iraq ryan crocker. plus, who's funding the controversial community center and mosque being built near ground zero? plus, my interview with dr. laura on why she's quitting radio after he repeated use of the "n" word on her program. comedian d.l. huguely and the reverend al sharpton weigh in on when, if ever, it's appropriate to use that word. beginning at the top of the hour. >> larry: thanks so much, john roberts, 10:00 p.m. eastern, 7:00 p.m. pacific. david webb, aren't we a country that's based on, as peter pointed out, that nazis can march in skoki, an anti-gay

church can be built in san francisco? that's where we are as americans. >> we absolutely are, larry. and, again, there are many examples out there that you can cite. but, again, we're not talking about the issue of what we're allowed to do or not allowed to do. we don't have to prove our religious tolerance. we have that. it's constitutional. no one, by the way, to peter's point, has said you can't build this mosque. what the community and what the survivors and what many muslims around the world, including the director general of al arabiya television and its former editor wrote in his column is there are many muslims who feel this is also not a good idea. this is a geographic issue. there isn't a muslim community near there. the closest muslim community, there's a travel path of six mosques just to get there. and, by the way, if imam were to do something very simple, i think it would go a long way.

if he were to stand up and denounce hamas, no longer support jihad or no longer be a purveyor of sharia law, which in its most violent form resulted in the sharia law, which resulted in the stoning deaths of a man and woman two days ago in afghanistan, if he were to denounce those things and say i'm a moderate muslim, that would go a long way. he hasn't done that. matter of fact, he supports sharia and he supports hamas. >> larry: mark, is there a solution? behind the obvious that it's constitutional? >> right. there is. we need a deeper, more complex and humanistic approach to understanding world religions here. as long as we continue to see islam as the purveyor of terrorism and violence, we'll continue to have these problems. we need to get to a more deep and substantive understanding of what islam is about. then we wouldn't have these problems. we don't blame christianity when a christian does something out of order. when you look at, for example,

timothy mcveigh, the davidians in waco. there's never been a more organized, efficient terrorist organized of the ku klux klan. we have to have the same temperment and sensibility toward islam. it's the right thing to do and treats muslims as full human beings. >> larry: susan, isn't that a good argument? >> yes, of course we want to respect everyone's religion and everyone's rights. when it is 500 feet from the greatest tragedy that any of us have ever lived there on american soil, i do think that as americans, we can also have a conversation. as people who can honor the religious freedoms of muslims in this country, who can honor the united states constitution and also honor the wishes of the people who lost their loved ones on 9/11. i just don't see why this has to be so different.

and the fact that we have to view it as such, that it's either us against them is making this a more difficult conversation, that we can't follow what governor paterson said and can't we sit down and move it a few blocks so that the footprint of 9/11 isn't impacted by this but, in fact, muslims get to worship wherever they want to in lower manhattan? i don't understand why it has to be such a big issue. and i don't understand why people like the imam wouldn't want to say if this is so much a concern to you, let me move it. you come when we open this four more blocks down and let's hold hands and show the world that we can negotiate our differences, our concerns and our fears. >> because the problem is that people are offering something that's not just hypothetical, but also counter factual. the fact is that muslims didn't -- it's not as if muslims were terrorists and christians died on 9/11. muslims and christians died on the 9/11 tragedy. >> of course. of course. >> exactly. islam didn't cause the twin

towers to fall. it was a few terrorists. the very idea that we should be offended by islam -- >> the very idea in the united states that we should be afraid to have this conversation between the two party sincere something that concerns me and should concern you, too. >> larry: we're having the conversation. don't go away. where there's magic. and you now understand what nature's been hiding. ♪ at dow we understand the difference between innovation and invention. invention is important. it's the beginning. it's the spark. but innovation is where we actually create value for dow, for society, and for the world. ♪ at dow, we're constantly searching for how to use our fundamental knowledge of chemistry to solve these difficult problems. science is definitive. there is a right answer out there. [ male announcer ] the same 117 elements

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>> larry: david webb, the question has come up as to how the building has been financed. >> the people against this are americans. they're not financed or funded in any way. it's americans, new yorkers who have spoken, 63-28 in the last poll against this. what's really wrong about this argument, about this debate, in summary, it's this us versus them idea. marc references that muslims were killed. muslims are also against the mosque.

this is about -- >> some. >> -- appropriateness. >> larry: peter, how would you respond to that? >> i think the main -- look, i think we could probably take a pretty good guess that the vast, vast majority of muslims are for this and actually pretty frightened about a situation where you now have, in communities across america, people opposing the building of mosques in places that have nothing to do with ground zero. the basic point is that we don't effectively correctly honor the sensitivities of people who have been victimized by repeating the victimization against others. lots of people who have suffered traumas. jews have been victimized by nonjews, african-americans have been victimized by white people who then come to hate all members of those groups even if they had nothing to do with it. it seems to me we do not actually help those people in overcoming the trauma by perpetuating the psycho hatred. >> you're not being very factual on this. >> tell me how, sir, please.

>> this is not about fostering hate against muslims. >> i'm afraid i think it is. >> you're completely wrong about that. there are plenty of muslims who said they don't agree with this. >> were those at tea party rallies, david? >> larry: isn't there a danger in this that you're a muslim watching this, you live in des moin moines? wouldn't you be offended? >> i would hope that muslims throughout the country or throughout the world who are watching "larry king live" right now understand that if we're going to say america has been in wars, you know, help iing to protect and save and stabilize areas for muslims throughout the world. and so, clearly, i don't think that's an issue. i think, you know, mosques have been built throughout the united states and in new york. i don't think there's anybody who has said don't build 100 more in new york city. don't build ten more in lower manhattan. it is just this one area, this one place that is in the footprint that suffered damage

from the plane that is a little more sensitive than the rest of the buildings. why is that building taken on such an importance to the imam and the people who want to foster understanding in this world and in this community? >> larry: marc, surely you understand that, right? you understand the sensitivity? >> i understand the sensitivity. my heart goes out to everyone who lost someone on 9/11, christians and muslims. if islam were responsible for this, i totally would understand. this is about al qaeda. this is not about islam. islam did not cause this. why are we going to single them out and say you cannot have a mosque here? if a church was being built there, there would be no public conversation, if there were a synagogue, there would be no public conversation. since 9/11, we're going to prosecute a war on terror, that has become a proxy as a war on islam. there have been attempts to block the building of mosques all around the nation, not just in new york. >> larry: thank you all very .