therefore legitimize the government and the people have to get with the program or not to get with the program, and that would mean that they would start to squeeze away from the taliban and the opium get with a legitimate. so money while it is very expensive is cheaper in the alternative which would be to hammer at this from the outside with bombs and bullets all the time. so it is a two-pronged approach. so yes, the economy and eckert culture because again you want to look at this in its totality as a -- a whole societal snapshot, and what are the symptoms, what is the symptomatic problem? agriculture is illegitimate, the government isn't providing goods and services. all the things we've talked about. so, when you read in the newspaper they are given all this money so they can grow wheat instead of poppy the first response shouldn't be what a

waste of time and money, how is that going to get rid of these insurgents. in fact it is going right to the heart of the problem i think. ..

>> thank you.

the american revolution begins in boston after the conquering of lexington and the american army's denounce the british to our under a virtual siege. the british find out that british general is in charge they have no one on staff who is really an expert deciphering code and they have no system in place to send a coded message to their operations in canada or here in new york. american general george washington takes command of the troops at cambridge and again on the american side there is nobody in charge of cryptology. what you do have is a situation where merchants are not totally ignorant of codes and ciphers. when they do with the factors the agents in london they have a tendency to use

a very cryptic system to tell their agents what grace to sell at and so on. if the message was intercepted, then the 18th century you have no privacy in the mail. it is public information and you could be assured that somebody would read along the way. one of the situations it is you have a dr. benjamin church, the surgeon general of the continental army, one of the five leaders of the patriot movement of massachusetts along with john and samuel adams and john hancock and dr. church the only problem is dr. church is a british spy and has been on the british payroll since at least 1772 is so while he is running

the american hospital sees cents in information to british generals in boston. what you see at the bottom of the screen is the actual decoded handwritten message the decipher key that was intercepted he was not able to send his mail directly to boston red go down to newport. he sent his mistress who was a prostitute in boston down to newport to one of her former clients to get the message to the british captain of the vessel. she delivers the message to him and he promises to take it on board the ship but sees the message that is

hidden ciphers and symbols and decides not to do it and takes the document and goes to the governor of rhode island to then sends him up to american general green who being a merchant dominos it is encoded message. americans put two teams to decipher the message in both using frequency analysis comment in other words, which letters appear the most common that you back get out the most common letter in english is a letter e you would figure what appears the most time then work down from there. they come out with the exact same translation, both of them and that is the code they broke down that he had used. the difference between the seifert and a coach everybody has a tendency to miss use that term. a cipher is when a character

or letter replaces a single letter or number using delta as a symbol = collector k or something similar. a code is when a character represents an entire word normally would need a code book to identify because you will use so many generally you cannot keep track of them in your head. what of the things we need to realize the alphabet in the 18th century is not our alphabet. it is not identical. the letters i and j.r. the exact same letter. there is no difference between the two the letters u and v our the same letter defy gave you the letter it looks strange but in the 18th century they would

immediately adjusted and know what i meant was the month july and sure handwriting is another form of codes and ciphers the earliest book i found dates back at 1856. it was well known. we were looking at is to assist and 30 -- and joseph stand very decipher it is a one letter shift. he is the person in philadelphia to receive to the messages from benedictus arnold and brought across new jersey right to different methods year to new york and given to the reverend jonathan dodo who decoded messages and then turned them into british headquarters right here.

they also used a book codes from the blackstone commentary on the loss of england and if you noticed on it says fifth oxford edition preferred is very important the two people coating and decoding the messages use the same edition of the rise if you put down the word balloon and they see baloney. you have to use the same edition. the first is usually the page the second is the line and the third is the word. 45, nine, eight maine's page 45, line number nine and word number eight and that would be your word which new have to have the same book. dictionary coast. very popular used by all sides.

said dictionary the most common was the new spelling dictionary that has a list of words alphabetical order, two columns and you have just about every word you could possibly want they would put a dot over the number to indicate first column or second column they had a tendency in the first column to ignore the dots and also do things like added 20 to the page or seven. if i was going to give you the number 155, 11 but i am telling you to go to page 139. [laughter] note day? also in instance where they paid to the book a backwards to try to keep it hidden. you're looking at the original letter from benedict arnold offering was

point* for 20,000 pounds it is in code the original letter is at the university of michigan at the cleamons library. this is a pig pen decipher we would call it a tic-tac-toe board they call it the pigpen. it replaces the letters in each quadrant the sender and receiver had to agree the letters go where progress long as you understood been positioning you could transcribe a message. in the first upper left quadrant you see the letters abc if you do just the upper left quadrant without putting anything in it it would indicate the letter a if you drew the squadron two with one let your -- one dots that would be letter b

or two dots would be the letter c and so on. all sides ended up using this american, british, french even a diary that is partially written in the pigpen cipher. that is what it would look like when you actually see it. if you took the time to translate it it would give you the word traitor if you look at the first letter lower left quadrant one docked and if you carry it out you would get the word trader the pigpen cyber is used up to the american civil war. this is the french version it also uses the letter x to

indicate to make it a little more complicated. the next thing is what we would call a mask the sections or the squiggles that are cut out on the page he would put the mask on the paper with your secret message in the cut out holes take off the hook mask and right the rest of the message around it. you will not get it right the first time so it is something that has to be done a number of times in order to get it correct. they also use a mask with a hidden center. we call it the hour class mask but they called it the dumbbell masked in the 18th century. always understand the different terminology. here is a letter written

with a hidden center here is the actual hidden message. it says is william howell has gone to the chesapeake sent by general henri echlin tin telling him that he was not coming of the hudson to help them he has gone to attack philadelphia. you can see the hidden center and again the actual letter. dead drops. that is where one party deposits letter or message a new location and leaves it there than another comes along to pick it up. there reduce injuries in albany in paris and its third and we have simon, a british spy that would pick up the message that was left

by his brother in a tree outside pittsburgh. the only problem is simon could not read or write which is a major handicap if you are ase buy. [laughter] the would have to get a friend of his translate exactly what the message was the only problem is the friend was an american spy who then went back to told the general have fort bit of information coming out of four bids going up to fort detroit. this is real. this is have really worked. and long island they use a box in a cow pasture be careful where you step but you could still do it. austin was a tavern keeper in suffolk county he would travel to new york city to pick up supplies ahead to

take the messages back up to eastern long island. he had rented a cow pasture to place his cattle to graves said he had an two the reason who go to check on the cattle and leave the messages in a box in the field. have a mess would paulson seat on the field had a legitimate reason to own the field to check it out and he would pick up the messages and give them to stella who would then place it in a location down at the beach on long island sound and by the use of glimmers and kerchiefs she would hang on the line would indicate to the american people coming over the service of dead drop where to go to pick up the messages. in philadelphia we have the

story of a lady who would step up on the heights of the river doing heard crocheting and dining -- dining issued observe the british and writes her messages and stick it in a ball of yarn which she allowed to roll down the hill and at the bottom of the hill was serviced by to americans who would pick up the messages and take them back to washington at valley forge. and in rhode island they also used a rock down by the water. invisible ink, anything that is mildly acidic will work whether milk, lemon juice, a great virtues, if during world war two they actually used urine for anything that will weaken the fibers of the paper. the fibers will begin when they bring it next to pete

they will darken first the only thing you have to remember is to take it away from the heat or the whole document goes brown anything that will weaken the fibers will work i am sure some of you tried writing with horror limit juice and it does work. also the 18th century three different methods which were identified in the book that tells you of compound chemical reactions where you would write with one chemical and then have to apply a second chemical which would then make the message to appear. applying heat to that chemical would have no effect and would not make it too visible. what you are what you get is the actual letter written in

invisible ink they are rare because mainly when you apply the chemicals the documents become very fragile. the reverend dodo mentions the fact he transcribed all the letters when they got to him because they became very brittle after applying that agent. if you would get the page at the top you can see if you drop down to the third line begins again. you can also see there are two different color inks being used. so on the left side what looks like a watermark is actually where the chemical reagent has been applied to the document. hidden compartments. they use all sorts of things to hide messages. up on the new york frontier near albany and canada, they used hollowed out bullets

and on the frontier people would be expecting to go out and shoot to their dinners a year would carry it in a pouch with musket balls for your rifle or musket so it is inconspicuous. in many cases it was. there is a situation after the fall of four to montgomery and clinton in new york said the american army is dispersed brave bridget -- british a jet carrying a hidden musket balls sees a group of lobsterback uniforms making breakfast and says take him to general clinton. however they take him to america in general clinton there are three general clinton's and the american revolution to american and one british and they are part of the connecticut troops who were given

regular british army uniforms to where that were captured act see an unknown as the revco regimen. -- redcoats regiment. when he realizes he has been captured he swallows the silver bullet. he is observed in and day give him stuff to bring up the message and brings it up and shoves it down again. [laughter] at which time clinton the stars to lose his patience and says he will take the charter again and it will stay up or he will reach three bit through surgery at the end of a bayonet. he brings it up and is convicted and hong in kingston new york. but in some of you may have coats were you have a cloth over the button this was a fashion popular at the time

of the american revolution on your overcoat were the buttons to match the cloth of the jacket. what was happening in philadelphia while the british were in occupation children could go in and out of the lines pretty much without being harassed so messages would be in short and placed over a wooden or bone by 10 covered in the cloth the son would go through the wind out to the american troops and see his brother who would then take the messages out from under the button and ride to a response and sent him back into the city of philadelphia. they're word double bottom canteens, clothes, dr. benja min church mentions some of the spies and you are

familiar with a heady, a sweatshirt that has pull strings you have a sleeves during the american revolution at that time you have a bolstering they would hide the message inside this lots of the drawstring. when british soldier when he applied for his british pension identified the fact he was a british spy turned in his they call a knife to prove the fact that he was working as a spy. and the pennsylvania troops mutinied at morristown british clinton said six buys out of new york to entice the new two years to come over to the british decided offered everything but the crown of england if they did but the messages

were encased in t lead t came in blocks sort of like chocolate bars and today they would be wrapped with aluminum foil back then they use of lead foil. not very good health wise but they were not aware of that. quill pens everybody most people carry a pen back in the 18th century they carried quills. there exists a set of messages rolled up a very tiny slipped inside the quill and carried through the lines and that is how we know they did that. clay pots. there is a case where a spy comes into new york city and hides messages inside the love their bladders hidden under the exotic plants and the plant pot serving was fine except to go still line

william smith goes to pick up the messages that this guy's apartment in new york casey's all of the messages hung up on the line in the room as that inking is running off of the pages. for the longest time i thought this was a dumb spite until i find out and the british found out he was a double agent a spy working for a lafayette park broke but by claiming documents were destroyed that was hopefully giving him credence. we know they use powder horns one was found in ohio with a message inside apparently dropped by the spy and issues, a number of instances where false heels were used and a case in virginia that we know of and

also a spy who carried messages from london to paris to benjamin franklin and used false heels on his boots to carry the message. washington's deceptions. the one thing i do have to say about washington for somebody who never told a lie he stretched the truth an awful lot. [laughter] up at cambridge when he first six over the american army, they were down 29 rounds her man. nine shots were bad as it does for as the gunpowder in camp. he knew there were british spies going around the american camping so he had a shipment of barrels brought up from providence rhode island marked gunpowder the only problem is in said the barrels was say and. the british spies would go back and report that the americans had plenty of

gunpowder and they could keep the cs for a long time. he also did a troop multiplication at morristown after the battles of trenton and princeton the camps at morristown and while there normally putting most of the troops in cluster in houses to keep as many together as you could. washington with the opposite way but wonder to soldiers and a house of the area that his troops had to occupy was much greater than the amount of troops he had. the spies are reporting back to british headquarters that washington's army extents over such a great areas of a report back he has three and four times more soldiers than he actually has. to me, one of the best one

occurs by general putnam and princeton new jersey after the battles of trenton and princeton you have the british army in new brunswick and the rest of the american army in morristown. the bulk of the british army could come down and squash him in an instant if they wanted. there is a british officer who was wounded very badly at the battle of princeton and was not expected to live and ask for permission to have their british officer, of new brunswick to take the last will and testament. he agreed but insisted it had to be done at night. putnam banality of the house as he put candles to make them look like they were occupied then had his 50 soldiers march passed the house for the last will and testament was being taken in sometimes to the time sometimes six at a time were sometimes a dozen or all 50.

when a british officer goes back to new brunswick he reports that putnam is that princeton with 4,000 soldiers. [laughter] instead of the 50 he really had. with eight reports for spies. washington like to make big reports and send them too british headquarters in new york. he did so well after the battle of brandywine in pennsylvania the british army captured an original american report but were absolutely convinced it was fake because they're getting some a fake reports they refuse to believe it. another one is what washington's deception was he needed to steal a march in the 17812 move the american army and the french army from north jersey and

westchester past the british come across the delaware river and even to lay down to yorktown to hook up with lafayette to attack cornwallis. so washington uses the deception battle plan. it is also used in world war ii for the landing at normandy also in desert storm by a general schwarzkopf to do the end of around on the republican guard. they used washington's plan. the first thing you need is a clear objective to steal a march without being attacked by the british to were located in new york and the staten island did know the end of these assumptions. and washington originally was planning to attack new york with the french and

british believed that so what you have to do is once you know, what the enemy believes you have to reinforce there believe that is what you will do. the next thing would be much good selection the options used. one of the things he did since they use the french army and the french army of both of them he had brick ovens being poked and they were built in chatham new jersey and order preparation of ovens and he also issued orders for supplies to be brought to the french ovens. once the french troops arrived since they were never going there he could write as many orders as he wanted because none of the contracts would take place. he also had troops assigned

to go down by the water's edge and he wanted the british to observe the them collecting bricks. there was a to gun artillery unit thus spend their time sitting there watching one unit on staten on demint and the students spent the entire war of serving each other. he knew the and it would be there so he sent them down there and they did so well being obnoxious and making noise and collecting the bricks as the ovens were being built that they were fired upon. that helped it is not

cooperating. but what winds up happening in the last board is the exploitation of it and washington is able to steal but he has 30 boats put on carriages brought to springfield new jersey to him for the anticipated attack on staten island. there is no other reason to bring the boats there because they were not going to virginia. he has gone and convince to the british there will be an attack on staten island and the eventual result is the fact that his army and the french army could move across new jersey without being attacked and as i am sure you are aware they make it down to virginia and cornwallis surrenders at yorktown.

and that gives you pretty much of a run through on the spike refuse during the american revolution. there are many more codes and ciphers better in the book and at this point* i would like to open up to some questions and hopefully i have some answers. please wait for the microphone. >> could you comment on nathan hale? >> nathan hale was a very poor spy. i don't know if you are familiar with what has been found out scottish general by the name of grant his papers were found just became recently available and he identified as that

robert rogers actually got him to tell him he was a spy but he should have kept his mouth shut. he thought rogers was also an american spy and because the ousted himself the winds up getting himself home. and -- getting himself hung next question? >> can you comment on washington getting his troops out of brooklyn into manhattan and using the cliche it to build up the fires to make it look like the army was still there? >> key use that down in

trenton where he had the fires bill to to deceive the british that they were still in position but at the battle of brooklyn he uses clever men to get the troops across to the east river back to manhattan by the fact the british were convinced some mornings they would have a victory over the american army that was on long island. that was another one of his deceptions. for somebody who never told the allies he stretched it to an awful lot. >> could do comment on hercules mulligan and relationship to alexander hamilton? >> when hamilton -- hamilton

first comes to your key end up living with mulligan about one point* in the beginning and that is how they get to know each other. morale again, there is one book on milan again that was published years ago and identifies that mulligan had been using a black servant, probably a slave to carry the messages to new jersey to hamilton who would have been at morristown at the time and that is all we know exactly how the system worked. this is one of the problems in working with researching spies that i have been doing the last 13 years it is like playing 500 chess matches at one time. items advance very slightly when you find another clue and in the case of mccann we

know he was sending messages and how he got the message is. it appears he was operating for most of the war. being a clothier the british officers would go to him to get to new uniforms or fancy attire in while they're they're being fitted he would entice them into talking and extract information that way. okay? >> could you speak to livingston and his involvement in lower manhattan and? >> one of the things the media appears to switch sides about a 1781. and and appendix rico and to

the correspondence that appears to exist between the colonel. the american goes over to long island and picks up the british naval signals there it is a a serious that seems to imply he is requesting some one to come over and pick up the intelligence by the means of ads that appear in the newspaper and i give you the chronology i appear to have found. it is very interesting than name used is the name of a person who wrote a book milan probes and ciphers and some of the references used would be references if you go back to the point* that would have been understood by somebody in the military

line. and also to mention he is indicating he is having a problem with his newspaper? his paper mail is on long island which happens to be where he turns over the codes for pro okay? see also says he will be there and is a specific time point* when he will be there and be available some of if you follow this, we don't have exact proof but the closest thing i could never find of many documents that might indicate how the connection was made. that took a lot of hunting and reading a lot of pages to find that one. >> can you go back 21 of the

codes from benedict are lit -- arnold is that the designs of west point your the letter? >> he offered west point for 20,000 pounds. >> that is not the one where the major was hung from upstate new york? >> no. those letters that to he was carrying a remember correctly are currently the property of the state of new york. that letter came in iraq the cleamons library from the university of michigan. absolutely it was offered to turn over west point their british were have to except the offer then you get to the point* where they have to agreed to meet which

follows up after that too. >> they were just trying squawks to make there's no reason to put it in code because it was face to face. one of the reasons you have espies coming out of new york and across to the jersey city area then across to new work. there is a map that has the spy routes marked on it. it came out of the british had quarter papers. which i found absolutely interesting that day market and the other was that they would go to staten island and go over to a elizabeth which if you go over the bridge now it is such a short area and the channel

has been widened to one of the spies tells us how they would do it would take a rope with a -- rowboat and road to the other side then sink the boat below the waterline go to the business then he would raise the boats and row across to the other side and sink it again. this if i was james moody. he operated mostly from staten island town and across from the creek and he would hide their rowboats right next to perth amboy. >> car and eight of the ciphers still used today by the government and if not what other types of

technology has hidden? >> computers. [laughter] you can use your computer and in code messages far superior than was used with the american revolution. computers today who designed the croats were i talk about the one letter shift, that is one transaction. they would then take the one better shift can use different combinations and make multiple shifts. if you get into reading about the enigma machine and the japanese purple coat you will see they go into multiple layers of transcription and the only way to decoded is to use a computer. if you really needed mathematician today too do codes and ciphers at that level. one thing we used in the

york was called the language of flowers. are a young girl at the putnam headquarters and on the top of broadway was a widow's watch should go up and observe the american troops then come down and draw paintings of flowers. the last real book written on the subject was 1835 but by using flowers you could give a description as to how many troops were there, whether they would just we amassed on the border there is one individual who claims and a bouquet of flowers he could put the equivalent of eight pages of text. [laughter] there are other systems i did not go into. i just touched on some of them.

>> could you list a few of the documented female spies? >> okay. there is an bait say british spy who was going into the american camps then coming back and reporting. there is another one. she is a seamstress that the british sent up in to the french camp and is suspected and interrogated by washington's command then back to north castle and she has had her head shaved and forced to ride backwards on a horse and a shearer comes back words-- comes back again she will be hung you haying spies who normally don't shoot them. only a gentleman is shot a

spy is not a gentleman so a spy is not shot. we asked to be shot and if you was he could not have been in use by and they should not have executed him. they had to hang him. that was the 18th century etiquette. [laughter] general washington had me aids in camp were they in charge of spying and decoding? >> you had different case agents running spies. you had one running spies on long island did another running spy's of elisabeth. of a lot more is made of others because they are so

well documented and documented because they operated over a long distance. when they operate at a close distance depositions are taken rather than original documents maintained if the reports tend to be summarized. so what happens is in those reports from the spies from nearby tend to be summarized in the general's report because it is word-of-mouth you do not know that much for the nearby spy's only those that come from a distance in a case of tallmadge his spies were in new york coming back from connecticut to where he would then do the decoding based on the code book which is one of the appendix items in my book there are other copies around and he would then send the transcribed

message some of the original messages went on when he was out of position as well so it tends to be to cover is the case agent that will be doing the decoding not necessarily the camps. they may be collecting the information and taking down the orders and sending them out but they're really not running the operations but more like the secretary. >> back in the days what was the main motivation for this buy and how much was a typical payday? >> they were paid based upon what the perceived danger was it depends on what the assignment is then the one thing you can be certain is

spies got paid if you see someone claiming to be a spit days us by and did not get paid if they were a scout for to you also always paid your spies because if you don't pay them the other side will pay them and they will work for the other side they even tended to get paid before the generals took their money. [laughter] also the term spry in 18th-century has different meanings beyond what we think we think of james bond going in cod need no behind enemy lines the 18th century the term also meant to scout on the frontier and used interchangeably. they would refer to my surprise but when you go find out what they were doing they were just doing reconnaissance and never went behind enemy lines on

the frontier you would see indians by eagles by any as a modifier be very careful because that usually means the somebody was given the job to go up on top of a mountain top and counted the people in which direction not doing anything more than traffic count. >> do have any specifics on the hidden messages with of vinegar and 11 jews or have something else on the page they could wash off? >> 14 miller uses one that is not chemically available today.

the americans original supply comes from james j. in london who claims to have invented it although the formula was known by the british for 100 years before he may have taken a liberal license to claim he invented or may have tweaked it a bit. the americans later on sets up a a laboratory around peekskill new york for the agent and reagent wants the laboratory is established the americans have a plentiful supply. the overall power at the time available through any medical supply any place

there was surgery they would have had it too. >> this is our last question. >> in your research how many of these have you come across? i assume they're the ones that have surfaced? how many were hung or how many do suspect we're never discovered or confessed after the war? >> many were never discovered because they operated one time. when i started doing this 18 years ago there was 40 spies to the number that were there doing it over the last 18 years with my computer database people actually went behind enemy lines to

collect intelligence many go for one trip and get cold feet and decide that as it were just get the money and that ends it. some continue on for the majority of the war the first book i wrote to the rebellion in the ranks there were 30 spies and many were identified the four and three have a series of other books coming down to working on to identify eight spies by state. [applause] thank you. >> i found that an amazing talk and i really do look forward going through the book in depth.

>> this is the cover of a booktv released on justice john paul stevens you may be one of the happiest publishers exhibiting here as we just learned today justice stevens announced his retirement what does this mean for your buck? >> everybody at northern illinois university press is very excited about this book. it is a coincidence with ideal timing is this book has been in research for more than a decade some of to have the publication of what was already a good book

coincide with the retirement is timely and appreciated by the press and we're thrilled to have such a terrific book coming out in a timely fashion. >> tell me about the authors. >> day generalist with more than 30 years experience most with "the chicago tribune." and the book is written in a wonderful journalistic style with clarity and plunge and gene is a former state legislator from illinois and have access to high-profile people interviewed for the book. they make a great team the. >> does just sends -- justice stevens know about it? >> guy would not put to a big sticker authorized but he did sit down for interviews and allowed us to take some photographs of trophies in his office he

does have a hole in one trophy and also gave his blessing to the authors and interviewing people at were close to him those people are incredibly loyal so they never would have spoken without the author's without his say so so we had access to family members friends and former clerks with his blessing. >>host: why so long if the making? >> of the authors have done astounding amount of research stores with his family and childhood growing up in chicago all the way through the current decision of campaign financing so the scope of the story is very "in-depth" in the number of sources in the research they have done is impressive. they spoke with everyone from the stevens brother, his children, people who work with siemens when he was a lawyer and judge in chicago.

president ford when he was still with us, donald rumsfeld who was instrumental in having stevens appointed, a former clerks ruth bader ginsberg ginsberg. a number of people they interviewed required a tremendous amount of time and research. >>host: what type of competition and do you have been in this space? we should note to age 90 the longest serving justice he has decades of legacy of the courts have there been other big works on his career? >> other books of have touched on stevens one looks at a very specific part of his judicial career but not a true biography. this personalized stevens he is beloved by the people that knew him so in addition to covering his important work and intellectual and professional life but also represents entertaining anecdotes about his personal

life and stories about the people who love him best this is the most complete to look at stephens the man and concerned it could not match it is in scope so and i thank you for staying with us. and independent life and we're talking with the publisher of nor the earned illinois a brass comment sara hoerdeman on the day that we do learn that justice stevens will step down from accord at the end of the term. thank you.