they have been saying that now for more than 40 years. in fact, they'd like us to build them some nuclear power plants to replace the electricity that we destroyed. >> in the book you talk about iraq's secret program. how did the story of this bomb program grow? and even if they didn't have any bombs, or they haven't found any bombs so far. >> you know, we went into that first gulf war argues that they did have a bomb program. which we did not know at the time. but afterwards when inspectors from the united nations and the international atomic energy agency went in, they found a huge effort to enrich uranium to make material for a bomb. they cleaned all of that out. so did the iraqis. they were tired of having our people. they blew up all of their stuff. but they didn't keep records. so when the second bush came along with an interest in resolving and settling the country down and getting rid of

saddam, there wasn't any proof. but the fact is it was fully cleaned up by 1998. >> speaking of cleaning up, you talk also in the book about the scramble for what was left over about the soviet nuclear arsenal. talk to us about that. >> it wasn't so much the arsenal . los alamos director said to me, they know the -- it was the material they used to make the bombs, the whole country had a prison camp. there was no way to get it out. when the walls came down, they were like us. we went in and sent a lot of money. with the real effort on our part helped them begin to put all of their materials under lock and key. we're still sam nunn the former senator estimated that about 60% of our nuclear materials are now carefully guarded and accounted for. so the job still remains to be

finished. but we've made a good start. >> earlier today, you had a presentation at the national book festival. tell us about that and during the question and answer period, what was foremost on the minds of the people that were asking you question there is? >> i really went through my new book, the "twilight of the bombs" and talked about some of the serious issues and sometimes the cops and robbers stories that came out after inspecting iraq after the first gulf war. ultimately what i talked about was the serious question of can we get rid of nuclear question. the usual question today, what about iran. as if a country that has not figured out how to build a bomb is as much of a threat to the world like a major power. like the united states which has at least 1200, 2,000 maybe 5,000 bombs. we tend to think we're the good guys. that make it is okay.

it's a basic imbalance in the world that we maintain large nuclear arsenal but say other countries can't. that was the kind of issue that i discussed in talking about how we get to zero. >> the book, "the twilight of the bombs: recent ch more thingn

with another author. >> joining us is richard rhodes, winner of the pulitzer prize in "the twilights of the bombs." richard rhodes realistically speaking is there a prospect for no nuclear weapons on the planet? >> i think so. they really lost the utility since the cold war. they cost us $50 billion a year. it is official u.s. policy that we move towards zero. it's just a matter of working out some of the security relationships that are standing in the way. >> with regard to working out those relationships, will we be able to come to agreements with countries like north korea and iran who seem to be on the path to making their own nuclear weapons? >> they do. partly because that's the only way they can -- they feel they can defend themselves against the major nuclear powers like the united states. but each of them has -- has

security needs. if we can kind a way to satisfy those, north korea would like to be an ally. they have been saying that now for more than 40 years. in fact, they'd like us to build them some nuclear power plants to replace the electricity that we destroyed. >> in the book you talk about iraq's secret program. how did the story of this bomb program grow? and even if they didn't have any bombs, or they haven't found any bombs so far. >> you know, we went into that first gulf war argues that they did have a bomb program. which we did not know at the time. but afterwards when inspectors from the united nations and the international atomic energy agency went in, they found a huge effort to enrich uranium to make material for a bomb. they cleaned all of that out. so did the iraqis. they were tired of having our people. they blew up all of their stuff. but they didn't keep records.

so when the second bush came along with an interest in resolving and settling the country down and getting rid of saddam, there wasn't any proof. but the fact is it was fully cleaned up by 1998. >> speaking of cleaning up, you talk also in the book about the scramble for what was left over about the soviet nuclear arsenal. talk to us about that. >> it wasn't so much the arsenal . los alamos director said to me, they know the -- it was the material they used to make the bombs, the whole country had a prison camp. there was no way to get it out. when the walls came down, they were like us. we went in and sent a lot of money. with the real effort on our part helped them begin to put all of their materials under lock and key. we're still sam nunn the former

senator estimated that about 60% of our nuclear materials are now carefully guarded and accounted for. so the job still remains to be finished. but we've made a good start. >> earlier today, you had a presentation at the national book festival. tell us about that and during the question and answer period, what was foremost on the minds of the people that were asking you question there is? >> i really went through my new book, the "twilight of the bombs" and talked about some of the serious issues and sometimes the cops and robbers stories that came out after inspecting iraq after the first gulf war. ultimately what i talked about was the serious question of can we get rid of nuclear question. the usual question today, what as if a country that has not figured out how to build a bomb is as much of a threat to the world like a major power. like the united states which has

at least 1200, 2,000 maybe 5,000 bombs. we tend to think we're the good guys. that make it is okay. it's a basic imbalance in the world that we maintain large nuclear arsenal but say other countries can't. that was the kind of issue that i discussed in talking about how we get to zero. >> the book, "the twilight of the bombs: recent ch

>> robert reich says that the root cause of the 2008 economic collapse was not wall street but america's ever increasing economic inequality. even the middle class as mr. reich says has to amass a certain amount of debt to achieving a certain standard of living. it lasts about an hour. [appe]