on the chinese continuing to buy our treasury notes. i hope for all of our state that they continue to do so. there are days when i question why they do or whether they should. and so i'm going to not answer your question by describing all the ways that it is a great unanswerable question. >> are there any other questions? >> a think that should do it. >> if not, thank you very much. [applauding] ..

to discuss a very important subject that i think you will find intriguing. before major douceur speaker went to briefly discuss my own interest in this issue progress was first elected to congress 2002 when i campaigned i met with parents, teachers, principal s, law-enforcement leaders and other community activist and a common theme emerged as a result of this meeting and all of these groups agreed on one thing you would not think they would agree on the same thing but they did. basically they told me that youth crime was a huge problem in our area. may agreed to many young people were dropping out of school to many young adults were participating in violence and to many families were broken with fathers or sons or brothers in jail. while these groups did not

agree how will i should approach solving the problems they agreed it was a huge problem confronting our community and they agreed many current policies were not working for those policies which included things like the three strikes you are out and mandatory said sentences and treating juvenile like adults it passed with flying colors to the state and federal level and that policy wasn't that -- embraced with support from democrats a and republicans and strong republican support for those measures. so those policies were supposed to solve the crime problem but they didn't that is one reason why when i was elected to the congress i asked to be on the judiciary committee so i could help to address these issues to

address crime and help our children and families. that is what brings me here today. we need to explore our options with respect to youth crime and look at the assumptions that we have. maybe our crime problem cannot be solved by throwing money at the problem but we are seeing current problems will not be solved by harsher punishments and longer sentences. at this time i am proud to introduce our speaker, to nine at ucla public policies goal and an expert of climate drug policy. 1973 -- 19391983 work to the criminal division u.s. or never justice and also the director and member of the national organized-crime planning council. since receiving his

doctorate from the kinsey school in 1985 he a steady crime and drug reduction policies. his most recent book, "when brute force fails" how to have less crime and less punishment" it is a combination of research on crime and deterrence and the founder of a number of programs that have demonstrated success not by increasing the severity of punishment by increasing the swiftness and certainty. i think he has the potential to change the a game to stop the battles whether we should build more prisons porsche employed zero tolerance are legalize drugs, universal concealed carry or gun prohibition is the perennial ideological battle that we have seen. so professor says we learn

that why we should use project hope that shows a truly convincing threat of punishment does not actually have to be carried out very often so i myself am very intrigued by his thesis and grateful he is here in person to discuss the novel theories, if you will please join me in welcoming him and i believe my colleague mr. scott from the judiciary committee is here and apply to say a few words on the matter. he also works also on news crime issues but of like to welcome you and welcome you to today's discussion. thank you. [applause] >> thank you for your leadership on the judiciary committee have been a valued member and subcommitsubcommit tee chairman chips and everything we have done and

i think you. this is extremely important and we really have the choice. we can do what evidence and research shows reduces crime or we can go to slogans and sound bites we have done that for decades now locked up more people than anywhere on earth by far in the united states. the research form does study that showed a 4,100,000 incarceration rate over then that was counterproductive way now won't lock up 700 out of 1,000 but the additional incarceration is extremely expensive and that money could have been put to better use with 30 intervention and more effective law enforcement.

this study showed how you can more effectively utilize law enforcer resources that we have but also they can respond but it does not reduce crime. cry reduction has to take place before the crimes are committed. views promise act will require the committee to come together and propose the evidence based research based proposals to get people on the right track and keep them on the right track. so many people around the track to present today it is called the cradle to prison pipeline we need to construct a cradle to college or cradle to the work force pipeline. by and large then they are not as much as a problem from a criminal perspective. but to keep him on the right track and even with law-enforcement they can be

more effective that is why we are delighted that mark kleiman is here today. thank you for coming. one. >> thank you for that very kind introduction congressman's sanchez it is an honor to be here in the presence of such great leaders with crime control congressman sanchez is the sponsor of the path to success program that gets community colleges and to use detention facilities to give hope that they will turn their lives around. if i went through mr. scott says accomplishments we would be here all afternoon by his current work on strengthening energy defense which is a great scandal. finally, i need to give my special thanks to ms. drake.

fire was to say she was the best masters of public policy student to graduate from ucla probably somebody would say so and so is just as good but i can say with confidence we have never had a better and rear a two be thrilled by her career. thinks you for taking time on a friday afternoon. i am worried and excited because we have too much crime and too much punishment. both of those are major social problems. i am excited because do what we already know how to do spending less money than we're spending today you have half as much crime or half as many in prison 10 years from now as we have today. that is something to be excited about in the me tell you why i think it is true.

i will talk about how bad the problems or how we got into the current social trends and how to get out then we get to the interesting part which is your questions and comments. we have half as much today they big crime collapse. having reduce our crime by half we have only 250% crime as we did when i was growing up. idea not battle. we have five times the homicide rate that any other advanced democracy has. congressman scott reported to the incarceration rates fedders scandalous and more scandalous if you look in particularly impacted committees and the same thing is true of the crime rate. homicide is the leading cause of death three gunmen

in some neighborhoods in this city and every major city around the country they are invariably the african-american and latino communities. both crime and incarceration are dictated by race and class. everybody pays of the cost of crime in ways they are not aware of because we did not used to do things. people talk about the nature -- need to fix land-use policies concentrate population in order to reduce our car been footprint so then they drive less. nobody in that discussion has mentioned the reason they move to the suburbs of the first place is to get away from the crime and if we cannot fix the crime problem we cannot get people back into the city's. the fear of crime ships

everybody's life when i was 13 i lived in baltimore i was a baseball fan and i was cheap and the most cost-effective way was the "twilight" night doubleheader they knew only paid one admission soap ads 6:00 would take a bus changing in a rough parts of a rough town. watch the games and come back at midnight and a change in the same rough neighborhood and my parents who were not by any means negligent, never thought twice it was considered perfectly normal behavior. many kids do not have the freedom that i have them unless they live in a different kind of freedom. crime avoidance has a different set to on poor people if you think about

the economic geography of any city in the united states it is shaped by the fear of crime. huge neighborhoods with well-developed utilities, roads, and factories the mismatch between job opportunities is something everybody knows about a few people who write about that writes about why they move in the first place. it was true when i lived here and it is still true the district of columbia has no movie theater south of capital streak. those are jobs. those are jobs not available to people so when you grow up in a crime neighborhood your opportunity to earn a legitimate wage, the security of what ever you earned your personal security is diminished and

it is not surprising that people turn to crime. one of the lessons that crime is -- those offenders that we have been president and several billion more on probation or bail or used to be in that status, those people are a subset of victims. not as if the world was divided into criminals and victims may be pretty madoff was never victimize before we he is unusual most people who turned into long term is serious offenders were abused as children, beaten up on the schoolyard or and victimization in a myriad of ways. as with crime we have an enormous disproportion by race a wish that was true due to racism or decisions

within the criminal justice system to publish black and latinos were heavily but if it were true you could fix that can fix the criminal-justice system if you look at the numbers perpetration since almost all crime is committed within instead of across class lines you will discover you will see it is roughly disproportion in the offending rate so if you look at the african abortion -- african-american proportion is different but it is the same. it is the same in prison as the melodrama with a victim and ability and i want to say it is a tragedy. it is not all clear to me that you make the average african-american community releasing back into it all vendors that are back in prison.

they are mostly not there for nothing but the present today is that a lifetime achievement award. we are massively to many people behind bars. congressman scott said we cannot solve this problem with sound bites but let me offer a couple that may help to clarify. harvard law school did a calculation and took the african american prison population and the total population and divided see you have prisoners per capita. that number is higher than if you did that with the soviet population in 1952 in the land of the free. this is not okay. the current level of incarceration is not sustainable or tolerable so high degree get out of that trap if we also think crime is a real problem for

precisely the communities affected by incarceration? to get more bang for the buck. to get every day do the maximum amount of investment work to not have the three strikes clause. we need to learn how to punish people and control behavior. without locking them up. and we also have to take advantage of the many opportunities to do crime control without enforcement. it is not true randomly increase social services spending would have a big impact on crime it is true almost every social service agency could make a large crime into a contribution if it was focused in that direction. i have some examples. lincoln said if we knew where we were and how we got here and where we were

going, we might figure out what to do about it. let me give you a key and history how we got there. starting with 1962 there are a million theories why we had a crime boom but since none of the people who made up those theories predicted in the first place you can take it with a grain of salt. i have my own theory that covers all of the facts. we had a crime boom in the face of the economic boom then 15 or 20 years behind that we had a prison boom. i was one of the people back in the late seventies or early eighties 263 decreasing capacity in the face of an explosion there for making crime a lot safer to commit from applied to view of the offender and i sped we have to close prisons. there was a case for that at

the time i think but like most people who said that back then, i now feel like the sorcerer's apprentice. does this have an office which? because we continue to build prisons in 1994 then as crime dropped through the floor, we continue to build more prisons and now we have 2.4 million people i change the talk because the number goes up and to say the fiscal crisis will put a crimp in that but maybe not permit it. unfortunately it is not true that prisons are very expensive the total budget is about $15 billion which is about a quarter of total law enforcement spending with elementary and secondary education summit is not the case there is tons of money that we could

spend on social programs instead although i am glad the crisis is slowing down but it is not the best reason. and partly as a result crime did go down but it is a little surprise why it did not go down more. if we had a tripling or quadrupling of the population and the crime rate than the punish before cry must have gone up by a factor of 10. or a benefactor of six. so we septupled and it only went down 50%? the demand for burglary must not be sensitive to the price. for drugs, we have multiplied by 15 in the number of cocaine users in

prison but the price is gone down 90%. for some reason we are running into a failure. not a complete failure but not doing the job that it should and engineers have a saying that when brute force fails come you're not using enough. [laughter] which is the slogan of our criminal justice system for as far as i can tell for the last 40 years. what is the puzzle? i think the answer is severity is no substitute for swiftness and certainty when it comes to changing behavior. moreover, it is the enemy. a severe penalty cannot be applied with certainty because you run out of cells. every person doing it 25 to life for stealing a slice of these is keeping 50 people away six months sentences for stealing a car and of

course, the more severe the penalty the more it is resisted and a more due process. you have to learn how to deliver the the minimum effective dose of punishment. any more than the minimum effective dose is too much. it is said that the optimist sees a class adds half full and a pessimist as half empty but the engineer sees twice as much class as you need for the watcher and that is the criminal-justice system today. we have to teach the system what everybody has ever successfully raised a child or trained a puppy, nobody knows. clearly communicated and consistently forced. and if you do that, you can make threats and warnings for most of the work progress my teacher likes to

say, the perfect right is the one that never has to be carried out. that is the way to get around the paradox of too much crime and too much punishment. what the threats to more of the work. when i worked in boston city hall there is a little bit of corruption and nobody's deals a hot so stove was the same. of you make a consequent immediate enough you can change behavior. let me give you examples. think of the work i have been doing is that i have been trying to prove it is possible to do in theory would a bunch of people have already done in practice. high point* north carolina this is david kennedy's project he is a john j. now we were together at the kennedy school. we were thinking about cracking down on the drug

markets and it turns out that from a pressure point* of new york that if you put enough cops in a flagrant job market area and make enough arrest you can break the market and when it is broken, it stays broken because it only exists because people expect me to come and buy and sell and you can put the market out of business it is ferociously expansive. operation pressure point* 1,000 copps, a six months and the convictions did not go up with somebody not being convicted of a burglary so david and i was sitting around trying to figure out how you can shorten the time it took the drug dealers to figure out you cannot deal here anymore and david said what if you

put up posters? would you just put up posters saying the market is closed as of november 1st? nobody would be here dealing because you will be arrested. who will show up to deal that day? if the answer is only a few people than you can rest all of them. you might be able to do a crackdown without penalizing the criminal-justice system. 20 years later he got the police to try that. they were frustrated they had a crack market on the west and. high point has 100,000 people it is economically depressed and had a crack market from the beginning of crack. , served the making arrests but there's always a replacement dealer that is why it is useless to put them in prison. if there are bad people on

other grounds but to put them in prison does not eliminate drug dealing the way putting a burger other inmates a burglary. but not to compete for opportunities bed drug dealers have to compete for customers. so they did community organizing and the story is told in david's book, deterrence and crime-prevention "but i will skip to the meat. they identified all of the dealers in the market, there were only 16 still active mostly living at home with their brothers because now making below minimum wage a identified dead dealers then invited the three of them who were genuine bad guys who shot people they could not prove that but when they had a case against every

drug dealer in the market, they arrested the three super bad guys and sent them to prison and consisting of a copy and community member inviting them to any meeting at police headquarters promising they would not be arrested and encouraging mom to come along. they came and watched a video of them making drug sales and police said raise your hand when you see yourself committing a felony [laughter] they handed out of books to each dealer with a felony case against him in it including the arrest warrant waiting for the judge signature. then did she said now that i have your undivided attention i have an announcement to make. the market is closed. nobody is dealing in the west end from now on.

you are not dealing any more. if we small that you are dealing, you will go away. we do not have to buy from you, we have already bought. the next morning, the market was closed. nobody was there. some frustrated buyers were there but nobody was selling. one day later somebody said this is great. i have a monopolistic crack he got popped the first day. then there were not any dealers and two weeks later there were no buyers. and they made five arrests and the market is still closed for govett did not eliminate the crack problem. you can still buy crack there on the edge of town not a single of dancer has complained. the point* of the program is not to abolish crack dealing or get their drug it was to return the west and to the people who live there and

that worked. people are pushing baby strollers what used to be a war zone. this is now been replicated in east hampstead and other places. were all right. honolulu, steve u.s. attorney now a court judge probation officers the bringing him probation for revocation seven, eight, 10 kumbaya 12 and din been they had an average of 14 prior arrests and fit judge said to probation officers okay i see why i should provoke him he is not getting the message but why get this file now while it is too

late? is number nine violation what happened the first eight times. the officer said your honor, we have caseloads of 180. they come in once a month for 10 percent don't show up , a 20% are dirty. we cannot write to all of those reports and if we did you would not hold the hearings so we do what we can and the ones that we can't we bring to you. the judge said i hear you and i understand but you would not train a puppy that way or raise your kid that way. i want to know about the first violation. the probation officer said, but your honor, , is there some parts of impossible for you like us to explain more slowly? we cannot do that. the judge was very reasonable and said okay. make a list of the people who have fouled up so often

that you bring them to me. that was 35 and he called all of the men for a new judicial procedure he called on the spot called a morning hearing and read them the riot act. from now on you call this the number every day if you're color comes up it is your day to come in for drug testing if you don't show up we will chase you if you show of dirty you go to jail that night. i promise. you are grown-ups come to take responsibility and show up for the testing and between. i hope i don't see you again. 30% violation rate he expected to have 10 hearings the first week in and he had three. the next week he had to. more of those never had to come in for a setian because nobody steals a hot stove. that was true with a very

high index now we have done a randomized controlled trial and the results are clear. something like 80 percent of a group of chemically active methamphetamine users will be stable and the committee for periods of months, just by telling them there will be a consequence. now it is boiled down to a small minority there really does need treatment. it saves about $6,500 per year big decrease in recidivism.

the people did not go to jail for probation violation any more than anybody else but they had more spells but they were shorter. it turns out you can actually in force probation and even make methamphetamine addict stop using. i claim you can control any behavior that you can monitor. for $1 per day you can monitor somebody. commercial services will sell you a service for a gps unit to going your kids backpack if he is not where he is supposed to me you get a text message on yourself on the flip that with a tamper evident anklet i cannot commit a crime that you do not know about. if he does not take it off you cannot do anything for you could not place him at the scene of the crime. i do not know what fraction of our prisoners i dunno

what fraction to do that to blend guessing that would not be a bad sanction to maybe be on a monitor and curfew. i do not know the fraction but just to take them off drug use would reduce crimes by 50% i don't know the combination of that would be but i think it would be effective and with the 2.5 million behind bars how many would where the anklet? instead of doing something truly horrible they got the crime rate down at 10% otherwise it would have been for 10% of the cost of a prison cell you have a terrific bargain. we can have half as much crime and half as much incarceration. we should not ignore all of the things we can do outside the criminal justice system

to reduce crime. if we spend more money on social services we would not need prisons. it is not possible on the other hand, we have not really focused on the specific social service programs to make a big difference. 69% reduction in the u.s. of kids who were randomly assigned to have them there rather than not. not very expensive. the good behavior game which basically gets kids in school to compete in teams for which team can compete better, more reduction of drug use among kids to get the program than any drug prevention program. starting the high school day longer so the kids have to good hours to commit burglary is when nobody is home would reduce crime and

see that teenagers like to sleep plate. gasoline may have been a single most important contributor of the crime reduction of the 1990's. it is dave ferociously commodity. lead paint is still in apartments. if we cleaned of the problem under per-cent we would get more than that and crime reduction. we have it terrible pair of problems reno is new it did seem half as much cursor ration 10 years from now because i'm not predicting we can make the criminal-justice system and other agencies do the job that has to be done. when experiment took two years to persuade a bunch of district of columbia judges to try sanctions instead of mandatory treatment as a way

to do with heroin use. he took two weeks for the heroin users under sanctions to stop using heroin. and the conclusion was changing addict behavior is easy but changing the judge behavior is hard. [laughter] the terminals can respond if we can't get public-service to respond. that is a challenge in front of us who do not have to mix of the rear now excepting and can we get beyond the quest of revenge and do pass to be done to control crime and reduce the number of people behind bars. thank you very much. [applause] i think we have time for the interesting part which is questions and comments but i am sure some people have to go.

we see the same hands. of. >> i know that it has been done locally and in a few places that the judicial system. >> there is something that is formation there is still some probation and also mandatory release, supervised release it is called probation at the federal level for eastern missouri, st. louis, as first was to be a spectacular job oriented the probation officer said it is your job to get them jobs. not job readiness or training.

the man who runs the montgomery county center here is doing the same sort of thing and it seems you can get a job if you want to one and that is so you get out of prison is if you want a job. the state offender group with a lot of gang bankers has a lower unemployment rate and the city of st. louis because it turns out if you call an employer and has a minimum wage employee who has to show for work every day sober, they wanted that so i don't think it is serious probation and parole supervision could substantially reduce the disadvantage that felons now face in the labor market. i actually have very substantial hoping for that. >> but what about the district of north carolina?

i know federal probation office is trying to bring the program. >> but that is jobs focused. i want to see you can add to that with drug testing. >> but the pending. madoff for him to get out of prison but probably not. >> those charges are pretty serious. >> can you point to examples of similar in effect you talk to the changes to probation and the example that the time line in texas that they're building new prisons instead of investing

to reduce the problems after words. >> evaluation literature is not overwhelmingly powerful. pretty clear it is not useful. it is not entirely clear to me on the other hand, the mike every county pre-trial release center, is essentially a jail, is run on the principle you have no privileges, that you do not earn by your activities to find a job. every time you do something toward finding a job you get later nights come a more tv and more phone calls and when you have a job, you have a privilege and that turns out to work fine. again, it is the same elementary incentive management problem but if

you have a 1500% jlo running at 140% of capacity it is hard to do that. one of the things that i believed it but do not have knowledge as we do better with the thames at that size a lot less gang problem and opportunity to do that stuff and not as many different kinds of services but that is pure speculation. what i would do is evaluate prison wardens on the basis of recidivism rate. you figure out what you have to do to get them not to come back it is elementary but the main action is on the committee corrections side the kit you can only teach somebody how to behave increased -- present was a behave at home they can stay

at home so that is for ic the big opportunity. deprivation system is caught in another social trap and a low resource, low prestige activity. nobody looks at the probation department to control crime if someone is arrested for crimes operation of a reno said it failed if you think about it is a serious indictment that nobody expected them to succeed. they get $1,000 per year than i get much corporation for the fabs and because they are low performance they get low resources and because their low resources they have low morale they're low performance and then you are stuck in the trap and somebody has to do what steve did witches move them to the center. i don't think doubling deprivation budget would do anything at all because that

just makes it more broken but what you ought to do without adding resources it turns out hope cost a lot less and the program it would cost it looks like it is perfectly feasible. is to show corrections are a heart problem. >> one other off the wall suggestion basically texas gave them a present a lot of first amendment arguments and uneven an evangelical protestant. why not have church represents? [laughter] i want to see the reconciliation and american civil liberties union run the prison they want to run. what the flowers bloom.

all the money they save and they pay out in bribes and excessive executive salaries. so they are not outperforming but again as a charter school i think this will only work it would make it viciously a darwinian bird you have three years to 63 we're gone you cannot have an entitlement but we should have respectable groups to have a chance to see what they can do. i do not believe that we're doing now is the best we can do and it is unlikely to perform within the bureaucratic system i am from a charter prisons.

>> what about health insurance reform? >> was afraid somebody would ask that question. the restart with one that will not happen. there is not a nickel in this bill for prison or jail house. that is a disgrace from a public health point* of view if you want to fix the infectious disease problem the jail is where you look everybody who is sick comes through the jail and comes out sector and capable of transmitting the disease as they picked up to everybody else. it is a catastrophe. there is something about that i can perfectly understand given the fuss we had about the immigrants i can see nobody wants to do anything with prisoners but if you want to do something you have to do that. whether parts of the routine prenatal care, you can do it by picking a people who are particularly needy, not unreasonable and we can say one visit is part of routine

prenatal care it is up to the health insurance and then it is up to the visitor to say you decline and here's my card if you needed vice or to say to the initial screening was the first visit which means you don't have to pick out people who are at risk and do that through the health insurance bill. bid is legitimate but saved expenditures how many do have to prevent to make that program easily pay for itself? that is the biggest. there is other stuff i do not know with health legislation but if somebody comes into a doctor's office with a sexually transmitted disease they will try to treat the disease there also try to make sure that disease is not transmitted that is part of the medical function.

gunshot wounds are highly infectious. they have had one they are very likely to give one to somebody else. [laughter] yet the trauma center does not regard preventing the infection of gunshot wounds. why the hell not? i think there are pieces of that. get pediatricians to ask. they have enormous amount of authority the way others don't. if they ask questions about his behavior is for drug abuse and crime it would make a huge change but the cost would be minor. the way to get them trained. >> i am wondering one thing about one other aspect of health care your remarks how

to address addiction reduction or elimination or the behavior of the criminal-justice system are not meeting expectations as opposed to all at once to treat people back in prison so there seems to be syndication that has an impact of keeping people. >> if not putting people back and present a couple of. >> that is what i mean if you fail you go back to prison. small jokes. with everybody having a health card with the indication one of the reasons before it gets to

the part where the crime is committed to support their habits, we will all have access. we'll having a health card the impact on that and the treatment before before? >> i am not optimistic are enthusiastic because as part of a routine annual physical you can pick up people with not a lot of problems but for that level intervention goes a long way but i have health insurance my doctor doesn't ask me about my drug use or drinking when i come in for an annual physical. that is pretty good. >> you are out of a point*

where you are supporting the habits and one way to address the problem is to drop the have it. will the ability to do that be any different? >> something to be in this bill, something they passed last year is parity for substance abuse. that can make some difference i am not convinced the barriers for treatment are a major cause of our addiction problem? the major barrier is people who have at least as much on the demand side as the supply side. when i lived in boston we had an expression for somebody who had a price intentioned but not likely to be filled and good luck to you and of the red sox. [laughter] that is basically my view

from people who think they can treat addiction better. but there is limits civic isn't there a capacity problem there are no providers? >> there are scattered access problems. there is never enough. there's always a waiting list for methadone problems the single most effective form of drug treatment. hands down. look at the research literature nothing even comes close but there is a curious produce -- prejudice against it that means they have to be in the clinics that mostly those with less serious problems still true you cannot get day this prescription give to come into a clinic every day four if you are a really good boy maybe they will give you a weekend takeover supply.

it is chemical probation you never travel there is a wonderful drug that was knocked off because of a tiny incidents of a heart valve problem and that was a tragedy. opium substitution methadone off the market people are often easier to get. there is never a net residential treatment predictor they never enough for women with children. because then you have to be licensed not just as a drug treatment program but as a day care facility. that is a nightmare. it seems 13 talking therapy, the problem is people don't show up. if we put more money into the budget certainly not like anything that we have seen but the pressures are not a special population.

the most of the drug users they do something to get arrested for curfew have day trust fund or rock band door lobbying practice you might be able to afford your have it to do anything that you did not get arrested. but most of the people who have heavy drug habits the want to knock the heavy use that as a place to approach with the longer sentences to have proof that that does not reduce crime? >> that is a question not answerable by research you have two many different variables working i think it is pretty clear it is better

to give out punishment and short chunks if for no other reason than a 20 year sentence, most of it happens more than 10 years from now. 10 years from now he will be retired criminally any way. so we're basically turning our prisons into retirement communities for former burglars. that is clearly not efficient. on the other hand, those of a high rate of serious crimes adjust makes sense to put them away for a long time to protect the rest of us. i did not one is a generically their bad that the current system and save the over relies on those sentences too many long sentences it will hit people who are about 35 which are passed the prime crime committing years. the age structure of crime is about the same as sports.

>> >> but with the entire election cycle did not talk about social security. >> of some of the. >> we were told his qualify you get 30 years to serve without parole in the federal system then it kicks in after that of there 35 already come a they are 65, well past the prime age. we asked, how many people there were that had committed three strikes and got out and commit to a fourth suggesting maybe getting to the third strike but they said they would get back to us. >> my dream of the gps

monitor system you can take a bunch of the geriatric cases in california is a constitutional provision you cannot let people out early on a strike. but if we have to have people out of the present people who want to let out 55 year-old's second and third strike and put them on a gps monitor. that is right. but if we can continue to get the crime rate down we can address the crime issue with that is the better chance to have a policy. but that is the hope of the moment. we have not exhausted the topic i have exhausted your patience. think if anybody wants to

talk. i will be around. thank you. [applause] . .