more and more republicans are coming out every today calling the ted cruz shutdown plan a dumb idea. it looks like republicans are finally listening to the country. >> well, before you unfurl the "mission accomplished" victory banners, let's call it like it is. nothing has changed yesterday. the government isn't reopened. the debt ceiling has not been lichted. the only thing is that president obama is finally back at the table after promising he would not negotiate and reportedly considering bills that might fundamentally change obama care. so let's see where this goes. in the crossfire tine. brian schweitzer, and -- now, for the sake of ease, gentlemen, you will be congressman, and you will be governor. i hope that's okay.

then we heard they also want to set the media talks to re -- and repeal that medical device tax, a couple other things. are democrats going to learn how to say yes at some point? >> i hope they do, but listen, a six-week delay is like kissing your sister. the markets are not going to be happy with this. the markets are going to continue to say, my god, how are the politicians going to screw it up six weeks from now? it's the full credit and faith. people can say it doesn't matter, full faith and credit. you want them to say no? >> i want them to say let's not use it as a chip. i've got ideas on how to make the government smaller. i haven't heard a lot of

congressmen with ideas on how to make the government smaller. you can't start right now, say we're going to have vacancy savings. when somebody retires, we won't replace them. do 5% or 10% of them. if you incrementally did these things, you wouldn't hurt the programs, but make government more efficient. >> obviously you haven't been listening to many of us on the house republican side. for many of us, we've been laying out repeatedly, and for people like myself. >> think about how -- we have a -- for weeks and weeks, saying i'm not talking to you guys. the fact of the matter is you look at the success of the '90s with divided government. they had to go through a shutdown dance and learn how to communicate. maybe, maybe that's what's about to happen, is the adults are

coming into the room and realizing that a divided government, there are ideas out there on both sides -- >> we have to talk. >> let's communicate. >> let's talk about the adults in the room. the president has made clear, and nothing has changed that he's not going to negotiate. >> nor should he. >> right. so he's not good to do that. he also will not negotiate on anything until the government reopens. that still remains the position. however, in the discussions -- i was not in the room today, s.e. wasn't in the room. we're just reading what's out there. my understanding is you guys have completely folded on obama care. we're not delays, we're not defunding. >> let's walk through something here. our fourth offer that was also just tabled by our belund majority leader in the senate basically was nothing but an argument for fairness. individuals earn the -- and, by the way, those ofs in congress should also -- and it was

stunning, we didn't even get a counteroffer back on that. >> and you know why. you know why, right? because this is a problem that you created, because you followed ted cruz off that plank into shutting down the government. why should democrats negotiate, reopening the government with you when they've already agreed to significant budget cuts, a budget that you wanted, and this really was just a political ploy over obama care. the american people now know that. >> a fine talking point, but it loses a lot of substance in the math. the reality is for many of us, when you're moving into another multitrillion dollar entitlement at the same time where we all agree as right and left that we have a stunning dead crisis coming at us near the end of the decade, it's the honorable thing to stand up and say we can't afford this. i'm going to bay calculator, so

far you proposed -- but continue to pay the people who aren't working. you've also suggested, it may be already if interest rates go up. let's sell freddie mac and some other real estate. that's like a guy that can't pay his debtssh so pri soon you're out of business. >> that's sort of a ridiculous statement. one of the things i've worked for is how do you do debt management? is the fact of is the matter is we're $600 brill onshort. so 16% short of spending to the revenues. houses would you cover that shortfall? >> you borrow more money. >> on the years when you have a big crop, you pay it down. on the years with the weak crop, you get the banker to help. >> and when was the last attempt to pay down the debt. >> you have to pay attention. if you've noticed, a few

trillion have turned the other way just in the last year. some is increased revenue. >> and yet the long-term fiscal outlook that was just -- >> is better. >> absolutely not. it was just published. almost a 50% worse, because the economy outlook for gdp sgrut has been cut dramatically. we hit 100% of gdp to debt in half the time. >> that's running your business looking in the rear-view miroor. >> no. that's the budgeting. if we're going to play the truth with math, and math is my thing, it's how do you tirn to the world debt markets and say we're not just going to borrow our way to prosperity. >> math works for me, too. i was governor for eight years. every single year we had surpluses, because we were able to challenge expenses, not programs. >> and a republican legislature. >> but once again you have

divided government and you talked to each other. >> we did. but you had a premise -- >> let me cut in here, guys. on that point, i've just been looking at our banners. the last one said republican surrender governor, the president is negotiating. he's been in that room a numtsds now in the past two days. the hill today called him an aloof buyer, showing up 20 minutes late comparison shopping for the best deal. this sounds like a negotiation to me, something he promised he wouldn't do. do you think he's been an effective leader? >> here's what you're missing. i was a chief executive. every legislative session there was a different dynamic. sometimes they would wag their finger and say we're not meeting with you. others times they would say we'll meet with you, but we don't want to be in front of the press. >> and wouldn't show up?

>> yes. i had -- i had members of the legislature republican leaders say we're not meeting with you. fine, you'll have to send me a bill at some point. some you work with closely, some of them here's what you do. you say congressman, have you working out? you're looking good, and i saw your wife. she's looking beautiful and your business is just soaring. >> it democrats how a bit of human connects and charm can oven bring together that gap. god bless, hopefully we're about to ask the president engage. when i hear democrats in the elevator longing for the days of bill clinton, i'm actually starting to agree. >> and i hear democrats longing for the day of newt gingrich, because there is nobody to negotiate with in the house. the last point john boehner walked away from a significant reduction deal with your managing debt. he walked away from it, as a result we lost a trillion in the

stock market, consumer confidence, and hiring was at zero. is the point here is that negotiation is very important in washington. but one side is self-inflecting wounds on this country. >> i like the re-creation of history. >> well, i was there. >> but we know from the box of that time, and if you're going to say woodward is a liar in his book, he made it very clear, it was the president that crashed the opportunity for a big deal. >> he also said boehner went missing -- >> that's not what the book says. >> i think i'm with everything. let's get the heck out of washington for a minute. >> good idea. >> governor, you passed up the opportunity to run for an open u.s. senate seat next year. after we get back, i want to ask you whether the mess in washington will make 2014 a very republican year? how much protein

does your dog food have? 18 percent? 20? new purina one true instinct has 30. active dogs crave nutrient-dense food. so we made purina one true instinct. learn more at purinaone.com rep. rokita: obamacare hurts this country much more than any government shutdown. vo: reckless. rep. blackburn: people are probably going to realize... they can live with a lot less government. vo: destructive. rep. bachmann: this is about the happiest i've seen members in a long time. vo: the government shutdown is hurting veterans, seniors, and our kids. now tea party republicans are threatening... an economic shutdown. refusing to pay our nation's bills. endangering american jobs. tell them to stand up to the tea party. enough already!

at any minute... ...you could be a victim of fraud. most people don't even know it. fraud could mean lower credit scores, higher loan rates... ...and maybe not getting the car you want. it's a problem waiting to happen. check your credit score, check your credit report, at experian.com america's number one provider of online credit reports and scores. don't take chances. go to experian.com. even when we cross our t's and dot our i's, we still run into problems. that's why liberty mutual insurance offers accident forgiveness if you qualify, and new car replacement standard with our auto policies. so call liberty mutual today. and if you switch, you could save up to $423. liberty mutual insurance. responsibility. what's your policy?

welcome back. it's day 11 of the groismt shutdown, and less than a week from the default deadline. in the "crossfire" night governor. look, guys, i see a way for us to go forward. if republicans can walk away from the negotiations with some entitlement reform, some tax reform, some spending cuts, hey, that's a win for me. do you guys see it differently? >> done deal. where do we sign up? >> well, the details matters.

>> the details matter. >> yeah. >> look, understand i believe the house is heading towards rolling out a very big tax reform. dave kavrp has been busting his back side for two we're. >> will it increase revenue? >> it would increase revenue because it will grow the economy. it's time we look away from the special lobbyist created deals in washington where they carve out their special treats in the tax code and to do something -- >> look, i don't trust you guys. the same cast of characters who carved out all those special deals for all those multinational corporations, yeah, let's see, are still in charge. when we say tax reform, we see what general electric and general motors and ford and lockheed martin want, and then we do it. this is something for the audience to get their head around. the general electrics around the world aren't big supporters of the republicans. >> i disagree with that. >> the u.s. chamber of commerce

loves those who gives them the special deals. that will have to be a bipartisan battle to say the only way out of the some es we're all walking into is massive growth. the only way to get there is dramatic change in the tax code, the regulatory code. immigration, we'll have to deal with all these things. >> meanwhile, you have a congress that is dedicated to motion masquerading as action. i can't see a damned thing that's happened here in the last year that's been good. now you saz we'll hold our breath. are you blue yet? >> governor, think about what you just said. in divided government, my side controls one third. i don't control the senate, i don't control the presidency, so i'm very happy you're willing to throw the democrats under the bus in that fashion. i'm elated i have a president willing to talk to us in the house. >> let's talk about your current strategy and whether it's been working. >> yesterday nbc/"wall street journal" came out with a new poll that showed republicans at

an all-time low in favorability. i believe that favorability was 24%. in terms of who they blame for the current government shutdown, it's republicans at a significantly higher rate margin than what republicans were blamed for in the '95-'96 shutdown. in terms of divided government, making washington work, talking to each other, will you at least admit what you have done this far has not worked? ivities actually know. nate silverman wrote an amazing article this morning. he's not a fan of my philosophy and diced it up, made it clear, the ds, democrats left need to be very careful of what they're seeing in the numbers. it's the left walking into the brutal senate year. they're the ones that have -- and if -- you've got to walk through the math. if it's a pox on all their house -- >> i don't disagree with you, but -- >> and if the president is -- >> on the generic ballot.

>> if the president is now in the mid 30s in favorability tests, particularly even worse in those senate seats that need to be defended in those states, let me -- >> wait a minute, i find -- let me just say this. finally i've heard a strategy. you put the skunk in the chicken coop. you've decided that we all have to go and get him out so there's enough smell on the democrats that they'll lose the election. >> very nicely put. >> very folksy. bizarre bus folksy. >> you've been around skunks. >> not many in arizona. >> everyone hates congress, but continues to vote for their guy. i think where this could matter is in state houses. let me ask you about montana. it's a republican-ish state. democrats have been running on this antigun message nationally. that's bad for business in montana. obama and obama care not

completely popular, but you're proof a democrat can win. what do you make of the politics? do democrats have a cans at getting the 2014 senate seat in montana? >> well, thank god we have some strategists in washington, d.c. on the republican side, because they're making it easier for democrats. >> i sense sarcasm. >> i can't understand the strategy. they did bring the democrats down with them. >> they did at a slower rate. >> but here's the problem. they're saying we want that mandate to go for one year. i signed a bit in montana that we wouldn't force the mandate until there was a legitimate public option, because i don't think you ought to force a private citizen to force it. -- >> i hate to say this. i'm starting to like you. >> some of the democrats with are sleeping with the insurance industry and the republicans are married to them. wow. >> except if you look at the

campaign contributions, they make a fortune off obama care. the really is the year is a very long term. we've all been around politics for a long time. a year from now, what will the merch experience be with the new 4e6r89 kaye law? many on the left think it would be wonderful. those on the right believe it would be a disaster. >> i'm betting they'll be -- >> but that will be the benchmark. i've got to tell you, a lot of my brothers and sisters on the left in the house, when that elevator closes, and we talk about it, that's what they're scared about. they will be judged a year from this november on the law. >> if you believe that obama care will be a complete wreck, you should have stood back -- >> no, you're absolutely wrong on that. if we did not get the information to the information voter that we were the ones opposing it, you were the ones supporting it -- >> i don't think there's any

misunderstanding. having seen some of the cross tests, it was stunning to the low information voters didn't understand that irmgts the same poll, i know s.e. said polls schmoll system -- obama care went up in approval ratele. think while you're shutting down the government. i will say there's huge disagreement over the doesn't want the government shut down. doesn't want obama care repealed. you're getting a significant amount of money from the law. governor -- senator mccain wants the republican party to move on. he campaigned all over the country and the people did not care. >> and ted cruz and rand paul. >> and mike lee. >> you're sharing it quite well.

the election as year from now, at that time, what will be the american impression of the health care law. from my view was shoved down their throats. if they love it, your side wins. if they have had the horrible experience i believe they will, they will at least know our side fought to maximize their freedom, their choice and their option. >> i had a lot of ideas for making this health care law better. my ideas for the most part were not incorporated. there are almost 40 million people that had preexisting conditions who are going to love this chance of finally having financial security because they have a child. >> in some ways you're our point. there is nothing the republicans did that touched the preexisting conditions. >> that's not true. >> it is absolutely true. >> if you take away the individual mandate, you cannot cover people -- >> one more time. the preexisting stayed in law.

and you've also seen -- let me finish. you've seen the data that says at the end of the did he go arkd how many of our brothers and sisters are still uninsured? 31 million. you're going for 44 million to the latest data says 31 million. because they screwed up the calculations on how many spouses and children will be rolled off insurance. they screwed up the math. >> i have the solution. the republicans first said they wanted to get rid of the one-year mandate for individuals. let's give it to them. let's have every member of congress who votes for it sign the fiscal note that says we understand, because we understand insurance. if you have healthy people, not enrolling and you self-select for just people with preexisting conditions, the economics of obama care will be upside down one year from now. so sign the note. that they will lose $800 billion in a single year and you're okay with it. >> that adverse election is designed into the law right now.

when the penalties done come even close to covering the cost and the adverse selection. for those of us who study to be actuaries, we look at it and eight this will crash and burn around us. and at least lay the marker down saying this will be bad. we see the numbers say it is approaching 2 trillion. when it was cast, we were promised by this president what? >> it would be revenue neutral. it would save money. the very people that gave us that number say it will cost trillions. >> who was like then? >> when you look at the numbers it will reduce the deficit. we have a health care system that already did crash and burn. we get the results worse than 36 countries around the world and we paid, i don't know. two, three times as much per patient. >> and then when 52% of health care dollars comes through government before, you know in many ways, it was government

that created the distortion in the markets. we have to go to break. i want you to stay here and i want our viewers to stay with us. we would like to you stick around and see if there is anything you two can agree on. i think there's some glimmer of hope. >> besides your last name. >> and we want all of you to weigh in on the fireback question. will there be a deal to open the question and avoid default? tweet yes or no using hash tag cross fire. dad! dad! katy perry is coming to town. can we get tickets, pleeeeease??? tickets? hmm, sure. how many? well, there's hannah, maddie, jen, sara m., sara b., sa -- whoa, whoa. hold on. (under his breath) here it comes... we can't forget about your older sister! thank you, thank you, thank you! seriously? what? i get 2x the thankyou points on each ticket. can i come? yep. the citi thankyou preferred card. now earn 2x the points on

entertainment and dining out, with no annual fee. to apply, go to citi.com/thankyoucards okay, who helps you focus on your recovery? yo, yo, yo. aflac. wow. [ under his breath ] that was horrible. pays you cash when you're sick or hurt? [ japanese accent ] aflac. love it. [ under his breath ] hate it. helps you focus on getting back to normal? [ as a southern belle ] aflac. [ as a cowboy ] aflac. [ sassily ] aflac. uh huh. [ under his breath ] i am so fired. you're on in 5, duck. [ male announcer ] when you're sick or hurt, aflac pays you cash. find out more at aflac.com.

we're back with the governor and the congressman. let's call a cease fire. is there anything that you two can agree on? >> i'm going to go with a couple things. one as from federal and state side. your medicaid dollars and an agreement that we're never going on use the word default again. because we're not going to walk up to that. we're going to find some way to make this work. >> agreed? >> not exactly. >> oh, shoot. >> stealing the love. that ceiling should never be negotiated. you shnl mess with the markets and i think we can agree on that. the block gran, it works. if you give full flexibility to the states. i propose to have not just medicaid but send me all federal dollars that you're spending. let me put together a single payer system. i can deliver that health care for half price and the money

that is sent by the federal government will be able to take care of the other half. >> i don't know that it becomes a single payer system. i would love to get the states that flexibility. i know in arizona, we can touch so many more lives if would you let us control those federal dollars. >> you have to like that. >> a for profit health insurance system is not working in the united states. we would have five times as many procedures per patient. have a poorer outcome. it is not working. >> by adding individual choice and the right incentives, you deal with that. >> you don't like obama care, come one something. >> thanks to the attempt. to go facebook or twitter to weigh in on our fireback question. will there be a deal to open the government and avoid default? 48% of you say yes. 52% say no.