everyone has been very, very gracious to me. and colonial williamsburg, so thank you for coming out today. as john told you, i am a lawyer by trade, but, please, do not hold that against me. [laughter] [laughter] ..

>> unfortunately, there were only three parachutes remaining. the doctor grabbed one and said i'm a doctor, i save lives, so i must live and jumped out. the lawyer then said, i'm a lawyer, and lawyers are the smartest people in the world. so i must live, and he jumped out. he grabbed a parachute and jumped. the priest looked at the little boy and said, my symptom i've lived a long and fruitful life. you are young and have all your dreams ahead of you. take the parachute and live in peace. the little boy handed the parachute back to the priest and said, not to worry, father, the smartest men in the world just took off with my backpack.

[laughter] >> let me talk briefly about my dumont, "in defense of thomas jefferson." and thank you for coming out here. i really appreciate that. i believe my book once and for all proves that the sally story is pure fiction, possibly revisionist of politics him but certainly not historical facts or science. in my view, it reflects a recycled inaccuracy for over 200 years. let me preface my remarks by saying i am not a professional historian. i'm not a jeffersonian scholar. for the past 26, 27 years, my expertise has been in courtrooms giving the most persuasive

arguments, getting incredible evidence to a jury. so as a civil litigator i have tried to analyze and research every scholarly book, article, committee report, 18th century letter and ancillary material relevant to the single, inflammatory subject of whether thomas jefferson had a sexual relationship with sally hemmings. in writing this book, i gained access to never before and seen correspondence, and personal interviews with jeffersonian insiders, intimately involved in the distorted and misleading bna. they revealed how evidence was manipulated into a censored pre-determined official conclusion giving the false stigma of jefferson's guilt to the american public. in contrast to the blizzard of recent agenda driven books spinning the controversy as a

miniseries of history, i found that layer upon layer of evidence points to a mosaic distinctly away from mr. jefferson. with one in evitable conclusion. the historians have the wrong jefferson. the dna as well as the other historical evidence matches perfectly to his younger brother, randolph, as the true candidate for a sexual relationship with sally. quite simple, my book presents the most credible evidence which completely exonerates mr. jefferson. so let me give you a summation. if i were a trial lawyer defending mr. jefferson in court, let me give you my summation, my final argument to you as a jury, and as to a jury in the public arena. ladies and gentlemen of the

jury, today, the reputations of america's founding father seems to be in disrepair. 21st century americans seem skeptical of greatness. just as oliver wendell holmes obdurate, quote, belittling arguments always have a force of their own. but you and i believe that high-mindedness is not impossible in men. the evidence in this case proves one of two things. thomas jefferson is either the most prolific, hypocritical liar and american history. or he is the victim of the most profane, scurrilous defamation of character allegation in legal annals. there is no middle ground. there is no compromise. the evidence since the inception of the sally myth 200 jezebel, many americans want passionately

to believe that thomas jefferson fathered some or all of sally's children. whether or not the evidence supports this charge or not, the legend that jefferson took sally as his lover, refuses to die because it is not good enough for some to know that his brother, randolph, or his nephew, keep your car, can't sally as their mistress. for neither randolph north teater car can be made a symbol for america. and didn't revisionism, however, is not a substitute for concrete facts and relevant evidence. blatant speculation is not drawn with a sharp pencil but a broadbrush. thomas jefferson, both the man and his family i'm out to something more important than sordid gossip, now obscuring his

memories. the hemmings case against mr. jefferson breasts on three skeletal pieces of evidence that i want to talk about tonight. framed by a selective exclusion of all these exculpatory evidence point to mr. jefferson's complete innocence. number one, the hearsay testimony of sally's son, madison, who gave an interview to a politically biased editor 50 years after the fact stating that he, madison, was the son of thomas jefferson. number two, the unreliable documentation stating the physical presence of jefferson at the time of each of sally's conceptions. and three, the misleading bna which would be excluded in a real trial and discredited in whole or part. so let's talk about the most

credible evidence that completely exonerates and proclaimed mr. jefferson's innocence. and let me borrow from david letterman's top 10 reasons, and i've expanded this a little bit. these are the top 16 reasons why thomas jefferson did not have a sexual relationship with sally hemmings. the top 16 reasons why thomas jefferson did not have any relationship with sally hemmings. number one, i feel like i need a drumroll. randolph jefferson, the president's younger brother is sally's most likely sexual partner. he would have the same jeffersonian y-chromosome as his older brother, and it matched perfectly good dna. randolph had a reputation for socializing with the slaves at night, and he was expected at monticello approximately nine

months before astin was born, the dna back. what a coincidence. this was proven by a letter that i found in the university of virginia archives. this is not mirko incidents, since the oral history of astin's descendents in 1976 held that they descended from a jefferson uncle. randolph was known at monticello as i'll go randolph. number two, the misleading bna result would be excluded any real trial. because it did not come from thomas jefferson. the dna was taken from descendents of his paternal uncle, feel jefferson. but even assuming that dna was admitted into a real trial, the results are gross distortions at best, and utterly misleading at

worst. they matched a male jefferson, not thomas jefferson. randolph chester o jefferson hae subs. thomas jefferson had all female children, except for an infant who died within two weeks. the dna match was to a male child. the dna does not exclude or rule out either one or both of the carr brothers brothers, except as eston. peter carr in fact admitted his paternity to jefferson's grandson, jeff randolph. finally, at least eight other jefferson males in and around monticello are candidates for eston hemmings. number three, the virulent rumor was first started by the

unscrupulous candle mold journalist james callender, who burned for political revenge against jefferson. calendar was described as close an alcoholic thug with a foul mind obsessed with race and sex who attempted to defame the public career of thomas jefferson. by today's standards, he would be the equipment of a reporter for the national inquirer. almost every scandalous story about jefferson which is still whispered or believed may be traced to the scurrilous writings of callender. as a historian stated, callender's charge has been dragged after jefferson like a dead cat through the pages of formal and informal history. the allegations against mr. jefferson would suspect from

the beginning, because they issued from the vengeful pen of an unscrupulous man, and were promulgated in the spirit of bold political partisanship. yet, this jury is asked to believe that after callender broadcast his lies to the world in 1802, thomas jefferson was so brazen as president to have two more children with sally hemmings. this devise good commonsense. number four, the one credible eyewitness to this entire sexual allegation is admin bacon. admin bacon was jefferson's overseer at monticello who saw another man, not jefferson, and he wrote this down. not thomas jefferson, another man leading sally's room, quote, many a morning.

bacon wrote, quote, i have seen him come out of her mother's room many a morning when i went up to monticello very early. number five, jefferson's health. jeffersons health, especially in the last two decades of his life were physically prevent an otherwise dissuade him from a vibrant sexual relationship with a 14 year-old girl. he suffered severe migraine headaches, diarrhea, rheumatoid arthritis, diabetes, and emotional distress over the loss of his wife, the death of his daughter and his finances. it is simply beyond common sense to believe he was having an ongoing sexual relationship at the age of 64. he complained to john adams, quote, my health is entirely

broken down within the last eight months. number six, jefferson owned three different slaves named sally, adding to the historical confusion. yet he never freed his supposedly over of 38 years, sally hemmings, from her enslavement, or ever mentioned her in his will. seven, the paternity believers rely heavily on the sketchy circumstantial evidence of the birth records of all of sally's children, proof that jefferson was present at monticello during all of sally's conceived pregnancies. this is absolutely false, since it assumes that sally was also present at all the times that jefferson was present in monticello. sallies simultaneous physical presence in monticello with jefferson is completely unknown

by any recorded evidence. this false and misleading assumption skews the entire time in debate. in fact, there are a specific letter in 1802 from jefferson to his daughter, which reasonably implies sally, as was her sister, may have been elsewhere besides monticello. number eight, the confusing testimony of madison hemmings, who gave an interview to an abolitionist editor has been discredited and i'm out to nothing more than scripted hearsay, gossip, and speculation. moreover, his capacity to observe events that occurred some four years earlier lack of certainty, clarity and veracity. madison was coached by a politically activist editor, s. f. wetmore who had both a motive and political bias against

jefferson as a slaveholder, and as a gives the south in general. in fact, it is clear that wetmore was a radical abolitionist wrote some or all of madisons interview, verbatim himself, based on calendars original article in 1802, using some of the very same language. number nine, three eyewitnesses who intimately knew both sally and jefferson, martha, his daughter, ellen coolidge, jeff randolph, his grandchildren, all found the accusations inconceivable, and never witnessed any hints of sexual liaison or impropriety. in fact, there's not any evidence to prove cohabitation or any physical intimacy between jefferson and sally during the 37 years that she lived in

monticello, on and off. most important, at least four witnesses prove that jefferson was not in physical proximity to sally for 15 months prior to the birth of her son, who most resembled jefferson. martin randolph, thomas jefferson randolph, and biographer henry randall. 10, in the year 2001, there was little noticed of a 13 member blue-ribbon panel of prominent histories, black, white, male and fino, known as the scholars commissioned. after a year of investigating history's most famous paternity case, the independent historians known as the scholars commissioned, tamp down the simmering allegation, and this was their finding. quote, our conclusions ranged from serious skepticism about

the charge to a conviction that it is almost certainly false. let me say that again. the 13 scholars, quote, our conclusions ranged from serious skepticism about the charge to a conviction that it is almost certainly false. the scholars commissioned for the most expert, the most notable independent jefferson scholars, who led their expert opinions to this jury and agree that the accusation of an affair lacks not only credibility, but would be utterly outside the moral character of thomas jefferson. said the preeminent historian who served on the panel and who i interviewed personally, quote, thomas jefferson was simply not guilty of the charge. mcdonald and other panel members pointed to the real suspect, jefferson's brother, randolph.

in fact, the scholars commission concluded the most logical, and credible evidence points to randolph who was unmarried, in his early '50s, and no for socializing with the monticello slaves. randolph, unlike his accomplished brother, was easily influenced by others. in fact, i found an old militia list reveals connections between randolph and white men with black mistresses in two cases, both hemmings. more importantly, the scholars commissioned concluded that revisionist slave historians have misread language and en vogue explanation to misinterpret jeffersons motives. the sally story reflects one of the most striking dereliction's of scholarly integrity in american history are the. 11, jefferson never denied the

accusation publicly, although he denied it and private writing to two cabinet members, both levi lincoln, his attorney general and his secretary of the navy, robert smith. to deny the allegation public, however, would have been to slander the reputations of his father-in-law, john wales, who purportedly was the father of sally hemmings. his beloved wife's memory and either his own brother randolph, or his two favorite nephews, the carr brothers, who admitted their paternity of sally's children to jeff randall. as a man of devotion and family honor, jefferson chose to suffer in silence. 12, the hemmings true believers. like professor annette gordon reed, have turned the debate into an obsessive agenda on the

color of sally's skin and slave status. gordon reed's assessment, it must be taken on face value because white historians had previously ignored it are not facts, but racial canards and misinterpretations of the evidence itself. moreover, that is an intellectually dishonest argument. to paraphrase one historian, quote, i'm afraid that professor gordon reed, despite her admiral under an admirable qualities, is the worst thing to happen to thomas jefferson since james callender. this latest have taken diversity and created a hostile environment in the academic world in which scholars feel pressured to accept the hemmings myth as historical truth.

ladies and gentlemen of this jury, justice is supposed to be colorblind, and neither race nor gender nor bias have any place in a court of law. nor in the court of public opinion. the only question before this jury is what is the most credible and reasonable and believable evidence, not jefferson's view on race or slavery, but whether it is proved beyond and to the exclusion of every reasonable doubt, as to whether he had a sexual relationship with a 14 year old girl. 13, when it came to women, jefferson's true nature was sheepish, some would say awkward and geekish, but certainly not lustful. his marriage proposal to his first love, rebecca burwell, was

in 1763, and that illustrates the point. jefferson was so nervous that he could barely utter his words. he later reflected on his disastrous experience in the famous apollo room just a few blocks from a. he said that he was overwhelmed with strange confusion that deteriorated into a few broken sentences. later in life he was in his home life that monticello with his wife, who he called paddy, and after her death he was deeply conflicted over his romantic feelings for the married maria causeway in paris. the sexual allegation and conduct towards sally is contrary to jeffersons refined and reticent nature towards women. 14, some paternity believers are

quick to believe jefferson was a brutal rapist, slaveholder. yet, when jefferson arrived at monticello from paris after a five year absence, his servants were so overjoyed to see him that they unhitched his forces, pulled out his carriage up to the last ridge of the mound, then carried to their master into their arms into the house. quote, it seemed impossible to satisfy their anxiety, to touch and kiss the very earth which boreham, patty jefferson, his daughter wrote. 15, the hemmings would have you believe that the absence of any letters to or from sally and thomas jefferson are evidence of a family cover-up. this is one of the many examples of total lack of information as proof of their sordid

allegation. it merely shows that some ardent revisionists, hemmings historians will fill in the blanks to convert innocent information into incriminating information. 16, finally, perhaps the most important point in mr. jefferson's favor, unlike his brother by taste and training, thomas jefferson was raised as the perfect virginia gentleman, a man of refinement, intellect, who was taught and trained at the college of william and mary, and was taught and trained by george with. the personality of the man who figures in the hemmings soap opera cannot be attributed to the known nature of thomas jefferson. having an affair with a house servant would be preposterously out of character for thomas

jefferson. jefferson was arguably the most accomplished than whoever occupied the white house. naturalists, lawyer, educator, musician, architect, geographer, inventor, scientist, farmer, philosopher, and more. one of his biographers characterized his subject as a man, quote, who could eclipse, calculate and eclipse, survey and the state, tie-in artery, plan edifice, try a cause, braced a horse, dance the minuit, and play the violin. and he was describing a young thomas jefferson, before he wrote the declaration of independence.

commenting on president john f. kennedy's assassination in 1967, walter cronkite said, quote, only in fiction do we find that the loose ends are neatly tied. real life is not all that tight, and neither is the jefferson hemmings case. coming to terms with the jefferson is not easy for some in the 21st century. jefferson was no saint, but none of his biographers claim he was. no one will deny that the facts about the paternity of sally's children are repulsive evidence of one of the worst aspects of the slave system, the manner by which some enslaved women were sexually abused by their masters. but the hemmings myth has come full circle. in 1840, citizens passed a resolution, quote, vindicating

the memory of mr. jefferson from posthumus slanders, with regard to his private character. these individuals were his neighbors, who had the opportunity of personally knowing the true state of facts. you know, when you visit monticello, is but a short walk from the pastoral west lawn down the sloping hill to jeffersons gravesite. as one enters the cemetery, you feel closer to history. you feel closer to thomas jefferson. who once wrote that politics were the subject i never loved, and now hate. without a doubt, the hemmings controversy and bodies mr. jefferson's senate. on his deathbed jefferson spoke of the slanders and libel against him. uttering, quote, they had never known him. they had created an imaginary

being being clothed with all these attributes to whom they had given his name, and quote. unfortunately, as pulitzer prize-winning historian virginia dabney said, jefferson, quote, is one of the principal historical victims of the current orgy of debunking our heroes. finally, only two people know the true absolute truth. one was sally hemmings, who wrapped herself in a mantle of silence her entire life. she never commented on the accusation. perhaps she believed that it deserved nothing more. as historian john c. miller commented, quote, we know virtually nothing of sally hemmings. or her motives, and she is hardly more than a name in

history. the other witness was thomas jefferson, who denied the charge to friends and colleagues, declaring that, quote, truth is great and will prevail if left to herself. she is the proper and sufficient antagonist to error. ladies and gentlemen of the jury, as jefferson's granddaughter proclaimed, there are such things as moral and possibilities. and although the sally brimmer survives, no reasonable, sensible person hearing all the evidence, not just in the speculation, but hearing all the evidence, has ever declared his or her belief, and neither should this jury. . .

why didn't somebody either send off a nephew or brother if two virginia beach or someplace act? >> did somebody who -- did anyone hear the question? while i think some of his friends, in fact, james madison acted as an inter mary between himself and callender. i think people were trying to

distance himself from callender at the time, but i think jefferson's, i think his whole approach to the whole affair was two have a moment of science, not to comment publicly on the slanders and he didn't feel any one really needed to defend him and because in his view if you deny or admit one slander another 10 are going to come up to use of that was his public stance that he would not deny its in public because what ever you deny or admit something else would come off but i think there are other people behind the scenes, james madison and monroe, who were telling him to distance himself particularly from callender. >> what about the studies on the sally hemmings descendants? >> the dna on sally hemmings? did dna study from what i have

learned and from what i know matched all they can say is that it matched a male white,, a descendant from a field of jefferson matched the descendants from the having said. that is all the dna says. it does not thomas jefferson. there were at least 12 other jefferson's in and around that area at the time, at least of child-bearing age. again, my research shows that in all likelihood the most likely candidate was randolph so all the dna said it was that a male jefferson was a match to a male descendants of sally hemmings. >> as you know, the thomas jefferson association has

accepted the professor recent version of the opportunity. would you care to speculate why they may have done that and would you be willing to, or have you been invited by the morals association up in the monticello to dupage? professor read it on the subject. >> i would be glad to debate professor gordon read anywhere anytime. i have a chapter in my book about kind of the political agenda that i think the official monticello has. i think they do have and had an official who really agenda to kind of promote the story for whatever purpose is to get more business, to raise more money, to have a higher prominence profile of monticello, but i really really disagree with it. in fact, i took to to worse recently of monticello and the sally story was pretty prominent in the tour guide that i took

and i didn't say anything because i was going to write this book but i certainly think that the thomas jefferson memorial foundation founded for the legacy to preserve the legacy of thomas jefferson should neither not mention this or take a very neutral stance. in fact, they just excised the were memorial from their foundation. it's no longer the thomas jefferson memorial foundation. is the thomas jefferson foundation. and for the life of me i can understand that. >> the charges about jefferson's sexual relationships with sally hemmings, as they were developing if jefferson were truly innocent then, of course, he would certainly no, why would he keep her in his household and especially as she continued to

have -- bear children? >> well, there were a couple of reasons. first of all, jefferson inherited it the entire hemmings family from his father-in-law. in fact, betty hemmings was really the surrogate mother of his wife, martha, so jefferson's felt a special affinity for the hemmings from the very start. everything i have read from him and his grandchildren, the hemmings were very trusted, value to servants. and this is why they had a special affinity. and some say that special affinity was because he was having an affair. no, it was because they ever trusted, valued, intellectual people that he had trusted and from his father-in-law. in fact, it was rumored that his father in law was the father of of sally hemmings. this may have been a the reason

why jefferson felt an affinity to treat them kind of as part of the family, certainly more in a special status as the other slaves. not because he was having an affair with her. >> you mentioned in your talk this evening that you've had many interviews. could you tell us some stories about the interviews and when you learned that we might find interesting? >> well, the most interesting into -- i flew down to tuscaloosa, alabama and interviewed professor force mcdonald's. he was one of the professors and historians who served on the scholars commission and i asked him point blank, i go, tell me what you think is some of the most important point that really proves jefferson's innocence in this whole thing and he said,

it's very very easy. let me tell you what people have not seen from the forest from the trees. thomas jefferson had all female children. except for that infant to die. randolph jefferson had six male children. the dna match to a male child. he just told me, what is more common sense? who is more logical as the father of a male child? randolph having six male children or thomas jefferson who had all female children? and that kind of just dawned on me, that was just one of the things that i learned from interviewing these people. before i even researched this book, i really didn't know that thomas jefferson had a younger brother. he was 13 years younger and one historian and described him as a half with. in fact, there's only one book that's been it written about his

brother and that's called, randolph jefferson: -- thomas jefferson and his son and brother and is edited by bernard mayo i believe and that is of the one a book about thomas jefferson and that's where i found it the one letter from thomas jefferson to his brother inviting him to monticello, nine months before sally got pregnant. yes, ma'am did you have a question also? >> quite some time ago i was reading a biography of jefferson and the author discuss a situation about i believe in jefferson's 20s when there was a woman living on a farm with her children, her husband was not present and he had approached her, something. not really clear about the details because it's been quite some time ago. can you talk about that? >> yes, that's called the walker

of their. as a young man when he was a goal he admitted to proposing love with to a handsome woman. her name was mrs. walker, she was married to john walker, i believe his name. they were friends and neighbors. later on in life thomas jefferson wrote an apology and admitted that his condors was completely inappropriate and that's the letter that he wrote to his secretary of the navy, robert smith, where he denied all the other allegations including the sally rumors but admitted in that letter to the walker affair that he behavior badly. so that was known as the walker a fair and he ended that. he was young, he was rejected in he knew that he acted inappropriately. yes, ma'am. >> at the end of the day, how much do you think these rumors

have actually hurts good jefferson legacy, both release certainly but also how much was he really hurt when he was alive? >> well, obviously he wasn't hurt when he was alive because he was reelected after the 1802 calendar -- callender article. >> so he was elected twice. and i often get asked that question, what does it really matter to his legacy. and i think the loan was the best line about that -- you cannot -- you can never not -- not thomas jefferson off his pedestal but you can scribble graffiti on the statute. and i am here and hopefully my book is here to embrace the graffiti. if you know, i had one young lady asked me which side are you on in this controversy? and i asked for -- i answered her i am on the side of truth.

which side are you on? and i think truth always matters and is this -- this why that i believe it is -- i think true voice matters especially to one's legacy. >> i understand that to the grave of one of the madison, is it, was found and the hemmings are not allowing -- the dna to be taken to show whether he was the son or not. >> that is true, it jefferson family historian by the name of her barker has found the grave of the son of madison having, i believe his name is william hemmings. he approached the hemmings and asked them if we could do this dna study because they still have a car blood, they still have the jefferson blood in if, in fact, it matched let's see what it matches -- the hemmings that absolutely not, there are satisfied with the world history and the dna study at this point

and they refuse any further testing on his son. >> [inaudible] >> no, that is in leavenworth, kansas. it is where he is buried i believe. that's where herbert barker who was one of the technical consultants of of my book actually found the grave. and in case anybody is interested in the subject is, there are two other books that i highly recommend. one is fine author in charlottesville, shoes and historian, cindy. jenna. her book is called the jefferson vindicated, and the other is a small book called the jefferson hemmings maf. it is by -- edited by either coats. both of those are excellent books on the subject especially cindy's book about the jefferson health. a really has the most knowledgeable technical expertise on his health at the

time. >> [inaudible] >> the jefferson hemmings myth. and jefferson vindicated by cindy burton. yes, sir. >> how many people -- [inaudible] how many people were on the plantation at any time recorded? >> slaves i believe at the time of his death he had 137 slaves. over his lifetime i believe i have read that he had approximately 200 that came and went. he allowed a son to run away when he turned and run away, in favor of a mature age and had a trade, he allowed them to run away basically, he freed them and he didn't pursue the. but i have read that he had on the plantation anywhere from 137 or 200 slaves.

>> [inaudible] >> there were many, many people that frequented it monticello, especially when he. in fact, he would pick up his daughter martha and martha had 12 children and he would pick up martha and all the grandchildren and take them to speak for and that's another reason why i don't think of a sexual relationship is really credible. there was always family members around, always grandchildren, always children, boys family members around to see and have ice in the years since you have a sexual relationship in front of his own family i think is just really incredible. >> well, i want to thank you very much for coming out today. and i will be glad to sign any books for anybody who wants to come over and talk to me. thank you so much.

[applause] >> william hyland jr. is a trial lawyer and former prosecutor with over 25 years of litigation experience, he currently serves on the floor of a judicial nominating commission. he is a member of the york and virginia historical societies. it for more information visit william hyland jr..com. >> every once in awhile to get the chance to talk to a children's author on booktv. and judy blumenauer is one of the more famous children's authors and she is joining us now while we are doing our show at the national book festival. judy blume why did you start writing? >> i started because i had so much creative energy, locked up inside me. and it was making me sick, i didn't know at that time but i was sick throughout my 20s and once i started to write off all my illnesses magically vanished.

i do think that the creative child, i had a lot of outlets when i was in school and suddenly i didn't have this same. of balance or i didn't know that i did. i didn't know what to do. and once i started to write in i always have the stories inside my head and i let it out and it was cathartic and it was wonderful and it changed my life and to this day it continues to change my life. >> did you write when you were in school? >> never. 2i mean, i can say never but creative writing when i was in school in the '50s was and stressed, it was in something that we did every day. i always like to write. when we were assigned reports other kids were grown and i would think, good, and i worked on at the high-school newspaper. but it never occurred to me that a person to grow up to be a

writer. people who wrote books i thought were dead end. i don't know what i thought. but it was just something so far away that i never dreamed of it and i never knew anybody who wrote, i never knew anybody who had written. and never knew anybody in publishing. so i did this in my own little isolated world. and again, never dreamed of what happened. >> who was the first person that encourage you to start writing again? >> i can say that anyone encouraged me to write. and came from deep inside and what kept me going after my first books first to ms. gibson were rejected i think that determination. i would go in the closet and cry when i got a rejection once or twice and after that it would be, that book, but wait until they see what i'm going to do

next. i do believe that kind of determination is what makes one succeeding. you can be talented and be afraid to do with and while i was a very fearful child i have always been fearless in my riding and i can't explain that, i can't explain that. >> you mentioned that you're fearless in your riding yet some of your writing has been controversial. >> but i never dreamed about that when i was riding. it never occurred to me. i tell people, it's dangerous to think ahead when writing, you don't think about who is going to read your book or about a sensor on your shoulder or a critic on the other shoulder. you just have to write from -- it comes from someplace else and it's so amazing when it actually works, when you sit in that room for a few hours and you look at the time and you know it's the other end of the day and you

think, well -- you look back and say, well, how did i do that, how did i know that because you aren't aware. it isn't a magic but it is. >> is writing isolating? >> well, it is lonely. writing can be really lonely and there was a time in my life when i thought i didn't want to do that anymore. i wanted to be out in the world, i wanted to be an editor, i wanted to work with people. and i never stopped, i never stopped and then i began to be very grateful that i could do this. and there have been other times when i said this is it, and never do this again, it's too hard, it's too painful, i can't go through this again because it is torture for me. as pleasurable as it is when it's working it is torture.

especially if a first draft so i said i was quitting after summer sisters which is an adult model and it took me three years and twentysomething traps and i said i'm never doing this again. if i waited a few years and i could not wait to get back into that little room alone with my characters. >> 20 giraffes, so that it did or did you have an editor you're working with? >> summer more difficult than others and that was a particularly difficult birth. it went through many many many drafts before i ever showed it to an editor. and thanks to that editor, she encouraged me to get it right and by talking with her about it i knew suddenly what i had to do and once i a dot there, you know, i could not stop writing. it was over the summer, i was in

my little cabin and i never wanted to come out. it was working, working, working and it grew and it came together. >> to use a computer? >> well, i started long before there were computers so i have been through manual typewriters, and electric typewriters, and, yes, i use a computer, but i am printing out a lot in corrine -- isn't corrine bibey use the paper and the reason that i am printing out so much is that i have to have a pencil in my hand. and on those printouts with pencil, all of my best ideas coming edits, revisions and i write up and down and over and around and behind. sometimes i can't figure out what i meant, but that's where it's really working. that's what ever it is that happens between the brain and

the pencil in your hand, that's really important to my process. you know, kids would ask me how you do this. i don't know how depraved process works, but i've come to trust this. i have come to trust that it will happen. >> is your computer connected to the internet? do you worry about your manuscripts getting out accidentally? >> i have never thought of that. and, yes, i am on the internet. i have a husband who is extremely high tech and so when i go home and ask him this question i'm sure he is going to laugh and say don't worry. i think any way. >> how anonymous are you these days? can you be anonymous still? >> i can be anonymous enough, sure. and when i am recognized it is the sweetest kind, if you want to call it fame, that you could

possibly have. it is the ups guy saying, your book and a super fudge, was the first book i ever read it. it is giving your credit card to a sales clerk for a waitress person and somewhere and saying, thank you for those books. it couldn't be nicer. but i don't really have any problems with that the. >> except maybe at a book festival. >> do you get mom today? >> today? yes. >> do you enjoy it? >> i enjoy its when is someone to orderly. [laughter] i signed books for two hours and we had to turn away a couple hundred people and that was very sad, i don't like doing that. >> so judy blume, you talk about people coming up and being very nice to you, glad to read your books, but not everyone has liked the topics that you have

picked in your books. when somebody comes up to you and is not a fan, what do you hear and how you respond? >> i don't think i've ever met any of those in person. i have certainly heard from a lot of them in writing, but i don't think anyone has ever come up and attacked may. i don't want to give anybody any ideas here because i wouldn't like that. you know, the urge to keep books from children, the urge to ban books, to challenge books, it is maddening and yet it is interesting because i think it really grows out of the desire, it is fear. it is really fear that if my child reads this book you have written in my child is going to know about this and if my child knows about this maybe it is going to happen to my child or

maybe my child is going to do it or maybe my child is going to ask me questions i'd want to answer or maybe my child is going to get new ideas and i don't want my child to have new ideas, but if you can as a parent talk to your kids all the time about whatever comes up, read the same books they are reading without becoming fearful and just let it happen naturally. talk to your kids about characters and books. a great way to communicate. and don't be afraid and don't be judgmental of what the kids are reading. the important thing is they are rating. >> did your parents encourage your reading and writing when you were wrong? >> my parents totaling first my reading. my parents were both readers and books at our house -- it was never anything off-limits. i said last night when i spoke here that books for a good

thing, everything was a good thing. it was an anything to be afraid of and there was no book in my house and there were many books in my house that i wasn't free to explore. and i was reading a lot of adult books at 12 and 13. i think also because there weren't any young adult books bennett. you went from nancy drew to salinger -- i don't know, john o'hara. i never had the idea that i was reading anything wrong because there wasn't anything wrong. in the workbooks and never to be cherished and they were there for me. the more i explored these books of the more i wanted to read and is repeating that to become a writer. i don't believe that anybody can be a writer who has and first in a reader. >> how many books are you currently working on?

>> currently, i am a one project at a time girl. i have to focus in the end is very hard for me if i can do that. i only take on one project at a time of. >> how many ideas are in your head? >> i don't know. i'm not sure. i never know, it's very interesting. usually use it on the back burner for a really long time before i know this is the day, okay, it is a return, let's see what you have to say and i go into that room and start. but for the first time in my life and idea came to me last year while i was listening to another writer talking about her book and it was just like, being, and it came with and a plot and characters and required research which i have never had the pleasure of doing before because i read contemporary fiction. and this process of doing

research i loved it. i have fallen in love and i don't know if i ever want to do another book without it but i haven't started the book get in my nonfiction writing friends say yes, the research, that is the fun parts. wait until you have to sit down and write the book. the book will be a novel based on something back in the in my town and in the '50s when i was growing up. >> where did you grow up? >> elizabeth, new jersey. >> can you give us an idea of what the event was? >> i would rather not. >> children's author, judy blume, thank you for being on booktv. >> thank you so much, it was fun. >> in "the future of faith", theologian harvey cox analyzes why he believes christian beliefs and dogma appear to be inspiring grass-roots movements in social justice. the westminster presbyterian church in minneapolis hosts the 50 minute event. ..