poster, and miles described taking a road trip with a group of young people to bedroomingham, alabama to participates in a demonstration, and they saw one of these billboards on the hyperand then martin lugedder king and the commune training school and then they saw a second one and as the third one loomed up one offed the kids turned to miles and said that's the dumbestty. it doesn't tell you who to call. so you think here what the white citizens council trying to discredit king and all they were doing was promoting communism. that the feeling i had there. ...

>> you could go to an oil rig and find five workers sitting round trying to read, trying to write their own stories. what an exciting kind of extraordinary thing. i think learning should go from okayed toll grave. i think it's one of the crazy emings about our educational one hof young learn and then what, go on automatic pilot? that's nutty. so i did admire that and i do admire >> i did admire that. i don't find that objectionable. >> host: we have another question from the audience is.

>> i am from cleveland ohio. my question is educational that piggybacked on the question asked previously. you sort of answered by a one to elaborate but given the importance of teachers schools are only as good as the teachers what your thoughts and how we can recruit, retain and support good teachers and the other side of the coin, a teachers who don't believe children can learn or are discouraging or tend to maintain a system that we have what your thoughts on how you handle that? >> are you a teacher? >> no way former school board member i had to do with no child left behind to get history back into the curriculum and culture and arts it is reading and arithmetic and not much else and it kills a student's

interest in learning. >> you make so many good points. missing history, we're missing scions you know, we're missing geography national geographic did a survey of 18 through 25 year-old american kids and ask them to find a certain countries 80 percent and a fine iraq or publicizes israel 40% could not find great britain and 10% could not find in the united states. that makes you laugh but the problem is as bernadine often says that it should be a rule we cannot bomb a country that we cannot find on the map. [laughter] >> i think it is huge an important question the problem around controlling metaphors is we have bought into the idea, for example, that teach for america that type of program alternative certification is the way to go. i cannot defend the status quo

because we do a poor job but the ideas of all we need to fix the schools is a smart kid from columbia who gets two months of training who goes into the worst school of america and believes in two years is not a model for success. we need to invest in teachers with higher pay, recognition of the actual work they do which is backbreaking, a mind bending, they work six hours, forget about it they work 24/7 four months and months. we need to pay more. we need to create schools that teachers wanted to tease by recognizing their intelligence and allow them to flourish but rather than teach them like a bureaucrat in a factory.

those are broad and i should make a distinction as i did earlier. that kids are fantastic, to a person they're wonderful people is justice system and the theory of change strikes me as wrong in terms of teachers as they exist coming here i want to say there is a metaphoric shift whenever john mccain stood up as he often did in the campaign to say we have to get the lazy incompetent teachers of the classroom all of us felt ourselves nodding. what my going to say? no they must day? of my granddaughter to have the lazy teacher. he framed the issue of fisa first and said every kid in an american public school deserves an intellectual grounded curious morally committed well-paid well rested teacher i would get approval to. the question is how do we

frame it? most people that and are in the chicago public schools are fantastic they work in systems that undermine their ability they do not recognize their intelligence or talents or do not give them the kinds of opportunities to talk to one another, work with parents that allow them to be more successful. we need to change structures much more than we need to change the people. >> host: texas plea go-ahead with your question for bill ayers. >> caller: whether the three or four important things for teachers to do too be assured that the students are learning? >> guest: i missed it. >> host: three or four most important things for a teacher to teach their student or be with their students in a classroom to when it is a huge question but simply i would say the intellectual challenge

of teaching and ethical challenges to see your students as three-dimensional creatures like yourself with a heart, mind, spirit, aspiratio ns, goals taken into account. that is not easily done in a system that reduces kids to deficits and thrives of a toxic cabot of labeling. they are 80 h. d., adjusted endless swarm of labels but that does not get the part of the one and only. your job is to look through that confetti and see the actual human being before you. challenge number one. challenge number two, led to create an environment that is the deep enough and rich enough and wide enough so every child can find something familiar and stretch toward it. it is huge it is under taught

in education and ignored often. if you go into a room and i do all the time were they desperately want the kids to read a book the room at is still littered with no books or magazines or words or time to write you run the environment against your goals for relentless as a young teacher 20 years old use to take my kids to the detroit metropolitan airport and would have nothing in mind but watch the planes take off. we would get there before securities and before the airport turned into a mall. their book at concourse a and what would they do? exactly. they would run because a five year-old sees a call like that will run down the hall program would chase after them than the next time we $1 give them sketchbooks and explained they

cannot run and give them a m&m's and if they stayed together. we got there and they ran. why? [laughter] because the environment trump to the less in. we do not pay attention to that but it is true. the environment tells you to read or cooperate. the environment tells you to be a good citizen or not. so all of this dividing and ranking kids is creates the condition to teach cooperative lee is a loser. creating an environment is a huge. and linking teaching to the wider world other is no way teaching could exist in a vacuum. we have to open our eyes to a wider world and participate in it. students should learn to read and write in history and charter free and the rest but to create the environment, create a culture

of curiosity, a culture of learning goes a long way toward that goal. >> host: a little more than halfway through of "in-depth" with bill ayers real take a short break fly from chicago with a studio audience and we will be back with calls and questions from the audience. >> when i arrived here and went looking for your office somebody said you are easy to find because of the things are attached to your door. shows my interest is eclectic and ever-changing. 1/2 pence, as things strike my attention eventually this fall will be covered by clippings

and things that i think are worth sharing my students who are waiting for office hours we'll set out here and i figure i will give them a political education. some of it is personal this is one of my sons play said juilliard he is a playwright. then what happens is the wall grows with martin luther king with a powerful quote from me, 1967, as the wall grows at some point* somebody complains the then said dean says the wall does not belong to meet the door does put the ball is the public square then i have to take everything down so i take everything down and it starts over. i am the education professor

so i have to have the chalkboard i must remember to be cheerful and obedient rich and over and over. >> i was in the merchant marines 1964. i dropped out of michigan and chose the merger remains that is my identity card. >> these are my three kids who are now all grown at a teacher in oakland california now, fed is him at eight years old he is now a playwright and a teacher at columbia university and he is an author and first-year law student at yale. >> this is my play right to son and his wife and she is a novelist. and a poet. >> it is crowded because i have been here 20 years. these are my three kids. that is our place in california that i mentioned. that is us.

about 12 years ago. >> several of my students have published books. of borders and dreams was a day dissertation of her doctorate. these shows are actually for my research class because they teach glasses and qualitative for a narrative research and one of the things we do is we read a lot of examples of qualitative for interpretive research and try to see what other people have done. for example, this is a tremendous book about street vendors in new york city and then they hang out with these guys. that is the cover of a book that i edited and maxine was my a mentor at teachers college at columbia university.

a book i just found is the high school slang dictionary my brother who just retired as an english teacher put together year after year and it is a very, very smart book about language and the plasticity of language the opening word and of the final word. the best thing i have never done is to raise three extraordinary kids. the most fun i have these days is taking care of my grandchildren. >> you have any pictures? >> guest: i have lots of pictures. there is one, there is one. that gives me a lot to do. also, also like to take care of my granddaughter's it is

not only personally satisfying and wonderful to watch the kids grow up and their minds work and for them to make the connection what we take for granted and to have them look at the world in a different way but it is useful. my son and daughter-in-law are extraordinarily hard-working themselves and both artists and both in the early parts of their projects and work so actually i think it is of some use. what do one to when you were 65? >> guest: to be with you. i feel that i m.

>> this summer, book tv is asking, what are you reading? >> the books i >> the books i would have pulled out if you ask what a reading now are two or three graphic novels, one book is a graphic and memoir issue is famous been at subcultures because she has had an online comic strip for years called dikes to watch out for. she is a funny, a feisty

irreverent insurgent kind of art is. she spent many years working on a memoir and it is of her true story growing up and coming out as a lesbian. her parents were english teachers so it is a very literary the lens through which she refracts of her work a very literary less. hand as she comes out as the adolescent she learns of her father is a repressed homosexual and as she makes that discovery he kills himself. it is a powerful, a poignant, funny an incredibly moving book. alice sen is one of my favorite current writers, authors, artists and another book is a graphic memoir of the iranian

revolution. the author is an iranian french woman and it is an extraordinary book with a very different style and coming of age at a time of repression and autocracy and a theological or theocratic nightmare in her country and to flee to france and as all of the adolescents tropes of falling in love, discovering your body and the rest of it but told against the backdrop of this gigantic historic moment. a very moving book and shows you both books together show you the great flexibility of this medium and the great things you can do with comex which i don't pretend to be an expert. taught comex for a long time i have written a comic. it is a terrific medium and reaches to all corners of the

world that other literature does not. >> wolf plants are what will you be reading this summer? >> i have the books beginning with the emperor's new clothes. and a very well-known washington lawyer yet was very much involved many years ago with watergate the 9/11 commission, and i want to get through this book because i think he will have good stories to tell about what is going on here in washington over the past several decades.

the second book entitled house of cards. this is a book that it basically tells the story of how they collapse on wall street occurred, what was going on in. i had him on my show, he is more i have read parts already but i want to really get through it as a result by have heard directly from william crowe and. there's a book called myths, illusions and peace. the author is now working in the obama administration and on iran and the:op there is that the institute for near east policy is. he used to work with me so i am interested in what these two guys have to say about the arab-israeli conflict. that is another book i will go through. another book is entitled of

the inheritance. having read him four years in "the new york times" and know what a terrific record your he is and he is now put together an important book on what the president of the united states has basically inherited. he has been on my show, he is smart and i think this will be an important book for our will learn something. the one piece of fiction i 12 to read this summer, i want to read others but definitely the new book a mad desire to dance because he is such a terrific writer brac oe you rights is so important for our was moved by what he said when he spoke openly about having lost his foundation with so much money in the bernie madoff uproar and fiasco. he was so smart and has lost millions but this is the book obviously that continues what

he has been writing about the holocaust for our want to get through this book if i can this summer. of those of the five books i plan i hope to get through them all and star on some more. >> host: you are a busy man. where do you do your reading? >> guest: i tried to read before i go to sleep, i try to read on the weekends i just go out on my deck in the backyard especially if the weather is good. i am busy i do not have a lot of time to do fun reading but you make time. it is important. i really do appreciate books 57 wolf pulitzer thank you very much. information, visit our web site at book tv.org.

>> and we >> we are back live from chicago with this month's "in-depth" program bill ayers has been our guest of the last two hours reno joined by one of his co-authors, bernadine dohrn the most recent book they have co-authored is "race course" against white supremacy" this is the book. but first of a little bit about bernadine dohrn how did you get your nickname? who. [laughter] >> some columnist 1970 when we first became fugitives came up with that idea. it was unusual to have women leaders of national and political organizations so you have to reach around in history and find someone.

>> host: what was your role with the weather underground? >> the national leader from 1968 through 1970 and then the weather and a ground i was the team of people that decided cannot show up for a court date and to create an underground. >> host: was that scary when a court date came and went and you weren't there? >> guest: it was not scary but a relief. we were in a situation in 1961 those of you from chicago will remember that bell level of tension and hostility and violence between the chicago police department and political activist had reached a level we could have only imagine and the assassination of fred hampton, mark

clark, the fbi and chicago police department we now know but covered up by the city and re-enacted as if they have provoked the attack and assassination in. constant a rest of white radicals really for a lot of new since the events. massive demonstrations against the war which by then who knew it would go on five more years? but about 1,000 people per day were being killed in the southeast asia. though bubble polarization, the militancy and resistance was the normans and in that framework, once we dropped out and changed our name and just tried not to be caught and regroup it was a relief to be outside of that bernadine dohrn where did you grow up bernadine dohrn? >> guest: chicago, my home town. the northside. then my parents moved to

milwaukee i graduated from high school in milwaukee and it is my 50th reunion year for high school that is the ones you have got to go to. i had a wonderful childhood, not money come i am the first person in my family to go to college. my parents had a high school education. my mom was my dad secretary. she was orphaned as a child and passed around. she lived into her 90s, my dad lived until 94. he was born about ninth and 14th street. in my later life i drove him by the house and said this is weird jane addams or as if i was telling him something and he said i came here every day after school. my sister and i grew up in a

loving household they consider themselves a mixed marriage because my dad was jewish, my mom was swedish the families were not happy but they have a good marriage. they wanted better for their daughters. >> host: how did you get involved with a student activism and the anti-war movement? >> guest: i watched part of "race course" you will see there is a story of my looking at tv and images in the newspaper from my safety and security of the all white high-school in milwaukee and thinking something is going on out here. then when he was lynch and he was my age, seven youngsters trying to get into school in little rock and they are my age. something is going on i felt very far away but i knew there was a world i wanted to get to. it took me awhile but right

when i started law school dr. king came to chicago and i will not miss this. so i volunteered with his lawyer team and pretty soon i found myself on the west side trying to desegregate chicago housing and bring the housing that was there up to code. i wore little are banned that said lawyer. i was a second year law student by then come up pretty ignorant of the world. it was a big teaching and i opening experience. >> host: when did you graduate? said the practice? >> guest: university of chicago, graduated 57, there were only six women and a loss gall not one at single person of color. and every single guy in my class who included