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tv   International Programming  CSPAN  February 17, 2010 7:00am-7:30am EST

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short lee wachovia, and over the next weeks we had six european nations to step in and recognize the institutions said this was coming at us pretty quickly from all sides. >> it's ironic, but in effect, i think you talked about ken lewis having an appetite for meals or something like that, but if he had made this deal which does not look like necessary the greatest deal, he offered a 70% deal which the next it might have been at zero, but did he kind of save the system forest? >> i tell you, he was a confident, decisive ceo. there's no doubt that was very much a stabilizing, stabilizing action. >> do you think we would have gotten two tuesday on aig if
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there had been action on merrill that they? >> i don't know, know what would've happened. because i don't think, warren, i don't think we could have taken one of the big institution to fail, do you? >> no. >> the system is, i think the thing that is hard for people to understand is, you know, we have 10 institutions that had, 50 to 60 percent of the financial assets in this country and they are so interconnected. i think, in many ways, as bad as this is, and it's terrible, but we look at what could've happened. we were pretty fortunate. >> hank, the british had given you the kind of british like bail warning about the situation
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a couple of days earlier. but in effect, they blocked the barclays acquisition of lehman. do you think they understood what the consequences were? >> i don't know everything they understood, but remember, there was a requirement for a shareholder vote. >> but we overcame a lot of things in this country. >> that's right. and then what we needed was, we needed a buyer that could do what j.p. morgan did with bear stearns, which was filled the capital hole and didn't guarantee the trading during a shareholder vote. because there was no authority to do this in the u.s.
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and what i think people have a hard time understanding, because we are the united states of america, and i had a hard time understanding until i started overturning, turning over every stone to see what authorities we had, that there was no authority to guarantee liabilities or to put capital into institutions. but in any event, i'm not sure what -- but the british were, i had said in the book, i did use some rational language when i was disappointed, but as i said in a book, as i reflected on it, they obviously their own issues they were looking at, and the regulator, it was for them a very difficult, must've been a very difficult decision to let one of their banks go ahead and in the middle of a run on lehman
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brothers, step in and make an acquisition and be confident that they had the wherewithal to do that. >> hank, lima did go down on that sunday. and barclays then bought apart, it much smaller transaction. i think is tuesday to wednesday that the british authority -- like as the british authorities said that if you had an account with lehman, they were keeping your securities there, you couldn't take it out. i mean, they froze the accounts basically, which i gather came as a big surprise to you. it sort of came as a big surprise to me. >> that was, i think that shocked the markets. my recollection is it was tuesday, that i could be wrong. because i recall learning about it tuesday, and that was
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actually the day that, of the aig rescue. but what happened was, a collateral third party customer with a collateral accounts, broker dealer and were frozen for a while, and investors need to know that their accounts were safe. and of course, when they worked with -- worked with lehman brothers in the u.k., there's a big emotion with confidence in the investment banking model, the viability of the investing banking wow. >> that wouldn't have happened in the united states. you would've had access to your securities. as i remember, that didn't get publicized much but it was a huge shock. did they consult -- >> if they did it was a with me remember, the sec was a
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regulator, so the sec was the regulator for lehman brothers, and was the one, that had the lead in preparing for the bankruptcy, because we knew that was going to be a possibility. we hope to avoid it. and they were the ones that would've been talking to the various authorities during that period of time. but it sure came as a surprise to a lot of investors, and as a surprise to me. >> hank, you and i own, and we owned it entirely, a huge investment banking for trading. and it is our only family assets. we can't sell it. and we got all these talented people making lots of money. your head of the compensation committee. what sort of arrangement do you have with them? can anybody make 25 or 50 million a year? how are you going to treat these people so that they keep making
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money for us and they don't leave and go someplace else? >> well, i would say we may have to talk about when it is we're doing this and when it is we're making this decision. >> let's say we're doing it today. [laughter] >> well, today, warren, you've got to know that you and i, as i say and as i write in the book, and i would have these conversations with wendy all the time during a nine period, that i think that the compensation levels on wall street, you know, are out of whack. so i just lay that just in general during benign times. and i think you would, too. just as in general in terms of, number one. and number two, today in light of everything that's gone on and the fact that the taxpayer came in, and granted, that the reason the taxpayer did was to prevent
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calamity, but came in and help the whole financial system. so not just the big banks and investment banks, but hedge funds, everyone. i think that today, restraint is very much in order by the top people. and i think the anger is coming from, if you have losses you are supposed to their responsibility for those losses. so the way i've talked about it is, i've talked about it and said i'd like to see this anger channeled, and i'd like to see congress feel, you know, pressure. and i know they're working on it very hard to get the regulatory reform. reform, we need so you don't need to ever have taxpayers come in and prop up, bailout in their present form a failing financial institution. we need resolution authority.
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so any financial institution. any type of financial institution, if it is going to fail, can be liquidated outside of the bankruptcy process in a way in which it doesn't take the financial system down and the economy down with that. so i would like to see congress get that done and get the systemic risk regulator that can look at every institution, no matter what the size is and type. and if they see risks that are important, restraint them. so i would like to see that. now, in terms of longer-term compensation, clearly you need compensation -- it should be in equity for the high paid people and it should be, it should be something that reports long-term performance. it's the only thing that counts, long-term performance and aligns incentives of the individuals
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with the company and its shareholders. >> are we getting the look? >> gentlemen, we are done. >> thank you. [applause] >> booktv in prime time continues wednesday night at 8:00 eastern with a live discussion on the current economy.
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>> coming up next, but >> booktv present "after words," an hour-long interview program where we invite a guest host to interview the author of a new book. this week professor joseph recalls the black power movement in his book dark days, bright nights. from block power to barack obama.
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>> welcome to booktv's "after words." we're talking to tufts university history professor, peniel joseph, who has a very compelling new book out, freddie and fannie. welcome, professor joseph. >> thank you. tell me what that title means. that is a very intriguing title. >> well, the title really talks about, refers to wear black people have come from in this country, really from the dark days of slavery, segregation and jim crow all the way to having the first african-american president. >> it was kind of a little duty during the campaign that went
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viral. and you mentioned it early on in the book. and it goes rose is set so martin could walk so barack could run so your children can fly. and that came kind of a catchphrase guardian, particularly among african-americans. you cite this and say that as emotionally powerful as these words may be, they make for poor history. explained that. >> guest: absolutely. the whole notion of rosa parks has become this iconic in the story of the civil rights story. and it is the heroic period and what i mean by that is may 17, 1954, to august 6, 1965. and that encompasses the. from the brown desegregation court decision all the way to the signing of the voting rights act by lyndon johnson. and in between, what we are told
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both as students and as a nation in terms of popular imagination is that there's all kinds of cities and marches and demonstrations that occur. but they are really done by these famous iconic people. basically it is rosa parks who just was so tired that she refused to get up from the bus in montgomery, alabama, and sparked the bus boycott. and basically a young preacher who, even the president referred to, during the election as this young preacher from george which is dr. martin luther king junior, who sort of leads the masses from racial oppression. so this notion that rosa sat and martin could do this stuff and jesse could run and then barack could fly, all these things. they sound good but they really, they really simplify a much more complicated history. and that complicated history really involves so many african-americans, women and
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men, who proactively dismantle racial segregation, including rosa parks. rosa parks was an activist that she didn't just refuse to give up her seat by accident. it was a concerted, strategic ever to try to transform democratic institutions. so the lessons that we have to impart to our kids into the nation is at this isn't just something that happens by accident. by these iconic figures. like a dr. martin of the king junior come down from on high and help the rest of those. that was really a debate during the election. because remember, hillary clinton said that even though martin luther king jr. was important come it took a president to sign the voting rights act. because then when senator obama kept invoking dr. king, he kept invoking dr. king and the fierce urgency of now. and hillary clinton, then if senator clinton said hold up a minute. it took a president who signed
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that bill. so she was invoking this notion that our politics are still run in a top down way. even though king was the seminal figure, her point was you still need a president to transform this institution, transform this nation. and really, i think the most transformative parts of our history, especially when we think about the civil rights move in the black power movement in the social movements of the 1960s and 70s in the postwar period, it is really ordinary people who transformed his period. it is really sharecroppers, seamstresses, people who are in prisons and students. its regular people who then converge with these figures to become iconic. >> host: one of the things i love about your book, which is the complexity of it. and how you have taken the history of african-americans and really done a complex portrait, particularly of the iconic figures that you cite. martin luther king jr., for instance, you know, also was a
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critic of racism and he posted against the vietnam war and called attention to urban and world poverty, and he had a different actual life that often is described and remembered as kind of this figure who somehow get this great, i have a dream speech, but there was some hard parts of dr. king's portfolio. >> guest: that's an important one, especially one worth mentioning, we're about to some of dr. king's birthday genuine 18. dr. king has been shorn of its complexity. and really his radical edge. king is one the most vociferous critics of american democracy. he describes america as the biggest purveyor of violence in the world by 1967. and have to take note that his
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riverside speech april 4, 1967 in new york city when he first comes out against the vietnam war in a very robust publicly has been given one year to date before he is assassinated in memphis. so when we think about income especially between 1965 and 68, even two years before riverside, by the time he's going to chicago and he is in chicago to try to transform the slums. he talked about a slum clearance campaign and desegregate housing in chicago. he is talking about poverty. is talking about economic marginalization of poor people, laborers, king makes a very famous speech where he talks about all labor has dignity, which is one of his last speeches in 1968. kingsport people campaign is something that we shun to cite a well. we keep dr. king frozen on august 20, 1963, with the i have a dream speech right here in why she can be seat. we don't think about the king who was really much more combative come even though he was not violent.
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team believe you could use nonviolence as a moral and political force, really a battering ram to transform democracy. so it wasn't that king was not combative. he was very combative. the difference between king and even his african-american critics was that he believed violence was acceptable politically or morally. >> host: and it was also true that king, everybody embraces him now, but back in the time, even among african-americans, a lot of people did want him coming in to their towns and neighborhoods because when he left, he made life more difficult for many of those who had to stay behind. >> guest: absolutely. when we think about king and the southern christian leadership conference, they are the premier mobilizer's of the civil rights movement that they are not grassroots organizers in contrast to the student nonviolent coordinating committee was led by carmichael in an earlier. king goes into places like
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birmingham, albany georgia, like chicago, like memphis, tennessee. and he really stirs things up. that's what's interesting about dr. king. very, very combative. and many dozens of things from mayor daley in chicago in 19 safety five-66. of slum clearance, a really early version. also among certain black power brokers who had their own relationship with city hall and mayor daley and a look at king as really this outsider who's really upsetting the delicate balance of power in their own city. >> host: let me pause in this conversation a bit just to ask you what compelled you to write this book? >> guest: well, i was really, really transformed and impacted by the 2008 election. in a way, what i wanted to do was really connect the election
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results with my own work on postwar african-american history. especially the civil rights and black power movements. i think one of the least reported stories of the election was the impact of black power radicalism had on the nation in terms of transform the nation enough to elect the first black president. when we talk about obama treated 2008 election, most people talk about civil rights, including the then senator obama. one of his most famous speeches was in 2007 commemorating soma and the demonstrations that occurred in march 1965 that really culminate in the passage of the voting rights act several months later. and famously, king and others are really turned away from, there's going to be a lot of racial violence. john lewis who is head of the student nonviolent coordinating committee was going to be brutally beaten.
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is one of the iconic images of the civil rights era. and what obama said, senator obama said that at that speech was the new generation of civil rights activists were the joshua generation. he called dr. king's generation moses generation, and it was really the joshua generation. people like him are going to see the promised land. so he put himself directly as an air and beneficiary of that civil rights movement. in contrast, we really never talked as a nation about black power during the election, and when we did it was only in a negative context connected to reverend wright and racial controversies. one of the things i wanted to show and argue in this book was that the black power movement, even though was very combative movement, even though it was very forceful in his criticism of racial segregation of racism, of american democracy, it really did like the foundations of long sight of that civil rights movement and transforming this nation to have the first black
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president. >> host: you write that the black power movement remains the most misunderstood social movement of the postwar era. transit absolutely. when we think about black power and imagination, still we usually think of black power as a movement of violent, a gun toting blank panthers and others, a movement that was antiwhite. a movement that really drag down more successful counterparts, namely civil rights for social justice. so basically a movement that practice politics without portfolio, and the civil rights movements evil twin that record dr. king's dream of a beloved community. when, in fact, when you think about the black power movement and look at what it occurred, black power really grows out of the same historical context that produces civil rights that it is really going out of early 20th century african-american activism, people like marcus garvey, hubert harrison, the
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harlem renaissance. and in its postwar context it is going out of the activism of malcolm x and the nation of islam, but actual people who are in detroit, james and grace lee boggs, james baldwin and hansberry. so we think about black power, it's got a very ecumenical, very secular side to it. and it is a site that people don't discuss. one of the most interesting aspects of study the black power movement is the way in which there is an intellectual, social, political culture component. so on one score, black our activists try to transform curriculums in high schools and colleges. on another they try to transform african-american consciousness through cultural centers, through poetry and prose. on another score they try to push for anti-poverty and welfare rights. so we think about black power in our popular conception, we don't think of black women being at
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the forefront of that movement, that black women really were some of the key activists in that movement. not just the iconic figures like angela davis and kathleen cleaver who are very important, but also poor black women who were welfare rights and tenant activist in places like durability alive and baltimore mayor in places like philadelphia. so certainly black women participate in that movement in organizations like snake and the black panthers. but for the most part more black women and black people participated just an ad hoc grass-roots organizations. both on university campuses and especially off campus in the 1960s and 70s. you mentioned a number of people who were kind of in the shadows that kind of a personal note to cite one, william worthy, who turns out was an adviser to our
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black student newspaper, boston university, when i was a student there and we founded in bill would be was there. you mentioned him and another in a number of other instances where he was one of those people kind of in the forefront among african-american radicals, got to go malcolm x and played well as an african-american journalist, the first one to go to china would you could go to china. >> guest: bill worthy is a great example of some of these unsung heroes of history. bill worthy was born in 1921. he's one of the key radical black journalist of the 1950s and '60s. he goes into the soviet union in the late 1940s. he goes into china in the 1950s. he is one of the key black journalist who was in cuba during the cuban revolution. he's a friend and ally of mauka max. is a key domestic idea is
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something called freedom now party. and it is really going to be one of three black independent political parties in the 1960s. what is the freedom now party. the others the mississippi freedom democratic party led by the sharecropper from mississippi who was not allowed to be seated at the 1964 democratic national convention in atlantic city, new jersey. and the other is going to be the lowndes county freedom organization which is nicknamed the black panther party, which is in lowndes county, alabama. and that started with grass-roots locals and loud study with the help of sncc activist, especially stokely carmichael. what we think about bill worthy, he is interesting because he's a black our activist who's also a pacifist who actually went to jail in world war ii for refusing to fight in the war, but worthy want a foreign policy that is based on human rights. way before president jimmy carter talks about a foreign policy based on human rights, william worthy was talking about
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this. and worthy as one of the people who is part of the ropes and generation. i call the roads generation the group of activists who come of age during the prime political time of the key african-american political and cultural figure of the 1930s and 40s and 50s who is going to be really marginalized by the cold war. between 1951 and 1958, paul robeson's passport is revoked it is not going to be able to earn a living outside of the country because of his left wing please. robeson never joined the congress party but is certainly sympathetic to marxism and communism and he is going to suffer because of that. but worthy is extraordinary and he provides a different genealogy of the black power. people like william worthy, richardson who was the activist from cambridge, maryland, who was called the legion of the
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civil rights movement who waged an unprecedented struggle in cambridge, maryland in 1963 and 64 to help desegregate that city, met with attorney general robert f. kennedy to cite a peace accord in the early 1960s. but also goes to malcolm x november grassroots leadership conference in detroit where malcolm delivers his famous message to the grassroots what he really lays out a secular vision of a domestic national, but also international global, political revolution. >> host: you write that malcolm x was nothing less in the civil rights era's invisible man. >> guest: absolutely. in the terms of the way in which historians view malcolm x, he is not part of that heroic period of the civil rights movement that he usually only pops up around 1963-64, and he really only serves a foil to dr. king. he is more characterized

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