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tv   John King USA  CNN  December 13, 2010 7:00pm-8:00pm EST

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>> a whole house. >> next, he's buying himself a mercedes. based on the top ten youtubes, you might think our culture is going down the tubes. jeanne moos. >> what does this mean? >> reporter: new york. >> remember, you can always follow what's going on here in the situation. you can get my tweets at twitter.com/wolfblitzer cnn. you can also follow us on facebook.com to become a fan. that's all the time. thanks very much for watching. i'm wolf blitzer in "the situation room." "john king usa" tarts right now. >> obama's tax cut deal clears a key hurdle in the senate and the white house is confident the package is gaining momentum, too. today with victory in sight,
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consider this conciliatory language in an effort to broker a democratic family detente. >> i recognize both sides are unhappy with certain parts of the package. and i understand those concerns. >> also, a group called itself no label make a mark when politics are dominated by left versus right sparring? we'll explore the mission of a new effort on the debate of taxes, school, spending and more. but we begin with the president's major policy initiative, health care reform. a federal district judge ruled the centerpiece of the new law a requirement that both americans get health insurance is unconstitutional. he wrote a congressional mandate is neither within the letter nor the spirit of the constitution. the case was brought by virginia's conservative general, a tea party favorite who cast a
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ruling as a strong message to the obama white house and all of washington. >> this case is not about health insurance, it is not about health care. it's about liberty. >> we'll explore the ruling in just a minute. but first, our white house correspondent has the administration's battle plan now. dan? >> as you pointed out, a lot of people believing this is a blow for the white house. the white house dun playing any major setbacks saying this is all part of the legal process and in the end, they believe that they will prevail because the merits to this case are strong. they point out there have been two other similar cases in federal courts. one in michigan, the other also in virginia where the courts ruled that the law is constitutional. the big question, though, being asked now is if this ruling will give any ammunition now whatsoever to critics out there who believe this law should be repealed white house spokesman
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robert gibbs says he doesn't believe it will have any impact whatsoever. but already incoming house speaker john boehner was reiterating that republicans had planned and pledged to repeal the health care law and he says that's exactly what he'll do. >> dan lothian at the white house. a ruling that reignites the political debate. now the perspective of a man who challenged the law and won. at least this first round. what do you think this makes this decision better than the other two decision? >> well, whenever you have a state in the part of the federal government, you're in a different category. the next will come up in florida. probably get a ruling in january or february time frame in that case. there are 25 total cases running across the country.
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certainly you're going to see a series in rulings, but even in the two we've seen so far that went the federal government's way on the individual mandate, the federal government was ruled against in both cases on their tax argument. and there are two arguments in this case. the individual mandate, whether or not it's constitutional, and whether or not the penalty, if you disobey the government instruction that you must buy their government-approved insurance is a tax. and the federal government lost again on the tax argument in addition to the individual mandate today. this is obviously a very important ruling. but as you've pointed out here on this show, this one is probably going to the supreme court. we hope it gets there soon because it certainly introduces an amazing amount of uncertainty for our whole economy. >> let's get to that point. your position is this law is unconstitutional. the admissied administration cl disagrees. you're in a bit of a limbo. you're thinking, should i change my conduct? should i affect my hiring?
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what should doi if i'm an individual and i don't buy insurance? do you believe there's the political will to at least ask the supreme court for an expedited review of this case? >> i actually think it's harder to not make the request than to make the request. that's so much uncertainly out there. there's a lot of business money parked on the sidelines, waiting to see what the rules of the road are going to be. all these things have an impact on whether or not businesses are willing to start investing that cash that they're holding, and to help start creating jobs. and i think that this administration could benefit by moving is this case faster and reducing the uncertainty in the economy. whatever the outcome, whether virginia wins or the federal government wins. knowing the outcome is a benefit to all americans.
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obviously i hope we protect the constitution and virginia prevail, but i don't get to decide that. the supreme court is ultimately going to have to do that. >> mr. attorney general, i know your position, the conservative, the federal government has no right to do this. that's your position. answer, though, if you go on twitter, on facebook, e-mails to us today, answer the critic of your position. well, what happens? if you don't have this mandate in play. what happens if some 30, 35 year year old person decides i'm fine, i'm safe. then they have a horrific accident, say a car accident. and they end up in the emergency room. who pays snen. >> that's a great question. my obligation first is to defend the constitution. but the reality is, as you said, there are plenty of people who see benefits in this bill. and in a 2,700 page bill, surely there's something in it for everybody. i hope, a that we win the case and b, the parties can get back to the table and start to work on things there was broad
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agreement. there were enough feet voets to get this through, but i wouldn't call it broad agreement here. we need to start getting consumers in charge of health care. more government hasn't worked for 45 years. we need to go in a different direction so we can offer people other alternatives. i did that as a state senator to increase the availability of health insurance, put in bills to help myself do that. there are ways we can do this to help take care of the folks who need greater access to health insurance, but violating the constitution and eliminating some people's freedom is not the way to do that. >> this is a legal fight, but it's also a high stakes political battle. within minutes, you could go on the internet and see an ad congratulating you, celebrating your victory in this case and saying donate money. don't ma-- donate to ken cuccinelli.
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>> there's no doubt that occurs not just in the media but in the political environment, and also in the political environment like campaigns. and the fact is i need to survive politically. i'm an elected official in virginia. the people, 58% of them voted fsh me in my last election. and an awful lot of very upset folks a lot of them very fouerful with plenty of money are going to come after me. they already said as much, in the next election. we have to prepare for that as well while we continue to defend the constitution. regardless of what the issues are. >> this much appears certain, sooner ore later, as we just discussed, the supreme court will get the final say. jeffrey toobin is with us. we have several decisions saying the law is constitutional, this one saying it's not. where are we going? >> we're going to the supreme court, and anyone who predicts
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with absolute confidence how the supreme court will address is this blowing smoke. this is a perfect illustration, this case, this issue, of how much more conservative the courts have gotten over the years. this argument would have been borderline frivolous 20 years ago. but the courts are now taking a much closer look at whether congress has the power top act, whether it's in the first amendment and the citizens united case about corporate tidsing or in a case like this about whether the government can require health insurance. >> he says congress went way dwrond its power in stretching the commerce clause. >> article one of the constitution says congress has the right to regulate commerce among the several states. it's through that brief passage in the constitution that most of
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the modern federal government was invented. the courts said look, even if individual decisions have nothing to do with interstate commerce, if you add up all those small transactions together, they do have an affect, and that's enough to let congress regulate. what this decision says is, it pulled back from that. it basically said no, is this goes beyond congress's power on interstate commerce. >> you attract the high court, as well as anyone, jeff. the lower court decision, judges by democrats have said this law is okay, judges appointed by republicans have said this law is not okay. is this a where does anltny kennedy go or is it more complicated than that? >> i don't think it's a bit more complicated than that. there are four democrats, there are four republican appointees, and justice kennedy, appointed
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by ronald reagan, right in the middle. that's where this case is going to be decided. it's after great time to be anthony kennedy right now. >> a stressful time perhaps. another huge political story today. the president's plan be struck with republicans. remember tough rhetoric from democrats last week? well, it cleared a key hurdle senate today by a lopsided vote. more on the other side.
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so far anyway, it's easy going for tax cut that president obama negotiated with senate republicans. the senate voted overwhelmingly to begin debate and we're hearing the white house is making progress with some of its liberal critics on the house side, too. uj a hunl vo-- a huge vote in t senate. momentum? >> i'm hearing that might be the case. we'll see if that's what happens and what the house decides. but 83 united states senators voted for a pretty big piece of tax legislation. republicans and democrats kind of evenly split. the president came out today making clear he wants the house to go forward. that's the open question, whether or not they're going to do that. >> and the open question is
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whether they're also secretly negotiating, the white house and the democrats in the house? or whether the house plans to change this bill. what is it? >> well, the white house, the president themself said he was making calls today to try to persuade house democrats. what's likely to happen is the house will take up what they're working towards happen, but an amendment on the estate tax provision. they believe it's just too generalous to wealthy americans. what they would do is try to put up a measure to make it less generous. the question is whether or not they could actually pass it. i'm told by house democrats, those who may oppose it, it would probably just quickly go to the senate, they would reject it and it would go back to the house. people on both sides of the capital, democrats seem a lot more resigned to the fact that
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this tax cut package is likely to go through before the end of the year, before everybody's taxes are slighted to go up. >> all right. let's move on. no bill clinton side kick, but the president came into the white house briefing room solo. the mount angered liberals last week by labelling their criticism sanctimonious. >> so you did compromise? >> all right, that was the wrong sound. we were supposed to have the if the saying he understands both sides of this debate. that's what he says. let's move on to the conversation. here's eric ericksson, and in washington, d.c., cornell belcher. sorry we couldn't get the sound right there, gentlemen. the president went out of his way today, oh, i understand
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people on both sides don't like this. i share some of your concerns. what happened to you sanctimonious people don't support me. >> politics. he's looking like the only adult in the room. you see democrats coming over. you're going to see for the first time a bill passed with truly bipart son support here. >> you're at the founding meeting of this group called no labels. you think the strength of american politics is in the middle. is this proof of the middle or finally let's just give up and vote for what the president wants. >> i don't. 83 votes in favor. when was the last time we saw an 83-vote margin on any piece of legislation in the senate? it's been a long time.
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i think it does reflect the fact that this bipartisan package has 66% approval rating across the nation, even though the far left opposes it and on the far right. trying to forge a compromise bill. it's not perfect, but perfect ain't on the menu, folks. >> that's a good bumper sticker, just like no label. >> you were hoping the right could stop this. >> this isn't a hill to die on for conservatives. there's been a growing sense since last thursday when house democrats kind of exploded on the issue that maybe we could kill it and get a better deal in january, but there are a lot of guys in the senate who don't like the deal saying we're pretty sure we can't get a better deal, particularly on eskate taxes so we're going to go for it. >> you were wondering why we were playing the leez le stahl sound with john boehner.
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the president of the united states called this a compromise. mitch mcconnell was on the floor of the house of representatives saying this is a compromise. but listen to this. >> so you did compromise? >> we found common ground. >> why won't you say -- you're afraid of the word. >> i reject the word. >> what's wrong with the word compromise? if people get together and make a deal, isn't that a compromise? >> there are compromises, but john boehner has tenuous ground to track with these tea party guys. for all the people in washington who like compromise, not all compromises are good and boehner knows that and wants to set the tone headed into january. he's not the spieaker yet. >> you've got pollsters involved here. i have a feeling somewhere focus groups -- i've stheen happen -- focus groups saying we don't like the word compromise. so you're trying to avoid the
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word compromise because it means weakness. >> i wasn't even going to throw cornell's profession under the bus with that criticism, but clearly, you know, john boehner feels that word connotes weakness. i really don't care what you call it, but it's interesting that he feels that is a sign of weakness and he wants to avoid the word. as long as we can find the common ground and build on it, that's a good day in washington. >> let's look at this one. since we have the pollsters front and center, this one to you first. a poll out tudjman, the president's approval rating is at 42% prk d, disapprove at 50%. let's look at his approval rating among democrats. 74% approve, 21% dis approappro. back just a few weeks, 83% of democrats approve, 11% dis
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appro approve. so a 10% jump in disapproval among democrats. is that this tax cut deal? >> didn't you ask me earlier why the president was coming out saying both sides have a point? well, part of it is, you know, you can't let your base get too far out there. and the president's job approval rating chooses from poll to poll, but truth of the matter is, going into an election year, you have to bring back your base. and clearly, there's a lot of people, voters on the left that are ticked off about this. i think the president is right going to the middle. he's going to bring home independents who say i want both sides to stop fighting and sit down in a bipartisan manner and move the country forward. but clearly, he can't move his base behind politically. and that's you've seen the action we saw today. >> evan bayh, maybe slightly conservative democrats, do they see the president making a clear post election pivot? >> i think there was some
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discussion and gratitude for the president for acknowledging the election and trying to reach out and forge a compromise that moved the ball forward. that wasn't the topic of the meeting today, but i think you do see, look at the polls. 71% support this will compromise. both keeping the tacks low and extending the unemployment benefits. so that's the kind of balanced approach that does seem to resonate, that does resonate with the electorate. so i think, you know, in some ways this has been a good week or ten days for the president, even though it's been a rough week for liberal democrats. >> also it's a new triangulation. some would argue it's helpful for the president 20 distance himself from house democrats. >> how would you define new triangulation. >> same old-same old by the time
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we get to 2012. you're not going to see democrats bolt from the president. although it may be like george h.w. bush in 1992 where a lot of them sit out. >> thanks. i'm going to walk over here. we'll show you some of the president in the briefing room earlier today. you heard dana bash say one thing that democrats liked the least about this tax cut deal is the estate tax provision. every night this week we're going to break down a provision of the deal so you can see what it costs and how it fkt as you. so let's come over to the wall and take a peek. this is the entire deal. this is all $900 billion. if it's yellow it has bipartisan support. blue is the parts democrats like and red is the republicans. the president wanted to set the level at $3.5 million and a 45% max yum rate above that.
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under the current law the exemption is $1 million with a 55% max rate. this is the much more favorable deal. the president agreed to $5 million is where the line is and only a 35% max rate. that's why it adds up to $68 billion. let's take one more quick here. see the line come down? that's the two years of this deal. this is a two-year deal. $68 billion added to the deficit. then the government assumes the rate will go back up. they will have to fight that one out in congress. but that's the price tax democrats don't like. they think that's a big giveaway to wealthy estate holders. a quick break for us. when we come back, sarah palin makes a weekend trip to haiti. why was she there? what did she say? gary tuckman joins us in a moment. [ male announcer ] this is james.
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former alaska governor sarah palin is back from a weekend in haiti, a country first ravaged by an earthquake then a khchole epidemic. gary tuchman is there.
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gary? >> it was a most unyankee visit, mainly because this woman who might run for be the. she's a well known american, a vip, a very important person, did not have most of her visit covered. she didn't allow reporters to attend any of her meetings. it was made for fox news. you might say hey, she has her choice, and she definitely has a choice whether to invite reporters or not, but usually in these situations where it's life or death situation, we kind of work together, the journalist, the vips, fox news helps us, abc helps the bbc, we all help to cover their visits to give attention to give attention to the problems to as many people around the world. why didn't she want us to cover it? we found out the answer at something that was called a news conference.
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sarah palin said she would not get into any questions. we weren't able to ask why she didn't let reporters come wither hp. it was a unique visit because we didn't really learn much from sarah palin being here for two days with her husband and daughter here in haiti. >> gary, i love the very diplomatic you put the fox news gets access that the rest of us can't, we're going to have to deal with that with sarah palin and others. you're there on the ground with a difficult weather environment. you were there at the heart ache just after the heart quake. they're dealing with the cholera epidemic. how are things on the ground? >> it's just miserable, john. there are still hundreds of thousands of homeless people in the country. many of them are just so used to being in monsoon-like rains they
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don't have umbrellas or anything. you have violence in the streets continuing after a contested presidential election two weeks ago. the runoff is january 16. there are many angry people here. it's subsided a little bit over the weekend, but there are lots of rumors and that's how things start here. lots of rumors it's going to pick up this week. government said there will be a recount, but many of the candidates -- there were 18 candidates who ran. the third place finisher and even the person who came in first said they won't participate in monitoring the recount. >> and your sense, you've only been back a few days, but after a disaster, there's an outpouring of aid. she was there with franklin graham, samaritan purse. is the help, the food, the medical supplies still coming in? or is that a problem on the ground, too? >> well, you bring up franklin graham and his group. he invited sarah palin to come.
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they built, for example, more than 10,000 shelters for the homeless people here. a lot of work has been done for these people. but the problem is there's so much to do. there's more than 1 million homeless people. only 10 million people in the entire country. 1 out of every ten people are homeless. and this is the saddest thing. this park across the street has been totally full each time. it was a little less full. i thought maybe people found shelter, better places to be. as it turned out, we found out from the people who operate the hotel, two people were killed in violence the other day. everyone was so scared there would be more violence, they got out of here. they're homeless somewhere else. so that's the only reason this park emptied out a little bit. >> gary, thanks for the update. stay safe. your crew as well. when we come back, since the midterm election whence we all know republicans made big gains there's been a big domino effect. party switching including two
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. let's continue our conversation about a big day in washington. a federal judge in virginia saying the obama health care plan is unconstitutional and then a victory for the white house. a lopsided senate vote to move forward with the tax cut deal the president brokered with the republican leadership. gloria, in terms of the health care fight, the legal battle will continue, but politically, you get the sense that the advocates of repeal kbetget a le re-energized. >> they get oxygen out of this. they came to washington to repeal what they call obama care. and now they've got a constitutional issue that they can really bring into the political debate. the white house will tell you that there are two judges who ruled for them so far. one who ruled against them. and they believe the motivation is much more political than
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constitutional. but as jeff tubin was saying earlier, this is a different world in which we live and one feeds the other. this is going to really, really give them a lot of steam to go talk about repealing health care reform. >> and in the tax cut debate, when you get more than 80 votes in the united states senate, i can't remember the last time a big policy fight that has happened. i assume the message to the house liberals is you know what, this train is leaving the situation. >> right, the train is leighing the sfiegs station. the liberals clearly want to do something on the estate tax, but i don't recall in the last couple of years when we've had 80 votes for anything. we couldn't get 80 senators to vote on what day of the week it is. now they've passed this. i spoke to a senior white house adviser today who said, you know, this really, really is looking good for us, and i think
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that in the end, the president is going to get what he wants. now, of course, john, ehe's got to think about phase two. he's just spending almost $900 billion on a stimulus package, and he's got to start talking about the deficit and deficit reduction. >> gloria is going to stay with us. we're going to work on a quick break. when we come back, more political news and the night's other big headlines. oh, my gosh. ♪ [ male announcer ] you know her. we know diamonds. together we'll make her holiday. that's why only zales is the diamond store. where you can get up to $1,000 off now through sunday.
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sad breaking news to report tonight. a senior administration official tells cnn that ambassador richard holbrooke has died just days after suffering pain while at the state department for a meeting. mr. holbrooke, you see the pictures of him there, was rushed to a hospital in washington for a puncture in his aorta. he had been hospitalized, but a senior administration telling cnn tonight veteran diplomat richard holbrooke has died. i want to get to jill dougherty for more on this tragic news. i'm sorry, jill is not technically ready for us. a man who knows richard
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holbrooke very well is david gergen. this is a sad day for the diplomatic community. >> it is sad. we were going to walk in and talk about something else. i'm dispressed. dick holbrooke was -- he was one of the best of his generation. there were just two or three people in his generation that were anywhere near as good. i was there in the clinton administration when he came in, and he literally just sort of picked up aspects of foreign policy. just huge blocks of foreign policy and moved them. he was a force of nature. and had hillary clinton been president, dick holbrooke would have been her secretary of state. she had enormous faith in him as does her husband. i think president obama called him a towering figure. that's exactly what he was. he started in foreign service way back in the vietnam war. he's been in and out of government ever since. he's been a major, major figure in foreign policy. and of course, right in the
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cockpit for afghanistan and afpac as he called it. these were very hard years for him these last couple of years. >> david please stay with us. veteran diplomat richard holbrooke, the president's point person on afghanistan and pakistan, david noted going back to the vietnam war. in the clinton days he was a key architect of the president's bosnia policy. jill dougherty is joining us now. this is a loss in the department of a man who was a giant in the busine business. >> it was. certainly there's a very heavy heart. the family was here, they had a christmas celebration, and the president making some very strong and warm comments about this man because certainly, he was one of the key architects of that policy, the afpak policy.
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and a person who made his mark, a very, very tough negotiator. everyone who knew him said they wouldn't want to be across the table with him if they were going through some negotiation. and that was his reputation. he was actually very polite in a sense but when you got into negotiations, he was one of the best. and that's really what these diplomats here in this building do. not just the pinstripe diplomacy. and the senior administration official confirming to cnn now that he has, ambassador holbrooke has died. remember, again, that he became very ill at the state department on friday, just friday of last week. it was a very serious thing. a problem with his aorta. the main artery in the body. he had undergone several hours. in fact, about 20 hours of operations at gw, george washington university hospital, not far from here. he put up a very hard fight we
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are told, but unfortunately, it ended with his death today. >> and jill, i want to ask you to stand by. david gergen is here with us. but first, the long career of richard holbrooke, probably better known throughout the world than he is here in the united states. a look back at the life and career of richard holbrooke. >> reporter: in the button-down world of international diplomacy, richard holbrooke was the muscle behind the pinstripes. he sometimes spoke in a quiet tone, but there was nothing soft about his approach. once described as the hydrogen bomb of diplomacy. he served administrations from linden johnson to barack obama. brought back from private life to the world of washington to tackle one of president obama's thorniest problems, afghanistan. >> we must recognize the fundamental connection between the future of afghanistan and pakistan. which is why i've appointed
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ambassador richard holbrooke -- >> holbrooke went to vietnam shortly after joining the foreign service in 1962. he worked on vietnam issues for president johnson, east asia for president carter, including china when relations with the u.s. were normalized. and for president clinton, he took on the bosnian war. his biggest diplomatic achievement may have been his most personal. >> i don't think there's ever been a negotiation any more difficult than this one. 48 hours with almost no sleep, people dying, incredible pressure. >> holbrooke, whose grandfather escaped hitler in nazi germany said the conflict brought the world modern day scenes of ethnic cleansing. he reflected on that in a 2008 advise to bosnia. >> i thought, i'm seeing a color remake of the black and white scenes we've seen in world war ii. >> he also served as u.s. ambassador to germany and later the united nations. leaving the spotlight after the
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clinton administration for a second krooer on wall street. but he returned to washington in 2009 in perhaps his toughest role. president obama's special enjoy for afghanistan and pakistan. >> we concluded quite simply that america's basic national security interests were at stake in these two countries. >> he was a regular voice in president obama's situation room meetings on the new afghanistan strategy. but bob woodward's book "obama's wars" said holbrooke harbored doubts about the plans, saying it can't work. he described the unique diplomatic challenges. there there's no ho chi minh, no slobodan milosevic, no palestinian authority. there's a glup of people we roughly call the enemy. >> reporter: biden called
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holbrooke, the most egotistical bastard i ever met, but the right guy for the job. for holbrooke who knew diplomacy wasn't always being diplomatic, the end result is what mattered a peace deal requires agreements and you don't make agreements with your friends. you make agreements with your enemies. richard holbrooke was 69. jill dougherty, cnn washington. >> just a bit earlier today, as richard holbrooke was still fighting for his life, the president of the united states attended a holiday reception for the diplomatic corps and paid tribute to the man this evening america has lost. with. >> i know everyone here joins me when i say america is more secure and the world is a safer place because of the work of ambassador richard holbrooke. michelle and i, to the entire family, just know we are thinking and praying for you and for richard every single day.
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and she a tough son of a gun, so we are confident, as hard as this is, that he is going to be putting up a tremendous fight. >> he was confident, many would say sometimes cocky, self-assured, never afraid of making his opinion known in a meeting. we're going to take a quick break. when we come back, we'll reflect on his life and career. [ s. greenlee ] i would love to have been a musician but i knew that i was going to need a day job. we actually have a lot of scientists that play music. the creativity, the innovation, there's definitely a tie there. one thing our scientists are working on is carbon capture and storage, which could prevent co2 from entering the atmosphere. we've just built a new plant to demonstrate how we can safely freeze out the co2 from natural gas. it looks like snow. it's one way that we're helping provide energy with fewer emissions. ♪
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if you're just joining us, sad breaking news tonight. the man you see on the left of your screen ambassador richard holbrooke 69 years old a veteran u.s. diplomat, the architect of the deal that ended the war in bosnia during the clinton administration most recently president obama's top representative for afghanistan and pakistan, ambassador richard holbrooke, dying earlier this evening at the age of 69. had a tear in his aorta. he was rushed from meetings to a hospital in washington. many hours in surgery. passing a bit earlier tonight at the age of 69. many of our correspondents and analysts knew richard holbrooke
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well. i want to start by going back to jill doherty at the state department. you mentioned in your piece how he was sure of himself. some thought him cocky, some thought him arrogant. but he was never shy which is a gift any good diplomat needs. >> it's true. we always had this impression of diplomats as people who go to receptions and things like that but actually the past two years richard holbrooke put on his hiking boots and went off to afghanistan and pakistan and went into some of the most remote areas assessing how the surge and how the u.s. policy was working. in fact, he really was considered the architect of that strategy combining those two countries in kind of one unit in the sense that it was very important he felt to attack both issues at the same time. that it was a regional approach that was necessary. and the timing of this, john, is
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significant. because after all this week on thursday we're going to get the roll out, the report on afghanistan policy that's being headed by the nsc, the white house, and certainly mr. holbrook we was very much a par of that. at the briefing today i asked about that specifically and they said that people would very much miss his input. obviously a lot of that has already gone into the report. but just his presence and the ability for him to sput togethe ideas and go to the region and talk to all of the people involved was very, very important. he knew people all over the world. as secretary clinton mentioned today, nearly 50 years in diplomacy, going back to vietnam. and he used vietnam in a sense as a template. so he had enormous experience, enormous self-belief in his
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ability to put these things through. but you'd have to say, john, two years of very, very intense work probably did take its toll. >> and david gergen, you knew richard holbrooke well. i remember my days covering the clinton white house how controversial the bosnia war was. and you had not only for the president to make the case but for his diplomatic team to make the case, to politicians in the united states, to congress, but also around the world to key allies we needed there and more recently afpac as he called it very controversial not only here in the united states and congress and the democratic party but to many around the world who weren't sure the mission was worth it. describe the sharp elbows if you will of richard holbrooke. >> well, i don't think i've ever met anybody on foreign policy who was quite as forceful and could be extremely aggressive. very, very smart. but he just was -- he could not abide procrastination and just talk, talk, talk that sometimes goes on in diplomacy.
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he wanted action. he was a strong patriot. he really believed in america. it's unimaginable to think about american foreign policy without dick holbrooke being part of it. my whole life he has been part of it. i just want to say one other personal thing. one thing i was really pleased about in his life. he found enormous happiness in the last years in his marriage to connie martin. she was -- it was a second marriage for both. she had at one time been married to peter jennings. that marriage was just a blessing for him. he told me on many occasions just how it really changed his life so there was a soft side to dick holbrooke, too. >> david gergen, thanks for those reflections. barbara starr, join the conversation. as you listen, you have covered as well as anyone the disputes, disagreements, the tug of war between the competing voices within the administration over the strategy in afghanistan. should we surge with the troops over whether the administration was doing enough on the other side of the border in pakistan? help us put richard holbrooke in context. >> reporter: what comes to mind, john, is i recently saw him in
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kabul at a press conference and he spoke about iran. i saw him at the pentagon give a briefing and he would talk about pakistan, the arab countries. this man had an enormous global vision. this was much more than just afghanistan to him. people say afghanistan, pakistan. richard holbrooke was focusing on regional stability. i believe he really genuinely thought, and i say quite accurate accurately, that one had to have a regional outlook in that very troubled part of the world. you couldn't just think about afghanistan. you couldn't think about pakistan. you had to think about all of the countries and how they interplayed. and when ambassador holbrooke walked into a room in the pentagon full of generals and admirals and lots of guys with that fruit cocktail of medals on their chest, let me tell you, he sucked the energy out of the room. he was an enormous presence
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because he was very well respected and because of this energy he had to communicate ideas, this briefing that comes to mind that he gave, there were a number of reporters sitting in the back. he made sure he said hello to every reporter. he knew everyone's name, even those of us who covered the pentagon more than the state department, and as he would brief the room, he would turn around and look at reporters in the back. he knew how to communicate. he knew -- he knew his audience. so many americans, i think, probably don't know richard holbrooke, don't know what he accomplished. why we're talking about him tonight, because this is a man that high school students, college students, people will study decades from now the range of his diplomacy, which as jill and others have pointed out spanned vietnam, bosnia, and the war on terror. this was a towering figure in american diplomacy and his work will be studied for decades to
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come. >> barbara, thank you. gloria borger, one of the ways you become a towering figure these days in american diplomacy is by having good political instincts as well. i remember at the sunday show "state of the state the union" richard holbrooke sometimes we would seek him out but every now and then he would seek us out when he had something he wanted to say. describe richard holbrooke the politician. >> there is really nobody else like him. i mean, the blunt diplomat, the towering figure as barbara just spoke about, who else could brow beat slobodan milosovich other than dick holbrooke. somebody who always had a point of view and shared it with you so i or other journalists would speak with him he always had a well formulated reason for believing sloeb -- believing what he believed. he was also an accomplished author who wrote a book about the dayton peace accords and i
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believe a true intellectual. i also think as david gergen was speaking about, this will be a loss not only for american diplomacy but on a much more personal level a loss for bill and hillary clinton. i think they were both so close to him over so many years and she has depended on him in so many ways at the state department on the afghanistan/pakistan policy and i think this is going to be a very, very big loss for the clinton family personally. >> and let's go to the white house finally to dan lothian on that point. dan, he was a clinton guy if you will and yet he was a key player in the obama administration strategy. what was his relationship like with the president of the united states? >> very close with the president, guiding him through the strategy as you pointed out. this comes on the very week later this week, thursday, when that review will come out and then of course tomorrow also that routine meeting, the afpac meeting the president holds with his national security team here at the

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