all told, 25 different product lines with the bricks. lego is world's third largest manufacturer of play materials. well, i'm deborah feyerick. thank you for joining us today. cnn "newsroom" continues right now. ashley bamfield. go ahead. >> hey, deb. thank you so much. good to see you. thank you, everyone for being with us. i'm ashleigh banfield. here we go. a massive wild fire in washington state right now and if you thought you heard there was a fire out there, things have changed. dramatically. in fact, this thing has grown from 2,800 acres to 26,000. all of this just over the last few hours 678 we have been watching this in the newsroom and we have new video in the newsroom from washington. take a look. just phenomenal flames, imploding trees. the firefighters there are battling these things. it's near cle elum southeast of

seattle. but the plumes of smoke can be seen for miles. firefighters are now calling for backup all over the state and out of state, too. forcing people to evacuate their homes and quick. meaning, you don't get to grab a lot as you get out. we want to go to affiliate reporter of kiro joining me now on the telephone. rick price, this is just remarkable. when we were putting this story together for the newsroom, we weren't sure where in the newsroom it would go and then all of a sudden it was going to the top of the news. give me a bit of feel for how things are going. >> well, it got very, very big as you noted very, very fast. it's windy all day and very often the fires lay down overnight. the winds calm down a little bit. that was not the case. i noticed one point on the internet and nearby wind reading bigger than cle elum about 20 miles per hour and driving the

fire to the south and east a little bit and really, really moved from where you noted about a few thousand acres now to 26,500. equivalent is about 41 square miles and they don't have any containment lines around this yet. they have really only been able to try to defend some structures and even at that they lost about 60 homes. there are hundreds of people that have been evacuated and this thing is sll going on. really not clear how it's going to develop because the wind is supposed to pick up and the temperatures supposed to reach upwards. >> is it too early for the forensics the find out where it started and how? >> that is what we were told by the undersheriff last night. these things, the point of origin is fairly easy to spot. at least in general. because you know where the fire started, you know where it's going. but really, they've got their

hands full fighting this thing right now to keep it away from the houses and the ranches and the outbuildings and so forth. and it will probably be a little while before the investigators can get in and take a look at that for sure. causes of wild land fires in the last ranged from -- caused by accident to human caused by arson to something as simple as a lightning strike which could sit there and smolder for days or weeks before it really catches. >> it is frightening to see those statistics jump in the last couple of hours. 2,800 acres to 26,000 acres burning in your state. all right. be well. be safe. rick, update us if things continue to change through the hour if you would, please, sir. rick price joining us of kiro-tv in seattle. the president and his gop challenger, they're heading through the swing states, folks. not to mention heading all over the air waves, too.

president obama and mitt romney with events this hour. obviously with events for the next three months, too. and the former is in iowa. day two of the hawkeye bus tour and the latter is in ohio. you will see them live right here on cnn as we keep our campaign cams hot and ready to go at any moment. and by now what all of the political professionals think of paul ryan as mitt romney's running mate, that's pretty clear. but in 84 days you and me and everybody else in your living room and everybody else out on the street we get to have our say in this. meantime, we do have the polls to let us know what our neighbors and we seem to be thinking at this point and also the pundits, too. you know what? like the pundits, a bit of a mixed verdict. paul steinhauser joins me with more. there's a bump and exciting and then all of a sudden everybody gets to know this person pretty

quickly and in the case of paul ryan my thought is that he started off with some numbers and they went much, much higher right away. >> exactly. paul ryan was not very well-known to most americans before this weekend and the battle is to define him and it's been under way and heavy and hot on both sides but, yeah, what about the first impressions? it is a mixed picture of abc news and "the washington post." well, you can see right here, they polled wednesday, thursday, friday. that's before the naming of ryan and they also named after. here's the favorable rating of registered voters. 26% last week. 40% over the weekend. that's a pretty good bump up there for paul ryan with the favorable rating and among independents a similar jump there, as well. go to a gallup poll. this thing conducted on sunday, the day after the naming of ryan. they asked, well, was the naming of ryan a good, fair, bad choice for mitt romney? you can see right here, 39%, about 4 in 10 said a cent or

pretty good choice for mitt romney to name ryan as his running mate. 16% still no opinion. mixed, right? compare it to past choices. you can see right here that that ryan choice was not as good as sarah palin four years ago. 45% saying that ryan was a fair or poor choice. that's higher than palin was in 2008. also higher than dick cheney was. dan quayle back in 1988 to find somebody. >> holy cow. >> yeah. >> look at that number, 52. whoosh. >> you have a mixed message here. good and bad news. i say it with polls. a snapshot. we have still 80-something days to go until the election. people change their minds. >> i want to button that up, as well. 1988, no big internet and may have had an easier ride without the scrutiny or the extraordinary microscope that everybody else has to endure. thank you. i know the polls change and you will come back with new ones soon. talk to you soon.

thank you, my friend. all right. chris christy. didn't make the cut for vp but that outspoken new jersey governor is not going to be sidelined. no way. no how. it's going to happen, folks. he'll give the keynote and the gop convention two weeks from now and wolf blitzer will join me a little bit later, bottom of the hour to talk more about that and marco rubio's involvement in the campaign, that's significant, as well. we'll let you know how the details shook out and how they will shake out. by the way, she snagged one of d.c.'s most eligible bachelors in the '90s and now front and center as the wife of the republican vice presidential candidate. janna ryan, not just a doting spouse. she has a degree of george washington university. she went on to be a corporate lawyer and a lobbyist in washington, d.c. she also happens to come from a family with strong ties. are you ready? are you sitting down?

to the democratic party. i did not miss speak. janna ryan, strong family ties to the democrats. joining me now is margaret hoover. without ties to the democrats. it's nice to see you, miss hoover. so this was a surprise when i started looking in to janna ryan and background and then you tell me that you know her. >> no, no. i actually haven't met janna. i have met paul and lucky enough to meet paul a couple of times and knows the folks he's worked with and the thing about janna is you're right. she has a law degree of george washington university. she went to wellsly. >> smart cookies. >> her cousin serves alongside with her husband, her uncle was the governor of oklahoma. democratic govern nor of oklahoma. one of the things you see about the ryans is that unlike many of the congressmen in washington who do not reach across the

aisle and don't have friends and colleagues on the other side of the aisle, they actually are related to democrats on the other side of the aisle so this is what -- i mean, we regret that our politics is so personalized, so vitriolic. >> they reach across the bed, no matter what, right? we have examples of bedfellows that seem unlikely partners and how did these two get connected? >> i don't know that janna is a registered democrat and seems to me she is a proponent of her husband's policies. they met when she was a tax attorney in washington. she was also a lobbyist and met in the first term of congress when he was first serving as a freshman on the hill. they're both catholic and a mutual friend introduced them and the reports and stories say they were married only a year later. >> very young. married very young. they have the -- >> they're in their 30s.

>> i think that's really young. >> 28, 29, 30 years old, yeah. >> there's something that a lot of people have been tweeting about and blogging about seeing her. and she showed up for the sort of inaugural -- what do you call it? the introduction to america, sort to speak and wearing a dress of kohl's and retails $70 and on sale it's $35. people were thrilled about this. >> look. they're normal people. right? janna even though she has a george washington university law degree she lives in janesville, wisconsin. raises their three children and a stay at home mom and a part of this power couple. >> power couple. when you say that, i want to wrap this up this way. how important is that woman behind that man when it comes to politics? >> that -- they clearly have a political partnership and a -- their marriage is a partnership. you can't be a congressman and chair of the budget committee in washington, gone all week and come home on the weekends unless you have a strong partner raising your family and family

is really, really important to them. you hear that from everybody that knows them well. they're family people and paul ryan sleeps on a cot in the office and comes home on the weekends to make sure he's there with the kids. >> many of us at cnn, we sleep on couches in our office, too. pulling doubles and triples. >> not that much separate. >> i know, i know. except for those eyes, holy cow. margaret mentioned the law degree of george washington university. a stay at home mom now by choice but you should remember she followed in her mother's footsteps by attending law school and then moved to oklahoma and stay at home with her family. ntgomery and abigail higgins had...

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i tell mike what i can spend. i do my best to make that work. we're driving safely. and sue saved money on brakes. now that's personal pricing. a quick note for you heading out the door. no problem. you can continue to watch cnn from the mobile phone or ipod or anything. if you're heading to work, also watch cnn live from the desktop computer. so easy. just go to cnn.com/tv. i watch cnn on my way to work this mitt romneying on my ipod and flawless. believe it or not. i want to turn overseas. remarkable stuff is happening. syrian president bashar al assad controls less than a third of

his country and his power is disintegrating. that's the blunt assessment of his former prime minister, a man that left him, walked away, speaking publicly for the first time since the detection to jordan last week. listen to what he said. >> translator: i can confirm to you given my experience and the position i had the military and economy has completely collapsed and only in control of no more than 30% of syrian lands. >> in other developments, syria's also expected to be booted from the organization of islamic cooperation and that's a group meeting in saudi arabia right now as we speak. it's also where nic robertson is live covering the summit and joins us live. so nic, when i ahead some of the things that the syrian former prime minister had to say, it sounded pretty clear to me that's just about calling bashar al assad a filthy liar for the things he said about the

conflict saying it's just a bunch of terrorists out there. this man said, not true. i was there. i saw what's going on and it's horrifying. >> reporter: and i think we'd expect him to say that. look. this former prime minister according to reports that we hear was forced in to taking over the job as prime minister and pretty much since he got the job trying to get out of the country. that's the scenario we're told and we would expect him to sort of convince people standing in the middle to join the opposition, but the reality is there are assessments that said assad still controls the security forces. we haven't seen any major, major large-scale cracks in that. he hasn't used by barely a fraction of the stockpile of weapons. so while the prime minister is perhaps the more authoritative person to hear from and sounds

convin convincing, we need to view it with a little bit of skepticism. it sounds too good to be true that assad could be on the last legs. >> you think they're covering their backs, as well, for any kind of international prosecution, too. let me ask you about the organization of islamic cooperation right now. how much of a toothy move, how much teeth does this organization have in kicking out syria? because it seems like everybody else who has, you know, cut ties with bashar al assad hasn't seemed to have a big impact on that dictator. >> reporter: yeah. that's really i think the question a lot of people asking here right now. the heads of state will vote on that tonight. well, this is a massive organization. it's a largest international organization outside of the u.n. represents about 1.5 million muslims around the world from 57 different states so we can't underestimate the sort of weightiness of the organization but, you know, what about those teeth?

okay. kick s out syria and means nothing unless these states arm themselves and go in to syria and remove assad himself which is not on the agenda but the reality is that assad is really given up listening to about anybody other than those that support him, iran, china, russia. ashleigh? >> thank you, nic. further east to thailand. this is a story of a politician, but before you say what do i need to say about a thai politician? a former wife and a uzi, a sub machine gun and took it to a restaurant and did not come out well. zain virgie joining us from london. this caught our attention today. the ex-wife who is not estranged from this man is dead. the restaurant erupted in to chaos. this politician is in trouble but not arrested. what on earth happened?

>> who goes in to a restaurant a uzi for dinner? what was the point of that? but he did and apparently accidentally fired and killed his ex-wife and also severely injured the personal secretary. the thing is that he's been charged with negligence here, death by negligence, but he can't be arrested and the reason is because he sits in parliament and you can't arrest anyone in a sitting parliament so they can't do anything until parliament ends. so it's a really weird story and no one really knows how this even happened. >> all right. let's head to another international story, not far from you, actually. just across the pond in germany. some flash mobs and not the kind you like to cheer to and enjoy and pass on to your friends. these are like the former 1930s, you know, nazi torch marches. these are people who have come out in white masks with torches, basically, spreading a message of hate through germany. how did these people come in to

being and what is their story? >> well, basically, these guys call themselves the immortals. you can see them in the videos wearing the white masks. they're trying to represent the 1930s nazi marches. n eo-nazis that organize through the internet and text messaging and upload video to places like youtube and main message is multi-culturalism kills germany and they've been raiding homes to try to get them but this kind of video really horrible is still coming out. >> it's awfully creepy. not sure how flightening it is. i'm not among them and sure does look creepy on video. i would be remiss, my friend, you and i have both been in the media for a while and remiss if i didn't ask you about the passing of the former cosmopolitan editor helen girl brown and i feel like i might not be where i am today were it

not for this woman. i don't know if you feel the same way. >> i do. millions of women around the world do. sex, sex, sex. that's what she was about. got your attention now, right? she gave women a space to talk freely about it and to be okay with having sex being single and enjoying it, as well. you know, the magazine, she took it over in 1965 an she pretty much transformed it, provocative andraunchy and promoted women's sexual and financial independence. i picked up the usual copy every morning here. you know? how 50 shades is your sex life. you know? >> oh boy. >> a few good tips out of this. >> she you know what? she picked -- her magazine pi picked me as one of the fun, fearless and they do heady stuff, too. >> they do. >> besides your boyfriend.

>> they do. they have great articles. you know? one of the great things that she said, she said, good girls go to heaven. bad girls go everywhere. my own philosophy is if you're not having sex, you're finished. >> that's funny. we all sort of made light of it and the truth is it gave women a freedom that if you extrapolate used elsewhere in businesses and workplaces and made women feel equal to men in other areas of life. >> exactly. exactly. one of the things that she was really targeted for during her life is the feminist movement. this is against feminism. promoting beauty. looking like women to be in the servitude of men and destroying feminism. i think she promoted it, this sort of do me feminism and a space and a voice and taking control of sexuality and independence. >> zain virgie, it is always a pleasure, my friend. i adore you and look forward to talking to you again tomorrow. >> all right. thanks so much, ashleigh.

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i got this great e-mail yesterday. it was company wide here at cnn and announced that our candy

crowley the first in two decades to moderate a presidential debate. apart from her awesome back story, there's three teenage girls in new jersey starting a petition. they wanted a female moderator and thought it's time. been too long. that petition got 120,000 signatures online. and shazam. pretty good stuff. remember carol simpson. she was the first black woman to anchor an evening newscast, the first african-american woman to moderate a presidential debate back in 1992 and this morning carol simpson and candy crowley spoke with cnn's soledad o'brien about the enormous significance of this moment. >> it took these three teenagers to make the world cognizant of the fact that it had been 20 years since a woman had done a presidential debate. and but i had no doubt once the publicity got out there and i

started trumpeting it too that they were going to name a woman and i can't -- i'm hard pressed to think of a better woman to fulfill that role than candy. >> first thing on my mind is i'm a journalist and so great. this is just such an opportunity and so few people get it and i didn't -- honestly, didn't click in until people said what does it feel to be like the first woman since carole simpson, a dear friend, i've known carole forever, so that's very fun and i didn't think of the female part until later. >> well, we sure did and we're very proud of candy at this network. every day, in fact. the town hall debate will take place on tuesday, october 16th, at hofstra university. one fabulous woman to another fabulous woman who had a very lofty goal for her 104th birthday. that's the goal. holy moley. that's alice aho.

she joked to her daughter she wanted to climb a mountain for her birthday and her family took her seriously. and they set up a trek up oregon's mt. hood. this was her first time up the mountain in decades but she had done it three times before with her husband in the years before he died. this time, alice could not physically climb on her own and took the ski lift and took her family along for the ride, as well. >> so far, the mountain's just the same as it ever was. and now it's very nice. i enjoy being up here. >> one of her great grandchildren was the person if you could squint and see was actually holding her walker during the chair lift ride and took it on the chair lift. great grandchild carrying it. it took the family as far as 7,000 feet and cnn wishes you a very happy birthday.

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all right. quick look at the markets right now. the dow is up almost 37 points. we're keeping an eye on things today but not a bad way to start the first couple of hours of trading. let's talk about the next big event on the political horizon. republican national convention, two weeks from now in tampa. until today, one of the few remaining unanswered questions had been who besides the nominees take the primo speaking slots. may have been a badly kept secret but new jersey governor chris christy delivering the keynote address and florida senator marco rubio is going to introduce romney's acceptance speech. they're two good spots to be as

a politician. wolf blitzer joins me with his thoughts on that and other fun little nuggets to get to. wolf, this wasn't a huge secret, but that's a great spot for chris christy given the fact he was, you know, people wanted him to run for president. >> people wanted him to run for president. people thought marco rubio would be a great vice presidential running mate selection. they weren't going to get the number two slot on the ticket. marco rubio maybe just being not as experienced nationally as he probably should have been in order to be heart beat away from the presidency. still a young guy and opportunities in 2016, 2020 down the road. same was chris christie. i don't think he was ever seriously considered for the running mate slot because he's -- you know, he just has been a little bit too controversial, a little bit too outspoken and would have gone against totally what mitt romney was looking for. although he does have a huge

future ahead of him. he's an impressive politician. we'll be there covering every step of the convention. >> you are not all work all the time. you take in a sports game now and again and i understand you were fpresent for the infamous kiss cam moment and michele obama address third degree controversy of why they didn't kiss when the kiss cam hit them up. she told jay leno what the story was all about. let's listen. >> i had just walked in and sat down and i just saw my face on the jumbotron. i'm still a little embarrassed. i didn't see the kiss cam part. i didn't know we were supposed to kiss and then malia came over after we got boo'd for not kissing and she was just disgusted with us. she said, why didn't you kiss? i was like, kiss what? what are you talking about? she said, you were on the kiss cam. you were supposed to kiss.

>> let's show what happened. here's your daughter. there you go. thank you. >> she orchestrated that second try because after the second half we came back. she said, i've arranged for you to get another chance on the kiss cam. and then she came and sat with us to make sure we didn't mess it up. so, she was like, get ready. it's coming. and that's when she was like okay, go, now, kiss, do it. >> man, how adorable. she got a twofer kiss, too. one on the mouth and one on the forehead. you tweeted about it, didn't you, wolf? >> i was at the game with my pals ernie gren feld, the president of the wizards. we were sitting there and all of a sudden, you know, they start singing that song "so kiss me" and they came up there and i saw the original moment and no kiss and that's when i tweeted that barack obama and michele obama

on big screen and kiss cam and no kiss. there was boo'g. everybody wanted to see them kiss and took well in to the second half when all of a sudden malia got them back on the kiss cam and i took that picture. that was the first picture when there was no kiss. the second picture that i took did show the kiss. i don't know if you have it there. >> adorable. >> this is what i tweeted, finally! at barack obama, at michele obama. there's the kiss right there. do i have a future as a photographer or what? >> tmz without question. you can be here and working tmz. all facets of politics. thank you, sir. >> i tweeted it out right away and probably got more replies, more tweets in response to that one little -- those two little tweets on the kiss cam than all of the serious politics i tweet about all the time. >> change your hair, see what happens. thank you. we'll catch you again 4:00 p.m. eastern. right?

>> 4:00 p.m. eastern. we got a lot of news coming up today. >> look forward to it. thank you, wolf blitzer.

well, as we mentioned earlier in the program, th president obama and mitt romney are on the stump today. not surprisingly. mr. obama's in ohio and republican rival is in ohio and of course hecklers and protesters are part of every race for the white house. but our dan lothian who's covering the president caught a very unusual protest of sorts. have a look. >> reporter: president obama says he feels right at home in iowa. >> we spend a lot of time in iowa. and i felt like an adopted son of iowa. >> reporter: but even at this friendly rally -- >> four more years. >> we found discontent. do you think the president let you down? >> on global aids funding, certainly, absolutely.

because i look at the promise that was made versus, you know, when's happened. >> reporter: recent harvard grad from iowa and otherwise vocal obama supporter showed up at the rally, stood just over the president's shoulder and quietly unfolded the hand made sign that said fund pepfar. it started under president george w. bush. >> campaign told you to put it down? >> they did. a guy crept back there saying put the sign down. i didn't want to cause too much of a you kous. >> reporter: he said aids funding flat lined or decreased under president obama. you are a supporter? >> complete supporter because i think mitt romney would be even worse as would paul ryan. >> reporter: now the obama campaign provided a laundry list of things that they say that the president has done to fight the global aids problem,

highlighting the fact that the u.s. remains the largest donor to the global fund and that the president has a renewed focus to fight the aids/hiv problem here at home, as well. ashleigh? >> that's from a file titled with friends like these. dan lothian, thank you. a reminder to you all to stay with cnn for complete coverage of the race for the white house. [ male announcer ] the perfect photo... [ man ] nice!

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introducing the all-new cadillac xts. available with advanced haldex all-wheel drive. [ engine revving ] it's bringing the future forward. when new jersey police busted in to the home of a suspected gang member they found the things you might think they would find. drugs, cash and then they found something else. a 44-year-old woman locked up and not just for a little bit. locked up for years at a time on and off. this story is off the rails bizarre. jason carroll, covering this story. you got a source on this one. it is bizarre to think that somebody could have been locked up off and on for periods that could last years. >> that's what the source is telling me. when they went out there, they had a search warrant to search

an apartment, michael mendez, for drugs. searching the apartment, they go to a back bedroom. they break off the lock and find a 44-year-old woman inside the bedroom. the source says under questioning it appears as if she had to use a bucket for a bathroom for a period of time and given a phone and she could have called at any time, as well. during the whole process of interviewing her about what had happened to her inher time there, she defended michael mendez so it's a very bizarre case. here you have the officers of new jersey state police going in to the apartment in patterson, new jersey. execute a search warrant. they find what they're looking for. they find the drugs and obviously find a whole lot more. >> she had a working telephone. >> correct. >> and didn't call out to alert the authorities that she was a prisoner. >> did not call. some of the neighbors actually saw her off and on over a period of time, you know, for brief periods. so she had the ability to call. she had the ability to reach out

for help. but you know, the source tells me they see this time and time again in certain situations, people held. >> not this with the padlock on the outside. >> and perhaps not this severe. >> extraordinary dmesing abuse or a stockholm syndrome of sorts? >> good question. we don't know. here you have this woman being evaluated at a hospital. the condition at this point unknown. but it's one of those situations where clearly there's been some psychological damage. >> and he's been held on a million dollars bail which is no joke. >> no joke. he's held on a million dollars bail. he is a suspected gang member. >> latin kings? >> latin kings. more than 4,200 prescription pills found there in the apartment. >> not good. >> perhaps a court appearance later on today. >> good the know. keep your eye on that for us if you would and let us know in this hour if it breaks. as jason said, a court appearance to find out the charges may result because oftentimes when they break, what you are charged with ain't what you end up being tried for and

we could see additional charges in the case. back in a moment. siri, what's my day look like?

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lawyers prepare their defense in

the shooting death of trayvon martin, here is the latest move. it centers around this man, the judge presiding over the case, kenneth lester. turns out zimmerman's attorneys do not want him on the bench. they say they, quote, lost faith in the objectivity, end quote, of the court and they don't believe zimmerman can get a fair trial with the judge. the judge says i don't think so, refusing to recuse himself and he says zimmerman's request is legally insufficient, end quote, short story. now the defense says not so short a story. they're taking it up a notch to a higher court. they want the higher court to step in and they want to appeal this thing and remove judge lester from the case. so it begs the question, what's the problem with the judge? what difference does it make to this case? the guy with the answer is our senior legal analyst jeffrey toobin. the first thing i thought when they put forth this motion to get rid of judge lester is they

mighting going for a stand your ground hearing because it is the judge and the judge alone that decides if this goes to trial or you walk out a free guy. that may not not case here. >> that's right. the defense in this case is weighing whether to have a stand your ground hearing which is does the law that we have discussed so often which says that you can stand your ground or respond if you feel like you're threatened, does that apply, or maybe they'll go to the judger and say this was self-defense, end of story, ignore the stand your glound law altogether. the defense said different things publicly and don't have to make a decision yet. that's a possibility as well. >> the strange part is zimmerman's attorney intimated last week without question they were going forward to try to prevail in the stand your ground hearing. then this week he is suggests, you know, maybe not so. maybe we'll go with the standard self-defense argument and battle this out before a jury. i am thoroughly confused as to

the strategy. >> this is one of the reasons why a lot of defense attorneys don't talk to the media much before a trial or during the lead up to a trial because you change your mind. when you're a defense attorney, your strategy can change based on developments, but you don't usually want the media chronicling that, and this might be an argument for not talking so much. >> i always had the love/hate relationship with the law because i want to hear everything. i like the sunshine state because we get great stories and it is a lovely disinfectant but at the same time it really does tend to enkroech on a fair trial especially for zimmerman who has been all over the press. >> florida is great. florida is the most open legal system, the most open in the country. >> it is the reason "in session exists. >> and unfortunately after the o simpson case a lot of states cut back on public access, on televised access to trials because people thought the

cameras had a bad effect in the o.j. case. that happened in new york. florida has not. florida remains the one state where cameras can always get in and as a media guy i support it as well. >> i hear you. not before i say this. do you think this change in strategy or what's been said in public by zimmerman's attorney that he wants to go forward with the self-defense is because a bench trial would be too difficult given the credibility issues zimmerman has with the lying? >> no. i think there are a lot of moving parts here. i think it is bizarre frankly they're trying to have this judge disqualified because, remember, the judge revoked bail because zimmerman clearly lied but then he gave him bail again. >> he gave him bail. >> how can you ask for recusal when he ruled in your favor? so he said a couple nasty things. >> like he flooded the system and manipulated the system, but judges say these things. don't go anywhere. a few minutes. >> all the time in the world. >> i would like to work you over time. this is the case against the

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to switch, and you could save hundreds. liberty mutual insurance -- responsibility. what's your policy? james holmes, by now you have seen the pictures of him in court with the dyed red hair after the colorado shooting and a lot of people say it will be insanity defense more than likely. what most people don't know is that we're not even there yet, are we? we're not even at the stage where he can go to court. have you to be declared competent. >> that's right. it is a two-stage process. this is what would happen in the loughner case in tucson, the shootings with gabby giffords. there were months where loughner was found not fit to stand trial, that is too crazy even to understand what was going on. he subsequently was found sit to stand trial and then wound up pleading guilty. >> sometimes you're medicated

into being competent. >> sometimes against your will. sometimes there are cases where people say i don't want that medication. >> elizabeth smart's abductors. >> and that case wound up taking years and years in part because of that controversy. here the question first will be is the aurora shooter holmes fit to sta trial, fit to understand what is going on. >> what the trial even entails. >> yeah. that's fair. >> it is constitutional. >> that's right. you only want cases where people understand what's going on, and of course in the meantime he is not going anywhere. it is only if he is found fit to stand trial then the whole issue of the insanity defense or some other defense arises. >> by the way, i got to wrap this. the chances of this case actually prevailing in an insanity defense given the kevlar, the booby-trapping, given the, oh, this is bad stuff i am doing, it is highly unlikely. >> the insanity defense rarely, rarely succeeds, and certainly on the basis of the evidence we have seen