that is one of level of folks. and in july in the chapter we are talking about, it is a white woman with the two doctors, she wanted something done about health care, very specific. wh"s"s'a $bp$s"d >> and will try to at least impact them. >> i just want to say one thing. i think the idea of a messianic

figure in our politics is so strong. we're both privileged to live in south africa at the time. and the idea of the messiah, we got it on us. that's something that africans and african-americans that we've always believed in. i'm not saying it's ever existed in this country. and to some extent it's been. the figure of a messianic figure in barack obama and in the last 30 years in some ways is emblematic of just the sort of polarizing the%class divisions that erupted really in the last 40 years in our community. and so what you have are people who are -- who are more and more distanced from working class people.gxg and the concerns of working class people. i mean, i don't want to get too esoteric. there's this theory -- and we talk about these factory workers in chicago. and these are -- these are essentially -- there's this --

when they wanted to -- decide they were going to strike, they were arguing should they strike and have a sitdown strike, basically the discussion came down to whether or not mexicans be most of whom who came over in the last 10 years most didn't have their papers to be honest would they be deported and the blacks many of whom had previous arrests, would they be arrested? and at the end they just said, screw it. if we're deported we're deported, if we're arrested we're just arrested, whatever. and i think so much of -- when you look -- king, of course, is from a middle class family in atlanta. but if you look at that moment so many from working class people. the people who really empowered king was from working class environments. i think that's what's missing. so the messiah is in some ways if you look at king or malcolm who was definitely from a working class family -- fred hampton whom you know i'm a huge fan of.

very much working class families. and even if you look at all over the world, you know, you look at some of the power and the impact of unions and radicalizing people and making them sort of want to fight, understanding what their rights are and what their rights should be. and that's what's missing, i think, in this. ultimately what you're talking about is this isolation of people. i think that's the greatest danger for our community now is that we're isolated from one another. rich from poor and that's true for the entire country. but that to me is sort of where the messiah figure comes up short. we can't really produce them anymore. [inaudible] >> good evening. thank you for sharing your thoughts tonight. in the last question you touched on this issue. and that is when barack obama campaigned, it didn't seem as if he really said anything specific

to black people except for the most part -- take some responsibility for your issues. other groups he specifically had things he campaigned on. and so it seems like -- you start talking about this a little bit. i'm not so sure when you talk about black people and it's and language and all this that we really know what we want. and you talk a little bit about this. you said there's this couple who said we're small business owners we just want to make sure taxes are cut for us. my question is, to the extent we talk about all the time how we're not a monolithic people, can we really have a discussion if we haven't decided what it is we really want besides saying we want to have our children perform at the same level besides saying we want our children to graduate from high school wubt. -- 100%.

can you start talking about that a little bit. >> but that goes back to the question of who is we. it just isn't a monolithe because when you start talking across those things, there's some folks whose issue -- their kids are graduating. their kids are graduating at a high level if you've got money, your kids are doing fine. and so those black people -- that's not their main issue. we're good -- we're good with that. this is what i need. and so i don't know -- i mean, i think there is -- anyway, i think the question is you have to go back who is we again. and is that just -- because when you start talking about the community used to have to live in the same place. we don't have to live in the same place anymore and everything has changed and that apartness sort of affects us having one voice. >> i feel a little bit differently than robert on this.

i think this get back to the unresponsiveness of the government. i think that's complicated. you know, i think we're very clear on some issues. not just african-americans but the country as a whole. when it comes to healthcare, we're very clear. poll after poll shows we want some sort of government financed healthcare system. we're very clear on that. why aren't we getting that? we clearly want us to be out of iraq and afghanistan. we escalated those wars. at least afghanistan. you know and i think this gets to what -- and i know this is heretical among black people but i think it raised the question -- people always talk about how smart barack obama is. and i've never met him. i have no idea. but, you know, the first thing he did in the whole healthcare debate was to take single pairer healthcare off the table. what good does that do. the employee free choice act which we talk about in the

chapter about the labor unions. i mean, this is something as it was original authored was probably the most progressive piece of legislation in 50 years. and what it could have done is strengthen labor leaders and strengthen the democratic base. most people want to join labor unions. why would you not pass that piece of legislation that would not sort of strengthen workers and their ability to sort of make a living and raise the economy which it would also contribute your main base. and so this is really my question. which is, you know, who is he listening to and why? and i think part of that is our fault obviously. i do think we're not -- we're not articulating -- we're not -- we're not making the demand in a way that he feels it. but, you know, again that distance between our political

class and average uncelebrated americans is just -- it's vast and it's almost insurmountable, it seems. >> i think you had the next question. >> first of all, guys, congratulations on the book. [inaudible] >> one particular thing. and that is you called it a failed state. see, i have the complete opposite view. and i did something you did on a story you broke with the "post" which is one of the smartest stories i've ever seen written at the "post" about race. [laughter] >> about race and its impact on politics. and that is a more diverse society becomes the more virulent in its conservatism it mechanics. when you look at states like minnesota which is homogenous and nations like sweden and scandinavian which developed

their social safety network. and the issue really is about who are the received beneficiaries of the social safety necessary. -- net. and it's different than the majority of the population, that will have a rise of populism. i will give my money to these people in our society. now, what i saw as a "washington post" reporter covering politics 15 or 16 years ago. and the conclusion i came to is that the vast majority of the country actually doesn't think like that. and their feelings on politics and a democracy leads the democracy to do exactly what they want them to do. sobl it's a failed state. in a sense the polls that you're looking at and talking about are asking questions. do you want a single payer healthcare. yes. what if all of these people like

we're having this immigration debate and floods of brown people coming across the border. that's not happening on healthcare. if you ask those people will be beneficiaries of that and they want a single payer healthcare. it's something i believe in. the vast of the majority of the country doesn't believe in. and so i think to the extent the democracy works the way it's supposed to work with the problems we've always had we got to change the mentality of the population. they don't think like you. i'm just curious what you think like that. and the reason the opposition of barack obama is so virulent they see in him an embodiment of somebody who could accomplish what no one has before. which is to get that benefit for those people who have been disenfranchised. and the reason he's not been able to get anything done, he's listening to a few people who disagree with us.

he's listening to a majority they don't want to take their money to benefit people who look like me and you. >> you asked me specifically so i want to explain that. i see what you're saying. i agree with you. i mean, it's no coincidence that if you look at, you know, a country like -- one piece i've been thinking of writing recently is sort of how chile in 1990 was faced with almost this exact same sort of economic environment where they had these years -- the cycles of boom and bust where their economy was geared towards speculation and not production. and they switched course like that. and they -- you know, it's not perfect but they created basically almost from whole cloth because pinochet ruined the country and that country is white. it's overwhelmingly white. argentina if you looked at what

they've done in the last five or six years. and the scandinavian countries. it's not a coincidence these countries are white. but i do think there is -- having said that, there's still a step in the industrial process that we never took. and i think this happened -- to be honest i think it happened in the 40s where we never sort of recognized -- our elites, our political class was clear. they were never going to let what happened in europe where you have a working class movement, a viable working class movement. they were never going to let that happen. and so if you look at something like the taft-hartley bill in 1937, we look at that -- that was intended to make sure we never had -- and so we don't have -- that's one of the reasons we don't have single payer healthcare because whenever you have single payer healthcare you have viable, robust unions. and so i think you're right. i agree with you completely. race is a huge component but i think it's more than that. i think it's the corruption of our political class.

and also the sort of -- the isolation again of our political class. and then of us. so i guess i'm -- i'm agreeing to you to some extent. >> okay. why don't we take two more questions and then we'll have time to visit personally with robert and jon. so they can sign your books. now, don't forget that they're honored by your presence but they would be honored by your money. [laughter] >> so go buy the book. this lady will be the last one. [inaudible] >> okay. we'll have three questions then and then go buy the book. >> yes. i must say i agree with a lot what you said. but i disagree with some things. and let me see if i can sum up. i think one of the big issues -- you know, i grew up in the

caribbean and i grew up in europe. [inaudible] >> but in a strange way i was put in a position and why why do you have something against obama. i don't have nothing against obama. i'm telling you african-american people this is not going to for work well with you. it's not going to work well with you. it's absolutely not -- they look at him as your grandmother looked at him as kind of a figure who's going to transition things and the great hope. if he was a great hope -- [inaudible] >> he was a step forward. >> and for him it was -- there's no question about that. it was a step forward. >> no question about it. there was a great sense of hope under a lot of african-americans.

he was purely from a symbolic process and he was a voter, right? >> yeah. his elections need to be seen by a white political class. he was coming in at a very important issue in time when the political class was bankrupt. what are some of the things especially when he was talking about. it seems to me when you read -- that was book written by barack obama and the future of american politics, right? it's a really frightening book when you read it. this is obama completely. i mean, it's completely. >> if we could get a question. >> we're losing viewers. >> one last thing. >> i think some of the critique of obama is -- [inaudible] >> i think we are in a crisis. he himself and said new liberal capitalism is a crisis and we have not found a crisis a new

system. and at the same time he's doing much. he's quite the conservative tang. -- tank. what would -- if you were to write a book right now, how do you think -- would african-american community be much more skeptical and critical of him? much more distancing of him at this point in time? >> black america is not going throw barack obama away. because they understand their own experience. and you look at the polls even today where there is skepticism, black america is not going to throw him away. they've been in this country too long and they understand -- they understand that some of the -- what's thrown at him is not legitimate. i'm not saying that's good thing. they may not be in their best interest to do but none of the polls so far suggest that black america is going to distance themselves in any real way from barack obama at this point. >> yeah. i agree with robert completely. i don't think you're ever going to see the black support for barack obama dip below --

certainly below 80%. but i do think this. i don't think if things continue the way they're going, and i think they're going to, i don't think they are going to turn out for him in the next election. and, you know, the -- our presidential elections are not that complicated. there's a few states. i'm from indiana. he won't win indiana -- if the vote was today he wouldn't win indiana. i don't care who he's winning against. he won't win ohio and pens. -- pennsylvania. if some laid off worker benefits go out and vote for barack obama because he believes in all this hope and change, i don't believe it. if i had to bet money i would say sarah palin would she the next president because you look at -- if you look at -- really if you look at the history of this country and every time there's been any kind of -- even when it didn't happen but when there's this sort of recognition of the sort of -- the sort of idea from white right wing

voters that there's some egalitarian post-racial or pan-racial democracy happening, public schools and reconstruction, you know, the civil rights and black power movement. when ronald reagan came to office, you know, there's this backlash that happens. and it's based on two things. one is this white right wing anger, not all white people, of course, but this white wing anger and the fact black people won't come out to the polls. no change. they didn't see any change. it's not relevant. it doesn't matter if it's george bush or barack obama. they're not going to come out. i do think that's what we're looking at. >> perhaps we should end on that because if sarah palin is going to be the next president, i need to run and get my ticket to canada. let's keep my question short. >> hi, guys. congratulations on your book. >> thank you. >> i'll just keep this very short.

what are the expectations for barack obama. i mean, did you have any expectations for him? and the second part of that, i have never seen social change in this country cough solely by the ballot box. that social change has always been while there has been, you know, success in electoral politics, real change historical changes come by public movement, a popular movement. and i think in some ways i would say the election of barack obama was an expression of that. and my criticism of barack obama is not that he is a failure 'cause it's only been a year. but that the movement that elected him has in some ways been abandoned. that that's my critique of that movement. that movement that elected him, that his campaign has seemed to have abandoned that popular

movement and i have to say finally in terms of african-americans and i think john you spoke very eloquently about the centrality of african-americans in advancing the democracy in this country, and i think it's rooted in our historical social economic position as, you know, being completely on the outside of the democracy and continuing to push our way in and in some ways for the front of it. so my point i trust the wisdom of the african-american -- na [inaudible] >> and i'm curious when you think of the answer is at this point. >> i agree with you. i don't think they made a mistake. i think they chose the best possible candidate. but i think -- and you'll understand this because we both understand chicago. if you look at how harold washington was elected, what was that 20, 30 years ago, yeah, almost -- almost 30 years ago, if you -- and we talk about this

a little bit, a movement led by workers that said we need change and they identified the candidate and they made it happen. and so what would happen there? he didn't change the world. harold washington didn't change the world. he didn't fix what happened in the one term and the few days that he had. but he was responsive to the people who elected him. who does barack obama have to be responsive to? i think that's the whole point that i sort of was trying to make with the -- what i contribute in the book. we've been so isolated. there's no hope really for right now -- there is no sort of social movement to make him respond to. and so, you know, i agree. it's not -- it's not barack obama's fault. in some ways, what he does he owe a labor union when it only represents 12% of the work force? nothing. >> i think this gentlemen gets the last one and you can ask the rest of your questions to robert and jon. >> congratulations. robert, did your grandmother

have a chance to hear the book or read parts of the book? >> no, no. she read the book. and there was -- boy, you didn't put that in there, did you? [laughter] >> but, no, it's interesting. she did read the book. and she -- her political thought over time -- my grandmother first of all when she was coming up didn't have time to think about all of these. when i was raising 13 kids, that's how many kids she had, i didn't have time to look at a tv and all that. and it didn't matter. they didn't have tv initially. but her thoughts after the election was being. she was afraid initially that he would be killed, you know, like a lot of people. that something would happen to him. but secondly, her -- she didn't have lots of expectations because she wasn't sure what he would -- and that's where i talk about what he would be able to do. for her it was largely a symbolic thing that this guy would be elected president.

and particularly, you know, six or seven months into his term, you know, she got to see an entire year of his presidency. she was like obama, obama, obama. so it was kind of -- he had become in some ways like every other politician. now, that's totally different from my mom, her daughter, who was a primary caregiver who was sort of a big supporter. and who used to fight with john and i about what's wrong with y'all. why are y'all asking all these questions about this man. my grandmother -- because she lived longer and didn't have as much -- belief that the political structure wasn't going to change as much with just the election of this one man. >> well, thank you all for coming and for an excellent presentation. a great book. let's give them a hand. [applause] >> and go buy those books.

>> all this month, see the winners of c-span's studentcam video documentary competition. middle and high school students from 45 states submitted videos on one of the country's greatest strengths or challenge the

country is facing. watch the top winning videos every morning at 6:50 eastern just before "washington journal" and 8:30 during the program meet the students who made them and for a preview of all the winners, visit studentcam.org. ♪ >> coming up next, booktv presents "after words." an hour-long program where we invite guest hosts to interview authors. this week, former massachusetts governor and republican presidential candidate mitt romney discusses his new book, "no apology: the case for american greatness." in it he examines what he believes are the greatest challenges to the nation today. and provides his own blueprint for american progress in the years to come. the expected 2012 candidate talks with juan williams of national public radio. >> host: i'm juan williams.

today on "after words," mitt romney, governor, thanks for joining us. >> guest: thank you, juan. >> host: mitt romney's book is called "no apology: the case for american greatness." mitt romney everybody assumes this book is the kickoff to your 2012 presidential campaign. are they right? >> guest: well, it's too early to tell. and frankly the book has come from my experience over the years working in the private sector. working in other countries and seeing that some of those countries are making a lot of progress. we've always assumed we're way ahead of the rest of the world. and other nations are catching up. and my concern is that if we don't recognize the source of our greatness and take action to shore up the fundamentals of america's vitality, that we could find ourselves being clips by other nations. -- eclipsed. let's rise to the occasion. let's rebuild our strength and provide for our kids. and their kids with a bright future.

>> host: now, some of these seems to be especially in the early parts of the book a critique of president obama. in specific, it's caught the attention of people around washington that you said that his outreach to some nations and specific muslim nations has been -- and here i quote kindling for people who hate america and who wish america the worst. is that right? >> guest: well, i think he made an enormous error that hurt his credibility and hurt our national interests. by carrying out if you will the first months of his presidential a form of apology tour. a series of statements saying that america has been derisive. that we've been dismissive. that america is arrogant. that we don't listen to the concerns of others. that america has dictated to other nations. i don't think that's historically accurate. i think america has freed other nations from dictators. we have not been dictating to other nations. but that being said, i think it's created the impression that

our conviction and our principles and wavering and it is not. i think that's a mistake on the president's part. i think a foreign policy consistent with the values and the proscriptives that were described by harry truman and dean atchison following the second world war is the more appropriate course. of america's way forward. >> host: i think in the book you say the u.s. is good and it's good for the u.s. to be strong. >> guest: yeah. >> host: but then in talking about some of the things that president obama has done and especially in the foreign policy area, you seem to suggest that he is diminishing america as you just said. the democratic national committee by the way then issued a statement that said americans in the last election rejected radical foreign policy authored by dick cheney and wholeheartedly adapted by mitt romney. and that this policy would alienate allies and embolden allies. >> guest: i don't have much to say about the