this negative louisiana could haveaid we wanted to die in prison. we don't want him to be free again. they could have said that is a fair measure of punishment. fair measure of punishment. that is justice i will never forget that the gentleman is pain and suffering and i will always knothat act on december 5th, 1965 for ever separated me in a very real way from humanity that you are never

the same, you never truly become part of man against collectively if there will always be something that separates me from you and i understand that and that is a tragedy that i will carry to my grave and it's a shame because it was something that i did. >> the final thing i would like to say in terms of coping that one day we can be rid of the death penalty in this country is we have been obsessed with it and ambivalent about it since the founding of the country. and as we light on page 18 american history in the essays collected in the federalist papers alice alexander hamilton argues for ratifying the american constitution, which was not a forene conclusion in 1788. he warned american law would be

harsh unless the president had the power to pardon criminals. amana see dicta that pardoning should be as little as possible fettered or in paris he reasoned the criminal country texas much necessary to the to severity without easy access to exhibition in favor of fortunate guilt justice what we're accotants to sanguinary and cruel. so hamiltons argue reflected the constitutional need for reason and mercy and if you don't have that you have contempt. the last thing i would say and think you for being patient the two arguments against the death penalty that resonape with me, one is secular and one is

religious. how do you show killing is wrong by killi someone? i would call that theecular argument. and the other is the religious argument if christ died to win forgiveness for sens who are we not to forget and those are the o arguments that stay with me. so if anybody has any questions we are happy to certainly answer the questions or if you would like to get some wine we did bringome cookies because i understood there will be children although i love cookies myself. [laughter] i do know that other people have enjoyed cookies so please, feel free. these are really heavy and disturbing issues and i think in writing the book probably the worst moment i have is discovering there are some people that actually believed

the byzantine leaves condemned allied to underand a horrifying way what has taken place. i have a 99-year-old cousin, bless her heart, graduated from louisiana, and she sys up with everything. she is still very much mentally with us. who was so disturbed by that that i basically have not discussed anything else from this book with her because it was horrifying. >> not only are we ting questions butf ybody would like to make a point. >> pro or con. >> you talk about something of was the sociological aspect and things haveeen written but i still have a question when you coider the extraordinary number opeople on death row,

people are poor and minorities do you eel that there is an element in the death penalty in this country? >> this book deals with -- there were so many issues we coun't go into, defitely racism in the death penalty. and there is a case billcan talk about, the gouarec charles brooks, colin clark. >> charles brooks was the first person executed in this country in '82 by lethl injection by the state of texas. and in his case there were both of these gentlemen talking about the parties will go, both of these gentlemen committed a robbery in which a victim was killed and the prosecutors never knew which one of theactually fired the fatal shot that killed the victim. and so, brooks, who was black gold the death sentence.

his partner, woody, received a life sentence. he was white. we would later say and so many people believe he actually fired the fatal shot and in fact the district attorney who prosecuted brooks went before the texas board of pardons and a gentleman named jack strickland i believe from karen county in fort worth went before the board of pardons and said t this day ty don't know who actually fired the fatal shot. brooks had an appeal before the fifth circuit of appeals the issue in that case was that it was never established which one of them actually fired the fatal shot until this issue could be resolved in his execution should not be carried out.

and the courof appeals rejected that issue and said it had little constitutional merit and they allowed the execution to be carried out. in the meantime in louisiana, colin clari was seeking to be by his own request the first person executed in the state of louisiana. he had asked h execution be carrd out and his mother on hi own behalf fired an appeal and the federal courts seeking to stay the execution saying he wasn't mentally stable. well as this appeal process worked its way through clark finally changed his mind. in that case also this was to gentlemen went into a red lobster in baton rouge and killed the manager of the red lobster. no one knew who actually fire the fatal shot and stabbed the man to death. they knew that one of them di but they didn't know which one.

clar was white. michael glover his defendant was white so in this case the white guy got the death sentence and the black guy got a life sentence, so clark appealed to the fifth circuit's, his attorneys, and raised the same identical issue raised by charles brooks on the morning of december 7th, shortly after midnight, 1982, charles propes was put to death in a texas death chamber. the same morning while on death row colin clark turneon his television to learn the same court of appeals on the same issue they had let brooks go to e death chamber to give gouarec a n trial so on the same day in america you have a black man that was executed and a white manas given a new

trial. to be there are thousands of other instances but those two cases of execution carried out in onetate to boarding states and one being given the new trial underscores and illustrates the issue of racism as far as i am concerned. >> if you actually loo at the death penalty is almost a regional sentence because it is the southern states that most often carry out the death penalty if you look at the statiscs and certainly they are in this book i won look them up at the moment far the number of people that get executed are black people if you look at the lynching that take place, south of flinching, clearly it stands out that racism is definitely in has been

a feature of the death sentence. for example a black person can ll an enti black family and white district attorney will let him bleed out to reduce charges but another black person can kill one white victim and the district will demand the death penalty. so that is an issue we covered extensively in this book who gets the death sentence and what circumstancedo they get and it's being carried out. so it is the same shameful history in this part of the country. >> anything else? >> people feel like they have been hit with all these terribl facts. but i think it is important, and i truly do believe this no matter how people feel about the

death penalty it should never -- it should always be a topic of discussion, always because you can't take the sentence back. so any new development and any -- all of the cases should be topic of discuion and we shld never ever let ourselves let this become monday and -- mond in. it's one of the most important issues we fe. >> of the 1100 executions carried out through november 30th,008 in this country which was the cutf date we've used in r book that 1135 executions more than 9 of them were carried out in the south. during the era when they have the death penalty for rape in

this country of the 468 people put to death in this country, for rape, 405 of them were black. the people from 1930 through up to 17 who were ecuted in this country for murder more than half of them were black so i think when he looked at the death penalty the first thing you have tonderstand the number one factor that plays in the decision making process who received the death penalty is the race not only of the offender but the race of the victim as well. the second thing is i believe it is the social status of the victim. if you look at buddy roemer to the time he was governor and bless his heart because he commuted the life sentence and i will always be indebted to him

and respectful ofim for doing that, but during his administration, the only inmate who received executives clency that had a condemned inmate was a black inmate who killed a woman in a housing project. now, when victims of crime or more often black people eight times more likely to be victims of violent crime in our siety the vast majority of violent crime that occurs in the society occurs in the nation's 16 largest cities and mostly this violent crime is predominantly in our minority communities and as long as it is confineto the

lowest social ord as long as it is blacks killing blacks or hispanics telling hispanics or even crossing those social and racial lines it becomes socially aaceptable behavior prosecutors will try them and put them in prison. the prisons are full of african-americans an hispanics who have committed viont crimes but when it comes to handing out the death penalty, the only african-american or hispanic people that are going to receive the death penalty are those that cross over their communities and went outside of their communities to kill white victims and particulay white victims of social status. at is reality woven through all the statistics, and all you have to do is go down the list of people executed and look and see who the victims were. if you go back and look at where

they got -- and i did this, i went down á@ @ @ @ @ @ @ rbrb@ b memory right now you oy have a small number of people, white people who fed executed for killing black victims in this country. so when you start looking at the

statistics, the coldblded reality behind the system and see the kind of the rule that race has played in the administration of capital punishment in the society. >> thank you for coming. the history of capital punishment and as gracia as we can compress into these 14 essays. it sted upntil the book actually went to print this fall. this is as concise else you are going to get on th death penalty in this country and the way that it has been handled since literally since we became a country, and i certainly hope we all get out of this recession before it turns into a depression. t the one argument that i can think of that would favor a ntinued state of recession is that states may recent the death penalty because it cost $3 million to execute somebody

versus $0 million to leave them locked up. thank you very much. >> one final ote before we close. jodie and i were talking about the cost factor but i do believe in what i am afraid of is that as the economy titans,nd right now we know dollars hour precious and the competition f those dollars and circution is becoming more and more intense. people who make crime a way of life depend upon those flow of dollars and as the flow of dollars shrink they become more despate and more violentn their effort to get their share matter howrinal it may b to get what they feel is their share of the capitol. and so, you know, you see in mexico what's happening. mexico you almost had a total collapse of organized society. because the violent gangs do not

want to give up controlf the walth that they have. in this country i think that we may see as our economy forces cutbac in the law enforcement and other community services that you are going to see an increase in our

>> welcome. tonight we have two writers. one is a novelist ask one is a memoir writer but they actually both workery

similar terrain. the first reader is matthew goodman and he's written a book called "hold love strong by touchstone books and it said in a fictional housing project in queens and it is a retelling of the biblical story of abraham and it's just out. matthew grew up near wte plains and lives now in brooklyn and spent six years or so working with prisoners who have just been reased from prison. and look forward toearing him read. here's matthew goodman. [applause] >> how's everyone? >> good, good. >> so this is the second time i guess i've read from this. the first time it was my parents and friends. so you alway get a good response from them because they have to love you. hopefully you don't have

to love me but maybe for five minutes you just listen so this is a story about a young man named aabraham and his family they live in fictional housing projects called ever park and he lives there with his grandmother his two cousins, his aunts, his uncle and himself. and i'll begin bically the beginning of the book. the scene he's born. his mother is 13 years old. andhe's going to giv birth to him in the bathroom of their apartment and his grandma who is 30 is going to deliver the child so this is where it begins. in the bathroom my grandma and my aunt rhonda hemother take off her clothes my shirt t asked my mother? shirt too ordered any grandma unless you've got the money to pay for a new one if it gets blood. so off came my mother's shirt and for a moment my grandma and aunt and my

mother just stood there three proximate shades of brown women. hughes in a small plain bathroom with white calls walls a white porcelain sink a white bathtub and ahite toilet with a broken black plastic seat my grand ma and aunt rhonda looked a it my mother who looking in the bathroom mirror looked at herself as well. in addition to the disposition and body type of my grandma my mother was the color of an old penny at the bottom of a wishing well equally she reflected and absorbed sunshine, street lights and the hopes of those who wished upon her and then cast her off. her eyes and lips @er nose shoulders and breasts even her thighs and hips were shaped like new leaves full yet still tim still approaching their eventual lustrous peak. my grand ma snatchad a red bath tel from the back of the bathroom door and put it on the floor here she decided lay down on this and rhonda get behind her and

ld her tt baby's coming. i can feel it. we ain't got much time. my mother laid down. the bathroomas so small her head krolsed the threshold of its doorway behind my mother on her knees wrapping her arms around her and wedging her thighs against my mother's back my aunt rhonda neiled on the coarse gray carpet of the living room my grandma stepped into the bathtub. she hiked her skirt up over her knees squatted and put my mother's ankles on her shoulders. lord hav mercy she said. lord have some -- mercy on me. my mother sweated and writhed from the paint. another contraction came and went and the she cursed and screamed and told myrandma she didn't want to live no more. jelly shut your mouth demanded my grandma. stop thinking about yourself. you're about to be a mother. on the couch donell asked question after question a eric awoke and hlered for my automobile rhonda. he reached for her. he fought to get out of my

uncle roosevelt's arms my uncle tried to keep them calm. he hushed them. he softly sang verses of spontaneously composed lull la buys. tried to remine my cousins about the movie they just saw how e.t. had a magic finger and loved reeses pieces candy. my mother quaked with another contraction and s moaned and rolled her head from side to se as if her neck and spine were suddenly severed and then she developed looked down at the round mound of her belly her eyes so wide it seeme she was surprised by the sight. she put her hands-on it and with her fingers spread as wide as they could stretch my mother began to woep but it was not woeping caused by physical pain or by ignorance or even a e weeping causedded by fear my mother wept because although she was still a child she had enoughense to understand she was not prepare to shape my life. she couldn't multimy or divide. she didn't know north, south,

east or west. she couldn't tell time on regular clock. this is not to say s was dumb. in fact my mher was brilliant so smart she could remember all of the words in a song after hearing it just once when my mother was then was the product of low expectations. she had been failed so she had failed. and yet social protion she had just cometed the 7th grade. but when she felt weak. when she felt hopeless and useless and begged my grandma to make the pain stop to let her quit. my grandma said no. my mother coun't stop not even if great god almighty himself said she could qt and s because my grandma was not the type of woman anyone could disregard my mother pushed with her life. she clenched the a in her first ifs she gritted her teeth. she closed her eyes so together aly she saw everything she'd ever wished to see. every mountain and ocean. every sdy beach,ropical waall. elephants lions and giraffes

in africa. she sawesus. she shook president ri gane's -- reagan'sand. she saw the statue of liberty whers a car ark fur coat a collie likeassie. sheaw herself a a movie star. her toes curled her cal fs clamped her head became a volcano bursting blood she saw her dreams she felt their temperature she smelled them my grandma saw my head. she took it in he hands and pulled gently then holding one hand up as if halting a train she shouped stop. every muscle in my mother's body went limp my up bill cal cord was wrapped twice around my neck my mother's pushing combined with my twisti and turning was killing me. i was being lched and i was hanging myself. my face was the color of an electr blue. one more push or pull, one more twist and i was dead. my mother begged to understand what was

happening. momma she said propping herself on her elbows momma please, what's wrong asked rhonda. ma, what is it? myrandma breathed deep. shhh both of you. let me think. outside of the bathroom eric stopped hollering darnell stopped asking questions and my uncle roosevelt stopped hushing and singing lull la buys. all of everett park, all of queens went silent. then in through the door burst sherry our neighbor. they coming she shouted. an ambulance is on the way my aunt rhonda looked over her shoulder at sure ri. her eyes demanding silence. sherry stopped in the middle of the living room. what's going on she said. her voice a fraction of its preceding size. in theathroom my grandma looked up at the ceiling god she whispered, jesus somebody please help me save this child. my grandma took one dp breath, closed her eyes and made is same prayer say

silently then she opened her eyes gently held my head and slowly drew my shoulders free. she paused to think what next? what could she posbly do? the umbilicalord was taug. she cupped her hand beneath me breathed and then cautiouslyuidi me in an unhurriedommer salt she turned me upside)down, freed my legs and unwound the umbilil cord from my neck. my grandma saved me from that which fed and kept me for rst nine months o my life. she cleared my nos rs and u --os tir rils and with her pinkie and wiped the blood with a ead roosevelt she call out get me a knife a sharp one, one of the once the wooden handles but it wasn't my uncle who brought my grandma the knife it was darnell li a miniature mercury he burst into the bathroom and heldhe knife out to her then stood on h tip toes and look at the new life my grandma cradl to

her chest. this your baby cousin she said. she pushed me into his arms. now love strong. darnell held me against his chest like a ball of loose yarn and my grandma cut my umbilical cord and left me the ugliest outty the world has er seen. she washed me in the sink and handed me to my mother and as my mother held me on the floor in the bathroom as she wept and dealt with the awe of my making rhonda asked what my name should be because my mother had not yet been able to settle on one. abra ma'am -- abraham my grand ma announced like the president rhonda ask? no, said my grandma like the ol man in the bible who god said was going to be the faer of a great people as numerous as the stars. so that's his bth. i'm going to jump ahead 8 years. so his cousin darnell is now, he was 4 years old at his birth and is 8 years later

so he's now 12.dh6ú3@ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ a)@ @ rbrbn#@ @ @ @ @ ) rnertore the 99 cent candles with all the patron saint on them. he's sitting at the kiten doing his homework by that candlelight and darnell has just come home and told him that someo put one of those plastic kid pools on the roof and he's talked

abraham, his mother and his mother to come up and go swimming i this pool. it is also this is the same time in new york city's history when we had our first plaque major -- black mayor which was david den kins if anyone knows the history of that when david den kins became president it was also a pretty bad recession in the city and there were tons of job cuts and abraham's grandma wked at the hospital doing laundry and she lost her job. so this is eight years later and they're on the roof of the building. so it's abrah was 8, his mother which -- who is now i guess 21 his cousin darnell who is 12 and his grandma who is i guess about 38 now. and they're all getting into this kid pool. >> we squatted and sat down in the water and our legs toucd in the middle of the pool. the kidool was the first

pool i'd ever been in that wasn't packed with people on a hot summer day. brimming with children splashing and peeing and seeing who hold their breath longer with teenagers wrestling each other with mothers holding infants i was conditioned to be one of many. to be of the masseso be crammed in ando call such nditions relief. to know crowds as home. my mother, grandma and darnell whispered and cursed everett. how strae it was when the heat was broken the elevator ran smoothly. darnell talked like an adult like he was husband and they were his wives. he could do that. he had an ability to speak in the manner and on the terms of those he was wit i half listened and looked up at the sky. watched the light of airplanes blink through the blackness. wondering who went where. you all right ae@ darnell. flicking water o my face and shifting the conversation to me. yeah, i said meeting his eyes. why?

he shifted his eyes to my mother and laughed a tumble of breath. abraham can be so quiet. can't he. he's always bee that way my grabbed ma said said my mother reached over to me pressed and slid her wet hand down my ear andheek and along the line of my jaw. she said calling me by the name she used or the for me when when she wished to tell me how much she loved me or chose not to or bould not say the words. darnell spun himself around in the pool. hooked his legs over its plastic wall and leaned backwards into t water he fload on his back his arms at hisides. his head in the middle of the pool. the only sound was the waves made by darnell's movement. the water lapping against our bodies and the walls of the pool. look at the moon he said talking louder than necessary because his ears were submerged in the water. the moon was nearly full. like someone had punched a hole in the black night and there was white on the other side.

my mother laid her arms along the edge of the pool leaned back and looked up. sometimes don't it look so close. you can touch it she asked. darnell turned to his side and splashed water at me. lay on your bad he said. it's nice. there's nothing to be scared of. who said i'm scared i snapped. darnell lifd his legs from the edge turned and quickly sat on his news. here he said laying his hands on the surface of the water lean back. i got you. lean back and put your feet up. you going to pull your hands away i said. i got you he said. trust me. i turned around bent my knees over the lip of the pool and looked over my shoulder at darnell. come on he said. sometime before i dead. i leaned and lowered myself until i felt the tips of darnell's fingers and then the flat of his hands against my back slowly he lowered me. abraham my grandma laughed open your eyes. they're open i sai then open them wider darnell order. i opened my eyes as wide as

i could and breathe he said. i breathed. the surface of the water hovered an inch from the corner of my eyes. two inches from the sides of my nostrils and half an inc from the corner of my lifes -- of my lips. my ears were underwater all sound was mufeed. it was wonderful. peace. all right darnell said i'm going to let go. i felt his hands leave my body and then water rippled against my skin when he returned to lying on his back. imagine doing this in the ocean he announced making sure to speak loud enough for me to hear. what if you got tired i shoulded back -- shouted back. then you climb onto your boat he answered. what's got a boat laughed my grandma. in the ocean darnell said you can have whatever you want. abraham, what do you want? i thought far moment. i wanted whatever he wanted. whatever he needed. i don't know i said. what you want? who he said. you scolding my mother

unless you see someone else in this pool. all i sees the sky darnell said. there could be thousands of people in this water for all i know. so what you want i asked again. a boat for one thing said darnell and then after a brief pause he added and a trumpet. >> a trumpet my grandma said? if i had a trumpet darnell began. if you had a trumpet what my grandma interrupted. siddenly police sirens burned theight. broke us from below. jesus why mother sighed why they always g to be -- erything up. never have i been so still so weighless never have i been in the pool of rost roof of ever. i look at the pool one last time and then i closed my eyes i was surround. floating in darkness the t whale of the sirens faded and disappeared and i waited for someone to speak to say anytng t overcome the silence to speak before police sirens arrived again. so my grandma finally said what are you going to do

with your trumpet? if i had a trumpet darnell answered his voice soft and longing, if i had a trumpet, i don't know. thank you. [applause] >>. >> that was great. august in new york s a doing -- a dangerous time for on's mental health just like most months actually and it was one fes erg august 6 or 7 years ago when i first met cadillac. i was taking a shortt through the alley that ran below the via duct that cuts across history ya on my way back to my apartment having just returned to the city from two week at the beach down south with m friends and family. i was in one of those just back in the city and what am i doing with my life states

of min heading back through the rancid air to my unr-conditioned apartment which was going to look actly like it had when i left because i lived alone. which meant i was sort of returning to a tomb of my own makg an airless museum that featured teetering stacks of magazines, books and newspapers and dust balls as big as tumbleweeds rolling down theall. i rekilled the wisdom of some fellow -- true solitude is when no one anywhere is waiting for you and tha was mytate. so true i thought. so true. i figured that an ice col bath and an ice cold gin and tonic was going to be necessary for me to successfully accomplish new york reentry. it was in the midst of such joy us -- joyous reflection that i rounded the corner where a homeless man under the via duct greeted me like a long lost relative. did you have a good vacation he asked.

you've been gone for, what two weeks? i stopped in my tracks. wow. maybe this guy was homeless, maybe all his possessions were in a near shopping cart that he had borrowed from costco but he sure was friendly. in fact, he seemed to be a one manuel come wagon with direct access the my subconscious. how i love new york. those of you who already know cadillac understand that in ather life he must have been a great politician a truman of the people. -- true man of the people. maybe from the days of boss tweed and hall where the irish still ruled. apparently cadillac is one of those great old irish names. he can tell y exactly how he inherited it. and that even now he could probably beat our local councilman peterithout having to change any electoral laws in the process. he shakes hands, he kisses babies he consoles the sad and he comforts the lonely.

i've seen him do it many of times. and that august day six or seven years ago he began to work his magic on me. we struck up an acqintance that developed into a friendship. it seems that homeless guys and freelance writers which is what i was have more than a little bit in common. cadill probably made more money than i did through his canning which on aood day could bring in about $100. but neither of us was exactly rolling in the dough. and is often the case with freelance writers that i know cadillac and i always had time in the middle of the day to shoot the breeze for hours solving the world's problems if notur own. one morning when we met under the via duct i notic he as opposedo me actually writg damn im the one of those old-fashioned spiral notebook what's that you're doing i asked? and he told me. he was writing the story of his life as a homele man.

by that point he'd been on the stredts for close to a decade and as i was eventually to discover he believed that he was faded to die out there. and as a result he wanted to leave a record of his time on the streets to his three daughters. he hoped when the authorities discovered his body before they had shifted out for burial to the poters field on an island "the land of the lost" "the land of the lost" souls title of the book. which is where he believed he was goi to be buried in a plywood coffin laid into a long trenched -- trench dug by prisoners from. before that happened cadillac hoped someone might find the notebooks on his body and instead of throwing them inhe garbage deliver them miraculously to his daughters. but i didn't know that then. then i just knewe was one more aspiringriter on the block. everybody in norng -- in new york it seems has a

manuscript. even the homeless guys. but for some reason i said to him words that as a rmer edito i try never to say to anyone if you ever want me to take a look at it i'd be happy to. and i said this as softly as could. i actually mumbled it. but he apparently heard because a few months later cadillac handled me a notebook and i took it home to read. my deal with myself that night was that i would read only until i got bored and so i sat down andtarted to read what turned out to be the story of his relationship with penny a runaway with whom he fell in love during h early days on the street. and this long before col his current live -- love. and it's now one of the final chapters of the "land of the lost souls". i read it with increasing excitement. enough so to send it eventually to mark at "esquire" who would eventually run an excerpt d then to nick at blooms bury w gloriously saw fit to make a it book.

the handwting was a little gnarled as befits a hand that has delivered a punch or t in its time but there was a sto there with dialogue with whit and had the sensibility of an older no,. -- new york.ñr it was courtly andlangy at the same time. ke something out of damien runnion. if damon runnion had been a homeless guy in love with a runaway. the next day i went back to cadillac and asked if he had any more to read and he did lots more it turns out. hundreds of pages as t turned oud. pages about strilth straight fights about wizards and lost old menhoalk to themselves who drank and lived alone about street walkers and pumps about how much you can come to hate christmas music when you're homeless. about how to find a safe place to sleep at night and about how to live with loliness and how to make friends wherever life takes you. it's not all bad times out on the street either.

there's also frae don't anded a venn -- freedom and adventure and ka rousing which is one reason why i think cadillac has a soft spot for le out there to this day. his colleagues on the street include such characters as old crow, rubber man, chocolate milk, bones, shaky detroit and twinkie among others and snir all there as large as myth in the "land of the lost souls" which cadillac imposed outside under the via duct in all weathers in between shaking hands and kissing babies and joking with and comforting and consoling those of us who walked past him. "t land of the lost" souls a hard and magnificent book shows that the line betwe home and homelessness is as thin as a few bad weeks and as long as a lifetime. but also and this is maybe more important that home can be made anywhere a man or a woman is brave and intrepid and curious enough to make one. so tonight i give you man

who was brave and@ p@ @ @ @ @ @b see it when you came in there it is. the cover. anyway, i'm going to be talking about the very beginning with my life out on the streets starting in 1994 and then slowly go into

the later years. if i get a little nervous just bear with me maybe it's my teeth that's a little loose. i don't know. i was 44 when i came out on the streets. before then i had a whole life. maybe a lot like yours. childhood growing up, sometime in the army, jobs, sometimes and three beautiful kids. one way too early when i was 14 and two others from my previous marriages. ..

desota is hard to describe him now. he had believed sixd, in his 30s with red hair, receding. he will put the lampert delhi served in world war ii. aloha i know because one tony tactilely done to the brooklyn navy yard. i wanted to golden, but he justify held me up in the distance. everybody was afraid of him. but when he was sober he was a real nice guy. linney hattie fueling him, he

would mumble and crumble in scare people off. but that did not bother me. he got stopped by the police one night, a filthdirty and everyone said that he was a bum. but, i never looked at a person that way in my mind. he is an alcoholic. when deye told me, i am going to show you how to make some money and we went to the gbage cans and picked up the bottles. the little bottles were 2 cents, in the great big bottles were 5 cents. oberoi, i thought, this is money here. back in 1960 fugate quarter, i was in seventh heaven. do you know, candy i can get for a quarter? candy was two for a penny and a soda was in a cult. what happened all these years? everybody was a drinker back then and there was a haiti party, so there was always models around.

some days we would make a dollar easy. we usually didn't have to go that far. there were places in the neighborhood that we would cash in the bottles. i knew a lot of people and they liked me because i was equal little boy with red hair and freckles and i looked like how do you duty. i hope nobody remembers how do you duty here. but i am stl queued anyway. joe would wait outside. joe would get his beehrs, he would go to the liquor store and get a bottle of wild irish rose. they still that-- that was one of his favorites, 40 cents a pint, real, cheat stuff. and then, whatever money was left over was for me. although once in a while he would say, get your cigarettes too, joe. so i would just be happy number one, just having the company and

number two, get whatever money and made after he got his whine and smokes. eating was out of the equation. i had never seen him he anything. so he actual taught me about recycling. 34 years later i would be glad for the things that he taug me. the first morning i was on the streets, on the upper east side, the security "me up an told me to get out of here. i must have had maybe $2. remember getting peanu butter crackers that were 25 cents a pack and that helped. for cigarettes, i was picking the bugs off the streets. i did that for many years. mita even had, with cigarettes going up to $10 a pack. that first morning was saying, wait a minute, i need some money to survive. i know i couldn't panhandle.

to me that was they set down to go over and ask somebody, can you spare a quarter or a dime and i still can't, and i never will. i am proud of it. but they knew about county. during a walkabout in the flood i noticed a beer distributor that there was a group of homeless and they were putting all these cans intone of these cardboard containers and they were going inside the store hank coming out with cash. with when i was living at home, it never really occurred to me to do something like that. enever i had an empty can or bottle i would put it in the trash. but when i hit the streets i was saying to myself, this is an excellent source of income. so the first time in 34 years i started canning. after a while, homelessness becomes a way of life. in the very beginning, ias

content with making five, $10 a day but as time went on, i had a lot of time to kill, s i would spen more of it out there canning. it was something to do. so i easily make $50 a day minimum. most peopldon't have any idea how much money you can make out there. i called it nickel have the income of 5 cents a caj. there were times when i cod sily make 80 to 100. i found myself a nice big cardin, sitting by its lonesome on the corner, near the anp on ninth avenue. i used it for canning. on any given day i did at least 15 or 20 miles, walk, walk, walk, just load up the card. i would can find mccain's in front of the residents. you can get bags right out of the trash cans from people at the redeemer, after they were done cashing in. later i would sometimes find

some restaurants that would give me hands but that was very rare. for the most part i would stop in front of a residence, looking the recycled barrel and also at the wastepaper baskets where people would be dumping. it is all tax free. and but it takes time and energy. you want to make 50 bucks a day, you are going to have to work, meaning what. i will give you an example. later on i had a map of queens when the department of sanitation. this map told you what days everybody puts out the cans and bottles in any given location so every so often i would wak and from story to flushing, a little over three hours collecting cans along t way. there were times where i couldn even get to flushing. i had so mh stuff that i had to turn back. i would go to the redeemer, unload some of it and then go

right back to another area. sometimes i would work 24 hours straight because canning gave me something to do. u know one of your worst enemies out there is boredom and bill lonely ms. too. and it hit me hard in the first couple of months out there. nobody was talking to me, i mean nobody. when you are homeless who would talk to you? people don't even want to see you. so sometimes you may n realize it, you will be talking out loud to nobody. you are just getting it out of your system. it was just like this guy at the meat market that i used to work get named bernie. he used to work in the freezer and nobody wanted to go down there. it was t cold, below is the road down there. whenever somebody needed some think they would go and call bernie, put this on the

elevator. but i would go down there on occasion and he would be having conversations. i would be looking in there and saying, who is he talking to? the same thing on the streets. it gets lonely out here. the closest i ever got to a conversation with anyone was when somebody was going by and they took a look at me and started laughing, laughing at me. my first week of tribe gnat my bortz-- i was sleeping in front of this bank on park avenue between 47 and 48. every night this guy would come over with a sandwich. he would say, here you go you bump, here you go. nice, nice sanich, and then one day i decided i am going to see what this guy looks like. i opened up my eyes would and i freaked out. i am a been shaking right now. he looked like something out of a quorum of the, lipstick, tattoos all over his face.

this guy look like a complete psychopath and i said to myself, that is that. i have to get out of here because this guy's going to kill me in my sleep one day. still it was good to have some kind of human contact. and i didn't have much bad it really helps that i kept a journal for my day to day activities, but mostly i went canning. finally, by word of mouth, and observing other homeless i found the aces i could get myself a t meal so i could save money there. it is hard out here in queens where i live now. there are no places to eat a hot meal unless you go way out into jamaica. there is nothing in historic, long island city, koranic, jackson heights, nothing but in manhattan and parts ofhe bronx mike-it was every third or foth block you can get something deet, paradise. maybe that is why i gain so much

weight. so it was impossible for you to start. there were times that would go into a restaurant, some places would serve me, others wouldn't. i must admit i did look like a maniac with my beard and everything else. but i was trying to keep myself clean. the main thing that worried me, gosh, that was so hard. but even after two weeks i consider myself street. i like the lifestyle. the first couple of days i was sleeping ona piece of cardboard and thereafter my travels i came across a dilapidated beach chair and i said, i could use this for a bed. that same day i came across these banners that mcy's throughout. it was in macy's clearance day. i w looking at them and, i could use these for blankets. so now i avgot a dilapidated beach chair and i have got

blankets. so what the heck, what else do i need? everything was falling into place for me. i found it very enjoyable that i could adapt to it. there were a few inconveniences but other than that everything was fine. watching was the biggest inconvenience going. i would go in the fast food places, for a five minute rob doug were you take off your shirt and wash your armpits and watch between your legs and that is that. it made the situation more bearable. alright, mike closer dreeben at least i have got a somewhat clean body even though it is between my legs underneath my armpits. there were even places along sixth avenue where they used to have these outdoor water displays. i think they still have them. it was 2:00 in theorning and i figured, it was going to be around? go right in there and that is

all. boy, tt water was cold but during the summertime it feels good. i had a bar of soap with me. i could be and therefore a good ten minutes, wash behind my ears, wash my hair and everything, even don't underneath the water. great. there were times when they-- would come out and act rough and tough and they would come out and say what in the heck do you think you are doing? in fact one time ey call the co on me. the cops came in the security was so proud of themselves in the cops told them, don't worry, we will take care of this. then they would look at me and say, you have got to minutes. gethe heck out of here. but it was a convenience. little by little, i figured out how to do everying. i feel so free. nobody riding my back saying, do this, to this, do that, do that.

i did whenever i wanted to do and they didn't have torb@ @ @ y from 99 to 2002 i moved around a lot before a really settled down. i went back to hell's kitchen for a while and then i went to brooklyn. i was out there for a couple of months, in coney island for a while, and i was even in new york, east new york o wehrey stuck out like an oreo cookie but i got along good with the

people over there. and manhatten i went to look for some old friends but no luck. we were like nomads for the most part but i was slightly disappointed when i got over there and nobody was around. of course i went to central park and there were new street people over there. i really didn't want to make their acquaintance. so i went to brooklyn and hung out at prospect park. from brooklyn i went up to the bronx over to-- and i was therefore little while and then i went back to hell's kitchen again, then from there i came not to a story of. in those years, i would just be free. one place one day and another place the next. i slept everywhere. there were times where i would beleeping underneath travelers, behind the big wheels and nobody would notice me there because i wore dark clothing and dark blankets. ything not to bring to much attention to myself.

i slept in rages for code you could hide in people's backyards. provided you conceal yourself very well. i spent a couple of nights in old maintenance rans underneath the triborough bridge if anything else was opened i would be over at the cemeteries. i think i visited every cemetery there is. i like the calvary cemetery in woodside or st. mike's and has story. theroux several flights places in brooklyn, like greenwood. who was going to bother you? the dead are not going to bother you. in some cemeteries they have security guards but it might they don't want to go out there and check the grounds. i wonder why? they are staying in thir shapes so cemetery is the perfect place to hide in you can get plentof rest. at st. mike's, i slept in the mausoleums.

one night i slept between the two coffins. it was a husband and wife, but no big deal. they didn't mind. alright, there was a lite bit of a musky odor in there, but other than that no problem. then there were times in brooklyn that i was just so tired i even slept in open graves. it was just like when y were in the army. they may do dig a fox hole and he slept in it, so what the heck is the difference, a fox hole, a great. a whole is a poll. [laughter] beh you know they are going to put somebody in there the next day so in the meantime i may as well go in there. believe it or not it is warm, not warm, warm. you still need a blanket in there and it is not draftee. cemeteries are a good place to stay. park stu. central park is ideal because it is so big and decreasing over there doesn't have enough

manpower to coverhe whole area and the parks department does not have that many people. in fact, i don't think they even were it not, just meiners but in you can hide in the shadows. prospect park was not a great one. the bigger the partthe better. is dori apart is not good. in fact the remember when i used to go canning bear the cops used to yell at me for gn down there after midnight. they said, what are you, crazy? coming down here canning with all the trouble that don-- goes on over here? >> duguid a good job at the 114 patrolling it but you still hear what goes on there when the cops leave, the like little get together is and the drugs then maybe on occasion in muddying. central park back in the '70s and '80s, forget about it, in your life wasn't worth a nickel.

if you went through there after dark. now it is like little house on the prairie over there. but still a lot of people won't go in there at night, so that is a plus for the street people because they know they nt the hassle by one of the outsiders going jogging. you know, i just saw a street person sleeping behind those bushes over there. it never fails, it never fails. there were so many cubbyholes and places to hide. i settled here in the to the underneath the viaduct were live now. before that i was going t months here, three months there but when i hit the streets i had no particular destination in mind. you know, i would go to one place and i would say well, this is a good place to plop down. all ias focused on was getting some sleep, but now with e wintertime here, i had several places i could stay where i am

away from the elements. i feel sade there. that is the key, to feel safe. the viaduct on 33rd street and 23rd avenue, is painted yellow with murals on both sides. on one side is a big blue and white greek painting with some statues and the word athens. there are lots of great people that live in the neighborhood. on the other side were parked my wagon it used to ve a beautiful mural of a firemen and policemen holding up amecan flags. last year some kids painted over it with some political thing where bush and hillary were fighting it out. i don't like it as much. but still, this is my place. this is where people come and see me in the evenings, all the birds in the railway trestle start to sing as they are getting ready to go to sleep ago you wouldn't believe the noise in the mornings too. the story is my comfort zone.

we are very territorial, my people, absolutely territorial. when it plant myself down underneath the viaduct, i say that is it, i am staying right here. no way am i leaving. especially the way i am treated by the people. you know something? i like you hear. saying these people, how concerned they are, and that is no b.s.. it is genuine concern. a while back i finally cemented the back of my wheels of my car

>> welcome. welcome? is this working? welcome. i am cynthia, director of latin american studies at george washington university and delighted to welcome you to a presentation by his excellency, president manuel zelaya. this is the first time president zelaya is speaking at a university here in washington and we are thrilled to welcome him. we would also like to welcome others in the government of honduras who are here with the president. the minister of foreign affairs, and weekday, the ambassador of ponder arrest to the united

states, carlos is ambassador of honduras to the organization of american states, and reach enrique, the finance minister, ed wynn is the president of the central bank, and the president of the bank commission of honduras so we would like to welcome all of these representatives of the honduran government with us today. at 5 a.m. on june 28, soldiers burst into president zelaya's bedroom, may and held him at gunpoint and then put him on a plane out of the country in his pajamas. those facts are well known. i think less well known here in the united states is at the same

time as those events were going on, eight cabinet members were arrested as was the mayor of the country's second largest city. a curfew was declared that sunday night. a subsequent emergency decree suspended fundamental rights and scores of demonstrators were detained. tv stations were closed. the ce president was not put in place of the president. accordingly is was the first coo to occur during the fifth feared wave to last more than a few days. accordingly it is urgent that democracy be restored in houras a i am honored that president zelaya is here today to present his thoughts and recommendations for the return

to democracy and honduras. as i mentioned, this is a university. we are respectful of diverse viewpoints at a university so i would ask for a tone of respect. in the case of any disruption i am sorry to mention this this is university policy in the case of disruption that couldesult in removal of potential sanctions. i would also ask you to turn off cellphone and this is everywhere now, return of the cell phones and annie recording devices, please. we will be taking questions. i believe most of you have no cardsnd staffers will be coming around to pick up note cards for your questions to president zelaya. introducing the president will

be our cohost. he was wonderful in helping to make this event happened and i am delighted he will be introducing the president. he is the co-director for the center of economic policy research. washington. he holds a ph.d. from the university of michigan. he is the author of a 2000 book from university of chicago press entitled social security, the phoney crisis. heas written extensively on economic issues in latin america in particular the international monetary fund, the debt crisis and most recently he has been very insightful and his publications about the true in honduras. mark?

>> thank you very much, cynthia for that introduction and for helping organize and moderate this event. i want to h1n1 everybody that came here today. as the microphone working okay? okay. i want to also think dan and my colleagues at the center for economic research for the hour help as well and the embassy of honduras and especially for president zelaya for taking the time to come here and speak. i just want to provide background information. cynthia already mentioned the details of the coup itself. but the world reaction to the overthrow of ponder and a democracy was swift and determined. the organization of american states, the general assembly of the united nations and other international bodies unanimously called for the immediate

unconditional return of president zelaya. the response from washington has been more ambivalent and ambiguous characterized by inconsistency and mixed messages. the first statement from the white house did not take sides between the government and the democratically elected president. leader statements rejected the coup but more than one occasion the secretary of state hillary clinton was asked if restoring the constitutional order meant bringing back the elected president and she declined to say yes. august 4th the state department sent a letter to the republican senator richard lugar widely seen as retreating from some of the prior statements in support of the elected president. today more than two months after the coup quite astonishingly u.s. state department is yet to determine that the honduran military's overthrow of

president zelaya was a military coup. under the law if the government makes that determination it would be required to cut off aid to the defective to the-government of honduras. and so althoh a small fraction of u.s. aid about $18.5 million has been cut, tens of millions more continue to flow to the dictatorship but most disturbing of all has been the administration's toughening silence about the human rights abuses committed since june 28 by the honduran dictatorship. the shootings, the arbitrary arrest and the detention of thousands of people, the police beatings and brutality against peaceful protesters, the closing down of independent radio and tv stations all of this has been investigated, documented and

denounced by dug!c# president obama and is one of the first people out in the streets on the might of the election celebrating his victory. we all look forrd to a new foreign policy and a new foreign policy in this hemisphere as well and i still expect to see the changes we've voted for. there is no doubt that the united states government has the power to reverse the coup and in the last tuo months it has responded to pressure both from within the united states and

outside of the united states. 16 members of the u.s. congress sent a letter to president obama on august 7th asking him to denounce the repression committed by the defacto government and freeze the bank accounts of the leaders and denied them visas to the united states. the union of south american nations announced it would not recognize any gornment that is elected under the dictatorship because you know elections are scheduled for november 29th. on august 17th the presidents of mexico and brazil signed a joint declaration saying the same thing and it looks now like the organization of american states will also follow. l of this has been noticed by the administration and last week the state department moved a step closer to oicially recognizing a military coup has

taken pla. so why ask all of you here today were those watching this on television or on the internet, take a moment to ask president obama to live up to his promises. if you are representing the government please try to get your government to speak out against the systematic repression and honduras as numerous precedents in this hemisphere have noted this coup is a threat to democracy not only in honduras but throughout the region. the days when the military could overturn the will of the electorate were supposed to have gone away in the last century. we could not afford to go back to those days. president zelaya was overthrown because werful special interests objected to his efforts to help and empower the majority of hondurans who are poor. in the first two years he succeeded in reducing poverty by

10%. he wanted 60% increase in the minimum wage and large increase in elementary school enrollment by getting rid of school tuition fees. these are the real reasons for the coup that differed greatly from the fictional ones we've read and hear every day. but i will let the president give the first and version of the story. history will record him as a hero for standing up to entrenched powerful interest and risking his life for democracy. we welcome president zelaya. [applause]

>> [speaking in native tongue] >> translator: thank you. i think you sincerely for having extended the invitation. it is an honor to be here with you. and when all i am in the u.s., i feel lika true descendant of the teaching of theounders of this wonderful american nation george washington, jefferson, lincoln and all the other men and women that have formed this democracy. i would like to thanks cynthia from theniversity and the center for economic policy research who have helped organize this event.

to all of you, greetings. i am truly interested to have this brief talkith you so that we can build and learn lessons from an event and central america that has more -- mourned and has been a sourc of mourning. and the words i will utter will be helpful for all of latin americans to think about how to prevent any further could a coup de ta because learning abt in the event means learning how to carry out. so, it is important to assess

the good and bad when we look at this nature. democracies are a political process where in all of the factors that pertain to society are involved. the social, the economic, cultural values, and at the same time, the personality of the individuals with his own contradictions based on his existence the role of the individual has a specific weight beyond the dialect othe analysis of the jufcture, the character of the person always marks a path in society. it is not easy to define and 20

or 30 minutes the whole event that took place and all of the problems of the region what alone to define specifically what democracy means for it. and my own knowledge of the definition of democracy from the greek times the one i like the most is the definition by abraham lincoln when he said that democracy is the government the people, for the people, and by the people. so it is not the government r the eletes or the government for the groups that hold power nor a government developed by the day

facto groups. on the contrary, it is a government for the people, organized by the people and also organized by the people. a well-known general from china many years ago landed in her paris and a journalist asked ho chi minh what was his opinion about democracy, and the general said the 200 years is too short to ss democracy. we need to wait a little longer.

my task is not to judge democracy. my task this morning is to make some comments and it is up to you to judge it. we wl have to make an assessment not to change the space system but to perfect it as i said at the beginning of democracy is t number one process, the way of life. it is the concept that lies behind a political power that emerged after the french revolution of the modern world, the greek practiced in their cities and now it has become the paradigm of modern society that is why in my opinion we have to

and by it. we have to defendant very honestly, very sincerely. that means to analyze its weakness and strength that way we can assess where the wkness and strength lie so we can make prress. and honduras on the 28th of june, barely two months ago, a cruel coup d'etat took place rated by the spanish writer from the university of sarah llosa and expert constitutional law and i read this online after a

document he wrote. he said the coup d'etat in honduras according to him was poorly presented by those who executed it. they did not take care of the visibility and the international community has backfired for the international community. i can say that it was obscene and not as that to pull out a precedent at 5 a.m. raving his residence, shooting guns. there are 150 bullets in a metal door in my house, and i think that this spanish writer, the

way he qualified he said obscene and anti-semitic. there are other elegant coups? perhaps. according to this writer this brought about redemption for the pro coup even for the media promoting the today talked perhaps of the sympathizers turned their back on them. after the storm to my house i was dragged in my pajamas as we say. i was put in plane by force and in 40 minutes after they supplied fuel which to the plane

at the middle of the base we took off and got fuel at the base and i was taken to the city in nicoe -- period scirica there were three men dressed in hoods with their vests become heavy weapons perhaps they were thinking they would throw me out of the plane. i mean why so much force in a small plane? three military men guarding me. i asked the one closer to me i asked officer, where are we gog? and he said i don't have any orders to advise you of anything. well, could you find out?

the truth is 40 minutes latere were landing at san jose, costa rica. i thought it was strange, the plane, buthey were careful to open the door, they pulled out the steps. it was a small plane and they told me get off. so they just left me on this trip in my pajamas. what do i do now in my pajamas? .. get@

dressed and we are taking you soplace. i would have accepted the

invitation because they were clearly armed and they were military man. but, no, they wanted to humiliate me, to show their power when someone is threatening you at gun point. and when i left my room i wanted with two or three people know. i wanted to talk to my wife. i was not able to. when they saw my cellular they did not want me to make a call to let the people kw. they surrounded me, ten military men with their rifles. they pointed their rifles at me. of course they are pointing at

the president. very nervous. i noticed they were shaking. and they say this is a military order. let go of your cellular. we will shoot you . they were acting crazily. i said i a the president. if you're going to shoot, shoot. it was very uncalled for. but i wanted to share with you some details. this was the way things develod, but my concern is the cost. and i want to discuss lessons that we ne to learn from this

for the rest of the world fst of all, because it is potentially only one, the probe coup people argued that i was mmitting a crime, presumably because i've have not being prosecuted. i've never had a trial. either privately or as a president or politician. i have never had a lawsuit against me. i have never been convicted of anything. however, they allege that there were several crimes that i had committed, and fractions to the

law. but if this is the case that there's a broken tree, the prosecutors, the judges. you just make a phone call. then trials change overnight. that is well kngwn, the level of corruption there and the impunity in developing countries is quite sizable. but they have always had they were able to handle justice system. i have never been accused, prosecuted, or convicted. however, after the coup there have been 24 lawsuits and bench

warrants that have been issued against me. and i have -- their is a lawsuit against meor drug dealing, terrorism, corruption, but trail to my country, and violation to the legal system, i presume the entire world. they are trying to place fear in me or to humiliate me.

these are some of the reasons that they come up wh to justify the coup. and there are some other causes, and i am actually advertising for them here in d.c. means to know both sides. address the charge that the person was receiving came from venezuela. determined by planes. descended to the u.s. and then had a drug cartel between venezuela, honduras. so 1,000 accusations that are completely unfounded and that

are trying to seek support for the coup. the truth is that it is just like looking for a scapegoat to justify the cp. they said that the coup was to because they were trying to put a stopo an opinion poll that the government was developing. this is the closest thing to something rational because we were conducting a poll on the day of the coup d'etat. that day the government had organized a public opinion poll, not a referendum.

this was an opinion poll close to what the journalists to on radio tv or those, and they are taken by a very public opinion companies to understand the trends of public opinion, such as to rate the opinions. this opinion poll was asking the organization whether they wanted to be asked -- if they wanted to be asked aut prosecution. they just wanted to know what the people were thinking. there are a lot of and scattered communities in honduras. it is difficult to have true

opinion poll because there are no phones in some areas to reedbuck the systems for participation are not fair. so the most effective way is to ask the tnt what is their opinion about something. this opinion poll, the outcome would not bind anybody. that is the love for a citizens' participation. it's just to find out what people like banking. the crew alleged that the pole

was a illegal. they were trying to do everything possible to make the process to find it illegal. i know that there may be attorneys here. the people of the government based on a law that has been approved in honduras -- if the

govement did not pass this law did not want to swear in. i was swearing in front of a church because that is what the law said. congress does not swear un. a judge will. congress passed the law for a citizens' participation. and in article five it states that citizens may request from the state to be consulted about matters of national or local interest. they obviously are interested, and that the outcome may not be binding. so this is just to find out what

the population is thinking. so in order to avoid the consultation they took over. they had their coup because that would mean that the presentations in there on imagination because there are some descendants of nested omas barr an astrologer. they were predicting that after the pole the president was going to cancel the supreme court national congress. that is why they had to have a coup in order to put a stop to

those persons that were in the president's ideas. they never asked me. i denied it categorically. they asked if i would continue to rule in this league. i said no. i just want to know how people of thinking about reforms that are necessary to the legislati of the constitution. ju want to know. but let me not delay the presentation. areaha theyive you my opinion. there are six families. only six families that handle 90% of the economy.

they monopolize everything virtually related to developments, in legends, telecommunications, food, fuel, financial, banking,now owns and those families to control. they used to control congress. the congress members, i found out that one of the families had a group tha was stronger -- actually has representatives that were more powerful than the

president's grouping,@@@ ident. the president had a limited power. the congress of points the

attorney general, the supreme court justice. i criticized the appointment of the supreme just says. of the 15 justices that there are 27 were named by the main banks. the justices defend the interests of the bank. and we believe that that should not be so in a country that is poured that needs more independent sounds. this should not be associated. so three and a half years of my

government. always been associated with those points. they will be appointing a commissioner for human rights for competitiveness, for the environment, for the attorney general. also named by the congress, and he is now an attorney working. so the power in honduras is directly related to those that are being appointed. it is that like in the u.s. that

the justices are named for life and you need a whole process for there to be removed from their positions. and right now these six powerful families -- and i don't mind someone being economically powerful. they can make as much money as they want. free market. but they are using that money to deprive others from their own right saddam to perform a a coup d'etat. those six families are handling

and maneuvering. there is an article of the constitution that says that no honduran can be thrown out of the country. another article says benton in the constitution of secession we only by death, incapacitated by accident. but to those say that it was absolute absence because that is why they named the president of the congress. because there is absolute absence of the president. if interpretations to be made

like that, if you turn arnd someone else is taking over. they seek to of legalized words justify the coup. the families that i am mentioning now have been documented. their is a book out about eight months adobe the economy powering honduras. their is a picture ture on the r that is the national congress. we have to get that book to show you. the names of the families are

documents. i won't abound on details to be there is a report by the ousted government on line that you can read. so this is a company in cenal america that is developing and trying to overcome a large social problem that afflicts seconds. 65 percent of e population lives below the poverty line. the country's most pronounced

inequalities. in the three-and-a-half years during my administration i executed several reforms. they were not structural . the constitution does not allow me to. they were important be within the free market economy. these were reforms to the neoliberalism that i believe has some advantages and some huge

disadvantage is accumulate corruption. so part and parcel of the process. i have been biting for more economic freedom. that means less monopoly. monopolies -- if at the end of the day they were good we could discuss their adequacy, but for us they deteriorated this system and market. the cause poverty, marginality, and inclusion. they are protected by the state itself, concessions, exception

saddam. and this type of economy mends to look for new laws we took monetary action. we reduced to a five-bedroom the allowance said that the banks can use more money. exchange members measures. we did not seek to tax more people. there are many companies that are not paying taxes periods so

there were monetary and fiscal . what about the fact that the banking interest rate came down from 24% to 8%. so when the whole banking system based on the actions we were taking produced at it economic increase that from the first year of my administration went from 3% to 7 percent of growth, growing at 7%, recreation, exports.

10% on every agricultural. some country some from central america, they are importing food when we have enough land and the ability to grow, but we are importing pork, for instance. unbowed, we are importing from oil-producing countries, we have thermal energy potential we could be generating energy for central america, but everything

is based because it is the zealand's to buy o buy a machin. you can generate power. the next day you can sell it. but if you set up a geothermal company or a hydrolectric company it takes seven years to build. you only receive profits seven years later. so it's easier to toe the finds the oil used. the alternative. one of the economic policies we

started to quantify the growth rate was 61%. in 07 there were several years. itas actually 65%. even during the wall street crisis last year regroup. so when there is growth there is a reduction of poverty. for the first time we experienced three poverty reductions, 30 percent in one year. and the reduction, 1% in 10 years. i was able to do a reaction of extreme poverty of 10% in 1 year, but i had the banks working, which they don't like. they like to charge.

they had to lend money. we were supervising the lending. i need to cut short in the order to get to the questions and answers. we were le tubes get social and environmental indicators . also went from 1,000 to 1,400. so that is huge. we implemented social progress. when there is growth there is more tax collection. you are able to put in place@@@ with bral, and we

opened up the economy for more competitiveness. and i know those that have the

monopoly do not like it because they do not want to share, but to accumulate. and we open up a policy to reach to countries who are completely isolated from venezuela, cuba, brazil, argentina the foreign policy was great. cuba has a program that teaches people to read and write. there is a campaign. they have done 38,000 operations

in honduras. the sioux have not paid their eye operations, they can do it. all seconds help tundras with energy without having to ask tok for it. the country that has a migration and economic influence. but to say that due to the influence that is why the coup took place dividends just helping socially programs. these are the main elements that

precipitated the coup as i see them. the affects of the coup have been extraordinary. the president condemns the coup publicly. the obama administration could do other things, but we believe that there is more to be done. i will be meeting tomorrow, and we will have an opportunity to discuss some ideas that need to be developed.

the president is in a row of diation. a document was created, and it was not accepted. that is a challenge. the document, accepted. it is rejecting it time. add think that the first country in the world that cannot put its prestige on the line and submit to to not accept the opinion of the international community. this is like democracy and

during the obama administration. as far as domestic issues for honduras people have reacted in an extraordinary fashion. they have been resistant and have very heroic way. they have never done that before. of course i have one of the mayor's year that has been ousted. he was ousted as i have been. he has to come to the u.n.

the director that has pinza close saddam. the radio station has been closed, and the threats. that is the only one that says remained independent providing information. the torture that has been documented. that human-rights has provided a report. there are 1500 political detainees. therare women who have been raped and two teachers have died in public demonstrations. killedy military snipers by shots in the head, died instantly in reedbuck their is .

the department has not made a statement about human-rights violations. we hope that in a few hours there will be a declaration about the coup. the statement, the department of human rights is apparent. lastly i would like to say that howard coble at this time is his to learn a few lessons that all the citizens of the world have a need for so that it may not happen in tandem and the

possibility of reversing peacefully or to restore the state of law. the international community doesn't have efficient mechanisms to make a coup a crime. those who perpetrated. this is the international community. second leads, the role of the armed forces had still be reviewed. the role of the armed forces and its leaders but is able to be corrected by the elite turned into violence if they would use

the armed action disbands to put an end to democracy then there would be violence. that would make the security of the people in latin america in the hemisphere. there are groups that we hado get rid of. we have gotten rid of. but we continue to bring conflict to our countries. we did not have to go through. but if this happens addends then there are people ople from canao

the south will continue to experience violence. on society, the freedom. that is how the u.s. is able to have an african immigrant as the president. and it is actually the best way we have to fight for poverty. to remove poverty if our people lose the hope that a democracy. we will have hope. it should bring about the dreams of our patriots and the

independence of our country. [applauding] >> thank you so much. thank you very much. and i think we have time for of a few questions before the media event. the most common question was about the specific steps that you would like to see the obama administration take now. i know you have already mentioned the indexation of the human rights abuses that are ongoing. are there other steps that you would like to see the

administration take? [speaking in native tongue] >> translator: tomorrow some of the issues that will be discussed are precisely not just the characterization of the coup d'etat for which the state department has a recommendation, but also the outcome of the mediation. it is being weakened by the

rejection of the pro-coup regime. ..

more freedom of the press, and to give you as detailed-- and i will say this to the state department, the pro-coup government has named the former military person has a ministered to ill-advised on safety. he was the death angel during the 80s. he was in charge of cutting tongues, putting out eyes, and castrating people during the '80s. he has trials awaiting in spain and in the u.s.. he was the leader of the death squad anhe is now advising his@b and threw him out with

the same features. the people don't have any

weapons in the position. now the teachers and campesinos have been, have not been working for good they are on strike for 64 days and these are all issues that we will discuss with secretary clinton. >> i would also like to recognize the two ambassadors here, whom i know. ambassador alvarez from the embassy of venezuela and the ambassador from the embassy of brazil. if there are other ambassadors here, i am sorry that i don't recognize you, but we welcome your presence and we are honored that so many distinguished officials at the oas and from the embassies could come to hear the president.

a second question that was asked was about your interest in changes in the constitution in honduras and your vision for politics in honduras in the future at that time. [speaking spanish] [speaking spanish] >> translator: as i was stating before, the changes that we have introduced or of an economic, social nature, that wiin the washington consensus in the neoliberal model to develop our countries, and we are accomplishing the best development indicators, but we

reached a solution that is the best for the democratic system, the direct participation from the cities. when it comes to the large domestic issues, now there is a debate on health in the u.s. and when it comes to domestic issues, what we do and in many countries direct policies being used goes straight to the people. we don't rely on the president or congress, bute ask the people and we base our decisions on that. in europe for instance, the decisions need-- decision needs to be made that they would have the edu-- he is rubmitting a referendum because the president

does not make that decision when the euro was proposed. they submitted it to the population and they stayed with the-- because some officials may betred the will of the people so in contrast they have a plebiscite in a referendum, but that is not taken seriously by the people, so what they did is i change that so people could give their opinion. the love for plebiscite in national arab sides-- states, that it would be used for the people to participate democratically. but, based on this law, he

cannot ask about budget or social programs or tax matters, or international treaties. then, what is t use of the law? i said no, this lot needs to be changed, and they say that i am attacking the constitution because i want the people-- as the people of the want the law to be change. it is the people who can change the law of the constitution. i is the president cannot do it. i cannot issue a decree to change it. there is another article in the constitution that states that the branches of power cannot amend the constitution, but the people can, because the people approve the constitution, so we

wanted to ask the people whether they wanted to be asked, whether they wanted to change the constitution. that is what we were asking. >> a third question is, given-- a third question is that the mckibben elections are scheduled in honduras for november, it seems illogical that the defect of government would be so resistant to a mediation into your return. should we understandhis in terms of the ongoing repression, or what exactly? [speaking spanish] [speaking in spanish]

>> translator: yes sir the i was that the oas an there were several ambassadors here. and about 75% of the ambassadors made a statement yesterday, and there are resolutions from the union of countries of south america and there are statements by the central american countries and resolutions. the president of mexico stated, and also the minister of foreign affairs and likewise from brazil, and countries that have made the statement outside the multilateral entities from

those-- also made a statement. they have stated that they will not recognize our government that is the product of a coup. as long as the president that has been elected by the people is restored to power, and the coup d'etat is reversed precisely because the president himself, who i am the project of the process of a liberal nature, very encpassing.

there is a whole series of actions that to guarantee a clean and transparent process. the population is now being repressed. those who are against the regime are repressed. one of the candidates for the presidency has his arms broken and is in a hospital because he has been attacked in a demonstration. this is a presidential candidate. there are many years-- mears that have been ousted by force and the nephew of the current de facto government has been appointed as the mayor and he was not accepted and he had to be replaced. other labor leaders that for working on polk, campesinos,

indigenous people, they have been captured and their rights to participate have been violated. so, my question is the same that america as the continent is asking itself. candy pro-coup regime guarantee democracy when there repressing a large part of the population, and members of my party and others who were working on the pull. is it transparent-- could it be transparent, and the other question is,, the coup haened

six months before the election. now we are four months away, but win the elections wereostponed in may, then the coup happened the next month. so, is this an action to set up a fraudulent action, that will be made easier by removing the elected president from the country? can they guarantee clean elections are one of the most politically important forces are being repressed then there are no guarantees for democratic participation? the people of the americas are speaking against the process and when honduras was excluded from the oas, it was so that it could

come back later and we need a two-thirds of the vot and we were not able to get it, so the regime out of our de facto government will not be recognized and the elections, if the government is restored, it thsocial agreement to carry out elections are not a good outcome, but it will be a deepening of the social graces. >> unfortunately we are now 15 minutes past the hour that the esident is scheduled to meet with various med, but i am hoping very much that this presentation has helped andeed

into repression in honduras and the return of democracy to hondur

live coverage on c-span. >> welcome to each of u. the commissioners, the aspen institute and the other organizations that have assembled. this is an important national issue. i want to extend thanks to those who havagreed to come and testify on this great issue of national significance. the great son of our nation, up thurgood marall, would be great -- would be proud about the work we are embking on today and the work debt is being

engaged on and those who were testifying. several feet from hear, thurgood marshall did a great work that led to the ground breaking brown vs. board of education dision and exnded the umbrella, constitutional umbrella for o children and created the cultural and educational landscape that we're now trying to enrich. here in the law school and working with scholars he at howard university. we all appreciate the fact that this is a starting point to the discourse in which our nation has been engaged since, in discourse that has had ebbs and flows and, nonetheless, it is continuing. we see this assemblagas a continuation of that.

i just want to thank, on behalf of our president, each of bust to continue with the dcourse -- for each of us to continue the discourse. and how we will guarantee the constitution umbrella over them, and guaranteeing equal educational opportunities for all of our children. we here at howard are pleased to have a great school of education and with our team here is sitting here, working with our school of science and math. we are pleased that you have come into this in barman to discuss this critical question. we have to have great standards for our children that did not separateur children based upon class o ethnicity, or immigrant status or whatever. they are common for all of our

babies and that we prnvide a corporate funding for those standards. they're not specific to states or municipalities or home of origin or family income. most importantly, making sure that there are accountability standards that do not allow it to school or community to underpin a chief. so again, -- but do not allow them to under achieved. welcome to an environment that will enrich just an empower rest and to ensure the umbrella over our babies is complete, comprehensive, and inclusive. thank you very much. i wish for you every good hearing and a day to y at howard university. [applause]

>> good morning. i am did dean of howard university school of education. i am proud to echoed those remarks. thank you for conveni here at howard university. this first hearing wouldccur on these grounds, the place for the intellectual and legal strategy for the brown strategy was drafted. charles hamilton houston and charles thompson charted a course that continues to require that our nation expand its citizens access to quality education. their legal calculus, these men

fined access as the accountability measure. as you engage in these hearings, you are aware that some what hap@ens believed that the court, building issue of the day it is summarized about which students are scoring higher on standardized tests. the real issue before us is which states, which districts and schools are enabling student achievement. some states and schools are enabling student achievement and some are not. there is a consistent pat of input variables which have high studt outcomes and those that do not. evidence is showing us that the fundamental assumption that achievement-focused education systems is deeply flawe a recent harvardducation study found that test-driven some --

systems do not incentivize and they hurt minority schools, often leaving the school's dramatically worse off. we sit here and knowing that in high poverty schools where 50% ar on free or reduced lunch, those students are at 7% likely to encounter a teacher who was not certifie@ or who does not have a minor or majorn the field they are teaching. but those other factors that consistently limit students' opportunity to learn. students' language in schools that are underfunded and have short tendered superintendents and high turnover rates among teachers. despite these well documented input variables, we continue to

talk about measuring kids, to see if they are achieving. we' beginning to a conversation about student academic achievement. education -- we published statistics that 84% of african- american students are in states that require high stakes high school exams. 66% of white students are in such states. who is measuring these students access to quality teachers? availability of gifted and ap schools? we encourage you as you engage your important work to evolve a w model that clarify the relationship between input variables to produce an index of sort. it will likely have high

predictive value, providing student achievement. policy makers, parents could use this indexed to understand the opportunity to learn in these schools and districts. it could be used to hold states and districts accntable, up shifting the attention away from measuring kids. it could expand acss to quality education opportunities. a recent report would be instructive. continuing to test malnourished children will not yield much progress. until the inputs are changed, the students -- will continue to find these students come up first. perhaps the most meaningful

action you can take is to affirm that more equitable distribution of corporation resources is needed to give students at a fair opportunity to learn. the original intent of the education act, no child left behind's para legislation, was to improve opportunity for poor children. thk you fo being here today. we welcome you to howard university. i want to introduce the chair of the commission, dr. michael lomax. dr. lomax heads the nation's largest and most successful minority higher education assistance organization. through its headquarters and in 24 field offices across the country, they annually provide program funds to the 39 member

colleges and universities and their 55,000 students. manages -- they managed scholarship programs at over 900 colleges and universities. over 64 years, they have raised and distributed over $2.5 billion and has a system over 300,000 students in learning undergraduate degrees. uncf received the largest private gift to american higher education from the bill and melinda gates foundation. it provides outstanng minority students with an opportunity to complete their college education. dr. lomax joint after serving in

a series of hi-level and political positions. he served seven years as president of dillard university in new orleans. i am pleased to introduce to you dr. michael lomax. >> thank you very much. i also want to thank our host today, our prosts. i want to think the president' who could not be here this morning. wh we called and said we wanted to have this hearing at howard, he was so gracious to provide all of the support needed. it was so appropriate that we are here. this is the ground on which

thurgood marshall stood with charles hamilton schuster and dean thompson as they prepared for the landmark brown vs. board of education mitigatn. it is appropriate that we come back to ask how we fulfilled that extraordinary promise and that ruling which outlawed separate but equal in the nation that ha yet to be ab to find a way that all children have equal access to an education that will prepare them for college and for life. i am delighted to be here today wearing two hats. i am a new member of the aspen institute's commission on no child left behind. i want to say a special. word of thanks to aspen for taking the leadership in addressing this important issue for our nation.

the commission was formed in 06 to take an independent, bipartisan looked at the strengths and weaknesses of neutral behind. it is a law that is a vital part of our nation's commitment to educate all children, including those often forgoen. the commission is cochaired by two former governors. roy barnes of georgia and tommy thompson of wisconsin, a republican. a bipartisan effort in the town that does not often see that. let me tell you why i wanted to get involved with this important effort. y is uncf in the k-12 reform movement? we're a post secondary organization. we have always worked in its 65

year history to open the doors to higher education for all amerans. our focus has been on removing the financial barrier, to raising dollars to ensure that the young men and women who arpire to a college education have the financial resources to attend. today we see another barrier to the dreams pets so many young people have for achieving a college education. that is educational preparation for college. to many men and womenho graduate from gh schools are not college-ready. in fact, 3 of all entering freshmen need remedial education. th figure is much higher among students of col.

for tooogl"@úx)@ "$gi@ left behind act sustained national dialogue about the quality of the public schools and how to improve achievement for all students and close the

achievement gap between disadvantaged and minority children and their peers. it has transformed the debate. as their rest of the data, we are better equipped to make informed decisions about what is working and what needs improvement in our schools. we have been -- it has been an important step forward. our work is far from over. to many parents lacked the clear meaningful information they need to make good informed decisions about their children's education. too many children are still assigned to schools that are not meeting their needc the.

the pace of change in struggling schools is far too slow. the political will to address the obstacles is often lacking. copp i think we should -- i think at this time we should acknowledge the importance of no child leftehd as we shine ght on critical areas of improvement. we should all stop for a moment and pay homage and respect to senator edward kennedy. we want to take a moment to nor the late senator's tireless dedication to improving education. he was not only a leader in creating the law we're talking about today, but he spent the last 40 years working to build the fountion of a good education for every student, for every child in this nation. he understood that education and

civil rights went hand in hand. we hope our work will carry the same commitment to lasting education reform dplay by senator kennedy. where do we stand today? since the release of the aspen institute's commission on no child left behind, the initial report, more than two years ago, there have been major strides. wealled for a model national standard. there's w an effort to adopt common standards. states have made great progress in developing data systems that informed reform efforts. stimulus funds will help accelerate the progress. stimulus funding as also driving

reform conversations in other key areas addressed by the commission, including teaching -- including increasing teacher effectiveness an improving standards and assessment. the commission recently added new members. we're launching a series of public hearings develop updated and expanded recommendations fo improving no child left behind. it will build on the previous recommendations issued beyond nclb. the direction of o established work will not change. we will be taking a fresh look at the law in order to update our recommendations to reflect progress made toward their adoption. new guidance, regulation, and pilot initiatives, activity

generated by stimulus funding, lessons learned, and other changes to the landscape. with respect to today's hearing we have chosen to begin a public discussion with an examination of what can be done now to address chronically low performing schools andow. auorized notes child left behind can best advanced a support effective school turnaround an improvement efforts as well as expanding academic options for students every year, up 1.2 million american students, approximately half of inner-city students do not graduate from high school. the nationwide graduation rate is shockingly low, around 70%.

a disproportionately high amount of these dropouts come from so- called dropout factories. 2000 high schools produce more than half of our country's dropouts. among students who do make it to graduation, four in 10 are not ready for college or employment, according to professors and employers. the consequences of not getting this right extend beyond missed opportunities for individual students and have a significant affect on our collective standard of living. the persistence of the achievement gap imposes the economic equivalent of a permanent national recession. i am delighted today to be joining my fellow commissioners in this critical work. i would now lik to introduce my

colleagues on the commission who are here with us today. you have full bios in the materis we have passed out. the state superintendent of education in the louisiana. the president of the national association of charter school authorizes. principal of young scholars academy in brooklyn. the chief management official in the centers for disease control and prevention. dr. jane hathawanaway. vice president for education at the national council. mike johnston, colorado state

senator. master educator for the district of columbia public schools. and the director of disability services in the district columbia. i would also like to acknowledge and express our deep appreciation to gary, the executive director of the aspen institute. i would like to introduce our witnesses for the hearing in the water that they will speak. each will be given five minutes to summarize their testimony, which will be foowed by a discussion. following that, we will have an

open opportuni for members of the public to speak, as well. today, the distinguished panel of witnesses, in the order that they will provide their testimony. ronald, state superintendent from baltimore. garth harries, assistant superintendent for performance manament in connecticut. mike contompasis, senior field consultants turnaround strategy group, boston, massachusetts. phyllis lockett from chicago. natalie elder, principal in chattanooga, tennessee.

and steve barr, a founder and chairman of green dot's public- school. pelletier from o witnesses. -- let's now hear from our witnesses. >> good morning. i am with the maryland state department of education. but i think it is important dialogue that we need to have as we look forward to the present -- to the future. maryland's turnaround began a long time ago at the governor's commission in 1989 that established a school intervention program. by 1996, we had identified low performing schools. we had 73 schools statewide and we transitn them into the no

accountability program. w're now up to 200 19 schools -- we're now up to 9 schools. of all those schools, about half have been in some stage of the school improvement process for five years or more. and number of them have been languishing for more than a decade. close to two decades of our work, we've done some things that represent all the tools on the table, from replacement of staff and the replacement of curriculum and bringing staff developers been. many of those things did contribute if only incrementally to making improvements. we did have improvements. we had 32 elementary, middle,

and high schools and we have been able to turn those schools around. they're working quite well. this year, we believe we have 20 elementary and middle schools and we're looking to pick up some high schools. one week transition into no child left behind, we changed our tests and the identification of these tests. we ended up identify a lot of the same schools. they will continue to be low- performing schools. we know how to identify them. i am not saying we do not need to do work with assessments. i like to talk a little bit about one thing that is unique. it is fitting dr. lorton ould have intduced the proceedings. -- dr. thornton should have

introduced the proceedings. it has worked hand in hand with the reform program. it has brought about change pretty dramatically. it pumps $4.5 million into hools. it came with a lot of accountability. as schools would lay out their plans to spend this money, and it was distributed according to the high cost students in the district. this system had to develop a meaningful plan as to how they would develop the problem. the have to review between 9100 experts. sometimes those plans were not approved. it went back and forth. we have a good relationship with the local school system. we believe a lot of the change

has under girded because of this master planning process. in 2008, we looked at the work and felt there was a lot of good progress. we looked at those dollars. we want the system to have a comprehensive way to look at them. we were one of the foptunate states that had approval to use a different accountability system as a pilot. instead of having schools in one singleathw, to move them into two different pathways. we identify schools that have lots of issues with multiple subgroups' versus those who have more targeted needs. this is with the special education suburb alone. it allows us to get pretty intensive to work with the low was performing