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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  August 22, 2013 8:00pm-9:00pm EDT

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with a field trip to facebook where they met cheryl sand burg. >> this is creating opportunities for the girl i was 20, 30, 40 years ago and making the future different. >> reporter: a future one woman is determined to make better. for "out front" dan simon, cnn, oakland, california. >> ac 360 starts now. erin, thanks. good evening everyone. tonight prepare to laugh, cry and be inspired by a woman. my interview with antoinette tuff, who lovingly persuaded a mass kill tore give himself up in a school. she saved countless number of lives of kids and police officers and feels compassion for the man that could have killed her. in fact, she tells me she wants to maintain a connection with him. my in de-depth conversation wit her and her face-to-face meeting with the calm, cool 911 operator
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that helped her save the day. >> how are you? >> how are you doing? >> oh, god. >> we made it. >> we did. oh my god. >> made it they did. both ends, the most remarkable 911 call we heard. emergency operator and bookkeeper at the discovery mcnair learning academy outside atlanta. together they prevent add likely massacre with kendra relying messages to police on the scene, antoinette with the gunman who fired off half a dozen shots and had enough ammunition to kill hundreds. he said he was off his medication, he wanted to die and ready to kill. calmly, sensitively, and compassion etly antoinette tuff persuaded him to surrenderer to police. >> they are coming, so just hang on michael. go ahead and lay down. don't put your phone -- okay.
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you just got your phone? that's fine. tell them to come on, come on. okay. he just got his phone. that's all he got is his phone. >> do not move, stay on the ground. stop moving. >> it's just him. >> stay on the ground. we've got him. we've got him. we've got him right now. >> okay. hello? >> yes. >> i'm tell you something, baby, i've never been so scared in all the days in my life. >> me, either, but you did great. >> oh, jesus. >> you did great. >> oh, god. >> oh, god, indeed. antoinette talks a lot about faith tonight because that faith saw her through. fbi hostage negotiator chris voss calls her performance under such pressure is amazing. president obama called her just before she sat down with me tonight. i've been looking forward to meeting her since i heard that remarkable tape and i'm pleased to introduce antoinette and shortly kendra to all of you.
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it's extraordinary to hear this tape and there is such an outpouring of people saying how amazing you are. i think you're incredibly heroic and that's that gets thoern around a lot but you saved people's lives. how did you remain so calm throughout this? >> i was actually praying on the inside. i was terrified, but i just started praying. knowing that if i got as hysterical as i was on the inside, outside he would panic. >> so inside you were heretic? >> i was on the inside. >> we hear that at the end, once it's finally over this flood of emotion comes out. >> yes, because then i knew -- i knew they had captured him so i knew at that point in time i could actually take a breather. >> i've heard you say that your
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pastor talked about being anchored in the lord. is that something that got you through? >> yes, he had just started this actual series that sunday on being anchored, and i had told my -- i had told myself monday morning that i was going to get up and start studying that morning. so i studied monday morning, and i also studied on tuesday. and he had been talking about how you anchored yourself, not actually allowing life cares of the world to overwhelm you but allowing yourself to be anchored. >> so means to be rooted. >> rooted and grounded in the would and that allow the situations you're in indicate your actions. >> that was a good timing of that sermon. >> very good timing. >> i want us to start -- i want to play some of the 911 recordings and get your thoughts on them. this first excerpt we'll play is when the gunman has basically first entered the room. let's listen. >> okay. i'm in the front office. he just went outside and started
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shooting. >> okay. >> oh, can i run? >> can you get somewhere safe? >> yeah, i got to go -- no, he going to see me running. he coming back. oh, hold on. >> put the phone down. >> bye. okay. she said that she's getting the police now to tell them to back off for you. okay? okay. okay. stop all movement now on the ground. stop all movement on the ground. >> what's it like to hear that? >> realizing how terrified i was, and that was not his actual first entrance in the building. he had been in the building for a minute by the time that actual incident happened. he had already shot before that. >> he left the office you were in -- we heard those shots
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firing and he came back in. >> that was his second time shooting. >> second time shooting. >> yes, he actually shot the first time in the office with me. >> when that first time when he shot, i mean, did you think this could be it? >> well, what he did is he actually took the shot to allow me and the other person that was in there to know that this was not a game and that he was not playing and that he was for serious. so i knew then that it was not for -- i knew then it was for real, and that i could lose my life. so. >> how did he appear to you? did he seem -- when you first saw him, he's got this ak-47, how did he seem? was the look in his eyes? >> like he didn't care, and he made it clear to me multiple times that he didn't care. he knew that he was going to die that day, and he came in purposely knowing that he was going to die and take lives with him. so he let me know that from the minute that he entered the building. >> and when somebody says that
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to you who is heavily armed, later we now know he had almost 500 rounds of am ammunition with him, what did you do? did you think? >> when he said that, i actually was like okay and so i just kind of started really getting afraid when he actually shot -- shot the gun because at first i was like maybe he's just playing. but when he shot the gun and then pointed the gun up to us, you know, up towards the -- to allow us to know and made gestures with the gun, then i knew he wasn't playing. so at that point in time i just started praying on the inside. >> were you afraid he was going to go in classrooms, go after the kid sns. >> well, he did actually go to the door. he went to the door leading up to when the first person actually left out, he told them to go and let everybody know that this was not a drill, that this was for real. when that person went out, other people went out with her because they didn't -- he didn't know that other people was in the -- there was another room around
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the corner and he didn't know people was there. so he started seeing all this movement and he actually went to that door with the gun drawn to start shooting, and the media person was there and he looked him dead in his face and started drawing his gun up. so then i started talking to him saying come back in. just stay in here with me. don't go anywhere. stay in here. you know, it's going to be okay. don't worry about anybody out there. you told her to go and do that, so she's doing what you told her to do. i started talking to him and all that. but he was unracial tional at t time because he was agitated. >> we hear in the 911 call at one point he's talking about wanting to shoot police officers, and i want to play that part. >> he said to tell them to back off, he doesn't want the kids, he wants the police. so back off and what else, sir? he said he don't care if he die
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and he don't have nothing to live for, and he said he's not mentally stable. >> i mean, that's the last thing you want to hear somebody say when they are armed to the teeth like that. he talked about saying he should have gone to a mental hospital, that he was off his medication. >> correct. >> did that make you even more worried about who you're dealing with? >> yeah, because by the time he made that statement, he had already fired all of his rounds in his gun for the first time, and i didn't know what was in the book bag at that time, but he had then got the book bag and was filling up the magazines in front of me. >> so he was reloading? >> he reloaded every magazine he had in the book bag and put them all in his pockets. >> i was amazed, too, how kind you were to him, and how compassion et you were to him. is that something you really felt? >> yes, it was. i -- at one point i just started
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feeling sorry for him. i -- when he got to telling me that he wasn't on his medicine and everything that was going on with him and all that, i real he begin to feel sorry for him. i knew that where he was at mentally was not a good place, but i knew he was there for -- for whatever particular reason it was in life, and he started talking to me and telling me that, you know, he wasn't on his medicine. he should have went to the hospital, and, you know, he hasn't taken his medicine in awhile. so i knew i wasn't actually speaking to someone that was in their right state of mind. >> i want to play that portion. >> it's going to be all right, sweetie, i just want you to know i love you, though, okay? i'm proud of you. that's a good thing you giving up. don't worry about that. we all go through something in life. you don't want that. you know, i tried to commit suicide last year after my husband left me. but look at me now, i'm still
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working and everything is okay. >> it seems that really connected with him. i mean, you're willingness to share personal details of your own life really made an impact on him. >> yes, by that time he had actually called one of his family members, and he was talking to them, and then they was telling him some things and things like that, what was going on. so i knew that -- i knew how he felt. i had been in that situation. i had been in that devastating moment when all of the things happened to me. so i knew that that could have been my story, but because of god's grace and mercy it wasn't, and i knew that i could help somebody, somebody -- god sent people, my pastor and people and friends and family in my path to help me through, and i knew at that point in time that he needed me, and i was the only person there. so i just wanted to be able to
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allow him to know that there was some hope, and that even though what seemed to be devastating for me then, look at me now i just opened up a brand new business, you know, god had brought me back from what seemed to be hopeless to hope. i just, you know, did a grand opening. opened up a motor coach company and travel agency and getting ready to do non-profit kids on the move for success. i looked at all of that to know if i don't allow him to see what we do, it would be hopeless for him also. >> we'll be playing this interview for most of the hour because of the in a news we focus on the negative and so many people say they want to hear positive things when they happen. i just think this woman is extraordinary and has a message that all of us, all of us need to hear in these difficult times. we're also going to play the moment when antoinette meets the voice on the other end of the
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911 call, the operator that reunites them for the first time. that's on 360, next. every day we're working to be an even better company - and to keep our commitments. and we've made a big commitment to america. bp supports nearly 250,000 jobs here. through all of our energy operations, we invest more in the u.s. than any other place in the world. in fact, we've invested over $55 billion here
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she said she was scared inside praying on the inside, she and the 911 operator were partners in preventing a mass cure at the school where antoinette works. the interview left me with a lump in my throat more than once and a smile on my face. antoinette has that effect on people. sometimes people say things just to convince somebody, but i feel like you really believe it and that is authentic and your belief and i think it made a big difference. >> yes, it did. i believed it from the heart. that's something we were taught in our ministry and i owe that to my pastor. he has actually trained us. we've had classes and he sits down and teaches us, you know, how to deal with people and how to deal in desperate situations and pray and we practice that at church. so really in reality all i was doing was carrying out what i'm taught every sunday and wednesday. >> do you still feel compassion
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for him? do you still feel sorry for this man? >> i really do. i would like to go back and visit him. >> you would like to maintain contact? >> yeah, i would. i would like to go back and contact him and see how he's doing. i mean, not end the relationship there. i know it's beyond what he sees. he's a hurting soul, so anyway i can help him and help him get on the right path, god gives us all a purpose in life and i believe he has he has a destiny for that young man. >> i want you on my speed dial. when i'm down i want to talk to you. you're great. >> thank you. >> i want you to call me sweetie and tell me everything will be okay. >> it's going to be okay. >> i want a ring tone with you saying sweetie, everything is going to be okay. and it is. >> it is. >> i've learned that through everything i've been through.
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i was actually telling god that even though it seemed like i've been through he lll and back, i promised him december the 31st, sitting in that seat in that place, right? >> correct. >> that's just extraordinary that it just happened to be you. >> right, matter of fact, we just had someone hired in that position, and really by the time he came in, i would have been really leaving that seat to go back to my desk, but i was
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actually late getting up there to relief her because i got devastating news myself, and i had set at my desk for about ten minutes trying to not get overwhelmed by the news that i just got, and so it made me late to relief her, and so then i -- i'm sorry. >> it's okay. >> i got there late because i was actually, you know, meant -- the news that i got was devastating, and i know god had me to be late to get that news
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and to put all that aside that i just got to be able to help that young man because if i had got there at the time i was supposed to get there and actually leave the time that i was supposed to leave, she would have been there, and i would not have been there. i would have been -- relieved her and been back at my desk. >> do you know you were capable of this? we are all tested at times and you never know how you'll react. some people that think they can rise to the occasion fall. some people that think they would run rise up and are strong in ways they never anticipated. did you know you would be able to be this person? >> no, i didn't even know i had it in me. no, somebody would have told me i was going to be doing that that day, i wouldn't have believed it. didn't know it was in me but god has a way to show you it's in you. >> you must feel like anything
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moving forward, you can do anything. i mean, i believe you can do anything. i mean, given -- you have been through not only in your own life and personal things devastation but this situation. i mean, you've survived unimaginable things. >> yes, i have this new thing that i say to myself, it's called push past the pain. my pastor's wife did that teaching in a women's ministry last year, and she titled the message push past the pain in spite of whatever phase you may go through in life, just continue to push, and so every time things come on i always say to myself push past the pain. it's going to be okay. so i know today no matter what, i can push past the pain. >> you have given me so many things to write down that i'm going to tell myself in the years ahead, push past the pain. >> you got bag he had
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another bag so he had bullets inside the book bag and bullets in another bag. three magazines, changed the magazines, bullets in his pockets, pants pockets -- you know, jacket pockets. he had bullets everywhere on top of magazines. so i knew when he made that last call that he was going to go. because he had loaded up to go.
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>> when you were talking to the 911 operator, did her calmness give you strength, as well? >> she was talking but to be pe out where he was at at all times. have you talked to that 911 operator since?
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>> no, i haven't but she was real calm though. that probably helped me because she was really calm. i don't remember. it was devastating. i don't remember her name. i think she said it, though, but i don't remember. >> her name is kendra mccray. >> oh. >> and i have someone i want you to meet. >> okay. >> come on in. >> this is kendra mccray. >> great. how are yes.
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was calm talking a gunman to lay down his weapon and expressed concern about his feelings. having met her, i'm no longer surprised by that.
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during the entire ordeal her link was kendra mccray. tonight these two women met face-to-face for the first time. back with our 360 exclusive interview. kendra, what do you think of the job antoinette did? >> she is a true hero. i say that she missed her calling. she should have been a counselor or something. you did so great. >> thank you. >> i've never had a call where the caller was so calm and so confident in what you were saying and so personable. it was great -- >> thank you. >> you did a great job. you made my job a lot truly
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tell you i was terrified inside. >> and yet, talking to you, it didn't sound like you -- that she was terrified. i was amazed how calm she was. >> she was very calm, and myself the same. i was terrified. coming on that line and hearing those gunshots and you asking me those questions, should you run and -- >> yeah. >> my hands are shaking so bad but -- >> i have such respect for 911 operators. because you-all have to remain calm and the stuff that you never know what will be on the other end of that line. >> exactly. >> you never know when you pick up the phone what the situation will be. >> exactly. >> i want to play a little bit more from the 911 record sglg we not going to hate you, baby. it's a good thing you giving up. so we not going to hate you. >> ma'am, you're doing a great
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job. >> so let's do it before the did you know what to say to him? how did you know the right things to say? >> well, to be honest with you, i didn't. while i was there and she was talking to me and he was saying things to me, i was just praying to the inside of myself saying god, what do i say now? do i do now? open hallway
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and he had already had all the ammunitions on him. >> and he would go to the kids. >> he would go straight to the kids because he already went out that door a couple times so i knew that. >> are you typing all this information and it's going to police? >> yes, i'm -- every word that she gave me, every demand, every request, i was trying to get it in as quickly as possible and remain calm for her. >> that's important for an operator to remain calm for the person on the other end? >> yes, if i'm calm, she's calm. if i'm hysterical, she's hysterical. >> you don't have eyes on the scene, so you're hearing everything through antoinette and sending messages to police, but you're not exactly sure of where the police location or what they are doing or interpreting the message. >> in this situation, it felt like i was there, like i could visualize what she was seeing and going through.
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it's like i could see the gunman right there at the door. she said he's right here at the door and it's like i can see him through just her words. >> did he -- did he look at you a lot? i mean, did he -- was he kind of connecting with you a lot? >> not in the beginning. >> not in the beginning. >> in the beginning he wouldn't even give me his name. alle he said -- kept saying to e is i'm not on my medication. i'm not stable. i'm on probation, and he told me to tell her to call the probation officer, but he wouldn't give me the probation officer number, tell everybody to stop moving, and so in the beginning, he wasn't. so then i had to, like, say okay what am i going to do? because now he's getting agitated, and he really got agitated the last time he went out because the last time that he went out the police officer started shooting back at him, and i don't know if you remember
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i asked him could i go to the bathroom. >> i don't recall that. >> yeah, i don't know -- i don't know if i hung the phone up. >> i think you put it on hold. >> you asked him if you could go to the bathroom? >> i had to go to the bathroom so bad. >> sorry to be laughing but all the things to be in your mind at that time. >> so bad and i was just sitting there literally shaking i had to go to the bathroom so bad. >> wow. >> and -- >> is that the real reason you were shaking? >> i mean, i was just shaking so bad. and he had just went out there to shoot at the police and they were shooting back at him and the bullets was coming from everywhere and i said to him, come back in here right now, come from out there. come back in here. don't worry about it. come back in here and stay with me. we're both going to be safe because i said to him bullets don't have no name and if they shoot you they going to shoot me. come back in here, we going to work this out. so he came back in -- >> that's amazing you were encouraging him to come back into the room where you were.
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>> yeah. >> a lot of people would be happy he's out of the room you were but you said came back -- >> he was firing bullets with him and they were firing them back. i knew they were going to kill him. and i knew that he was not in his right frame of mind, and he had all those magazines on him and i know he was going to light it up. >> i want to play another part of the 911 tape where you have actually -- he's already relinkished his weapon and put it down. >> okay. she said stay right there where you are. guess -- he wants to know can he get some of his water right quick? yes, michael, you said michael hill, right? okay. guess what, michael? my last name is hill, too. you know, my mom was a hill. he said what are y'all waiting for? is taking them so long to come on. >> when you started telling him your mom's name is hill, i was like god bless you. you're having a conversation
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with him, just relating to him. >> i was and my mom's maden name is hill. >> i believe everything you said. i didn't think you were making up a word of this. i mean, i just thought -- but i just thought again it reflects on the person you are. you didn't have to in that very moment you know continue to connect with him but you really -- i just think it says a lot about the kind of person you are. >> well he started getting agitated and he got up, and i'm like okay, if they don't come on, that's why i asked are they coming because he started getting up and i'm like okay, lay down, they coming. then he said can he have sop water. i don't even think you responded back to me, i just said you can have some. >> when you said he was getting agitated, i had to put my phone on mute, hey, he's getting agitated we need to move. >> in a situation like this is everyone else in the room listening to you? >> there are still calls coming in so other people are on calls right next to me or across from
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me on different calms, not the same call i'm on. so the room is loud. we have call takers on one side and the dispatchers on the opposite side. so we have supervisors, with this situation they were back and forth trying to make sure the information got relaid from my side to the dispatch side, so they can quickly notify the police as to what i was saying. so -- >> there's one more part of the tape i want to play once the police have come in and it's all -- it all is over. let's listen. >> stay on the ground. get on the ground. stop moving. do not move. >> let me tell you something, baby, i ain't never been so scared in all the days of my life. >> me, either but you did great. you did great. >> oh, god. >> you can really hear there, i mean, the strain this put on you. >> oh, yeah.
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>> that moment when the police finally came in and he was taken out, what goes through your head? goes through your heart then? >> i realize then that they actually -- becau when they came in, they came in with guns but he told them not to come in with. so once they came in with the guns because now remember, his gun and all his weapons was not too far from him and so when he came in -- when they came in i was like okay, lord don't let him move. don't let him get up and go get that gun. and so by the time they all just swarmed around him and realized he didn't have anything because i told him to put his hands behind his back and so they would know he didn't have anything, and when i seen that police officers put they hands on him, you know, and they were all surrounding him, i knew i could just like breathe. >> and go to the bathroom. >> and go to the bathroom. i was like if i go to the
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bathroom, them bullets don't have no names on them. they going to shoot us all because ain't nobody know i'm in the bathroom. >> this is also really a teachable moment it seems to me for people, kendra, in how to respond in an emergency situation. antoinette, this tape could be played in classes in terms of how to remain calm and importance of remaining calm in an emergency. >> yes, and just being yourself and being personable with the person and simple thiezing with the person. we get a lot of calls with people in the same condition that he's in, but a different situation, and that's what we're trained to do, to sympathyize with them. in no situation would we want anyone to get hurt. that was my biggest fear. >> yes. >> well, as i said before, i think a 911 operator has such a difficult job, and i just want
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to thank you for what you did in this situation and what you do every day so thank you. >> thank you. more of our conversation next, including antoinette's reaction to a call from president obama. antoinette set up a go fund me page with proceeds going to help under privileged kids enrich their lives through travel. the web address is www.go fund me.com/41 fqvw. again, that's www go fund me.com one word, go fund me.com/41 lower case fqvw. you can find the link on our website or my twitter account at anderson cooper. we'll be back with more. right now, 7 years of music is being streamed.
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time for the 360 exclusive interview tonight. antoinette tuff learned she's a natural-born crisis counselor when a gunman stormed the school with a gun, she talked him town. the 911 operator and her met
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face-to-face and antoinette got a call from president obama. i talked about what that moment was like with her. you got a call, literally, right before you came out -- >> yes, i did. >> who called you? >> president obama. >> oh, wow. >> how was that? >> in the makeup room. awesome. oh, god, it was awesome. >> what is that like when you suddenly hear the president is on the phone? >> i was like, president obama, it's really you? you get the call and somebody tells you the president is going to call and it's the white house but when you really hear the voice you know it's the president. so it was the best voice that i could ever hear. couldn't have a better leader in place at this time. >> i appreciate you, too, i learned from the best, the best president in the world. no, that's me. you can't get any better when you got a great leader in front of you. >> what did he say to you? >> he wanted to let me know him
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and his wife and his family is very proud of what i did and everybody wanted to thank me, and they were, you know, happy and glad for what i did and that it was, you know, for me being a hero and that hopefully one day he would be able to get to meet me. so that would be -- oh, just to see his face was awesome -- to hear his voice but to see his voice would be more awesome. >> if the president wants to meet you, they will figure out a way to make that happen. >> awesome, awesome, awesome. >> that was really cool. >> that made the night. we can turn the phones now off. >> what do you think this -- the lesson of this is for people? what do you want people to take away from this? >> to know that god is real. to know that it wasn't me. it wasn't nothing that i did that was so special -- >> you don't feel you're
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special? do you not feel like you're a hero? >> no, not really. i feel like i helped somebody in need that god was able to use me, and it was an honor to be able to be used. i feel like i was in the right place, and god needed me to be there to be a vessel for him. >> it's interesting, too, even now you're talking about helping this young man, helping this man with a gun. again, i think that says something about you. >> yes. >> did you know that the kids were being evacuated during all of this? >> no. no, because what i did is he had me to get on the intercom and to let them know, you know, to get the kids -- because the time that he came in, that's how you know god was in control. the time he came in was a dismissal time for us, one of the busiest times of the school
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day. so if it had been business as usual, we would have had multiple parents, and multiple children in the front office trying to go home. and not one baby got hurt. that's an awesome part. not one baby and one adult and that was the whole key is to be able to have everybody come out safe and be able to go home to their families and know that god did it all. >> you just say to me one more time, baby everythings going to be okay. >> baby, everythings going to be okay. >> thank you so much. >> you are so welcome. you are so welcome. baby, everything is going to be okay. a reminder, antoinette mentioned her work helping under privileged kids see a world they might otherwise miss. she set up a go fund me page. www.go fund me.com/41 fqvw. the link will be on ac 360.com
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and on my twitter account. she's hoping to raise like $1500. hopefully she can raise more than that for folks wanting to donate. let's get the latest on other stories. susan hendrix has the bulletin. >> anderson, deliberations in the court marshall of admitted fort hood shooter major nadal hassan. he declined to give a closing statement. bradley manning plans to live as a woman while serving time and wants to begin hormone therapy as soon as possible. the army doesn't provide that. aaron hernandez was formally indicted today on six counts including first degree murder in the shooting death of odin lloyd. he pleaded not guilty to the charges. anderson, back to you and that inspiring woman. hanna anderson speaks about about her kidnapping. why she doesn't consider herself a victim anymore. anyone have occasional constipation,
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she wanted to clear up, people have been speculating about those 13 text messages she swapped with jim dimaggio. she wanted to clear it up and here is what she had to say. >> the phone calls weren't phone calls, they were texts because he was picking me up from cheer camp and he didn't know address or what -- like where i was. so i had to tell him address and tell him i was going to be in the gym and not in front of the school, just so he knew where to come get me. >> reporter: she also got choked up remembering her mother and her brother and having to prepare herself for the memorial that will happen here on saturday. and one other thing i want to mention to you, anderson, is i just spoke with the aunt of jim dimaggio. he says that she believes her niece, the family member asking for the dna test to be done to find out if jim dimaggio is actually the father of hanna and ethan, she thinks that niece is after the money because she's mad she's not getting the
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insurance policy jim left to hanna's paternal grandmother. another interesting twist in this very bizarre case. >> we wish hanna and her family the best. thanks very much. we'll be right back. before we. it found out the doctor we needed was at st. anne's. wiggle your toes. [ driver ] and it got his okay on treatment from miles away. it even pulled strings with the stoplights. my ambulance talks with smoke alarms and pilots and stadiums. but, of course, it's a good listener too. [ female announcer ] today cisco is connecting the internet of everything. so everything works like never before.
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--[captions by vitac -- today c swww.vitac.coming the internet of everything.

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