agency even has the authority to take action in the first place. vice president pk. platform revealed. presidency defined. the announcement we all used to wait for at political conventions. we already know. so do conventions really matter? fresco fiasco, and what has to be the worst art restoration project ever. a painting of jesus hundreds of years old virtually -- well, you see what happened. the 81-year-old parishioner who thought she was doing a good thing now coming forward, accepting responsibility, and in this case the picture is really worth a thousand words. plus this. >> i'm brian todd in tampa where concerns are growing about isaac possibly coming ashore as a tropical storm or a hurricane. that's bay shore boulevard. that was flooded eight weeks ago by a tropical storm. look how close it is to the convention center. can the delegates from out of town be evacuated here in time? if the storm hits here? we'll tell you about the concerns. "cnn newsroom" starts right now.

and good morning to you. happy friday. i'm carol costello. thank you for being with us. we begin this morning with a bombshell announcement about lance armstrong. he could lose his seven tour de france titles, and he's facing a lifetime ban from cycling. those decisions by the u.s. anti-doping agency comes hours after armstrong said he would stop fighting charges of illegal doping. and according to rueters, the head of the agency says armstrong's decision to drop the fight means their case has substance. armstrong has always denied doping, though. >> i think that the people that know cycling know that we're the most passionate, fanatical crazy team out there when it comes to preparation and the right way. we spend more time on equipment and training and legal methods than anybody else. and i stand by that statement.

and over time, we'll see. >> but now armstrong says there comes a point in every man's life when he has to say enough is enough. for me, that time is now. armstrong made his decision after losing a legal bid to stop the anti-doping agency's case against him. joining us now, peter flax, editor-in-chief of "bicycling" magazine. welcome, peter. >> good to be here, carol. >> this is what it says on the cover of your magazine this morning. you see it there at the bottom. so why won't this decision bring the truth but not justice? >> well, i think that this is dragged on for so long, and, you know, it's like the situation is that lance is guilty of what he's charged of. and at the same time, he's the victim of being, you know, a part of a witch hunt. and so it's not satisfying. the verdict will not change a lot of people's minds. and it will leave a bad taste in people's mouths. >> and i can see why you say that.

the u.s. anti-doping people say they have 10 witnesses who would testify against lance armstrong. but he's passed every drug test he's taken, right? >> yeah. there's one drug test that's in question where he actually failed the drug test and produced a doctor's note afterwards. but he passed lots and lots of tests. i think the testimony from his teammates who testified to usada would paint a very different picture of a systematic program where he and his teammates used performance enhancing drugs and doped. and i think in my mind, there's no question that these activities transpired. it also is true that he is the greatest cyclist of his generation and an inspiration to millions. so it's a difficult situation to process. >> so does this agency, do they clearly have power to take away lance armstrong's tour de france wins? >> usada is definitely set up to have the signal authority to run this sort of drug testing and

arbitration. i think the case of the tour de france titles, it's going to turn into a little bit of an international spectacle because the international body that rules pro cycling and the company that owns the tour de france are going to have to weigh in. so this could drag on for months. and those two bodies might decide otherwise. so we'll just have to wait and see whether everyone abides by usada's decision or whether there's just more conflict. >> and, peter, we have heard that lance armstrong -- they might go after lance armstrong's winnings from his tour de france titles. had you heard that? >> yeah. i mean, there's definitely a lot of speculation about whether new litigation will open. there was a case years ago for a company that gave lance a $5 million bonus for winning his fifth tour, and it's possible that in situations like that that people are going to present new litigation. financially, i don't think it's the kind of stuff that's going to bankrupt lance or necessarily

ruin live strong, his foundation. but it's another round of challenges he's going to have to deal with. >> peter flax, editor-in-chief of "bicycling" magazine. thank you for joining us. >> good to be here. america's poorest neighbor in the path of disaster again. just hours from now, tropical storm isaac will pound haiti and the 400,000 people still living in tents. that's nearly three years after devastating earthquakes left them homeless. many of the people did not even know the storm was coming until cnn crews arrived and told them the storm was on its way. millions of floridians know they could also be in the path of the storm that could reach hurricane strength. right now, the future track is still unclear. one big question is how much of an effect will isaac have on the republican national convention in tampa. tens of thousands of people are streaming into the gulf coast city ahead of monday's start. we have a report from tampa, but let's start with rob marciano who is tracking isaac.

go for it, rob. >> good morning, carol. this thing has strengthened overnight. it's a large storm, but for the most part it's been very disorganized. because it's been so slow to strengthen, we don't think it's going to blow up into a hurricane before it hits haiti or cuba. so that's good news for them. but the bad news is, it still has a ton of moisture with it, and that's really the main concern talking about port-au-prince and the surrounding hillsides that have been deforested. and the people who live on and below the hillsides are in shanties and tents. so that's a huge concern when this thing makes its way towards the north and east. we have been talking about the track. where is it going to go. yesterday they flew a high altitude reconnaissance aircraft well north of the storm itself. that gave us valuable data to plug into the computers. each one of these lines indicates a computer model that now will be a little bit more tightly clustered as we get into the gulf of mexico. so we are getting some more confidence as to where this is

going to go. the strength of it, we still don't really understand that quite yet. we don't think it will become a hurricane. famous last words. but the main threat for cuba and hispaniola will be the rainfall. into the florida straits as we go through sunday night into monday. so tropical storm force conditions expected along all of the keys. possibly including miami. and then potentially developing this into a hurricane, making its way as a category 1 landfall anywhere really from tampa potentially to new orleans tuesday into wednesday. so that's the latest track. it will continue to change. as we get closer, you're going to have to start thinking about making some preps, including folks in tampa. >> that's right. because people are taking no chances. and that's very smart of them. many people in tampa and several other florida cities are already preparing for isaac, filling up sand bags and stocking up on essentials, including bottled water and batteries. brian todd is outside of the republican national convention site in tampa. this is an area that's prone to flooding, right? >> reporter: sure is, carol. just eight weeks ago, tropical

storm debby hit near here, and this area just to my left, bay shore boulevard in downtown tampa was under a few feet of water. just a couple of blocks from here is the convention center. the area where the convention will be held. the forum just around the corner. and you can see the water behind me. it's a low-lying area. storm surge is a hooj problem here. that was a problem during tropical storm debby eight weeks ago, and it could be a problem if isaac comes anywhere near here as a tropical storm or as a hurricane. tampa bay is kind of a funnel. it brings water up from the gulf right into this area. it has nowhere to go. once it hits right about here, other than to maybe flood these areas. we talked to dan noah about the potential for storm surge right where we're standing. >> one thing about tampa bay is once the water gets into the bay, it piles up. and right where we are standing is where it piles up.

the biggest storm surges occur right here. >> reporter: so that's always a worry here. and that's why there's been so much concern about tropical storm isaac as it creeps up here. you heard rob's forecast. even if it projects out and it passes maybe 100 or so miles to the west of here, just the residuals from that storm could cause problems, carol. and it of course could do that right when all the delegates are here. >> we hope not. keeping our fingers crossed. brian todd reporting live from tampa. weather reporting, cnn's live coverage of the republican national convention from tampa begins monday night at 7:00 eastern. best buy is going to pay its new ceo a package of about $32 million for three years. what's even more surprising, this news comes days after the company announced a 90% drop in its second quarter profits. and get this. that new ceo could get more than $6 million even if he doesn't take the job. alison kosik is at the new york

stock exchange to make this more clear for all of us. good morning. >> good morning. so his name is hubert jolie. he officially was named ceo of best buy this week. but even for that $32 million he's going to be getting, this guy is inheriting a huge mess. best buy sales have fallen in eight of the last nine quarters. and the guy who was ceo before him was forced out after he was involved in an inappropriate conduct with a female employee. that scandal also forced out best buy's founder and chairman richard schultz. all right. so he has a lot of work to do. and, yes, he's going to be paid very, very handsomely for it. let me break down the pay package. jolie is getting an annual base salary of about $1.2 million. wait. hold onto your hat. that's just the beginning. also he is getting over $16 million to compensate him for money he is forfeiting by leaving his old job of ceo of carlson. and there's more. there's the bonuses. almost $9 million a year in bonuses begin in 2014.

and some of that will depend on how well the company performs. but, carol, before you have a total outrage thing about this, there are two ways to look at this. you can say that the company is struggling and the ceo should be paid based on how good a job he does in the future. or you pay up front for top talent to come in and whip the company back into shape. you want the best, you have to pay for it. carol? >> ok. i'm trying to look at it both ways. it's going to take me a couple of days of looking at it. alison kosik, thank you so much. >> have i convinced you? >> uh, thanks, alison. james holmes. his early threats and warning signs before the movie theater massacre. why prosecutors are now pointing a finger at his former university. continuing to lend and invest in communities across the country. whether it's supporting a delaware nonprofit that's providing training and employment opportunities, investing in the revitalization of a neighborhood in the bronx,

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just about 15 minutes past the hour, time to check our top stories. the man who killed 77 people in norway last year has been sentenced to the maximum, 21 years in prison. anders breivik said he committed the crime to prevent the, quote, islamization of norway. prosecutors wanted breivik to be acquitted on insanity grounds

and held in a meant at health facility. the court found him sane. a top u.s. diplomat faces drunk driving and hit-and-run charges in washington state. police say earlier this month, ryan crocker hit a tractor-trailer and spun out of control and then he drove away. tests showed he had blood alcohol levels twice the legal limit. crocker has been u.s. ambassador to several nations, including afghanistan. in money news, when the federal reserve bailed out insurance giant aig taxpayers wondered if they'd ever see that money again. well, it turns out that the government actually made an $18 billion profit. aig's bad bets played a major role in the 2008 financial crisis. washington still owns $29 billion of aig common stock, though. and two massachusetts men on a sight-seeing trip probably never saw this coming. take a look at that. a 150-pound boulder found from a canyon wall in arizona. as you can see, it smashed through the windshield of their suv.

the boulder actually landed between the two men in the front seat. both of those men walked away with only minor cuts. oh, my gosh. that's incredible. although we are excited about the upcoming political conventions, there are many who are not. they yearn for the days when political conventions used to be more than scripted infomercials. back in the day, george h.w. bush and the candidates before him used the convention to announce the vp candidate. you know, like right there. hello, dan quayle. to be fair, even today, conventions can create stars like ann richards, the keynote speaker at the democratic convention in 1988. she was the texas treasurer, and this delicious snarky comment netted her the governor's office. >> poor george. he can't help it.

he was born with a silver foot in his mouth. >> it was a great line. but this year, the keynote speakers are chris christie for the gop. already a rising star. and actually he is already a star. and for the democrats, julian castro, the mayor of san antonio, a not so subtle plea for the hispanic vote. of course, conventions can rally the base. drill, baby, drill was born in 2008. >> drill, baby, drill! drill, baby, drill! drill, baby, drill! >> but is all of that enough to justify all the time and money to put on two massive cheerleading sessions? the director of center for politics at the university of

virginia has written about this in "the new york daily news." welcome, larry. >> well, good morning, carol. how are you? >> i'm good. i know you think conventions are getting to be a waste of time. so tell us why. >> well, i have to confess i'm going to my 19th and 20th national conventions, so i'm just as guilty as anyone else. these things are dinosaurs but they are not extinct. look, you can't turn back the clock, carol. it would be nice if in some ways if we could go back to a time when i grew up when you had the coverage road blocked by all of the major networks. they covered the conventions gavel to gavel. and if you were going to watch tv, you were going to watch the conventions. you were actually going to learn something. it was a civic education moment for the country. well, that's gone forever. you know, you have so many cable choices. most of the cable channels won't cover any convention activity. so in essence, the audience is

reduced to a self selected band of partisans on both sides. hey, the democrats on the second night of their convention have to go up against the nfl opener. carol, who do you think is going to win that? who's going to get a lot more viewers? will it be the nfl or the democrats? i think we know the answer. >> i think we do too. although we hear -- i'm talking about the republican convention -- we hear it will focus extensively on governor romney's time at bain capital and his mormon faith. so won't that help people who choose to watch the convention, won't that help people get to know him? >> well, i think it will help those who actually watch, if there is a substantial number of swing voters or undecideds. and as we're seeing this year, there really isn't. i would peg the number of undecided voters at around 5%. to turn that around, it means 95% of the people already know for whom they are going to vote, and the vast majority are not going to change their minds.

people are dug in this year. so i think that's another reason why the conventions have become cheers sessions for the partisans, for the true believers. and that's okay their enthusiasm level matters, and it will determine which side wins the turnout battle in november. >> the networks, you know, cbs, abc, nbc, not cnn, the networks will cut back their coverage. they agree with you. they say people are kind of bored with the selection. they have already made their choice. but when you look at the big picture, isn't that kind of irresponsible on the part of journalists? >> well, in one word, yes. networks have used cnn and the other cable channels increasingly as an excuse not to cover the basic events that key circumstances of american politics. and that's a shame, because still millions and millions and millions of americans just watch those basic networks.

they don't get to cable channels as often as they get to their major network. so they are not learning as much as they once did about these candidates and about the parties. and, look, even though they are infomercials, carol, they do present the basic platform. you get a sense of the candidates. you get a sense of what they're like, what their values are. you know what the parties stand for. so they are important educational moments. and unfortunately, lots and lots of americans are tuning out education and moving even further into the entertainment realm. >> yeah. they're going to watch football. larry, thank you so much for joining us. >> they are going to watch football. >> that's right. thanks, larry. thanks, carol. here is a campaign bound to grab headlines. tony danza and alec baldwin. both considering a run for the mayor of new york city. it could happen. [ male announcer ] while many automakers are just beginning

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startling details out of colorado. prosecutors now say james holmes, who is accused of killing 12 people at a midnight

movie, had made threats a month earlier at the university of colorado. holmes appeared in court, his hair still died red. his attorneys arguing over access to his university of colorado records. jim spellman is live on the phone from denver. tell us more. >> reporter: the prosecutors in the case are looking for all the information they can get about james holmes from the university, especially in this period before the shooting, the month of june. now we know why. prosecutors said in that month alone he failed his oral exam, made unspecified threats that were reported to campus police, and then he dropped out. meanwhile, he was buying large amounts of ammunition and guns and he was seeing a psychiatrist on campus at that point. now the defense in turn wants to keep all of this information from the university out of prosecutors' hands. that's what this hearing has been all about. the judge did not rule yet. but it really raises an important issue. which is did the university know something about james holmes

that he was dangerous leading up to the attack, and possibly could something have been done to stop it, carol. >> from what i understand, his alleged threats were turned over to. caus police. but do we know if the campus police turned anything over to the aurora police? >> reporter: we don't. and that's a really key question here. but there's a real strict gag order, and almost all of the important documents in this case has been sealed. that's in a way why this hearing was so important. we got this information directly from the prosecutors and we've been having to piece things together through the series of hearings because we just can't get this information. >> thank you, jim. in florida, a new storm bears down as old memories bubble to the surface. 20 years ago today, hurricane andrew struck. its impact still felt every day. at shell, we believe the world needs a broader mix of energies. that's why we're supplying natural gas to generate cleaner electricity...

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this is cnn breaking news. >> some disturbing breaking news to tell you about out of new york city. right near the empire state building, a place where many tourists are visiting that iconic landmark in america. this is at 5th and 34th in midtown manhattan. apparently, and cnn has confirmed this part of the story, five people have been shot. we have our poppy harlow heading down to the scene. we don't know the circumstances surrounding the shooting, why it went down, whether it had anything at all to do with the empire state building. we just know that shooting

happened near that landmark. when poppy harlow arrives on the scene, we'll get her on the phone and hopefully she'll have more information to pass along to you. in other news this morning, today millions of floridians have their eyes on the horizon, but their memories may be locked on hurricane andrew. 20 years ago today, the category 5 storm roared ashore and became at the time the costliest disaster in u.s. history. and the impact is still being felt today. john zarella is in miami. good morning, john. >> reporter: good morning, carol. people are certainly keeping a close eye on tropical storm isaac. and if it should hit here, people in south florida are going to be safer and better prepared than most anywhere else in the hurricane prone areas. and why? because of hurricane andrew. the ritual has begun. people buying up storm supplies,

plywood, water. it happens about every year in miami, and reaches a frenzied pace when something is out there headed this way. like there is now, isaac. but this year, the timing is, let's say, a bit creepy for a couple of reasons. what are the odds tampa would be in that cone of uncertainty the same week the republicans are in town? >> we actually calculated the odds when we bid on the republican national convention. and it is probably less than 1% chance that a hurricane will hit based on history. >> reporter: and then there's august 24, 1992. >> this is going to be one of the big natural disasters in our nation's history. >> reporter: only the third category 5 haurricane to strike the u.s. in recorded history struck miami. its name, andrew. entire communities were flattened. >> you ever heard of the devil breathing down your neck? we had the devil here. >> there's boats on boats, under

docks, on docks, it's a mess. >> reporter: and it remained a mess for several years. but out of the andrew devastation grew the toughest hurricane building codes for new construction in the nation. >> three, two, one. >> reporter: storm shutters and impact glass had to stop a projectile. the plywood decking on roof has to be thicker. now even the nails have to be ribbed so not to pull free. a major dilemma for scientists and engineers trying to figure out what construction materials and techniques would best hold up in a major hurricane has always been simulating a major hurricane. well, that's not a problem anymore. it's called the wall of wind. at florida international university, a dozen norm out fans can replicate the most powerful hurricanes. >> now we have reached major category wind strength. >> reporter: here a roof built to current code is tested against a pre-andrew roof.

it's clear what works. >> you can't get it in any other way, until you actually put it in a wind field this wide and with this force. then you can really tell. does that product really work or not? >> reporter: saving lives is the bottom line. the wall of wind team believes what they learn here will do just that. so 20 years ago during hurricane andrew, the winds gusted, carol, to 175 miles per hour. 180,000 people were left homeless. 110,000 businesses and homes were destroyed, and another 10,000 businesses. so it's a tough day. >> more than that. that's an understatement. great story, though. john zarella reporting live for us this morning. here is a problem facing mitt romney's running mate, paul ryan. ♪ we're not going to take it >> remember that song from twisted sister? turns out the '80s hard rock hit

is causing some very hard feelings on the campaign trail. and actually beyond the trail. i'll tell you why.

in communities across the country. whether it's supporting a delaware nonprofit that's providing training and employment opportunities, investing in the revitalization of a neighborhood in the bronx, or providing the financing to help a beloved san diego bakery expand, what's important to communities across the country is important to us. and we're proud to work with all of those who are creating a stronger future for everyone.

if a picture is worth a thousand words, many of them in this case will only be four letters long. this is the 120-year-old fresco of jesus by a spanish painter whose relatives still live nearby. it adorns a church in spain. and i'm sure you've seen this. this is what it looks like now. a well-meaning parishioner, she's 81 years old, she's come forward. she tried to restore it. she was given permission, but nobody monitored her work. so this could be ruined forever. this woman is distraught. she is reportedly now suffering from anxiety. art experts are too. they are hoping to save it. the bbc described it as looking like, quote, a very hairy monkey in an ill-fitting tunic. there's a long history of

actors entering politics. gene kelly, ronald reagan, arnold schwarzenegger to name a few. now tony danza and alec baldwin may wind up running for mayor of new york city. i didn't mean to laugh, aj hammer. i didn't. but it's like tony miceli running for mayor. it's weird. >> i was thinking about it, carol. when ed koch was mayor, he would always ask, how am i doing? tony danza may be asking voters, who's the boss? the sitcom star is saying he is a concerned citizen, he reads the papers, and he thinks maybe he is the guy to think new york. he says let me fix the city, let me run for mayor. he told the "the journal" that he would probably push for congestion pricing to help the traffic situation and raised the idea of going up against the other celebrities also considering getting into politics. we've heard alec baldwin talk about it. even jay-z. and by the way, you could sign me up to be at that debate. but i don't think we have to worry about seeing any tony for mayor signs just yet because he also told "the journal" he

didn't know if he could stand the scrutiny, carol. we know there's a lot of scrutiny. he also admitted it's a tough job, and it's not like anybody is asking me. i would love that debate, though. wow. >> that would be quite interesting. let's talk about dee snyder, twisted sister, and paul ryan. >> dee snyder doesn't think much of paul ryan's politics. and he doesn't want to be associated with his campaign in any way. paul ryan has been using twisted sister's song "we're not going to take it." so dee released a statement, here is what he is saying. i emphatically denounce paul ryan's use of my band's song "we're not going to take it" in any capacity. there is almost nothing he stands for that i agree with. he did release a second statement. he says he's not anti-republican, he doesn't like paul ryan. in a second statement, he also reminded everyone about his song's history, saying this. i do find it ironic that the same song, "we're not gonna take it," that was under fire from

conservative watch dog groups in the '80s is now the go-to song for those same groups. this is a pretty regular occurrence where politicians use songs. artists tell the politicians, hey, don't use my song. the ryan campaign did respond to snyder pretty quickly by saying, we're not going to play it anymore. >> i'm always -- i don't know. it's just strikes me as strange that these political camps don't call the artist and say, hey, do you mind if we play your song? >> well, i think they know what the answer is going to be in most cases. and it's also interesting to me that they sometimes don't even look at the lyrics. in this case of this particular song, they didn't know the song's history and how much fire this song -- it was a rebellious song in the '80s and came under fire from a lot of conservative watch dog groups. >> aj, thank you. you'll be back in the next hour. and so is dee snider. he won't be back, but he'll be joining us in the next hour to talk about this dispute and why he released two such strongly

worded statements. we'll be right back. [ male announcer ] more power. more style. more technology. less doors. the 2012 c-coupe. join mercedes-benz usa on facebook for the best summer sweepstakes. exclusive to the military, and commitment is not limited to one's military oath. the same set of values that drive our nation's military are the ones we used to build usaa bank. with our award winning apps that allow you to transfer funds, pay bills or manage your finances anywhere, anytime. so that wherever your duty takes you, usaa bank goes with you. visit us online to learn what makes our bank so different.

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this is cnn breaking news. >> all right. we have more information now on what transpired near the empire state building at 34th and 5th in new york city. apparently, police were near the scene of the shooting and have shot the shooter dead. wabc is reporting there is no longer any danger in this area. cnn has confirmed that five people were shot. not inside the empire state building, not on top of it, but outside of the empire state building. we still don't know what the motive was, if this had anything at all to do with the empire state building. but it is tourist season in new york city, so there were lots of people around that area. not only that, it was at 9:00 a.m. eastern time, and a lot of people were walking to and from work. penn station is two avenues over from this at 34th and 7th. so this is a very congested

area. so when we get more information, of course, we'll pass it along. but here's what we know. five people shot outside of the empire state building. and we have confirmed that police have shot the shooter dead. when we get more information, of course, we'll pass it along. we're going to take -- oh, poppy harlow is on the way to the scene, so of course she'll get us more information soon.

this is cnn breaking news. >> as promised, we got someone on the scene near the empire state building in new york city. rose is one of our producers. rose, we know five people were shot. the shooter is dead. can you tells more? >> yes. people here have a slightly different account than what the police are saying. but to set the stage for you, there are a good number of tourists. we're at the height of tourist season in new york city.

long lines outside of the empire state building. one witness described to me that a man ran after another man and pulled a gun. he said it was not a small handgun but looked to be a sawed-off shotgun or automatic weapon and started firing into the man's chest. at that point, people began to scream. the crowd dispersed. and an elevator man from inside the empire state building came out and pursued the guy with the gun and was calling for help. alerted the police who apparently were inside. they then chased after the gunman. and caught him right in front of the empire state building tourist entrance. shot him people say three times. in fact, his body is still lying on the ground outside of the entrance to the empire state building. >> so how were the other people shot? how did they get hit? >> well, people here, witnesses here, say they there was some ricochetting of bullets on the first shooting. but they are under the impression that no one other

than the initial victim and the shooter were actually wounded. i can tell you looking down at the scene right now, i'm only seeing two people who were shot. they may have been taken away before i got here. but it does appear that there are the two of them. they have the police officer off to to the side, and the doorman, the elevator maintenance men all being interviewed right now. >> i'm just sort of stunned that this security person from the empire state building started chasing this armed man who had just shot someone. >> yes, and i mean even more amacing he's all uniformed and everything but really his security job is to guard and operate the elevator. he's not even an armed guard, you know, as far as i can tell from talking to his colleagues here. he's not even trained to do this, but as soon as he heard the shooting he ran right outside and went after this guy. they say he almost caught him, he was running so far. >> kudos to him. i mean, obviously he was trying to stop this guy from committing more violence.

>> yes, yes, absolutely. i mean people were talking about him as being heroic. there's a crowd of people that were right outside the building, and you know, because it's august, it's new york, it's the empire state building a lot of these people don't speak english. i talked with several tourists from spain, other countries, you know, and they were completely stunned by what had happened and were screaming but didn't have the opportunity to communicate it, have the ability to communicate with police and this guy apparently will be able to both get police and pursue this guy all the way, i mean he must have run a half a block after this guy, caught him like right near the tourist entrance where the police shot him. >> so were the police, did they just happen to be nearby? because it's hard to get through the crowded streets of new york city, frankly. >> yes. my understanding is that the police officer he alerted was nearby. i know i actually was in the empire state building with some

tourists not a week ago and there seemed to be police officers that are stationed around the building quite a bit. they were there at all hours, because there were very long lines of tourists and it is considered a major new york city landmark. several people described it was incredible, the people is with which this building got surrounded by new york police department vehicles, ambulances, emergency service, very, very fast. >> wow. just describe to people how congested this area is, even without the tourists. >> even without this, i can tell you that this is one of those points in the city where you always have a traffic jam, and there's a considerable amount of construction on top of the fact that you have the empire state building here. the empire state building itself has scaffolding on one side right now so the traffic is at a snail's pace, and then you add to that, that you have the long tourist lines. the tourist lines at the empire state building right now are so long that when you come in and

get a ticket, they're giving you a ticket to come back hours later so that you won't have to stand there all day. that's how many tourists there are in new york trying to get into this building. >> bow. if you're just joining us, these are live pictures courtesy of wabc, fifth and fourth near the empire state building. witness told our producer rose arce that a man with a large what looked like a sawed off shotgun was running after another man, he shot that man and somehow cnn has confirmed at least four other people were hit by either shrapnel from the shooting or were shot. we're not sure about that. rose, pick up the story from there again and tell me, there is the security guard, the man in charge of guarding the elevators inside the empire state building, he heard this gunfire, he ran out and then what happened? >> apparently he runs out of the building and is screaming inside to police, he's got his phone out and he's chasing this gunman. he kept him in pursuit, kept him

in his eyesight. that's when another prifr apparently came from out of nowhere. people believe he was alerted by him and shot the guy right in front of the entrance, and in fact it's quite a scene right now because you have this, you know, big crowd of tourists that have been pushed back a half a block, all staring at the front of the empire state building and there's a body lying out front with like a white sheet over it. >> i just can't imagine. we've heard that the crime rate in new york city has been inching up in recent months. i mean this doesn't sound like the gunman targeted tourists, it sounds like he was chasing after someone he wanted to kill. >> yes, well that's the speculation here certainly. i think the one thing that makes people wonder if this was just a regular sort of street robbery is the fact that the gun, everyone keeps mentioning that the gun was so unusual. it wasn't like a little handgun.

it was bigger than that. one person said to me, this is four or five inches longer than a regular gun, that it's big earl, it's thicker and looked to them like a sort of a semiautomatic weapon. of course, people don't know which gun is which, but it looked to them to be larger than the regular handgun and also when it's fired, it's fired into this guy, multiple shots and also, new york certainly has had its crime issues but i would say it's very rare to see that kind of a street crime in the city anymore. to see somebody take out a gun and shoot somebody else that's fallen into the area of something shocking, unusual. people here are speculating for a mugging, why would you use that kind of a gun. >> definitely. >> they described both men as being not well dressed as in suit and tie but dressed sort of nicely, and that both of them

were white, regular sort of haircut, kind of average looking guy, no one that you would think was unusual. they looked sort of like businessmen in the neighborhood, without the suit and tie. >> wow. okay, so again, five people hit by bullets or the ricochets of bullets outside of the empire state building. one man is dead, we believe that was the shooter. police say they did, plits did tell cnn the shooter is dead and as our producer rose arce his body is still lying near the entrance to the empire state building. i would suspect, rose, tourists are not being let out of the area right now? >> what they've done is anybody who was outside the building they've pushed back just really in some cases across the street and in another case about a half a block away. i think you can presume there are a kusconsiderable number tourist its inside because there have been people leaving the building. the front of the building is

closed off to anybody but police and they have a small group of witnesses there that they've been interviewing. >> rose, great job. you stay on the scene and try to get more information for us. we're going to take a quick break and be back with more. 00 . in that time there've been some good days. and some difficult ones. but, through it all, we've persevered, supporting some of the biggest ideas in modern history. so why should our anniversary matter to you? because for 200 years, we've been helping ideas move from ambition to achievement. and the next great idea could be yours. ♪

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breaking news to tell you about at the top of the hour, i'm carol costello, police tell cnn ten people have been shot in front of the empire state building. seven people who were injured are being triaged at the scene right now. police do tell us the shooter is dead. his body is lying near the doorway of the empire state building. we want to bring in lou palumbo,

former nassau county police officer. police responded very quickly to this. i was talking to our producer, rose arce in the last few minutes and she told me in a matter of minutes police surrounded the empire state building. what do you make of that? >> it's no secret the empire state building from time to time has been identified by the intelligence community as a potential target. in fact, i was involved in koord nading a security detail all active and retired law enforcement agents from a private perspective to help secure the empire state building. so there's always focus and concentration on the building, not to mention they're only blocked away literally from many of the commands in the police department, whether it's the south precinct or the task force but that building gets special

attention, that's the reality of the situation. >> so witnesses told our producer, rose arce, that this suspect had a very large gun, what looked like a sawed off shotgun, chasing a man down the street and police also tell us that ten people were shot. what do you make of that? >> well, if, in fact, he was carried a sawed off shotgun the type of projectile that that discharges is one in which is shoots multiple pellets that come out of the barrel and they don't stay in what we call a tight pattern so the likelihood if he discharged the weapon at one individual and had a particular type of shotgun shell in the firearm that the bullets disperse as they come out, they create a wide pattern and they're capable of hitting more people, referred to as double aardvark or inertia. it is reported he did have a shotgun. >> lou, stand by, i have rose arce back on the phone, she is a producer, on the screen.

describe to us what that witness told you as the gunman was running down the street. rose, can you hear me? she's having trouble with her cell phone connection, so we're going to try to get rose again. back to you, though, lou. you say police have confirmed it was indeed a shotgun? >> it appears it was a robbery that went bad and the guy was armed with a shotgun. >> we also have mike brooks on the phone, he's the cnn contributor, also a former police officer, and you've been talking to new york authorities. what have you found out, mike? >> carol, apparently the reporting is correct, ten shot, two dead, including the gunman and apparently a young woman who was an innocent bystander on the scene and a lot of those shot were shot in the leg and the buttocks, which would go right into what lou was talking about with the possible use of a

shotgun and pellets flying out of the gun in large pattern. they're still looking for a motive. there have been a number of different thoughts out there, some people are saying it was two co-workers, somebody else saying it was a robbery gone bad so trying to confirm that right now. >> the young woman was she a tourist standing in line? >> don't know, apparently an innocent bystander who happened to be in the area. i talked to my source on the scene, still an active crime scene there at 34th and 5th. on a beautiful friday afternoon, i guess, it's going to be a lot of people around the empire state building, so but apparently this woman was just an innocent bystander. >> rose arce our producer was telling us this is a busy time for the empire state building. so many people want to get in there and see it, they're taking tickets and having to walk away for a few hours and come back, so that area was so congested not only about tourists but with people going back and forth to

work, penn station, which is two avenues over. lou, i wanted to ask you about this. rose told us witnesses told her that a security guide guarding the elevator inside the empire state building came running out when he heard the gunshots and chased this gunman down. do police encourage that kind of thing? >> well, you know, it's not an issue whether they discourage it. i would tell you they wouldn't encourage it unless you were properly armed and trained as we are in law enforcement. this guy took a huge risk in understaking that. i would say this guy is a fairly brave individual. i would not encourage someone to do that as well as you were, like i said, properly armed and trained as we are in law enforcement. the thing that you might find interesting is that every square inch of the empire state building, including the sidewalks surrounding it are under video surveillance, that's something i discovered when we were involved in the security detail that i had mentioned earlier back in '98, so this

thing has been heavily recorded, even across the street, from the empire state building, they tape, and they're capable of generating polaroids. that's where i came to learn about the surveillance system, to go back to your initial question what he did was quite risky for himself. >> quite heroic. we have rose arce back on the phone. we were talking about the security guard that witnesses told you ran out and tried to stop the gunman. tell us more. >> is that me you're talking to? >> it's really difficult to get a cell phone signal out of new york city sometimes, especially when -- >> can you hear me now, carol? i'm here now. >> oh, great, you're back. tell us about the security guard, the elevator guy who tried to help. >> yes, i talked to three different people who describe a scene where as soon as the

shooting occurred and there were the multiple gunshots, one of the men who was operating the elevator, security guard that screens who is getting in and out of the elevators ran out from a side entrance of the empire state building and actually pursued this guy, as he was simultaneously calling out to police, he had a phone in his hands, believe he was maybe dialing 911. the guy was in hot pursuit of this guy, chased him up fifth avenue, which is where the main entrance of the empire state building is where police appeared and shot the man, witnesses counted three times, and i can tell you right now that the body of this guy, the gunman, is still lying jute side the entrance of the empire state building. >> you say it was covered with a white sheet. mike brooks is reporting, rose, that a young woman was also killed, an innocent bystander. do you see evidence of that? >> i don't. there is so much police

activity, of course it looks like a lot went on but it's very hard to tell. i can tell you there are mo visible ambulances around the scene of the shooting. they may have already taken off. the fbi, however, has just arrived. the emergency service unit is here. there's a very big investigation, i'd say easily nearly 100 law enforcement officials of various types that are around basically the entire building and there's also some heavy construction going on from above, so they've extended a lot of that and put police officers on a perch looking down. >> okay, stay right there, rose. mike, i want to ask you this question. the fbi is on the scene, but we understand authorities have ruled out terrorism as a motive. >> yes, what you're going to see now just like the shooting the other day and last week in washington, d.c., on g street

northwest, you're going to see members of the fbi, joint terrorism task force that are going to show up on the scene just to assist nypd, if it's needed, until they find out what the true motive is, and they also can assist in finding out who the gunman is because they do have large tentacles that areach out across the country but they're just there to assist the nypd. nypd is the lead investigative unit for this particular case. >> lou, i wanted to ask you about this as rose has been reporting, the shooter's body is still lying there near the entrance to the empire state building. you have all of these tourists around. the streets are blocked off. this has to be a nightmare scenario for police. >> well, you know what they do is we would go in and create like an area of containment or what's more commonly known as a crime scene and that's what this is right now. that's why nothing's been disturbed, in other words, including the body of the alleged shooter. to go back and just address the

fbi involvement, the fbi is looking at this, any possibility this might be something other than just a conventional robbery. this entire process, they're satisfied, if they're satisfied that's what it is, they will continue to investigate this with the police department. if it turned out to be something terrorist related, the emphasis or control of the crime scene would shift to the fbi but as far as the body and the crime scene, which is i would suspect rather large, it's going to remain like that until the police are satisfied collecting evidence, interviewing witnesses, doing a complete canvas of the area, reviewing the tapes that exist in the empire state building. they've got a lot of work to do on this thing. it's going to be disruptive for quite some time. >> i'd like to tell people who are just joining us what has happened. ten people shot outside the empire state building. we understand one young woman, an innocent bystander was killed in the crossfire. police did shoot the shooter

dead. his body is lying at the entrance of the empire state building. oh we have a witness on the line. rebecca fox? >> hello? >> rebecca, can you hear me? >> yes, i can. >> rebecca, you're a witness to this terrible thing. tell us what you saw. >> i was basically getting my coffee walking on the street toward fifth avenue and 34th street and i saw people running and i didn't know what happened. i thought actually there was a celebrity sighting but pretty far from it, and i continued to walk down. i didn't actually hear any gunshots. i had headphones in but somebody had said that there was a shooting, and there were several shots fired. so i walked across the street and this is before they blocked off the crime scene, and i saw a woman had been shot on the corner next to the hartland brewery in the foot and she seemed in shock, you know, that

she had just been shot. i looked in the middle of the street, right at the empire state building in front of the doors, where you enter and there was a man lying on the ground, there was police all around him, like they had shot him down and a lot of this i heard just from the aftermath that this man had been in pursuit of another man running down the street and he had shot the other man next to the starbucks on 33rd street toward sixth avenue, shot him in the head, and someone had shown me a picture of him and it was very gruesome. another man across the street at the empire state building i saw the police flip him over and saw his head move up, like he was alive but people tell me he's dead and that's basically what i saw. it's a crazy scene. it wasn't that long ago that 9/11 happened, so i really had no idea. that's it. >> so you were just going to get your morning coffee and you had your headphones on. >> you can say that again?

>> you were just getting coffee this morning, you had your headphones on? >> yeah. like another normal day, and now not normal. >> tell us about this area and i mean normally it's a safe place, isn't it? >> normally it is. it's funny because my parents said i was crazy for moving up here after 9/11 but i worked across the street from the empire state building for about five years now and nothing like this has ever happened. it's mayhem and there are detectives everywhere, trying to map out the crime scene as we speak. i had pictures of -- something's beeping. okay. i saw blood on the sidewalk. it was just a very surreal scene. so yes. >> you work inside the empire state building. is that what you said? >> no, i work across the street from the empire state building.

there's a chase bank and i work right across 34th and fifth avenue. >> i was going to ask but the tourists lining up to get inside the empire state building to take the elevators up to the top and then they see this terrible thing transpire. >> yeah, i mean normally people are standing in line every morning and i'm cursing the tourists that are trying to get up to the top of the empire state building. i've never actually been to the top myself, but you know, i'll never forget it. >> do you know that ten people in all were shot? >> no, wow. i only saw the woman who had been shot, on the ground, and i saw another woman getting carted away on an ambulance but i had no idea there was ten people, wow. >> well, we're glad you're safe, rebeak rebec rebecca. >> yes, by chance i normally take the yellow line and the nrq but this morning i took the green line and i wanted to get to work faster, so by chance i

missed all this. >> thank goodness to are thafor. >> pretty lucky. >> yes, pretty lucky. we're glad you're okay. we'll be back with much more from the empire state building. who dreamed she could fly. like others who braved the sky before her, it took a mighty machine, and plain old ingenuity to go where no fifth grader had gone before. ♪ and she flew and she flew, into the sky and beyond. my name is annie and i'm the girl who dreamed she could fly. powered by intel core processors. ♪ powered ♪ intel core processors.

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just about 18 minutes past the hour. terrible news out of new york city, right in front of the empire state building, there was a terrible shooting. police tell cnn ten people were shot. there are two confirmed deaths, a young woman, an innocent bystander was shot by this man holding a shotgun. police quickly surrounded the empire state building, and they did shoot the shooter. the suspect is dead. his body is lying near the entrance to the empire state building. seven people, we understand, were triaged at the scene. witness told me she saw a woman who had been shot in the foot, that's what most of the injuries were like, people shot in the legs, in the behind or the feet, because of course it was a shotgun, and the pellets

scatter. they were hit by shrapnel. our rose arce is on the scene and rose, you've been talking to witnesses and you described how one witness saw this man running down the street. can you share that with us again? >> yes, i've heard that from more than one person that they saw the shooting, it was very loud, several shots and a man securing the elevator inside ran out and began to pursue him, while calling for help, calling for police, apparently rounded a corner on to fifth avenue, chasing the guy, was catching up to him, the police stepped in and shot him. the man that he shot is still lying on the ground. the body is maybe 20 feet from where there's observatory entrance to get inside of the empire state building, right at the entrance where tourists by the hundreds come every single

day. >> we're looking at ariat shots courtesy of wabc. police are setting up a police line there. we understand police have said this is not terrorism related. we don't know a motive just yet. i also want you to share the story of what this weapon looked like. people were standing in line to get into the empire state building, it was going to be an exciting morning for them in new york city, and then they see this guy with a gun running down the street. >> yes, and i did talk to one woman who saw when he shot the man, and she really, her most vague memory is the size of the weapon, kept repeating over and over to me it didn't look like a regular handgun, it was so big. she cried it as being a little bit box-like, that the barrel stuck out quite a bit. i asked her as long as a shotgun? she said it was like a short shotgun or an automatic weapon, she called, you've seen the guns

not just a handgun. >> right, so we have this big gun, it was exposed and he was chasing after a specific person. what happened to that person? >> the person that he was chasing is the one, first off, the gunman shot someone, then the elevator man chases him and then he is shot by police. that is the account i've heard from witnesses, i'm told other people were shot here but it's hard to tell how they were shot. >> right. and we do understand sadly that an innocent bystander, a young woman was shot and killed in the crossfire of this terrible incident. we're going to take a short break and we'll be right back. i the same set of values that drive our nation's military are the ones we used to build usaa bank. with our award winning apps that allow you to transfer funds, pay bills or manage your finances anywhere, anytime.

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24 minutes past the hour. ten people have been shot near the empire state building in new york city. two are dead, one an innocent bystander, a young woman, the other the alleged gunman. this happened just after 9:00 a.m. eastern this morning, as tourists were lined up to get inside the empire state building to take the trip up to the top, as people were going back and

forth to work or making their way over to penn station. this was a very congested area. the body of the shooter is lying on the fifth avenue side of the empire state building near the entrance to the empire state building, that body now covered with a white sheet. i just want to show you exactly where we're talking about in new york city. you can see how congested this area is, right in midtown manhattan. police, new york city police responded very quickly to the scene of this crime, rose arce is there. rose, where exactly are you? >> i am right across the street, diagonally from where the body is lying. from where i am i can see the entrance of the observatory, when the tourists usually line up and the body, which is right now being examined by what appears to be the police photos marking, taking pictures and marking with numbers the bullets that they're finding on the

sidewalk. >> have police cleared the area of tourists now? >> no, there's a good number of tourists that are about a half a block away behind police lines, sort of catty-corner from where the body is lying. they are, in fact, there are several of them watching right now as the police are taking out numbers. they've gotten as far as i can tell four in marking the bullets and also paying a lot of attention to a black bag that is lying next to the body, which is covered with the white sheet. >> are they interviewing people yet? >> yes, i've seen them take several people out from the observatory entrance, and start talking to them, and in the case of one woman, they walked her to her hotel, which was about two blocks from here. i spoke with her, she was walking, she had not had somebody shot that she knew but somebody who was next to her had been shot and they've returned with her and with several other people who have their luggage

with them. clearly tourists, some of them didn't appear to speak english but they've brought them back to the scene with their luggage, and they were being talked to by what appear to be both police officers and fbi. >> i understand we have kelly wilson on the phone. is kelly a witness? >> yes, i'm here. >> took a picture right after the shooting, kelly, can you hear me? >> yes, i can. >> hi, kelly. it's carol costello. thank you for being with us this morning. you snap this picture, tell us what it is. >> it's just me walking across 35th street about a block north of the empire state building, and just saw a big crowd of police, of tourists taking pictures of the scene. >> and when you, i mean did you immediately realize what had happened? did it take you a couple of minutes? >> it took a couple minutes, i

mean seeing a big group of police like that is uncommon in the city. i heard a lot of murmuring in the crowd and realized right away that a shooting had happened, at which point i hustled on to get to work and get out of, away from the scene. >> but when you hear that ten people were shot near the empire state building, there's a dead body lying near the entrance of the empire state building, a young woman who was just innocently standing by, was killed, what goes through your mind? >> well, it's a terrible thing, first impulse is to think about whether it's time to get out of the city. >> you're seriously thinking about leaving? >> well, that's an immediate thought, and then the next thought was even if i left the city i'd still be coming to work in the city, so there really isn't a way to avoid it. >> and i think, sadly, we can say this sort of thing happens all across the country.

>> yeah, yeah, there's been a lot more of it lately that you hear about. i don't know if it's just happening more often or you hear more about it. >> does it make you feel any better that police are saying this was not terrorism-related? >> me, not really. i mean it's -- terrorism isn't really the number one worry. i mean it's violence, people against people, whether it's terrorism or any other cause. >> does it seem to you these days that this type of violence is getting worse? >> i don't know if it's getting worse or if it's just being reported more, i mean there does seem in some ways to be in a sense people are getting less, that some people are getting less sensitive to the value of other human lives. >> kelly wilson, thank you for sharing your thoughts with us this morning, and sharing the picture you snapped for us, thank you so much. >> all right, thank you.

>> we understand that mayor bloomberg, the mayor of new york city, is going to hold a press conference any minute now. when that press conference begins we'll bring that to you live. i just want to recap for those of you who are just joining us, it's been a terrible shooting outside of the empire state building at fifth and 34th. ten people in all have been shot, this has all been confirmed by police. cnn has confirmed it. two people were killed, one a young woman who was just standing there, she was an innocent bystander. also police shot and killed the gunman, his body still lying near the doorway on the fifth avenue side of the empire state building, all of this happened after 9:00 a.m. eastern time this morning, just the prime time for tourists to get in line to get tickets to go up to the top of the empire state building. prime time for people to arrive at work, to get their morning coffee, to travel two avenues over to the penn station to catch a train to get to where they're going. police tell us no connection to

terrorism, and of course, as i said t happened on the fifth avenue side of the empire state building. rebecca fox? i talked with rebecca fox, she was a witness to the shooting, sheefts walki she was walking to get her coffee at starbucks, earphones in, listening to music and suddenly realized what was happening. this is what she told me. >> i was basically getting my coffee walking on the street toward fifth avenue and 34th street and i saw people running and i didn't know what happened. i thought actually there was a celebrity sighting but pretty far from it, and i continued to walk down. i didn't actually hear any gunshots. i had headphones in but somebody had said that there was a shooting, and there were several shots fired. so i walked across the street and this is before they blocked

off the crime scene, and i saw a woman had been shot on the corner next to the hartland brewery in the foot and she seemed in shock, you know, that she had just been shot. i looked in the middle of the street, right at the empire state building in front of the doors, where you enter and there was a man lying on the ground, there was police all around him, like they had shot him down and a lot of this i heard just from the aftermath that this man had been in pursuit of another man running down the street and he had shot the other man next to the starbucks on 33rd street toward sixth avenue, shot him in the head, and someone had shown me a picture of him and it was very gruesome. another man across the street at the empire state building i saw the police flip him over and saw his head move up, like he was alive but people tell me he's dead and that's basically what i saw. it's a crazy scene. it wasn't that long ago that 9/11 happened, so i really had no idea. that's it. >> so you were just going to get your morning coffee and you had

your headphones on. >> can you say that again? >> you were just getting coffee this morning, you had your headphones on? >> yeah. like another normal day, and now not normal. >> tell us about this area and i mean normally it's a safe place, isn't it? >> normally it is. it's funny because my parents said i was crazy for moving up here after 9/11 but i worked across the street from the empire state building for about five years now and nothing like this has ever happened. it's mayhem and there are detectives everywhere, trying to map out the crime scene as we speak. i had pictures of -- something's beeping. okay. i saw blood on the sidewalk.

it was just a very surreal scene. so yes. >> you work inside the empire state building. is that what you said? >> no, i work across the street from the empire state building. there's a chase bank and i work right across 34th and fifth avenue. >> i was going to ask but the tourists lining up to get inside the empire state building to take the elevators up to the top and then they see this terrible thing transpire. >> yeah, i mean normally people are standing in line every morning and i'm cursing the tourists that are trying to get up to the top of the empire state building. i've never actually been to the top myself, but you know, i'll never forget it. >> do you know that ten people in all were shot? >> no, wow. i only saw the woman who had been shot, on the ground, and i saw another woman getting carted away on an ambulance but i had no idea there was ten people, wow. >> well, we're glad you're safe, rebecca. >> yes, by chance i normally take the yellow line and the nrq

but this morning i took the green line and i wanted to get to work faster, so by chance i missed all this. >> thank goodness for that. rebecca fox thank you for sharing. >> pretty lucky. >> yes, pretty lucky. we're glad you're okay. thank you so much. again to recap, ten people shot outside of the empire state building in new york city. two of them are dead, one is the shooter, the alleged shooter, his body still lying near the scene, the other a young woman who happened to be in the area. mayor bloomberg, the mayor of new york city, is expected to hold a news conference in a short time, when he begins speaking of course we'll bring that to you live. we'll take a short break and be back with much more after this. hey, i love your cereal there --

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nine people were hit by bullet, by shrapnel. one innocent bystander, a young woman was killed and new york city police shot the man who allegedly wielded that shotgun. our poppy harlow is on the scene, as you might expect it's hard for us to get a big, huge live satellite truck into that area. we have liveview, like fais time on an ipad with a long day but poppy harlow is there. tell us what you know. >> reporter: you have several streets shut down in the busiest part of manhattan, 34th street, just tons and tons of police around. we know the fbi is on scene. i've spent a good portion of the past hour talking with the witness you spoke with, rebecca fox, a young 27-year-old woman from queens. she like many people were coming here to work at 9:00 a.m., works across the street from the empire state building, going to get her morning coffee and

seessehe saw hordes of people running down the street, dropping their coffee, she quickly realized there was a shooting. she saw four of the people that were shot, all together we know that at least nine or ten people were shot. she saw four of them, one was a woman sitting on the corner right in front of the hartland brewery restaurant at 34th and 5th avenue looking completely shocked, shot in the foot and she was taken away in an ambulance, rebecca saw a man on the ground whom she believes is the shooter. we cannot independently confirm it but she believes she saw the shooter, she described him as a caucasian man lying on the ground. police tried to kick him over and then he was shot and killed again, we cannot independently confirm this is the shooter. she believes it was. she also saw another man whom she believes the shooter was chasing, shot in the head and

dead, and then she saw a fourth man shot, but not killed. that is what she saw, again, blood all over the street. she did not see the face of the person she believes of the shooter. i want to emphasize this because it's new york city and there are always fears of terrorism, what law enforcement are telling us is that there is no connection, no connection to terrorism at this point. this is not anything connected to terrorism as far as they can tell. obviously they're doing checks on the suspected shooter, who is dead, but again, no connection to terrorism is believed and that's important to emphasize because i'm standing on fifth avenue, carol, looking straight down and you can see one world trade center being rebuilt and rebecca told me look it makes me think of 9/11, it wasn't that long ago where there was this chaos and confusion, she was frightened. no connection to terrorism at this point in time. we're waiting for a police press conference from new york city police, i see this man, you can

see him here, this is the deputy commissioner of the new york city police department paul brown. at this point, this is what we know. >> is the weapon still on the scene? we understand the man used a shotgun. is the weapon still on the scene or have they taken that away? >> not that we can see but i'm a half a block away from the scene. it's all roped off. we were pushed to the side by police officers so not that i have seen on the ground yet. i did see two pictures that rebecca fox witnessed so she showed them to me, one was a woman that i told you about, shot in the foot, sitting looking perplexed and shocked and terrified and i also saw another picture and in the far ground of the picture you can see the man she believes was the shooter, laying on the ground, wearing dark clothing, but no weapons on the ground that we can see yet, we have no reports

from police single, multiple weapons, what they may have been. >> of course this has happened, poppy n a tourist area, the empire state building. >> right. >> tell us how unusual it is to see a man with a shotgun running down the street shooting at people? >> reporter: look, i've lived here, carol, for 11 years. it's extraordinarily unusual. i have never heard of or seen anything like this happen in manhattan since 2001, when i moved here. this is, as we said, a very busy tourist area, when you look at the numbers, about 4 million people come to the empire state building every year, just to visit the observation deck. it's a busy commercial area, you have major businesses here, a chase bank across the street, a mcdonald's, hartland brewery restaurant on the ground floor, a starbucks, you've got a lot of commercial businesses here that would be, frankly, very busy at 9:00 a.m. in the morning so it's a very busy congested area with traffic running each way around

it, so terrifying enough that this happened, that it's in a place like this that is so crowded around the fall. >> poppy, stand by. i understand that mayor bloomberg's news conference is going to happen at 11:00, that's in about, oh, 15 or 16 minutes. of course, when mayor bloomberg begins to speak we're going to take that press conference live. i also have tony roman on the phone, a security expert and i wanted to ask you, tony, how duke the investigation is proceeding right now. th >> they send specialtyive detectives to gather expectations whether or not this was a random shooting between individuals who had a dispute, workplace dispute or whether or not it's an actual terrorist attack. terrorist attack can take the

form in separate ways. it could be a primary location or a distraction for a secondary attack at a secondary location, and that's what the intelligence unit detectives want to make a very quick determination about. >> well, we understand, tony, i'd like to interrupt you for just a second to make it clear for folks. they've made the dertermination this has nothing to do with terrorism, so this is i guess sadly what you call a meat and potatoes investigation now, right? >> well, it should be, but they're still going to keep the options open as to whether or not there was something further going on here. one of the secondary or third elements of this investigation will be to determine whether or not perhaps there's some small risk that this was an attack that would primarily be staged for determining what the police response would be, in order to plan for a future attack.

that's always on the back of the minds of the intelligence unit police officers. so even if they quickly determine that it's a random shooting, they still, as a second or third part of that investigation, will be looking at the terror aspect. >> we understand there are security cameras, surveillance cameras, all over the place, around the empire state building. i would suspect police are already busy getting those tapes into custody. >> without question. many of those cameras are actually monitored by the police department at the command and control center at 1 police plaza and at other locations. they also have radiation detectors, they also have gas detectors and a whole host of items that can protect the public in the event of future terrorist attack or a random attack such as this. as you can see, by the way, the uniformed police responded, the initial response was incredibly rapid, and that had to have

saved countless lives, because this gentleman was armed with a very dangerous weapon, a shotgun can take down a lot of people very, very quickly. >> see, you wouldn't really initially think that, that a shotgun could fire that quickly. >> yes, it can. there are various types of shotguns, semiautomatic, when you pull the trigger they automatically reload the next shotgun shell and you can fire 12, 15 rounds per minute. even a pump shotgun, which you manually have to chamber each round by taking a slide that's at the front of the barrel and pushing it back and then pushing it forward, even a trained individual or a very angry individual can put off ten rounds in a minute or perhaps more, and they don't have to be that accurate, because it sends

a wad of pellets into a pat person th pattern that widens as it gets further away from the barrel of the gun. it can take down a line of people in a crowded area like 34th street and manhattan, similar to times square, the crossroads of new york city and thank god it gets special attention from the police department. >> that's for sure. tony roman, thank you so much for joining us. we understand our reporters near the scene have spotted new york city's mayor, mayor bloomberg, so apparently he's going to hold that news conference from the scene, when that takes place, of course, we'll bring it to you live. we have to take a break. we'll be back with much more. capella university understands businesses are trying to come back from rough economic times. employees are being forced to do more with less. and the need for capable leaders is greater than ever. when you see these problems do you take a step back,

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any minute now the new york city mayor michael bloomberg will hold a news conference near the scene of a terrible crime near the empire state building in new york city. ten people in all were shot, including the shooter. the shooter shot dead by new york city police, his body still lying near the entrance to the empire state building on the fifth avenue side. another person was killed, sadly, an innocent bystander, a young woman. we don't know if that woman was a tourist or a new york city resident but we do know she was killed in this incident. eight other people were hit by

gunfire. witnesses tell us the man with the gun had a shotgun, and as you know, when shotguns fire, pellets scatter and most of the people who were hit were hit by those pellets. they had injuries in their feet, legs and buttocks. other people had more serious injuries. seven people were treated at the scene and there probably are some five to six people in the hospital today. our rose arce, our producer, was on the scene. she talked with witnesses as this man wielding that shotgun was running down the street after another man, a security officer who was in charge of the elevators inside the empire state building came running out and chased that gunman down the street. i'll let rose take it from there. >> another witness say a man ran off another man, and started

firing into the man's head. at that point people began to scream, the crowd dispersed and an elevator man from inside the empire state building came rushing out and actually pursued the guy with the gun and was calling for help, alerted the police, who aparentally were inside, who then chased after the gunman, and caught him right in front of the empire state building tourist entrance, shot him, people say three times, the body is still laying on the ground outside of the entrance. >> i was talking to a security expert, he said that security man's actions were heroic but probably not advisable, but witnesses say that man probably saved countless lives because he slowed the gunman down. new york state police are always around the empire state building, since 9/11. police probably have surveillance tapes in their

custody right now and maybe they're looking at them as we speak. we do know the suspect's body is still lying near the entrance. police have been taking pictures. his body is now covered with a white sheet. we don't know about the other victim's body. we have not been able to locate that body as of yet. we understand that the white house has been informed of this shooti shooting, we don't know if the president is expected to make a statement. mayor bloomberg is expected to conduct a news conference in six minutes. poppy harlow is on the scene on fifth avenue. poppy, what do you see? >> reporter: we are waiting, carol, for a press conference here on fifth avenue right in front of the empire state building, i believe you're looking at shots of that. what i can tell you is since we last spoke new york city police commissioner ray kelly along with new york mayor mike bloomberg went into a nearby building to be briefed. i spoke briefly on the phone with the deputy commissioner, the man right under ray kelly,

the deputy commissioner of the new york city police department, mr. paul brown, i asked if he had a moment to speak. he said we don't right now, getting ready for an 11:00 a.m. press conference. we'll hear the latest from him, from the commissioner and the mayor. i can tell you 9:30 a.m. approximately president obama was briefed on this by john brennan so we know the president is aware. look, this is new york city and a place where they take extra precaution given past events and given, carol, the fact that this is an incredibly busy commercial part of the city, it's right in midtown, the heart of manhattan, full of offices, commercial business, also a major tourist attraction, about 4 million people visit the observation deck of the empire state building every single year. so you've got to believe that this morning it was filled with not only people going to work at 9:00 a.m., the height of rush hour but also tourists and as you know, we spoke with one of the witnesses who saw what

happened, saw the shooting, rebecca fox, the 27-year-old from queens. she was terrified, didn't know what to make of it. she described the scene to me, people running in every direction, coffee cups strewn on the ground, right by a mcdonald's and starbucks and a local restaurant, blood on the sidewalk. lot of that was cleaned up by the time we got here but again it's hard for us to see exactly onto the street because police are keeping us about a half a block away, carol. >> it's sad that this shooting happens on the heels of the sikh shooting in wisconsin and the shooting in the theater in aurora. >> reporter: right. >> i'm sure mayor bloomberg will mention both when he holds his news conference and as you said the president of the united states has also been informed and maybe he'll say something we don't know. i'm sure maybe mitt romney will say something, too, we don't know. we are sure that mayor bloomberg will hold that news conference in just about four minutes. we're going oto take a break.

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